Democrats Don't Care Whether Banning 'Assault Weapons' Is Constitutional
Even while conceding that the rifles they want to ban are commonly used for lawful purposes, they refuse to grapple with the implications.

A week before the House of Representatives approved a ban on "assault weapons," a federal judge in Denver explained why such laws are unlikely to pass constitutional muster. House Democrats either were not paying attention or did not care, because they view the Second Amendment as an outmoded provision that imposes no meaningful limits on gun control.
Unfortunately for them, the Supreme Court has repeatedly held otherwise, ruling that the government may not prohibit law-abiding Americans from keeping handguns at home or carrying them in public for self-defense. The Court also has said the Second Amendment covers bearable arms "in common use" for "lawful purposes," which presents a problem for Democrats who want to ban many of the most popular rifles sold in the United States.
On July 22, U.S. District Judge Raymond P. Moore, an appointee of former President Barack Obama, issued a temporary restraining order that bars Superior, Colorado, from enforcing its ban on "assault weapons." The city defines that category to include semi-automatic center-fire rifles that accept detachable magazines and have any of four features: a pistol grip, a folding or telescoping stock, a flash suppressor, or a barrel shroud.
Two gun-rights groups argued that Superior's ordinance, which also bans magazines that hold more than 10 rounds, violated the Second Amendment. Moore concluded that they had "a strong likelihood of success on the merits."
Moore noted that the plaintiffs had cited statistics to support their claim that the guns and magazines targeted by Superior's ordinance "are commonly used by law-abiding citizens for lawful purposes." He also mentioned an earlier case in his court where both sides had stipulated that "semiautomatic firearms are commonly used for multiple lawful purposes, including self-defense," and that "lawfully owned semiautomatic firearms using a magazine with the capacity of greater than 15 rounds number in the tens of millions."
Under the Supreme Court's test, Moore said, those facts mean that "the right to possess, sell, or transfer" the arms covered by Superior's ordinance is "presumptively protected." The burden is therefore on the city to show that its ban is "consistent with the Nation's historical tradition of firearm regulation."
That will be a formidable challenge, Moore suggested. "The Court is unaware of historical precedent that would permit a governmental entity to entirely ban a type of weapon that is commonly used by law-abiding citizens for lawful purposes, whether in an individual's home or in public," he said.
Like Superior's ordinance, the bill that the House narrowly approved last Friday covers "large capacity" magazines and includes a general definition of "assault weapons," although its list of prohibited features is slightly different. It also bans many specific models by name.
During the debate over the bill, Democrats said the rifles they want to ban are "the weapon of choice for mass shooters," which is not true: Most mass shooters use handguns. Democrats said the features targeted by the bill make rifles especially deadly, which also is not true: With or without those features, a rifle fires the same ammunition at the same rate with the same muzzle velocity.
Even while implying that the rifles covered by the ban are good for nothing but mass murder, Democrats emphasized that the bill would exempt the 24 million or so "assault weapons" that Americans already own. They refused to grapple with the constitutional implications of banning guns that millions of people use for lawful purposes.
When confronted by that reality, Republicans noted, House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerrold Nadler (D–N.Y.) said "the problem is that they are in common use." Rep. David Cicilline (D–R.I.), the bill's sponsor, likewise had no patience for Second Amendment arguments, saying, "Spare me the BS about constitutional rights."
Unlike Nadler and Cicilline, federal judges like Moore cannot ignore the constitutional issue raised by this sort of legislation. Democrats will have to comply with the constraints imposed by the Second Amendment, no matter how much they might wish that it did not exist.
© Copyright 2022 by Creators Syndicate Inc.
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https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1554595088541442049?t=uu1TGmD4Y5cg7NhLkkuqcA&s=19
BREAKING Via Project Veritas: FBI Whistleblower LEAKS Bureau’s Domestic Terrorism Symbols Guide on 'Militia Violent Extremists’ Citing Ashli Babbitt
Document references The Second Amendment, Gadsden Flag, Revolutionary War Imagery, & The Betsy Ross Flag
[Link]
They did they during the Ron Paul days too.
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It's remarkable how ignorant these people are on the topics they are trying to ban. They don't know how guns work, and they don't seem to know how laws work.
None of that’s important in their world. Only acting like power crazed Nazi’s looking for even more control over the people matters.
This overuse of comparing everything disagreeable to "Nazis" has to be curtailed before it loses any more of its actual meaning and saved for more appropriate usage.
Just as dems have thrown around 'insurrection" and have convened a kangaroo court merely to keep Trump from running for any office an actual insurrection is occurring when the Constitution is attacked and viewed as out-dated. The outcome grows more dire if one stops to consider the propaganda campaign that has been occurring to youth at public schools. These children are now in their 30s to 40s. Any subjective thought or logic escapes them and they have no eagerness to know what is going on around them. They were never taught how to think but rather told what to think and to rely on how they "feel". This is one thing you can compare to Nazis and how they manipulated and influenced their youth. Those youths were summoned into military duty late in WWII when barely into their teens. Older German soldiers knew the end was near and the battles were for nothing. No soldier wants to die when the cause is lost. Japanese had the same indoctrination and took loyalty up to and beyond stupidity. America learned these lessons and are employing them as we speak. Young tech workers in control of a trillion dollar industry are displaying lack of thinking basing most of this industry in 10 square miles of coastal property and spying on its own citizens. They are the ball-bearing factories of WWII tracking every movement of every citizen with a cell phone and trying to disarm you and they are in possession of all firearm sales information. Jews were not disarmed in Germany but allowed to own and register firearms. The SS used that list and who do you guess were the first targets for The Night of Broken Glass - Kristallnacht in 1938! When fierce military/police types kick in your door and break out windows then you can use the term "Nazi". Dems lack of firearm knowledge will be their undoing but chipping away at Rights and breaking laws along with killing has never been beneath them.
They _do_ know how laws work. Unless 51% of their constituency likes guns or deeply respects the constitution - and they'd probably never have been elected to that district in that case - passing a blatantly unconstitutional anti-gun law solidifies their position with their voters at zero cost to them. They don't pay the cost of defending their law in court, let alone the cost of suing to overturn it. They don't lose a right they care about for 3 or more years while the case works its way through the courts. They can spit on the Constitution that is the basis for all our laws, and not have to worry about a judge throwing them in court or out of office, nor about us law-abiding citizens deciding that we don't have to follow the laws against shooting them.
Mr. Cicilline, if you think constitutional rights are bullshit, what the fsck are you doing in *my* House?
In the next six months you're going to be amazed at all the constitutional violations the Democrats are going to perform.
I will not. I would enjoy being amazed at how many such violations are voided, but I am not optimistic.
The general election is just short of four months. Three more, and the new congress will be seated.
THIS is why they dialed their antics up to 11.
Rep. David Cicilline (D–R.I.), the bill's sponsor, likewise had no patience for Second Amendment arguments, saying, "Spare me the BS about constitutional rights."
I would think an openly gay lawyer would champion constitutional rights, but at the end of the day he is a fucking Democrat.
Dude, any gay or black who isn't a Democrat is a traitor to their group identity.
If you didn't vote (D) you ain't black (or gay).
FIFY
Why can't these people be sued under Sec 1983? It would seem these laws are blatant civil rights violations.
Better yet, arrested and charged with felony perjury for swearing their oath of office then ignoring/refusing/failing to observe it.
They ALL swore to uphold and defend the US and their State Constitutions, and obey all laws enacted under them. Knwingly and wilfully enacting laws that are clearly contrary to those documents is NOT upholding the oath they swore. That felony perjury bust will preclude their ever holding public office again. OR possessing any firearms. And you can bet high stakes at long odds most of these political turncoats DO want to have their own "personal means of defense". They are not comatose. They want to disarm US of the weapons WE want and use, but keep their own right to self-protection. If it were not for bad moral character they'd have none.
"Spare me the BS about constitutional rights."
I wonder what the Good Gentleman would reply if one used his comment re: abortion.
THIS ARTICLE ISN’T REAL REASON NEVER SAYS A SINGLE BAD THING ABOUT DEMOCRATS! ARGH! (gargle burp)
Poor sarc
Just sad how broken he is now. And how every day he has to reinforce how broken he is. All for jeff attaboys.
So he’s basically a less useful version of the Trashcan Man?
In theory, banning assault weapons should be constitutional, because the Founding Fathers could not have foreseen a firearm capable of firing exponentially faster than musket.
Look up the Girandoni air rifle, and the Puckle gun; then, apologize for speaking out of ignorance.
Thanks for saving me the trouble of bringing those up.
Forty rounds in rapid succession without reloating, single trigger pul for each round, ready for next without doing anything. Rate of fire was about one round per second, a far cry from the typical Brit rate of fire with their Brown Bess muskets of about one round per two minutes. Our guys could reload and fire the next round in about half that time, but still, the guy with the Girandoni could fire all forty of his rounds before even Daniel Morgan's men could get their second round off.
Also, the experimental British Ferguson rifle was deployed in the War of Independence. A breech-loader, it could fire 6-10 rpm.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferguson_rifle
most didn't foresee ending Slavery either, or at least had funny ways of showing it.
Shall we then be able to ban private computers and email because the framers couldn’t foresee the Internet?
Reason continues their defense of Democrats. Fucking leftists.
And I’m definitely not putting on this whole act to distract from legitimate criticism! (burp, barf)
"Spare me the BS about constitutional rights."
Rep. David Cicilline (D–R.I.), Cockswoggling Mob Lawyer
It's the sort of comment that you'd think would sink a political career. I'd hope that anyone ever hoping to challenge them in a race would be filing that one away to just air as a campaign ad. Just run it as a five second TV ad: "Spare me the BS about constitutional rights". Name. Done.
If declaring your intention to nuke gun owners and being compromised by a Chinese spy doesn't do it and open corruption is fine for Democrat voters, why would this be even a blip?
How little self-esteem did that Chinese spy have, seducing Swalwell?
No sense of irony, these guys.
My Marlin 60 is an assault rifle. It has a high capacity tube magazine that holds an astonishing 17 rounds of high powered .22 long rifle. The company actually had to redesign the gun because of the 80s assault rifle ban. They shortened the tube to make it legal. But I've got one from the early 80s with an assault tube. A couple inches of tubing is the difference between a benign plinking rifle and a weapon of mass murder.
A couple inches of tubing is the difference between a benign plinking rifle and a weapon of mass murder.
I'd ask which of your girlfriends told you this but I have some unfortunate news about your mother.
Yeah, no. The AWB didn't apply to rimfire.
You suck at doing this. It's not even Poe's Law. You just don't differentiate idiocy and sarcasm.
Now try Washington State's definition of 'assault weapon'.
It's not centerfire.
Yeah, I've got one of those newer Model 60s with the 14 round tube mag instead of the old 17. I've run into one situation where I had one round left. An Extra 3 rounds would be nice during Raccoon season.
A lot of states trying to write these magazine laws try to get around it by making only "detachable" magazines illegal. But I wonder if the Model 60 would qualify. Would the detachable tube count as the magazine? Or the non-detachable tube on the rifle be the magazine? The laws never seem to clarify.
In a pre-WWI exercise called the "mad minute", British soldiers were required to fire and hit the target with at least 15 rounds in one minute, using a bolt-action SMLE rifle. This had a 10 round magazine; no spare magazines were issued and their one magazine was removed only for cleaning. That is, to meet the _minimum_ requirements, they had to reload the magazine through the top of the gun at least once, and still fire their 15 aimed shots in under a minute.
Many British soldiers exceeded the minimum significantly. IIRC, the record was 35 hits. That was reloading at least three times and shooting at a rate of nearly 1 shot a second - with a weapon that took your hand away from the trigger to work the bolt back and forth for each shot. I doubt there's been a mass shooter since the Texas University Clock Tower in the 1960's that could manage that rate of aimed fire with any semi-auto weapon, no matter how big the magazine.
So, for whatever reason, the circuitous logic of 'pistol grip' has never occurred to me. In the contemporary legal environment (ignoring FYTW), the best I can come up with is "A rifle with a pistol grip is an assault rifle" = "A woman with a strap on is a rapist." To wit, as a man, I say nobody needs more than 10 orgasms.
It could be argued that a pistol grip makes a rifle easier to control, thus more accurate and deadly. But the same could be said for every single design choice, such as having a buttstock, having sights, having the trigger pull backwards, and so on. And I've never heard any such argument to start with. It's just bullshit like the bayonet mount, which always made me laugh.
It’s more than that. The pistol grip allows the shooter’s elbow to drop, which allows a better shooting stance. It also allows a straighter stock (along with raising the sight line for aiming the gun) which allows the barrel to be positioned in-line with the shoulder, which mostly eliminates barrel rise when shooting, allowing for quicker follow up shots. It also allows the use of a buffer in-line between the barrel and the shoulder, reducing recoil. The result is a soft shooting firearm with minimal barrel rise.
all that still does not impress me.. I cannot stand to hold a rifle with a pistol grip. My hand simply does NOT fall where I need it to fall and I've tried a bunch of them. My Marlin 14 has a conventioinal stock, fires the exact same round as the AR pattern rifles do, and i am very fast and accurate with it. Barrel rise is not an issue, it shoulders well, line of sigh is just how I like it, I'm certain it is labelled an "assault rifle' in my state and many others, but I don't give a rip. It is my rifle and I like it.
Still do not like the AR pattern rifles at all. Support hand is never comfortable, stabilising with the aid of a sling (hasty) is fast and simple, and the story goes on.
I really do NOT see why they have picked on "the shou8ld thing that goes upo" or the grip, or a telescoping stock to decide. They decided before considering, then went to work to invent things that made it 'scary looking' so they could fool some infinetisimally small portion of the population into supporting their fairy tales.
Corrupt law breaking rats, all of them.
It could be argued that a pistol grip makes a rifle easier to control
You misunderstand, I'm not talking about practicality or functionality, neither is Congress or the ATF. I get the claimed benefits of a pistol grip and I get how thumbhole stocks supposedly conform to or circumvent the law. I'm talking about strict objective and definitive legality. For instance, if I give you the definition of an apple as "A red or yellow, starchy fruit with thin, crisp skin and hard black or brown seeds." and an orange as "A juicy citrus fruit eaten either as a skinned whole or juiced." I can't, then, definitively say that any apple-skinned citrus fruit is an assault orange without being unduly vague or fundamentally changing the definition of what is an orange and an apple and effectively tipping the whole fruit cart. While I agree the inclusion of the bayonet lug is still absurd, I can understand, using the analogy, how logically and definitively saying a woody stem or concave blossom end or a blender or some other modification makes a juicy citrus fruit into something other than an orange. Orange juice is not an orange. If I give it a thin, crisp skin, it's still an orange. If I give it a thin, crisp skin and make the flesh starchy, it's an apple.
I guess, ultimately, the issue is that even without the assault weapons ban, the NFA was a terribly written piece of legislation written by morons and every time I look at it I find a new way (or remember an old way) that they demonstrated their utter stupidity.
I don't understand the "barrel shroud" thing. The only thing it's for is to keep your hands off the hot barrel.
A cynical person might come to the conclusion that it is a legal bear trap (elephant trap?). You simply lay enough of them around an area where only right wingers exist and then sooner or later one will haphazardly get nailed by it, become a felon, and no longer able to vote against you.
the barrel shroud is has mounting rails for mounting accessories like bi-pods, optics, lights, etc. i suspect the tards hate these accessories.
IMO, no. I was going to say 'again' but, in this case, we don't have any formal definitions. I agree they are probably blatantly conflating several things but a barrel shroud (intended to prevent incidental contact with the hot barrel) is distinct from a hand guard (designed specifically for handling the weapon) is distinct from a mounting rail (used to attach devices to a weapon, routinely handled or not). The historical use of the term barrel shroud in the law predates modern rail-mount systems and traditional barrel shrouds were of such flimsy and expedient manufacture as to make them useless for accessories. Maybe they mean accessory rails when they say handguard and the definitions are fucked and need updating (which is what originally made me want to say 'again') but a barrel shroud is not a handguard with mounting rails any more than a burial shroud is a tactical vest.
do you own a ar-15? i do. mine has the picatinny rail mounted on the barrel shroud. so actually, yes. what i said is correct.
do you own a ar-15? i do.
Do you own a Winchester 1897 Shotgun? A Browning M1919? An MG 13? MG 24? MG 42?... Do you differentiate between these weapons that definitively have a barrel shroud as designated in the designs but not a handguard as they aren't specifically 2-handed weapons, *and* predate modern handguards with rail attachments or do you *also* own a brain with no clue as to its parts or how to use it?
A barrel shroud is an external covering that envelops (either partially or full-length) the barrel of a firearm, to prevent unwanted direct contact with the barrel (e.g. accidental collision with surrounding objects, or the user accidentally touching a hot barrel, which can lead to burns).[1] Moving coverings such as pistol slides, fore-end extension of the gunstock/chassis that do not fully encircle the barrel, and the receiver (or frame) of a firearm itself are generally not described as barrel shrouds, though they can functionally act as such.
Even the retards at Wikipedia understand this better than you.
so you just proved that you're a liberal by quoting the highly inaccurate and uber left wikipedia. nice work. here is a barrel shroud with a picatinny rail exactly like i described. i have something similar on my ar-15. you're clearly an idiot and you don't own an ar or any firearm.
https://www.tacticool22.com/product/15-inch-m-lok-free-float-handguard-monolithic-picatinny-rail-ar-15/
I don't need links. I'm not confused about what a barrel shroud is. Even then your link agrees with me, it clearly calls it a handguard and the word 'shroud' appears nowhere on the page.
Look, whether I'm a liberal or not, it's obvious that you're the one equating the sneeze guard at the buffet with a kleenex in the hopes of sucking on Carolyn "the thing that goes up" McCarthy's clit. If you'd said that originally, I could've at least respected you as an honest shill rather than a lying scumsucker.
One thing I've never understood: How are the wooden strips that covered the barrel on every military long gun from the Brown Bess musket to the M-14 rifle functionally different from a barrel shroud?
Not all barrel shrouds have mounting rails....
No - see my comments below. It’s main attraction on an AR-15 is that it effectively “free floats” the barrel, thereby improving accuracy, while providing numerous attachment points for all of the accessories you might want to attach.
No it's not. You and 'justme' are either historically and engineering-illiterate disinformative shills or two morons sharing one brain between the two of you.
See my response to your other response below. My contention is that gun grabbers are calling now standard front handguards as “barrel shrouds” to confuse people. They have become massively popular because, for most people, they are better. Buy a more traditional AR-15, try to add some attachments, and you very quickly run out of attachment points. Your next AR is most likely going to have plenty of them, and will have a front handguard that they are likely to consider a “barrel shroud”.
See my statements above and below. Your contention is obviously wrong to anyone with even a tacit knowledge of history and a modicum of common sense. You do realize that, to anyone over the age of about 6 who's played any one of a hundred war games on any one of a half dozen gaming systems (let alone anyone who's actually fired a gun, been in a gun store, or even just watched a gun video online), explaining how a hand guard works with accessories makes you sound like a retard, right?
Is that your goal? Are you here trying to deceive retards? Pretty fucking scummy.
Tee hee hee:
Houston Gun Buy-Back Purchases Hundreds Of 3D Printed Guns
Finally, somebody turned a profit off 3D printers by producing something useful rather than foisting worthless hunks of plastic on unsuspecting victims. 3D printer go 'brrrr'.
I don't know why you're knocking 3D printers. That's like saying there's no point in having a first aid kit because hospitals exist. They're really great for things you need on the spot or which aren't practical to buy.
And printing guns. They're good for that too I guess. Thanks government largess!
That's like saying there's no point in having a first aid kit because hospitals exist.
No, it's like saying there's no point in having a printer for first aid because first aid kits, EMTs, and hospitals exist. I'm not against 3D printers as a prototyping tool, I'm against 3D printers as some sort of second coming of the industrial revolution. Especially given the continued market hype (two notes: 1. pumped concrete "technology" is almost 100 yrs. old, 2. the speaker still uses lots of buzzwords like 'horizontally scalable', the only time I can think of in human history where construction wasn't horizontally scalable is island populations and 3D printing is between meaningless and anti-productive about that issue).
Ugh, foobarred the link to continued market hype.
Yes, the hype is completely oversold. 3D printers are not in any way going to replace mass production. All I meant is that they are really useful for one-ofs or when a mass produced piece isn't readily available. For that, they've been transformational.
I'd be real careful saying that. We started using 3D printers to make plastic housings and mounting components. We were spending too much on vendor modifications to their products. Now we design our own, where many of the components are snap fit. Right now the hobbyist printers are where the commercial printers were five years ago. I give it about another five years and 3D printing will be able to compete with injection molding in some areas.
We've got a couple of 3d printers at work, and they both paid for themselves in the first month, printing random mounting hardware that otherwise would have taken hours for a shop to fabricate. They're good for stuff like that.
Once again, it's very simple: statists hate independent thought and action. They are in government because they want to be large and in charge. They do not want independence from the plebes mucking up their control.
Democrats Don't Care About the Constitution.
Democrats Don't Care About the Bill of Rights.
Democrats Don't Care About Liberty.
Democrats Don't Care About Justice.
Democrats Don't Care About Inflation.
Democrats Don't Care About Democracy.
Democrats Don't Care About US Sovereignty.
Democrats Don't Care About Much, Other Than Getting Their Own Way And They Will Use Any Method To Get It. Constitutional or Not, Ethical or Not. Legal or Not.
^Pretty much this
The current (D) coalition that includes progressive puritans, ideological zealots, very frightened children, billionaire utopians, and just plain power-mad totalitarians not only have no use for liberty, they see it as an impediment to achieving the society they want to impose on us.
you fail to cmprehend the meaning of the term "puritan" as used wa back when, else you'd never have used that term as you did. They'd be aghast at the nonsense going down these days. And roundly condemn it out of hand.
Given that they’re such a problem, we should end our tolerance their kind and thin their ranks until they’re more manageable.
I mean, it’s good that they said the quiet part out loud. Apparently, if you don’t like something in the Constitution, you don’t have to pay attention to it. So, therefore, we must be allowed to search the private home and files of every one of these congressmen without a warrant, at any hour of the day.
It might be a good thing, but it certainly has happened more during the past few years. Blame it on Trump, COVID, or post-modernism, but we now have a breed of Democrats who don't even bother to pretend they respect Constitutional law, or actual civil liberties.
".but we now have a breed of Democrats who don't even bother to pretend they respect Constitutional law, or actual civil liberties."
In a way, that's good. That can be used to influence the 'fence sitters'.
Democrats Don't Care Whether Anything They Want To Do Is Constitutional.
The point of fascism is to rule, not govern.
Remember, remember, the eighth of November.
Jacob, care to take a look at the 2020 election through that lens of Democrats not caring about the Constitution? You support the violation of the Constitution as much as the Democrats you support but point out here.
Reason's chief gun-queer Jacob somehow thinks the legislation Scalia passed from the bench in Heller defines constitutionality. It overturned 200+ years of precedent and will be overturned back to normal when Democrats take over the court, which is even worse than at that time and completely illegitimate.
The 2nd amendment is based on a constitutionally defined "militia" which is obsolete and archaic and has been for over 150 years. None of us, our fathers, grandfathers, or great-grandfathers have ever been called up to the militia, and never will be. The 2nd amendment is obsolete.
It is amazing how wrong everything you write is.
VC comments: Groundhog Day.
Eat a bullet.
Suck my dick.
Nobody wants to eat your trans dick, crayon breath.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults.
Not a one of his posts is worth refuting; like turd he lies and never does anything other than lie. If something in one of Joe Asshole’s posts is not a lie, it is there by mistake. Joe Asshole lies; it's what he does.
Joe Asshole is a psychopathic liar; he is too stupid to recognize the fact, but everybody knows it. You might just as well attempt to reason with or correct a random handful of mud as engage Joe Asshole.
Do not engage Joe Asshole; simply reply with insults; Joe Asshole deserves nothing other.
Eat shit and die, Asshole.
You haven’t had nearly enough beatings. That must be corrected. You need to learn your place.
You're a perfect reverse barometer. Everything you vomit is wrong, so the opposite is fact.
There are quite very many elderly men who were forced to fight in Vietnam.
The 2nd amendment is based on a constitutionally defined "militia"
Oh, shove that stupid fucking lie back up the anus in the middle of your face. The amendment doesn't even presume to grant our right to self defense. It acknowledges it as already existing, mentions one reason why it's important, and forbids people like you from infringing it.
It does not make our human rights contingent on serving in the militia, you bootlicking scumbag.
-jcr
Feel free to amend the Constitution.
Eat shit and die.
Millions of Obama voters were robbed of about 100 federal judges and a U.S. Supreme Court pick. Al Gore actually won the popular voter but lost the electoral vote but Gore wasn’t a cry-baby about it! Last year these conservatives tried to steal an election certified by over 60 federal judges (including Trump appointed judges).
Republicans have disdain for the U.S. Constitution and democratic elections but now want that same rulebook to protect things they value.
In 1791, when the 2nd Amendment was ratified, the “Gatlin Gun” didn’t exist. The Gatlin Gun wouldn’t be invented until about 100 years later. The 1800’s Wild West towns like Dodge City had gun restrictions - some sheriffs made gun owners remove their guns before entering certain parts of town.
If we are debating original intent in regards to the 2nd Amendment - it does indeed protect single shot weapons. The 2nd Amendment’s “well-regulated” clause almost essentially meant an 18th Century “National Guard”. The Governor of each state was the leader of any government controlled militia. The 2nd Amendment didn’t protect private militias attacking the government.
If conservatives are going to cite the U.S. Constitution, maybe give the millions of Obama voters their judges back to them. Their argument would matter if they actually followed the Constitution also!
+1
All true.
Good thing VC doesn't block misinformation or you would have nowhere to post.
Gore was not a crybaby about the 2000 election?
He initially tried to get recounts only in those counties in Florida which were Democrat strongholds with largely the excuse that the ballot format (approved by Democrat election commissioner) was too confusing. Keep in mind, the Florida result would not have mattered if Gore had won his ostensible home state which he had been Senator for.
Yeah Mickey, just like Trump won his home state NY, stopped contesting the election after the SC spoke, actually won the vote of the American people, got on national TV to concede graciously while asking that all Americans rally around the new administration, took his place in Congressional verification of the EC vote - including personally shutting down some few democrats who objected - and then showed up at the inauguration, just like American presidents and VPs have done for a couple hundred years.
NOT!! You fucking idiot! Are you kidding?
Here you go Mickey, this is what a patriot does. Your guy is a cowardly loser and traitor who tried to steal the vote away from Americans. Let's hope he lands in jail where he belongs.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=gore+concession+speech&&view=detail&mid=59B2123325F9620F90A059B2123325F9620F90A0&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dgore%2Bconcession%2Bspeech%26FORM%3DHDRSC3
The Supreme Court of Wisconsin disagrees with you.
https://issuesinsights.com/2022/08/01/a-declaration-of-dissolution-wisconsin-supreme-court-fires-the-starting-gun/
“If elections are conducted outside of the law, the people have not conferred their consent on the government. Such elections are unlawful, and their results are illegitimate.” — Justice Rebecca Grassl Bradley, writing for the Wisconsin Supreme Court majority in Teigen v. Wisconsin Elections Commission
A court of law has finally confirmed it: The 2020 election was “illegitimate.” And all the demands for sufficient evidence of voter fraud to reverse the outcome were a red herring.
The truly dispositive factor, as stated by a Republican Wisconsin state legislator in a March hearing and affirmed in the opinion: “If a vote is cast in an illegal process, it’s an illegal vote!”
The reasons for legislatively enacted absentee ballot protections are clear. Justice Bradley quotes the Wisconsin Legislature’s rationale: “(P)revent the potential for fraud or abuse … overzealous solicitation of absent electors who may prefer not to participate in an election … undue influence on an absent elector … or other similar abuses.”
And that’s exactly what unlawfully relaxed provisions occasioned in Wisconsin.
Fuck off and die, asshole.
You should be muzzled, taken to the vet, and put down.
Al Gore was a wonderful loser and there was no Chad recount in Florida for months
None of that has anything to do with the subject at hand - which was your sockpuppet account talking about Gore.
But then you pop in in your other browser window to bring up Trump? TDS is a terrible disease.
Just curious as to what the significance of the Gatling Gun (not Gatlin Gun) has to this discussion? It was never widely accepted or used even by the military.
That should be "widely used..."
Ironically in California of all places Gatling guns are legal since they are not considered a machine gun.
I think that is the position of the ATF too. Hand crank the gun, and it isn’t a machine gun. Put a motor (maybe an electric drill) to drive it instead, and you have a machine gun.
Hand-cranking doesn't count for 'being a machine gun' purposes.
Put an electric drill on it though . . .
However - gatlings *are* considered 'firearms' federally because, even though they're black powder, they use a complete round instead of loading each component separately (like a ball-and-cap revolver would).
Same rule is why you can own a muzzle-loading black powder cannon firing 10 lb balls but you can't own a breech-loader.
Gatlin guns can fire all the rounds made of all the gold in California....
What's this about the Gatling's never having wide military use? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XJ0nblZjZE
I was going to comment on that, as it seemed fascinating to me. Perhaps he was suggesting that the idea of non-single shot firearms hadn't occurred to anybody yet? That would be both wrong and puerile, but...
"Some have made the argument, bordering on the frivolous, that only those arms in existence in the 18th century are protected by the Second Amendment. We do not interpret constitutional rights that way. Just as the First Amendment protects modern forms of communications, e.g., Reno v. American Civil Liberties Union, 521 U. S. 844, 849 (1997) , and the Fourth Amendment applies to modern forms of search, e.g., Kyllo v. United States, 533 U. S. 27, 35–36 (2001) , the Second Amendment extends, prima facie,to all instruments that constitute bearable arms, even those that were not in existence at the time of the founding."
D.C. v Heller
You don't have to like it, but IT IS the law and you're not just a fuckheaded moron trying to pass off bullshit as fresh clean cattle fodder, that hasn't already been through the cow, you're also a lying, anti-Constitution domestic enemy.
Thanks. Knew that it was in Heller, but didn’t want to take the time to dig it out. For that, I thank you.
Millions of Obama voters were robbed of about 100 federal judges and a U.S. Supreme Court pick.
You.
Are.
Full.
Of.
Shit.
Oh, just go DIAF, you less-than-worthless lying sack of shit.
They want to take away your guns, because they are letterally Hitler. They plan to use the state to murder all of their enemies.
Eeyore, the guys with the nets are probably looking for you, but it has nothing to do with your owning a gun.
Fifty-cent army Democrat. Worth every penny.
Europe has, over the last century, had more people killed by governments - including their own - than Americans killed by guns wielded by other Americans.
So, yes, anyone who wants to disarm you is literally Hitler. And Mao. And Stalin. And Castro. And Pol Pot. And Kim. And . . .
Andrey Vyshinsky
Roland Freisler
Bennie Thompson
It's a recurring theme with the left.
"The Court is unaware of historical precedent that would permit a governmental entity to entirely ban a type of weapon that is commonly used by law-abiding citizens for lawful purposes, whether in an individual's home or in public,"
Lefties are probably genuinely puzzled by this statement, since in their sincere belief government is permitted to ban whatever they strongly feel should be banned, and not permitted to ban whatever they strongly feel shouldn't be. To these people the law is actually a social media poll. Or in other words, they are children.
To these people the law is actually a social media poll.
No, no, no... They would never leave "social justice" up to the masses. They are communists, and therefore autocrats by definition.
-jcr
LOL... Democrats have NEVER cared about the U.S. Constitution...
There #1-Goal is to conquer the USA for a Democratic National Socialist (syn; Nazi) Regime.
And frankly; They've already conquered it. Clear back in the early 1900s. Now this nation will continue to struggle with its Nazi-Invasion probably until it's entire collapse unless the Supreme Court stops being treasonous and enforces the people's law OVER their government.
Here is the problem I see - the Dems here are trying to turn back the clock on firearms technology available to civilians by maybe 65 years or so.
What we know now as the AR Platform was, in retrospect, probably the biggest firearms innovation of the last century (putting the cutoff date after WW I). Armalite and Eugene Stoner developed the AR-10 in response to our military’s first attempt at an “Assault Rifle”. It lost the competition, and essentially a select fire M1 won, that was named the M14. It was heavy, and turned out to be almost uncontrollable in automatic fire. The military did another RFP, specifying a lighter cartridge, and Armalite scaled the AR-10 down, resulting in the AR-15.
It was a game changer (a term I despise). Every main battle rifle today has adopted aspects of the AR-15 design. First, the stock is synthetic, which makes it lighter and stronger. The .223/5.56 round is significantly lighter, allowing the average infantryman to carry maybe 3x the ammunition they carried during WW II (210 vs 60 or so rounds). This is important with fully automatic fire.
But as important were the innovations of adding a pistol grip and straightening out the stock, so that the bore of the gun is in-line with the shooter’s shoulder, which eliminated muzzle climb. The pistol grip provided a more natural shooting stance by allowing the shooter to bring his elbow down and tuck it in. It also allowed the straightening of the stock. A buffer was added, in-line with the bore of the barrel and the shoulder that reduced recoil. The stock in previous rifles had evolved to be curved, when accuracy became important, so that you could sight along the top of the barrel. That required that the bore line be above the shoulder, resulting in muzzle climb. Instead, the AR Platform raised up the sight line for aiming the gun (originally, the sights were in the top of the carry handle). The result was a light, strong, soft shooting rifle with minimal barrel rise, and easily controllable in automatic fire.
This 65 years of firearms technology is what the Democrats want to deprive the American public of. It’s the equivalent of limiting us to vacuum tube computers (which is what they were using when the AR-10 was designed).
While we are at it, let’s address “barrel shrouds”. Yes - you need some temperature neutral material to protect your hands when shooting a lot of rounds. But that really isn’t what is going on here. Many modern AR-15s forgo the pseudo stock carried over from the original version (and military M16s), and instead utilize a shroud that attaches to the upper receiver, but, importantly, does not touch the barrel (also attached to the upper receiver). This effectively “free floats” the barrel, which improves accuracy. That is because barrels touching traditional stocks are affected, during passage of a bullet through the barrel, by the stock. It can’t deform uniformly. They are limited in their flexing by the stock they are in contact with. This is eliminated with most modern AR type “barrel shrouds”.
And then there is the problem of attachments. A standard AR-15, with just maybe some optics, is boooring. Anymore, you need the ability to add stuff - multiple optics (enhanced and backup), laser, foregrip, flashlight, bipod, etc, and for the military grenade launchers and maybe even bayonets. The easy solution is to get a “barrel shroud” that has, for example, a bunch of MLOK attachment points (which are the cutouts you see). This allows you to very quickly add, subtract, and move around various attachments.
Yes - you need some temperature neutral material to protect your hands when shooting a lot of rounds. But that really isn’t what is going on here.
Fuck you. No. You're part of the definition creep problem. You use the term 'free floats' in quotes but it's actually a free floating barrel and the specific distinction is in reference to hand guards that touch or are even directly attached to the barrel, as opposed to heat shields which would be ineffective mated directly to the barrel along its length. Barrel shrouds were specifically designed for air-cooled machine guns including, if not specifically, mounted and crewed machine guns (i.e. guns not intended to be fired with one hand on the trigger and one forward of the receiver) before Stoner picked up a hammer.
Why don't you dumb fucks just be honest and outright agree with regulators that only "assault rifles have free floated barrel shrouds"?
Not sure why your vehemence. Sure barrel shrouds were originally designed for machine guns (which M16s and M4s legally are). But I don’t think that is what is going on here. Rather what they are apparently calling “barrel shrouds” are what are called in the AR world, for example, a “free float rail” or an “MLOK PARTIAL PICATINNY HANDGUARD”. While they do protect your off hand from heat, it’s the other functionality that is primarily advertised (free floating or accessory attachment).
Part of the popularity of the AR platform is its modularity, and part of that is the variety of things that you can attach to them (Picatinny and MLOK are both attachment systems). I will suggest here that to limit these two features is why the House added “barrel shroud” to the no-no list. If you go onto web sites that sell AR parts, you will find that the bulk of the completed AR upper receivers utilize these parts, providing at least a Picatinny rail on top, for optics, and multiple MLOK (etc) attachment point cutouts for everything else. And, yes, there are typically additional cutouts that provide cooling - but as importantly, reduce weight.
Again, we are talking advancements in firearm designs that the gun grabbers are trying to outlaw, just because they think that they can. Up until maybe a dozen years ago, the typical AR you saw in a store had essentially the same sort of handguard as were found on early ARs and M16s. Not anymore. Sure, you can find old style handguards, but they are inevitably greatly outnumbered by these newer style handguards usually with a Picatinny rail on the top, and a bunch of cutouts, many designed as attachment points. They are popular because they are, for most people, better. And that is why gun grabbers are calling these modern handguards “barrel shrouds” and trying to ban them.
Not sure why your vehemence.
Because you and justme are blatantly lying, sucking cock, and carrying water for people like Carolyn McCarthy who, in 2007 (before your retarded 'up until maybe a dozen years ago') replied "I don't know. I think it's the shoulder thing that goes up." when Tucker Carlson asked her "Do you know what a barrel shroud is? Because it's in your bill."
You can't know why they put the term barrel shroud in because they don't know why they put the term barrel shroud in. You arguing that it's referring to hand guards is an attempt to convert the fact that they don't even know what they're talking about into meaningful and actionable legislation. Fuck you for trying.
You forgot adding chainsaws... and sharks.
Sharks with laser beams attached to their heads!
I like to think of it as the biggest post-Browning innovation.
Not surprising when you look at other prohibitions. The criterion they all tend to go by is, how much does the user value this? That's how it is when they consider whether to ban a drug. It certainly goes for flavored smokes and vapes.
I would argue the Sturmgewehr was a bigger innovation. It actually introduced the concept of an intermediate round. The M-16 and AK both are descendants of this innovative rifle. This was the first true assault rifle and was highly popular with those lucky enough to be issued it. However, it's impact on the war was slight as Hitler's meddling led to it being introduced to late to have much impact (he did the same thing with the ME-262). The big thing Armalite did was introduce lightweight materials, such as machined aluminum and synthetic stocks. This was because Armalite was an offshoot of Fairchild aeronautics, conceived as an experimental division to see if lightweight aircraft materials could be successfully integrated into small arms manufacturing. Eugene Stoner was an Aerospace Engineer and machinist.
So THIS.
TY, SM76
The Constitution is the entirety of the legal basis for the federal government's existence. If the Democrats don't want to obey it, then they are bandits acting with no authority at all, and should be resisted by whatever means necessary.
-jcr
This has been the m.o. of the progressive movement for more than a century.
That's why they tried to pack SCOTUS a century ago.
And they succeeded by squeezing an awful lot into "interstate commerce" and "incorporation".
Hopefully, some of those cases will be overturned.
Fixed.
"The illegal we do immediately. The unconstitutional takes a little longer."
"Here is the problem I see - the Dems here are trying to turn back the clock on firearms technology available to civilians by maybe 65 years or so. "
Just FYI
Longer than that. The first selective-fire, fully automatic, shoulder-fired "assault weapon" was developed in the late 1880's for the Mexican army. Yeah, it wasn't very good, but a couple did show up as late as the Vietnam war.
It wasn’t the select fire aspect here, but rather the unique AR design with the barrel bore and buffer in line with the shoulder, elevated sight line, pistol grip, replaceable magazines, and most often constructed of inorganic materials, that I was talking about. Sure, replaceable magazines are over a century old, an pistol grips on long guns almost as old, but it was the entire package that was really novel - 65 years ago.
I understand that. Not a criticism.
They know what the implications are
https://www.independent.ie/migration_catalog/006f5/25263296.ece/AUTOCROP/w1240/fisk
That's why they're so insistent on taking them from us.
Note: They're not giving up *their* rifles.
Could someone with legal credentials explain to me how a member of Congress *knowingly* passing a law that violates an individual constitutional right as defined by the US Supreme Court is not in violation of 18 USC 241, "Conspiracy against rights" and 18 USC 242 "deprivation of rights under color of law?"
Because FYTY.
The Democrats don't care about the Constitution, period.
It's merely a tool for them - when it happens to lend support to their agenda, they wrap themselves in it. But when it doesn't - which is usually - they reject it.
They also blatantly gaslight us about what it says and means.
Heller did not "create a new right" or "expand the Second Amendment," or change its meaning.
"Militia" means MILITIA. Not Coast Guard, National Guard, Reserves, etc..... MILITIA. As in the Lexington-Concord MILITIA that fought the first battle of the Revolution, AGAINST THE NATIONAL GOVERNMENT AT THE TIME - SPECIFICALLY OVER THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE - AS OPPOSED TO A NATIONAL GOVERNMENT BODY - TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS.
The Founders did not get back together sixteen years after this battle to declare that King George had been right all along.
If that was their intention, they would not have said it in the Bill of Rights, a document that expressly states the opposite about every other bone the Colonists had picked with King George. The entire purpose of the Bill of Rights was to square the Constitution with the Declaration.
If it had been their intention to rescind the entire cause their comrades had fought and died to advance, and to declare that King George had been right all along, then they probably would not have even bothered drafting a Constitution - they would simply have petitioned England for re-certification as a colony.
It was terrible for Trump to not concede the election graciously after being fucked over, what was he thinking? Didn't Hilldabeast tell Bided to not concede the election if he lost and it was close? But I'm sure that would have been fine because you know....Democrats.
This article illustrates why Reason libertarians keep failing. You're writing articles like this wondering why Democrats don't know or care. You don't get the game the Left is playing or that their win condition is different. They know full well the guns aren't the core problem, and the law is unconstitutional (as noted in the closing of the article). They are playing the endurance hunter game. 99 times the deer is faster and escapes. But all it takes is 1 success, and the deer loses. They keep hunting for a law that will succeed. When it does, and the problem doesn't change, they hunt down the next liberty to restrict, promising this time they will solve it.
The difference between ignorance and stupidity is while ignorance is merely a lack of knowledge, stupidity is lacking enough grey matter to be able to process information one has. In other words, these people are just stupid. The further one swings to the left, the less intelligence one has.
Yes, I'm talking about you, democrats. What happened to you, anyway? You weren't always this dumb.
Sorry , it's not stupidity, it's pure evil. Satanic level evil.
"...Democrats will have to comply." Yea, AFTER the courts rule their laws unconstitutional. But, they swear an oath "to protect and defend" the constitution". Publicly admitting they don't care, is treason. But don't worry for them, the GOP is just as treasonous, so no one will be charged.
Do you still vote? Why? Think about it.
Comments like those of Rep. David Cicilline (D–R.I.) and revelations that the FBI considers images of and comments by our founding fathers to be symbols of insurrection and ‘white supremacy’ (even when exhibited by a black person) are why patriotic Americans no longer trust this government. It is time to turn out the socialists and decapitate the FBI by firing everyone with a rank of GS-15 or higher and moving it to Kansas.
I care if it's constitutional. I need to know how difficult it will be to get the policy I want. I'll keep voting for Democratic presidents in the meantime. Thomas and Alito aren't young things anymore.
You give zero shits about the constitution. Unless you can use it to stifle a political enemy.
It would seem the admission that this bill bans guns that are in "common use" pretty much renders this legislation DOA. At least with the current makeup of SCOTUS, the likelihood of this bill surviving a legal challenge are practically zero. Passing this bill could have the added impact of fast-tracking resolutions to lawsuits challenging gun laws in other states. You'll see dozens of challenges to this federal law everywhere in the country and by addressing this federal law the court will most likely render a decision that voids a lot of similar state and local laws.
Many "gun nuts" refuse to admit "assault rifles" even exist. This is nonsense. During WWiI the Germans had a vehicle called a Sturmgeschütz which translates to "Assault Gun". Tankers commonly refer to the main gun as the "rifle". This makes the German long 7.5 cm gun on a StuG an "assault [gun] rifle" by definiton. Nobody should be allowed to carry one of these "assault rifles" around with them in public places, concealed or not.
A semi-automatic varmint rifle is not any type of military "assault" weapon. The U.S. Army's little "rabbit shooter" (term used by the late David Hackworth) is more of an LPMR (Little Plastic Muskrat Rifle) than an effective military weapon. It is not an "assault rifle" by any reasonable standard but they are still trying to use it as one. Maybe the U.S. military should finally replace their "rabbit shooter" with something that actually works as an infantry rifle and leave the LPMRs for civilians.
Rather than debate dems descriptions of "grips" and such I suggest that filling your comments with flat-out "hell no, all gun laws have got to go". Then research who you are voting for before actually voting and vote out incumbents. You are easily duped and do you think they read these comments? And they do not read email but stacks of handwritten letters cannot be deleted easily nor can phone calls. 1000 calls a day will have their staff dreading being employed by dem bosses.