The Volokh Conspiracy
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Scalia's "Prophecy" in Lawrence And The Joint Dissent in Dobbs
That awkward moment when Justice Breyer joins an opinion that criticizes his join in Lawrence.
Lawrence v. Texas was decided in 2003. Only two members remain from that Court--Justices Thomas and Breyer. Well, at least Breyer is on the Court for a few more days. Justice Kennedy wrote the majority opinion in Lawrence. At the end of the decision, Justice Kennedy assured everyone that striking down the ban on sodomy would not lead to striking down traditional marriage laws.
It does not involve whether the government must give formal recognition to any relationship that homosexual persons seek to enter.
In dissent, Justice Scalia called bullshit.
At the end of its opinion--after having laid waste the foundations of our rational-basis jurisprudence--the Court says that the present case "does not involve whether the government must give formal recognition to any relationship that homosexual persons seek to enter." Do not believe it.
We all knew the logical end-point of Lawrence. Really, that train started with Romer. Justice Kennedy's assurance was not worth the paper it was printed on. And who joined Lawrence? Justice Breyer.
Fast-forward a decade to Windsor. Once again, Justice Kennedy assured everyone that striking down DOMA would not put in jeopardy traditional marriage laws. The penultimate sentence of the opinion reads:
This opinion and its holding are confined to those lawful marriages.
Once again, Justice Scalia called bullshit. Don't believe it.
The penultimate sentence of the majority's opinion is a naked declaration that "[t]his opinion and its holding are confined" to those couples "joined in same-sex marriages made lawful by the State." Ante, at 26, 25. I have heard such "bald, unreasoned disclaimer[s]" before. Lawrence, 539 U. S., at 604. When the Court declared a constitutional right to homosexual sodomy, we were assured that the case had nothing, nothing at all to do with "whether the government must give formal recognition to any relationship that homosexual persons seek to enter." Id., at 578. Now we are told that DOMA is invalid because it "demeans the couple, whose moral and sexual choices the Constitution protects," ante, at 23—with an accompanying citation of Lawrence. It takes real cheek for today's majority to assure us, as it is going out the door, that a constitutional requirement to give formal recognition to same-sex marriage is not at issue here—when what has preceded that assurance is a lecture on how superior the majority's moral judgment in favor of same-sex marriage is to the Congress's hateful moral judgment against it. I promise you this: The only thing that will "confine" the Court's holding is its sense of what it can get away with.
And who joined Windsor? Justice Breyer, as well as newbies Justice Sotomayor and Kagan. Of course, two years later, Obergefell v. Hodges declared unconstitutional traditional marriage laws that predate the Age of Antiquity (the Age of Antiquity!). Why not? They had the votes and could get away with it.
Now, fast-forward to Dobbs. Here, the dissenters argued that Justice Alito and his ilk cannot be trusted on Lawrence and Obergefell. Their repeated promises that those precedents are safe are illusory. And how do we know the conservatives can't be trusted? Part I of the joint dissent--which I think was written by Justice Kagan--highlights Justice Scalia's Lawrence dissent:
Nor does it even help just to take the majority at its word. Assume the majority is sincere in saying, for whatever reason, that it will go so far and no further. Scout's honor. Still, the future significance of today's opinion will be decided in the future. And law often has a way of evolving without regard to original intentions—a way of actually following where logic leads, rather than tolerating hard-to- explain lines. Rights can expand in that way. Dissenting in Lawrence, Justice Scalia explained why he took no comfort in the Court's statement that a decision recognizing the right to same-sex intimacy did "not involve" same-sex marriage. That could be true, he wrote, "only if one entertains the belief that principle and logic have nothing to do with the decisions of this Court." Score one for the dissent, as a matter of prophecy. And logic and principle are not one-way ratchets. Rights can contract in the same way and for the same reason—because whatever today's majority might say, one thing really does lead to another. We fervently hope that does not happen because of today's decision. We hope that we will not join Justice Scalia in the book of prophets. But we cannot understand how anyone can be confident that today's opinion will be the last of its kind. . . . Even before we get to stare decisis, we dissent.
We should all learn from the prophecy of St. Nino. (This past week revealed at least three judicial miracles for legal canonization--overruling Roe in Dobbs, overruling Lemon in Kennedy, and expanding 2nd Amendment in Bruen!) But there is a special awkwardness for Justice Breyer. He joined the Lawrence dissent which promised, Scout's honor, that marriage laws were not at issue. And there is similar awkwardness for Justices Sotomayor and Kagan, who pinky-sweared that Windsor would not lead to the nullification of marriage laws. None of us believed them. Not for a second.
But I do believe Justice Alito, et al. The outrage about Griswold and Lawrence are mostly messaging. The joint dissent had virtually nothing to say about Roe and Casey being correct decisions. Rather, they had to spend nearly eighty pages talking about related decisions that face no realistic prospect of being overruled. There is no march on Washington to ban birth control. Indeed, even as Griswold was being decided, the Connecticut legislature was in the process of repealing the law. A step that Justice Douglas made unnecessary. And with regard to Lawrence, the Harris County District Attorney ignored everyone's advice to prosecute the case. There was simply no interest in Texas, or anywhere else, to prosecute someone for engaging in a consensual sex act. Finally, in the wake of Obergefell, societal acceptance of gay marriage has steadily increased. Even most social conservatives have given up on the issue. Take a look at who is the Chairman of the National Organization for Marriage!
There were barely five votes to overrule Roe. I don't think there is more than one vote to even grant cert to reconsider these other cases. Let's move on.
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After Dobbs and Kennedy we know that there are at least five votes to give the American Taliban anything it asks for. Now the question is simply what it will ask for next.
Lawrence legalized butt banging. The sexual selfishness affirmed by the vile lawyer profession killed 20 million from AIDS, 100% caused by butt banging. It was transmitted to humans when a homosexual got butt banged a monkey. Now, this lawyer scum wants to bring butt banging in graphic details to our schools. They are sexualizing children in kindergarten to groom them for their sexual pleasure and for lethal butt banging. The lawyer must be stopped.
I ordinarly do not react to such drivel, but here I am forced to.
As an Orthodox Jew, I wear a skullcap (known as a yarmulka) every waking moment, both in public and private. While I live in the Northeastern United States, I have traveled around the U.S., both for work and pleasure, and never felt at all uncomfortable, let alone threatened.
In contrast, in much of Europe, Jews are advised not to do so, for fear of being physically attacked. See this article:
https://jmoreliving.com/2018/04/26/will-europes-jews-stop-wearing-kippahs-most-already-have/
Let me quote part:
So, frankly sir, your use of the the term "American Taliban" rings hollow to me. In America, I might have to endure hearing some Christian pray at a football game. In Europe I might be physically assaulted for wearing my religious garb. I'll take the Yankee version any day.
Or to quote a certain Jew:
First remove the beam out of your own eye; and then you will see clearly to cast out the mote out of your brother's eye.
See Godwin's Law for name calling by the left.
You do have to explain the mystery of the 70% Jew vote for the Democrat Party, the mortal enemy of Israel.
My explanation is that NYC is where most Jews live. They cannot escape their degenerate local culture.
It's not hard to explain. Most American Jews are not Jews at all, but leftists. Look at the way they talk about Haredi Jews.
75% of Orthodox Jews vote Republican.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2021/05/11/u-s-jews-political-views/
That was my point.
Voting pattern is not how Judaism is determined.
Most of that 70% barely counts as Jewish. If you look at the Orthodox, most of them now vote GOP.
I routinely respond to such drivel--mostly because the Conspiracy relocated to "Polite 4Chan" Reason.com.
How glad I am that you, as a Jew, don't think the American right is a theocratic movement going after vulnerable communities. But hey! Look over in Europe where these things can happen. Look way over there! Don't look here. How double dare you!?
So, I'm not Jewish but I am gay. And yes, there are a few nations in Europe where I'd have to be careful, but luckily they're easy to avoid--why would I visit Belarus or Russian anyway? But it may surprise you, should you even care to know, that there are US state where I also need to be cautious. I need to worry about white nationalists packing into a van to "smear the queers" at a pride parade, for example. I have to worry about what I say in some states these days, like Florida and others that have passed new anti-gay laws while resurrecting the meme that gay people are pedophiles (groomers.) Justice Thomas himself painted a legal target on the set of rights that provided some security for my husband and I, don't make us felons for kissing (fun fact! when we started dating in Nevada during college, we were repetitive felons!), and make it harder to deny us jobs and other things even some Jewish Americans appear to take for granted. I've been denied work, refused service more than once, and watched friends being thrown out of their own homes after the death of their partner.
I've very glad that the Yankee version is good for you. Phew! Lucky you. How easy it was for you to forget about others in the midst of your relief.
You want a quote? Try the one from PASTOR MARTIN NIEMÖLLER.
>How glad I am that you, as a Jew, don't think the American right is a theocratic movement going after vulnerable communities. But hey! Look over in Europe where these things can happen. Look way over there! Don't look here. How double dare you!?
The theocratic movement isn't just worse in Europe, there's a reason why it's worse--it's made up of Muslim immigrants and their descendants, and they are much worse on tolerance than Christians are. They're also found very sympathetic by the left despite this.
And yes, the Muslims in Europe beat up gays just like they do Jews.
Shawn, maybe you did not notice, but the "white nationalists packing into a van to "smear the queers" at a pride parade are now facing serious jail time," as they should. In Europe, people have murdered Jews, because they are Jews, and the civil authorities look the other way.
As for the rest, you are seriously misinformed. The Florida law applies only in public schools, and only in Kindergarten through 3rd grade. If you are a teacher there, you can keep your sexuality to yourself, regardless if you are gay or straight. Otherwise, that law does not even apply to you.
This country has a long history of ignoring violence against LGBT Americans. Remember the "gay panic" defense? Why do people think it's okay to excuse American atrocities by pointing over to another country and say "see, you have it great here." What sort of B.S. is that?!
I'm not seriously misinformed, though you appear to be. The Florida law applies to K-12, for starters. The governor and others specifically mentioned "groomers" when touting the law. You know, "pedophiles." I'm also old enough to have lived under sodomy laws and I understand how these sorts of moral signaling laws work. It's a signal to bigots that the government will tolerate shenanigans against the disfavored minority. I've seen this before; it's a repeating pattern in places where the GOP takes a majority.
I'm sure, as a Jew, there are certain words or phrases that might seem innocent to some that are clearly understood to target Jewish person. For gay men, "pedophiles" is one of those words and a "groomer" is another way of saying the exact same thing. We understand what's being said there loud and clear--the government's getting back into the "smear the queer" game.
You have no need to talk about your proclivities to school children, and neither does anyone else.
When a straight person talks about getting married and families having a mommy and a daddy, that's not considered "talking about their proclivities." When a gay person talks about getting married and creating a family with two daddies, that's "sex education." It's a double standard and it's a shallow way to view people simply by the sex you *assume* they're having.
No, it's not. The law prohibits gay men from coming into a classroom and telling the children how great it feels when his husband erupts in his colon.
That the Volokh Conspirators cultivate such a shabby group of bigots as fans marks them as quite low-quality people. It is possible to express objection to modernity and progress without flattering and attracting so many ugly bigots, but this blog strenuously avoids such a course.
Carry on, clingers. Until your betters decide you have gone far enough, as usual in modern, conservative-rejecting America.
You realize that two people were murdered in what appears to be a religiously motivated mass shooting at a Pride festival in Norway on Saturday (as in, two days ago), right?
You aren't seriously implying such a thing couldn't happen here, are you?
Pulse Nightclub in Orlando ring any bells?
No, you stated it could not happen there. It did.
You know that this argument has been discredited, and there's no evidence that he chose Pulse because it (or, rather, its patrons) was gay, right?
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/4/5/17202026/pulse-shooting-lgbtq-trump-terror-hate
What is the relevance of this incident?
You haven't noticed that right-wingers are more like to use this insult? Your sense of outrage is pretty selective.
That's a lot of deflection, Bored Lawyer.
Why are you deflecting so hard? Most of the Jews I know realize that the rise of Christian nationalism/populism does not have a history that's kind to the Jews.
I don't want to speak for other Jews, but it seems to me invoking 'as a Jew' in favor of explicitly Christian policies not being a big deal because Jews aren't getting targeted by the government yet is not something they would think is wise.
Bored Lawyer: There's a similar problem in some areas with Muslims who wear religious headgear.
Sounds like the assurances they gave us concerning the 1965 immigration law.
Its entire purpose was to replace the white population with 85 IQ third worlders.
Well HEY! Good news! The recent death of the right to abortion is being heralded as a boon for "white lives!" You should be overjoyed.
Who exactly is doing this heralding and what statistics are they quoting? This CDC report suggests whites only account for about a third of all abortions.
How long until whites are no longer a majority in America? And not a moment too soon.
I thought the "Great Replacement" was a conspiracy?
Mary Miller, Republican candidate for 15th congressional district in Illinois called it "a historic victory for white life." (Her campaign is trying to walk the statement back.) She's also praised Hitler in a speech. (She has Trump's endorsement.)
Actually, she made the statement at a Trump.
In 2022 is gay marriage even necessary?? Can’t any two people just be whatever gender they need to be for the day and wear whatever they want to get married?? Who is going to check for 1 pee pee and 1 wee wee??
Let me take your flippant question seriously:
Pretty much any state with an anti-"CRM", anti-gay, or anti-choice law will absolutely check birth certificates, which you have to provide.
Is straight marriage necessary? Trump might think so because Melania cannot be forced to testify against him in court.
Then after the fact will they check? Because people can just get married in California and marriage is marriage. So how is Alabama going to deny someone saying they are married when they don’t know what gender the other person is?? So is a hospital in Alabama going to check the spouse’s genitals when they want to see their spouse in a hospital??
In a world where Obergefel has been over-turned, you think they'd skip over Windsor?
And as the bathroom panic has shown, people concerned about traditional gender roles are very confident in their ability to identify sex and gender at a glance, and aren't worried about their track record of assaulting cisgender people over it.
There is an obvious difference between a series of decisions which have the effect of extending rights and those which constrain them.
It is absolutely 100% true that Obergefell did not infringe on traditional marriage rights.
It made a mockery of marriage, that's an infringement of the value of actual marriage, leading to a decline in marriage rates.
Marriage rate in 2016 was 7 per thousand, it dropped to 5.1 in 2020.
Wow.
"It made a mockery of marriage"?
You fragile bigot.
There are some posters here who are this stupid. Bob isn't a rocket scientist, but he isn't one of those posters. Which means he's deliberately lying.
The "marriage rate" being cited is not the number of people who are married; it's the number of people who got married that year. Can anyone think of any reason why 2020 might have had a sharp drop in the number of weddings that took place? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?
(Also, we would expect national marriage rates to continue to drop from year to year as the population ages.)
Lol. You’re such a bad person. It’s incredible really.
"did not infringe on traditional marriage rights."
It infringed on the longstanding definition of marriage effectively re-writing it to something that it was not.
Homosexuals could have had their own state recognized union, but this was never about that.
No, we couldn't. We even tried for that, BTW. We passed domestic partnerships in several states. What did the Right wing do in Congress? Passed the Defense of Marriage act to prohibit the recognition of same-sex marriages or anything similar. Oh yeah, it outlaws federal recognition of other state-recognized unions. So even separate and unequal was too much for the Right. Looks like it still is, too.
Did you read what I wrote? SCOTUS could have simply ruled that any State granting or recognizing marriage must likewise grant or recognize same sex unions. But they didn't do that, they redefined a word instead.
You can't infringe a definition. You're trying to conflate rights with semantics.
Because that's all these bigots have.
Obergefell v. Hodges did not re-define marriage. The decision came on June 26, 2015. Every person eligible to marry on June 25 was still eligible on June 27. Obergefell merely expanded the universe of persons eligible to marry.
no - obergefell did not expand the universe of persons eligible for marriage. It only created a new type of marriage under an existing maritial statutes
The only difference between same-sex marriage and opposite-sex marriage is in your bigoted brain.
The difference is that marriage is a relationship that encapsulates the family unit, and usually results in children. Gay "marriage" is about two adults playing house.
Oh brother, I unmuted you for that stupid comment!
No, Joe, it's the same marriage. You can keep stamping your foot but much like the few holdouts after Brown, this debate is basically over, and you lost.
Sounds a bit like "separate but equal"...
Granting your characterization as accurate for the moment—what is the relevant difference here?
This post is so stupid it's hard to know where to start.
First, is Breyer 100% accountable for every word of a decision he joins? And if he is, is he entitled to change his mind?
And how exactly did Lawrence inevitably lead to Windsor and Obergfell? You give court decisions way too much power.
Both cases, like Lawrence, reflected the growing sentiment that vilifying homosexual, criminalizing their behavior, discriminating against them in all sorts of ways, was morally wrong, and violated their rights.
Apparently both Scalia and Blackman reject that idea. Doesn't speak well of either of them.
Anyway, the dynamics were not Lawrence -> Windsor -> Obergfell. They were social trends and attitudes gradually forcing those issues.
Obergefell v. Hodges declared unconstitutional traditional marriage laws that predate the Age of Antiquity (the Age of Antiquity!)
Exactly what marriage laws were struck down? And do really think we should be following all the marriage laws that predate the Age of Antiquity?
How about,
If brothers are living together and one of them dies without a son, his widow must not marry outside the family. Her husband's brother shall take her and marry her and fulfill the duty of a brother-in-law to her.
Both cases, like Lawrence, reflected the growing sentiment that vilifying homosexual, criminalizing their behavior, discriminating against them in all sorts of ways, was morally wrong, and violated their rights.
Apparently both Scalia and Blackman reject that idea. Doesn't speak well of either of them.
Anyway dynamics were not Lawrence -> Windsor -> Obergfell. They were social trends and attitudes gradually forcing those issues.
The cases mainly reflect Tony Kennedy's personal views.
Not bigoted enough for you, Bob?
I wonder whether you could have been hired as a paralegal at my law firm. I make it 50-50. Assuming you were willing to move from the sticks to civilization..
Fair enough. But those views happened to be correct. Whereas yours are bigoted and mean-spirited, and simply don’t need to be accorded any deference in a healthy society that respects the dignity of all its members.
[i]Both cases, like Lawrence, reflected the growing sentiment that vilifying homosexual, criminalizing their behavior, discriminating against them in all sorts of ways, was morally wrong, and violated their rights.[/i]
What? American society didn't just start "banning" SSM in the 21st century, it never recognized it as possibly legitimate, until a few years ago.
I just re-read the Obergefell oral argument transcript this afternoon, and that suggestion was ridiculed to little result: when exactly did this that growing sentiment of vilification? How can it be growing if it always existed? Nothing like SSM ever existed in English society and law, marriage was about the family unit and passing on wealth to children. English law criminalized sodomy since forever. Such statements as "growing" are bad faith assertions to justify judges imposing their policy preferences on the blank slate of equal protection.
[i]Lawrence[/i] led to [i]Obergefell[/i] just like [i]Griswald[/i] led to [i]Roe[/i]. I can't believe you that disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
You misread his post. You even quoted the part you misread, which is ironic.
Does this edit help? Both cases, like Lawrence, reflected the growing sentiment that vilifying homosexual[s] ...was morally wrong, and violated their rights.
You really have an odd view of the law. Do you think judges are supposed to take a public opinion poll to decide what rights are protected by the Constitution?
Well, I don't know... they appear to have taken one here... by going back to the Dark Ages to find their favored result.
Do you have any understanding of Constitutional law? Any state can permit abortion up to birth. They can even permit abortion up to age 5. And nothing in the opinion stops them.
That's the thing. Not every social development is Constitutionally mandated. Convince others,and then get the states to enact what you want. That's how women got the vote in the early 20th century.
Am I to take you seriously with "abortion up to age 5?" Or was that hyperbole. Around here, it's hard to tell. I've little doubt some Y'all Qaeda QAnon tiki-torch warrior thinks that the Democrats want to kill children. (A dude terrorized a pizza parlor over it, after all.)
Convincing the states doesn't work in today's environment. Step two for Y'all Qaeda is to get a national law passed outlawing abortion in all states while doubling down on the racist and homophobic laws that feed their base. 58% of Americans supported abortion in some form and watch how quickly they lose it in nearly all forms regardless. "States rights" is a dead concept in a highly polarized and gerrymandered country like ours. It's winner-take-all.
"Any state can permit abortion up to birth. They can even permit abortion up to age 5."
I suppose that, in the abstract, a state which does not recognize common law crimes is free to repeal its homicide statutes if its legislature chooses to do so. But do you have any authority that any state's generally applicable homicide laws do not apply from birth to age 5? Please be specific.
"They can even permit abortion up to age 5."
No, after birth they run into 14th amendment problems. Serious ones; Setting out one group that it's OK to kill was one of the exact evils the 14th amendment targeted.
Heck, they're treading thin ice just by deliberately looking away for a few hours after 'abortions' to make sure not to notice when accidental live births get corrected.
Do you think judges are supposed to take a public opinion poll to decide what rights are protected by the Constitution?
No. Do you really think that public opinion has no effect whatsoever on judicial decisions, including on what cases make it to SCOTUS?
Among other things, changes in public opinion may cause some to rethink their assumptions and logic. When an issue starts being discussed extensively lot of points get raised that maybe had not been widely considered previously. This is generally thought to be one of the advantages of freedom of expression.
Meanwhile, in more good news a NY state court struck down the law allowing non-citizens to vote in local elections.
While this observation is somewhat off topic, it actually isn't, with regard to SSM. Hopefully subsequent appeals will uphold this judgment.
The most obvious reason why this issue (non-citizen voting) has rarely been litigated for there to be prior precedent is because until a few years ago, nobody would have that this even possible.
In that way it's just like same-sex marriage. Until recently, nobody even bothered bringing legal challenges assuming they would be laughed out of court. I believe the NY State Court of Appeals had a very good opinion during the ramp-up of SSM cases explaining why traditional marriage was justified, tied to the state's interest in the children that can result.
Goes to show you the "danger" of not fully litigating a novel idea all the way to the top when it's unimaginable. Because eventually it will be. The notion that SSM was an open/undecided constitutional question because there was never a Supreme Court precedent is laughable to make one cry.
To your comment, I believe that anyone who lived in the revolutionary era would think the notion of non-citizens voting was batsh!t crazy.
There's a lot of historic Conspiracy articles about why your argument regarding birthrates is wrong. But let's just point out the most obvious fact: two men who were never going to have children in the first place because they are homosexual would also have never had children if marriage were illegal. There is no logical tie between marriage and increased birth rate.
Also in your bucket of things you failed to imagine: non-citizen voting happens in San Francisco. Has been for a while now. It's limited to things like school boards and other hyper-local issues. Are you implying that a city is prohibited from finding out what all of its residents want as part of its duties?
You have this exactly backwards on both points.
That children can result of hetero marriage is the state's interest in it. There is no state interest in validating the pairing of any 2 individuals otherwise, i.e. there is no reason for marriage to exist absent children. That's the point about children. I didn't make any argument about "birthrates". Traditional marriage was not created to punish homosexuals.
I also didn't deny that non-citizen voting happens. A city may be prohibited from "finding out what all of its residents want" if its governing law forbids it. My point, again, was that from the founding of this country, giving non-citizens the franchise would have been crazy talk. The presumption at that time was that anyone living in the community would have been citizens, or on a path to becoming one. Back then people took oaths seriously, and recent newcomers would be known and dare not attempt to vote before taking the oath of allegience. It's not relevant to the legal, social, and historical niceties that today's immigrant citizen path is longer than it was in the revolutionary generation. Our immigration law has changed because we are no longer trying to populate a continent. Even so there were periodic pauses in immigration admittance for various reasons, often particularly motivated by the idea that immigrants might badly influence electoral politics. The consensus was that only citizens have the franchise. Also why Dred Scott was a setback for all blacks, not just the enslaved, because it said they were not citizens.
I do not deny that in municipalities that lack a restriction like the New York state constitution, it might be legal for non-citizens to vote in local elections. It's embarrassing that New York City passed such an ordinance given the language of the state constitution. Talk about lawless.
I believe that anyone who lived in the revolutionary era would think the notion of non-citizens voting was batsh!t crazy.
So?
I'm really tired of arguments that begin by guessing at what revolutionary era opinions would have been on some topic, and then claiming that this is what we must think today.
It's nonsense.
Yes, agree there's no need to constrain it to the revolutionary era.
I believe anyone who thinks I should be able to have an outcome determinative vote in your club without first having to be accepted as a full member is batshit crazy.
Citizenship is not a club.
It is not crazy to think that consent of the governed includes noncitizens so governed.
What you suggest is lawlessness, and empties citizenship of any meaning. Talk about gaslighting, I'm choking on the fumes.
No, it's not lawlessness, and citizenship includes a bunch of other stuff than voting.
Disagreeing with me real hard is not getting gaslit. Come with an argument, not just complaining and abuse.
The problem with the argument from incredulity is that when it's wielded by ignorant people it simply reflects their ignorance.
In fact, the legality of non-citizen voting was common in the colonial era and the revolutionary era. It wasn't until the early 19th century that it started to decline. Even in the mid-19th century it was still pretty common — at least to the point of including aliens who had declared their intent to naturalize in the future. It really wasn't until the early 20th century, with the xenophobia surrounding WWI that was also reflected in anti-immigration laws, that it almost completely died out.
It's disingenuous to the point of dishonesty to talk about the colonial era. In that time, living in the king's domain pretty made you his subject. That's why it was no big deal.
There's a reason why the Constitution specifies the citizenship qualifications for the presidency.
I have no doubt that in various jurisdictions as the West was settled, the definition of citizenship was lax and so was the administering of voting rolls. The presumption was that if you were settling the frontier, you were going to be a citizen. You weren't an alien.
That's why the Insular Cases are so problematic, because of the differing presumptions about the territory involved and what that meant for "citizenship".
> "Sotomayor and Kagan, who pinky-sweared that Windsor would not lead to the nullification marriage laws"
Pinky-swore? Had pinky-sworn?
I love the description of how the Left was totally duplicitous then but the Right is being totally honest today (except for Thomas, apparently) when they say they aren't going after the gays and birth control next. Except, of course, the logical test they used to sink Roe also applies to a LOT of the current set of civil rights we take for granted today--including Thomas' own marriage. At least we'll know where he'll eventually draw the line.
Let these clingers have their moment of respite from getting stomped by their betters in the culture war. The future will deal with them quite predictably and severely.
"But there is a special awkwardness for Justice Breyer. He joined the Lawrence dissent which promised, scout's honor, that marriage laws were not at issue."
Uh, Justice Breyer did not dissent in Lawrence v. Texas, nor did he join any other dissent. Professor Blackman is, at best, seriously mistaken.
The observation that Lawrence "does not involve whether the government must give formal recognition to any relationship that homosexual persons seek to enter was not set forth in a dissent; it was in Justice Kennedy's opinion of the Court (which Justice Breyer apparently supported, but did not expressly join). Moreover, that language made no promise of prediction about the outcome or reasoning of future litigation.
"And there is similar awkwardness for Justices Sotomayor and Kagan, who pinky-sweared that Windsor would not lead to the nullification marriage laws."
Again, Sotomayor and Kagan apparently supported, but did not expressly join Justice Kennedy's opinion of the Court in United States v. Windsor. And the language therein, "This opinion and its holding are confined to those lawful marriages", also makes no promise as to future litigation.
Professor Blackman is heedless of truth or falsity.
The Lawrence dissenters were Thomas, Scalia, and Rehnquist. Naturally. Three especially bitter clingers.
You don't get a lot of invites to social functions, do you?
This is precisely the level of analysis to be expected of a disaffected, immature, partisan hack from a shit-rate law school.
How can this guy ever expect to get a date if he spends all his time fixated on photographs and writings of Scalia on nine big screens? On second though, the natural inference is that he is quite happy with his pictures of Nino.
(That video reminds that John came to the band as a horn player before he became the strongest bass guitarist around. The soundtrack version of Quadrophenia presents the best version of this one, maybe because John was the remixer.)
Show us on the doll where the bad man touched you AK...
It is the misapplication of Timbs that threatens these other decisions. And that misapplication was signed onto by 5 current justices. As the dissenters clearly spelled out and Prof. Blackman pointedly ignored. True that none of the other justices signed on to Justice Thomas' concurrence advocating doing away with SDP completely. But limiting it to only rights "deeply rooted in this nation's history and tradition" and discarding "fundamental to our scheme of ordered liberty" constitutes the very real threat. But according to Prof. Blackman we should just move on.
The problem with "fundamental to our scheme of ordered liberty" is that it doesn't really provide any guidance on these issues. Is abortion fundamental to our scheme of ordered liberty? Why or why not?
I do realize that, and I don't have a brilliant solution to define such rights. But defining our individual rights only in terms of 18th and 19th century morality and justice doesn't seem great either.
We all know where the end game is going - the complete sexualization of children and normalization of pederasty.
You do like the 'we all know' construction these days.
Turns out your nuts, most people even in your party don't know that, and, and fuck you.
If you were actually against sexual abuse of children you’d be working to abolish juvenile detention, the Catholic Church, the Baptist church, and frankly
any number of religious organizations, various youth sports, the Boy Scouts of America, etc etc
It's a shame Justice Scalia wasn't prescient enough to refrain from going hunting with Dick Cheney.