Is DeSantis a Principled Governor or a Retaliatory Culture Warrior?
Plus: Are political parties the ideal vessel for advancing libertarian principles?
In this week's Reason Roundtable, editors Matt Welch, Peter Suderman, Katherine Mangu-Ward, and Nick Gillespie scrutinize Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis' style of conservatism and touch on President Joe Biden's upcoming visit with the House of Saud.
1:28: DeSantis and his approach to governance
30:36: Weekly Listener Question: You guys occasionally talk about the Libertarian Party, and you might be aware of the recent convention which saw power go to one faction that many describe as quite alienating. This has led to many of the traditional libertarians leaving the party altogether. My question for you all is do you think that the Libertarian Party is necessary for facilitating more libertarian representation in politics? If not, how do you see libertarian ideals grow in the traditional duopoly?
38:39: Biden's forthcoming visit to Saudi Arabia
52:30: Media recommendations for the week
This week's links:
"The Death of Walt Disney's Private Dream City?" by Zach Weissmueller and Danielle Thompson
"Anti-LGBT Panics Are Bad for Everyone's Liberty," by Scott Shackford
"Blame Biden for High Gas Prices," by Nick Gillespie and Regan Taylor
"Saudi Prince's Plan for 'Walkable' City of Single-File Buildings Could Be Two Miles-Long Skyscrapers Instead," by Christian Britschgi
"Alex Epstein: Why the Future Needs More Fossil Fuels," by Nick Gillespie
Send your questions to roundtable@reason.com. Be sure to include your social media handle and the correct pronunciation of your name.
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I mean, he’s a politician. So he walks some line between the two.
He stated he was going to veto the training stadiums before Tampa anti gun rant. So men.
The tweet from the rays about gun violence was on May 26 before a game with the Yankees. The veto was made on June 2. I couldn’t find anything from DeSantis or his office prior to May 26 announcing a plan to veto that funding. Do you have something showing that it was planned for us to see?
Given that the one public reference to the veto I could find was this,
“During an appearance Friday in Orlando, DeSantis said “we were not in a situation where use of tax dollars for a professional stadium would have been a prudent use,” while adding it is “inappropriate” for private corporations to “subsidize political activism.””
It sounds like the Rays’ statement certainly could have played a role in his decision.
Gov. Ron DeSantis said Friday he opposes tax dollars going to professional sports stadiums in explaining his decision to veto a $35 million budget proposal that was expected to benefit the Tampa Bay Rays.
DeSantis, who made the veto Thursday as he signed a $109.9 billion budget for the upcoming fiscal year, said cutting the stadium funding “was just a decision that was going to be made.” In all, DeSantis issued more than $3.1 billion in vetoes.
His spox also said this was always his stance on funding stadiums.
The June 2 date was because that’s when the legislation got to him.
During an appearance Friday in Orlando, DeSantis said “we were not in a situation where use of tax dollars for a professional stadium would have been a prudent use,” while adding it is “inappropriate” for private corporations to “subsidize political activism.”
So, you are taking the word of DeSantis and his spokespeople that the decision was made before the Rays’ tweet, since you did not have anything stated publicly to that effect from prior to that tweet.
And as for June 2 being the date that the legislation “got to him”? That may be when bills are officially sent to him, but they were passed long before that. It would be kind of hard for him to decide to veto it before May 26 if he didn’t know what was in the budget before June 2, anyway, right?
It doesn’t look to me like you have anything other than DeSantis’ word that he had already decided to veto it. I, for one, am not willing to take him at his word.
JasonT20 is a lefty shit-pile who supports murder of unarmed protesters if they might do something later which the asshole doesn’t like:
asonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?…
Eat shit and die, asshole.
A: YES.
“My question for you all is do you think that the Libertarian Party is necessary for facilitating more libertarian representation in politics?”
Why does Welch get to write all the questions for these? Seriously, I don’t know who the questioners are, but they always seem to start from the most cosmotarian worldview.
I didn’t listen to this podcast. About a week ago I got through about 15 minutes of one before calling it quits.
I’m glad they told me they were libertarians. They sounded like the most slapable bunch of liberals I’d ever heard in my life.
You can differentiate TeenReason libertarianism from progressivism by the fact that they don’t openly brag about censorship, and talk more about legalized drugs and hookers.
Also they moved seamlessly from legal buttsex to genital mutilation of children.
It always sounds like an non-satirical, self-serving version of The Mr. Obvious Show to me.
Honestly, they should have Heaton answering these questions on the Mr. Libertarian Show.
Caller: “So what you’re saying is, all versions of socialism are really the same and require people to die?”
Mr. Libertarian: “Yes caller. That’s exactly what I’m saying.”
Caller: “Huh. I never would’ve made the connection. Thanks Mr. Libertarian, you’re a life saver!”
I always have two opinions on political and other events. One, they almost invariably violate my principles, ie don’t hurt people and don’t take their stuff. But that is government’s sole means of enforcing its sole purpose of controlling peasants so the elite can stay in power, so there’s not much that happens which doesn’t violate libertarian principles.
My other reaction is to chortle in glee when the elite fuck with each other. Here, DeSantis is just as unprincipled as any other politician, but he is fucking with Disney because Disney thought it was smart to play politics with children and especially with catering to the woke crowd who want to use children as weapons in their woke war. DeSantis playing with Disney is far less objectionable than Disney playing woke games with millions of children, so I chortle with glee.
It has nothing to do with any principles. It has everything to do with the lesser evil.
I think DeSantis missed an opportunity to be the better man here. It would have been far better to use his bully pulpit to explain how Disney only wants to support politicians who will push “these” books on kids as young as kindergarten.
Retaliating against Disney with government turned a debate about the proper role of schools into a Freedom of Speech issue. It gave all the usual suspects cover to come in and defend Disney from a free speech perspective. Defending Disney’s freedom of speech is much easier than defending the actual speech that Disney is making. Had he left Disney to its devices, they’d be continuously on record supporting very specific materials that most americans find odious.
Yeah, I agree. Plus, he had already won legislatively. The law Disney had opposed passed and was popular. That was the true victory.
Retaliating against Disney with government turned a debate about the proper role of schools into a Freedom of Speech issue. It gave all the usual suspects cover to come in and defend Disney from a free speech perspective. Defending Disney’s freedom of speech is much easier than defending the actual speech that Disney is making. Had he left Disney to its devices, they’d be continuously on record supporting very specific materials that most americans find odious.
You may be right, but you might also be surprised about how even that could/would have been turned against him. Trump (correctly) pointing out that this or that story was fake news was considered “an attack on democracy”. If you think that merely calling something out would have helped blunt the criticism by giving the critics nothing to hang on to, you haven’t seen how effective they are at building their own handles onto stuff.
De Santis failed in the attack on Disney. Clearly what he did violated the US and state constitution. Worse yet it is far from over or clear what the end result will be. Left as it is now the tax payers will be footing the bill for about 1 billon. He put at risk about 80000 jobs in his state. A good leader would have known what the final outcome would be, before having a temper tantrum.
Had he left Disney to its devices, they’d be continuously on record supporting very specific materials that most americans find odious.
And the media (probably including our hosts) would run cover for them and Disney would regroup and turn their corporate efforts against Florida Republicans. After all, it was after the bill passed and Disney made it a point to shift their political efforts against the Florida GOP that DeSantis went to the mattresses. Sorry, but the Florida government refraining from making special carve-outs and exceptions for the Walt Disney Company isn’t some sort of odious punishment. It’s what they ought to be doing anyway. If you’re a libertarian, you shouldn’t be complaining that Florida stopped picking Disney as a winner. You should be complaining that they were picking winners and losers in the first place.
That leads to an interesting idea. If DeSantis had taken the high road, the media would have covered up the woke agenda. But the woke media couldn’t resist publicizing DeSantis’s bitch slap, which, unfortunately for them, also publicized the woke agenda for children. Maybe DeSantis actually thought that through, although he is a politician, and it was more likely just the typical political knee jerk reaction.
Correct
If he really thought that far ahead, he’s a better politician than I expected. I suspect that he did it primarily because he knows that, post-Trump, GOP voters are going to expect their leaders to engage in the culture war, irrespective of how much the media whine about it.
^This^ a large portion of GOP now crave that kind of responsiveness.
Maybe DeSantis actually thought that through, although he is a politician, and it was more likely just the typical political knee jerk reaction.
Again, they aren’t 12D chess geniuses. They are conventional 2D chess/checkers players opposed by people who struggle to be one dimensional.
Speculation is hearsay with no offer to bet money on the prediction.
The woke crowd plays their own rules, and would have turned on DeSantis regardless. His anti-Disney bitch slap was fun to watch, and maybe he figured it was worth it anyway. Sitting back and ignoring the woke agenda is no ore useful than ignoring any other thugs.
Yea, being a pussy taking the high road has been working out so well!
The usual MAGA crowd pretending to be principled libertarians, who don’t believe in the 1st amendment, is an amusing is repellent sight.
They are OK with the full power of the state being used to punish those who criticize the state as long as they don’t agree with the speech.
You are some confused mother-fuckers.
Who are you talking about? Names and quotes, please.
Everyone discussing DeSantis on this board so far – except me.
What in the First Amendment protects the woke agenda for children, such as pumping them full of puberty blockers and excising pieces of anatomy?
Of course you are welcome to your opinion about the Florida legislation but hopefully you realize it is not definitive and others – including the Disney CEO who has interests in Florida – may disagree. That’s probably a vain hope.
“Everyone discussing DeSantis on this board so far – except me.”
Everyone commenting on an ostensibly libertarian website has a different opinion than you?
How strange. Must be MAGA’s fault.
Yeah, couldn’t be the actual positive support for a MAGA governor using the full weight of the government as punishment against someone saying something he didn’t like.
That’s not what happened. Having to be like any other Florida company isn’t “punishment” by any metric. But you’re here to lie, so okay.
Joe, you’re just mad that a Republican dared to hit back. Get used to it. It’s time to make you Marxist shitbags hurt after everything you’ve done.
“Yeah, couldn’t be the actual positive support for a MAGA governor using the full weight of the government as punishment”
Interesting way of describing removing corporate welfare from a large corporation.
I repeat my question which you refused to answer:
I answered A:
“Of course you are welcome to your opinion about the Florida legislation but hopefully you realize it is not definitive and others – including the Disney CEO who has interests in Florida – may disagree. That’s probably a vain hope.”
You didn’t even come close.
“What in the First Amendment protects the woke agenda for children, such as pumping them full of puberty blockers and excising pieces of anatomy?”
SUCH a loaded question! The 1st amendment doesn’t mention my right to bodily integrity, and-or contract rights. So if I elect to see a cancer surgeon (or have my kid see one), will you object to that, and accuse me of supporting willy-nilly carving up human lives with knives?
They are NOT your children! And the children do not belong to Nosenheimer or Buttinsky either! They belong to themselves! What does the 1st amendment have to do with THAT?
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Disney’s CEO’s interests do not extend to our schools unless he needs his casting couch warmed up.
Plus,
and others – including the Disney CEO who has interests in Florida – may disagree
the ‘interest’ in this case is to join with the largest publicly represented side [by media, dems. school admins, social ‘science’ grads, etc] to engage in a little culture war virtue signaling. Not sure how that was supposed to be a win for Disney but – whatever.
Just what in Disney’s statements spoke of using puberty blockers ? My question is why is it ok to speak to 4th graders? If you are going to ban speaking to students on a subject then you need to include all students. Any teacher that wants to spread this crap will simply move to teach in a different grade.
Don’t you mean hyper or ultra maga?
Quantum MAGA. Crossbred between the darkest wine mom fears of Q-anon and a WaPo certified Jan 6 insurrectionist.
Names and quotes, please.
Joe, you’re a democrat. That means you’re a vicious unprincipled shitweasel. Your kind have been fighting dirty for decades and pulling all kinds of corrupt bullshit. Republicans are increasingly done being punching bags for your kind. They’re starting to hit back, and hard.
You democrats don’t like it when your victims fight back. But you had better get used to it. Republicans, and the rest of America, have had enough. Best you and your evil friends crawl back under your rocks, while you can.
It’s going to get real fucking bad for you. I look forward to that.
1st amendment doesn’t give business the right for government handouts.
No one has said it does Jesse. No one.
And if that was an issue it would have come up before in the Florida legislature, in the press, in the Governor’s speeches, press conferences, party platform, SOMWHERE!
It didn’t. It has been a complete non-issue in contemporary Florida and with consequences no one has studied, including whether it would somehow end “government handouts”. Maybe, maybe not. Disney runs their own government, including responsibilities. As far as I know, they are not subsidized by the government nor has anyone except you made that claim.
It had come up multiple times in floridas history dummy.
No it hasn’t – show us the links to previous debate or even press mentions.
The favored nations clauses that included Disney had been debated in the legislature multiple times over the decades.
Show us the links Jesse. Put up or shut up.
Thank goodness you’re dumb.
Here’s an article mentioning Republicans wanting to strip Reedy Creek of its status in 1990.
“Disney’s image took a beating last January, when a Disney-controlled development body in Florida won all of a $57-million allocation of tax-free state bonds, thus denying them to an agency that planned to develop low-income housing and all other government applicants in a six-county area. The state distributes the bonds on a first-come basis, and first in line this year was Disney’s Reedy Creek Improvement District, which was created by the Florida legislature in 1967 to develop and govern the 28,000-acre Disney properties.
A firestorm of criticism ensued. In a state where Disney was once above reproach, a Republican gubernatorial candidate sued to block Disney from using the bonds. A state legislator introduced a bill to limit Disney’s ability to reapply for the securities and, before the furor abated, there was new talk of stripping the company of its unique governmental powers.“
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1990-07-08-fi-486-story.html
They’ve been debating this since the seventies.
Do you want more, “Joe”? Because I’m willing to make your rubble bounce.
ML. Helping willfully ignorant people like Joe never helps. He will pretend you never gave him the citation tomorrow.
Over 1.5 hours after a link was posted, and no Joe.
Thanks for the article from 1990, but it’s not about the pros and cons of Disney’s special district status, but Disney’s tough business practices and the winning of Florida state bonds they won in competition with other plans. So, that’s how controversial it has been – 32 years ago it was brought up as aside in an out of state newspaper.
Show me more!
Unlike you apparently R mac, I have a life and family.
Looks like Joe ran like a little bitch. As usual.
You didnt admit you were wrong Joe. Why?
“32 years ago it was brought up as aside in an out of state newspaper.”
Are you deliberately ignoring what the 32-year-old article establishes on purpose, because it completely invalidates your claim that “if that was an issue it would have come up before in the Florida legislature, in the press, in the Governor’s speeches, press conferences, party platform, SOMWHERE!”, or because you’re retarded?
That article clearly shows that the issue did come up before in the Florida legislature, and in the press, and in a governor candidate’s speeches.
Your sealioning demand was totally met. At this point any reasonable person would apologize to the rest of us for being such a disingenuous fuck.
“Unlike you apparently R mac, I have a life and family.”
Cite?
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/04/21/disney-special-district-florida-taxpayers-could-face-a-1-billion-debt-bomb-if-dissolved.html
Florida taxpayers could face a $1 billion Disney debt bomb if its special district status is revoked
MAGA MAGGOTS just absolutely LOVE to punish-punish-PUNISH the taxpayers, so long as they get to rant and rave as the scraps of cultural red meat are thrown around to Alex Jones and his supporters! Punish EVERYONE, so long as I get to satisfy my obsession with MY particular punishment boner!
If we’re talking about excising some anatomy around here… Why not try cutting off some WAAAAY excessive “punishment boners”? We’d ALL be better off!
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Biden opposed arming Ukraine until after, well, they gave his son lots and lots of money.
No problem there, though.
That is the implications of your post dummy.
Be specific – that makes no sense.
You are making claims the 1a is violated here despite nothing being criminalized for speech. Nothing said “you shall not say x if you want y.” It was the discontinuation of a favored nations clause in government. Businesses have no rights to these carve outs.
Your entire argument is infantile.
Jesse, you are justifying punitive legislation from a state government targeting a citizen for criticizing them. Your ignorant support of that legislation – you, like everyone else has no idea what the ramifications are – is irrelevant. By the way it is not about “favored nations clause”, as if that was a thing in Florida governance. It is not.
What’s “punitive” about being treated like anyone else, “Joe”.
It isnt punative to remove isolated benefits.
There is no “everyone else” Mother, you idiot. Disney is the largest theme park in the world, is based on 27,000 acres of Florida swamp, and was granted a special district control of their unique investment which they have been wildly successful with. That included responsibilities and rights. Maybe they are somehow unfair and if someone thinks so, how about having hearings, staff reports, input from neighboring counties, all the things that go into far reaching and serious legislation. The fact that none of this happened tells anyone but the idiots here that it was not based on substance but on revenge. And you jerk offs act the fool and claim bad and “unequal” treatment was originally granted but can’t be specific. Equal to what? Who else did this?
Joe, ML gave you that link you asked for upthread. You didn’t read it, did you?
Wow. I thought he would wait a day until he conveniently forgot about the link. I was wrong.
“Which they have been wildly successful with.”
Oh they certainly have. If some government gave me my own personal fiefdom to rule, I bet I could get wealthy as fuck off it too.
“Equal to what? Who else did this?”
Now I know you’re reading off a Media Matters PDF. Five other special districts in the state were dissolved along with Reedy Creek.
https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2022/04/19/what-is-a-special-district-in-florida-heres-an-explanation/
FYI Disney’s other local competition, Universal, SeaWorld and Legoland, do not have special districts to operate in. Now Disney will have to be just like them. What a terrible “punishment”.
Thanks for the link mother. You should read it. Among the gems:
The Villages – that’s the right wing retirement enclave were DeSantis regularly goes to make political announcements, including just last week. I guess he won’t dissolve their special district staus.
Lead GOP legislator Randy Fine: “Disney is a guest in the State of Florida and today we remind them of that,” Fine said. No they’re not. What a fucking attitude toward business, and one that has enriched and grown Orlando and state’s tourism business beyond anyone’s imagination, creating multi-thousands jobs, and tax receipts for local and state governments, not to mention their own employees who live there and may have been born there. By the way., the Daytona Beach Racing and Recreational Facilities District is in Fine’s district. I wonder if he’d say the same about them. “Guests” my ass.
“Reedy Creek encompasses 25,000 acres of land in Orange and Osceola counties “servicing 19 landowners, including Walt Disney Co. and its wholly-owned affiliates,” according to its website. Reedy Creek is responsible for overseeing the land and providing essential services; such as fire protection, wastewater systems, solid waste and recyclable collections, among other services.
If Reedy Creek were to dissolve, those responsibilities would fall to Orange and Osceola counties.”
As noted by Sqrlys above, Florida could incur as much as $1 billion in debt if this goes through – put off for one year. NO ONE KNOWS because the asshole Governor couldn’t wait to review the impact, or get any facts because he saw another headline he knew the dummies like Mother would love and circle the wagons over.
“What’s “punitive” about being treated like anyone else, “Joe”.” Also sprach Mammary-Fuhrer.
How do we EVER make progress with THIS kind of mentality? ALL persons are PROHIBITED from hiding and sheltering escaped slaves, witches, warlocks, illegal sub-humans, and heretics of ALL kinds! And here YOU are, asking for a A SPECIAL EXEMPTION from these prohibitions, “Mother’s Lament”! NO special clauses for YOU, bitch!
Have you authoritarians ever heard of polycentralism? When a corporation or other association (like Disney) gets a carve-out from Government Almighty, and they provide their OWN public services, outside of the all-encompassing greedy clutch of Government Almighty, then, within reason (little if any individual freedom is lost), this is PROGRESS! NOT all powers to the one and only Mighty Government Almighty!
But I would NOT expect totalitarian power pigs to see this, indeed!
I’m a free-market libertarian, sure, but I am also a “poly-centrist”… We do NOT just need ONE political party; we need more than one! And we need “power” (soft power at least) shared with comedians and churches and mosques and temples and poets, priests, and artists, as well as politicians! In a dictatorship, the dictator typically tries VERY hard to shut down ALL other voices! The comedians may NOT make jokes about the dictator! That’s not what I want… So, unlike the shrill voices of the authoritarian conservatives on comment boards, I am glad that not ALL power goes to Mighty Government Almighty!
Give up Your Perfect Power Lust, bitch!
Disney had to give up some of their political power lust by being treated like everyone else – and the Sqrlsys and Joe Fridays are beautifying their faces with leftist tears. So good.
“As noted by Sqrlys above, Florida could incur as much as $1 billion in debt if this goes through – put off for one year. NO ONE KNOWS because the asshole Governor couldn’t wait to review the impact, or get any facts because he saw another headline he knew the dummies like Mother would love and circle the wagons over.”
Because FL would not simply bill Disney the taxes necessary to honor the obligations….
damikesc presumably scratches his own ass, w/o burdening the taxpayers, or Government Almighty, about his independent ass-scratching! Hooray for damikesc!!!
Let’s take AWAY from damikesc, his self-sufficient ass-scratching, and have Government Almighty do it FOR him, instead, then simply bill damikesc the taxes necessary to honor the obligations!!!
I think DeSantis missed an opportunity to be the better man here.
DeSantis chose to defend families, parental rights and children. He did the right thing because Republicans lack a spine and Democrats are groomers with their barbaric “gender affirming hormones”
DeSantis was a Navy JAG attorney. He knows what he is up against: evil
I disagree and I actually think he took a very Trumpian/incidentally libertarian* position when accidentally mashing the hot button. That is, exactly how pervasive and/or longstanding does corporate capture get before libertarians accept a unified front of fascism in place of actual free markets? Do libertarians support an active government defense of free speech as free speech?
*As opposed to ‘the other side’s’ “Yes, Facebook has the right to shut down dissenters on behalf of the government, they should have more. And yes Disney has the right to thwart both lawmakers and popular consensus in the effort to groom school children, we should grant them further copyright protection and tax exemptions.”
Quite a few libertarians seem content with corporate fascism and well hidden government influence. Well people calling themselves libertarian at least.
Quite a few libertarians still think there’s a nice and conventional way out.
I get it- the truth of current circumstances and what it will take to keep things from getting catastrophically worse is horrifying.
Unfortunately, it is what it is.
Nope. It’s tie, to take the left down. Using any means available. They’ve brought this on themselves.
American freedom > democrat lives
It’s always fun seeing libertarians defending government perks and carve-outs because they come up at an inconvenient time. Sorry but if pushing pedos on kids is the nudge it took to get the issue passed, so be it.
Neither one of us knows the details of Disney’s special district status, but have you considered the possibility that what Disney did in Florida might be a libertarian dream? Private company takes all rights and responsibilities for it’s development of previous swamp land and is wildly successful – no government involvement, they are their own government. Doesn’t turn me on particularly, but I’m not an antigovernment libertarian, or libertarian of any kind.
Why do you keep assuming everyone is as ignorant as you?
Because that’s what he’s paid to do.
“You do not fight with honor!”
Bronn: (Pointing at the man he had just killed and thrown out a window) “No, he did.”
You may think that effective but the woke have already overcome that. It’s better to show business there is a tangible cost, this gives the non-woke people inside the business a tool to oppose the woke.
Retaliatory Culture Warrior?
Maybe in the way the Chinese built the Great Wall to keep the invading Mongol Hordes out.
Yeah. Big difference between retaliation and defense.
There everyone was, just minding their own business when… ALL OF A SUDDEN!
Yes.
My answer from 20 years ago is still good; see the essays linked from the bottom of http://users.bestweb.net/~robgood/political.html . The answers are that political parties are useful ways for libertarian activists to proceed, as long as the political party isn’t specifically libertarian and in the USA. You’re at your most influential in any system, such as an organization, where they’re about 50% in agreement and 50% in disagreement with you; it’s then at equipoise so you have your best chance of moving it in your desired direction.
Political parties are the only way for the roughly like-minded to pool their influence into politics.
But that means a really old fashioned political party. Basically the machine type organization. That has a bunch of value outside election day – to help people find jobs, get bureaucrats to take action, serve as a social/civic association, etc. With that kind of org, getting outhe vote almost incidental.
The DeRps still are that type of party for two groups – unions for D’s and churches for R’s. But for every other group, those parties are purely an election day thing. And for that, the modern party requires top down messaging and manipulate where the voter is merely the object and pollsters/donors/consultants/pols run things for their benefit
“…unions for D’s and churches for R’s…”
Dim-witted cliche’s for JFree.
The DeRps still are that type of party for two groups – unions for D’s
Dem quid pro quo is not limited or even primarily offered to unions. Their offer is government employment. They want jobs paid enough for a lush life with zero performance accountability. If you consider this whenever you read a “socialist” you’ll see they are trying to replicate these features into the “private” sector so they can take credit for delivering this to everyone without having to pay for it.
I see little reason to believe Ron DeSantis is any more or any less retaliatory than any other politician. Because the Disney situation isn’t about vindictive retribution. In the wake of the anti-grooming bill Disney decided to put its lobbying and PR resources to work against DeSantis and the Florida GOP. And DeSantis and the Florida GOP responded like any other group targeted by an organized opposition, by attacking the organization targeting them. Anyone who thinks this is somehow an unusual situation in politics is, well, an idiot. I can cite off memory at least a dozen examples of Democrats doing just that in the last decade or so. And fundamentally, DeSantis’s “targeting” of Disney amounts to revoking cronyist privileges that the state of Florida had granted them. Maybe I’ve missed something, but I never knew libertarianism was about the divine right of political cronies to enjoy their grants of government privilege.
“Because the Disney situation isn’t about vindictive retribution.”
Of course it is. Are you blind dumb and deaf?
Using the power of the state to “respond(ed) like any other group targeted by an organized opposition, by attacking the organization targeting them.” is an abuse of power given to you by the people of the state, it’s not yours.
If ypou think this is normal, please, give us another example, and please, be sure to note that the legislation used to punish was about an extremely complicated situation with not easily seen consequences of importance to neighboring counties, Disney, the state, and the state’s economy, and that no committee hearings of substance occurred before being rushed through, no public or expert comment, no legislative staff study, and most importantly no previous discussion among anyone about doing this or clarifying debate the “issue”, if there was one. NOTHING!
But it’s ok to use the power of the state to implement the woke agenda for children, such as puberty blockers, genitalia surgery, racist ideology, and all the rest of that trash.
A, as you must know, your opinion of what the Florida legislation does is not definitive and the end of debate, any more than what the CEO of Disney says about it. Only one of you had the full power of the state dumped on you and/or your business for expressing your opinion.
It sucks when your own tactics are turned on you, isn’t it?
I’d mention the dozens of stories of Politicians not allowing this or that business into their district because of something something social justice abortion/trans/gay/LGBTQIA2+QWERTY rights, but we’re all friends here.
Florida also didn’t push new regulations on Disney. They removed a policy that effected very few corporations and was already a violation of equal treatment.
Jesse, is it your opinion that there are very many corporations out there, but especially in Florida, that wanted to own 27,000 acres (largest theme park in the world) of swamp to make money of course, but also spark the explosion of business in the formally sleepy burg of Orlando, and if so, how many would be willing to take full responsibility for governing their area, which by all accounts they do well. Until you have a list, I don’t see how you can claim unequal treatment.
You are arguing uniqueness for a government hand out. I clearly am against any favored nations clauses.
What don’t you understand?
Can we keep this short and just say what Joe doesn’t understand is close to everything.
All Joe knows is that someone was a big meanie to democrats, regardless of the provocation. The only thing else that he knows are the talking points given to him by Media Matters, Think Progress, etc..
He is an empty vessel with an empty head.
Ted you doofus, Disney was one of the GOP and DeSantis biggest contributors – about $200k to his PAC in the last 3 years.
I don’t read Media Matter or Think Progress.
So you get DNC talking points? Or from somewhere else? Regardless, you democrats are making war against anyone who gets in your way. Now your victims are hitting back. Don’t ever expect us to submit to your perverted and frequently treasonous agenda.
Sure Ted, you don’t regurgitate talking points.
Try reading a newspaper doofus.
Like the newspaper you dismissed above joe?
Jesse, what was the handout? Please be specific for a change, and why didn’t DeSantis or anyone in the state legislature bring it up until Disney pissed them off.
Their regulatory structure dumbass.
Please describe this regulatory structure for us Jesse. I thought you didn’t like government control.
Are you this fucking retarded Joe? Out of control or favored application the latter is far more insidious. It is the favorite if authoritariana and tyrants. Make everything illegal and who it applies to.
If laws exist they need to apply equally or we are not a nation of laws.
I’m not an anarchist dumbass.
Jesse, you don’t know what you are talking about and keep doubling down on it. Disney took both responsibility and rights with their special district. Without deep analysis – which the state legislature and DeSantis did not do – we don’t know if it was a deal or not and whether neighboring counties would be better or worse off without it. We do know that Disneyworld thrived and in the process generated jobs, income, growth, and tax receipts for the state and neighboring governments.
Did you know that The Villages retirement community – the venue of choice for right wing Republican politicians and where DeSantis often makes public announcement – has it’s own special district. By your reasoning that must be a scam and give away, but don’t bet your house on DeSantis removing it.
What “deep analysis” yields when done by left-wingers can be seen in the last 2+ years of public health policy.
Dismissed.
Clearly the core concept.
“Jesse, is it your opinion that there are very many corporations out there, but especially in Florida, that wanted to own 27,000 acres (largest theme park in the world) of swamp to make money of course, but also spark the explosion of business in the formally sleepy burg of Orlando, and if so, how many would be willing to take full responsibility for governing their area, which by all accounts they do well. Until you have a list, I don’t see how you can claim unequal treatment.”
Yes, most companies would happily avoid most red tape if permitted to do so.
Don’t be polite. Let’s hear about it or we’ll have to assume you’re full of shit.
Who’s “we”.
Reasonable people, who admittedly do not abound on this board.
Well let’s see here.
That’s bad – I agree with you. Now your turn.
His turn to what? Keep giving more examples that you’re a disingenuous, ignorant little shit?
Take a principled position. She’d be the first one of the “libertarians” here to do so on this issue.
I just agreed with her on her post and you’re just as mad as before. By the way, I’m running circles around you and the others here who know nothing about the subject but are perfectly willing to fill in the blanks to support the Governor’s attack on business and free speech because you’re MAGA zombies.
You agreed after denying other examples existed then ignored they did again just below.
? English please.
Lol Joe Friday can’t parse English. Even I can do that:
“You agreed after denying other examples existed, then again ignored they did [existed], just below.”
Is your verbal iq caught up now?
And.
That’s bad – I agree with you. Now your turn.
Jesse took to school. Just admit he’s right and you’re wrong.
And of course.
Now in this case, this one is kind of on Amazon. I mean… what in fuck’s name were they thinking even trying to do business in New York? I mean, who does that?
Not the same as your other examples or Disney in Florida. AOC’s bullshit aside, the issue of tax incentives is a valid cause for debate and acceptance or rejection of a deal granted for a business locating. Of course there was no debate about the Disney legislation in Florida which passed in a couple of days though it had not been even on the horizon as an issue before and without any committee hearings of substance, staff study, public and expert comment, or feedback from neighboring counties which will be heavily impacted.
I’m sure you see the difference.
So, you have no standards. Quite shocking.
They really should have taken the Newark deal, which was in the same market but better in nearly every way. Unfortunately we care a great deal in this society about the label.
They didn’t criminalize anything. They removed a favored nation clause in the state code that favored some people. It was already a bad policy. All favored nation aspects are.
Jesse, to repeat, this has been a complete non-issue in Florida since it happened 50 years ago, and as far as any of us know – including the DeSantis – this could end up costing the 2 neighboring counties who will have to assume the responsibilities for the area Disney inhabits and who knows how many jobs if Disney retaliates or suffers significantly (Disney is the touchstone of the state’s tourism industry and especially in the Orlando area).
You think it’s bad policy. Fine. Got it. That doesn’t make it some sort of unusual thing. Politicians have been rewarding their friends and punishing their enemies since time immemorial.
Not like this one, but even if true, you and other “libertarians” refusing to criticize it, and even applauding this attack on the 1st amendment says what most of you are about – it’s not freedom, free speech, or libertarianism.
No libertarian should ever support favored nation clauses. If a law or benefit is good enough for one it is good for all.
So, you oppose the special district the The Villages retirement community and favored site for DeSantis public announcements holds. Do you think he’ll remove their SD status?
Why do you want to take housing away from the Elderly?
Joe, it was the right call, and if you like the timing, tough shit. Everyone else is sick of progtards trying to victim bully the vast majority of Americans to dignify their idiocy, and their perversions.
But I’ll tell you what sugarbear. You’re free to not like it, all you want.
(Disney is the touchstone of the state’s tourism industry and especially in the Orlando area).
Bwahahahaha
Act Blue is providing you pathetic talking points. Go to Florida and get some sun on the beach. Youre delirious in your mancave with low Vitamin D levels
I’ve been to Florida a half dozen times. Never Disney world.
Same.
You’re not missing anything. Been twice and regretted it both times.
Unlike you jack off, I don’t get talking points. I read the news, always have, and have principles.
Haha, good one Asshole Joe.
He may be gay, but I don’t think he would ever lower himself to jack off with the likes of you. Your assumption that he would is not very pride friendly, and a micro aggression.
I should turn you in to GLAAD for cancellation.
Not what I meant Ted, but whatever turns you guys on – not that there is anything wrong with it.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Asshole.
I consider it pretty disgusting, but whatever. I’m not the one getting bottomed by Tony.
We don’t want Joe here.
He can fucking go to the Joisey Shore.
/FloridaMan
To repeat you are full of shit. It has come up multiple times during legislative sessions in Florida.
Favored nation clauses are still bad if nobody complains for a few years.
Prove it Jesse. Show us the links.
ML did three hours ago. You ignored it, surprising no one.
Answered above R mac. Get a life.
And then maybe you answer a post every once in a while with substance.
That wasn’t really an answer, it was more dishonest handwaiving.
You didn’t answer fuck.
You pretended it somehow didn’t count because it was in a national newspaper instead of a local Orlando one.
Your article was from 32 years ago you fool. That counts as controversy in your mind?
Joe. Mout put the words.
“It has come up in the past.”
ML provided the link showing it did. You asked for citations it did. You keep now dismissing it.
Your article was from 32 years ago you fool. That counts as controversy in your mind?
It has to be exhausting moving those goalposts around, you marxist waste of carbon molecules.
You guys will jump through any hoop. No, something that there is a link for that happened 32 years ago is not a controversial issue.
OT, but could Jeffy in reality be Brian Stelter?
Cite?
I’m not quite sure what it is Joe believes, whether it’s that Democratic politicians don’t have a history of rewarding their friends and punishing their enemies or whether it thinks its only a problem if Republicans respond in kind.
Bill, I will oppose a similarly abusive action by a democratic government and legislature. Let me note however that Disney was one of if not the biggest contributors to both DeSantis and the GOP in the last several years.
“DeSantis’ political committee received three contributions from Disney totaling $100,000 and a $6,809 in-kind contribution for “food and beverage,” likely catering for a fundraiser or some other campaign event. Disney gave DeSantis $50,000 in 2019 and $50,000 in 2021.”
And here Joe thinks it is abusive to remove carve outs for favored business.
Jesse does not know what the agreement was or if it was a carve out – there is literally no comparable situation to compare it to and Disney has both rights and responsibilities under the agreement. Yeah, maybe it’s not fair, but Jesse doesn’t know that or care and no one in the state legislature or DeSantis had made that claim prior to their act to punish Disney for criticizing them.
Joe, this is all beyond your understanding. You’re really just mad because DeSantis won’t let democrats groom small children, and that he fought back against Disney when they shilled for democrat interests and lied. The only principle you adhere to is democrat power.
DeSantis received $100k from Disney in 2021 doofus.
Demon-Craps are grooming our small children! Man the battle stations! All who are NOT Members in Good Standing with the Republican-Amish-Islamic Church-Mosque are groomers, vampires, Satanists, blasphemers, idolaters, and infidels! Conform or be cast out!
Have these kinds of methods been tried before? What were the results?
“Have these kinds of methods been tried before? What were the results?”
You mean publicly indoctrinating kids and private companies engaging in propaganda? Yeah, I don’t know, what were the results?
Your continued ignorance is entertaining.
All who do NOT take as many “smart pills” as R Mac does, and agree with R Mac precisely, are “ignorant”. Conform or be cast out!
Doesn’t take a single one of those pills to deal with you, hun. :*
But not abusive for perverts to groom small children.
If ypou (sic) think this is normal, please, give us another example
The State of New York literally spent millions of dollars on an investigation of Donald Trump that the sitting State Attorney General ran a campaign plank on conducting with the express purpose of finding some violation of the law to hang him on.
The mayors of Chicago and Boston have both said that they will disallow Chick-fil-A from opening any franchises in their cities because of their stand on same sex marriage.
The IRS was on record slow tracking the approvals of Tea Party affiliated groups for tax exempt status.
The NLRB targeting The Federalist for a joke e-mail sent by the publisher to his staff.
Shall I go on?
Bill, none of those are about passing legislation targeting a person or business because they voiced an opinion unpleasant to the ears of the government.
PS The IRS did not slow traffic Tea Party applications because they were conservative but because they inappropriately used organization names – including progressive organizations – as clues to which ones my not be legitimate for exempt status. The Inspector General faulted the (overworked and low budgeted) Department for using that shortcut, but found no evidence of targeting for political reasons. I don’t know about the legitimacy of your other examples.
The IRS literally publicly apologized for targeting conservative groups dumbass.
No, Joe is right here. They did not apologize for *targeting* conservative groups. They apologized for *how they treated* conservative groups. It is an important distinction.
They did not say “We targeted conservative groups for extra scrutiny because of their political views and for that we’re sorry.”
They said “We apologize for the heightened scrutiny and inordinate delays for these conservative groups.”
They never said they specifically targeted conservative groups for their political views, because they didn’t. As Joe said, the IRS also subjected some progressive groups for heightened scrutiny.
Here is a news article on the subject:
https://www.npr.org/2017/10/27/560308997/irs-apologizes-for-aggressive-scrutiny-of-conservative-groups
But at this point, it is so embedded in the right-wing canon that Obama personally directed the IRS to target those uppity Tea Party groups for threatening his liberal agenda, that it’s impossible to change anyone’s mind on the subject.
“No, Joe is right here. They did not apologize for *targeting* conservative groups. They apologized for *how they treated* conservative groups. It is an important distinction.”
LMAO. You’re such a fucking joke.
‘Libertarian Jeffy’ giving cover to Obama. What a surprise.
“But at this point, it is so embedded in the right-wing canon that Obama personally directed the IRS to target those uppity Tea Party groups for threatening his liberal agenda, that it’s impossible to change anyone’s mind on the subject.”
Because if you claim otherwise you’d be flat-out lying, you disingenuous fuck.
Nope. What I wrote above is the truth. Your story is the right-wing oppression narrative.
This is pathetic even for you jeff.
Is it though?
“They never said they specifically targeted conservative groups for their political views, because they didn’t. As Joe said, the IRS also subjected some progressive groups for heightened scrutiny.”
That has been debunked. Several times.
Where?
You’re wrong, They apologized for targeting applicant’s based on their name, including progressive groups, of which examples were presented in the thorough report of Sep 2017. Since organizations cannot be tax exempt if they are engaged in political activities, the short hand use of organization names as keys to further investigation, made sense – and that included words like “green”, “progressive”, and “tea Party” – but was counter to IRS official policy. That was the apology, not for targeting based on the organizations’ politics.
Oh bullshit. They wanted to hobble Tea Party related groups. Next you’ll be defending Operation Chokepoint.
Sorry the facts don’t support you Ted and you don’t care.
They actually do.
Yeah, they do. Oh, I noticed that you didn’t condemn Operation Chokepoint. What a surprise.
This is why it’s pointless to bother with asshole Joe. He asks for examples, many of which have been discussed here repeatedly over the years, then when given them, hand waves them away.
It’s best to tell him to fuck off.
R mac, I don’t hand wave anything off. As demonstrated above by chemjeff and myself, Jesse was wrong and you obviously have nothing intelligent to add to the discussion.
Bill gave the examples you hand waived away not Jesse dumbfuck.
I answered his post with a substantive response asshole. Try it sometime.
Still haven’t figured out how those dotted lines on the left of the page work, huh smart guy?
https://reason.com/podcast/2022/06/06/is-desantis-a-principled-governor-or-a-retaliatory-culture-warrior/?comments=true#comment-9530879
OOOH, internet tough guy! That’s like an Eskimo bathing beauty.
Watch your mouth. We’re doing you a fucking favors by even interacting with you. Not to mention letting you people live.
Kiss my ass dummy.
Kiss my ass dummy.
I’d rather kick the shit out of it so your buddy SQRLSY can get his dinner.
Joe, my IQ is several,dozen points higher than yours. As is almost everyone here, but the usual basket of progtardables. So casting aspersions on my intellect doesn’t help your case.
But then, you’re too stupid to understand that.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
OK, Fucktard … Time for you to join Squirlsy in Muted Progland
“Of course it is. Are you blind dumb and deaf?”
No, but you are Joe. You’re seen here universally as a buffoon. And a propagandized, ignorant one at that. No one looks forward to interacting with you. This is likely true in other aspects of your life. My guess is that in a gathering, you are ignored like Biden was recently when Obama visited the White House.
The opposition to DeSantis, btw
https://twitter.com/DWUhlfelderLaw/status/1533885262174072838?t=tO_lML9VcecYG-LnXFcyVg&s=19
My great grandparents died in Nazi Germany. I know a fascist when I see one. Ron DeSantis is a fascist.
I don’t twitter so you’ll have to tell me how this story played out. I’m really curious. What happened to the guy? Did he fall out of the guard tower he was manning at the concentration camp?
I’m assuming his grandparents were either wearing Hugo Boss or were marching on Berlin from the East.
Conan on what is best in life:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oo9buo9Mtos
And nobody at Reason is a bigger and more projecting lefty culture warrior than Park Slope We;chie Boy, the fugazi’s fugazi.
Well my takeaway here is that this guy DiSantis is the biggest threat to liberty since like literally Hitler. Seeking guidance I took a look at the latest endorsees of the libertarians at Reason. Hmm. Looks like most of the editors promoted HRC and Biden. Hate to lose my status as a small l libertarian but I gotta say I may fall from grace and vote for this guy if the alternative is Biden.
Hate to lose my status as a small l libertarian but I gotta say I may fall from grace and vote for this guy if the alternative is Biden.
news flash: there are more than two candidates on the ballot
Yeah but the third party was just taken over by a bunch of racists, right Jeffy? Now what?
Practically hitlers.
Just vote Democrat like him then go to random boards pretending you aren’t a leftist.
He could make a stronger argument if he did admit he’s a democrat. I’m not sure what advantage he hopes to gain through such a deception.
Does DeSantis stand for Individual Liberty and Justice for all or is his Anti-Liberty laws just ‘retaliation’ against the Nazi-Regime????
Tough question to answer until the Nazi-Regime is conquered but I think trying to force the press to host his news goes way too far…
Guess who got fired from the Washington Post for a sexist retweet? Go ahead, guess? And guess where he used to work? Go ahead, guess.
Don’t tease me like this bro. Has he really been outright fired or just suspended for a while? I feel like he already got suspended once before a few years ago and eventually came back.
You are referring to Dave Weigel? Well, this CNN article says he was suspended for a month, not that he was fired.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/06/media/dave-weigel-washington-post-suspended/index.html
What I don’t understand is, why would he retweet a joke like that *under his own name*? He should know at this point that, rightly or wrongly, that type of joke would likely come with some level of professional consequences. Why not use a pseudonym, like most of Twitter?
Jeff is more concerned with jokes than the multiple embarrassing corrections wapo has had the last few weeks on articles.
Jesse is more concerned with acting like a troll and stirring up shit than in having an intelligent conversation.
Yet you’re obsessed with him.
I mean just this weekend you were claiming how outlets like wapo were so trustworthy unlike those evil right wing sites.
Even here you say nobody should speak freely because of the backlash.
You have so many suitors among the leftists here. I’m almost jealous.
That shit won’t stir itself!
Bark bark!
Jesse doesn’t read sources that issue corrections.
Well, in the case of WaPo, they stealth-edited repeatedly before issuing a correction. Seems odd that Taylor seems to be so shit at her job and has literally zero consequences for being shit at her job.
You are correct, I was told by a friend in a text he was fired, but it looks like he was suspended. And the woman who complained had previously sued her employer (wapo) for sexism because they wouldn’t assign her to something related to #MeToo and she claims to be a sexual assault survivor. So for better or worse, the WaPo is well aware of what they’re dealing with.
I’m too lazy to link the article I read, but ye FUCKING gods so-called “respectable” journalism is a fucking shit show of jr high locker room bickering. And I mean that. There has to be a better way of describing it. Perhaps one of more literary commenters could take a stab but holy shit, anyone who gets into mainstream journalism literally deserves whatever they get.
What I don’t understand is, why would he retweet a joke like that *under his own name*?
I have to agree with you here. Not because I believe he deserved it, but for fuck sakes, you work at the washington post and your cubicle is next to a woman who’s obsessed with #MeToo allegations and sued your boss over them. What on earth do you expect to happen?
Why not use a pseudonym, like most of Twitter?
As I said, Twitter is the greatest invention in journalism since the printing press and I mean that. Journalists can’t keep their mouths shut. You want to know what bias you thought you were smelling when you read that article on X? Go to the writer’s twitter feed and all will be revealed.
I enjoyed this one.
Weigel needs to hurry up and go trans.
Dunno if he can … we have his CockRing …
Congrats to Claptrap for being the first one in ALL of these posts to mention the word “bullying”!
Now who (besides me) will bother to point out that all of the hate-spewing by “Team R” against trans and gays, is firmly linked to bullying in the schools? Of gays and trans, of course! NORMALIZE that bullying! No matter how many bullied school kids (bullied for ANY reason) commit suicide, you hate-mongers will cheer on the bullies, and tell their victims to “toughen up”!
If this had been the Alex Jones Amusement Park that was getting “special carve-outs” (doing for itself, what Government Almighty normally does, WITHOUT violating any individual rights), and Alex Jones’s “Park” included a “Smoggy-Smartsless Skool of “R” Party Wizards, Witches, and Bullying of the Trans and Gay Kids and Other Weirdoes”, then would the “R” Party troglodytes be cheering on the effort to take away the “special carve-outs” of the Alex Jones Amusement Park?
Tribalism ALL the way, Baby!
for better or worse, the WaPo is well aware of what they’re dealing with.
Yeah, Sonmez is certainly acting like someone begging to be fired so she can launch a lawsuit in response and coast on her victimhood for the next forty years. If Taylor Lorenz continues to go all Patrick Ewing under the bright lights then they should just slide Sonmez into that role with lots of fanfare, giving her all the rope she needs to do the same.
Weigel actually defended this same woman publicly when she was threatened with suspension for her Twitter comments.
Wow. Lefties really have the gratitude of piranha.
Since it’s in partly structured on having no fixed morality, it tends to attract sociopaths. The only time I’ve ever seen anything approaching empathy is when they use phony concern to attack sk even or justify something horrible.
That should not make me laugh and smile so…but it does. Fuck him.
I’m too lazy to link the article I read, but ye FUCKING gods so-called “respectable” journalism is a fucking shit show of jr high locker room bickering.
At least 2 generations in this country thought the Harry Potter novels were the greatest collection of literature in the western canon, at least until the author revealed herself to be an anti-troon feminist. The journalists are simply reflecting the state of today’s adults.
“What I don’t understand is, why would he retweet a joke like that *under his own name*? He should know at this point that, rightly or wrongly, that type of joke would likely come with some level of professional consequences. Why not use a pseudonym, like most of Twitter?”
You don’t seem a bit concerned that a joke would have “professional consequences”. He apologized, though, so Dave honestly warrants all of the negative treatment. Fucking pussy.
Technically a 1 month suspension. But the journalist who has now had 2 articles in a row full of lies and corrections remains there.
Last I saw he resigned after they suspended him.
That joke was funny.
https://twitter.com/miltimore79/status/1533988316923691014?t=mpwUcxBvw0ishIK9TyBFDw&s=19
An actual fact check from @PolitiFact explaining how Nazis confiscating Jews’ guns was “trivial” and didn’t contribute to the Holocaust.
[Link]
Careful, you’re going to conjure up Misek with use of the ‘H word’.
“Trump – Threat or Menace?”
Look, “labeling” the guy is exactly what TDS-addled assholes did with Trump; makes it easy to dismiss him as a result of YOUR choice of labels, not HIS actions.
I didn’t like Trump one bit prior to his election; loud-mouthed, blithering idiot. But his election at least assured us we didn’t get HRC’s choice to capsize SCOTUS to port.
And then we got DeVos, Kavanaugh, Ajit Pai, U/E at 3%, US Mfg Index at 33-year high, withdrawal from the Paris clusterfuck, tax cuts and more.
Been around for a while, and AFAICS, that makes him the best POTUS since Silent Cal.
Regardless, TDS addled shit-piles like Brandyshit, the fucking ignoramus Lumberjack, Sullum and others were still whining that ‘he isn’t libertarian’ while they continue their H/S sophomoric focus on his personality and MEAN TWEETS!
STFU. Let’s see what the man delivers before the chattering classes make asses of themselves again and help to deliver another droolin’ Joe, Welsh. Yes you; STFU.
None of that matters. It’s unarguable that this Biden administration is a disaster, and Reason shilled for him during the campaign, and they’re still attacking Republicans running in the midterms.
I’ll argue that all day. The table was set for inflation, oil prices, and Afghanistan by preceding events and if you recall, 2020 was a worse year.
Joe Friday
June.6.2022 at 10:28 pm
Unlike you apparently R mac, I have a life and family.
47 comments in less than 12 hours by JF. Not that his “family” has noticed his absence.
Your handlers are not sending us their better trolls.
2020 was a worse year because so many states shut down for almost the entire year.
I am sure inflation et al were just waiting to shoot up once Trump left office. Of course. Explains gas prices doubling under the drooler in chief.
High oil prices are a world wide event and nothing Biden has done or not done, or what Trump did or did not do has impacted them. US Oil production is on a steady climb up from 2020, that slump of course due to Covid, not Trump.
PS Covid relief bills passed under both Trump and Biden and with bi-partisan support are increasing already high world wide inflation. In the Covid relief bill passed under Biden, Trump was advocating for a higher individual pay out. The federal deficit increased every year under Trump.
PS PS Damik, the 2020 slowdown was world wide and caused by Covid, not governors in blue states, but nice try.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Joe Asshole.
Those states didn’t shut themselves down. Of course, you defend democrats no matter what, so I’m sure you find them entirely blameless.
Ted you idiot, the entire world shut down and that’s why we have an international crisis of supply, inflation, and high oil prices. How dumb are you?
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Fuck off and die, Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Are the writers of Reason libertarians or progressive hacks? You all have been licking the DNC jackboots for so long you cannot recall the last independent thought you had.
Biden Administration weaponizing school lunch program to force states and school districts to implement transgender affirming policies.
“…It is stunning how aggressively and unabashedly the Biden Administration is violating all principles of federalism demanding that schools implement policies that are arguably unconstitutional.”
That’s OK. The bad thing is when a government withdraws corporate welfare from preferred companies.
So – – –
Democrats starve children!!!!!
DeSantis is a leader, something rare in politics today. But DeSantis is a conservative, not a woke liberal, so of course Reason must find a cause to question his policies.
Disney had an OPINION that DeSantis didn’t like, so he’s marshalling the full strength of the Kulturwar against them. Such as fragile ego. Such a tiny man.
Conservatives: Unable to separate governance from opinions.
Again, treating them like literally every other company in the state is not unfair.
Obama, on the other hand, did try to get banks to stop providing service to gun manufacturers and retailers…
So because Obama did it that makes it right for DeSantis? If Obama jumped off a cliff then DeSantis should to? Why kind of morality is that?
Used to be Conservativeds claimed they were better than Liberals. Now it’s just “Well they did it so I can too!”
The asshole brandyshit is still trying to distract attention from his raging case of TDS.
Damiksec, not sure where you’re getting this talking point, but it’s false. Disney’s deal included them taking total responsibility for their development, including providing governmental services. It wasn’t a give away. I thought you libertarians want less government. By the way, The Villages retirement community where every GOP politician makes a visit, including DeSantis who is there every month to make public announcements, has special district status. Think DeSantis will end it? There are many other special districts in Florida – hundreds if not thousands, including things like Library Boards.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Fuck off and die Asshole.
Desantis has something that both Trump and Biden are bad at — he’s a very good explainer.
If you listen to Desntis’ own explanations about his decisions, he sounds rational and persuasive. As a candidate, I would expect him to pick up voters from both right and left because of that.
Maybe not at the level as “The Great Communicator”, but close.
Maybe, but he has a short fuse and is easily riled.
Translation: he doesn’t take shit from lying leftists, and hits back.
Get ready for more of that. You democrat fuckers have played it dirty, sleazy and nasty for so long now. Trump showed people the way. Hit back and hit back hard. Now democrats will reap the whirlwind.
It’s what you deserve. You should find the rock you crawled out form under, and slither back in. While you can.
Answer: A 2-faction looter Kleptocracy is the ideal delivery mechanism for totalitarian rule–until a small party offers a platform voters can use to signal displeasure with coercion an preference for freedom. A libertarian spoiler vote sends a permanently recorded signal as a way to reveal credible information to Kleptocracy partisans. It is the only reliable way to insist on the repeal of cruel laws by putting both looter factions at risk of losing.
So after a lifetime of leftism, you’re think of becoming a libertarian?
“Is DeSantis a Principled Governor or a Retaliatory Culture Warrior?”
“Jared Polis: The Most Libertarian Governor in America?”
I’m not gonna claim that DeSantis is a “libertarian” but when you’re willing to give the moniker of libertarian to a “moderate” Progressive Democrat (and put out 3 articles to that effect) but question whether or not a fairly limited government Republican Governor is a retaliatory culture warrior it’s pretty easy to see why folks think this magazine has gone progressive.
I live in Colorado, and while I’ll readily admit that Polis is better than my previous Governor on the East Coast, he still isn’t a libertarian. Moreover, on policy, DeSantis is much more libertarian than the Polis. And you don’t need to endorse DeSantis’s “cultural conservatism” to recognize that fact.
Well I guess if Trump can be the most libertarian president since Jackson, then anything goes. Definitions have no meaning, all must follow the kult.
I’ve already pointed out repeatedly that Polis is not a libertarian. He’s just less of a sperg than the left-wing neurotics on the Front Range want him to be.
To TDS-addled shit-piles, facts have no meaning, TDS-addled shit-pile.
No asshole, he just showed you the meaning. In detail. Stop with that shit. No one is buying into it.
What is most libertarian about DeSantis? His dictating the actions of CEOs (not just Disney), local governments, or high school students? If he’s a libertarian, I’m a Viking King.
Fuck off. You’ve threadshitted enough here.
DeSantis is not a libertarian. He has led the State legislation in an orgy of bills taking authority away from local governments and businesses and replacing it with his edicts. This is not a matter of opinion. So, if you like centralized big governement where the governor is on the news everyday telling everyone from high school students to CEOs (not just Disney) what they can and cannot do, he is your guy. I don’t know. Is that what you libertarians believe in?
Whoops forgot that there are no libertarians here only MAGA zombies and of course they like bullies.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
OK soldier, got it. Not everyone here is a pussy like you who can’t defend his position.
Just so everyone is aware, this steaming pile of lefty shit supports murder of unarmed protesters as a preventative action in the event they might sometime later do something this asshole does not like:
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Asshole.
He isn’t Soldier you moron.
I’m not, but the guy claims it IS Joe Asshole.
Well you guys imagine that I am others – including the chicken shit soldier who hides just like Sevo – so I thought that must be standard behavior here.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it’s what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Asshole.
“…who hides just like Sevo…”
Which is but one more lie from the lying piece of shit Joe Asshole.
Do not engage the lying pied of shit Joe Asshole; he deserves insults and nothing more.
Reason doing their typical impression of an NFL Ref, who does not call foul on the egregious penalty, but instead flags the player who retaliates.
The only difference is that sometimes those NFL Refs don’t actually witness the primary offense, while what Reason witnesses they do not see as the problem much less the source of what inevitably follows.
“Are political parties the ideal vessel for advancing libertarian principles?”
Principles? Political parties? … *ahem*
While sympathetic to libertarianism in principle, I cannot help but think of this quip by E.O. Wilson: “Karl Marx was right, socialism works, it is just that he had the wrong species.”
The original Libertarian party has been an effective vehicle for getting bad laws repealed. Remember coathanger abortions? Been drafted and sent to Southeast Asia lately? Noticed the federal workforce has been declining since 1972? Had to bail your kid out of jail for plant leaves? These changes are all the effect of libertarian spoiler vote clout.
I WAS shopping for a house near Tampa. Now, after seeing this Trumpissta governor politician, and the miniature copy of Fulgencio Batista, I got my doubts. One 1930s wag explained Hitler as “a sort of cross between Billy Sunday and William Jennings Bryan.” Nowadays this describes every railing redneck with green teeth the Gee-Oh-Pee enlists to hypnotize the gullible, shoot their dogs and confiscate their assets.