What We Saw at the #MuslimBan Protest at LAX

Chaos ensuing from Trump's executive order led to protests at JFK Airport in New York and at LAX, where Reason TV was on the scene to talk with demonstrators.

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What We Saw at the #MuslimBan Protest at LAX

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President Trump famously called for a halt to all Muslim immigration during his campaign, and he seemed set to follow through only a week after being sworn in by signing an executive order that not only stops all refugees from entering the country for at least 120 days and Syrian refugees indefinitely, but puts a 90-day hold on travel visa and even green card holders from several predominantly Muslim countries.

This last move left many travellers who live and work or have family in the US stranded at airports and, in many cases, sent back home.

At Los Angeles Airport, for instance, we spoke with Iraqi-born journalist and U.S. citizen named Mohammed Al-Rawis whose father was en route to the United States for a family visit when he was detained for 12 hours and then sent back to Baghdad.

Hours after Trump signed the order, a New York federal judge issued a stay saying immigrants stuck at American airports should not be sent home.

The chaos ensuing from Trump's executive actions led to protests at JFK Airport in New York and in front of the Tom Bradley International terminal in LA, where Reason TV was on the scene to talk with demonstrators.

Watch the video above for a look at the protest.

Produced by Zach Weissmueller. Music by Kaie Engel.

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Comments

[Konima]

Judging by recent comments, I have successfully restored ideological equilibrium. You're welcome.

[GILMORE?]

"Douche" is not an ideology

[American Memer]

I respectlessly disagree.

[Konima]

According to who? Do you have a list of state-approved ideologies? Fascist.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

It's a troll. It's a good one, but it's a troll. It hasn't written anything except "look at me, i'm a progtarian, you hit & runpublicans suck!" in the few days it has been around.

[John Titor]

You did nothing, Trump started doing things people didn't like and wanted to bitch about. World doesn't revolve around you.

[wareagle]

Ironically, Trump did many of the things he said he would do and people freaked out. Odd that we have reached a state in politics where someone following through is a shock.

[John Titor]

Hell, I wish we could have a Libertarian Trump in that sense. Imagine the freakouts over "OMG Libertarian Trump promised to close the Department of Education in his campaign and now he's doing it!!!!!"

[Hyperion]

A libertarian Trump would be the end of the left. Mass suicide. They'd all drink cyanide kool-aid while waiting for the prog mothership to arrive and save them.

Imagine a libertarian president throwing huge stacks of paper into a woodchipper live on TV and going around to all the different alphabet soup agencies and hurling people out the door with all of their belongings, yelling after them to get a real job. Libertarian moment.

[Password: pode$ta]

... alphabet soup agencies and hurling people out the door with all of their belongings, yelling after them to get a real job. Libertarian moment.

... Rick Perry might be our savior?

[thom]

"Oh, no, I'm actually not going to be appointing anybody for that position."

[Austrian Anarchy]

Ironically, Trump did many of the things he said he would do and people freaked out. Odd that we have reached a state in politics where someone following through is a shock.

The most amazing thing is who is shocked. The press, who covered and bitched about every one of these policies for about two years. Suddenly they are shocked.

They are shocked by other things too. Shocked when a mass shooter is not associated with the Tea Party.

Shocked when violence breaks out where leftards gather.

Shocked when no violence breaks out where non-leftards gather, unless it is onlooking leftards starting the trouble.

Shocked when anybody of any education level disagrees with them.

Shocked when unemployment numbers are adjusted in a direction they did not anticipate (turns out to be any direction).

These are the most shocked people ever to walk the Earth. Perhaps they need a disorder named for them.

[Holger da Dane]

They weren't so shocked when the previous President was busy bombing the snot out of Syria. Somehow that was OK, but deferring entry for a family of refugees while they're being checked out is just beyond the pale.

One of the things that tipped me in favor of Trump (in as much as I had to prefer any candidate), was that the media and the prog'o'sphere would at least hold his feet to the fire for 4-8 years. Had the alternative won, there would have been nothing but boot licking and back scratching in the media, regardless of how many Syrian families were bombed to death in their home country.

[Austrian Anarchy]

They weren't so shocked when the previous President was busy bombing the snot out of Syria.

If by not shocked you mean they cheered, yep, right on the money bruddah.

[Ted S.]

It revolves around me. 🙂

[Konima]

Be jealous all you want.

[C. Anacreon]

I'm jealous of your pancakes, Aunt Konima.

[Lowen]

NO!!!! Trump has been telling the world for over a year how he intended to Govern. Then those people you speak of went on to are you ready for this, give him 3,084 counties out of 3,141. Bill's wife garnered 57. Therefore, we have a President with a backbone doing exactly what he said he would do and the human knee jerk reaction of disbelief is what you are seeing now. Too many underground things going on (and all fueled by Obama) to now let this new U.S. President disrupt that. It's common sense just open your eyes.

[Charles Easterly]

Judging by recent comments, I have successfully restored ideological equilibrium. You're welcome.

Konima,

Where does Ideological Equilibrium begin?

[perazati]

My last month paycheck was for 11000 dollars... All i did was simple online work from comfort at home for 3-4 hours/day that I got from this agency I discovered over the internet and they paid me for it 95 bucks every hour... This is what I do

=========================== http://www.4dayjobs.com

[dajjal]

Very proud of my fellow Americans today - including the newest ones. 🙂

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

including the newest ones. 🙂

But they're hardly old enough to make a difference.

[Domestic Dissident]

Barely over one week in office, and he's already got the entire New World Order fulminating at the mouth. I never really thought that I'd see the day, and I absolutely love it.

To all of you worthless, barbaric Islamonazi scumbags: hopefully the message is becoming more clear that most of us in America don't want you around bringing us down to your gutter level. Stick to killing each other in your own dishusting shithole countries, or else go terrorize Europe. They seem more than willing to bend over and get on their knees and have their throats cut.

[GILMORE?]

I take it back = Douche is an ideology

[John Titor]

And DD is Il Douche.

[Karen24]

Karen's Corrollary to Rule 34: If an opinion exists, no matter how horrifying the consequences if it were adopted as policy or how completely lacking in any evidence supporting it, someone will 1. Hold it; 2. Post it on the Internet; and 3. Get 1,000 Twitter followers.

[dajjal]

The reason Europe is suffering is that they don't have free speech - they will jailed for speaking out against the Muslim influx. Every single person on this video articulated American values of freedom. What a vindication. What an indictment of Trump's hate and fearmongering. That my worthless little frankentrumpkensteins are being unmasked for the stupid and hateful fascists and nazis that they are - I absolutely love it.

[R C Dean]

No, the reason Europe is suffering is that they allowed over a million migrants into their countries with no possibility of successful assimilation/integration of the vast majority of the migrants.

[American Memer]

I mean, the first half-sentence of dajjal's post is true--Europe would be a lot better off if all the countries in it had the First Amendment.

You know what they say about blind squirrels and nuts.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

You know what they say about blind squirrels and nuts.That their sense of smell is as, or even more, acute than the sighted ones?

[Holger da Dane]

The First Amendment means nothing, it's just an affirmation of a pre-existing right. Repeal it, and people would still have freedom of speech. This isn't some philosophical mumbo-jumbo either, it's how it was intended if you read the pre-amble to the Bill of Rights. Most Americans are just confused about where their rights come from for some reason.

[loveconstitution1789]

The 1 st Amendment is a limitation of government power to suppress freedom of speech, assembly, religion and redress grievances. Americans are not confused were it came from, we are just one of the few nations that limits government power on certain things and this is one.

[wareagle]

Indeed. Import people who 1) do not speak your language, 2) offer little in the way of skills needed in the market place, and 3) are hostile to your culture, then act shocked when things don't go well.

[Overt]

Except that the majority of people affected 1) Do speak our language, 2) Do offer much in the way of skills needed in the market place, and 3) are not hostile (any more than your average prog) to my culture.

My wife is now making a trip to Europe because of this bullshit. She is making the trip because her colleague cannot go, despite years of fine service at his company despite being born in Iran. Others in her country are trapped overseas. They have been living and working in the US without incident, but suddenly they are denied entry because some dudes they never met, associated with or had anything in common with except the border (defined by colonialist Europeans) surrounding their birth city.

This is a stupid order, and it is impacting far more than a handful of jihadis. It is impacting people who wanted to escape that shit. It is impacting people who happen to work with folks escaping that shit. It is bullshit.

[Hyperion]

Obama's not coming back, shreek.

[Rational Exuberance]

That my worthless little frankentrumpkensteins are being unmasked for the stupid and hateful fascists and nazis that they are - I absolutely love it.

It's progressives like you that keep unmasking themselves as fascists and Nazis.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Barely over one week in office, and he's already got the entire Jew Whirl Porner fulminating at the mouth. I never really thought that I'd see the day, and I absolutely love it.

To all of you worthless, barbaric Jizlaoponzi scumbags: hopefully the message is becoming more clear that most of us in Homomerica don't want you around bringing us down to your gutter level. Stick to killing each other in your own dishusting shithole countries, or else go terrorize Throwup. They seem more than willing to bend over and get on their knees and have their throats cut.

[VG Zaytsev]

Race gaiters gotta race bait.

[CZmacure]

Obvious troll is obvious.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Fuck off fascist.

[Trigger Warning]

President Dolan is the greatest gift that terrorist propagandists have ever received.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

The Episcopalian lady and the Iraqi-American are the only interviewees in the video that produce anything resembling a thoughtful position.

[MarkLastname]

Yeah, no thought on facebook either. I mean, go figure, but still. There's just a complete abdication of the need to think anymore. Knee-jerk reaction, write up a sign, go and scream your head off at a protest about white male privilege. No attempt to refute their opponents' position. And it's not that hard to refute either. I'd say it's an all round bad EO.

Maybe I'm a conspiracy theorist here, but I think most people are genuinely afraid of the prospect of changing their ideological opponents' minds. They need an enemy in life. To them, trying to convince someone of the correctness of your opinion is like killing your chess opponent. Why would you do it? If you did, who would you play the game with afterward? You need your opponent to keep playing the game with you, ad infinitam.

I'm starting to feel like Agile Cyborg.

[R C Dean]

I wonder how many of those protestors have anything remotely approaching an accurate idea of what the EO actually does.

Because its not what they've been told by the DemOppo Media.

Yesterday Donald Trump signed an Executive Order on refugees and visa entry procedures.

You should read the actual EO, because most of the media and leftist pundits either have not or are lying if they have.

http://legalinsurrection.com/2.....isleading/

[Hyperion]

The disgusting fucking leftists are putting out 'fake news' trying to scare immigrants from other countries by saying that Trump is going to deport all immigrants, suspend green card applications and applications for citizenship. Totally unsubstantiated garbage. I hate the left more every day.

[thrakkorzog]

I think it's safe to guess that Trump is deliberately trolling the media for his benefit. Whether or not you agree with him, he is a master at getting the left and the media to overreact.

The press is happy to print stories about a Muslim ban , but most of the things in the EO are things the majority of the country would agree with, like prioritizing persecuted minorities for refugee status, and making sure that immigrants from lawless countries with large populations of violent extremists are properly vetted.

Yes the ban on green card holders from returning home is a terrible mistake, but that is one that is easily rectified.

[Hyperion]

I've been wondering if the main reason he's going all of this is to whip the left into such a frenzy that they lose it and start getting violent.

[Hyperion]

Isn't the ban only 90 days or something like that? I mean it sucks for legal immigrants being denied entry, I would have never done that. But it's not the end of the world for those folks either.

[thrakkorzog]

It is indefinite for Syrians, 90 days for everybody else. As for the green card holders, they actually do have residency requirements they have to meet, so spending too much time outside the US could cause them to lose their green cards.

[Rhywun]

They just need to tighten up those jihadi training classes to a week or less.

[Hyperion]

Green card holders staying outside the US for more than one year have to fill out a form to get permission to do so. If they fail to do that, they will probably be told that their GC is no longer valid when they come back.

[DenverJ]

My understanding is that the EO did not apply to green card holders. The DHS screwed up and applied it to people it was not meant to be applied to.
Whether that is true or not, IDK.

[Hyperion]

Hmm, not sure. If it was a mistake, hopefully, it will be cleared up soon.

[Austrian Anarchy]

Totally unsubstantiated garbage. I hate the left more every day.

Fear not brother. The leftoids are likely accomplishing one thing. Scaring off the peaceful immigrant applicants to make way for the dedicated up-to-no-good scum. In other words, their allies from around the world.

[wareagle]

Come on, RC; this approach is done on purpose. It plays directly into confirmation bias. I am increasingly seeing the Trump = Nazi theme on Derpbook, as if going Godwin should be taken seriously. But seriously they take it. Obama may have been the high point in cult of personality politics but I never associated him with Hitler.

[Hamster of Doom]

On topic... sorta...

Remind me again why Rico quotes this idiot.

[GILMORE?]

It is important to get a diversity of perspectives: Buzzfeed, Vox, "Fake Black Guy", and [random tweet from some nobody] are all essential voices in the debate over [something copy-pasted from Campus Reform].

[John Titor]

Because this is what happens when professional journalists consider research to consist of reading Twitter feeds and taking yellow press like Buzzfeed completely seriously.

[John]

Hold John, weren't you telling me yesterday that Reason was a pit of anti Muslim animus and the Reason staff had serious objections to Islam?

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Chortle. Good lawd get a load of Podesta Inquisitor here

[John Titor]

Surprisingly John, there's a middle ground between "Reason is perfect" and Chicken John "OMG YOU WANT MUSLIMS TO FUCK YOU YOU LOVE THEM SO MUCH I'M SUCH A GREAT PERSON FOR BEING A RAGING LOUD-MOUTHED CUNT."

[John]

Sure there is a middle ground. You find it and that pony in that pile of manure somewhere. Just keep looking.

[John Titor]

Yes it's truly unfortunate we can't all be as hysterical as you.

[John]

Yeah. That is why I resorted to all caps and obscenities. I am the one being hysterical and defensive.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

The circumstantial evidence pointing to Reason Magazine as a jihadi apologist and anti-Christian rag is highly compelling. You heard it from Johnno first.

[John]

I mean it is not like the blamed the Charlie Hebdo massacre on PC culture and said it had nothing to do with Islam or anything. Right?

http://reason.com/archives/201.....s-to-blame

Right?

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Highly compelling circumstantial evidence.

[John]

That is not circumstantial evidence. That is direct evidence. Try learning what words mean before you use them.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Whoosh. Try not biting fart bubbles in the bathtub when you want a snack, Johnno.

[John]

An article excusing Muslim violence is not circumstantial evidence that the magazine excuses Muslims violence. It is direct evidence. Words have meaning. If you don't like it, take it up with the people who wrote the dictionary.

This is why I call people stupid. They misuse terms of art, make faulty arguments and then when this is pointed out they respond by pretending to be smug and saying things like "Whoosh" like that means anything. What else can you call that except stupid?

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

It is direct evidence. Words have meaning.

This just in: all Reason Magazine editors endorse unfettered Muslim refugee spree killings and infinite rapes.

[John Titor]

Yeah John, you're not hysterical. That's why you flip out at people who disagree with you and scream about how they're stupid. Because you're the rational one here.

[John]

I don't scream at anyone. And yes, I do call people stupid, because they are. Does that happen often? Yes. As everyone knows, God loves stupid people the most. That is why he made so many of them. If you don't like being called that, stop being stupid.

[John Titor]

Yes John, you're your own little savior in your little play, where everyone who disagrees with you is stupid and they can only not be stupid if they unquestioningly support whatever your freakout at the time is. It must be so nice being the right-wing version of a social justice warrior.

[John]

Not everyone John. Just you in this instance. If you don't like that, too bad. The only people who like crybabies are their mothers and Democrats. So get over it. Reason is appalling about this issue. Read the article I link above. Muslims murder a bunch of journalists for the crime of lampooning Islam and Reason's response is that somehow the PC culture is really to blame. Are you kidding me? How can you get on here and defend that?

If that is the hill you want to die on, have fun. But you are stupid if you do.

[John Titor]

Yes John, anyone who points out your shitty behaviour is just being a crybaby, it could never possibly be that you have a shitty personality. It's never John's fault, no need for self-improvement, it's everyone else's fault.

Again, hero in your own little play. Grow up.

[John]

Again John. I am right. Reason has a terrible double standard and excuses behavior from Muslims and bends over backwards to avoid telling the truth in circumstances it would never do so for any other group. That is a valid criticism. And one you have never disproved. If my harsh tone offends you, well sorry about that. The fact that I am a jerk doesn't make me any less right and you any less wrong in pretending reason is somehow even handed on this.

[The Hyperbole]

Reporting that Charlie Hebdo editorialized about not being allowed to criticize and blame islam for the Brussels airport attack is hardly blaming the Hebdo massacre on PC culture.

[John]

That is not what it says Hyperbole. Read the article. Here is the money quote

It is this moral sheepishness, not Muslims, which Charlie Hebdo blames for Brussels. Where its editorial talks about the "veiled woman" in our local town or the baker who refuses to serve ham, it isn't blaming these ordinary Muslims for terror; it's simply asking if we should be allowed to have open, critical debate about their cultural habits, about the veil and other things. Where the editorial says that something like Brussels cannot happen "without everyone's contribution," it is talking about Europe itself, not Muslims. It is talking about "the dread" of open debate, "the dread of being treated as an Islamophobe or being called racist," which, it says, makes public life in Europe less open, less honest, and more prickly. It's right.

That is appalling. The problem isn't that we have a murderous ideology lose in our midst. No, the problem is that we didn't correct Muslims enough and teach them better. It is we who are to blame for this.

[The Hyperbole]

Where are you getting the correcting Muslims bit, CH (not Reason) blames not mocking islam.

And how have Charlie's critics responded to its critique of the culture of "You Can't Say That?" By saying to the mag: "You can't say that." Charlie's editorial is an "anti-religion rant," said Salon. To which the only reasonable response is: So what? Why shouldn't people be anti-religion? The anti-Charlie set isn't about protecting Muslims from harm; it's about protecting Islam from rebuke.

In truth, they're all about protecting a global religion, an ideology, from ridicule, and in the process they're doing more damage to freedom and social solidarity in Europe than they could ever understand.

[John]

That is all fine and good, except that the reason why Muslims are out doing this is not because it has been protected from criticism. Protecting it from criticism is bad, but it is not to blame for Brussels or Paris. Islam is to blame for that. And saying that our failure to criticize it is to blame is to let Islam off the hook, which was the point of that article.

Moreover, that claim would have a lot more credibility if the author or anyone at reason bothered to actually criticize Islam. You read that whole article and it goes on and on about the need to criticize Islam but then never says why. The author cannot bring himself to say exactly what criticisms Islam is being protected from. It is typical of Reason. Islam is never to blame for anything. It is always something the West has done that has caused these things to happen.

[Ted S.]

You'd have to be a cretin to think that being protected from criticism doesn't embolden them. Look at SJWs on college campuses, for example.

[John]

Sure it did Ted. But that doesn't mean the protection from criticism was the problem. Being protected from criticism is only emboldening if you have something to be bold about.

And beyond that, reason refuses to say just what criticism they were protected from. That makes the entire thing just an exercise in excuse making.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

John, you don't come here for the hunting, do you?

[The Hyperbole]

I'm not really arguing with any of that, or even defending the articles conclusions, just pointing out that it didn't say what you said it said.

[MarkLastname]

So, basically John is saying anyone who isn't basically Pamela Gellar is a Muslim-lover who is appeasing the jihadists.

[DenverJ]

The Johns fight is not as confusing as the fight between the American socialists. One of the AS's needs to add "Titor" to its handle so we can keep them straight.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Word.

[CZmacure]

In before someone claims that he isn't actually the illegitimate child of a black man, he just decided to out his mother as having an affair with a black man to cover up that he's "really" "white." Because you know, someone would do that, and after he did that no one from the family would contradict him if it were false.

[Azathoth!!]

Talcum X is as black as the driven snow.

And don't you say otherwise.

[AlmightyJB]

Yeah, I don't see anything happing to de Blasio

http://hotair.com/archives/201.....t-bharara/

[GILMORE?]

i honestly never expected to see anyone prosecute NY (much less NYC) pols in my lifetime. I know Preet is as much of a self-serving scumbag as many of his predecessors, but i can't help but genuinely enjoy watching him make these people sweat.

Its like the Leland Yee thing, only better - because Yee was really just an extreme offender in a rare case of over-reach. Preet is going after the NY pols for the banal stuff they've *always done*. Which makes not only his targets uncomfortable, but everyone else in the business.

[Rhywun]

There's a special place in he-- Um.... I wish the good mayor the best of luck in employing wheelbarrows full of my tax dollars in his worthy defense.

[dajjal]

Innocent civilians killed by American drone stikes in Yemen today: 10

Innocent Americans killed by Islamists from the banned countries in the past year: 0

[John]

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/ar.....ed-13-2015

The U.S. State Department's annual Country Reports on Terrorism 2015, released on Thursday, counts 11,774 terrorist attacks in 92 countries last year, but it says that's an improvement over 2014.

"The total number of terrorist attacks in 2015 decreased by 13% and total deaths due to terrorist attacks (28,328) decreased by 14%, compared to 2014," the report says. "This was largely due to fewer attacks and deaths in Iraq, Pakistan, and Nigeria. This represents the first decline in total terrorist attacks and deaths worldwide since 2012."

How many of those attacks were not perpetrated by Muslims? Any of them? But hey, the world doesn't have a Muslim problem. Not at all.

[dajjal]

America also has a very high murder rate. Just call it 'terrorism' and yeah, we have the same problem. So what now, ban Americans too?

[John]

Yeah, gang bangers shooting each other over drug turf is totally the same as people running dump trucks through Christmas markets. Go away shreek.

[dajjal]

Yeah, there were 11,000 Christmas market attacks last year. Go away john.

[John]

That totally makes it no big deal when forty or fifty people are murdered at one.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

John math: 40>11,000

[John]

No, the fact that 11,000 Markets didn't get attacked doesn't in any way make it okay that one did killing 40 people. I am not saying forty is greater than 11,000. Why would you think that I am?

Are you that stupid? What the hell is wrong with you?

[Jerry on the sea]

U.S. service member's death in Yemen is the first under President Trump:

The U.S. military said Sunday that one service member was killed and three others wounded in a raid in Yemen targeting its local al-Qaida branch, marking the first-known combat death of a member of the U.S. military under President Donald Trump.

[dajjal]

Al-Qaida - isn't that a CIA front group?

[DenverJ]

More of a cover band

[Juice]

Isn't it great that the US has boots on the ground in Yemen? And they're getting killed as a bonus.

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

In addition to members ISIS trying to infiltrate the ranks of Syrian refugees and other visitors, Somali immigrants have launched attacks on us here at home: http://tinyurl.com/zm2v3gb

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

and tried to leave here and join ISIS: http://tinyurl.com/hapxkc3

Moreover, of all the immigrant groups that come to our shores, this one contains a significant number of terrorists: http://tinyurl.com/gwam7ft

[Hyperion]

I'm just as much against killing poor goat herders in 3rd would countries as anyone. But it doesn't justify just randomly letting people into the country that might be dead set on killing us.

[DenverJ]

Innocent civilians killed by American drone stikes in Yemen today: 10

Innocent Americans killed by Islamists from the banned countries in the past year: 0

We're winning! Trump promised we'd win so much that we would get tired of it.

[Number 2]

What? We're now keeping count of innocent people killed by drone strikes in Yemen on a same-day basis? When did this start? I thought it was government policy to release the number of innocents killed by drones only at 7pm on summer Fridays that precede three-day weekends.

Yet another wise Obama policy reversed by Nazi-Trump.

[John]

They are protesting something that doesn't exist. Trump didn't ban Muslims. He banned people from seven countries the Obama administration designated as failed states and harbors of ISIS and Iran. The vast majority of Muslims in the world are unaffected by this.

Since 911, there have been over 30,000 terror attacks conducted in the name of Islam. Why does no one ever protest that?

[dajjal]

Your tears - they are so yummy. 🙂

[John]

It bothers me when Muslims murder people. Yes, you think it is fabulous. We know that.

[dajjal]

Trump-Putin-Netanyahu - axis of the alt-righteous. They are the real terrorists.

[John]

Yeah, it was Trump who walked into that gay bar and murdered those people in Orlando.

[dajjal]

Actually it was the FBI that radicalized Mateen, and it was Bush that radicalized his father. Remember, the Mujahedeen were another CIA front group. And yes, Putin is responsible for many terrorist attacks, as it Bibi, and Trump admires them both for this reason.

[Hyperion]

Sheek's off his meds again.

[Password: pode$ta]

Actually it was the FBI that radicalized Mateen, and it was Bush that radicalized his father.

You must own the fucking Cadillac of tinfoil hats.

[MarkLastname]

When did George HW Bush get radicalized? Is that what the hospitalization was about? Were they covering for him after he tried to ram his rascal into a crowd at a Christmas market?

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Why do you hate black people?

[dajjal]

I hate everyone. I'm an equal-opportunity hater.

[R C Dean]

And you've got the idiot NYT reporter who implied (on Twitter, natch) that none of the terror attacks since 9/11, save one, were done by immigrants, when in fact most of them were.

http://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/.....rs-oblige/

Let's not overlook the livestreamed gang rape of a Swedish woman by Afghan migrants.

http://pjmedia.com/lifestyle/2.....-facebook/

I have no problem severely restricting immigration that poses a higher risk of violence against actual American citizens. If your "open borders" doesn't allow that, then I don't have much use for it.

[John]

It is our job to risk our lives and safety so that Muslims remain free.

[dajjal]

The main causes of terrorism are: radicalization by FBI/CIA, being forced into an arranged marriage at a young age and having a daughter, being a stooge for the private security and airport security industries, and mental illness and CVE indoctrination. 'Islam' is much further down the list.

[John]

You really did forget your meds today. Shreek, they wouldn't give those pills if you didn't need them.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

The main causes of terrorism are: radicalization by FBI/CIA

Oh for fuck's sake.

[lap83]

"Being forced into an arranged marriage at a young age and having a daughter"

Women...can't live with them, can't live without blowing them up..amirite?

[GILMORE?]

the idiot NYT reporter who implied (on Twitter, natch) that none of the [LETHAL] terror attacks since 9/11, save one, were done by immigrants [FROM THE 7 BANNED COUNTRIES]

The ones who were from the banned countries all caused 'mass casualties' but no deaths, the ones from the high-death count events were mostly from Afghanistan/Pakistan.

If the goal was to make some logical point, the obvious retort would be "then you're suggesting we should be banning Afghans/Pakistanis/Saudis instead, right?"... but, much like the claims people make about "Mass Shootings"(which are common) in order to conflate them in the public mind with "Mass killings"(which are rare)..... its for rhetorical effect, not to advance any actual reasoned debate.

[Hamster of Doom]

Remember how some pro-lifers killed some doctors and we took prudent necessary steps to vet the pro-lifers so they don't kill us all?

Me neither.

Look, if we really believe the counter for bad speech is good speech, then this is where the rubber meets the road. I maybe-could be persuaded that a pause for Syrian citizens is sensible. Maybe. There's likely a decent argument there, though it doesn't seem it would be very pro-freedom unless it's temporary and accounts for bureaucratic error and malfunction. That's the kicker here, because I really do believe that the counter for bad speech is good speech.

Maybe, maybe, the best tactic would be a short-term pause. And maybe the better tactic would be to loosen the barriers to accessing the marketplace. The guy who didn't grow up with a pot to piss in nor a window to throw it out of, now has gainful employment, an apartment, a girlfriend, a car and a dozen modern electronic entertainment devices and the ability to bitch about anyone he doesn't like on any of them. That guy isn't blowing anything up, he's saving to buy a goddamned house and looking through credit card pamphlets.

Offer them good choices and see what happens. Of course, that means the government has to let go of its stranglehold on the economy. The government thinks the answer is a better stranglehold on the borders, and perhaps I can see why some might agree, but I speculate that it's going to work about as well as every other government stranglehold.

[Africanis]

Liberals think their speech is good speech and you should just shut up you racist bigot homophobic scum. Their speech and opinions good, yours bad. Oh yeah, you are anti science, the debate is over. Please don''t strain yourself over to make an analogy via pro-lifers as I don't see them regularly driving trucks into Christmas celebrations or raping women in the public square during the holidays.

[Hamster of Doom]

Okay!

[John]

Remember how some pro-lifers killed some doctors and we took prudent necessary steps to vet the pro-lifers so they don't kill us all?

Pro lifers killed one doctor. If pro lifers had murders 2800 people in one attack and engaged in multiple attacks over 15 years that included bombing the Boston marathon, murdering 49 people at a gay club in Orlando, over 30 at Fort Hood and numerous other attacks too numerous to mention here, you God damned right the country would have come down hard on the pro life movement.

It is called false equivalence. If our Muslim problem amounted to a couple people being murdered and a single bombing over 20 years ago, no one would be concerned about it. When a pro life person flies a plane full of people into a building or guns down 50 people in a club, get back to me and we can talk about our pro life problem in this country. Until then, fuck off and quit acting like one is anything like the other.

[Hamster of Doom]

Pro lifers killed one doctor. If pro lifers had murders 2800 people in one attack and engaged in multiple attacks over 15 years that included bombing the Boston marathon, murdering 49 people at a gay club in Orlando, over 30 at Fort Hood and numerous other attacks too numerous to mention here, you God damned right the country would have come down hard on the pro life movement.

Blah blah blah, blah blah-blah-blah.

Really, John? Because I was pretty devout back in the day, and being pro-life dating from those days (you remembered that I am pro-life, I'm sure, and interpreted my words accordingly, of course), I remember getting a frank butt-ton of shit for being a devoutly Baptist pro-lifer and therefore the next thing to a religious fundamental nutjob psycho. I remember having internet fights with people (leftists) who said religious people oughtn't be allowed to stand for election because dangerous fundamentalist nutjobs and separation of church and state.

Maybe you don't remember that. It was certainly all based on hot air and frenzy at the time, such a pity a what everyone knows gets halfway around the world before the truth has got its boots on. I remember it though, the castigation wasn't pleasant, and I'd quite like that sort of bullshit to stop.

I concede that makes me a weirdo. After consideration of the alternatives, I'm good with being a weirdo.

[Hamster of Doom]

Hey. Hey. LOL. Hey guys, what do you want to bet that people choose to read this as "proggie identifies with Muslims" instead of "me today, you tomorrow"? Hahaha, never mind, that would be silly.

Silly Hamster.

[John]

Because I was pretty devout back in the day, and being pro-life dating from those days (you remembered that I am pro-life, I'm sure, and interpreted my words accordingly, of course), I remember getting a frank butt-ton of shit for being a devoutly Baptist pro-lifer and therefore the next thing to a religious fundamental nutjob psycho. I remember having internet fights with people (leftists) who said religious people oughtn't be allowed to stand for election because dangerous fundamentalist nutjobs and separation of church and state.

If the pro life movement had murdered the number of people Muslims, had, those points would have been legitimate. But the pro life movement didn't. It didn't do anything like that or in any way comparable. So those points were not legitimate. One situation has nothing to do with the other. So why are you bringing it up other than to make a false equivalence?

[Hamster of Doom]

I already said why, John.

Entertain the thought that you are wrong. Logically, you have to be at some point, otherwise you are perfect, and since you are not perfect, John, you must at some point be wrong. Maaaaaybe this is one of those times. Maybe - just maybe - you read what I wrote from a faulty assumption. In which case, you've no idea what I was getting at and miss things, such as, for e.g.; that part where I said why I mentioned it.

Or, hey, if the communications flaw is on my end and I haven't effectively conveyed what a pro-lifing pro-lifer I've been, pro-lifing away on the internet since the 90's as pro-lifers are wont to do, then let me hasten to do so now. Any base assumption that starts with "Hamster believes or claims pro-lifers are crazy nutjobs who kill a lot of people" is therefore incorrect. Because I'm pro-life and I know better, from a pro-life point of view.

[John]

I am not wrong. I am saying how we treated the pro life movement after the handfull of acts of violence in the 1980s and 90s has nothing to do with the subject of how we treat Muslim's today. My statement has nothing to do with your opinion of pro lifers. It points out that you are making a false comparison. Go back to what you originally said

Remember how some pro-lifers killed some doctors and we took prudent necessary steps to vet the pro-lifers so they don't kill us all?

Me neither.

What is the point of that except to bring it up as a valid comparison to now? It is not. And that was my point.

[Hamster of Doom]

1) Misunderstand
2) Tell someone what they're really thinking
3) EVERYONE IS STUPID.
4) ???
5) Profit!!

[John]

Okay, then what are you saying? If I misunderstood you fine. You own your point. But please tell me what it is because it is not clear to me. What was your point in saying that? Explain to me what you meant and tell me how I am misunderstanding your point. I am not saying you are wrong. I just don't see it.

[Hamster of Doom]

Sure. I'll rephrase and try to make it more clear, but you'l have to give me just a minute. It's the weekend, and succinct is not often my strong point.

[John]

I am not being a jerk. I just reread your posts and I can't figure out what you are saying.

[Hamster of Doom]

So, this may sound as if I'm talking down to you. I'm not, I'm trying to lead you down the path my thoughts were walking, and some hand-holding could be helpful.

One of my formative internet memories, lo, in the days of dial-up, was fighting with a bunch of leftists, after the abortion clinic mess(es). Their stance was the dangers of people who believe religious things; pro-life was synonymous with terrorist; fundamentalist was a slur. People began to question, on the news and in all seriousness, whether religious people running for election violated separation of church and state. (And this may not have been a neat progression, but there were "incidences", people became shirty, then at some point after the rhetoric boiled over. Maybe all like that, maybe over a couple years, I'm old, you get the drift.)

If they could have gone after rights wholesale, they would have. Cooler heads prevailed. Everything calmed down. Now the media presents religious people as merely superstitious backward buffoons, rather than wild-eyed fanatics and "fundamentalists".

Alternately, pragmatic heads prevailed, the power players realized they lacked sufficient power to move the Overton Window that far, and dropped it for more auspicious timing with more to gain.

Or maybe space aliens made them knock it off and politicians set the idea aside, caressing it fondly and whispering, "Later... later..." . It certainly wasn't principle, integrity or intellectual rigor, that's for damned sure.

[Hamster of Doom]

MT;YT in this case turns out to be "me yesterday; these guys today" and, sure, I can see how that's identifying with them, but have we decided the saying no longer works if the guy getting it today is sufficiently icky? Say, I've been labeled sufficiently icky many times, find "icky" to be remarkably subjective in practice by people not good with subjectivity, and I have my doubts. Hell, I have my doubts about the whole process, starting with "icky" and moving smartly on to whether we're utilizing the most effective solution to the problem.

There may be a good argument on Syria. Maybe. I'm willing to concede this much, since there is a definite identifiable pattern in how Muslims react to poor social engineering, and we have some outrageously poor social engineering.

Having stipulated that a valid argument is possible, what is the pro-freedom way to pause Syrian immigration? Well, short-term, right for fucking starts. We're handing a power to people we know to be unfit to wield it. We'd better do so sensibly and put strict reins on it unless we want it biting our asses off someday. I'm not going to agree that all Syrians should be indefinitely the same as bad people because icky and reasons and *hand-flail* DANGEROUS, since that's something I associate with leftist behavior.

[Hamster of Doom]

That covers the short term. Now what? Well... it occurs to me that a land of opportunity which doesn't bomb anyone's home village may be a safe place to live, since everyone's so busy grabbing new and interesting options they've never been offered before. When choosing between heaven in the afterlife and heaven on Earth, I suspect.people with a newfound high quality of life will pick the latter.

When asked to choose indefinite subjective extra powers being handed to proven failures because our poor social engineering mixes badly with vulnerable demographics, my vote is get rid of the poor social engineering, free-market this bitch up and see what happens.

See. Told you it wouldn't be succinct. Let me know if it's any clearer.

[John]

It is no mystery why the pro life people didn't start killing people, they were not violent. There were very few people who did more than talk, and not many who talked. You couldn't generalize about the group because violence really was a rare exception. Muslims in contrast, are violent. Yeah, it sucks to be a peaceful Muslim who can't come into the country and escape Syria, but it sucked to be on the planes that hit the WTC. Life is like that sometimes. The bottom line is allowing unlimited Muslim immigration will likely end with a lot of innocent people getting killed. So, do you let those people die so that Muslims may immigrate or do you tell Muslims to fix their own mess instead of bringing it here? I vote for the latter.

[Hamster of Doom]

The bottom line is allowing unlimited Muslim immigration will likely end with a lot of innocent people getting killed.

Citation required.

Perhaps it's like with health care. Either folks can see that government regulations, CON laws, racketeering, collusion and cronyism are driving the huge price increases in medical care, and without the meddle-meddle-tinker-tinker prices would drop drastically. Or folks can't see that, and without government meddling to give everyone free insurance then they are dead certain we'd all die of cancer in the streets.

If Muslims are, have been and always will be violent and are truly all exactly alike; and if America has been an immigrant country from the start, then I would like to see your extraordinary claims sourced through violent Muslim attacks dating from the start of our country. There should be a regular and continuous baseline of violent Muslim immigration since we started importing them, and I'd like you to show your work.

Otherwise, this sounds like an argument from emotion: everyone should go along with extra government powers and less freedom because fear, panic, and death.

Convince me with facts.

[Drake]

How about a citation for any country ever that let in large numbers of Muslims and didn't end up with a bloodbath on their hands.

Name that place where Muslims showed up and lived peacefully with their neighbors.

India? Tens (probably hundreds) of millions dead. Muslims now live there relatively peacefully because the Hindus will mob up and fucking kill their whole neighborhoods if they step out of line.

[Hamster of Doom]

Name that place where Muslims showed up and lived peacefully with their neighbors.

Read a history book. This isn't in any way isolated to Muslims. The Jews, the Mongols, hey, ask Native Americans and the Denisovan their views on immigration.

The question here isn't whether you can convince yourself I'm wrong. You're already sure of that. The question here is whether you can convince ME that I'm wrong. I'm persuadable here, I've already conceded that there may be an argument to make in one specific case and I've been convinced to change my view by a superior argument on these threads before.

Bugger the logical fallacies, show me some facts, and start it from when the facts starts.

Muslims now live there relatively peacefully because the Hindus will mob up and fucking kill their whole neighborhoods if they step out of line.

What I'm hearing you say is that Muslim immigrant culture can be changed so that they live within the community. I'm not sure you meant to phrase it that way, it makes your argument seem specious.

[Drake]

I was a history major - and you didn't answer the question.

Unfortunately, the U.S. and Western Europe won't react like Indians. Did the Brits do a damn thing about Rotterdam besides wring their hands and make apologies?

[Ted S.]

You must be stupid to think John could ever be wrong. 😉

[MarkLastname]

So, you're basically a collectivist when it comes to Muslims. Got it.

At the end of the day, when you look at the numbers, Muslims commit fewer murders per capita per annum than some other major demographic groups in the US. If you're trying to contend that Muslims are worse because fewer of them kill more people all at once, as opposed to more of them killing fewer people per instance (but killing more people overall per capita, again, as is the case with African Americans and Hispanics), then say that. Of course, I think that's pretty dumb. If 1 in 10,000 people from group A kills 50 people and 1 in 100 people from group B kills 1 person, why am I supposed to fear group A more than group B.

Or, it should also be mentioned, that if one takes into account the disproportionate number of Muslims who are doctors or other medical staff, it is almost certain that Muslims save more lives per capita than they end.

[DenverJ]

The guy who didn't grow up with a pot to piss in nor a window to throw it out of, now has gainful employment, an apartment, a girlfriend, a car and a dozen modern electronic entertainment devices and the ability to bitch about anyone he doesn't like on any of them. That guy isn't blowing anything up, he's saving to buy a goddamned house and looking through credit card pamphlets.You mean like the couple in San Bernardino?

[DenverJ]

End blockquote fail

[Hamster of Doom]

You mean like the couple in San Bernardino?

No, I mean giving a couple actual freedom and access to free markets. Talking about how wonderfully capitalist and free everything is while cronying, credentialing and taxing the hell out of everything that moves seems to not be working.

[Pat (PM)]

The San Bernadino shooters would have been Ward and June Cleaver in a laissez-faire society. You really are a fucking idiot.

[Hamster of Doom]

Brilliant counter-argument. Eagerly awaiting the part where you flick a booger at me, draw a stick figure making a face and label it "Hamster" for the encore.

[Pat (PM)]

Your defense of every criticism is that your critics are booger flickers. I understand actually supporting an argument as incomprehensibly stupid as saying that crony capitalism is responsible for Islamic terrorism is a tall task, but if you weren't up to it you shouldn't have started out with the incomprehensibly stupid premise in the first place.

[Hamster of Doom]

Your defense of every criticism is that your critics are booger flickers.

Yes. Every one of 'em. Well known for the old booger-flicker defense, Hamster is. Famed for it, in fact. Why, just the other day, someone was commenting, "Yeah, Hamster sure does defend every criticism by calling her critics booger-flickers."

What a comfort to you, to have so much company in this regard.

[Pat (PM)]

And what a comfort to you, holding positions that could only be questioned by cretins. It's as if god, having mistaken you for Voltaire, granted his prayer twice.

Here's a dank meme. Looks like u got pwnd. Hurr durrr.

[Hamster of Doom]

Your ripostes grow more intellectual by the moment. Surely, calling you a booger-flicker was unfair.

[Pat (PM)]

Preen moar. It sure is a lot more comfortable than actually supporting your inane arguments and propositions.

In the unlikely event you ever get tired of smelling your own farts, look no further than the housing crisis for what happens when fucking idiots like you make national policy based on mistaking cause for effect. A bigger TV and unlimited internet porn is no more going to make goat fucking roadside bombers in east bumblefuck into New Libertarian Man than 20 million new units of 3 bedroom 2 bathroom houses made poor white trash and undocumented Mexicans into middle class home owners.

[Pat (PM)]

Ahh, shit, I forgot to close with a dank maymay. I guess I lose.

[Pat (PM)]

The guy who didn't grow up with a pot to piss in nor a window to throw it out of, now has gainful employment, an apartment, a girlfriend, a car and a dozen modern electronic entertainment devices and the ability to bitch about anyone he doesn't like on any of them. That guy isn't blowing anything up, he's saving to buy a goddamned house and looking through credit card pamphlets.

This is where the bubble that half of you retards live in really comes into play. You can't get your heads around ordinary flyover country religious devotion, let alone third world religious fanaticism. Not everyone in the world thinks the same way you do. Most of the people from your own cultural background don't think the same you do. Fucking bitches and getting money isn't a good enough value proposition for tens of millions of mainline evangelical protestants with the same basic set of Enlightenment values that you have, and you think titties and beer is going to change 1500 years of cultural values for a billion people. You're fucking delusional.

[Hamster of Doom]

Okay!

[Pat (PM)]

Haha, got'em.

[Hyperion]

The Ohio guy in the truck attack, that was a Somali refugee. I'm still waiting to be corrected on that.

[GILMORE?]

no, he was, but no one was killed. the guy specified "LETHAL terror-attacks", ensuring his claim remained technically-true but otherwise pointless.

[Hyperion]

Well, ok, he was bad at terrorism, but doesn't he still get a gold star for effort?

[GILMORE?]

ISIS gave him "Jihadi of the Month"

[Rhywun]

LOL

[DenverJ]

You know who else gave out gold stars?

[Ted S.]

Technically correct is the best kind of correct, after all.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

I think being overwhelmingly correct is even better. So, technically, "technically" is not the best kind of correct.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Or "undeniably" correct. Or "undisputedly" correct. There are many kinds of correct that are better than "technically" correct.

[MarkLastname]

Instead of saying 'technically correct' I prefer to say (I think more accurately) "correct but irrelevant."

"An X did this bad thing. Let's ban X." Is not what I consider to be a persuasive argument. When someone shows me some data indicating that people from Syria/Somalia/wherever commit a disproportionate share of homicides or other crimes relative to other demographic groups, and gives some idea of where the threshold is for where we decide a nationality has warranted stricter response at the border, then we'd be having a logical debate.

Thus far, I haven't seen that. Certainly not from John. Basically from the argument seems to be 'well lots of people from some of those countries did bad things that got on the new.' But I really don't give a shit about what makes the news. Show some statistics or GTFO.

[CZmacure]

immigration that poses a higher risk of violence against actual American citizens

[citation needed]

(FWIW, given this cohort, I figure you can actually make the case. But you have to actually make it?)

[CZmacure]

That said, Trump didn't ban immigration from Mexico... I have heard from PapayaSF that Mexican immigrants are super violent... I wonder why he didn't ban them?

[MarkLastname]

They kill people more frequently but in smaller quantities. For some reason that's better.

[Ken Shultz]

Listening to those people trying to rationalize why it was okay for Obama to issue executive orders and whether that may have contributed to Trump's ability to do so was telling.

It was also telling that one of them then turned around and blamed people who voted for third parties for Trump.

Some people voted third party because they thought Obama and Hillary were imperial jackholes who rule by way of executive orders and ignore the rule of law when it suits them to do so.

It's telling that the people rationalizing why it was okay for Obama to issue executive orders because if Hillary had been elected or when Liz Warren or some other progressive becomes President, they'll want him or her to issue executive orders like this, too.

[SimonD]

It was also telling that one of them then turned around and blamed people who voted for third parties for Trump.

Seriously? I would bet $1000 that if you put a gun to the head of every third-party voter and said "Trump, Hillary, or Bang", most of them would have picked Trump (with Bang a close second)

[SimonD]

/s on Bang being a close second.

[John]

Hours after Trump signed the order, a New York federal judge issued a stay saying immigrants stuck at American airports should not be sent home.

If they can go home, they are not stuck at the airport. In fact, if anyone is causing them to be stuck at the airport, it is the judge that is preventing the government from sending them home. At any time they can get on a plane and go back where they came from. They are choosing to stay where they are. So, don't lie and claim they are being held prisoners or something.

[dajjal]

You really did forget your meds today. John, they wouldn't give those pills if you didn't need them.

[John]

What happened Shreek, did you have a psychotic episode and forget the password to your Palin's buttbplug handle?

[dajjal]

I love how each of you is completely convinced that I am the universal representation of evil in all its forms.

[John]

No. You are just the usual idiot who trolls this board. Thanks for not charging rent for me living in your spacious and empty head.

[MWG]

Pot meet kettle.

[John]

Did you stay up all night thinking of that one? Try making a decent point once in a while and things will go better for you.

[MWG]

You shitting all over the thread and calling others trolls is laughable. I'm curious how you'd define a troll. Is it a republican who's contatantly appearing a on libertarian blog bitching about libertarians not agreeing with republicans sufficiently? Or maybe a Trump apologist constantly shitting his pants that libertarians are giving the dear leader the benefit of the doubt?

[John]

First, why do you think I am a Trump apologist? I think Trump was wrong to include green card holders and I think this ban is rather pointless because it doesn't go far enough or really address the problem. Pointing out how stupid reason is in their criticisms and how ridiculously apologetic and defensive they are about Muslims doesn't preclude you from criticizing Trump or disagreeing with this. So I am not a Trump apologist. You just think I am because you don't like what I have to say and accusing me of that is an easy if stupid way to respond.

Second, you don't like the points I make because you are lazy and don't like to think. You want a board where posting the standard Libertarian talking points and kissing the authors' asses is the standard. Well, I don't. And I have no use for people like you who think that passes for thinking.

[MWG]

Not at all. There are plenty of people I disagree with here, but who aren't prone to pants shitting the way you are. It's funny that you don't agree with Trump on this EO mainly because he isn't doing what his fanboys think he should do enough.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

First, why do you think I am a Trump apologist?

I can't even.

[John]

Yeah you can't even because I just criticized Trump.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

John, you may have criticized Trump once in this thread, but you praised him hundredfold.

[MarkLastname]

John criticizes Trump like Jon Steward criticizes Obama. "Why come you not do the awesome stuff you said you would all the way instead of compromising! :("

The fact that what you're upset about here is that Trump didn't ban all Muslims doesn't make you not a Trumpkin, buddy.

[Hyperion]

Shreek, you've gone right past Alex Jones level conspiracy nuttery, right onto WND level conspiracy nuttery. You sure as hell have no room to tell anyone else to take their meds. Crikey.

[Derpetologist]

Students say border wall is racist, want more illegal immigrants at their school
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtVw75bQQkw

It's racist because there isn't a border wall for Canada. This is what they actually believe.

[John]

Trump must laugh his ass off when he sees things like that.

[dajjal]

They are starting to take a stand against the sadistic fantasies of their frumpled uncle Trumpkins. Maybe they just realized they will be expected to pay for it, along with the network of private prisons to house illegals until the wall is built (i.e. never)? This is very gratifying and it's about time.

[C. Anacreon]

Good grief shreek, did you even watch the video?

Girl: Why don't we have a wall on our border with Canada?
Reporter: Maybe because we don't have millions of Canadians streaming into our country.
Girl: Touch?.

Other girl: Why do we need a border with Mexico now? We never had one before. If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

[DJF]

They ignore that fact that most of the US/Canada border are lakes/rivers or road less which is just as hard to cross as a wall.

[John Titor]

Comparing the 1999 U.S.-Canada border to the 2017 U.S.-Canada border, I'd say security has be significantly increased.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

You'll be grateful for the extra protection at the major land crossings once the jihadi start attempting to spill over the border and disrupt civil society in Nunavut.

[John Titor]

Civil society in Nunavut is like three guys out having a smoke, so a well-placed Jihadi bombing would be highly effective.

[GILMORE?]

he sounded apologetic when he said, "well, we don't actually have millions of immigrants coming across the Canadian border"...

.... and she sounded as though this were a counter-point no one had ever actually mentioned to her previously.

it was a good lesson in how the real comedy is often in the mannerisms of an exchange as much as the content of it.

[Hyperion]

I mean, besides Toronto and Vancouver, the Canadians have a natural form of immigration control. The fact that most of the country is an unlivable frozen tundra.

[GILMORE?]

Also = the "great wall of china" line was pretty priceless. You could see her friend was like, "Awwww shit, you gonna get served on that one".

[Don'tTreadOnMeChipper]

How many Mexicans are there in China? I'd say the wall worked for them, no?

[Episteme]

If not for the Great Wall, Ricardo Montalban would have waged a giant Eugenics War across Asia back in the mid-90s!

[MarkLastname]

Well it kept those aliens out. Matt Damon must be a national hero over there.

[Hyperion]

Are these the same people who need safe spaces and want to outlaw free speech? Yeah, champions of freedom they are. They want illegal immigrants to come because they don't already have enough people to annoy and oppress.

[Ken Shultz]

Also, when those people are chanting, "No Trump, No KKK, No fascist USA!", I wonder how many of them know where that comes from?

I bet zero. I bet no one in the crowd knows the ultimate origin of that chant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjOYxqgKceg

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

what a fucking awful song.

[Ken Shultz]

Some things aren't for you.

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

this one is all yours, my friend.

[Ken Shultz]

That's the song is where the chant came from, though.

Before the internet, before anyone outside of the underground had heard of them, back when I was, like, 14 years old, I saw them and was shouting that chant.

It's a time warp.

Back then, the lyrics were super libertarian. Now they've morphed them into something progressive.

I remember when there used to be honest liberals.

[BestUsedCarSales]

It's always been a weird inconsistency to me when I listen to punk, they are hyper anti-authoritarian, hyper individualistic, DIY, and fond of small organization. Then they almost always expound socialism.

[dajjal]

Type faster, my filthy little anarch0-frankentrumpkensteins:

[Hamster of Doom]

Rookie.

C'mon, there's lots of interplay against from several angles, not a lot of people cheering without qualification, and for the most part everyone's playing kosher cricket. John calls everyone an idiot, that doesn't count, a default is effectively the same as zero. For an immigration thread, these are amazingly good results. Maybe you missed the shitshow we threw below the fold when Trump first started banging this drum.

Recognize the small wins, grasshopper.

[Bra Ket]

Pretty sure he's not interested in characterizing things as accurately as possible. Partial truths twisted into insults are the best way to troll people.

[John]

I am so unfair to people. I mean it is totally legitimate to compare the threat of the pro life movement to that of radical Islam and then conclude that since we are not worrying about pro life people immigrating we shouldn't be worried about Muslims immigrating.

With top quality reasoning like that going on, it takes a real asshole to even question it. You are right Hamster. You got me.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

You look amazing up on that cross, Johnno. Take the fight to 'em.

[Ted S.]

The reason Jesus is always so thin on those crucifixes is because he did Pontius Pilates.

[Rhywun]

Phrasing...

[Ted S.]

What is, "The reason Jesus is always so thin on those crucifixes is because he did Pontius Pilates", Alex?

[Password: pode$ta]

I thought it was cross-fit...

[Password: pode$ta]

Only a carpenter would have abs that chiseled.

[MWG]

Oh John, you poor dear. Do you have a little violin we can play for you?

[Hamster of Doom]

...compare the threat of the pro life movement to that of radical Islam...

As pro-lifers are wont to do and all....

*coy pinkie*

[John]

You did compare the two.

[Hamster of Doom]

I am a pro-lifer. I did not compare their threat; pro-lifers do not assume that pro-lifers are a threat to the public.

[John]

That is because the level of violence associated with the pro life movement is so small. If pro lifers were routinely blowing themselves up in public places, that would be different.

[Hamster of Doom]

That is because the level of violence associated with the pro life movement is so small.

LOL, no, it's because I'm a pro-lifer and why on earth would anyone collectivize against themselves, John.

Don't overthink. It's okay. Humans are all assholes, but we're neither of us trying to specifically be an asshole here, so I have faith we'll get there in the end.

[MarkLastname]

Muslims are routinely blowing themselves up here indeed. Why a third of the Muslims I know have blown themselves up at least once in the past month. It's like Baghdad around hear I tell ya.

While you're at it why don't you tell us about the rape crisis on campus.

[John]

Politically, the open borders rhetoric helps Trump. Even in California, three-quarters of the population, according to a recent UC Berkeley survey, oppose sanctuary cities. Overall, more Americans favor less immigration than more. Most, according to a recent Pew Research Center study, also want tougher border controls and increased deportations. They also want newcomers to come legally and adopt the prevailing cultural norms, including English.

http://www.ocregister.com/arti.....harsh.html

Yet these people seem to think that they can oppose Trump on the grounds that he is just not letting enough Muslims from failed states into the country. By defining the battle as one of Trump versus people who want completely open borders for anyone no matter what the risk or cost, these protests are accomplishing nothing but doing Trump's bidding. If he is not paying the protesters, he should be.

[Ken Shultz]

After Trump was elected, his favorable ratings rose from 34% to 42%, and his unfavorable ratings dropped from 62% to 55%. Gallup hasn't done a favorability survey on Trump since, but when they do, I bet his favorable ratings pop even higher.

Meanwhile, support for Trump is almost certainly underestimated in the polling.

I'm not sure the usual Overton window applies to Trump. Instead of being forced to act within the window, Trump seems to be shifting the Overton window to what he wants it to be.

Banning refugees from coming to the U.S. used to be completely outside the window. Now, if banning Muslims from coming to the U.S. is outside the window, it's probably right on the edge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window

[GILMORE?]

Gallup hasn't done a favorability survey on Trump since

its not like they have a monopoly on "phone surveys"

[Ken Shultz]

I like Gallup's because the results are comparable across the board on various people in the public eye--and across time.

I especially find this page interesting.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/161.....-news.aspx

It's interesting to see what happened to Trump and Hillary's approval ratings right after Trump won and Hillary lost.

American loves winners and hates losers. People all over the country will start buying Falcons' jerseys if they win next Sunday. I mean, presumably, Trump's numbers right after the election went up--just because he won--and Hillary's went down just because she lost.

If Trump's favorability numbers at Gallup go up above 55% like they did at Rasmussen, I'll be impressed--it'll be all about what he's done since he's been elected. . . . and his real approval ratings will probably be higher than what people will admit to over the phone.

[GILMORE?]

I like Gallup's because the results are comparable across the board on various people in the public eye--and across time.

rasmussen's is daily. they've been doing it for over a decade. as far as i know the sampling is the same or better as anything pew/gallup publish.

the only significance is the definition of the question they are asking - e.g. "Approval of performance" vs. "Favorability" - which are in fact different things

(someone could approve of job-performance while not liking a public figure, or vice versa)

Gallup is considered the best pollster when it comes to pre-election assessments of candidate-support.

They aren't especially advantaged or a special source of insight into sitting presidents or current attitudes about whether the status-quo is "good/bad" or whether people feel things are "getting better", which is actually what Rasmussen *does* do (their consumer indexes and other econometric data is used by Wall St as leading indicators, where stuff like gallup is definitely not)

neither here nor there, just saying. you don't need gallup to make your point.

[John]

The reality is a large majority of the country want something done about illegal immigration and about Muslim immigration in particular. They may not want the more extreme measures that Trump proposes but that is not the point. They want something done. What Trump is doing here is making extreme proposals knowing that it will cause his opponents to go insane and protest and demand he stop. All that does is make it look like he is the only one who cares about the issues has any plans to address it.

This is what he did in primaries with immigration. Rubio, Cruz, Bush and the whole lot of them had plans to deal with immigration. Yet, not a single GOP primary voter could tell you what they were. Why? Because Trump by proposing the wall and the Muslim ban forced his opponents to spend all of their time and efforts explaining to the media how bad that was and how they didn't support it making it appear to the voters Trump was the only one who cared about the issue.

Same thing is happening here. Trump, by inciting such a reaction is framing the issue as one of him versus people who think we just are not allowing enough Muslims into the country. That won't work out very well for them.

[Password: pode$ta]

I'm not sure the usual Overton window applies to Trump. Instead of being forced to act within the window, Trump seems to be shifting the Overton window to what he wants it to be.

That's exactly what it is, and this is exactly how you do it. If you take a "super-extreme" position, it will drag one side of the window in your direction. One way to view the Trump presidency is that he picked a few Overton windows where he realized a huge portion of the population actually held views outside of the window.

When one side dominates the boundaries of the Overton window, the window will drift to the point that the majority no longer hold an opinion inside the window, and that makes for a very unstable environment.

[John]

The problem is Trump's opponents are so addicted to outrage they never can resist the bait. If they would ever respond with their own reasonable position, Trump's extreme positions would look extreme. Instead, they just respond with outrage and create a false dilemma where Trump is the only one offering a solution.

[AlmightyJB]

It's the sanctimony that keeps them warm. They would feel empty without it. Logic just isn't as ego fulfilling.

[Hyperion]

I believe that the left have tried to logically debate their positions in the public arena. They get the shit smacked out of them every time they try it, so they've abandoned it in favor of sticking their fingers in their ears and shrieking like toddlers.

[Password: pode$ta]

Not only are they addicted to outrage, they have no idea that the outrage is becoming tedious to most people that don't believe in absolutely every left-wing cause.

About 30 minutes ago, I got held up by a bunch of protesters marching across the sidewalk blocking the entrance to my apartment garage for about 5 minutes. I figured they were doing another wymyns march or some shit. Nope. They're protesting DAPL. In downtown Atlanta. A pipeline from North Dakota to Illinois is being protested and inconveniencing me in fucking Georgia. I wonder how many of the protesters even know any of that? I bet the three and five year olds being dragged along by their parents don't. And that's fucking disgusting as well. That's the yuppiest thing I can imagine: using your small children to social signal to everyone else around you. That's the shit I'm forced to sit through and watch while I'm just trying to get home? And they want my sympathy?

/rant

[John]

The protest in Atlanta is an example of why Trump is going to be unstoppable. These people are totally unable to deal with someone who doesn't give a shit if they don't like something and want to protest about it.

[Hyperion]

Gonna repeat myself. All the left had to do is stick with 'more free shit' and just keep their mouths shut otherwise and try to look somewhat sane. But no, they had to go batshit crazy for everyone to see. Well, see how that worked out?

[Jerryskids]

This is a fucking outrage. These protestors are asking me to be accepting of and tolerant of and appreciative of another culture? Let's just call it by it's real name - cultural appropriation. Well you scumbag sonsabitches can protest in favor of stealing these people's culture by "assimilation" - AKA cultural genocide - but count me out of your evil plans you bastards.

[Jerryskids]

"Segregation now, segregation forever" is what I always say. I fully support the right of marginalized minorities - non-men, non-white, non-Christian, non-specifically-gendered, all of them except that vast majority of straight white middle-aged Republican Christian men - to establish their own communities of concern and their own safe spaces free from any interference or influence from outsiders.

[Hyperion]

I see you don't do history. The entire world was living in blissful peace and harmony. And then you white devils appeared and see what has happened?

[cavalier973]

Trump=literal Hitler
Syrian refugee=literal Anne Frank

But refusing to allow A.F. into H.'s country is evil, or something.

[Bra Ket]

The article is pretty formulaic but the video is great.

Especially the love for executive orders, just not ones from Trump.

[Ken Shultz]

Well, President Elizabeth Warren is going to need those to use against white people and their guns.

[Bra Ket]

As long as she tries to work with congress first before issuing imperial edicts only when congress refuses to do what she wants.

[Ken Shultz]

+1

[AlmightyJB]

Elections have consequences. She has a phone and a pen.

[Africanis]

Oh no, they are protesting again, what ever will Trump do. There are a few hundred protesters out there. There were 300 hundred people affected out of a nation of 350 million it's the end of the world. By the way there is no Muslim ban and anyone using the term is a hack.

[AlmightyJB]

They'll be 4 years of the this. The major cities have a pretty well organized network of progs. They can put together a protest almost instantaneously. Obviously. They will protest everything.

[Hyperion]

I have this feeling that the left are going to hand the GOP landslide victories in the next several elections. They really are their own worst enemies.

[AlmightyJB]

My concern is that average voters will be so fatigued by all of it that they'll vote democrat just so they don't have to hear about it anymore. I think that may even be the strategy.

[John]

I don't think that will happen. I think that is a lot of what happened in 2008. People voted for Obama thinking he would bring the country together and the left would shut up for a while. Since that didn't work and seemed to make the left even worse, I don't think they will fall for that again.

[Hyperion]

I have a strong feeling that the behavior of the Democrats over the next couple of years will end any chance of that happening.

[Hyperion]

Taxi Driver's strike because of Trump

Oh noes! This is an Uber bad situation!

[Password: pode$ta]

God dammit, what if someone needs a Lyft?

[OneOut]

They should have their medallions stripped.

[Rhywun]

Another job Americans won't do any more. And what better way to get them on your side than inconveniencing the shit out of them?

[Ted S.]

Travis Bickle's strike?

[DenverJ]

So, I use Uber and Lyft. Except, this morning I got a sanctimonious email from Lyft, criticizing Trump's immigration EO.
Of course, it's a cynical marketing ploy, since the left is calling for a boycott of Uber because Uber's CEO had the terminaty to accept a position on Trump's economic advisory board.
I use ride sharing to go places without getting DUIs, not to morally preen.
So, Lyft, your email just backfired: I'm not using your service anymore.

[Ted S.]

Did you tell them this?

[DenverJ]

Not yet. Started to reply, but haventy sent it, yet.

[DenverJ]

Now I've told them.

[Rhywun]

a sanctimonious email from Lyft, criticizing Trump's immigration EO

Wow. Why would they think that is proper thing to do. I hope none of my investment dollars are going to them.

[DenverJ]

"Defending Our Values

Hi (DenverJ),

We created Lyft to be a model for the type of community we want our world to be: diverse, inclusive, and safe.

This weekend, Trump closed the country's borders to refugees, immigrants, and even documented residents from around the world based on their country of origin. Banning people of a particular faith or creed, race or identity, sexuality or ethnicity, from entering the U.S. is antithetical to both Lyft's and our nation's core values. We stand firmly against these actions, and will not be silent on issues that threaten the values of our community.

We know this directly impacts many of our community members, their families, and friends. We stand with you, and are donating $1,000,000 over the next four years to the ACLU to defend our constitution. We ask that you continue to be there for each other - and together, continue proving the power of community.

John & Logan
Lyft Co-Founders

[Rhywun]

Banning people of a particular faith or creed, race or identity, sexuality or ethnicity

Which is not what he did, but whatevz. Signal away!

[AlmightyJB]

I noticed the DNC operative made sure to take a swipe at third party voters.

[MarkLastname]

That's how you win a battle. Make as many enemies as you can. Make sure every camp hates you. It's just a surefire strategy.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Non-voters and third party voters banned Muslims from entering the country. It's okay to throw around the term "fascism" when you have no intention of changing minds. Obama tried to work with Congress, so let's not talk about the tools he handed to he successors. Everyone on the other side needs to look outside their little bubble. These things are what the video taught me.

[Hyperion]

Maybe it's just me, but I got the distinct feeling that Obama was intentionally bringing in as many refugees as possible and intentionally settling them in small town flyover. Now why would he do that? Just asking.

[AlmightyJB]

Well I have an idea for the 50K Syrian refugees we are still taking. Half in Seattle and half in San Francisco. Somewhere nice, the artsy district, not the ghetto.

[Hyperion]

I like this idea. And the left should really love it.

[John]

I am all for that. But can I have 10K to put in the Dupont Circle area of DC and up Mass Avenue between Reason and CATO headquarters?

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Yeah. Fuckin' cosmos.

[AlmightyJB]

Lol

[lap83]

Reason staffers will send over a basket of cosmopolitan cocktail mix and artisan mayo with a card that says they are sorry for all our country has done to cause blowback and we're all a bunch of Adam Lanzas. Any terrorists there will shed a single tear and bravely move back home bringing with them a new message of peace, freedom, and self driving cars. Middle East becomes Libertopia.

[EDG reppin LBC]

Good one, lap83. 🙂

[lap83]

Because, with all the radical right wingers already living there, the new batch of radicals will assimilate very well?

[Episteme]

Seriously, Obama - we allowed one Kryptonian refugee to settle in Kansas; next thing we know there's a giant Kryptonian vessel destroying Metropolis and trying to terraform our planet. THAT is the problem with these things...

[Fist of Etiquette]

Will none of our presidents fly backwards around the earth fast enough to turn back the Muslim horde?

[Hyperion]

When are the left going to start protesting Zoolander. He's a fascist Muslim hater!

Zoolander hates all Muslims!

"Prime Minister Justin Trudeau welcomed those fleeing war and persecution on Saturday even as Canadian airlines said they would turn back U.S.-bound passengers to comply with an immigration ban on people from seven Muslim-majority countries."

[Password: pode$ta]

What We Saw at the #MuslimBan Protest at LAX: New at Reason

The exact same people that have been at every other march over the last year? #intersectionality

[AlmightyJB]

The same people who were not protesting Obamas restrictions on Visas, or illegal immigrant deportations, or the bombing of Middle Eastern countries.

[Rhywun]

Oh crap, I already ate a bowl of popcorn for the last post and now I see this.

[AlmightyJB]

Time for a refill

[Rhywun]

I'm kind of bloated from the last one.

[MWG]

I see red Tony is back to shit all over the thread. The trumptonian road to Armageddon is going to be long and tedious.

[John]

I say mean things to you and make arguments and point out facts you don't like. You poor dear. Thanks for whining and complaining. It is quite nice to watch and a good role for you.

[MWG]

No john, don't feel bad for me. I don't have the same victim complex you do.

[Ken Shultz]

You're a troll, but aren't you a self-described progressive, too?

[MWG]

Lol, I've never been described as a troll before around here and only to people like John would I be described as a progressive.

[John]

I wouldn't describe you as anything. I have honestly never seen you make a salient point or do anything except bitch about me. You don't seem to have any opinions.

[MWG]

Lol, yeah John two days of calling you out after me being here for years means I've never made a point at H&R.

[John]

Okay. Link to one. I would be curious to see it. Just what are your opinions. Do tell.

[MWG]

Search my handle in Reason. It's not hard.

[John]

Sure. And I don't find any. What am I missing? Link to something because I don't see where you have any opinions.

[MWG]

Tedious as always John: site:reason.com/blog mwg

[Ken Shultz]

You're trolling.

You have no point to make--except that John cares about Christians?

You're just a troll.

Actors act. Swimmers swim. Writers write, and trollers are trolls when they're trolling.

[MWG]

"You have no point to make--except that John cares about Christians?"

Yeah Ken, it really bothers me that Ken cares about Christians.

No, my vocal disdain for John this weekend is a result of months of constant bitching about any and all chriticism of Trump. Incessant pants shitting about immigrants and refugees. Although, I would say his constantly bitching about Reason not falling in line behind his views and appearantly of republicans is the most obnoxious thing about him. H&R is a libertarian blog and libertarians generally (not always of course) se open immigration as a net positive and collectavism (teh muzlims!) as a net negative.

It's one thing to disagree , but to constantly bitch about a libertarian magazine writing generally libertarian thing is... strange. I've pretty much disengaged as have others from the commentariat since the trumpkins all but took over, but why should libertarians have to sit back while non libertarians sit around on a libertarian website and bitch about libertarians being libertarians.

I've engaged many I disagree with in the past around here, but John represents a lot about what has ruined a pretty open and lively debate among the commentariat. Constant pants shitting and bitching.

[Ken Shultz]

A lot of us have been complaining about Reason's coverage of Trump.

Your problem with John is personal. It doesn't have anything to do with any particular issue. You're just trolling John. And it's mostly about signaling.

So, you claim to be a libertarian now? That's great. I just don't remember seeing you arguing for any libertarian issue.

What are you a big gun rights guy, now? You're big time against ObamaCare? You want to see us get rid of Medicaid? What's your libertarian issue?

[Ken Shultz]

I mean, we know you don't like free association rights for Christians, right?

Or maybe you just don't like that John supports free association rights for Christians, but you support them yourself?

[MWG]

I'm all about free association. Even to the point I'm for allowing anyone into the country with the exception of those with communicable diseases and those with violent criminal records. I believe free association and free movement go hand in hand. How about you Ken? Are you for free association as much as I am?

[MWG]

and before anyone chime in, I'm also against the welfare state.

[Ken Shultz]

I already spent last week arguing for open borders. Don't need to prove anything.

I'm just not seeing you argue for any issue--except that you don't like John.

And that's what a troll is, right? Someone who just shows up without any issue or anything to add--they're just here to antagonize people.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

I believe free association and free movement go hand in hand.

How? I'm legitimately asking because I see no correlation. If a person wants to associate with a nation by migrating there, and the nation (as represented, however poorly, by the government) doesn't want to associate with the person, it's forced association to give the person free movement.

[MWG]

Nations or collectives for that matter don't have "rights" only individuals do. If I want to invite my wife's family over (they're foreigners), as long as they don't have communicable diseases and no violent criminal record, it's no ones business. Real free association amongst peaceful individuals necessarily requires free movement.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

Nations or collectives for that matter don't have "rights" only individuals do.

Bullshit. Nations or collective have exactly the rights their constituent individuals convey to them. This is why Citizens United is a thing, why corporations are able to exist, and why PETA can protest.

Governments have much more limited rights than they assert, but they have rights nonetheless. They have the rights granted to them by their constituents, Just like a group of people have the right to own property as a group and restrict entry to said property, so does government. Just like a group of people do not have the right to kidnap and torture somebody, neither does government.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

If I want to invite my wife's family over (they're foreigners), as long as they don't have communicable diseases and no violent criminal record, it's no ones business.

Sure it is, when they are required to cross other people's land to get to your house. Freedom of movement is a rejection of property rights.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

You're a troll, but aren't you a self-described progressive, too?

You're thinking of MNG, not MWG. Granted, MWG seems to make a habit of following John around and pissing on the thread right next to wherever John pisses on it, but MNG is the troll.

[John]

I don't feel bad for you. Where did I say that? Like I say above, whining about things you don't like is a good role for you.

[MWG]

Generally saying things like "poor dear" suggest a certain amount of pity and you calling me out for "whining" is hilarious coming from you. Look at this thread and the one from last night. All you do is bitch and moan that Reason is too nice to muslims and too mean to christians and Trump. You are the red Tony of H&R. Except defending Obama and progressives, you bitch about libertarians stacking Trump and republicans.

[Password: pode$ta]

Generally saying things like "poor dear" suggest a certain amount of pity

Bless your heart.

[MWG]

Thanks password!

[John]

Turn on your sarcasm meter.

[MWG]

Perhaps you should turn yours on, or did you think I was serious when I told you not to feel bad for me?

[Ken Shultz]

Are you denying being a progressive?

[MWG]

Yes. I am not a progressive.

[Ken Shultz]

Why do you care if John likes Christians?

[AlmightyJB]

Are you a pterodactyl?

[AlmightyJB]

To MNG

[MWG]

Shit. Emberassed that I had to google "pterodactyl".

[AlmightyJB]

When I was a kid there were only like 5 or 6 dinosaurs and that was one of them.

[MWG]

That's why I'm embarrassed.

[Password: pode$ta]

When I was a kid there were only like 5 or 6 dinosaurs and that was one of them.

Wait, I thought the comet killed them all at the same time!

I'll see myself out...

[MWG]

Hey-o!

[EDG reppin LBC]

Pterodactyl
T Rex
Stegosaurus
Brontosaurus
Triceratops

That was all of 'em. Till that damned Speilberg and his Jewrassic Park ruined dinosaurs!!

[MWG]

This.

[Password: pode$ta]

(((dinosaurs)))

[MWG]

Never forget.

[waffles]

Trump is the opposite of Obama. He is actually fulfilling campaign promises. This isn't what I'm used to!

[AlmightyJB]

That is very different. It's kinda weird actually. He's obviously not a professional politician.

[Episteme]

"Sir, you don't need to actually fulfill all those promises that you made. You could just go play golf on the public dime!"

"I...I did not know that. I'm big league embarrassed now..."

[MarkLastname]

Honestly, if all our presidents just played golf from here on out, we'd be better off. I propose Pine Valley take one for the team and offer each sitting president a freer membership and lessons, to distract him from ruining I mean running the country.

[AlmightyJB]

So are the protesters angry about the 90 day lull in travel from 7 countries with either state sponsored terrorism or significant terrorist populations, or the 120 delay in importing regugees from the heart of ISIS territory, or that Hillary or some other D isn't president?

[Rhywun]

Yes.

[Password: pode$ta]

If I had more spare time, I would start showing up to these things and taking a cue from this guy.

I bet I could convince most people there that I was dead fucking serious and that it's a major pressing issue.

[AlmightyJB]

Yeah, I've seen that. That's great.

[MarkLastname]

I would be ever so slightly more sympathetic (well, less antipathetic) toward these protestors if I didn't know they'd be just as upset if Trump abolished the federal minimum wage or suspended federal funding to all institutions that practics 'affirmative action.'

[Mauser]

What is so unlibertarian about border control? Look at the sickening statistics out of Europe - uncontrolled migration is destroying the great cultures of western civilization. In a country such as the U.S., which in its constitution is the closest we have to a true libertarian system, given this, why like Europe should we open the floodgates to millions whose cultural backgrounds do not respect western beliefs or western civilization. Not all cultures are equal. There should be a vetting process but not to the draconian and inhumane extent that Trump is using but there should definitely be a process without opening the floodgates.

As Thomas Sowell points out:

"People who came here a hundred years ago usually did so in order to fit within the framework of America and become Americans. Some still do. But many come from a very different cultural background ? and our own multiculturalism dogmas and grievance industry work to keep them foreign and resentful of Americans who have achieved more than they have.
Some immigrant groups seek to bring to America the very cultures whose failures led them to flee to this country. Not all individual immigrants and not all immigrant groups. But too many Americans have become so gullible that they are afraid to even get the facts about which immigrants have done well and improved America, and which have become a burden that can drag us all down."

[AlmightyJB]

I would like to have seen the question asked as to what those people would do to keep ISIS out.

[AlmightyJB]

I can't say that he is handling it the best possible way but security solutions aren't always simple.

[Hyperion]

See, you got it all backwards. The immigrants HAVE to be brought here for their own good, so that they can become liberals. If only Arab Spring would have worked.

[waffles]

Dude, the Arab Spring was like the best worst idea ever.

[GILMORE?]

uncontrolled migration is destroying the great cultures of western civilization.

oh, this made me laugh. I'm not a cytotoxic-type-apologist that claims that refugees are an unmitigated good... but .....seriously, anyone who claims that Europe = "great cultures of western civilization"? has probably never actually spent any significant time there. It sort of pretends that some classical music and greek-sculpture in the background makes boorish soccer-hooligans "classier". And pretends there haven't been millions of non-europeans living in europe for the last 100 years.

these sweeping claims about 'culture' and 'civilization' strike me as coming from an inherently low-brow, provincial mind. It dresses up thuggish, beer-hall nativism in Masterpiece Theater pretensions, acting that their concern isn't *really* that dirty Arabs are nothing but goat-fucking pickpockets... no, they're worried that the Louvre is going to turn into a mini-mall, or that it will hurt attendance at the Opera. It would be hilarious if people didn't pretend to be so sincere about their concern. As though chamber music were super-popular amongst the masses BEFORE the moozies showed up.

It was more plausible coming from the Vdare types... by which i mean, "still not plausible", but at least they put up a better act.

[Ted S.]

I tend to be sympathetic to the idea of immigration. What it seems to me is going on in the western world, however, is that you've got a media class that's propagandizing in favor of immigration, and a bunch of average people looking at their daily lives and seeing a situation that doesn't look like what the media is feeding them at all.

The media, of course, respond by saying that if you don't agree with them you're horribly racist, while too many people on the other side (John, for example), basically scream for no immigration whatsoever and that if you don't agree with them, you're some horrible anti-white racist who wants to destroy European liberal culture.

[Lurk Diggler]

Did john argue for no immigration at all?

[GILMORE?]

What it seems to me is going on in the western world, however, is that you've got a media class that's propagandizing in favor of immigration, and a bunch of average people looking at their daily lives and seeing a situation that doesn't look like what the media is feeding them at all.

I think that's right.

my particular beef is just that the people who say "BUT MAH CULTURES" and start handwaving about "civilizational decline" etc. strike me as simply dressing-up their very boring and unsophisticated argument in fancy-sounding bullshit ... rather than just doing the honest - and frankly more accurate, i think - thing, and just say, "These fucking dirty arabs are a bunch of rape-happy lazy misogynist tribal bastards we'd be better off without"

iow, "spare me your pretentious, classics-loving bullshit", and just stick with the nativistic nationalism stuff, thanks.

At least cite Sam Huntington, or Allan Bloom, or something to suggest that its not just a complete pose.

[Heroic Mulatto]

In my late 20s-early 30s, I read a lot of New English Review-type stuff from Hugh Fitzgerald, Rebecca Bynum, Theodore Dalrymple, etc., but eventually it grew tedious. I could only take so much of Brit and naturalized American Brit whinging about the Hannibals at our gates. Some years later, I would read Daniels' account of why he chose Dalrymple as his nom de plume and it struck me how much of what was behind their continual jeremiads was just a calculated and affected pose.

[GILMORE?]

my first exposure was the Vdare stuff, and i drew the same conclusion.

I found the argument much more compelling when the great threat to western civilization wasn't coming from "without" (from the brown hordes), but rather from "within", from the post-structuralist gibberish that has come to infect everything in the liberal arts. (which is basically Bloom's beef)

[Ted S.]

To be fair, I think that especially in Europe, there's a legitimate gripe on the part of the regular people in that integration always seems to mean the regular people have to change to make the immigrants fit in.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Yes, the predilection of Euros to bend-over backwards to accommodate others is well known. So much so that some Japanese people who visit Paris suffer straight-up psychological trauma from how cunt-ish the locals treat them.

[GILMORE?]

the regular people have to change to make the immigrants fit in.

oh, they probably will. but they don't "have to", they just do. lots of people in NYC who have zero italian background at all (or even lived near any) will surprisingly talk/act in ways that are far more like that of italian immigrants than of their own immigrant forebears. I mean, forget about it.

you'll find that i'm not crazy-sympathetic to the idea that "culture" is a fixed, immutable thing.

dude down below was suggesting that the "Western Cultures" being at risk of devolution was actually more of the "civic institutional" stuff that makes us Westerners so darn hardworking and successful

(and less the 'wine & cheese and opera and ballet, etc')

I don't really buy that either. If institutions erode its because the majority cease to believe in them, not because some new minority is somehow incompatible.

[westernsloper]

I think the low brow comment I would add and maybe what several are getting at, is that if a country has to start a state funded program to teach new arrivals that it is not ok to rape a young lady because she is wearing a short skirt, that maybe they need to rethink their immigration policy. That is not something we have had to do in the states, but some euro countries are. I don't think that is nativist or racist I think it is reasonable. Full disclosure, I have worked with, I don't know, hundreds of muslims who would not need to take that class, and I have worked with some who would.

Culture in any given country is regional and fluid. Personally I like it when cultures merge and become whatever they become.

On another note, I would totally see a band named the goat-fucking pickpockets even if was buzuqs and tambourines.

[GILMORE?]

I don't think that is nativist or racist I think it is reasonable.

i agree.

my point above wasn't against the substance of the argument being made (*that europe is 'doing immigration wrong'), but against the form of it (*that its 'destroying their culture' etc)

[westernsloper]

Ya, I got that and appreciated the point.

[MarkLastname]

Europe's woes are mainly Europe's fault. Between declining birth rates and stagnant economies, not to mention the overwhelming cultural malaise, the immigrants were just filling the vacuum, not causing the decline.

I love (some) European cultures, far more than American culture in fact. So Europe's decline saddens me. But it isn't 'the Muslims'' fault. They're just filling the void.

[Heroic Mulatto]

The only "culture" I'm interested in is football, big tits, and Southern rock. I mean, as a STEM major, internet atheist, and regular HnR commenter, I have to say that the fine arts, literature, and philosophy like in those fag European "museums" and shit are actually what's ruining the world. Making stupid pictures and books for stupid children and women to look at or read with instead of majoring in something useful is mind-boggling for someone to do!

When you finally take the Red Pill, Gilmore, you'll finally understand what I mean.

*tips fedora in your direction*

[Lurk Diggler]

It's pretty simple, Europe and the US are among the freeist, most prosperous places on earth. It's not like a couple of places either. Essentially every free and prosperous country on earth today is there with the exception of a couple who decided to emulate European governance and culture.

Maybe the dirt is just magic, I don't know.

I think your confusing culture for genetics. Saying some non-Europeans lived in Europe is replacing culture for genes.

I'm not clear what your rant is about. It appears you've defined western culture as opera and think anyone who doesn't care about opera praising western culture is a hypocrite. Since western culture is more enlightenment thought about where liberty is derived, and its relationship with free markets it's a rather silly claim. Define western culture correctly and problem solved.

[GILMORE?]

I'm not clear what your rant is about

normally the thing is to ask a question, then.

[Troy muy grande boner]

What is so unlibertarian about border control?,/i>

A libertarian might have to spend an extra few bucks to get his lawn mowed so that he can scream "GET OFF MY LAWN!" NTTAWWT

[AlmightyJB]

So the poster with the chick with the American flag hajib and wearing makeup. How long would she live in one of those 7 countries?

[Hyperion]

Oh some on now, JB, stop with your hyperbole. She'd live on just fine after the good ass beating that she totally deserved. I mean if her brothers or cousins don't throw her down a well or something.

[Hyperion]

Damnit, one beer and I can't spell.

[AlmightyJB]

My android keyboard and spellcheck are so horrible, I spend more time fixing than typing and I still don't catch everything.

[Hyperion]

I don't even try posting on my phone or tablet anymore. Not even on my laptop. Desktop or no posting for me.

[Rhywun]

Never posted on a phone and never will. I have a computer for that. Very occasionally I have to reply to a work email on my phone and it's like "This isn't right. People are not meant for this stupidity."

[MWG]

Luddite!

[Hyperion]

Bullshit. When I get my phone that will fold out into a 25" display, then I can post on my phone. Until then, that's what this monster tower sitting on my desk is for. That and general surfing and gaming. And oh, telecommuting.

[Rhywun]

It's all going to be brain implants and thought control someday. Until then the great masses will think it's perfectly normal to walk around like a zombie staring down at your phone all day and transmitting gibberish.

[Hyperion]

"Until then the great masses will think it's perfectly normal to walk around like a zombie staring down at your phone all day and transmitting gibberish."

Where the fuck have you been? Half of us, the half they call females, already think that is normal and behave accordingly.

[Rhywun]

Feh it's not just females and I've been bitching about it for ten years

[EDG reppin LBC]

And porn.

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

WAIT A DAMN MINUTE!

You expect us to believe that you had ONE beer by 3:00 pm? Who the fuck do you think we are?

[Hyperion]

Yeah, no kidding. One beer. I was off to a slow start.

[MWG]

It's probably why she'd prefer to be in the US.

[MarkLastname]

I have it on good authority she actually came here just to see Wrigley field.

[Ken Shultz]

Some of the protestations I'm seeing about Trump's policy are dripping with elitism.

"More than 17,000 students from the seven countries listed in Mr. Trump's order were enrolled at U.S. schools in the 2015-2016 year, according to the Institute of International Education, while more than 2,000 such teachers and researchers were at U.S. colleges and universities . . . . Portland State has 76 students from the affected countries, most of them enrolled in graduate programs.

"Campuses Checking On International Students, Faculty After Trump Order"

http://www.wsj.com/articles/ca.....1485710683

If Trump can't see how upset white, blue collar, middle class voters in Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin are going to be about all the Sudanese graduate students who are being inconvenienced by his policies, then he doesn't have any chance of being reelected in four years.

I guess that's what we're supposed to take away from this.

[Hyperion]

I heard that Trump was already done after that women's march. Can't they just all go home now and be like normal people?

[AlmightyJB]

Done? There goes my dream of working at Stalag 13.

[Rhywun]

Did they read something in the EO that the rest of us didn't see?

[Heroic Mulatto]

Iran is currently in 11th place for numbers of international students, sending about the same number of students as Turkey or the United Kingdom.

[Rhywun]

My point is I don't see anything in it about yanking these scholars out of class and shipping them home.

[Heroic Mulatto]

TFA states that institutions are warning against travel outside of the country during the period. Particularly, depending on a particular institution's calendar, their upcoming spring break may fall under the 90 days.

[Rhywun]

I have Indian coworkers that encounter this stuff - to the point where if I was here on a green card I might not even think of leaving. One of them went home to collect his bride and was stuck there for six months because of visa issues. Not defending Trump here but at the same time it's par for the course & not the end of the world, really. The hysterics coming from every direction are a bit overblown, I think.

[Heroic Mulatto]

I agree that it's par for the course.

That having been said, I wouldn't mind if such hysterics led to a closer look at INS fuckwadery and led to reform.

[GILMORE?]

I wouldn't mind if such hysterics led to a closer look at INS fuckwadery and led to reform.

indeed, but like with "police violence", i expect this will be used for identity-politics victim mongering and claims of "racism", and completely ignore the systemic problems with the bureaucracy

[Hyperion]

Whatever libertarian issue you crazies are prattling on about, give it up. The Democrats will hijack your perfectly sensible idea, make it all about race, and ruin any chances for any solution, forever.

[MarkLastname]

Yeah. Problems aren't meant to be solved, they're an end in themselves.

[Cdr Lytton]

Or at CBP's general dickishness and what an incredibly poor image they project for this country. Last week, coming back through, CBP agent was yelling at an elderly Chinese man who didn't apparently speak English to get away from the agent because he was standing too close and to continue exiting. The Chinese guy was gestures that his family was still in the line and he was waiting for them. CBP agent continues to tell man to leave.

Meanwhile, similar experience in Japan. Wife was taking a moment to collect her passport and put it away in her purse. Japanese customs agent comes over to tell us we can't wait there, sees that my wife was just getting her purse back together, says ok and turns around without berating us through the exit.

[Cdr Lytton]

Similar scenario, not similar experience.

[MWG]

I travel outside over seas about once a month for work. I'd say 70 of my returns are "pleasant", but the other 30% makes me hate everything about CBP.

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Last CBP agent I had was Thanksgiving 2016, pleasant old black guy agent, great rapport, didn't hassle me about a declared high 4-figures sum of money, and even said something like "I can see you're declaring your own money" and waved us through. Bacon cheeseburger and beer for Thanksgiving dinner and hot tub the next morning at airport hotel. Finest Thanksgiving ever.

[Cdr Lytton]

Keep talking it up and people might start wondering who is paying for those slots at public universities.

[Rufus The Monocled]

I see the mainstream media is continuing on with the fake news.

Bill Clinton in 1995:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3yesvvYEvs

Jesus, the perpetually outraged ignoramuses are going to tire out pretty quick.

Have they ever heard of PACING?

[Password: pode$ta]

I don't think they'll tire out.

I think 'marching' and 'protesting' is becoming a sort of hobby for them.

[Rufus The Monocled]

Prog: Hey, you want to go protest?
Rufus: Don't you have to work?
Prog: Look at Mr. 2007. It's a part-time economy now!
Rufus: What do you mean?
Prog: I'm scheduled to work 3-6 at the Bowling Alley so it's all good man!
Rufus: How are you supposed to get out of your sister's basemen that way, Ed?
Prog (distracted at protestors marching by): Woooo! This pussy bites!

[waffles]

Don't ever joke about the vagina dentata.

[one true athena]

I just had to pass by LAX and saw people walking into the airport with their hand-written signs (do people not know how to print from their computer? why do all their signs look like a second-grader painted them?), so Day 2 of protests is starting. I'm so glad I don't have to fly today.

[Wizard with a Woodchipper]

OT: aw, shit, dogs, looks like Preet Bruhaha is sitting down with de Blasio to discuss the mayor's fund-raising.

http://tinyurl.com/hzng9hj

Couldn't happen to a nicer asshole.

[Suthenboy]

Quick, someone run in the room ambush style and throw a sack over the two of them and tie it up tight.

*internet bluster, hyperbole disclaimer

[Suthenboy]

I haven't been able to comment much today. Had a roof leak recently so...patching the roof, bleaching and scraping the interior ceiling, some spackling, etc. etc. preparing to seal and paint tomorrow. Now I have just finished throwing together a pot of sauce picante and putting it on to boil.

I sit down here and I get this? A muslim ban? No one is trying to ban muslims. If they are they don't know what they are doing. I notice the list is short on a few muslim countries. What is Indonesia, flied lice?

[Heroic Mulatto]

I think you mean "chicken satay".

[EDG reppin LBC]

I'm sorry, I don't speak jive.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Chinee Parang

[EDG reppin LBC]

By the way HM, thanks for linking to the rum/bollywood/calypso stuff. I was playing some videos for my wife, and she enjoyed them. Hell, she'll probably create an Amazon music channel devoted to the stuff now. She's a weirdo. But I love her.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Tell her it's called chutney music, and the proper thing to do to it is whine her hips like a goddamn snake.

[Suthenboy]

I will translate EDG.

Chicken marinated in lime, lemongrass, soy sauce and chili pepper bbq'd on kabobs and served with spicy peanut sauce (peanut butter, coconut milk, pepper, agave?, )

Thats from memory. I will have to look it up before I try to make it.

It's good stuff.

[Heroic Mulatto]

agave?

A good rule of thumb is that if it's S.E. Asian, it's palm sugar.

[westernsloper]

A good rule of thumb is that if it's S.E. Asian, it's palm sugar.

Perhaps the best euphemism yet.

[Playa Manhattan.]

There's some ketchup in there too.

[Suthenboy]

1/4 cup flour whipped into 1/4 cup olive oil, cook over medium high stirring constantly until you have a dark roux. ( not too different from a peanut sauce, I guess )

Mix in 6 oz can of tomato paste (canned paste is cooked in the canning process - a cheat when you don't have time to cook the tomatoes down yourself)

Throw in a chopped sweet onion, a chopped sweet bell pepper, garlic, cayenne, a little basil, a pinch of white pepper. Put in three cups of water and bring to a boil while you cut up the cajun sausage into 1/4" slices. Throw in the sausage and 2 - 4 chicken leg quarters.

Bring water level up to cover the meats, cover and bring back to a boil for 1-1/2 hours. It should thicken up nicely and be unbelievably delicious. Serve over rice.

It is quite different from chicken satay, but now you have me wanting to make chicken satay.

[Heroic Mulatto]

Nice!

That's the Suthenboy food I like!

[Pompey:? Class Mothersmucker]

Best gd chicken satay I ever had was a little 8ft wide shop front in Bangkok Chinatown, grilled over charcoal on a glorified hibachi on the pavement, their own spicy peanut sauce was good enough to drink.

[EDG reppin LBC]

Eat like the locals. Can never go wrong.

[Hamster of Doom]

This fucking fuck. Christ, what an asshole.

"Stop doing anything that could be construed as free speech without a permit," [Denver Police Commander Tony Lopez] explains.

"I cannot carry the Constitution without a permit?" one protester asks.

"Correct," the officer replies.

Trigger warning: There are no non-assholes in the video. That's a ferreal quote, though.

[GILMORE?]

the outrage is not that he said it, but that he will still have a job tomorrow.

[Suthenboy]

Tony Lopez doesnt understand what a right is. I suspect a judge will explain it to him before this is over.

Having said that the protesters are unscheduled and probably causing disruption. The cops should straighten it out so the airport can function (assuming it isnt ) but god damn that is one stupid thing to say. Cant carry a copy of the constitution? Watch me motherfucker.

[Heroic Mulatto]

You can't fool me, HoD! That's Jerry Lewis in a Candid Camera skit.

[Philippe Lemoine]

As I explain in this post, not only are the reaction to this executive order completely hysterical, but the hypocrisy of liberals in that affair is truly baffling. Overall, the charge of hypocrisy doesn't apply to libertarians, but I'm not sure I can say the same thing about the charge of being hysterical.

[GILMORE?]

FYI = Your blog-whoring-link was sugarfree'd

[Warty]

Anything in the Reason pipeline about sloopy's mom being gorillafucked by baboons in uniform? That shit needs the full Balko treatment.

[John]

NO shit? What happened?

[Hamster of Doom]

Link to commentariat thread.

Local news hack job, like wow.

[John]

Holy shit. This shit can happen to anyone. The days of respectable looking white people being immune from the police state have long since ended. And of course count on the fucking news to be state run media. Assholes.

[Hyperion]

Where you been, John? This stuff has been happening to 'anyone' for a long time now. Something might actually be done about it if the Democrats would stop making it all about race and getting away with it.

[John]

I am not saying it is new. It just never ceases to be appalling.

[MarkLastname]

"Obscenities were directed..."
Haha what? Let me guess: the cop was the one shouting them and he got spooked by his own echo.

[Rufus The Monocled]

http://www.blufftontoday.com/s.....t-comments

[Rufus The Monocled]

I'd be the world's worst journalist.

In fact...that gives me an idea...

[Warty]

She's a nurse, she was at a high school basketball game, a kid had an asthma attack, she rendered aid and tried to get the official to stop the game so EMS could take care of the kid like he's supposed to do, so a cop did the reasonable thing and bodyslammed the dangerous 67 year old woman, put his knee in her back, cuffed her, then picked her up by the cuffs. Oh, and as an extra fuck you, they made her spend the night in jail.

Basically, sloopy's family's net worth is about to increase. Let's put it that way.

Here's the local paper parroting the bullshit direct from the pigs. http://www.jaspersuntimes.com/.....upt-finish

Do I have it about right, Ken?

[John]

Thanks. I hope he sues the living shit out of them. Too bad they are not around here, I would get admitted pro hoc and represent them for free.

[Warty]

Apparently this town has a lot of poor black people who are not fans of the local PD. It might be interesting to shine a little light on their practices over the years. If they're willing to publicly brutalize a little old white lady, what haven't they done?

[(((Renegade)))]

I suspect contingency lawyers are stepping all over each other to get to this platinum mine.

[GILMORE?]

The official characterization =

Ridgeland police officer Kyle Horton = "When I went in I saw (her) going after the referee. She appeared to be angry and it appeared she wanted to bring harm to the referee. I went over to talk to her to get her out of the gym for a cool down period

[Rhywun]

Well that was pleasant viewing

[Hyperion]

Well look, it's all about race. That's totally not a black cop beating the crap out of a defenseless black guy. Nope, it's not that the cops are out of control, it's all whitey's fault!

Who was the black guy who wrote that book 'Please stop helping us'? Yeah, that guy was onto something.

[Suthenboy]

In the past lawsuits like this rarely prevailed. It was word against word as to what happened. Defendants were rarely sympathetic types and the cops word was gold.

Cell phone video is changing that. Someone got video of what happened. I just hope the cop tells lie on top of lie and then gets exposed in court when the inevitable video surfaces.

[(((Renegade)))]

Even if there weren't, you have several hundred unsympathetic witnesses.

[Suthenboy]

It will be a couple of years before that all works it way through the courts.

[EDG reppin LBC]

That's fucked. I hope they sue the shit out of that cop and that pd. May have to move to a new retirement community though. Just saying.

[Cdr Lytton]

Huh. The arrested woman, who dared to speak to an official which is absolutely forbidden, has the same last name as the assistant coach. What a coinky-dink. Could there be a relationship there? And the police officer advised the ref to end the game at the next dead ball? That totally smells legit.

[Ted S.]

I love the woman defending the other team's coach because his teams have won a lot of games over the years. So did Joe Paterno's teams.

[straffinrun]

Reading The Yomiuri Shinbun this morning. Above the fold story on Trump tightening the screws on immigration with a big old picture of a protest in New York. One protester is looking at the camera and holding a sign that reads, "The Whole World Is Watching" (Reuters). Oh, you Yomiuri kidders. What's Japan's immigration policy again?

[Suthenboy]

I was just thinking that. Or Mexico's. Or...hell, take your pick. They are all pissed because they liked the idea that our more open policies meant there was a chance they could leave the shitholes they live in and come here, even if unlikely, there was a chance. Trump took their hope away.

[straffinrun]

I've had the immigration talk with quite a few Japanese people. The ones that fancy themselves to be a Western Liberal type are aghast at the Trumpening and the working stiff types are more like, "Meh. It's your country." The working stiff types outnumber the Liberal type by 10 to 1(?).

[Ted S.]

Their treatment of Koreans is exemplary....

[Cdr Lytton]

I think it's in Theoretical Immigration Policy II - The Real Policy of Japan.

[Ted S.]

The anti-Trumpers aren't only unhinged, they're petty.

Could you imagine if people made this sort of fun of Michelle Obama's dresses?

[Ted S.]

This response is even worse.

[straffinrun]

Those aren't very civil discussions. Fucking Twitter is an utter cesspool of sophistry, ad hominem, appeals to emotion and any other enemy of open dialogue you can imagine.

[Ted S.]

Those tweets are speaking truth to power, why any criticism of the Obamas is RAAAAYCIST!

[Ted S.]

Oh, and I only came across them because they were responses to a "recommended" tweet. I have no real interest in this shit, so I have no idea why they're recommending this. (The Tom Crabtree tweets I can understand.)

[Rufus The Monocled]

3340 likes.

[The Fusionist]

"This response is even worse."

Ivanka's wedding photo, captioned "War Criminals."

That's from Mel Gibson's account, right?

[Rhywun]

I don't get it. What's so wildly offensive about that?

[Apatheist ?_??]

I kinda agree, people here made fun of Michelle Obama, including her looks, for years.

[(((Renegade)))]

You talking about the Wookie?

[Rhywun]

Only because she's an authoritarian who wants to rip your arms out but OK.

[Rhywun]

But there must be something specific that's "offensive". What is it?

[DK]

All I can figure is that her husband has his hand on her butt. Maybe the tweeter thinks he's grabbing her pussy.

[Apatheist ?_??]

I didn't get that you were referring to the person who called the dress post offensive. It obviously isn't. Neither making fun of her dress or posting a dress is offensive.

[Ted S.]

I said petty. And these tend to be the same sort of people who would claim Michelle Obama was the most glamorous First Lady since Jacqueline Kennedy (overrated; can we finally get past the Camelot garbage?).

There was another one that photoshopped the words "War Criminal" over that image. That I find more offensive, especially considering Barack's use of drones.

[Rhywun]

I was quoting the tweeter. He said it was "wildly offensive" for her to post a picture of her in a dress.

[Ted S.]

Obviously I thought you were quoting me. [blush]

[Bra Ket]

perhaps it's the fact that she's out living it up while muslims are suffering holocaust-level brutal repression at US airports.

[Hyperion]

I'm pretty sure that Melania is prettier than Michelle. I mean, I know, I know, it's just my natural inbred, inborn racism that's cloudin muh eyes, but I'm sort of stuck with it, you know. I'm also confident that Melania will be the most hated first lady ever (by the left) and that she probably should just shut the fuck up and look pretty. Sorry, but I'm actually agreeing with that last part. STFU, Melania,so that we can pretend you have a brain.

[SIV]

Some animals are more equal than others:

Joe
2 hours ago
Virat Patcharaphangkorn and all fans of rooster fighting should be shot to death.

[Ted S.]

I'm sure Donald Trump can drone-bomb you.

[Rhywun]

It's 3am and I'm at a cockfight. What am I clinging to?

[thrakkorzog]

I'm guessing it's a bottle of something.

[OneOut]

A cock ?

[Hyperion]

Damnit, you're one of them tea fuckers, I knew it!

[Rhywun]

PS. I didn't know they had Puerto Ricans in Thailand.

[AlmightyJB]

Everyone below around 30 degrees north is basically the same race.

[The Fusionist]

Their capital is called Bang Cock. NTTAWWT.

[Heroic Mulatto]

My mother-in-law, who lives in the land of Virat Patcharaphangkorn, breeds fighting roosters. She can make the equivalent of 1 to 2 year's salary on a champion.

[esteve7]

I don't understand. If there are 52 muslim majority nations, and this EO impacts 7 of them, how is that 'banning all muslims'?

[lap83]

Those Mooslems all seem alike to those of us who appreciate their diversity

[The Fusionist]

You obviously lack empathy, you fascist.

[AlmightyJB]

I always thought the fact that I lacked empathy made me a sociopath. Fascist does have a nice ring to it though. At least it's an ethos.

[Rhywun]

I always thought the fact that I lacked empathy made me a sociopath.

You could at least fake it like every leftist.

[AlmightyJB]

How do think I get laid?

[The Elite Elite]

Hey, you heard Hihn. We're all facists here.

[Pan Zagloba]

Not all of us. There's a list and those of us not on it are just plebes.

Hihn is strict but fair. Like you know who else...

[Lord Rollingpin]

Only the elite, most of us are just stalkers 🙁

[AlmightyJB]

Because limiting travel for 3 months from 7 countries that either sponsor terrorism or have significant terrorist populations or both doesn't sound as bad as banning all Muslims.

[MarkLastname]

To be accurate would have required being able to do long division to get "13.4% Muslim Ban" and log division is hard of liberal arts majors.

[The Fusionist]

Reason TV seems to have difficulty finding intelligent people to talk on camera at these marches.

Maybe Reason TV was covering the wrong marches, hint hint?

[The Fusionist]

But of course still photos from the March for Life, and a link to a stop-motion video of the march, was almost like interviewing the marchers on camera, I guess.

[The Fusionist]

Not a stop motion video...what do you call it when it's accelerated?

[Ted S.]

Time-lapse.

[The Fusionist]

Thank you.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

This is stop motion.

[AlmightyJB]

I would like to see better follow up questions that test the persons knowledge of the talking points they parrot.

[SIV]

A great libertarian Movie Classic is on Turner Classic Movies right now.

[The Fusionist]

Jimmy Stewart as a straight-talking Everyman with a heart of gold? I just can't see it.

[Ted S.]

Relevant.

[AlmightyJB]

Katharine Ross was a total babe

[Ted S.]

So was Paula Prentiss.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

So was Jill St. John.

[cavalier973]

FedEx guy who rescued U.S. flag gets to keep working for FedEx.

[Rhywun]

ugh trumpkin

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Sports Illustrated has a fairly even-handed article regarding the Super Bowl sex trafficking myth

My favorite section:

There's also the benefit of publicity. With thousands of media members in town for the Super Bowl?and often desperate for content?what better time to draw attention to a serious issue? Asked about the issue in 2011, McCarthy, the NFL spokesman, said to the Voice that the alleged spike in trafficking around the Super Bowl was "urban legend." He had pivoted by '14: "We were pleased to learn that the grave concerns about human trafficking and prostitution were not realized. Federal, state and local law enforcement deserve the credit for keeping host cities safe.... To further illustrate our support of law enforcement's efforts to combat human trafficking when there are 'special events,' the league's security department hosted a meeting in September of the supervisory command staff of the Violent Crimes Against Children Section of the FBI." Indeed, the prevailing sentiment goes something like this: Even if it's not the isolated crisis it's cracked up to be, what's the harm in treating it like one?

[AlmightyJB]

We have to credit law enforcement for preventing the imaginary crisis.

[Rhywun]

Well, when you equate all prostitution with "trafficking"...

[Hyperion]

If we can just pass a bill that turns all them teen sexters into international sex traffickers, we'll finally start to win against the terrorists. I mean no one who is a teen and has a phone and is forced into contact with teen girls with bodies like adult wimninz would ever be involved in that type behavior unless they were international sex traffickers, amirite?

[Rhywun]

We didn't have "smartphones" or "sexting" in my day. Poor us.

[straffinrun]

Trump is being an ass to green card and visa holders. Does my saying that mean I also have to believe the Muslim holocaust is nearing?

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Yes. You are either totally with Trump or totally against him. Choose wisely.

[Hyperion]

It's totally like that. Either you're for totally open borders or you're a Nazi. Glad someone has finally figured this shit out.

[American sociaIist]

Stop with the Trumplove. It's just so sad to watch how obsequious you libertarians have become. What happened, for pete's sake?

[Chipper Morning Wood]

I would say that at best, about 50% of the commenters here are libertarian. The rest are paleoconservatives, which sometimes share the rhetoric with libertarians, but end up opposing libertarian policies whenever it clashes with their cultural agenda.

[Not a True MJG]

That's been the rule for 18 months now.

[Rhywun]

I think it means you're a cuck.

[Hyperion]

Cucks just show up like white spaces for me. Not sure how that happened.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Nah, in fact the #muslimban is unhelpful because it is so easily refuted. There is enough to not like here without identity politics bullshit.

I also think beyond politics this there is a lot to criticize here. If they had spent a little fucking time drafting the EO to be less vague, excluded permanent residents, excluded people already in transit, and given at least some heads up to CPD to keep things organized it wouldn't have ended up such a clusterfuck. Hell it probably would be completely legal too even if I disagree with policy.

[straffinrun]

Calling out Trump for this BS isn't going to earn any goodwill in future debates with his devout haters, but who cares. He's wrong on this one nonetheless.

[GILMORE?]

If they had spent a little fucking time drafting the EO to be less vague, excluded permanent residents, excluded people already in transit, and given at least some heads up to CPD to keep things organized it wouldn't have ended up such a clusterfuck

All true.

i think its also likely a good chunk of the clusterfuckery has to do with govt middlemen intentionally making it as confused and fucked up as possible; the entire administrative state is involved in what is a gigantic version of a slow-down strike. Which should also have been anticipated, so i don't know if that lessens the point any.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

govt middlemen intentionally making it as confused and fucked up as possible

I learn toward less intentional, and more toward ineptitude, because they are government bureaucrats who have only concern in life, and that is is covering their own ass.

[Rational Exuberance]

Trump is being an ass to green card and visa holders.

American politicians in general are asses to green card and visa holders, and even American expatriates. Both parties have screwed with the immigration system for racial, political, and class-based reasons. This massive outrage seems rather selective.

[grrizzly]

There's also another issue that's rarely brought up. Everybody* discussing immigration issues in public is full of shit. They don't know what they're talking about. Pretty much any specific they mention is incorrect. I'm talking about politicians, pundits, anyone discussing the immigration issues in almost any forum. The American relatives of immigrants (and of course the immigrants themselves) have a better grasp of the system, but even they are often familiar only with a part of it. In other words, there was never any chance for a substantive conversation.

*With the exception of immigration lawyers (but their articles are rarely published in the prestige media) and one immigration foe Krikorian from CIS.

[MarkLastname]

The real canary in the coal mine is when he says he's decided he'll let them in so he can 'send them to Madagascar...'

[American sociaIist]

Horrifying. Not the Muslim ban, which is horrifying, but the obnoxious way the questioner spent half the video blaming Obama for Trump's fascism. Gotta love the upturned nose at the smelly antifa when the questioner asked if describing Trump a fascist was a good tactic. Yeah, well fucker, I just call a spade a spade, ok? Is that ok with you?

[__Warren__]

I have a huge order of Syrian orphans due in port in a few weeks. Sure I got them for a huge discount, this year was an epic harvest, so I won't be out that much cash but it's still irritating this Trump guy can just do this.

[thrakkorzog]

Just order some extra canaries to stretch out the orphans in the monocle mine until the ban is lifted.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

You should get them to build you a floating city in the ocean. Complete with a giant monocle that can focus the sun at your enemies. You will need a full-time team just to keep the thing polished, and Head Polisher will become the most esteemed position in the floating city.

[American sociaIist]

I sure enjoy making the argument that Obama wasn't going to install a communist government, wasn't coming for your guns, wasn't an Islamist, wasn't a Kenyan with a Maoist anti-colonialist outlook more than I like making the argument that Trump is an actual fascist, who will collude with private businesses, deport people he deems unreliable, build a East German-style wall on the border, and restore Amerikkka gripped by an inferior fifth column that sucks jobs dry from the glorious masses of manufacturing workers in Iowa. It's because I enjoy less stress, not more.

[Ken Shultz]

Are you drunk?

[Ken Shultz]

Half that shit reads like it was written by Agile Cyborg--except Agile Cyborg is downright coherent compared to that.

Jesus!

[Pan Zagloba]

So what you're saying is CBC should hire him as an American correspondent? He'd be better than Neil MacDonald, at least.

[Rhywun]

OT: watching the hockey all-stars game and the musical stylings of some male pop-tart. My god it's so awful.

[Ken Shultz]

Worst sports weekend ever.

I even tried to watch the X-games it was so bad.

[Rhywun]

Hey, the men's national soccer team engineered a 0:0 draw against a C-team of Serbian youngsters... so there's that.

[Ted S.]

Roger Federer won the Australian Open. Beating piece of shit Nadal in the final, no less.

[Ted S.]

Why are you wasting your time on the NHL all-star game? (And I'm a hockey fan.)

[Hyperion]

OH MUH GODZ!

OH MUH GODZ, MOOBZ IS A CRYIN!

Listen, you ugly piece of shit, poor excuse for a human, you're not crying over all the pain you've caused for American citizens living abroad with you FATCA bullshit, are you? Die in a fire, motherfucker.

[Ken Shultz]

I don't want to root for Trump.

He's not a libertarian, and I don't like him.

And I don't want to root for him.

"Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPw-3e_pzqU

[Rhywun]

Not to mention the misery he's caused all over NYS. God what an asshole.

[Ken Shultz]

"OH MUH GODZ, MOOBZ IS A CRYIN!"

I'm against building the wall.

But it's getting to the point where I want them to build it--over my objections.

You know what I mean?

[Rhywun]

I like the props - what horrors was that little ginger kid fleeing?

[OneOut]

This Pro Bowl sucks.

The high school flag game at halftime is going to be more exciting than the game itself.

All these AmSocs are stupid. I can no longer tell them apart they are so equally stupid.

[Ken Shultz]

How could it not suck?

What could they possibly do with it to make it not suck?

Turn it into celebrity boxing tournament, maybe. Nobody gives a shit about the Pro Bowl.

[OneOut]

How could they make it not suck ?

Score touchdowns.

Throw the ball deep every play.

Pay the winners 100K and the losers nothing ? Make winning worth something.

Maybe it's because I was a kid but it seems like years ago it was worth watching.

Ever since player salaries have gotten so high they are rightfully afraid of injury .

[Rhywun]

Ever since player salaries have gotten so high they are rightfully afraid of injury

In the soccer world there's talk every year of letting some tournaments die out for that reason. The money-makers are kept safe and you wind up a lot of B-team action that doesn't generate a lot of interest.

[Ted S.]

So the response is to expand the World Cup to 48 teams.

Then again, I do think EPL/Primera/Serie A should all be 18-team leagues.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

#reasonable

Seriously, your experience here will be so much better if you liberally mute the idiots on here. I've never once regretted muting somebody on here.

[straffinrun]

Use reasonable on my home PC, not mobile. Seems a pain in the ass on the Iphone. I'm probably wrong though.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

I've never tried it on mobile. I've given up on reading reason on mobile in the first place. The site sucks in mobile form.

[straffinrun]

I'm out and about so I use the mobile. Since I'm a giant with giant hands, it's a miracle I don't have more typos with this tiny keyboard.

[Rhywun]

I'm a smallish person (5-8) with non-giant hands and even I can't type a goddamn sentence on a phone without massive frustration. Some day we'll look back on this era and wonder what the hell we were thinking.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

I'm a giant with giant hands

*unzips*

Go on...

[GILMORE?]

For the brief time it was around, i actually genuinely liked the old "Blue Blackberry" phones

you know, the ones that were as wide as a dinner plate and had a... not-LCD, whatever you call it old-school screen? the ones with a full keyboard.

They were chunky, but also had huge batteries that lasted 2-3 days at a pop. and they'd do email/text super fast. basically when i was working on the road, i could write pages and pages of emails without much frustration. it was more ergonomic than the modern iphone style things as well - you could operate it and scroll/open/close things all with one hand (the wheel in the upper right plus buttons placed right under your thumb made one-handed operation very easy and natural)

i remain frustrated that no one has since designed some modern version of this. I don't like the "giant touchscreen" phones (tho its what i have). I don't need the video camera or the *@#*$@ multimedia stuff. i just need an email/text/phone device with some kind of Open Office apps (even read-only), and maybe an mp3 player. boom, done. Makes no sense to me why there's not a single competitive option out there, and everyone is basically making 'one size fits all' devices.

[GILMORE?]

Here - this thing was the form factor i think was actually the most comfy and utilitarian, tho it could have been shrunk a bit

The last one i had was the "Curve 8310", which was pretty functional if getting cramped. the trackball thing in the middle was added and it put buttons in the upper right instead of the wheel. i think it all started to go south right after that (2007/8?), and everyone started getting iphones.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

This is the one for you.

In all seriousness, I agree with you. I need a phone that can do maps, email, office, document scanning, phone calls, text, and maybe a few other core tasks. If I can have a phone that can do that, along with modern battery tech, perhaps my phone wouldn't die after 8 hours?

I'd happily take 3 or 4 year old phone tech with a modern battery in it.

[GILMORE?]

I'd happily take 3 or 4 year old phone tech with a modern battery in it.

@#$(@ EXACTLY.

plus, i hate these fucking giant-screen phones. i'd sacrifice 1/3 of that for a well-designed keyboard, and a scroll wheel on the corner. I hate the fact that touchscreens constantly demand 2-hands.

[OneOut]

I love the idiots.

I love the personalities here.

John's perspective. Ken's reasoned discourse.

Crusty and Rufus' humor. Fist's once firstness. Playa and Sugarfree and the lot of you all.

I love the rank and file here like myself most of all, else wise it would just be a cool kids high school echo chamber.

I even love the retards who don't recognize the absolute brilliance that is everything Trump.

I love you all.*

*wipes tear from eye and runs from the room ashamed for non manly emotional outburst*

*and tells wife nothings wrong he just has something in his eye*

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

I can tell that you posted, but I can't read what you wrote because of reasonable. /just kidding

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

John's perspective. Ken's reasoned discourse.

Crusty and Rufus' humor

I am grouped in with those three? What the frick, bro?

[Fist of Etiquette]

I'm more than just firsties!

[Hyperion]

It sucks because Derek Carr isn't the 2nd QB.

[Hyperion]

Also, WTF? Why are they playing this game BEFORE the SB?

[Sevo]

"Also, WTF? Why are they playing this game BEFORE the SB?"

It's filler for an empty weekend; you think anyone would waste time watching this celebrity hug-fest after the SB?

[Hyperion]

Ok, but why are NFL teams ok with this? What if a key player gets hurt? Doesn't make any sense.

[Sevo]

"Ok, but why are NFL teams ok with this? What if a key player gets hurt?"

I haven't watched it in years, but it seemed the rules were pretty much 'touch-football'. Plus, the SB teams aren't gonna let any of their go-to guys play there; the rest can heal over the summer, since (AFAIK), the teams all get a cut of the advertising.
IOWs, the same reason they play during the season, but with less chance of injury.

[OneOut]

If David Carr was the 2nd QB it would really be exciting.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Triumph attends Trump's inaugural.

[OneOut]

At least the true Red Hatters have a sense of humor.

I doubt you could find one Obama voter who could handle it with a smile if the situation were reversed.

[Sevo]

Well, when you need accurate info, you go to the source, right?

"Kim Kardashian shuts down President Donald Trump's executive order banning Muslim immigrants in U.S."
[...]
"On Saturday, reality celebrity Kim Kardashian responded with a tweet that has the internet losing their minds."
http://www.sfgate.com/entertai.....892534.php

It's the Chron, scraping bottom for any anti-Trump crap they can find, and regardless of your opinion on Trump's ban, this is crap. Number 9 will make you throw up!

[The Grinch]

It's well established that Kim is one of the leading political intellectuals of our time and you should give careful thought to what she had to say.

[Rhywun]

That... person makes me throw up.

[Rich]

Her tweet notes that more Americans are killed each year by "falling out of bed," "armed toddlers," "lawnmowers," and "lightning" than Islamic jihadist immigrants.

Sheesh, Kim, thanks a lot! Now Trump will probably ban *lawnmowers*. No wonder the internet is losing their minds!

[OneOut]

Nice tits Kim. Yes I know where you eyes are. That's why you wore that shirt right ? So I would pay attention to you eyes ?

Now what were you saying ?

[JeremyR]

Kind of ironic given she's Armenian, one of the people who have suffered genocide at the hands of muslims

[Sevo]

JeremyR|1.29.17 @ 10:41PM|#
"Kind of ironic given she's Armenian, one of the people who have suffered genocide at the hands of muslims"

From what shows up in print about the entire family, I'd bet not a one thinks the world existed prior to the invention of TV.
So if you said "Armenian" to her, she'd probably respond with "Gesundheit!".

[MarkLastname]

"banning Muslim immigrants in U.S..."
Sigh. When you refuse to engage reality, and instead choose to engage your imagined reality, it does not convey confidence in your position.

[Apatheist ?_??]

If you want to see some non-hysterical left criticism of the EO check out Amash's twitter, especially the statement on "What many supporters and opponents of President Trump's executive order get wrong."

[GILMORE?]

non-hysterical left criticism of the EO check out Amash's twitter,

"left criticism"?

is the idea that anyone who disagrees with things Trump does are therefore expressing "left" views?

[Heroic Mulatto]

God, I love syntactic ambiguity!

[GILMORE?]

oh, i see, "NON (hysterical-left) instead of not "Non-hysterical (left)"

i read the second version because that's how it was written, but i do that sort of thing all the time so its understandable if it wasn't intended.

[Apatheist ?_??]

It was my fault for being less than clear, I hoped that the fact that it was Amash that noone would think he was a lefty!

[Heroic Mulatto]

but i do that sort of thing all the time

That's because English is a head-first language.

[Sevo]

Ya, the subject of the cat catching the cheese eating mouse being chased by the dog is quite clear.
No, I don't speak German

[Sevo]

Corrected:
Ya, it is quite clear the cat catching the cheese eating mouse is by the dog being chased.
Is that closer?
Danke.

[MarkLastname]

Bitte!

[thrakkorzog]

You don't have to be a leftist to disagree with Trump's EO, but the loudest critics, and the one's making the talk show rounds, are overwhelmingly leftists who see any sort of restrictions on immigration who see it as a sign that Trump = Hitler.

[AlmightyJB]

The problem is that they blatently lie about every issue, so simply just calling them out on their lies gets equated with being a Trump supporter which is not the same damn thing. God I hate progs.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Missed a - should be non-hysterical-left criticism. As in criticism that is not hysterical or lefty. Really couldn't find a way to type that well, I'm tired.

[Derpetologist]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/c.....osque.html

[Derpetologist]

oopsy

Several Killed at Quebec City Mosque: Police

[Derpetologist]

"Le Soleil newspaper reported that one of the arrested suspects was 27 years old and had a "Quebecois name." The paper also reported that one of the suspects possessed an AK-47."

[AlmightyJB]

Impossible. I have it on good authority that AKs are illegal in Canada.

[thrakkorzog]

Editor's note: This piece originally stated that Reuters reported the names of the assailants. However, the information came from a Reuters parody social-media account. We regret the error and have deleted the information.

So it is your standard, wait 12 hours for some actual information to come in, type situation, because the actual news outlets aren't bothering to fact check any 'breaking news'.

[Cdr Lytton]

Why does Reuters have a parody social-media account?

[Ted S.]

It's the apartheid state of Quebec fighting those who don't pray in French.

[Craig Gembecki]

I'm a registered Libertarian and will mostly continue voting as such. But wow, the comments section never lies about a constituency. And I can see now why Libertarians struggle to gain traction. Still sound more like conservative apologists and compassion means nothing.

[GILMORE?]

glad you could make sure to get that in before the weekend was up. It isn't sunday unless some anonymous more-libertarian-than-thou shows up and pearl-clutches over how aghast they are that people aren't moaning in unison with the progressives. you're doing gods work, friend.

[AlmightyJB]

My sisters girlfriend bought a brand new Prius trolling libertarian websites.

[GILMORE?]

trolling libertarian websites.

what's the other one?

[AlmightyJB]

allthepornsites.com

[Pan Zagloba]

Somali Road Maintenance Commission site.

[AlmightyJB]

#Error404

[__Warren__]

I sometimes clutch my pearls.

[GILMORE?]

you never fail to get a laugh from me. and i think that's because i'm awful.

[Derpetologist]

"I said *peas*, Jay with those little pearl onions I love so well."

[Derpetologist]

https://youtu.be/ET0UBXOcFYo?t=2m38s

[Derpetologist]

"Oh no! The Reverend Al Sharpton!"
https://youtu.be/ET0UBXOcFYo?t=11m54s

Yes, there was a time when Al Sharpton was the butt of jokes instead of the host of a MSBNC show.

[Derpetologist]

MSNBC, that is.

[OneOut]

Why not both ?

[thrakkorzog]

Were the peas at least full of healthy green pea-ness?

[Chipper Morning Wood]

SIV sometimes pearls his clutches.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

It's always somebody registered with their "real name" and complaining about how the hit & runpublicans are tanking libertarianism.

It's almost like it's the same person over and over again.

[GILMORE?]

You noticed too? i think its cute that they keep trying the same thing. I wanted to encourage them. its how traditions are established.

[Craig Gembecki]

I'm not a troll, just an observer. Jumping to the conclusion that someone is a troll looks/sounds/feels a lot like calling everything you don't agree with "fake news."

I'm just calling it like I see it. And trust me, I'm not the holier than thou type nor am I "more libertarian" than anyone here. In fact I probably am less. I think libertarians have simply left one ingredient out of a near flawless philosophy, and that is compassion.

[GILMORE?]

"Compassion"

as defined by you?

I think when the US stops its bombing campaign in the middle east, i'll consider its refugee policy more 'compassionate' in context.

People bemoaning our lack of a heedless open-door policy while ignoring the militarism causing the human dislocation in the first place don't strike me as compassionate so much as functionally-retarded.

[Craig Gembecki]

I understand that we cause the wreckage that leads them to flee. I don't understand telling them on one hand, "we're here because we're on your side fighting the bad guys" and on the other telling them, "we can't let you in when you run from the danger we're causing."

I thought to myself, "hey at least this GILMORE cat is reluctantly engaging me in the conversation." Then I scrolled and saw that your first instinct was that I was a troll. Why is that? Genuinely curious. Is it because you and other have cultivated yourselves a nice little bubble here and I just sounded different than what is usually said? As an outsider, I view it more as an ivory tower than a bubble, but you get the point.

[Sevo]

"...It isn't sunday unless some anonymous more-libertarian-than-thou shows up and pearl-clutches over how aghast they are that people aren't moaning in unison with the progressives...."

I'd missed that until you mentioned it several weeks back, and it is pretty consistent.
For a while, it seems we were also getting hihnfections on Sunday, but earlier; no suggestion that the conditions are related.

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

Craig, the people in these comments are freaks and weirdos, so I wouldn't take what they say seriously. They are not representative of any ideology - let alone an ideology that embraces liberty - and at the very least they are untrustworthy scoundrels who do not deserve your scorn. Run away, sir, run away while you still can.

Also, there is a least one or two jooz about, and those people are the worst.

[__Warren__]

(((Wurst)))

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Chicken wurst is an abomination. Pork is the only meat meant to be stuffed into intestines.

[Playa Manhattan.]

Jesse disagrees.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Thanks, Playa. Sometimes I slow pitch perfect set ups and no one steps up to the plate.

[AlmightyJB]

Always listen to this man Craig. He is very wise.

[Chipper Morning Wood]

That's some back-of-the-pet-store wisdom right there.

[(((Renegade)))]

those people are the worst.

I know Nikki and she's not one of (((us))).

[Crusty Juggler - #2]

One of them! One of them! One of them!

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

Craig, I am not a registered Libertarian, and I will continue not voting. But wow, your comment never lies about you. And I can see now why you're getting mercilessly flamed by the commentariat. Still sound more like a troll and complete sentences mean nothing.

[Hamster of Doom]

The free market exchange of ideas isn't old ladies having a quiet cuppa tea, princess. We get vigorous.

Maybe hang back in the safe spaces and let us get on with it.

[Craig Gembecki]

This is your safe space, Hamster of Doom. And most of the response to what I said (maybe all of the response) was nothing close to an exchange of ideas.

[thrakkorzog]

Oh dear god, Craig Gembecki is onto us. We're not really libertarians, none of us are really libertarians. He's found us out. No true libertarians among us.

OK, Call it a wrap everybody we got caught play acting. I'm thinking tomorrow we can do a production of West Side Story. We can use the swarthy skinned folks to play The Sharks, HM can play Bernardo. They have black people in Puerto Rico, right?
Shit, we forgot the libertarian women, so how can we do "America" or "I Feel Pretty" without a bunch of neckbeards in drag?

OK, scratch that thought, we've got a bunch of dudes with beards, we should totally do Jesus Christ Superstar. We can cut, "I Don't Know How to Love Him," since it kind of kills the pacing, and do it with an all male cast, no problem.

[Craig Gembecki]

You've all gone silent since I tried engaging you in some sort of "free market exchange of ideas" so maybe I did in fact uncover something that I wasn't intending to originally.

[MarkLastname]

Hi Craig! Are you a Polack? That sounds like a Polack name you have there, and um, this is a little embarrassing: we don't allow Polacks around here. Hygiene reasons. So yeah, carry on and have a nice day.

[JeremyR]

Sorry, but some of us don't think Shariah law is compatible with libertarianism and you get Shariah law when you reach a critical mass of muslims.

[OneOut]

OT: Maybe the #NeverTrump crowd is right after all.

A Mosque was shot up today. Some people dead and many others wounded.

Maybe the left are on to something. This is just too much. I can't even.

http://www.reuters.com/

Oh wait. It was in Canada, the home of the woke..

Never mind.

[GILMORE?]

, a witness told Reuters that up to three gunmen fired on about 40 people inside the Quebec City Islamic Cultural Center. Police put up a security perimeter around the mosque.

Quebec police confirmed the shooting at a Quebec mosque in a tweet, and police on the scene said there had been fatalities.

"There are many victims ... there are deaths," a Quebec police? spokesman told reporters.

A police tweet said there were deaths and injuries and that suspects had been arrested.

weird that its multiple people (*tho they said that in the early stages ofthe Dallas shootings too) - typically this sort of thing is a 1-man band. unless its moozie (sunni) on moozie (shia)... which is always possible.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

OT: Random observation... The biggest financial shock in moving from TX to VA has been the return to a regulated electricity market. In TX, I had a plan that knocked $100 off my bill if I was between 1000 and 2000 kWh in a month, resulting in electric bills that averaged between $30 and $50 a month for the last year. I came to VA, and the first bill covered 5 days (because I started mid billing cycle) and it was $81, with a full $68 of that being various charges and fees completely unrelated to my energy usage. Sure, $40 of that was a one-time connect charge (something completely unheard of in TX), but what a stark contrast!

[Chipper Morning Wood]

Yeah, but you will still save money in the summer, because you won't have to pump out 110 F air from your house.

[Trshmnstr, stuck in this can]

My next-door neighbor in TX was an insulation specialist, and he had done up our house to the hilt for the previous owner. Once we replaced the A/C last summer, we didn't have a bill over $70/month, even when it was triple digit heat.

I'm gonna have to fly him up here to do his magic, because the new house is a drafty mess.

[Sevo]

CA utility bills are loaded with 'for the chillunz' fees. They get to do so because it is a lovely place to live, and, if you are careful, you can crawl under the radar of some of the fees.

[__Warren__]

*DING* Crawling under the radar fee: $4.98

[Playa Manhattan.]

Do tell.

I'd like to get slightly less fucked by Edison.

I'm all LEDs. Everything is on a timer. I hardly ever run the central air blower. Still over 200 a month.

[VG Zaytsev]

Install pv cells yourself.

[OneOut]

Not all of Texas is unregulated.

In San Antonio you have only one choice of providers.

They do not answer the phone. Ever. It simply isn't their policy. You cannot talk to a human employee as far as I know.

Every interaction with them is voice mail, website, or email.

It is twice as expensive as Houston and if you don't like it you can do without electricity.

[Derpetologist]

economic haikus inspired by Hayek

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-PMiiygV04

[Rufus The Monocled]

Dunno if posted. Five killed in Mosque shooting in Quebec City.

http://news.nationalpost.com/n.....-de-quebec

[Derpetologist]

Can't tell if this virtue signalling tantrum is real:

https://youtu.be/yyLqPUWamEQ?t=2m22s

[Chipper Morning Wood]

I see a future in which companies will segregate according to political ideology.

[MarkLastname]

"Resist or pay the price." No that doesn't sound ominous or threatening at all.

Ya know how not to win an election against Trump? Make everyone who isn't a rabid leftist feel like they need Trump to protect them from rabid leftists.

[Playa Manhattan.]

My understanding is that this shut down the entire lower deck of LAX.

If you're intentionally blocking me from going where I'm legally allowed to go, especially on a one-way street where I can't back up, it's called kidnapping.

Be prepared to pay the price for your violent felony against me.

[C. Anacreon]

Wow -- and right after Uber gets online smacked for this, suddenly Lyft has a new email to its app holders:

Defending Our Values

Dear Lyft Customer,

We created Lyft to be a model for the type of community we want our world to be: diverse, inclusive, and safe.

This weekend, Trump closed the country's borders to refugees, immigrants, and even documented residents from around the world based on their country of origin. Banning people of a particular faith or creed, race or identity, sexuality or ethnicity, from entering the U.S. is antithetical to both Lyft's and our nation's core values. We stand firmly against these actions, and will not be silent on issues that threaten the values of our community.

We know this directly impacts many of our community members, their families, and friends. We stand with you, and are donating $1,000,000 over the next four years to the ACLU to defend our constitution. We ask that you continue to be there for each other - and together, continue proving the power of community.

John & Logan
Lyft Co-Founders

[Homple]

Second-String Ride-Organizer Lights Virtue Signal Flare for Young Urbanites Without Driver's Licenses

Film at 11.

[MarkLastname]

"Banning people of a particular faith or creed, race or identity, sexuality or ethnicity, from entering the U.S...."
And yet, none of those things was done. People were banned from entering based on *nation of residence.* Get it right dipshits.

[esteve7]

I've made this argument before. It is imprisonment foyr you to block me where I'm at and prevent me from legally going where I can go. Who the fuck do you think you are?

[Scarecrow Repair & Chippering]

Completely OT: Look about 2/3 of the way down.It's about atmospheric railways from the 1840s and the present, including HyperLoop, with a quote by John Rearden, a spokesperson from Flight Rail Corp, I kid you not. Was he hired for his name?

[PapayaSF]

OK, maybe this is what Trump should do: announce a ban on immigrants with beliefs that are anti-women, anti-gay, anti-Jew, anti-Christian, or anti-Constitution. That automatically excludes all Muslims. Done and done, no "religious ban" required.

[C. Anacreon]

If Trump really wants to blow the world's mind, he should announce that the US will only pay for abortion clinics in terrorist countries. Then people will be outraged that he's only for killing Muslim babies. And then he can turn around and say, oh, it is killing babies after all? And then watch the Left tie themselves in knots trying to explain the difference.

[PapayaSF]

Clever!

[loveconstitution1789]

^^^ this.

[loveconstitution1789]

So, the guy on the video interview says he is "worried about US citizens outside the United States. This would actually put them in a bad situation".

So, Americans might be in danger of harm because the USA will not let in immigrants? Hmm.. although you don't speak for all persons outside the USA, thanks for justifying the reality that some will use any excuse to harm Americans.

Imagine if some of these people will use any excuse to harm Americans and they are in the USA.

[fenazuful]

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[jaliben]

My last month paycheck was for 11000 dollars... All i did was simple online work from comfort at home for 3-4 hours/day that I got from this agency I discovered over the internet and they paid me for it 95 bucks every hour... This is what I do

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[ammythomas849]

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