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Philosophy Professor Tells Bisexual Student Who Criticized Islam 'We're Not Going to Let You Damage the Program'

"We have not designed our program to tolerate these behaviors."

San AntonioPublic DomainA bisexual male student at the University of Texas–San Antonio said during an informal conversation outside class that he was uncomfortable with Islam because people still receive the death penalty for being gay in 10 Muslim-majority countries.

For expressing this thought, the student—Alfred MacDonald, who no longer attends the school—was instructed to meet with the chair of the philosophy department, Eve Browning. Prof. Browning told MacDonald in no uncertain terms that he had committed the crime of "offending" someone, and she warned him that his habit of saying what he thinks could bring down the entire program. She threatened to call the Behavior Intervention Team and refer MacDonald to counseling. She did everything but send him to Room 101.

Unfortunately for Browning, MacDonald secretly recorded their conversation. The transcript, first publicized by Gay Star News, is incredible.

"We have not designed our program to tolerate these behaviors," Brown tells MacDonald at one point. Later she adds, "We're not going to let you damage the program."

First Browning accuses MacDonald of skipping class, leaving early, and causing disruptions. MacDonald attributes his tardiness to a medical condition, but notes that he has been doing better on this front ever since his professors approached him about the issue. Browning rejects that this matter is settled—she claims that if skipping class was no longer a problem, it wouldn't be listed as a problem on the sheet of paper she's reading from—and moves on to the more serious charge: MacDonald offended someone.

Apparently, MacDonald had engaged in a conversation with a Christian student who noted she was marrying a Muslim man. It was then that MacDonald expressed his discomfort with the religion:

MACDONALD: I said that I was bothered that I could be killed in 10 Muslim countries. I'm bisexual. So they'd definitely do that in the 10 countries where I would be— you know.

BROWNING: Doesn't that strike you as an inappropriate thing to say about someone's fiance?

MACDONALD: I wasn't talking about the fiance. The fiance could have whatever interpretation of the religion that they want. I said something like...(thinking) that I...yeah it wasn't about the fiance, it was about the religious practices in those countries.

BROWNING: How is it appropriate to bring that up in connection with someone's fiance?

MACDONALD: They brought it up. The Islam part.

BROWNING: And you brought up the threat to your life as posed by this fiance?

MACDONALD: No. We got to the subject of Islam, not the fiance.

BROWNING: Do you understand how someone would find that offensive?

MACDONALD: How someone would find that offensive, yeah; how they could perceive it, yeah; yeah, I mean, if I...

BROWNING: It's a confusing comment to me because Muslims do not all live in countries in which bisexuals are executed. Muslims live in the United States—

MACDONALD: Sure.

BROWNING: —Muslims live in France, Muslims live in every country in the world—it's the fastest growing world religion.

MACDONALD: Yeah, one of my good friends at the university is Muslim.

BROWNING: And do you tell him that you object to his religion because there are places on earth where gay, lesbian, and bisexual people are discriminated against, including your own country?

MACDONALD: Well, "her." And my verbiage was "killed" not "discriminated against." I mean, death penalty's pretty severe.

BROWNING: What does that have to do with her being engaged to a Muslim?

MACDONALD: Nothing. I wasn't talking about the engagement to the Muslim. I was talking about Islam in that particular moment.

BROWNING: Well, let me just say that kind of thing is not going to be tolerated in our department. We're not going to tolerate graduate students trying to make other graduate students feel terrible for our emotional attachments.

MACDONALD: Um...all right.

BROWNING: And, if you don't understand why that is, I can explain fully, or I can refer you to the Behavior Intervention Team on our campus, which consists of a counselor, faculty member, and person from student affairs who are trained on talking to people about what's appropriate or what isn't.

At various points, MacDonald attempted to use philosophical reasoning to defend himself. When Browning noted that multiple people were offended by his comments, MacDonald accused her of succumbing to the logical fallacy of ad populum reasoning.

When MacDonald protests that he is on a public university campus—where the First Amendment is in effect—Browning states that "derogatory comments" could absolutely get him dismissed from the philosophy program. She asserts that his comment about Islam was "very objectionable," could prompt the Behavior Intervention Team to investigate, and could jeopardize his academic and professional future in a variety of ways. What's more, Browning repeatedly makes comment to the effect that this will not be tolerated, despite maintaining that MacDonald is not at risk of being removed from the program.

BROWNING: Those are things that would get you fired if you were working in my office. The Islam comment would get you fired.

MACDONALD: ...Would it really get me fired to say that I could be killed somewhere?

BROWNING: In that situation as you've described it, absolutely yes.

MACDONALD: How?

BROWNING: Don't even ask. It's clear you're not taking my word for it. I don't care to convince you. If I can't persuade you that it's in your interest to behave in ways that other people don't find offensive and objectionable, then at least I've done my job.

MACDONALD: Well I know that it's in my interest. I'm just trying to understand the reasoning.

BROWNING: You don't have to.

MACDONALD: Well, this is a truth-seeking discipline!

This incident took place last year. I could not immediately reach MacDonald for contact, but The College Fix's William Nardi recently obtained an interview with him. Browning declined comment to The Fix. A university spokesperson, Joe Izbrand, clarified the Behavior Intervention Team's role:

"It's not about taking punitive action or determining penalties," Izbrand told The College Fix via email. "The behavioral intervention team is comprised of a broad array of professionals whose job is to review concerns that come to them and to appropriately determine if any kind of follow up is necessary—concerns about the wellbeing of a student, if the student has expressed a threat to another student or themselves."

"We do not and will not take disciplinary action for students exercising their freedom of speech rights," Izbrand said, "and we expect faculty to help guide students in how to appropriately express those views when interacting with each other."

It's certainly possible that MacDonald's behavior was more inappropriate and disruptive than this conversation reveals, or that his attendance issues should have precluded him from being a student at UT–San Antonio. But it should not strike the chair of the philosophy department as offensive and unthinkable to make accurate criticisms of Islamic extremism, or of any other religious ideology. To quote Harvard University's Steven Pinker (alongside whom I will be speaking at a panel discussion next week: details here), "That's the difference between a university and a madrassa."

Photo Credit: Public Domain

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  • loveconstitution1789||

    It is really fun to see the left undermined at every turn by brave students recording real incidents of this stuff.

    You just cannot make this stuff up that lefties do.

  • Drake||

    And by some bisexual dude, no less, LOL. That's the kind of thing that might actually make these worms sweat. It's a potential fucking landmine for these people.

    I almost wish he'd played that card, actually, accusing her of being anti-gay and triggering him. It might've made her head explode, haha! Turn their own bullshit back on them, just like Medusa being shown her own reflection. That's exactly what we need here.

    Good for him. This motherfucker knew what he was getting into and had the cunning and foresight to actually record it, LOL. Very devious. I applaud him. We could use more just like him...

  • Quixote||

    More devious and deceptive behavior from radical elements who seek to offend, to disrupt, to stir up unwanted controversy and to damage the reputations of our distinguished colleagues. Surely no one here would dare to defend the "First Amendment dissent" of a single, isolated judge in our nation's leading criminal "satire" case? See the documentation at:

    https://raphaelgolbtrial.wordpress.com/

  • Chip Chipperson||

    Thing is though, they're NOT undermined by any of this.

    We can record whatever we want, they just shrug it off as 'doing what needs to be done'. They already have institutional control over pretty much everything that matters, so what do they care at this point? They don't. Mild embarrassment on right-wing websites is not a penalty to these people. Even the occasional symbolic dismissal is meaningless.

    Unless we're willing to do what needs to be done to take back control of the institutions -- something which will require a good deal more commitment (and kinetic action) than making YouTube videos -- this is our future, forever. They won.

    Short of outright revolution and guillotines, the best we can hope for is to carve out small cultural enclaves where we can at least try to shelter ourselves from some degree of tyranny... but I wouldn't be hopeful for even that much.

  • You're Kidding||

    "outright revolution and guillotines"

    Sadly, you're on to something there. It's the only way to turn back the tyranny now. We're long past the point of debate or political solutions.

  • Chip Chipperson||

    Thing is though, they're NOT undermined by any of this.

    We can record whatever we want, they just shrug it off as 'doing what needs to be done'. They already have institutional control over pretty much everything that matters, so what do they care at this point? They don't. Mild embarrassment on right-wing websites is not a penalty to these people. Even the occasional symbolic dismissal is meaningless.

    Unless we're willing to do what needs to be done to take back control of the institutions -- something which will require a good deal more commitment (and kinetic action) than making YouTube videos -- this is our future, forever. They won.

    Short of outright revolution and guillotines, the best we can hope for is to carve out small cultural enclaves where we can at least try to shelter ourselves from some degree of tyranny... but I wouldn't be hopeful for even that much.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Th only way to stop them is to destroy them and their agendas. Progressives should be made afraid to lea r their homes for fear of the consequences of their progressivism. Their lives need to be destroyed for attempting to advance ththeir cause of Marxism. Joe McVarthy was right, and we. Edd to bring back McCarthyism to battle this treasonous trash.

  • quichwe10||

    Looking at the transcript, the guy drew a bunch of complaints about his general actions in class, with randomly going on about Muslim countries exist where they'll kill me after hearing someone's marrying a Muslim, along with a record of being a really shitty student, especially if we're going off of what he says he's doing. This is also a new program, where student performance matters on if that program will continue or not. This just feels like a kinda big nothing burger of disciplinary action that got blown up by news.

  • quichwe10||

    Also, as he says, apparently he's really poor, though you can't tell cuz his demeanor is very white (his words), but also was able to go out of the country for a week long trip for a wedding, and apparently decided to go buy a car of all things, which he could only do because of school loans.

    To elaborate more on him as a student and what occurred, he's had many incidences of missing class, like that first week where he was at a wedding, was late to class and was leaving class early, something he says has been resolved, though his teachers say otherwise. In regards to the comment, he apparently decided to make someone talking about their Muslim fiance and wanted to make it all about "I could be killed in 10 Muslim countries". Dunno about you, but when someone starts starts talking about a Christian fiance, I don't tend to start going on a rant about the evils of Christianity. This guy just sounds like a special snowflake who wants special treatment. He can go fuck off for all I care, and I say this as a liberal leaning independent.

  • Chip Chipperson||

    The kid might be a total asshole and a shitty student.

    NONE of that justifies or excuses the positively Orwellian language the administrator employed.

    She didn't tell him he was a disruption to the class, she told him that his behavior needed to be modified because of the IDEAS he had.

    Big difference.

  • quichwe10||

    Ideas he had? The main thing that happened was that someone talked about a Muslim fiance, and he somehow thinks that butting in and saying that Islam is shit cuz he could die for being gay in 10 Muslim countries is a reasonable extension of a discussion on a fiance. Going back to the transcript immediately after he makes it quite apparent (or he plays dumb) that he sees nothing wrong when he barrels in on a discussion about a fiance to shit on that fiance's religion, it says:

    "EVE BROWNING: Well, let me just say that kind of thing is not going to be tolerated in our department. We're not going to tolerate graduate students trying to make other graduate students feel terrible for our emotional attachments.

    ALFRED MACDONALD: Um… all right.

    EVE BROWNING: And, if you don't understand why that is, I can explain fully, or I can refer you to the Behavior Intervention Team on our campus which consists of a counselor, faculty member, and person from student affairs who are trained on talking to people about what's appropriate or what isn't."

    He will now face the terrible Orwellian brainwashing machine known as... counseling for social interaction. Truly a great evil.

  • quichwe10||

    The main reason he was in there was because he had the most complaints from other students and professors about both his academic performance and his classroom conduct. Here's a quote from the beginning talking about his academic issues:

    "EVE BROWNING: Well the reason why we're meeting and why I asked to meet is that several faculty and several other graduate students have expressed concerns about things you're doing in class and out of class, and the nature of the concerns -- I made notes from their conversations and emails so let me just run through these. There's reference to your contributions to class discussion of questionable relevance and these were long -- so that's one thing -- and distracting. There's the business of being late to class, there's leaving class partway through, sometimes according to one faculty member staying gone for half an hour and coming back. There's a concern about your having made some inappropriate comments to other graduate students…"

  • quichwe10||

    And here's a quote about the complaints:

    "EVE BROWNING: It's troubling. It's more complaints than we've had about any student in our program. [I should add at this time the program had been active for less than two years.] How many are in close succession? It's troubling.

    ALFRED MACDONALD: I'm sure it's troubling. But I don't necessarily think that the number of reports of something… because then I could [make up anything and with enough reports] people would believe it.

    EVE BROWNING: That's half our graduate faculty."

    There ain't nothing about ideas of Islam being bad being an idea that's BS. That's only brought up by him in a weak effort to try to waffle on about 1st Amendment rights. There is no double think or attack on him for thinking any sort of "wrong" thing, there is a student who has received the most complaints about conduct and performance in the course and the classroom in the entire history (an admittedly short history, but history nonetheless) of a program, and is being brought in to the counselor in order to find out what the hell is going on here. She tells him to modify his behavior if he wants to stop getting complaints made about him and possibly in order to get along with other students in the program. Nothing about Islam doublethink or the "wrong" ideas.

  • quichwe10||

    Also, apologies for the broken up posts. Went far over the character limit with the quotes.

  • Mark22||

    The main reason he was in there was because he had the most complaints from other students and professors about both his academic performance and his classroom conduct.

    Translation: he held views not popular with the predominant political beliefs of his fellow students.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Well, this is a truth-seeking discipline!

    Mixed up t words. It's actually a tenure seeking discipline.

  • Radioactive||

    more like a douche bag attracting department

  • Hugh Akston||

    The combination of aggressive tone and willful ignorance of content and context does seem familiar, now that you mention it.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Your wife, asking you to put the toilet seat down?

  • Drake||

    Hey, didn't you see that South Park episode?! That poor broad had all her organs sucked her out of her! See, it's not so funny anymore is.. ah.. uh..pff.. ahem.. ach... AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA..

    Nah, it's still pretty funny. FunniER, even!

  • Agammamon||

    *You're* a towel!

  • mpercy||

    In our house, the rule is seat AND lid go down after every use. Makes everyone have equal effort (well, I have slightly more effort lifting both seat and lid to pee, but I'll ignore that) and keeps the dog from drinking out of the toilet. And if she's too dispossessed of self-preservation to not check before she sits down, all she gets is a cold ass from sitting on the lid rather than falling in.

  • You're Kidding||

    Plus, pet birds are known to fly into an open toilet and drown. Not pretty!

  • Quo Usque Tandem||

    Gulag Archipelago? That's how it feels when my wife tells me to put the toilet seat down.

  • Mitsima||

    The fact that urinals are not routinely installed in American homes is undeniable proof of a matriarchal society!

  • Unemployed Armenian Tranny||

    I think this would a have been a good moment to use the old. "what difference, at this point, does it make?", argument.

  • Finrod||

    Typical professor, taking forty-seven words to say Fuck You, That's Why.

  • Radioactive||

    nice philosophy department you have there, it would be a shame if anything happened to it. better to stick to nice middle of the road philosophy don't you think?

  • Elias Fakaname||

  • Inigo Montoya||

    I can't help but wonder what would have happened if this person had been speaking to a Muslim student who happen to mention her fiance is Christian, and he had said that he is uncomfortable with the Christian religion because it views gays as sinful.

    My guess is that, if he had heard anything further about it at all, it would have been vociferous praise for his woke-ness.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    One thing I wonder if if Browning believed it at all. They repeated several times that they will not allow the department to get in trouble for this. That's does not sound like he's saying the grad student is wrong, that sounds they know they could get in trouble with the university and so are shutting it down.

    That doesn't absolve them of sin, but it does show the problem is bigger.

  • Radioactive||

    what ever became of the Texas of legend...bisexual grad students engaged in identity political debates w/ wymen philosophy department heads...Mr. Colt used to settle these arguments

  • Zeb||

    That's a good question. Nothing she said really is asserting that he's wrong to say what he said. Just that it could cause problems for him and the department/program. Which, sadly, is probably true

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    ...and she warned him that his habit of saying what he thinks could bring down the entire program.

    DOES NOT COMPUTE. MUST SUPPORT GAY COMMUNITY. MUST SUPPORT ISLAM. CONFLICT. CONFLICT. ERROR.

    BROWNING: Don't even ask. It's clear you're not taking my word for it.

    Manslation: "I can't give you a rational explanation."

    And, holy hell, you simply cannot introduce any negativity about a man to his fiance. Women in the planning stages of getting married will go absolutely apeshite over the littlest thing. What's wrong with you, man?

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    I bet her head would have exploded if he mention Milo.

  • Inigo Montoya||

    Milo, as in the ancient Greek strongman who lifted and carried around a baby calf each day until it grew up to be a full-sized bull?

    Don't know about her head, but maybe her muscles would have exploded with new levels of strength.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Jesus, these euphemisms make my head spin.

  • timbo||

    War is peace

  • John C. Randolph||

    This pseudo-intellectual twat can't stand a student mentioning the fact that gays are routinely murdered in countries that practice sharia law. She should be ashamed of herself.

    -jcr

  • Hank Phillips||

    Not to mention the fact that gays uppity women are routinely murdered in countries that practice sharia law.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    It's a non sequitur. It became apparent after reading this conversation that nobody was talking about gays and nobody was talking about Saudi Arabia (or any other country where gays would be killed). He apparently thinks it's a good idea to interject this kind of dialog in the middle of class. In other words, he was intentionally being disruptive and controversial. Dr. Browning made it clear that this is the wrong venue to talk about that stuff, and that doing so in the workplace may get you fired (which is definitely true). The kid has some serious issues with social situations, which he practically admitted to.

  • You're Kidding||

    "he was intentionally being disruptive and controversial."

    And, why in a graduate level course, in philo no less, would this be a bad thing?

    Geez, Einstein would have never made it there.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Because it's probably inappropriate to bring your own topics to class. I assume there was probably a discussion of some sort going on and he changed the subject. This is what Dr. Browning mentioned. Without having a transcript of the class too, it's impossible to know.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    ""BROWNING: It's a confusing comment to me because Muslims do not all live in countries in which bisexuals are executed. Muslims live in the United States—"'

    I would think a philosophy professor would understand the connection between the Koran, and Muslims, at least to the degree it is practiced in Islam theocracies.

  • Cyto||

    But not all countries! Not all!

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    The proportion of muslims in those countries versus the rest of the world is tiny. So your sarcasm totally missed the mark.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Didn't Kevin Spacey teach us today that bisexual really means gay?

  • Whorton||

    "Another one bites the dust. . ."

  • rudehost||

    I guess when it comes to the progressive stack Muslim beats gay like rock beats scissor ... although I suspect Muslim also beats scissor .... and paper .... and rock.

  • Quo Usque Tandem||

    I wonder if there's a chart somewhere, delineating who is the more "protected species" among the victim class?

    Jews are clearly at the bottom because of Israel.

    Blacks are at the top because of politics.

    And everyone else falls somewhere in between.

    And of course this is a fluid list.

  • ThomasD||

    Black cannot be at the top because slavery is still a practice in much of the Islamic world.

    The hierarchy is defined by the degree of collectivism. The greater the degree, the higher the priority.

    Therefore Umma > race. Especially so for Western notions of race.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Muslim-Gay-Baker is what we play to decide who will drive to the next anti-sex-trafficking protest.

  • rudehost||

    I can see muslim beating gay and gay beating baker. I have a hard time believing baker beats anything. I guess that means some unlucky bastard has to make brownies and then drive.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    It's a vegan baker.

  • You're Kidding||

    That's O.K. MJ is an acceptable plant material for vegans.

  • Mitsima||

    Transgender baker. Don't even ask. It's clear you're not taking my word for it.

  • MarkLastname||

    In rock paper scissor c4-suicide-vest, suicide vest beats everything.

  • Phos||

    unless suicide vest is a double throw.

  • Whorton||

    Muslims beat any woman or child who does not fight back.

  • Azathoth!!||

    I'm thinking it goes, in reverse order

    Straight white man
    LGB (but not T), Straight white women, anything that can be classed, however spuriously, as 'minority', or 'oppressed'
    NBPoC (non Black people of color)
    Trans...--except 'vestite'
    PoC (Black people)
    Muslims

    Unlike Paper, Rock, Scissors, where each beats one other, in Progressive Stack, each beats all below it. It's the strictest of hierarchies, and Muslims beat all--they can be homophobic, anti-choice, transphobic, racist slavers and still be celebrated and defended by people who oppose all of those things.

    The only way to win is to kill everything in a stack the second it starts to form.

  • You're Kidding||

    Of course. Islam means peace you know.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Scissor beats everything when a lesbian plays

  • Just Say'n||

    Haven't you referred to certain speakers at colleges that have been shouted down as being anti-Islam for expressing the same views as this student is being punished for? I'm confused

  • Quo Usque Tandem||

    If McDonald had any sense, or just ambition, he would tell the flabbergasted philosophy professor that her program isn't worth shit to begin with and being "kicked out" of it is no loss to him. Seriously, given the cost of an "education" nowadays how in the hell do we even justify such a worthless misuse of resources?

  • timbo||

    Starting a college that only teaches Math, Science, law, medicine, engineering, etc.... would be a good business venture. No requirements of arts and humanities(whatever those are), or any other bullsh*t supposed social sciences.

    History should be required but who can you trust to teach history anymore?

    The answer is no one since everything has gone political.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I actually think people should be required to take Liberal Arts stuff. Writing, foreign language, logic and philosophy. These are essential to a well rounded individual even if they aren't a great choice for a major.

  • timbo||

    Fair enough. They are components of a classical education and good for cocktail parties. That's about it.

    Foreign languages should be in my example above.

    There is nothing scientific about logic and philosophy or anthropology or sociology though. Anything that subjective with ever changing terms and definitions is 99% bullsh*t

    That is why the vast majority of SJW nuts and psycho college leftists reside there.

  • Qsl||

    Science is still a sub-domain of philosophy. You don't get to the underpinning of evolution or even quantum theory without the framework of philosophy and logic (apologies to the mathematics majors).

    One of the worst aspects of the Cultural Revolution at universities is that whole disciplines are being dragged through the mud for the extravagances of the dominate ideology. It was bad enough for education and to a lesser degree economics, but forsaking entire avenues of inquiry is cutting your nose to spite your face. Yes, the homo-erotic Marxist interpretations of Moby Dick will probably not augment your mechanical engineering degree, but aesthetics?

    That's just crazy talk.

  • Microaggressor||

    Indeed. Not all of these courses have fallen prey to the Cult of Marx. I took a formal logic course and I still remember modus ponens!

  • Dan S.||

    Logic can be taught as part of mathematics, as in Boolean logic, which is what computers are based on. The difference between that and the kind of logic taught in philosophy departments is really just one of approach. Expressing things in Latin does not make them any more valuable than the same things expressed in English. As for science being a sub-domain of philosophy ... no. Even though it was once called "natural philosophy", if the words are used in their modern English meanings, just no.

  • generalisimo14||

    So empiricism, seeing as it only ever produces a theory that is yet to be disproved, and that will be disproved, is somehow superior knowledge and not at it's root philosophical/metaphysical? Think about that.

  • ThomasD||

    Every science is, at some point, dependent on a metaphysical statement or three.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Boolean logic is such a small piece of logic that it would be woefully incomplete to teach it in its place.

    Latin also has some very, very obvious relationships to the English language, and most consider it very useful.

    And he is correct, science is a "sub-domain" of philosophy. Look at its origins.

  • You're Kidding||

    "Expressing things in Latin does not make them any more valuable than the same things expressed in English."

    You blaspheme!

    There is value in the Tower of Babel. It keeps the Church in charge!

  • Finrod||

    When I was in college, I managed to satisfy a philosophy requirement by taking a course called Elementary Symbolic Logic. It was by far the easiest course I ever took.

    The most interesting part of the course was when the professor pulled out this oddball sentence:

    "He said that that that that that man said was incorrect."

    If you're having trouble parsing that sentence, compare it to this very similar sentence:

    "He said that this that which this man said was incorrect."

  • Dan S.||

    Huh? One of the three words in the sequence "this that which" still needs to be deleted for that sentence to make sense.

  • Finrod||

    Put quotes around the middle that: He said that this "that" which etc.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    "There is nothing scientific about logic and philosophy or anthropology or sociology though. "

    Except that the scientific method is based on logic, is dealt with extensively in philosophy, and sociologists frequently use the scientific method in their studies.

    Aside from that though, sure, there's nothing scientific about any of those things.

  • Finrod||

    "sociologists frequently use the scientific method in their studies"

    Yes, and people frequently use toilet paper when they go to the bathroom, too.

  • Griffin3||

    Foreign language, logic and philosophy are NOT ESSENTIAL to be an effective college graduate, nor a "well rounded individual". By saying it is essential, you are missing the basic meaning of the word essential.

    Writing, well, should've learning writing in high school. But that's a different bucket of larnin'.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Effective in the sense that you can get a job. Yes, I'm sure it is. Effective in that they are a traditional core topic for Universities. We are differing on the essential education apparently, but have the decency to attack that directly instead of condescending and pretend I don't know what words mean.

    That being said, all of those topics better one as an individual. Logic and philosophy are core skills that allow us to reason about the world and the meta knowledge that surrounds scientific fields. Without them it is impossible to even have concepts such as science, but it always gives a grounding and context to place any scientific works.

  • ThomasD||

    Understanding the full meaning of 'essential' is philosophy.

    Elementary, to be sure, but still very much philosophy.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Gen ed requirements should go away. Even though I disagree with you about what's "essential" and what isn't, this should be entirely left up to the program and should not be dictated by the government (which is currently what happens indirectly, through accreditation agencies, with student loans acting as the carrot).

  • Trollificus||

    Hmmm...a course-by-course, a la carte educational establishment called "Bucket O' Larnin'"? What could possibly go wrong? "It's cortex-buildin' good!"

  • Agammamon||

    Everybody *is* required to take that shit - and we aren't seeing the colleges turning out 'well-rounded' individuals. Not for a long time.

  • Qsl||

    Even a far back as the early 1970s- My dad graduated from a highly regarded university. Looking over the coursework for the humanities requirements, my reaction was "wow, you really got ripped off!". Besides the obvious ideological slant, there were HUGE gaping holes in the body of knowledge. You'd think all of philosophy/history/literature began and ended in the 1900s.

    So I get it. There are vast differences between education and indoctrination. However, casting them aside would be the same as disregarding the hard sciences if they were taught solely from a feminist perspective.

    These things are important, and worth fighting for. Hence why there is concern with Alfred MacDonald's plight instead of simply rolling of the eyes at the academic bickering

  • You're Kidding||

    "hard sciences" "from a feminist perspective"

    O.K. Hold it. Must not go there.

    It's hard to let this one pass. :-)

  • Qsl||

    You haven't seen Dawkin's takedown of Lacan?

    https://tinyurl.com/738hljp

    And feminist epistemology through to feminist theory of science (which in a more enlightened age was simply control group bias).

    It's already here.

  • EscherEnigma||

    Oh hell no. You gotta keep English classes and preferably also require Technical Writing. I'm tired of reading design documents that read like they were written by high school drop-off.

  • Agammamon||

    'Drop-out'.

  • tommyguns2||

    I agree with this, with the addition of specific liberal arts classes (they wouldn't be electives, you'd have to take specific classes... no gender identity studies BS).

    I wish that a few fortune 500 companies would come out and state that they will no longer require applicants to have a college degree from an accredited school. That would break the monopoly. I would think that each industry could come up with their own certification requirements, and if you can pass the software certification exam, Microsoft or Oracle or whoever will accept applications from those people. Same with engineering, law, accounting, etc.

    That would allow each person to go online and select the needed courses to learn the subject matter they need to pass the certification. Would save them $100,000 or more , and likely save them a few years of opportunity loss. Plus, companies would likely be able to hire young people cheaper, which means they hire more people and weed the losers out. The model for developing career skills has to change because the present model is crap... too expensive, and graduates a large number of people with no skills that the market requires.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    If you think a university education can be replaced by "the needed courses to learn the subject matter they need to pass the certification", then I suspect you fall into the same trap that many Americans fall into -- not understanding truly what a college education can provide.

    In short -- if you come out of college without 50-100 contacts in industry, without having spent at least a year working in your trade already, and without at least 3 letters of recommendation by people who are intimately familiar with your work, then you did it wrong. Sadly, most people don't use all the resources and opportunities presented to them. They think that college is about "going to class" and that taking classes online is an adequate substitute.

  • You're Kidding||

    Oh? I see. Colleges = trade schools. Frats = job connections.

    Rather old fashioned. Wouldn't you say.

    You guys are scaring me. Forget formal education. It's all about who you know and who you blow.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Yeah. Colleges = trade schools. That's a pretty good analogy, actually. If you're not there to learn marketable skills and concepts that will help you build a career, why ARE you there? This isn't old fashioned -- quite the opposite, experiential learning is all the rage these days.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Right, because your suggestion that the arts and humanities be eliminated isn't political?

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Social science majors should.not be eligible for student aid or loans.

  • Whorton||

    God forbid we make students THINK. . .

  • You're Kidding||

    No, no, no. The university much teach them how and what to think. That's the proper role.

  • damikesc||

    So, Islamic treatment of gays is verboten because some Muslims live in countries that don't kill gays?

    I guess I need more philosophy to understand the logic.

    I guess because Harvey Weinstein didn't try to sexually assault EVERY woman he met, then mentioning that he had a problem with doing so would be too offensive for that program.

  • stuartl||

    Yes, unless {Harvey Weinstein} is not an element of {{donors to the Democrat party} intersect {still powerful}}.

    Apologies for the poor set notation.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    "So, Islamic treatment of gays is verboten because some Muslims live in countries that don't kill gays?"

    Correction: "the vast majority", not "some".

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Ok, it of countries with strong Islamic majorities, how many don't viciously persecute homos?

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Are you talking about governments or people?

  • Rich||

  • mpercy||

    The behavioral intervention team comprises a broad array...

    It's NEVER "comprised of".

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    She couldn't even acknowledge the truth of his point. Piss poor professor, Piss poor practitioner of thinking, and philosophy.

    I'm surprised she's not teaching gym.

  • ThomasD||

    Her job does not involve teaching. She is well aware of this.

  • Whorton||

    No, she is not, that would require thinking

  • Hank Phillips||

    I guess I won't be getting any more gigs at UTSA. Any bets on how long before they take Mencken's "Treatise on the Gods" and "Treatise on Right and Wrong" out of the library and burn them?

  • Rich||

  • ||

    Ha. This twit-twat Browning is the poster child for progressivism being a mental disorder.

    That was solid philosophical critical arguing right there.

  • Juice||

    Gays should be executed!

    >How dare you say something like that? That's highly offensive.

    It's ok! I'm Muslim!

    >Oh. Carry on, then.

  • Juice||

    All the dude had to do was say "so you want me to be executed?" Then the professor would say "of course not, that's not what I'm talking about." So he could reply, "so? I didn't say anything about anyone's fiance, yet here we are talking about how you think I should be executed."

    That would have ended the conversation much sooner, ie it would have gotten to the "because I said so" part much quicker.

  • beepBoop||

    "—Muslims live in France, Muslims live in every country in the world—it's the fastest growing world religion."

    This is the reason white progressives are apologists for Islam. They are married to the idea that all brown skinned people are inherently part of the "struggle" and that by getting them on board the intersectionality train they can build a coalition that can defeat the white-Christian-male Beelzebub. Genuflecting to a barbaric Bronze age cult is not going to end well for these progressive utopians. Islam is too strong and virile and progressivism too deferential. Feminism and gay-acceptance will be consumed by Islam and not the other way around.

  • You're Kidding||

    "Individual Muslims may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world."

    Winston Churchill 1899

    That might have shut her up.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Thank you. Excellent quote

  • John||

    Gays are now lower on the intersectionality power chain than Muslims. Basically, it is back into the closet. Sorry but the party demands it. Your usefulness to the cause has ended.

  • Microaggressor||

    After all, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world, whereas homosexuals usually don't reproduce. See? That kind of forward thinking is why they are called progressives!

  • Arizona_Guy||

    I recall you saying something like this a while back, John. Now we are seeing it play out.

    The guy is gay, but a "cis" white male. That is only slightly ahead of hetero white women, who are in danger of being kicked out of the Oppression Olympics entirely.

  • Cyto||

    No. Not gay.

    Bisexual. Big difference.

    Although many hetero-normative cis-gendered males might have a "just a little bit gay is all-gay" rule, the gay community has a much more complex relationship with bisexuals.

    Even though the B in LGBTQAAI is for Bisexual, you can find areas of the gay community that refuse to accept that there is such a thing as truly being bisexual. So kind of a race purity thing. Sorta like Clarence Thomas not being really black.

    So maybe that puts you in a different position on the ladder of oppression.

  • Finrod||

    Yep. Old joke: why does it suck to be a bisexual ghost?

    No one can see you. Also, you're a ghost.

  • You're Kidding||

    "you can find areas of the gay community that refuse to accept that there is such a thing as truly being bisexual"

    I recall reading a psych text that indicated that, while hetro and homo were in fact legitimate conditions, there was no such condition as bisexual; that it was strictly a matter of personal choice and sexual experimentation.

  • Entropy Drehmaschine Void||

    Stupid Raghead, don't they realize that Fudgepackers will always be higher on the Progtard Grievance Totempole?
    Why?
    Ragheads actually kill ButtPirates, TurdBurglars only create unemployment for goats. Advantage: Peterpuffers.


    /how many microaggressions in that sentence ...

  • Elias Fakaname||

    So are you pro faggot or pro towel head?

  • ||

    "BROWNING: Well, let me just say that kind of thing is not going to be tolerated in our department. We're not going to tolerate graduate students trying to make other graduate students feel terrible for our emotional attachments."

    Chances are Ms. Browning has such an "emotional attachment".

  • Phos||

    All about the feels. The absurdity that one can control or is responsible for someone else's interior mental state due to a passing comment.

    I am not denying the possibility of emotional abuse. But emotional abuse takes time, intimacy and control. A rational adult acquaintance who dislikes your comments can tell you to get stuffed, using whatever level of tact they think is appropriate, and avoid you.

    Striving to produce rational adults used to THE goal of philosophy.

  • You're Kidding||

    Not if the offender is in a position of authority or wearing a badge!

    I don't think I'm going to walk down the hall and tell my boss to get stuffed.

  • H. Farnham||

    The most disturbing thing to me in all this is that a 'Behavior Intervention Team' actually exists outside of a dystopian novel.

  • FreeRadical||

    This.

  • AlmightyJB||

    BITches.

  • AlmightyJB||

    Behavior Intervention Team Coercing Higher Education Serfdom.

  • ChipToBeSquare||

    Their explanation that it's to examine the well-being of students is even more terrifying. In this specific situation it implies that to wander off the progressive reservation (he's bisexual so he has a narrow range of allowable opinions to the left) means that you aren't in your right state of mind and you need help

  • Microaggressor||

    You're probably right, and I don't buy their self-description for a second. True believers have established a pattern of shameless deception for The Cause. They hate it when people like this kid point out the uncomfortable truth, and feel no remorse trafficking in some pretty obvious lies, but they need to believe the lies to be able to sleep at night. It's sad.

  • You're Kidding||

    That's the definition of pathological liars as compared to say, cognisant dissonance

  • Brandybuck||

    OMG! Dolores Umbridge is real!

  • Brandybuck||

    OMG! Dolores Umbridge is real!

  • Griffin3||

    Can you imagine three people, no, fifty people, fifty people every day, walking into Eve Browning's office, and singing a line of "Professor Browning is a gay-hating imbecile" and walking out? They may think it's a movement ...

  • timbo||

    And they would bend like a pipe cleaner to which ever way the herd tells them.

    The beauty of pimps, politicians, preachers, and now professors is watching them pander to an ever accepting horde of imbeciles that lap this stuff up.

    The only thing more amazing than how morally and intellectually bankrupt this country has become is the subservience of the idiot zombie herd to all of the nonsense.

    There is no critical thinking left in the American brain.

  • timbo||

    "There is no critical thinking left in the American brain."

    I guess because absolutely none is required.

  • I am the 0.000000013%||

    Sing it the next time it comes around on the guitar...

    With feelin!

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    And then Reason commenters would take Browning's side because that might count as protest, and we hate that.

  • ||

    "...It's certainly possible that MacDonald's behavior was more inappropriate and disruptive than this conversation reveals,"

    lol.

  • AlmightyJB||

    To be sure

  • Procyon Rotor||

    Fish gotta swim, birds gotta fly, Soave gotta "to be sure".

  • TJM||

    I suppose she would find my view that Islam is a backward, dogshit, ancient worldview to be offensive.

  • Mickey Rat||

    That horrible moment when an LGBT is told that he does not hold the most favored position on the Social Justice totem pole. Identity politics giveth and taketh away.

  • Eidde||

    Gays are being placed on an inferior position vis-a-vis Muslims on the progressive stack.

    Gays need to find a new source of energy and get rich, then donate parts of the wealth to various universities...

  • ChipToBeSquare||

    Being a gay white male is basically being a straight white male to the SJW community at the moment, but once you add another oppression point you're probably back in their good graces

  • GILMORE™||

    *Noted: the author of the below piece is a history professor @ Franklin & Marshall College

    WHY ARE ALL THE CONSERVATIVE LOUDMOUTHS IRISH-AMERICAN?

    of course, this is an interesting and important question for an academic, unlike the offensive and verboten observation made by the student. Because some animals are more equal than others.

  • GILMORE™||

    **the all-caps was original to the quoted Newsweek piece. I wasn't yelling, and proving the point. although that *would* be kind of funny.

  • Cyto||

    grace of the old Irish American liberals like Tip O'Neill

    The... grace.. of Tip O'Neill? Eh.... exactly who did he think O'Neill was?

    Oh, and he kinda skips Reagan in his "Irish politicians of old" musings. Maybe his Scotch-English half is disqualifying?

  • Cyto||

    grace of the old Irish American liberals like Tip O'Neill

    The... grace.. of Tip O'Neill? Eh.... exactly who did he think O'Neill was?

    Oh, and he kinda skips Reagan in his "Irish politicians of old" musings. Maybe his Scotch-English half is disqualifying?

  • Cyto||

    grace of the old Irish American liberals like Tip O'Neill

    The... grace.. of Tip O'Neill? Eh.... exactly who did he think O'Neill was?

    Oh, and he kinda skips Reagan in his "Irish politicians of old" musings. Maybe his Scotch-English half is disqualifying?

  • MarkLastname||

    Well, at least it's still okay to hate those rotten Micks. Do Scalia and Alito make it ok to hate Guineas too?

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Pish posh. I'm Scottish American and quite the conservative loudmouth.

  • AndyWingall||

    As a gay man I've known for some time we're at the bottom of the rainbow colored totem pole. It's nothing new. Castro and the Nazis both embraced homosexuals only to slaughter them once the final goal was achieved. It's not an exaggeration to say that the Left finds a Christian who refuses to bake a gay wedding cake more offensive a Muslim who guns down 100 gay men in a gay bar. There's a reason for that.

  • Mark22||

    Note that the left likes to take credit where none is due. Progressives used to classify homosexuals as genetically defective and forcefully sterilized us (California used to be a hotbed of eugenics). That's far worse than the Christian right, which merely viewed homosexuality as a sin and something people should refrain from.

    Progressives and Democrats did little for legalization of gay sex and toleration of homosexuals in society, until public opinion had shifted sufficiently to make it politically expedient to change positions. And then progressives and Democrats did what they always do, which is to hijack the cause of liberty to advance an illiberal agenda, hence the gay wedding cake lawsuits, mandated sex change coverage, and gay marriage issues.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    If these progressive pieces of shit could have total Marxist control of things tomorrow, and all it took was to kill all the gays, every one of you would be gone.

  • You're Kidding||

    "Castro and the Nazis both embraced homosexuals"

    They were closeted?

  • Longtobefree||

    Eve Browning is a very offensive person.

  • Crazy mick||

    Yikes a "behavioral intervention team"! Talk about room 101, they couldn't have chosen a more Orwellian name

  • Fk_Censorship||

    Committee for the Promotion of Virtue and the Prevention of Vice?

  • Finrod||

    From the gaystarnews.com link:

    Dr Browning said: 'The number of threats I am receiving (due to threads the student has started on Reddit) makes this a subject I would not feel safe discussing even very generally.'

    In other words, this fucking bitch is perfectly comfortable threatening other people, but the second the tables are turned, she cuts and runs like a fucking coward. Plus I'd bet money I could count the "threats" the fucking bitch received on one hand, and I'm pretty certain she's threatened a lot more students than that.

  • Up To The Old Shenanigans||

    As we are seeing, what goes around comes around.

  • hail2theking||

    Eve A. Browning, Ph.D.
    Chair, Department of Philosophy and Classics; Professor
    Department of Philosophy and Classics
    Email: eve.browning@utsa.edu
    Phone: (210) 458-6031
    Office: MH 4.05.30 D
    Office hours: By Appt.
    Research area: Ancient Philosophy, Ethics, Feminist Philosophy, Popular Culture, Classical Studies, Philosophies of Animal Intelligence

  • John C. Randolph||

    Feminist Philosophy

    This is an oxymoron.

    -jcr

  • Elias Fakaname||

    She needs a man to slap her around and give her a good deep dicking. Then she can be put to good use by baking that man a pie.

  • Bruce Majors||

  • Benson Bear||

    When she was at Duluth, she got ten Awesomes and five Goods and not a single rating any lower than that. When she was at UTSA, she got four Awesomes and one Good and not a single rating any lower than that, up until the time when MacDonald starting posting this stuff. After that in quick succession she got 4 Awfuls, two of which are for courses she doesn't appear to teach and don't even appear to exist at UTSA.

    Her ratings were uniformly very high until she was unfairly brigaded with phony ratings.

  • Bruce Majors||

    So let me see - if I were a female grad student and someone told me their fiance worked for a club that didn't allow women members, or for a movie studio that sexually assaulted women, or a religious hospital that refused to perform abortions, and i observed that I would not be welcome there, Eve would counsel me to shut up?

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Poor analogy. If someone told you their fiance was a man, and you decided to talk about a club in some other country that didn't allow women, then it would be a more appropriate analogy. The student in this article changed the subject of a conversation that had nothing to do with countries on the other side of the world. We've all known people who have nobody to talk to so they end up trying to veer every conversation into something that they feel strongly about. It's disruptive and inappropriate every time. And from what he said, he doesn't talk to anybody there so he uses the classroom as his soapbox. Dr. Browning explained to him that when you pull that shit in your job, you stand a pretty good chance of being fired.

  • Azathoth!!||

    Yours is the poor analogy.

    If someone told you that their fiancé shared the belief system of people who think you should be killed because of your sexual orientation, shared the belief system of people who think slavery should still be legal, of people who think women are little more than chattel, you'd be well within the bounds of decency to note any of these horrific beliefs.

    And if that belief system was anything except Islam the progressives would be applauding you, not attacking.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    "Yours is the poor analogy."

    I know you are but what am I?

    "If someone told you that their fiancé shared the belief system of people who think you should be killed because of your sexual orientation, shared the belief system of people who think slavery should still be legal, of people who think women are little more than chattel, you'd be well within the bounds of decency to note any of these horrific beliefs."

    Befriend a Muslim and see if they believe any of those things.

  • You're Kidding||

    Well, there's this Muslim in New York recuperating in a hospital you might want to try "befriending".

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    There's a christian 6 feet under who killed way more people than that muslim guy did. I guess all christians are bad too.

  • Finrod||

    Because the guy shouted "Praise Jesus!" every time he fired.

    You have no fucking proof whatsoever that the Vegas shooter was a Christian, fucktard.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    I wasn't talking about the Vegas shooter.

    But sure, nobody kills in the name of christianity. Let's go with that.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    I urge everybody who loves to stereotype to get in the habit of drawing Venn diagrams.

  • Finrod||

    I drew one. It has a big circle labeled "Asshat" and a smaller circle entirely inside it labeled "JunkScienceIsJunk".

  • Finrod||

    Try moving to Saudi Arabia and being an open homosexual. Tell us how it goes.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Try moving to any of the top 10 countries in the world that have the most Muslims in them and being homosexual. It's not prosecuted by those governments, with one exception (Iran).

    You're conflating people who subscribe to Islam with a few governments whose authoritarianism extends a hell of a lot further than just LGBT issues. Again, Venn diagrams. Seriously.

  • Finrod||

    Top ten countries with the most Muslims by percentage, you'd be utterly and abjectly WRONG.

    But then again, you're wrong more often than a stopped clock.

  • quichwe10||

    A better equivalent is if I were an asshole atheist who heard that you were marrying a local Catholic and I butted in and started talking about how Catholics in other countries were pedophiles.

    Eve's main thing here is that that's behavior that'll get him canned if he goes to work and does it.

  • Finrod||

    Bad equivalent. Catholics don't have a book that commands them to be pedophiles.

  • Whitney111||

    Behavior Intervention Team (BIT). A definition of bit:

    "A mouthpiece, typically made of metal, which is attached to a bridle and used to control a horse."

    Origin:

    Old English bita 'bite, mouthful', of Germanic origin; related to German Bissen, also to bite.

    Weird serendipity

  • pxfragonard||

    I want to know how it came up in the conversation. I have doubts that he just answered: "I'm marrying a Muslim man" with "They make me uncomfortable."

    More likely he congratulated her and then she started talking about Islamophobia or something or other wherein it became necessary, in maintaining an honest conversation, to say he had reservations about it. She was offended because for her that was personal. But if the professor wants to examine the context, let's do that fully. Did it occur in a university philosophy department or at her engagement party?

    I had a neighbor who, upon finding out I was Jewish, some time in the course of the conversation told me the Jewish people shouldn't even exist. "Huh?" I asked. "Well, their savior came and they failed to recognize him." Ah, I thought to myself, he wasn't engaging in wishful genocidal thinking, he was just expressing a theological point. He was kind of dumb not to realize I might take that sort of personally considering the history. I can easily see another Jew, more emotional than me, fixing on the most frightening implication and not being able to let go.

    I think this is what happened.

  • Dead inside||

    I wonder with what regularity does Prof. Browning condemn Christians for their views on homosexuality and the role of women.*

    I hope but I doubt she (assuming gender here, please kill me) can see that there is a vast difference between wanting to pray for someone to change their ways and simply cutting off their heads, and in the case of women, the difference between wanting a subservient wife and mother, and forcing a women to wear wraps, and raping them if seen escorted in public and..oh yeah...then stoning them to death for being a whore.

    *Fun fact- these views mimic those held by the majority of Blacks, Hispanics,and Asians based on cultural and religious beliefs.

  • colorblindkid||

    How is this not a rule against heresy? These are becoming policies and laws against blasphemy.

    Mormons have a far longer and more severe history of oppression and religious persecution in this country than Muslims, yet they are mocked and ridiculed constantly.

  • You're Kidding||

    And, if you spent any time around serious Mormons, as compared to Jack Mormons, as I have, you would too.

    Along with Catholics, Jews, Protestants, Pentecostals, Muslims. The opportunity to demean and offend is endless. And, they just bring in on themselves by clinging to superstitions and ignoring science.

    I was raised Protestant, had a Catholic father and attended a Christian Brothers high school. My many Catholic friends in high school teased me relentlessly and returned the favor. We used terms like Dego, Wop, Mick and Kraut, but never the N-word, amongst ourselves and no one took offense for, serious offense was never intended and these terms were never used with hatred behind them. And, the characteristics stereo-typically associated with those terms hardly defined any of us. We saw ourselves as so much more than that.

    We need to return to such a place where people are a little more thick skinned and don't take themselves so seriously.

  • TxJack 112||

    Apparently they have also not designed their program to allow for any discussion on a topic other than what they have decided is correct. My wife graduated from UT Austin in 1988 and we moved to DFW in 1989. Stories like this one only reinforce our decision to not move back as originally planned was the right one. UT is full of left wing loons who have no concept of the real world. Austin has become as bad of a progressive "bubble" as the northeast and west coast.

  • You're Kidding||

    Austin is the Bezerkeley of TX!

  • TxJack 112||

    Behavior Intervention Team? Sound like thought police to me. She was threatening to force him into counseling because he expressed a point of view she found objectionable? I love how these idiots claim they are committed to "fighting fascism" and then engage in behavior which is the epitome of fascism.

  • GroundTruth||

    "Don't even ask. It's clear you're not taking my word for it. I don't care to convince you..."

    This, from a tenured Professor of Philosophy?

    What's next? Sticking her fingers in her ears and saying "nya, nya, nya, I can't hear you"?

  • Half-Virtue, Half-Vice||

    This professor brings dishonor and shame to every student of philosophy.

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    "But it should not strike the chair of the philosophy department as offensive and unthinkable to make accurate criticisms of Islamic extremism, or of any other religious ideology."

    Robby, you're usually better than this. Making accurate criticisms is definitely something he DIDN'T do. If you read the entire transcript (and I did), the student clearly conflates Islam with a few countries that are muslim-dominated. He didn't refer to "extremism" anywhere in the dialog. He didn't use that term anywhere. He just said "Islam". It's a very common mistake, but it's an ignorant one. However, being ignorant does not justify his expulsion from the program. But it sounds like he has done a lot of other things in the program that may warrant it (e.g. being generally disruptive, not attending class, arriving late, etc).

  • Azathoth!!||

    Islam says 'kill homosexuals'.

    The fact that only a few Islamic countries use the death penalty does not change that.

    But, being ignorant does not preclude your right to showcase that ignorance, preach it--let your stupid flag fly!

  • JunkScienceIsJunk||

    Not sure why the insults were warranted. Someone apparently has trouble playing well with others.

  • Sevo||

    JunkScienceIsJunk|11.1.17 @ 4:33PM|#
    "Not sure why the insults were warranted."

    Everyone else knows why you were insulted: You make stupid statements, be prepared to be called stupid.

  • ace_m82||

    While at a state University, I got into an argument in a public area with a table full of ELCA Lutherans (redundant, I know) about whether or not homosexual acts were "sins" according to Scripture. They, of course, said it wasn't. I asked them to provide literally any Biblical evidence of their position. They were unable to do so (of course).

    I did this in 2010 (I think). I wonder how lucky I was that I wasn't immediately tarred and feathered for daring to have a "wrong" opinion.

    Then again, this was a University in MN, so that might have had something to do with how "nice" the people were...

  • Mark22||

    They, of course, said it wasn't. I asked them to provide literally any Biblical evidence of their position. They were unable to do so (of course).

    Well, of course. The ELCA position is that the NT doesn't take a clear position on whether homosexuality is a sin. What evidence do you want for that, beyond noting that the four passages in the NT that conceivably might refer to homosexuality have been interpreted in different ways by different people?

    I did this in 2010 (I think). I wonder how lucky I was that I wasn't immediately tarred and feathered for daring to have a "wrong" opinion.

    The whole point of the ELCA position is that it isn't going to judge opinions on homosexuality as right or wrong. If you consider it sinful, use that to guide your own behavior. If you believe that a homosexual can't be a pastor, don't listen to homosexual pastors. Lutheranism is about acting according to your own conscience, not having some church hierarchy telling you what to do and think.

  • gclancy51||

    Teachers actually spend their time teaching where I live.

  • You're Kidding||

    Oh? Do tell please? Where is this place?

  • PlaystoomuchHALO||

    The "program" being one of indoctrination.

  • Sevo||

    "We have not designed our program to tolerate these behaviors."

    Free speech ain't part of the syllabus.

  • You're Kidding||

    Has it ever been?

  • Mark22||

    I think getting kicked out of a philosophy program is probably a good thing: there are few degrees that are more useless than that. He should consider himself lucky.

  • emmanuel||

    Glad the guy recorded the conversation.

    When it was indicated that what I had said could be offensive to some however I would have said "So?"

  • Barry Gold||

    "Behavior Intervention Team?

    WTFO?

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