California Reinstates Mask Mandate as Omicron Panic Devours Team Blue

Plus: Trump's family members and cable news supporters pleaded with him to stop the January 6 riot, the D.C. metro needs a reckoning, and more...

Despite no new public information that would suggest there is anything novel to fear from the omicron variant of COVID-19—which seems to be producing mild cases in vaccinated individuals—many municipalities are regressing into full-blown panic and reimposing mitigation measures. Case in point: Democratic Gov. Gavin Newsom reinstated California's mask mandate, beginning December 15 and lasting until January 15.

#BREAKING California is implementing a statewide indoor mask mandate from Dec. 15-Jan. 15.

If you're unvaccinated & want to attend a mega event (1,000 plus people), you must show a negative antigen test within 1 day of the event or a negative PCR test within 2 days.

— Elex Michaelson (@Elex_Michaelson) December 13, 2021

Many Californians had already been living under some kind of mask mandate: The city of Los Angeles never lifted its requirement.

Officials were quick to assert that the mandate is necessary because cases have surged 47 percent since Thanksgiving. That sounds like a lot, but we're actually talking about an increase from 9 cases per 100,000 people to 14 cases per 100,000 people. Thus far, the new strain appears just as infectious as the delta variant, but is causing less severe disease among those who contract it.

It "looks less severe in really early data," Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Director Rochelle Walensky admitted to ABC News. "We're certainly following and very interested in disease severity."

California is hardly the only Democratic-controlled place to implement new restrictions due to omicron panic. Philadelphia announced a new vaccine mandate for indoor restaurants. Even kids will have to follow it: The city is giving them until February to get their shots.

Throughout the pandemic, I've looked to elite college campuses—where the student population is typically between 90 and 99 percent vaccinated, and at low risk of negative COVID-19 health outcomes—for any evidence that progressive officials will ease up on their love of pandemic restrictions. Over and over again, we've seen that the very people who could most afford to return to normal are being forced to behave the most cautiously. And so it is with omicron: DePaul University in Chicago announced yesterday they would move classes online for the month of January. Craig Klugman, a medical anthropologist and member of DePaul's COVID advisory team, told higher ed watchdog news site The College Fix that he was not in the room where the decision was made.

Middlebury College in Vermont, which is 99 percent vaccinated, is immediately moving to remote instruction following a 50 person outbreak on campus,* and told students to leave campus immediately if possible. They will take all of their final exams online, and all athletic games and social events are canceled. Students who are stuck on campus may not eat in the cafeteria: All meals will be grab-and-go. Mask wearing is required and will be militantly enforced.

Cornell University suspended all school-sponsored events and urged students not to socialize. The administration said that the 90 active cases of COVID-19 on the campus are "deeply concerning," even though not a single one has been severe or required hospitalization. Not one.

And that's hardly surprising: We have learned a lot about COVID-19 over the last two years, and we know that young people, as well as all vaccinated people except for the very old and frail or the immunocompromised, are extremely protected from severe disease and death. If you have serious health problems or are in the 65-plus category, you may want to follow additional precautions for the time being. But for everyone else, we have reached the point where COVID-19 really is akin to the flu. Yet we're still treating it like the Black Death.

---

FREE MINDS

The select committee investigating the January 6 riot at the U.S. Capitol has voted to hold Mark Meadows, chief of staff to former President Donald Trump, in contempt of Congress for failing to appear and answer questions about his role in the events of that infamous day. According to CNBC:

Meadows, who refused to sit for a deposition to answer questions about the then-president's actions on Jan. 6, is the third Trump ally to face the threat of possible criminal charges stemming from the probe of the deadly attack.

The bipartisan, nine-member panel voted unanimously in support of a report that includes a resolution recommending that the House find Meadows in contempt and refer him to the Department of Justice for criminal prosecution.

The 51-page contempt report lays out Meadows' refusal to fully comply with the subpoena, which required him to produce a slew of records to the committee and sit for a deposition with the investigators.

That report also includes fascinating details about efforts made by Trump's family members, as well as Fox News hosts, to convince the president to take stronger action to stop the riot. According to The Bulwark:

Indeed, according to the records, multiple Fox News hosts knew the President needed to act immediately. They texted Meadows that:

"Hey Mark, the president needs to tell people in the Capitol to go home…this is hurting all of us…he is destroying his legacy," Laura Ingraham wrote.

"Please get him on TV. Destroying everything you have accomplished," Brian Kilmeade wrote.

"Can he make a statement?…Ask people to leave the Capitol," Sean Hannity urged.

As the violence continued, one of the president's sons texted Meadows:

"He's got to condemn this [shit] ASAP. The Capitol Police tweet is not enough," Donald Trump, Jr. texted.

Meadows responded: "I'm pushing it hard. I agree."

Still, President Trump did not immediately act. Donald Trump, Jr. texted again and again, urging action by the president: "We need an Oval address. He has to lead now. It has gone too far and gotten out of hand."

"Mr. Meadows has shown his willingness to talk about issues related to the select committee's investigation across a variety of media platforms—anywhere, it seems, except to the select committee," the panel wrote in a recent report.

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FREE MARKETS

The D.C. Metro is currently functioning at greatly reduced capacity due to various issues with the train cars. Rep. Gerry Connolly (D–Va.) plans to call Metro leaders to testify before Congress about hiding details of faulty cards for years. According to NBC:

"Metro has to account for the fact that they essentially hid the fact that they had a safety problem with the series 7000 cars for four years. For four years they didn't tell anybody," he said via video call.

"That for me – I'm a Catholic — that's in the category of a mortal sin," Connolly added.

Two major questions that have swirled since a train derailed on the Blue Line near Arlington Cemetery on Oct. 12 are, Who knew about the wheel problems? Why didn't they tell anyone?

Metro said they appreciate Connolly's oversight and will continue to provide information on the issues.

Transparency is essential, Connolly said.

"If we are going to win back confidence such that riders return, they've got to have confidence that you're not hiding safety issues from them," he said.

Metro's sidelined 7000 series railcars make up about 60% of Metro's fleet. Without them, riders continue to face long delays.

(No kidding.)

---

QUICK HITS

• Lia Thomas, a trans woman and college swim team star at the University of Pennsylvania, is smashing records left and right, prompting some charges of unfairness.
• A corrections officer was killed by the Kentucky tornadoes while overseeing inmates working in a candle factory.
• No one responsible for the Afghanistan drone strike that wrongly killed innocent civilians is expected to be punished.
• Kim Kardashian West passed the "baby bar" exam on her fourth attempt.
• Comedian Sarah Silverman defended her tweet criticizing MSNBC host Joy Reid over misleading commentary:

https://twitter.com/TrumpJew2/status/1469849261852569604

UPDATE: Middlebury's decision was in response to an outbreak on campus. This detail has been added.

Comments

[Don't look at me!]

Fuck Joe Biden

[Union of Concerned Socks]

FJB FTW!

[R Mac]

Comment 666 again!

[Caridad Seim]

Seriously I don’t know why more people haven’t tried this, I work two shifts, 2 hours in the day and 2 in the evening…FXX And i get surly a check of $12600 what’s awesome is I m working from home so I get more time with my kids.

Try it, you won’t regret it……..CASHAPP NOW

[ElvisIsReal]

9.6% year-over-year inflation this month! Clearly we need to print a few trillion more bucks and hand them out to the connected!

[Union of Concerned Socks]

Brrrrrrr!

[Kerstin Wirth]

I’ve got my first check total of $15,550, pretty cool. I am so excited, this is the first time i Actually earned something. I am going to work even harder new and i can’t wait for next week payment.jjw Go to home tab for more detail…….I highly recommend to everyone to apply…

Join this right now…………Pays-/24

[Don't look at me!]

The HAPERINFLATION only applies to spittin’ tobaccy.

[R Mac]

Right. And the rich don’t use spitin tobaccy, only rubes do.

[The Encogitationer]

Well, that part is correct. It is a both pricey and dangerous addiction to have. You certainly wouldn’t stay rich long if you took to it.

[Don't look at me!]

I bet you are a lot of fun at parties.

[JesseAz]

I mean the average spittin tabaccy user spends 250k or more a year on it. What millionaire could afford that??

[JesseAz]

Didn’t you watch Psaki and her press conference??? Big meat joined big spitting tabaccy to try to overthrow Biden by raising prices! Insurrection!!

[Chumby]

Psaki psays psausages & psteaks psoar?

[Moonrocks]

Fuck Joe Biden

[Chumby]

Just say no.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

But women, POCs, young people, old people, and cripples lack sufficient agency to say no.

[Chumby]

Rosa Parks said no.

[The Encogitationer]

Here is the truth on Rosa Parks and much more, spoken by a man on his own private property, in a time not long ago when it was still possible:
Barbershop (2002) | Barbershop Talk: Rosa Parks | MGM Studios
https://youtu.be/ZTiE34oJz5I

[Moonrocks]

Hey, remember 20 years ago when TSA probing your anus to get on a plane was just a temporary measure and once all the terrorism hubbub had died down we could go back to normal? This is that, but with masks and needles.

[The Encogitationer]

You mean that wasn’t a police fantasy fistiing sesh at the massage parlor that was near the airport?

[Chumby]

Tony refers to that as the golden age of air travel.

[Fist of Etiquette]

California Reinstates Mask Mandate as Omicron Panic Devours Team Blue

To be fair, actual Team Blue isn’t masking up, just those subject to their dictates.

[End Child Unemployment]

Following mandates is for the servant class!

[Mother's Lament]

But you don’t understand. The elites are smarter than the serfs and understand hygiene and know how virions are transmitted. They aren’t in danger like the working class, who’d still be living in mud huts and eating each other without people like Obama, Bloomberg, Soros, Steyer and the Bushes and Clintons to show the way.

[Moonrocks]

They’re a more Sophisticated crowd.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Hey, when you are mentally ill and addicted to destructive behavior, any excuse to perform is irresistible. Just ask battered spouses, anorexics, and self-cutters.

[Don't look at me!]

No one responsible for the Afghanistan drone strike that wrongly killed innocent civilians is expected to be punished.

Especially the big guy.

[Fist of Etiquette]

That sounds like a lot, but we’re actually talking about an increase from 9 cases per 100,000 people to 14 cases per 100,000 people.

Oh, no. They’ve discovered how to weaponize statistics.

[HorseConch]

It’s a dramatic spike in cases. Think of the children, you monster.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

In progressive math, “dramatic” and “spike” are actual numbers that feel really, really bad.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Where have you been for the past two years?

[Sevo]

5 one-thousanths of one percent!

[Sevo]

BTW, what’s the margin of error here?

[Minadin]

47%

[Fist of Etiquette]

Middlebury College in Vermont, which is 99 percent vaccinated, is immediately moving to remote instruction and told students to leave campus immediately if possible.

Preferably while screaming in panic.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Liberal arts education as performance art.

[Don't look at me!]

Can anyone point to the stats that show how much better they are doing in California with regards to Covid? Must be like nobody is getting sick, right?

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

If anyone in CA is getting sick, blame Drumpf. And DeSantis.

[JesseAz]

Just like gun violence is due to the neighboring states, not the blue states.

[Overt]

I mean, in deaths per 1000, California is doing better than Florida and Texas, hands down. Why I shudder to imagine the wasteland that those southern red states have become.

But. California hasn’t hit its big 3rd peak that typically comes in the December/January time frame. And additionally, if you compare extremely restrictive Los Angeles, CA (1 case in 6, 1 Death in 367) to Orange County (1 case in 9, 1 Death in 545) where school masking is really the only restriction, it indicates that the level of lockdown doesn’t actually matter.

[ElvisIsReal]

This has been obvious since we first started doing this insane shit two years ago. Seasonality trumps anything we do, and at some point we need to start listening to the people who are correct instead of the people involved in the cover-up.

[MT-Man]

Overt I’m not sure the hands down even though correct is the descriptor I’d use. if I take the Johns Hopkins numbers I get 1.89 per 1k in Cali and 2.54 in Texas and 2.85 in Florida. It’s about 1 person versus Florida per 1k and .7 for Texas. Take what you want from that number but I personally don’t think it’s worth it. But I guess you could really say “but it does save one life” * Note you’d have to further analyze with age, other issues, etc.

[ElvisIsReal]

And you’d also have to count lockdown deaths on the other side of the ledger.

[MT-Man]

Agreed. There’s so much to this including number needing to vax, deaths from vax and other causes that you could really get into some interesting discussions. I have a very strong bias towards individual choice.

[Overt]

” But I guess you could really say “but it does save one life””

Look, you aren’t going to find anyone more anti-mandate than me. But it is important to recognize the statistics- even the inconvenient ones.

And, by the by, my initial look at the graphs indicates that California is on track to do better on deaths during its “peak” compared to FL and TX. *If* that happens, and *if* that can be linked to the benefits of vaccination, I will still be arguing against mandates everywhere. Because my arguments against the mandates are based on the immorality of it all, and not pragmatic statistics.

As others have said, the Free Market is good because it is moral- the fact that it appears to have great outcomes is just a side benefit. If FL and TX tend to do as well or better than NY, CA, etc then hooray. They are still responding to this virus better than the other states in this union.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

where school masking is really the only restriction, it indicates that the level of lockdown doesn’t actually matter.

The level of lockdown, masks and social distancing don’t matter. The vaccine is the only thing that matters and its efficacy wanes dramatically in a relatively short time (like I wasn’t getting poked with a stick 6 months after my Smallpox vaccine to get a ‘booster’ because I was ‘effectively unvaccinated’). The vaccine helps to shave the sharp edges off the disease, and for really old, sick people that seems to be just enough to keep them from dying.

California is likely doing better than Florida and Texas because you have a higher percentage of people who are vaccinated, not because your two year old is forced to wear a muzzle.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The select committee investigating the January 6 riot at the U.S. Capitol has voted to hold Mark Meadows, chief of staff to former President Donald Trump, in contempt of Congress for failing…

…to show up and help facilitate Capitol Hill’s latest televised grandstanding event.

[Spiritus Mundi]

It is extreme sophistry at this point to highlight the contempt charge then show text messages Meadows handed over to the committee without ever mentioning where they came from.

[R Mac]

Or to ask what authority Congress has for this witch-hunt, or what other extra-judicial investigations The Party will try next if this precedent is set.

[R Mac]

I mean, maybe it’s just me, but it sounds like an issue a presumably libertarian publication might want to cover.

[Don't look at me!]

Where can I find one?

[R Mac]

I think there’s one in England that Paul keeps linking to.

[JesseAz]

mises.org is not bad, articles are good. Not much commentary.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

I hear the dark web is the place to find illegal stuff.

[Don't look at me!]

Not sure why, but that sounds racist.

[R Mac]

Sounded like a call to SPB to me.

[Mother's Lament]

In the DNC dream world kiddie touching intergenerational love will be mainstream and non-sexual libertarian opinion will be confined to a few .onion sites.

[ElvisIsReal]

Let me know if you come across one.

[Fats of Fury]

Apparently they think it’s “The Bulwark”.

[JesseAz]

They have gone as far as subpoenaing phone, bank, and even diary records from conservatives who weren’t even in DC on J6. They are using merely as a pretext to invade the opposing party. The actions would make Maduro blush.

[Mother's Lament]

This.

Hey White Mike, you want to see what an actual coup looks like? Look at the Democrats behavior after Jan. 6. Legitimate governments don’t act like that.

[DesigNate]

This is the most legitimatist administration in the history of the country! – Mike

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

Article 1 Sect 8 maybe?
The Congress shall have Power…To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court

[R Mac]

Seems like a stretch that this has anything to do with levying taxes and providing for common defense. Maybe that’s why they, and their payed shills like Jeffy, keep screaming “Insurrection!” despite no charges for that.

Any idea if Volohk’s covered this?

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

I don’t recall Volohk covering or seeing any coverage in recent years over Congressional hearings versus Constitutional authority to point you too.

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

This to me seems like they have the authority but are 1) over playing their hands politically and also maybe pushing the boundaries of congressional oversight. Just like Congress has commerce clause powers but those powers have been pushed beyond their original meaning to make them unrecognizable.

But my knowledge on historical congressional hearings/tribunals is quite lacking.

[Minadin]

“The bipartisan, nine-member panel . . .”

. . . contains 7 Democrats and 2 Republicans, but the Republicans were selected by the Democrats, rather than the Republican leadership, and are considered rogues among their own party.

. . . meets in secret behind closed doors without any press coverage or TV cameras present. It has been widely criticized for issuing subpoenas for materials and witnesses with no plausible connection to the subject of its investigation.

[R Mac]

What part of Orange Man Bad aren’t you getting?

[JesseAz]

Based on House rules, the panel is not bipartisan and it is operating against House rules.

House rules require members elected by both parties to be present at all depositions and a lawyer appointed by both parties. They have done neither in this investigation. Cheney and Kizenger were not appointed by the minority party, the depositions are invalid based on House rules.

[CE]

To be fair, they already held him in contempt.

[Jerryskids]

California is hardly the only Democratic-controlled place to implement new restrictions due to in order to induceomicron panic.

FTFY

[Illocust]

So what are the odds in a decade we will end the concept of women’s sports in America? If it becomes impossible for a woman to win a competition at the state level, the main reason people support having sex segregated sports will be gone (giving their daughters somewhere they can be competitive).

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

Ugh. What are you, one of those hateful science-denying bigots who insists transwomen have an “unfair athletic advantage” over ciswomen? That’s nonsense.

Stay tuned for Scott Shackford’s next piece. He’ll explain why you’re wrong.

#BeardedWomenAreStillWomen

[Zeb]

I think people will come to their senses and in a decade people will wonder what the hell was going on. I may be overly optimistic, but I really don’t see how this shit can go on.

[Illocust]

Unlikely, either the Supreme Court is going to rule or a federal law is going to get passed that will set this in stone. The only good news, is that this might accidentally make it illegal to have special carve outs from equality under the law for women.

[Don't look at me!]

So hateful.
Just because someone has a penis doesn’t give them an advantage over women who can’t compete.

[Chumby]

CaitGate

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Here is a radical concept.

Maybe there shouldn’t be sex-segregated sports?

Instead, maybe for competitions that involve athletes of different physical strength, to make the competition fair, the athletes should be classified by a weight class, such as with boxing or wrestling.

So there can be “Tier 1 Sport” which has only athletes up to a certain level of ability, and “Tier 2 Sport” which has athletes of intermediate ability, etc. No need to segregate by biological sex, just segregate by physical ability.

[Don't look at me!]

That is just as discriminatory as anything.
We are all equal, man.
If a woman can’t compete against a woman with a penis, she just isn’t trying hard enough.

[HorseConch]

In fairness, the one with the penis should be much harder than the competition.

[R Mac]

Never change Jeffy.

[HorseConch]

I say we get rid of the actual competition, and have a drawing to determine who gets the trophy. Jeff will have just as much chance at greatness as Bruce Jenner.

[JesseAz]

Don’t say you don’t ever say stupid things. You’re basically saying to eliminate women’s competition.

[Full Of Buckminster]

Because determining ability is so objective.

[Overt]

“So there can be “Tier 1 Sport” which has only athletes up to a certain level of ability, and “Tier 2 Sport” which has athletes of intermediate ability, etc.”

While I know you are trying to find a compromise, the result of this is going to be turning women’s leagues into 2nd tier men’s leagues, without any women.

Essentially, this is what happened in Women’s MMA, where a TG Woman was in the same weight class as the champion Cis woman, and beat her into a pulp. In the run up to the beijing olympics, the Canadian women’s hockey team has been playing men’s junior teams (that’s high schoolers) and have lost three straight. The US Women’s team (which is about as competitive) went like 1 – 5 (with one loss being in OT) in the run up to the Sochi games.

It is an inconvenient truth, but a man at the 20th percentile will generally perform better than women at the 80th percentile in sports. There is some variation, but you cannot wish away the power of testosterone and the disparities it creates. There are studies showing that the advantages bestowed on men for physical prowess begin as early as in the womb.

If you want a place for cis-gendered women to compete fairly, and not be at great risk of injury, you need to give them a place to compete amongst themselves.

[JesseAz]

Bone structure is also huge for sports. It isn’t just chemicals and hormones.

[Overt]

I mean sure- but the cause of bone structure is hormones. And that’s the point- you block the hormones today, it doesn’t change the fact that your body has been built on those hormones since before you were born.

[Overt]

Another example: Women’s Soccer. Here in the United States, soccer is interesting because there tends to be a much greater culture for girls playing here compared to boys (the boys tend to go into football, basketball, baseball before soccer). So the competitiveness among girls is much higher than among boys, and there is a great pipeline of athletes in development. Even more interesting, soccer does not require the upper body strength that men are generally expected to possess.

The USA Women’s team in 2017 lost to the Dallas boy’s under 15 team. Again: probably one of the most competitive and well-honed women’s sports teams in the world lost to 14-15 year old boys in a sport that is consistently one of the least competitive in the country.

This was one of hundreds of high school programs around the country, and most of those kids might play in college and then have regular careers. Most will not make it into a professional league. But pretty much every one of them could take a spot from the women operating at the pro-woman’s level.

TL;DR: Unless your sport has 1 Million “Tier 2” spots for playing, men will crowd out all but a handful of women. It will mean the end of women’s sports.

[Full Of Buckminster]

It’s been reported in multiple outlets that it was a scrimmage, and done mainly as a developmental outing for the boys. If true, I can see the women not really trying, and maybe even letting the boys win. Your point is valid, but I don’t think this is a good example.

[Overt]

This is spin. It is absolutely a fact that womens’ teams play against junior leagues, and it isn’t purely for exhibition. This dallas one was one example, but the UK Women’s team does the same.

They do it to get ready for World Cups, Olympics and other championships. You don’t go to an exhibition game and “hold back” to get ready for the Olympics. These women are playing against the best men they can in order to hone their skills. If they could play against minor-league men and still be competitive, they would do it.

[mad.casual]

Moreover, if I half-ass it through the “scrimmage”, *they* don’t get any better. Doesn’t matter if the “they” is the pro women or the HS boys. “I lost because I wasn’t really playing (or was distracted, or injured, or tired, or didn’t have the right equipment…).” is still an ‘L’. Unless you think the boys were cheating and/or the refs dishonest, it’s an ‘L’.

It would be one thing if it were a rag-tag team of boys playing a pickup game against *some* pro women, but it wasn’t.

[mad.casual]

All I hear are excuses.

Seriously, European pro women’s teams routinely play HS boys teams and lose. My understanding is that the final score was 5-2. My experience playing sports, you play to win and if you’re playing to let someone win on paper, the final is the equivalent of 0-5 at the half or beginning of the last period and 6-5 at the final. Losing 5-2 and then saying “Oh, it was just a scrimmage.” is how girls/children “win”.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

All I hear are anecdotes, and in the case of the US Women’s Soccer Team, an anecdote based on half-truths designed to push a narrative rather than to inform

[Overt]

At what point do anecdotes become data for you, Jeff?

This happens all over the world, man. Go do a search. It happens in the US, Canada, UK, and Europe. It happens for soccer and for hockey. The US National Woman’s Team used to train south of here in San Diego. Despite the fact that there are numerous colleges and men’s clubs to scrimmage against, they always scrimmaged against the U-17 team. High schoolers.

Think on that- in order to find teams matched to their skill level, the top ~20 women in a country don’t scrimmage against men’s pro teams; they don’t scrimmage against the minor/farm teams; they don’t scrimmage against colleges. They play high-schoolers.

But if that isn’t enough “data” for you, again, check the motivational times for US Swimming. The top ranked 17-18 Girls swim a 50m Free in 27.09 seconds. That’s worse than the top 3 ranks of boys 17 – 18, and about what the top ranked 11-12 yr old boys are swimming.

Hollywood and popular culture has done a lot to minimize the athletic differences between men and women- and for most applications it doesn’t matter. But when you are talking about competitive sports, the difference between male athletes who will go no further than college and the very best women is still rather sizeable.

[R Mac]

Jeffy’s staked out his position. Nothing anyone says is going to get him to reconsider, no matter how stupid his position is.

[Overt]

I am trying my best not to reflexively turn this into a kulture warz issue. Sufficient damage has already been done to kids as pawns in the Pandemic kulture warz, and I would prefer that this not be another one.

I understand the impetus to allow TG persons compete where they are competing, but you cannot wish away the fact that it means very biological males who are utterly mediocre in their prospective sport will take the place of women. They will take their scholarships. They will take their jobs. You might say this is an acceptable price to pay for TG Equality, but you cannot deny the price.

Chemjeff’s attempt to resolve the issue is interesting, but as noted, it doesn’t address the root cause. And indeed, in many sports, there is not actually a prohibition on biological females participating. It is just that the number of biological females who can participate at the level of biological males is extremely small- so small, compared to males, that without special leagues reserved for biological females, they will have trouble participating at all.

[R Mac]

“Chemjeff’s attempt to resolve the issue is interesting,”

Is it? Subjective so hard to argue it being interesting or not. Based off responses I don’t see any evidence that it was a good idea, and plenty that it wasn’t.

I did see you having to correct Jeffy at least once, and probably more, about what you said after he misinterpreted it in this thread. Not surprising since he’s one of our resident Cathy Newmans.

[JesseAz]

You are an idiot though jeff. You are our greatest example om these boards of cognitive biases.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

While I know you are trying to find a compromise, the result of this is going to be turning women’s leagues into 2nd tier men’s leagues, without any women.

You mean, like how it is today? Where “women’s sports” don’t receive nearly the same attention or respect as “men’s sports” do?

And the anecdotes you describe are not athletes competing against each other on similar ability levels, they are still segregated by sex, with the assumption that the “lower tier” men’s team should be competitive with the “upper tier” women’s team. That assumption, based on your anecdotes, seems to be false. So don’t segregate by sex at all, and instead create competition by pure ability alone. You will still have the highest tiers of every sport dominated by men, due to biological advantages that most men have. That’s fine. But you will ALSO have the occasional trans man who can compete at that high of a level and will be able to compete commensurate with his abilities. Why not enable that?

[Overt]

“You mean, like how it is today? Where “women’s sports” don’t receive nearly the same attention or respect as “men’s sports” do?”

No, not at all like it, Jeff. I am saying that you will have Tier 1 that everyone pays attention to, and then Tier 2, filled with men. Whether people pay attention to it or not, there will be no women in that Tier 2.

This gets a little wonky, but in swimming they organize you into 6 ranks (AAAA, AAA, AA, A, BB, B) based on your times. For example, 17 – 18yr boys AAAA (top) rank should do the 50 Meter Fly in a minimum of 24.39.

Now, the minimum time to be in the AAAA (top) rank for Women on the 50m Fly is 27.09. The AA Rank for boys beats that at 26.69. That means there are 3 full ranks of boys that can consistently beat the top women.

If you consider a college that has 25 person swim teams, or 50 total positions, there are going to be more men available to fill those slots than women who can out compete them.

[Overt]

“But you will ALSO have the occasional trans man who can compete at that high of a level and will be able to compete commensurate with his abilities.”

I think the thing you are missing is that there are more athletes than there are competitive “slots”. Today, as a man, if you are not in the top 25 men applying to a college swim team, you just don’t play any more. If you are not one of the top 25 women applying for a college you cannot play any more.

But in the tiered, multi-gender system, as a woman, if you are not better than the top 50 men in the sport, you don’t get to play. So the most likely case is that the college will have a Tier 1 swim team with 25 men, and a tier 2 swim team with 22 men, 1 TG woman and maybe one or two women.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

So what you are saying, is that the existence of women’s only sports actually represents a type of discrimination against men?

[Overt]

“So what you are saying, is that the existence of women’s only sports actually represents a type of discrimination against men?”

Why wouldn’t it be? You are discriminating the gender of who is allowed.

[DesigNate]

Any team that does not take all walk-ons is, by definition, discriminatory. Personally, I don’t see a problem with it. Nobody wants to watch you or me play basketball, they want to see people with exceptional talent.

I can understand why biological women, competing for spots on women’s teams, might not be copacetic with biological men taking their spots though.

[Overt]

Right.

If you value a place where biological girls and women can compete “fairly” (that is, with players close to their skill level, and who aren’t very likely to injure them) then really your only choice is to let them compete with other biological girls.

I can understand a statement along the lines of, “women don’t have any special right to be represented in sports”, and I agree with it as a philosophical statement. But, setting aside the complications of Title IX, there is demand out there- even among parents- to see girls compete in sports. And if you do not restrict the sport to biological girls only, many of the reasons you want girls engaging in competitive sports are gone, since they will be dominated or excluded by men.

[CE]

Maybe soccer moms will try to save traditional girls’ sports, once their daughters start losing their starting gigs and playing time on the soccer and basketball and softball and track and swimming teams, and with them the chance at college scholarships.

[soldiermedic76]

Someone has never played co-ed softball. Any league I ever played in capped how many home runs men could hit (usually two, after that they were all ruled doubles) because the men hit to many home runs compared to the females. Women didn’t have a cap and rarely hit two home runs in a game. None of us were professionals, in fact most of the females that played were younger, many had played varsity softball in high school and tended to be in better shape than the men. Some of us men had played varsity baseball, but none of us really were stars (my batting average senior year was sub .200, although I had 12 steals). The leagues also tend to not allow men pitch either. And we had to have equal number of men and women and alternate batting order, m/f. Despite all this the men just were more competitive.

[Bubba Jones]

As if the only difference between athletic performance of men and women is weight?

[Chumby]

Men tend to weigh two stones more than women.

[The Great Negro]

Sports are segregated so women have a chance to win.

[The Great Negro]

Why don’t you want women to have a chance Jeff?

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Cuz he has no use for (and appeal to) them?

[mad.casual]

What makes you think it will stop at women’s sports? The goal isn’t to give trans athletes a place to compete, it’s to eliminate conceptions of binary gender. If the trans athletes were *the* dominant athletes, it wouldn’t matter which gender category they competed in, they would win. We don’t have ‘black male’ basketball and ‘white male’ poker tournaments.

It’s a false conception that sports are, were originally, or always have been sex segregated. Most “male” sports leagues have no explicit requirement that the athletes be male. Plenty of individual sports don’t have even the implication. Plenty of mixed sports have the opposite implication. The rules “against” trans athletes aren’t gender biased, they’re capability biased. We don’t allow 250 lb. wrestlers to identify as 105 lb. wrestlers in order to win competitions. We don’t allow someone wearing a cast on their wrist to compete as a sprinter in the Special Olympics.

The idea that trans athletes just want a place to compete is BS. They want a trophy for being trans.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

So if a 250-lb trans man wants to compete in the 250-lb weight class in “men’s wrestling”, what is the harm in permitting that?

If a 105-lb trans woman wants to compete in the 105-lb weight class in “women’s wrestling”, what is the harm in permitting that?

[Illocust]

You are actually unaware of muscle and bone density differences between men and women aren’t you?

Also there is no issue with trans men competing in sports. Men don’t compete in sex segregated sports because men don’t need to compete in sex segregated sports in order to have a chance at victory.

That said, I’ve always been for the elimination of sex segregation in bathrooms, sports, and everywhere else. Separate but equal being illegal shouldn’t have an asterisk that says unless it advantages women.

[JesseAz]

He is obese. He knows nothing of exercise or sports.

[Minadin]

“So if a 250-lb trans man wants to compete in the 250-lb weight class in “men’s wrestling”, what is the harm in permitting that?”

There is none. It’s permitted currently and always has been.

[Overt]

As I mentioned up above, here is what happens when a TG woman in the same weight class as other women does MMA:

https://www.sportskeeda.com/mma/news-when-transgender-fighter-fallon-fox-broke-opponent-s-skull-mma-fight

The TG Woman breaks the other woman’s skull. She caved in a woman’s skull.

[I, Woodchipper]

HE caved in a woman’s skull

[Chumby]

Truly mixed martial arts.

[R Mac]

Your ignorance continues to astound me, Jeffy.

[mad.casual]

So if a 250-lb trans man wants to compete in the 250-lb weight class in “men’s wrestling”, what is the harm in permitting that?

Thank you for a sterling example of the fallacious argument based on a specious reasoning. I never said a 250 lb. trans man or even a 105 lb. cis-women can’t, according to the rules, compete against a 250 lb. cis-male. If you feel more trans-male athletes should be competing above their weight class, take your arguments up with them.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

I believe that any athlete who is willing to compete in a fair competition against a worthy opponent ought to have the ability to do so regardless of the individual’s gender identity.

[JesseAz]

Yes. You want to end all women’s competition so that you can virtue signaling for the Trans community.

Youre quite frankly an idiot.

[Brian]

But that’s so generic it’s pointless. So if a transperson finds someone who’s willing to play a sport with them, you’ll let them do so? Great! You’re not an authoritarian asshole!

Now, what to do about trans women who want to box women for the championship. How many women have to die in the ring so we can pretend trans women are women? How much of a body count does this concept of equality demand so that no one’s feelings are hurt?

You’d be completely fine with a private organization deciding not to allow that, right? No need to be an authoritarian asshole.

[Overt]

And you might also support everybody’s right to hash this out in civil discussion.

I get the problem that we are solving for. I don’t think essentially ruining the competition among women’s clubs is worth it. That isn’t transphobia or anything. It is recognizing that if biological females cannot compete without the interference of biological males, it ruins the sport for them.

[R Mac]

“And you might also support everybody’s right to hash this out in civil discussion.”

You’ve acknowledged the physical difference between men and women, correct? If so, then we’re hashing out with civil discussion mentally ill men beating the shit out of women who want to compete against other women in sports.

[R Mac]

But yeah, technically you and Jeffy have a right to discuss it. I don’t think anyone should stop you. I just find one position abhorrent, and it’s one of the many reasons Jeffy deserves all the contempt he receives.

[Overt]

First of all, I wasn’t trying to criticize either Brian or you, here. I was just trying to calm things getting into slurs and mud slinging when I thought a decent discussion was going on.

Consider this my holiday spirit arising. If we are going to ever stop the partisan tribal bullshit, at some point we have to chill with the theatrical vitriol. I still respond to asshole attacks, but nothing in Chemjeff’s posts on this specific subject was snarky or shrill.

I think Jeff genuinely thought he was providing a valid solution, because I don’t think he really understands the complaint. And as long as he is willing to discuss it in a civil manner, why not take the opportunity to have a decent conversation. (And for the record, I think he is trying to trap me into positions, and using other debate tricks, but that is different from being an asshole.)

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

You guys are missing a social justice (and huge commercial) opportunity. We need a bonafide Trans Olympics. Think of all the woke corporations that will throw billions into support and advertising, and the media who will provide 24/7 coverage.

[Commenter_XY]

Have Iran host the Trans Games in Tehran, with Gaza as a potential backup location.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Tranny surgeries are actually pretty common in Iran because of the laws against gay buttsex.

[rbike]

No. We will clean up in the Women’s Olympic events.

[DesigNate]

I’d like to subscribe to your newsletter.

[Brian]

I’m not looking forward to the first MMA woman who gets killed in the octagon by a transwoman for the sake of equity.

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

“Democratic Gov. Gavin Newsom reinstated California’s mask mandate, beginning December 15 and lasting until January 15.”

California. Is. AWESOME!

And eventually our benefactor Charles Koch’s immigration agenda will do to every state what it has done to CA — import enough reliably Democratic voters to produce single-party government.

#LibertariansFor50Californias
#OpenBordersWillFixEverything

[End Child Unemployment]

You are doing the Lord’s work OBL. Keep spreading the totally not a parody gospel.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

As long as masks and other measures don’t reduce worker productivity, right?

[Commenter_XY]

OBL, please do not change. I have laughed my ass off at some of your posts.

[Fist of Etiquette]

“Can he make a statement?…Ask people to leave the Capitol,” Sean Hannity urged.

This is worse than Don Lemon secretly warning Jussie Smollet to cheese it, it’s the cops.

[BillyG]

I’d like to compare the timeline of these texts with when Twitter banned President Trump on that day. Twitter prolonged and aggravated the problem by banning Trump.

[R Mac]

Interesting thought.

[Mike Laursen]

Baloney. The President of the United States can make televised national addresses, has White House spokespersons who are on Twitter, etc. Most people in the United States are not even on Twitter.

[Minadin]

How likely are people marching between the White House and in/around Capitol Hill to be watching television at that moment?

[JesseAz]

Rational logic doesn’t matter to white mike.

[Mike Laursen]

Not likely. But we know they were communicating like heck on their cell phones, as all modern Americans do. Word would spread.

Are you arguing President Trump shouldn’t have attempted calling off the MAGA rioters because the effort might be imperfect?

[Minadin]

Wouldn’t Twitter be a more efficient method for reaching people who are likely carrying mobile devices such as smart phones, smart watches, etc?

It seemed to be his preferred method to communicate to his base, at any rate, prior to his ban.

[Mike Laursen]

As I said, there were plenty of people who could post a message from the President on Twitter.

[JesseAz]

He did so within 2 hours…

[Zeb]

And the followers of Trump would likely be seeing twitter on their phones because Trump was on Twitter all the time.

[CE]

There are already some actual quotes from his speech asking his supporters to protest peacefully. Which kind of throws a wrench in the whole “inciting insurrection” narrative.

[Mike Laursen]

I didn’t say anything about inciting an insurrection. The conversation is about what he could have done, and done earlier, to help stop the rioting.

[JesseAz]

So prosecute based on whatifs and could have been.

Great ethos you have there white Mike.

[R Mac]

“I didn’t say anything about inciting an insurrection.”

The fuck you haven’t lying ass Dee.

[dbruce]

And we fight. We fight like hell. And if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore. Fight said 17 times more.
Doesn’t sound very PEACEFUL …. Rep. Mo Brooks’ office has confirmed with WAFF that he did wear BODY ARMOR while giving a speech on January 6. Why body armor for a peaceful protest ?
“The Democrats are hopeless — they never vote for anything. Not even one vote. ” DEMENTIA again?

[Brian]

If the outcome of the 911 hearings is Trump is a bad man because he didn’t do what Sean Hannity told him to fast enough, then the goalposts must have drastically shifted.

[R Mac]

There’s never even been any goalposts to this farce.

[Zeb]

There’s only one post. That way you can never get the goal and no one has to move it.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Lia Thomas, a trans woman and college swim team star at the University of Pennsylvania, is smashing records left and right, prompting some charges of unfairness.

I don’t care what the gender, she was pretty good on Caroline in the City.

[Brian]

This is what equity looks like.

[JesseAz]

Cheney gas a bombshell at the j6 circus yesterday. Well known conservatives including Trump Jr texted Meadows to get Trump to go on TV to try to quell the riots.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/house/hurting-all-of-us-meadows-texts-show-trump-jr-and-fox-personalities-clamoring-for-response-to-capitol-riot

A normal person sees this as proof the riots weren’t planned and the white house was reacting to a protest turned riot.

But not Cheney. This is proof everything was planned and meant as an insurrection.

[JesseAz]

Meanwhile the political assault on their opponents continue as they refer meadows for criminal contempt.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/watch-mark-meadows-responds-to-january-6-committee-making-criminal-referral-against-him

[R Mac]

That’s ok because Orange Man Bad.

—Reason

[Commenter_XY]

How do they enforce it, though? Might be tough.

[Moonrocks]

With an illegitimate executive branch that has proven many times previously to use it’s power to unconstitutionally meet political objectives?

[JesseAz]

If the DoJ abides, they can use the D.C. jail. If the DoJ refuses, Congress has in the past arrested people and put them up in Hotels they were barred from leaving.

[Commenter_XY]

Gonna be pretty tough to carry that off = arrest Meadows for contempt and detain him in jail.

I mean, the useless Team D bastards would do it in a heartbeat. I know that. But it would be tough, considering robbers and rapists seem to be let off with a warning these days.

[JesseAz]

See J6 non violent, no bail, defendants.

[R Mac]

I honestly feel like hardly anyone is really paying attention to what is going on with this whole story and what the implications are going forward. It’s the only way to explain there’s, what, 5-6 of us here that even really care?

This has turned into true, 3rd world country shit. When other countries do shit like this, we denounce them, and possibly sanction them. If it wasn’t for the fact that other western nations were busy locking their own citizens down because of Covid, we’d probably be catching heat for it.

[Fist of Etiquette]

A corrections officer was killed by the Kentucky tornadoes while overseeing inmates working in a candle factory.

Didn’t this thing come through during the night?

[Don't look at me!]

Candles are made with prison labor?
Are they stealing jobs from immigrants?

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Blood candles?

[Chumby]

At Kentucky inmate labor work facilities, they make and burn the candle at both ends.

[Cronut]

This is actually a shitty headline. The linked article says he brought the inmates he was supervisong to a safe area, as well as other workers, and then went back out to check for more workers.

Slightly more than “supervising inmates,” if you ask me. He died making sure everyone else was safe.

[Fist of Etiquette]

No one responsible for the Afghanistan drone strike that wrongly killed innocent civilians is expected to be punished.

Did we ever think the opposite?

[Fist of Etiquette]

To be fair, the country’s accountability apparatus is busy with omicron.

[R Mac]

And January 6th.

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

“No one responsible for the Afghanistan drone strike that wrongly killed innocent civilians is expected to be punished.”

Mr. Buttplug (quoting Juan Cole) told me everything bad that happened in Afghanistan a couple months ago was actually Orange Hitler’s fault.

#DefendBidenAtAllCosts

[HorseConch]

Damn Sloppy Pullout.

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

It’s supposed to be typed in all caps, but yeah.

[HorseConch]

I was too busy being pissed about the extra penny my Spittin Tobaccy cost today to use proper grammar.

[Don't look at me!]

The single cause of HAPERINFLATION.

[Chumby]

Biden should face a war crimes trial in Afghanistan for his murderous drone strike. “Oopsie” and “Here’s a check” isn’t good enough in modern, civilized societies.

[dbruce]

I guess you would agree double for Bush who lied ( WMDs ) us into 2 decades long wars including using torture.

[ElvisIsReal]

LOL do you think people here supported Bush or Iraq?

[dbruce]

I would not be able to venture a guess but I am sure it’s not 0 or 100%. George Washington did not take a poll when he told his men not to torture, even if the enemy does.

[Chumby]

As someone who voted for Bushes zero times in three opportunities, I agree. And to think then senator Biden was totally opposed to these military adventurisms.

[BigT]

Biden Admits Voting for Iraq War ‘Was a Mistake,’ Says He Did It Because He ‘Wanted to Prevent a War’ HAHA!

Brain dead even in 2003 – he voted for a war to prevent war. Maybe he realized his advice was so bad it would convince others to vote the other way?

https://www.newsweek.com/biden-admits-voting-iraq-war-was-mistake-says-he-did-it-because-he-wanted-prevent-war-1491369

[CE]

What does this green button do again?

[dbruce]

Bush lies fooled a lot of people. Saddam never had WMDs. He never had anything to do with 9/11. $Trillions wasted.

[DesigNate]

Yes.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Kim Kardashian West passed the “baby bar” exam on her fourth attempt.

She can sit on my docket any day.

[Chumby]

Pro bono?

[Fist of Etiquette]

Don’t be crude.

[Chumby]

First remove your legal briefs.

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

Ex parte girl can certainly handle a caseload.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Baby bono?

[The Encogitationer]

And show off her double endemnities on both sides.

[JesseAz]

PJ Media does what Reason won’t do and cover the defamation lawsuit from Stossel against Facebook.

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/paula-bolyard/2021/12/13/shocker-facebook-admits-in-court-docs-that-its-fact-check-labels-are-opinions-n1541089

Stossel got FB lawyers to claim the fact checks were not facts but opinions. Also claimed in filings that they have no power over attaching fact checks to stories.

Stossel correctly points out FB chooses the checkers (often biased), reduces ads and distribution, and handles all appeals.

Stossel also claims the label itself is defamation. Facebook refused to remove labels even when shown to be wrong through conversations with Stossel.

[Illocust]

I wouldn’t get my hopes up.

[R Mac]

About the case, or Reason covering it?

[Illocust]

Both, but mostly the former. Merits really don’t matter in this sort of thing.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

True enough in the court of (manufactured) public opinion.

[Moonrocks]

Possibly depends on how high up it goes. Section 230 is only a superconstitutional Superprecedent because it’s only been ruled on by California judges.

[The Encogitationer]

A super-duper superconstitutional superprecedent?

[Iridium]

Even with section 230 there are plausible ways to break through. As Stossell points out: the fact checkers are hand picked and their “opinions” are treated special by the platform and are displayed and have function that are effectively an endorsement. In character, this is far more like a newspaper than an open forum.

That being said, why is he bothering to sue Facebook? They are, at most indirectly responsible. He ought to be suing the fact checkers.

[I, Woodchipper]

At this point i’m surprised they dont just jump straight to a public struggle session.

[Minadin]

It’s the Rachel Maddow defense.

https://notthebee.com/article/there-you-have-it-folks-facebook-is-defending-its-shoddy-fact-checking-operation-by-claiming-that-its-fact-checks-are-actually-just-opinion-

[Fist of Etiquette]

Comedian Sarah Silverman defended her tweet criticizing MSNBC host Joy Reid over misleading commentary…

Check the color of that pill.

[Don't look at me!]

A comedian? Are you joking?

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Social justice does not tolerate comedy.

[CE]

Their warriors would laugh in the face of your comedians.
If they had a sense of humor.

[Moonrocks]

An alleged comedian. I have yet to see any evidence to support that allegation.

[dbruce]

I would put her in the top 10, when she was on Conan and the cell phone /vagina joke….killed because it tested the limits allowed, she could not have gotten any closer, which is what comedians are supposed to do. George Carlin, GOAT.

[Don't look at me!]

Are you like 12 or something?

[dbruce]

something

[JimboJr]

Women resorting to vagina jokes is usually pretty cringe at this point. Somehow it isnt looked at as the basic equivalent of a dick/fart joke which is low hanging fruit and good for maybe a chuckle, despite it basically coming from the same place.

I dont know if she would make a women’s top 10, but she certainly wouldn’t make any actual top 10 or top 100. She is cringey garbage, very hard to listen to.

[dbruce]

Humor is different for everybody.

[Jerryskids]

I don’t think Sarah Silverman criticized Joy Reid because Joy is a black woman, she criticized her because Sarah is a dirty Jew. And you know how those people are.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Like over-achieving Asians, right?

[dbruce]

racism is learned.

[R Mac]

Whoosh!

[dbruce]

Did that come too close to home? Or was it a hit batter?

[Chumby]

Public schools like to refer to it as CRT.

[JesseAz]

12 cities run by Democrats broke their murder records.

https://justthenews.com/government/courts-law/twelve-us-cities-all-led-democrats-broke-annual-homicide-records-2021

[Don't look at me!]

Tough competition.

[Chumby]

Part of their Yes We Can campaign.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

I’ll point out here that Albuquerque’s murder increase is likely more due to socio-economic factors than anti-police advocacy. Even though the city’s police force has a rough reputation, the black population there is only about 3.5%, so they don’t have the numbers needed to . That city’s had a horrible crime rate for a long time, and I’ve heard from people I know there that the recent spate of murders are often resulting from spur-of-the-moment decisions, like road rage or drug deals gone bad. It’s sort of a unspoken rule there that you don’t honk your horn at someone who’s driving like an idiot, for example, because they could be a gang member who will take a shot at you in response.

[JesseAz]

Good thing democrats didn’t do anything to harm people’s economic statuses.

[Fats of Fury]

1000 in Cook County (Chicago) Illinois. Breaks down to 81 % killed by out of control SUVs, 15%, by delicious taco trucks and 4% white supremacy, who are directly responsible for the other 96% anyway.

[dbruce]

just the news is one of the worst sources you can have. You would be better off making stuff up yourself.

[R Mac]

Seems to be working for you.

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

“Lia Thomas, a trans woman and college swim team star at the University of Pennsylvania, is smashing records left and right, prompting some charges of unfairness.”

Alright KMW. Assign your official LGBTQIA+ correspondent Scott Shackford to write about this, because obviously Robby Soave isn’t qualified.

Shackford will explain to bigoted cisfemale athletes that they’re suffering from a mental disorder called TRANSGENDER ATHLETIC PANIC. Really, they just need to practice harder. And if they practice harder and still lose to a transwoman? Tough luck!

#ILoveScience

[Don't look at me!]

If you can’t compete against a woman with a penis, maybe you shouldn’t be competing.

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

And when washing the chlorine smell off after the contest, if you don’t want to see cock & balls, you should stay out of the women’s locker room.

#TransIsBeautiful

[Chumby]

Did she test positive for estrojenner?

[JesseAz]

The end of James Bond is a possibility.

https://justthenews.com/nation/culture/nonbinary-james-bond-future-possibility-says-producer

[HorseConch]

You don’t think that a badass spy in the ilk of a teenage boy, but actually a woman, will captivate audiences worldwide?

[D-Pizzle]

And that’s really all that matters to the producers: How will it play in China?

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

In the woke future, with no tolerance for sexual aggression, luxuries, personal violence, and recognition of individuals with superior abilities, the end of James Bond is a requirement.

[Mother's Lament]

A 130lb, purple-haired James Bond bantering about perineum piercings with drag-queen SMERSH agent/love interest named “It’s MA’AM!”.

The critics will declare it “Stunning and brave”, but racist, bigoted potential audience members will cause it to lose it’s entire budget.

[The Encogitationer]

“Ma’am. James, Ma’am.”

[Chumby]

Octopenis

LGBT Q

Goldenbrowneye

Montepeenny

For Your Guys Only

[The Encogitationer]

Will Bond be the one stroking his kitty instead of Ernst Stavro Blow-feld?

[Chumby]

One of the Bond Girls in Octopussy was a trans woman. Recall her name was Tula. Howard Stern had her on his 80s (90s?) tv show.

[Gray_Jay]

Also one of the models around a pool in the first reel of For Your Eyes Only, Caroline Cossey. Interestingly, if the wiki’s to be believed, she passed until after a short time after the movie premiere, when News of the World outed her.

[Don't look at me!]

Live and let guys.

[The Great Negro]

A view to a dill.

[Chumby]

Oddjob will return.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

From Russia with Hate Crimes

Thunderprosthetictesticle

You Only Transition Twice

The Person With the Golden Ambiguous Genitalia

[Chumby]

From Russia with Glove

[I, Woodchipper]

Wokeness turns everything to shit.

They have to change Superman. They have to change James Bond. It’s a religion and all must be subsumed in orthodoxy

[Chumby]

Some kid will do a public school paper on a classic Bond film and get expelled for being a cis hate monger fascist.

[R Mac]

“Lia Thomas, a trans woman and college swim team star at the University of Pennsylvania, is smashing records left and right, prompting some charges of unfairness.”

I was assured this wouldn’t happen.

[Don't look at me!]

It’s not really happening. You know how chicks are, they complain a lot.

[Mickey Rat]

Apparently, smashing not simply collegiate women’s records, but world women’s records. This person had been on the men’s team for three years.

[Moderation4ever]

It appears that Mark Meadows has found the worst possible spot for himself. He could have clammed up, he could have spilled his guts, but instead he just gave out enough information to hang himself out to dry. He has this in common with his old boss, he not the sharpest tool in the shed.

[Don't look at me!]

Compared to the razor sharp intellect of SleepyJoe, everyone looks dull.

[Moderation4ever]

Frankly it does take a whole lot to be sharper than former President Trump. All you need to know is there were not airports during the Revolutionary War or that Fredric Douglas was dead.

[Don't look at me!]

Does that beat “57 states”?

https://www.reuters.com/video/watch/idWAO1209788800644

[dbruce]

I saw that too. The calling his own book fake news was a call to bone spurs for help but the stable genius doesn’t care about anybody but himself.

[JesseAz]

What did reason think would happen when they gave government the benefit of the doubt and didn’t forcibly push back on this shit? All we got was Bailey saying more tests! The very tests mentioned as being used to force new mandates.

[Moonrocks]

Well you know, it’s kind of bad, BUT IT’S FOR OUR OWN GOOD!!

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

It’s way past time for people to accept the simple truth that the government can’t fix everything. They can’t get us to zero Covid and they’ll only wreck society in the trying.

Before anybody says it, yes I believe Covid is real. Yes, I’ve lost people I loved to it. Yes, I am vaccinated. But none of this means that absolutely any measure by the government is justified. We have to know when to stop.

[Don't look at me!]

We know.
They don’t.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

If government can’t fix everything, then why even have one and give it all our freedom and property?

BURN IT ALL DOWN!

[Mother's Lament]

“and they’ll only wreck society in the trying”

Pretty sure that’s the point.
If you asked some people to deliberately destroy a society, I don’t think that they’d do anything differently from what the Western establishment has done over the last 15 years.

[JesseAz]

Lia Thomas, a trans woman and college swim team star at the University of Pennsylvania, is smashing records left and right, prompting some charges of unfairness.

2nd team all male swimmer for his conference. Beat a woman in 2nd place by 38s.

The issue is more than just about unfairness here. Ot is about telling society to house play with mental illness.

If Reason were libertarian they would have the stories on the female teammates scared to talk out about the issue of their male team mate. The women live in fear of confrontation with their school, losing scholarships, as well as the pushback they will get being called transphobic. So they have to sit and watch a male destroy every conference and school record instead.

[Don't look at me!]

Tsk. Get your terminology right. Not a male, it’s a woman with a penis.

[Chumby]

She could be your sibling but she’ll never be your cister.

[JimboJr]

Plus it is forcing us to play their post-modern pretend game that anyone wanting to have a serious conversation cannot play.

“Men and women are no different”

…Men allowed in womens sports…women consistently get dominated

“Dont believe your lying eyes, men and women are the same”

This is the 2+2=5 all over again. Believe this weird post modern garbage, unsupported by any facts, or you are a bad person and a bigot.

[JesseAz]

To be fair, Jeff is on the same side as the left on both issues. Yes, he pushed 2+2=5 for weeks.

[Don't look at me!]

Better stock up on spittin’ tobaccy before another 10¢ bump in price

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/wholesale-inflation-jumps-record-9-134429918.html

[OpenBordersLiberal-tarian]

It’s disappointing to see Yahoo Finance descend to wingnut.com territory.

#InflationIsAWingnutMyth

[Don't look at me!]

Must be some sort of infiltration.

[JesseAz]

I thought inflation was real but it is good because it results in higher ranges (yes, still less than inflation, but who cares!)

[JesseAz]

higher wages*

[Don't look at me!]

Also, inflation is profit!

[Commenter_XY]

And their historical ticker data is all FUBAR, too. I hit their API to scrape data, and the data is shit now.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

“We have learned a lot about COVID-19 over the last two years, and we know that young people, as well as all vaccinated people except for the very old and frail or the immunocompromised, are extremely protected from severe disease and death.”

We also know that young people, at least the types found on elite college campuses, are also the most susceptible to fear and panic, and most likely to demand coddling care from the entire world.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

“Mr. Meadows has shown his willingness to talk about issues related to the select committee’s investigation across a variety of media platforms—anywhere, it seems, except to the select committee,” the panel wrote in a recent report.

Well, are we governing by Twitter or not?

[drisco304]

To attend a mega event you need a negative antigen test plus have a permission slip signed by Gavin Newsom.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

And what do you need for a dinner at the French Laundry?

[Don't look at me!]

Voted into office.

[DesigNate]

A couple hundred thousand in campaign donations?

[Mickey Rat]

Or attend a dinner party with him.

[D-Pizzle]

Too high a price.

[nobody 2]

“But for everyone else, we have reached the point where COVID-19 really is akin to the flu. Yet we’re still treating it like the Black Death.”

If only that were true. The Black Death has been widespread in the southwestern US since the 19th century (and one or two people a year do still die of it), but nobody thinks anything of it. The only precautions are the occasional plague warning at campgrounds advising campers to keep their pets on leashes, and inside as much as possible. I’ll bet that if you took a poll of city-dwellers in California, the vast majority of them wouldn’t even know that it’s still around.

[Don't look at me!]

Well, it’s a well known fact that the hospitals are literally overflowing with Covid patients gasping for air on ventilators, and the only way out of this is for everyone to wear three old tee shirts across their face and get infants vaccinated.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

“The D.C. Metro is currently functioning at greatly reduced capacity due to various issues with the train cars.”

Let’s take this to a (progressive) logical (?) conclusion: in the name of safety, considering both accidents and all disease exposure, stop running all trains; in the name of economic justice, keep paying all train employees, with annual raises and hardship bonuses; in the name of transportation justice, provide self-driving solar-powered flying cars to all deserving people; in the name of tax justice, make all the billionaires pay for this, and also force them to produce apology videos for being rich and causing all the problems in the world; finally, in the name of emotional justice, provide (mandate?) free government counseling to all the people in the DC area, except, of course, billionaires and racists.

[R Mac]

How about only bipocs get to ride the trains. And for free. And the billionaire apology videos played on monitors on the trains for entertainment.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

You want BIPOCs to die? You monster!

[dbruce]

Not fair !! Bone Spurs has NEVER apologized.

[soldiermedic76]

Just out of curiosity when was the last Democrat president that served in the military? Jimmy Carter. Both Clinton and Biden took draft exemptions also.

[dbruce]

It was a stupid war as most are….the 100 hour war is the best.

[R Mac]

Still haven’t figured out how this comment section works, or retarded?

[Chumby]

He was a Naval Academy graduate. Nuclear engineering. When the TMI incident happened, he had an idea of the issue. Not a fan of Carter but thought him visiting Harrisburg while the situation was still causing public panic was presidential.

[Moonrocks]

Wasn’t their excuse for reducing capacity the reduced demand because of lockdowns? What were they doing with those cars for the last two years?

[Union of Concerned Socks]

many municipalities are regressing into full-blown panic and reimposing mitigation measures.

Dear Democrats,

The M-word isn’t masks, and it isn’t mitigation, and it isn’t mandates.

It’s midterms. And you’re fucked.

[dbruce]

That’s what they said last time….lost by 9 million.

[soldiermedic76]

You’re not very bright are you?

[dbruce]

I am sorry, I was way off……Democrats won the popular vote in the House by the largest margins since the Watergate scandal and resignation of Republican President Richard Nixon, according to an analysis by NBC News.
The analysis found Democrats led Republicans in House races by a whopping 8.6 million votes in 2018 midterms. NBC News reports that number is the largest margin that Democrats have defeated Republicans in a midterm House election since 1974.

[R Mac]

It’s a parody.

[BigT]

The 2022 election will be more like 2010.

[Ken Shultz]

The Capitol riot was an unimportant event, even while it was happening, and its significance in the real world has diminished over time. Democrats and their sympathizers try to keep it alive as a moral panic–because they have almost no popular issues of their own. They’re getting pwned on crime, inflation, foreign policy, and almost every other issue I can think of–with the exception of maybe abortion.

If you think the Democrats want to focus on the Capitol riot all these news cycles later, you’re nuts. They’re coming across to average Americans like a cross between Joe McCarthy and a conspiracy theorist–amid an explosion of inflation and crime. They’d rather be talking about what a great job they’re doing with crime and the economy, but they can’t–so they talk about the Capitol riot instead.

Oh, and the left wing media still can’t seem to understand what Manchin means when he says no.

“Manchin sounds in absolutely no rush to move ahead on the social spending bill.”

—-Politico, December 13, 2021

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bJP1NpxjFU

[chemjeff radical individualist]

The Capitol riot was an unimportant event

Premise: false

[R Mac]

It almost ruined democracy as we know it!

[Don't look at me!]

I’m literally still shaking.

[Mother's Lament]

It was horrible.
Planned on a lego set, deadly flags and fire extinguishers, AOC almost killed from a distance, poo on the floor, zip-ties for capturing Pence, a truck containing a rifle and ammo several miles away, and dozens of other imaginary things that didn’t actually happen.

[Ken Shultz]

I don’t know what was said, but it sounds like it must have been about reds under the bed!

“The Red Scare (1947-57) was a decade-long period of intense anti-communist paranoia in the United States. During this period, millions of ordinary Americans were paralysed by an irrational fear of ‘Reds under the bed’ – the belief that thousands of communist agents and sympathisers were secretly living amongst them, plotting or waiting to overthrow the government.”

https://alphahistory.com/coldwar/reds-under-the-bed/

The January 6 committee is the House Unamerican Activities Committee all over again.

Are you now or have you ever been a communist?

[Ken Shultz]

These people became laughing stocks.

[Mother's Lament]

The purpose of propaganda like chemjeff’s isn’t to convince us. It’s to demonstrate that they can lie with impunity and no fear of repercussion.

The January 6 official narrative is a display of power meant to frustrate and intimidate freethinkers.

[Chumby]

The Jan 6 riot is a red herring.

[Fats of Fury]

You know who else is a Red Herring?
tinyurl.com/2p98tt2u

[Mike Laursen]

“I don’t know what was said…”

That is correct. chemjeff said absolutely nothing about “reds under the bed”.

[Don't look at me!]

Whoosh.

[R Mac]

Poor Dee.

[I, Woodchipper]

they almost installed a whole new government!

[Ken Shultz]

For goodness’ sake, they ask Manchin if he’s ready to throw towel in on his opposition to the BBB budget reconciliation bill, and he answers with how concerned he is about paying down the debt.

LOL

He couldn’t be shutting them down any more effectively if he just gave them the finger. I don’t know what they can offer Manchin at this point that will give him more for his West Virginia constituency than he’s getting by being the thorn in Biden’s side.

He already brought them plenty of pork with the infrastructure bill.

[Joe Friday]

Doofus, Manchin’s WV constituency – not the wealthiest demographic in the country – will receive beaucoup benefits from BBB and most of those are popular across party lines of voters.

[Earth-based Human Skeptic]

Yeah, how stupid can people be not to want all the personal government grift they can get, and instead act on some higher principles.

[Ken Shultz]

In the case of the BBB budget reconciliation bill, they want a senator from coal mining country to seal the doom of coal forever. If Dee is suggesting that the Green New Deal provisions in Biden’s BBB budget reconciliation bill are in the interests of West Virginia’s coal minders, she’s delusional or stupid. And, incidentally, telling coal miners that the government destroying their industry is in their own best interests is exactly the kind of elitism we’re talking about. The story is different everywhere else in the country, where the progressives are pushing the Green New Deal provisions in Biden’s BBB budget reconciliation bill specifically because they’ll destroy what’s left of the coal industry.

[Don't look at me!]

They can learn to code.

[Cronut]

They’re always popular with voters, until you tell voters how much they’re going to cost and who’s going to end up paying for them. Which, hint, is not the “1%.”

[Union of Concerned Socks]

By “beaucoup benefits”, do you mean a reduced share of the Federal debt, or do you mean greater protection of individual rights?

Those are what you’re referring to, right?

[soldiermedic76]

They’re popular until you explain them to people, then not so much.

[BigT]

WV is practically an anti-fossil fuel state.

Not.

Trump won WV bigly (68.6 to 29.7%), and in ’22 the Heffalumps will beat that margin. By a lot.

[Michael Ejercito]

Talking about the Capitol riot inevitable puts focus on their reaction to the riots in Minneapolis, Portland, and Kenosha.

I concur with Jack Marshall when he wrote,

First and foremost, anyone who did not condemn all of the George Floyd/Jacob Blake/Breonna Taylor/ Black Lives Matters rioting that took place this summer and fall is ethically estopped from criticizing this episode.That means I can, and will, condemn it as stupid, useless, self-destructive and anti-democratic violence, but most Democrats, progressives and media pundits cannot.

[Ken Shultz]

And I blame all of it, the Capitol riot and the rioting over the summer of 2020, on the pandemic, the economic collapse, and the lockdowns. We have never seen so many Americans lose so many jobs so quickly, and it would be unreasonable not to expect social unrest under those conditions. People in those situations look for some means to rationalize their behavior. A very small minority of people on the right may have gone over the top because the election results, but all those rioters in Portland and elsewhere would have rioted over something else if it hadn’t been for George Floyd, too. And it’s really pathetic that the Democrats haven’t learned anything from this. I’m not convinced that the crime wave isn’t related to the economic downturn in the real economy and the long term consequences lockdowns, too–and here they are revving up to initiate lockdown orders again.

[Chumby]

Yes. And paying people to stay at home doesn’t mean they won’t engage in freelance wealth redistribution due to government funded “my time.” Folks that come home tired from a full day’s work have self-esteem and less energy.

[Ken Shultz]

+1

It’s been the same way going back to the Roman empire. Giving idle ex-soldiers and Romans bread and circuses didn’t stop them from causing all kinds of trouble either. The Gracci brothers and their reforms were not the solution to violence. They became instigations.

[Commenter_XY]

And it’s really pathetic that the Democrats haven’t learned anything from this.

To the contrary, Team D learned quite a lot. They have learned they can walk all over us.

[Ken Shultz]

The backlash happens at election time, and it will be devastating.

What do you think the chances are of the Democrats holding the House and the Senate in 2022?

What do you think Biden or Kamala’s chances are of winning reelection in 2024?

Payback is a bitch, and she’s coming to the polls in 2022.

[Mike Laursen]

“What do you think the chances are of the Democrats holding the House and the Senate in 2022?”

It’s a toss up. It was more of a sure bet for the Republicans to take back Congress, but then they succeeded in bringing Roe v Wade in front of the Supreme Court — that may energize Democratic support when it comes to election time.

[Don't look at me!]

People only care about abortion.
Right.

[JesseAz]

Two thirds of voters agree on restrictions after the first trimester dummy.

[Bill Godshall]

If the SCOTUS strikes down Roe v Wade in June (when it is expected to issue its ruling on Mississippi ban on abortions after 15 weeks), the GOP could very well snatch defeat from the jaws of victory (as the same women and many men who voted for Biden in 2020 will vote for Democrats in state and federal races in 2022 and 2024 who promise to keep abortion legal or enact a federal statute to do so).

[JesseAz]

Stop reading CNN and look at actual polls. Abortion on demand at anytime is largely hated. Vast majority believe in regulation after the first trimester.

[soldiermedic76]

Yes because abortion trumps supply issues, inflation, disastrous foreign policies and gun control (Biden just now demanded more gun control because of Sandy Hook that happened 9 years ago).

[BigT]

Sadly, it does.

If SCOTUS overturns Roe vs Wade, you will have millions of angry womyn folk marching, shouting, demonstrating, menstruating, and worse. This could very well be the issue that moves a great number of women who hate the school takeover by the Donkeys back to team Blew. RvW is a much more important issue than gun control to light blue women.

If SCOTUS makes a narrow ruling, then it might not be a big deal.

[JesseAz]

Again look at polls, not Twitter and stay away from the leading ones. See when people agree regulations should exist.

[Commenter_XY]

Ken, we will see. The stars appear aligned for Team R. But I have noticed Team R has an uncanny ability to do politically incompetent things are the wrong time and snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

I think POTUS Biden has a 70% chance of re-election, assuming he survives and/or is not incapacitated.

[Mike Laursen]

“And I blame all of it, the Capitol riot and the rioting…”

And not any blame placed on the personal agency of the people who rioted, or the people who spurred them on (such as Donald J. Trump).

[JesseAz]

Holy fuck. You contradicted yourself in the same post.

Did they have free agency or did trump make them do it? Difficulty. Riots started before the speech ended.

[Fats of Fury]

I blame you and your fellow pants shitters.

[Bill Godshall]

The covid pandemic is being unfairly blamed for all of the problems created by Fauci, Birx, CDC, WHO, left wing Democrat politicians, mass media propagandists and social media moguls (who advocated/imposed the unscientific and disastrous totalitarian lockdowns, then mask mandates, then vaccine mandates, then mask mandates for the vaccinated, then booster mandates, all while censoring truth telling dissenters.

New CDC analysis of 43 omicron cases found that vaccinated Americans were 5 times more likely to contract the omicron variant than those who previously had covid (i.e. due to natural immunity), and that Americans who had a covid booster were twice as likely to contract the omicron variant than those who were fully vaccinated (but didn’t get a booster).

https://www.wsj.com/articles/omicron-covid-19-cases-in-u-s-mostly-mild-so-far-cdc-data-show-11639163980?mod=Searchresults_pos1&page=1
“Out of 43 cases identified between Dec. 1 and Dec. 8, nearly 80% of the people infected with Omicron were fully vaccinated, according to CDC data, and one-third had received a booster shot. Fourteen percent of the people had a previous Covid-19 infection. Patients most commonly reported mild symptoms like cough, fatigue, congestion or runny nose, the CDC said. Nearly 60% of cases were in people 18 to 39 years old.”

[Bill Godshall]

But of course, the CDC never mentioned their key finding (that covid vaccines and boosters aren’t effective at reducing new omicron infections, and that natural immunity still provides strong immunity).

Instead, CDC continued to urge everyone to get a vaccine or booster and to wear a mask.

According to CDC estimates, 50% of Americans had contracted in 2020, and another 25% of Americans likely contracted it in 2021.
So while about 75% of Americans have already had covid, just 14% of these 43 omicron patients had previously had covid.

[Bill Godshall]

Amazingly, nobody at CDC or the news media has pointed out that CDC’s new data found 30% of those infected with omicron had received a covid booster shot (and that just 16% of Americans have received a covid booster).

[Sometimes a Great Notion]

Pandemic + lack policing. If Portland and the rest had clamped down on lawless looting, then you’d probably see less of these brazen smash and grabs robberies. People got used to no consequences for thefts and are acting accordingly.

[Mike Laursen]

“but most Democrats, progressives and media pundits cannot.”

None of which is chemjeff. Or me. Or other libertarians here who condemn the January 6th MAGA riots.

[Don't look at me!]

LOL

[JesseAz]

Fucking hilarious.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Let’s review a little bit what Ken had to say about the Capitol riot:

https://reason.com/2021/01/06/trump-tweets-about-mike-pences-betrayal-while-his-supporters-force-the-v-p-to-evacuate-the-capitol/?comments=true#comment-8677733

And since we aren’t about to have any voice that matters in policy anymore, I’m kinda rooting for the disrupters.

They need a little preview of what the reaction to their agenda will look like. Our only hope may be this kind of disruption.

Biden’s agenda will be voted on in his first 100 days. The rest of the time, between then and November of 2022 will be arguing about Biden’s laws after the fact. We need to reverse that equation–so that the disruption and dissent happens before and during Biden’s first 100 days. 120 days from now, the damage will already be done.

Protesting after the fact is too late.

Summary: Ken is objectively pro-riot

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Here’s another goodie:

https://reason.com/2021/01/06/republicans-white-house-aides-beg-trump-to-call-off-maga-occupation-of-capitol/?comments=true#comment-8677969

I’m right there with them. The agenda outlined on Biden’s campaign website is entirely unacceptable. Storming congress before it’s instituted makes a lot more sense than waiting until after it’s been passed.

Summary: Ken favors mob violence in order to stop Team Blue

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Seems as though Ken has changed his tune.

He was pro-riot when he thought the riot could be used to thwart the Team Blue agenda, with violence if necessary.

But since it didn’t, he has to try to memory-hole the Jan. 6 riot as “unimportant”. For the same reason that Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham wanted Trump to try to stop the riot – because it makes Team Red look bad.

Having failed to use violence to stop the peaceful transition of power, now Ken wants to claim that the violence, which he supported, was unimportant. How convenient.

[Don't look at me!]

Cry more, loser.

[Joe Friday]

Points at scoreboard:

81 million – 74 million

[Chumby]

Taliban 1 – Biden 0

[Union of Concerned Socks]

Driving through Pennsylvania these days is a hoot, with the billboards showing Biden in a turban shouldering an RPG launcher with the caption “Make the Taliban Great Again!” Fucking genius.

[dbruce]

Are you talking about the “1” the U.S. envoy chosen by President Donald Trump, Zalmay Khalilzad, has publicly confirmed that he requested and secured the release of senior Taliban official Abdul Ghani Baradar from prison in Pakistan ahead of negotiations to end the war in Afghanistan? Then there is the 5,000 Taliban fighters released that Bone Spurs doesn’t like to talk about.

[Chumby]

Unilaterally extending the agreed exit date to facilitate an ego boosting photo op event on Sept 11.

Ignoring the intelligence.

Belligerently talking down to a reporter when questioned about the actual intelligence.

Choosing to withhold key information from allied nations helping the US. British parliament voted to condemn him for this.

Abandoning the two airstrip, easier to defend and not in the population center Bagram in the middle of the night without informing friendlies. In addition to resulting in 5,000 high risk inmates going free, including Al Qaida and ISIS (one of who later was reported as being the suicide bomber that killed dozens at the botched evacuation including US servicemen).

Abandoning caches of military equipment for the Taliban to pick up. Some may have ended up in China and/or Russia for evaluation.

Claiming the Taliban would not take over when that was already occurring.

Via Blinken, stating there would be no Saigon moment where pictures showed it to be almost identical.

Drone strike murdering an aid worker, children and other innocent people.

Taking a vacation when much of Afghanistan was taken back by the Taliban and Kabul had been surrounded.

Checking his watch at Dover AFB when receiving the bodies of the fallen US soldiers that had been killed by the suicide bomber he ostensibly let free. The ones trying to defend HKIA instead of the easier and two airstrip Bagram.

Providing the Taliban with information regarding the Americans he had abandoned in Afghanistan. With humility.

Chaffing/redirecting that he was following Trump’s plan. Then switching to “Nobody knew.” Next to blaming the locals. Then going for “That was four days ago” before crossing back over to blaming Trump.

[BigT]

Most of that is ‘inside baseball’ that the unwashed public doesn’t know about or doesn’t care about. Inflation and Covid are the 2 issues that drive people crazy.

[Bill Godshall]

The only two policy advantages the Democrats have going for them are keeping abortion legal and legalizing weed, both libertarian policies.

Although support for weed legalization has been increasing among Republican politicians, the Puritan Christians (aka Conservatives) who control the GOP in red states continue to oppose legalizing weed (and campaign to ban abortion).

[Fats of Fury]

Except the democrats only purpose is legalizing weed it to tax it, some places so heavily that people still use the black market. I agree with you regarding the stupid party, but lifelong prohibitionist John Boehner(R) is now the voice of big pot.

[CE]

Dems control Congress and the White House. No action at all on those issues so far.

[Mike Laursen]

“The Capitol riot was an unimportant event”

The Capitol riot was an attempt to interfere with the peaceful, democratic transition of power from one Presidential administration to the next Presidential administration. That is not “unimportant”.

[JesseAz]

Keep the narrative alive Mike. Need to justify authoritarianism somehow.

[Fats of Fury]

January 6th was the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Shit your pants more.

[BigT]

Somewhat peaceful. Breaking and entering is not exactly peaceful, and destruction of property and stealing stuff ain’t legal either.

The damned riot was a disgrace. All people of good conscience will agree.

Now do Antifa BLM riots. Note any differences?

[JesseAz]

You mean entering. The doors were largely opened without damage. See footage released a month ago.

There is a reason the dema and DoJ are not releasing videos.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

So let’s review.

Those right-wing media personalities – Sean Hannity, Laura Ingraham, etc. – who urged Mark Meadows to tell Trump to try to more forcefully stop the Jan. 6 riot, why did they do it?

Did they urge him to try to stop the riot because they believed it was wrong for rioters to disrupt the peaceful transition of power?

Did they urge him to try to stop the riot because they were aghast at the vandalism and property damage at the US Capitol building?

No, of course not.

They urged him to try to stop the riot because IT MADE TRUMP AND REPUBLICANS LOOK BAD.

It is sickening and disgusting. It is literally party over country.

These people are literally paid party propagandists. They are bootlickers and throne sniffers. They are contemptible.

[Don't look at me!]

Cry more, loser.

[Joe Friday]

Points at scoreboard:

81 million – 74 million

[Chumby]

Pope 3 – Biden dropped a deuce

[Don't look at me!]

And absolutely no voters remorse amongst the “81 million”.

[Mother's Lament]

And yet you look at those numbers and say “totally legit”.

That’s an increase of a whopping 26 million voters, and all for old Joe.

2016 – 62.9 million – 65.8 million
2012 – 65.9 million – 60.9 million
2008 – 69.4 million – 59.9 million

“B-b-b-b-but they got the vote out, bussing and shit”

26 million worth? A massive 20% increase? An additional 11 million of those votes suddenly appearing out of nowhere at 4 am? Reversing a 150 year trend?

That didn’t happen with Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, FDR, Kennedy, Nixon, Reagan, Clinton or Obama, but Joe Fucking Biden.

There was a coup on January 6 all right but the protesters had nothing to do with it.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

DJT got the second most votes in history for a candidate for President and lost. 5 million more votes than the 3rd place when Obama beat McCain by 10 million votes and an increase of 12 million votes over his previous run.

Joe Biden got 15M more votes than Hillary and 12M more than Obama.

The 2020 election produced 27 million more votes than ever before seen. Yet Trump only lost by 42,000 votes in 3 states. The idea that fraud could have changed the election is not even remotely far-fetched.

That being said, by hook or by crook, Biden won. His side had the vast majority of the media and and a base that was willing to do anything to win. Trump’s most dedicated proved they could be shot in the face with impunity.

[dbruce]

Crosscheck PURGED an astonishing 7,264,422 suspects in 2016, yet we found no more than four perpetrators who have been charged with double voting or deliberate double registration.
Some states have dropped out of Crosscheck, citing problems with its methodology, as Oregon’s secretary of state recently explained: “We left [Crosscheck] because the data we received was unreliable.”
In 2016
Trump victory margin in Michigan:                    13,107
Michigan Crosscheck purge list:                       449,922
Trump victory margin in Arizona:                       85,257
Arizona Crosscheck purge list:                           270,824
Trump victory margin in North Carolina:        177,008
North Carolina Crosscheck purge list:              589,393

[bignose]

That’s an increase of a whopping 26 million voters, and all for old Joe.

No, Trump’s vote count went up by 11.2 million in 2020. Assuming for the sake of argument that nobody switched parties in 2020 and those voters are all newcomers, that would mean that 42% of them went for Trump. Of course that’s a vastly oversimplified take, but that appears to be the game we’re playing here so let’s continue.

“B-b-b-b-but they got the vote out, bussing and shit”

No, the main culprit is likely the increased ease of mail-in voting due to COVID.

26 million worth? A massive 20% increase?
Yes and no. The more useful statistic here is the change in % turnout among eligible voters between 2020 and 2016, which is +5.5%. That’s still large, but not earth-shattering. If you insist on measuring just the percent difference in votes cast between election years, you only need to go back to 2004 to see another roughly 20% increase.

An additional 11 million of those votes suddenly appearing out of nowhere at 4 am?
“Out of nowhere”? Nope, that’s not what happened.

There was a coup on January 6 all right but the protesters had nothing to do with it.
Nope, that didn’t happen either.

[Mother's Lament]

“Nope, that didn’t happen either”

The coup or the iNsurrEction?

“Out of nowhere”? Nope, that’s not what happened.

Alright, explain.

[bignose]

The coup or the iNsurrEction?
Neither. There was no coup on 11/4/2020, there was no coup on 1/6/2021.

As for “11 million votes appearing out of nowhere at 4am”, I assume that you’re talking about the blue shift that happened (as predicted) once mail-in and absentee ballots started to be counted in certain states. Or did you mean something else?

[Mother's Lament]

“The more useful statistic here is the change in % turnout among eligible voters between 2020 and 2016, which is +5.5%.”

The hell it is. The more useful statistic here is 155 million votes verses an average of 128 million for the last quarter century.
And mail-in doesn’t even begin to cover that discrepancy. Vote fraud is Occam’s Razor here, and even an idiot would see that.

[bignose]

The hell it is.
If you want to do an actual apples-to-apples comparison across time, yes it actually is.

The more useful statistic here is 155 million votes verses an average of 128 million for the last quarter century.
Actually, the average vote count from 1992-2016 is 115 million (you’re welcome). During that time, the difference in the popular vote between consecutive elections has had upward and downward swings. Was the 19% increase in votes cast in 2004 the result of election fraud? What about the 14% increase in 1992?

And mail-in doesn’t even begin to cover that discrepancy.
Not alone, no, the usual things like the economy, etc. factor in as they always do. Elections are extremely complicated things, and attempting to figure out why 155 million people make the choices that they do is tricky. But, like anything else, if you make something less difficult to do more people are going to do it. No nefarious overlords necessary, just normal human laziness.

Vote fraud is Occam’s Razor here, and even an idiot would see that.
My explanation is that voter turnout was increased by (among other things) the fact that a significantly higher number people could cast a ballot without getting off their couch. Yours appears to be that either tens of thousands of undetected fraudulent votes were cast in precisely the states Biden needed to win OR that a massive conspiracy with no guarantee of success was undertaken by election officials knowing that getting caught would likely earn them at least a decade behind bars. Gonna have to say that my explanation is the simpler one.
Also, if we’re using Occam’s Razor then our two prospective explanations ought to have roughly equal evidence behind them. That mail-in voting was greatly expanded in many states is not disputed. Proof of election fraud or massive voter fraud has yet to be discovered, despite conspiracy theorists having had ample time to do so. I’m sure that proof is just around the corner, though.

[dbruce]

I wonder how CROSSCHECK would enter into your fraud post?

[Fats of Fury]

He won the poopular vote.

[R Mac]

Lol. Keep going Jeffy!

[sarcasmic]

I still remember when I stopped listening to talk radio. It right after the Republican primary. Leading up to it the talk show hosts were somewhat critical of all the candidates. You know, pointing out what they got right and where they were wrong. Then the day Trump got the nomination he could literally do no wrong. He was the best candidate ever, was right on every policy, every embarrassing thing he said was to be defended, it was pathetic. It showed that, like you said, they’re just propagandists for the Republican party. No objectivity at all.

(cue the tu quoque brigade to whine and cry about how the rest of the media is a literal arm of the Democrat Party)

[Mother's Lament]

How about we instead chuckle about how sarcasmic has become a literal arm of the Democrat Party.

Oh, and ffs go look up what “tu quoque” means before you make an even bigger fool of yourself.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

Because the Republicans backed the candidate who won their nomination process they had the opportunity to provide guidance on 3 SCOTUS Justices. That seems like a pretty objective win to me.

[JesseAz]

And this episode of “things lies about” is brought to you by beast ice.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

And it is noteworthy, that all the people who continually say to me WHY DON’T YOU CRITICIZE THE LEFT MORE OFTEN, are absolutely silent when their right-wing propagandist heroes are caught literally putting party over country, and are revealed to have tried to persuade Mark Meadows to tell Trump to attempt to stop the riot not because they thought it was objectively bad, but because it made their team look bad.

Where are the right-wingers here condemning Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham? Hmm? Why can’t they criticize their Team Red heroes?

[sarcasmic]

Where are the right-wingers when Reason runs an article critical of Biden, but doesn’t include equal criticism of Republicans?

I mean, if Reason can’t say “Boo” about Republicans without being expected to give equal criticism to the left, why doesn’t it go both ways?

[JesseAz]

For someone who claims they’ve muted everyone they disagree with, you sure do state what they say a lot. Granted it is all strawman arguments.

But I thought you only discussed ideas?

[JesseAz]

You never criticize the left. Just sarc does.

I mean for fucks sake both of you yesterday claimed you thought the left was worse. And not even a day later your energy is fully only attacking the right.

Unlike you assholes everyone here condemned jan 6th the day it fucking happened.

You’ve continued to defend the over reaction by the left to those riots while having defended blm riots for months.

You are such dishonest lovers.

[JesseAz]

Auto correct called you gay, not me. I typed losers. But ill accept the change.

[BigT]

Did they urge him to try to stop the riot because they were aghast at the vandalism and property damage at the US Capitol building?

No, of course not.

I’m glad you know what goes on in the heads of Hannity and Ingraham. I’m sure they were aghast at the riot and ALSO realized it was a bad photo op.

[Michael Ejercito]

Has the media forgotten the advertised reason for COVID-19 restrictions?

It was to buy time for hospitals to prepare to peak COVID-19 hospitalizations.

Twenty-one months is far more than enough time.

Middlebury College in Vermont, which is 99 percent vaccinated, is immediately moving to remote instruction and told students to leave campus immediately if possible. They will take all of their final exams online, and all athletic games and social events are canceled. Students who are stuck on campus may not eat in the cafeteria: All meals will be grab-and-go. Mask wearing is required and will be militantly enforced.

If Middlebury College is behaving as if vaccines do not work, this begs one question.

What do they know about vaccines that we do not?

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

Has the media forgotten the advertised reason for COVID-19 restrictions?

No. They just hope that we have.

[R Mac]

Meh, they don’t care if we have or not. We’re fully into the FYTW stage of this.

[Brandybuck]

My California county already has a permanent mask mandate. So the new California mandate means little to me. I already engage in pointless masking because I’m fully vaccinated. My company also requires it anyway.

Still, when the overwhelming majority of California counties act as if we’re long past the pandemic (I ran across a food worker without a mask in a restaurant, in Fresno County, WTF?), maybe we’re past the pandemic. Newsom has too much power.

Is Omicron more deadly? It definitely spreads much faster, so fast it’s started to crowd out Delta (R6). But from all data, infections are less severe. More on the order of original Covid-19, not the more virulent Delta. Vaccinated people can catch it, but so far no vaccinated people have been hospitalized for Omicron. (The same cannot be said for unvaccinated).

Sidenote: Get vaccinated people. The quickest way past this bullshit is for everyone to get vaccinated who can. Otherwise YOU are adding another two years to the bullshit as we wait for a few hundred thousand more to die. You have the right to not vaccinate, but you do not have a right to impose your risk on others. Don’t like Pfizer? Get Moderna. There are choices out there.

[R Mac]

“Sidenote: Get vaccinated people.”

Really? I hadn’t heard that suggestion before. Thanks!

[Brandybuck]

Crazy how people haven’t heard that before. They must be playing their podcasts too loud.

For those of you afraid that the vaccines are full of Bill Gates microchips, I will be happy to come over with a strong neodymium magnet and remove them from your dose.

[JesseAz]

Hey. A strawman the asshole uses to feel superior. While he continues to live in California and their authoritarian shit. Lol.

Such an ignorant loser brandy.

[R Mac]

The joke: I think the vaccines have microchips in them. Not funny to me, but everyone has their tastes.

The reality: Brandy repeated the same government propaganda I hear during almost every commercial break when watching TV or listening to the radio, and she got so defensive I pointed that out, she felt the need to make a microchip joke.

On a libertarian comment board.

[dbruce]

https://www.historyofvaccines.org/timeline/all Never heard anyone say “I am not getting vaccinated, Polio is fake news”.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Polio is far deadlier and has far more severe effects than the coof, the polio vaccine was tested over several years, and its efficacy is so good that you only need one booster as an adult.

Boomers trying to compare polio and COVID consistently show how stupid they are.

[dbruce]

Testing efficiency has increased along the lines of computers, doubling every 18 months. How deadly it is actually refutes your statement. Dead people don’t go around to super spreaders except on the Walking Dead. The Bone Spurs effect in the US was affected by a leader who knew NOTHING about the virus and refused a comprehensive manual from the Obama admin. Funny, his grandfather died from the 1918 pandemic, yet the Stable Genius still calls it the 1917 pandemic even after being corrected hundreds of times.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

LOL, literally nothing in that WallOText refuted what I said.

[dbruce]

Sorry, EVERY vaccine needs a booster, even polio, except yellow fever. Most vaccines that do not contain a live, attenuated (weakened) virus, typically require multiple doses or boosters. The oral polio vaccine, although we no longer use the oral vaccine to prevent polio, at the time it was ground-breaking with longer lasting immunity that lent itself beautifully for mass vaccination. I actually received both the shot and the sugar cube booster.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Sorry, EVERY vaccine needs a booster

Not every 3-6 months, they don’t.

[dbruce]

A COVID booster shot is an additional dose of a vaccine given after the protection provided by the original shot(s) has begun to decrease over time. Typically, you would get a booster after the immunity from the initial dose(s) naturally starts to wane. The booster is designed to help people maintain their level of immunity for longer.

[MT-Man]

wow

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

The quickest way past this bullshit is for everyone to get vaccinated who can.

Do you really believe that? Do you believe the politicians will just cheerfully give up the juicy new powers they’ve acquired? And the busybody Karens who get off on scolding their neighbors–what will they do with themselves?

And I wonder: what percentage of the population must be vaxxed before we reach this nirvana? And when will the definition of “vaccinated” finally stabilize?

[Joe Friday]

Enjoy, take a pill for your paranoia. In April – prior to the deadly Delta variant and the stupid MAGA anti-vaxxing movement beginning to squelch vaccine rates – both the CDC and Biden announced the loosening of recommendations for the vaccinated, including masking. Beyond the fact that no politician in his right mind wants to impose personal restrictions on voters, this disproves your idiotic conspiracy based paranoia.

Do your part or stay home.

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

Observing that politicians always try to hold on to power is not “paranoia”. It means I’ve read a few history books. You should try it.

Do you care to answer the question?

[Joe Friday]

I answered your post Enjoy with a an event that actually happened – look it up – and the illogic of your position that elected officials like imposing needlessly restrictive measures on their voters.

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

My bad, I didn’t specify which question. I was specifically referring to:
what percentage of the population must be vaxxed before we reach this nirvana? And when will the definition of “vaccinated” finally stabilize?

[Chumby]

Ask again later

So sayeth the Magic 8 Ball oracle

[Enjoy Every Sandwich]

But I think you need a better understanding of human nature. Many elected officials enjoy wielding power over others.

And don’t forget Rahm Emmanuel’s notion that a crisis should not be allowed to go to waste. It’s not paranoid to observe that many in power would like to remake society, and see emergency situations (real or contrived) as excellent opportunities to press their agenda.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Enjoy, take a pill for your paranoia.

Someone hasn’t been paying attention the last 20-odd years.

[ElvisIsReal]

both the CDC and Biden announced the loosening of recommendations for the vaccinated, including masking.
—–
And, as always, they were following the POLITICAL science because people were rightly asking why they should get jabbed if they still have to wear the stupid mask that doesn’t work.

Then the political winds shifted again, and the masks came back.

[D-Pizzle]

Deadly = 0.2% mortality rate. Got it.

[Brandybuck]

> what percentage of the population must be vaxxed before we reach this nirvana?

Herd immunity. Which given the R factors of the latest mutations, somewhere around 90%.

The story was about California. Right now the threshold for the lockdown measures to go away is… 90% vaccination rate. We’re currently at 84% having had at least one dose. (Not sure if the threshold is for single our double dose).

But regardless, will the politicians give up power? Probably not. But that’s not excuse, politicians are followers not leaders. They go with the wind. Right now you conservatives pretend you are the majority. You are not. You’re just the noisiest. When the majority feels safe the lockdowns will end.

[Union of Concerned Socks]

Herd immunity.

No.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Right now you conservatives pretend you are the majority. You are not. You’re just the noisiest. When the majority feels safe the lockdowns will end.

LOL–the noisiest in all of this have been the Branch Covidians and their endless fear porn and goal-post shifting.

Go outside your blue-state bubble and you’ll find that the “majority” got over all this a long time ago. This is being driven by neurotic, hazard-averse left-liberals who are still operating under the fantasy that we can get to a COVID-free existence.

[JesseAz]

Notice he treats majority at a federal level too. He is a statist shit who can’t stand people disagreeing with California.

[ElvisIsReal]

And where in the world has seen the virus go away at 90% vax rate?

[MT-Man]

Brandy I don’t think it will be based on science just either it’s been long enough to forget which is scary since Joe F’s will fan the flames for a lot longer.

[JesseAz]

Do you buy every piece of bullshit fauci says?

[Eeyore]

Vaccinated will mean within the last N months.

Will it end anything? No.

[sarcasmic]

Do you believe the politicians will just cheerfully give up the juicy new powers they’ve acquired?

Cheerfully? No. Reluctantly? Yes. Not all of course. California is permafucked anyway. But where I live all mandates are over. No more masking, no more distancing, and businesses are all open. Get this, I live in a blue state too. Figure that one out.

[Don't look at me!]

That’s easy.
You are lying.

[Mike Laursen]

“Get this, I live in a blue state too. Figure that one out.”

Not possible. Ken says blue states are run by evil people.

[sarcasmic]

Not only run by evil people, but populated by evil people as well. Because anyone who votes for a Democrat is an evil, horrible person who is stupid, irrational, and impossible to reason with.

How do you save a country with tens of millions of people like that?

[JesseAz]

More ideas! Never talks about people.

Hypocrite.

[sarcasmic]

Did I say “people?” So sorry. Progressives aren’t people. Don’t know exactly what they are, but they sure as heck ain’t human beings.

[Eeyore]

Elder clumps of cells.

[sarcasmic]

Ah yes. When Nardz and Sevo go on their murder spree, killing their political opponents, it’s really just aborting clumps of cells in their [age plus one times three]ith trimester.

[MT-Man]

Mike that’s not fair to use that projection when you call others out on it. I totally get most of the rest of us doing that.

[Mike Laursen]

Projection? I’m straight-up quoting Ken.

[dbruce]

I don’t think we will ever find out what it takes because too many Bone Spur followers would rather die than do something that will make Biden look good.

[ElvisIsReal]

Still ignoring that minorities are the least likely to be vaxxed?

[Joe Friday]

False Elvis. Republicans are the least likely to be vaccinated and the reddest Trump counties have a Covid death rate per capita 5.7 times that of the bluest counties an it’s a single slope graph between.

Of Americans surveyed from Sept. 13-22, 72% of adults 18 and older had been vaccinated, including 71% of white Americans, 70% of Black Americans, and 73% of Hispanics. Contrast these converging figures with disparities based on politics: 90% of Democrats had been vaccinated, compared with 68% of Independents and just 58% of Republicans.

A Gallup survey released on Sept. 29 confirmed the KFF findings. As of mid-September, 75% of adult Americans have been vaccinated, including 73% of non-Hispanic white adults and 78% of non-whites. Along party lines, however, the breakdown was 92% of Democrats, 68% of Independents, and 56% of Republicans.

On death and red counties, here’s the chart.

Enjoy

https://twitter.com/charles_gaba/status/1470727799170347013/photo/1

[sarcasmic]

Shhhhhh! Don’t fuck up the narrative with facts!

[JesseAz]

Hey retard…

https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/issue-brief/latest-data-on-covid-19-vaccinations-by-race-ethnicity/

[ElvisIsReal]

Do the math on that right now and not during the seasonal summer spike. Hint: The data has shifted EXACTLY AS WE SAID IT WOULD when that stat was first shat onto the internet.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

Who is this “we”?

[JesseAz]

And here is the actual data you dumb mother fucker.

https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/issue-brief/latest-data-on-covid-19-vaccinations-by-race-ethnicity/

[soldiermedic76]

Still using outdated data?

[dbruce]

As of November 30, 2021, CDC reported that race/ethnicity was known for 70% of people who had received at least one dose of the vaccine. Among this group, nearly six in ten were White (58%), 10% were Black, 19% were Hispanic, 6% were Asian, 1% were American Indian or Alaska Native (AIAN), and <1% were Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander (NHOPI), while 6% reported multiple or other race.

[Don't look at me!]

The quickest way past this bullshit is for everyone to get vaccinated who can.

Read the story about the college in Vermont.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

Sidenote: Get vaccinated people. The quickest way past this bullshit is for everyone to get vaccinated who can.

I agreed with you up to here. And, for the record, I don’t believe people *shouldn’t* get vaccinated. Well, ok, let me clarify that. I don’t believe young people need to get vaccinated. I do believe old people and/or young people in high risk groups should be vaccinated. But if you believe getting vaccinated “gets us out of this”, you’re flat wrong.

[Mother's Lament]

Brandybuck got his degree in virology from the University of CNN, so he still thinks that Covid is like Polio or Smallpox, diseases with no animal reservoirs, which made it possible to isolate and eliminate the disease through immunity.
He hasn’t learned that Covid can infect every mammal on the planet so there’s always a reservoir and the disease will now never be eliminated.

[dbruce]

my problem is….Do you believe young unvaxed possibly having COVID don’t hug, kiss, etc their older Grannies, etc ? I believe COVID doesn’t care about age. It only cares about spreading and mutating. We know how to stop the spreading which in turn stops the mutating. Do you believe NOT vaxxing gets us out of this? Like you said in your last line ?

[Mother's Lament]

“but you do not have a right to impose your risk on others”

Like who? The vaccinated? Then what’s the point of being vaccinated?
This is like you insisting that I wear a jacket so that you don’t feel chilly.

[Joe Friday]

Doofus, covid is contagious if you haven’t heard and vaccines are highly effective but not perfect, it can be passed on by asypmtomatic individuals, and those who are not vaccinated are more likely to spread it (and die, but that’s their business and their family just as long as they don’t stay in the hospital very long).

Do you need a road map to figure this out?

[Mother's Lament]

At this point I’m 99% convinced you’re a parody.

[Joe Friday]

Powerful rebuttal Mother. Chumby would be proud.

[sarcasmic]

I put the Canadian fuckstain on mute a long time ago. It might think it’s clever with it’s personal jabs, but it’s really nothing but a tool.

[MT-Man]

Sarc – Joe isn’t anyone good.

[sarcasmic]

He’s wrong about most things, but he’s not a dick about it.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

A guy who completely ignores actual science despite being repeatedly schooled is being a dick about it. I understand that sarc can’t tell the difference.

[JesseAz]

How daft are you?

[Mother's Lament]

Looks like I’m the only one on trollboy’s official mute list today. Eat your hearts out Jesse, RMac, et al.

[JesseAz]

He named his list yesterday and only named me!

[Mother's Lament]

That was yesterday, this is today. You’re all washed up Jesse. Make way for the latest thing in mutees.

[Mother's Lament]

Rebuttal to what? You sort of agreed with me.

[dbruce]

I agree with Joe Friday, this is not rocket science.

[dbruce]

Where are these jackets that spread “chilly” to other people which could kill some of them ?

[BigT]

You have the right to not vaccinate, but you do not have a right to impose your risk on others.

Since vaxxed people can transmit the virus, isn’t everyone imposing their risk on others?

[dbruce]

Yes…it’s the no 1 reason everyone should vax, mask, test and distance. It’s like a basketball team, everyone has to play defense. Don’t be the one guy who doesn’t want to put out “D”.

[Brandybuck]

Regarding trans-women dominating women’s sports. There are three easy solutions:

1) Get rid of gendered sports divisions. Everyone competes together. Meaning men will overwhelmingly dominate in nearly every sport. Demonstrating that there is a difference in the sexes. Which the woke won’t accept.

2) Create divisions for trans-men and trans-women. This is the fairest, but means there won’t be enough members to field viable divisions.

3) All the woke tell me that sex and gender are not the same thing. So replace gendered sports divisions with sex based sports divisions. You compete in the division you belong to in terms of the sex you were both with.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

I largely agree, except separate competitions within a sport by “weight class” or other non-gendered athletic ability level.

[Mickey Rat]

It will not matter. Males are pound for pound stronger than females. Divinding by weight class will not alleviate the physical disparities.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

So to make it a fair competition, separate both men and women into separate “weight classes”.

[Don't look at me!]

HA HA HA !
You mean like it is now?

[Mother's Lament]

Lol.

[JesseAz]

Holy fuck jeff is dumb.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

I largely agree, except separate competitions within a sport by “weight class” or other non-gendered athletic ability level.

Men will dominate sports then.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

In the higher-level ability classes, yes I imagine so. Just like they do now.

So instead of dividing classes of competition along gender lines divide them along levels of ability, regardless of gender.

[Don't look at me!]

What a simpleton.

[JesseAz]

Participation trophy thinking from the obese kid always picked last.

[dbruce]

No, I do not want to see Bruce Jenner win and come back and win in the women event.

[dbruce]

McEnroe was discussing the Williams sisters and said if Williams “played the men’s circuit, she’d be like 700 in the world.”

[Mickey Rat]

3) will not be accepted without a lot of kicking and screaming, because when you press a woke ideologue on the distinction between sex and gender they will resist giving any weight to sex differences. Society should not act as if they matter, if they even exist (they do not want to acknowledge that sex differences exist, and may matter in certain situations). They are determined to make everyone talk and act as if reality is not real, if it contradicts their ideology.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

The difference in SEX is real and biological. Who denies this?
The point of contention is whether one’s SEX ought to determine one’s GENDER ROLE in society. Where is it written that because an individual has a penis, that this necessarily means the person must wear a necktie at a formal event? What is the connection between penis and neckties? It is purely socially constructed, having nothing to do with biology. Same for the connection between vagina and skirts.

[Don't look at me!]

What about penises and women’s locker rooms?

[Mickey Rat]

If no one denied that sex differences matter then Lia Thompson would not be allowed to compete jn a women’s division. The very existence of this story proves your assertion wrong.

[Ve-Ra]

Then he can be a man that wears dresses. Title IX, the main reason we have girls and boys sports, is based on sex-based discrimination. So a transgender woman competing on a college women’s sports team is saying my sex(not gender) is female. It all breaks down. Either gender is a social construct that doesn’t exist so we can easily fix it by as a society saying ok gender isn’t a thing and any sex can dress or act however they want and it doesn’t change the sex of the individual OR gender is not a social construct but based on our bodies so a person born with a male body is a male in both sex and gender because they are really the same thing.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

LOL! Jeffy hates neckties and wants to wear a kilt without judgement. Sounds like someone resents chaffing.

On a completely unrelated point, the first classification the human brain makes when encountering another human is ‘male or female’. This is not a social construct, it is hard wired from infancy. A lack of sexual characteristics causes subconscious anxiety as it interrupts the first impression right at the start.

Science!tists ignoring basic human biology is hilarious.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Jeffy hates neckties and wants to wear a kilt without judgement.

He didn’t want to look like a freak, so he bought the muumuu.

[Fats of Fury]

You don’t like how organizers run a formal event? Build your own formal event.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

2) Create divisions for trans-men and trans-women. This is the fairest, but means there won’t be enough members to field viable divisions.

Give it six more months. Trust me.

[I, Woodchipper]

3) All the woke tell me that sex and gender are not the same thing. So replace gendered sports divisions with sex based sports divisions. You compete in the division you belong to in terms of the sex you were both with.

So… back to the way it always was.

[BigT]

This has an easy solution. If you have a ‘Y’ chromosome you cannot participate in women’s sports regardless of what you call yourself.

[Sevo]

“California Reinstates Mask Mandate as Omicron Panic Devours Team Blue”

JFree hardest hit!

[Sevo]

As is the muted steaming pile of shit to whom EES is responding to above.
Fuck off and ddie, asshole.

[Joe Friday]

Your coprophilia is again noted Sevo. Try to not get any on ya’.

[Sevo]

With any kind of luck, the newest muted comment is from the same asshole.
Fuck off and die, shit pile. Make your family proud.

[Ken Shultz]

It shouldn’t get lost that Manchin may be saving the moderate Democrats from the progressives, too. He may be saving the Republican party from populism, too. Hear me out!

Populism in all its forms, from left to right, is always a reaction to elitism. The kind of elitism we’re talking about here is progressives forcing average Americans to sacrifice their standard of living for climate change, etc.–against their will.

The alternative to elitism is politicians responding to the desires of the voters, and Manchin is doing a really good job of that. Trump beat Biden by a roughly 70% to 30% margin in West Virginia, and Manchin may not be a Republican, but he knows what the people of West Virginia think of the Green New Deal and immigration provisions in Biden’s BBB budget reconciliation bill–and he’s opposing it for that reason.

Being responsive to the desires of your voters doesn’t require any principle beyond wanting to be reelected, but it’s a cold shower for populism. You may not feel like you need a populist to take on the elitists when you have an elected politician like Manchin fighting for what you want [against what you don’t want].

Populists need elitists in order to flourish, and to the extent that Manchin is blunting the ability of elitist progressives to inflict their policies on unwilling swing voters in swing states, he’s taking away the inertia behind more populist candidates in the Republican primaries.

There is still plenty of elitism in the progressive wing of the Democratic party to provoke a huge backlash against them in the 2022 midterms, but if Manchin manages to defeat the BBB budget reconciliation bill, or run out the clock, there won’t be as much of a push behind the populist wing of the Republican party in 2024.

[Joe Friday]

Ken confuses his minority opinion with the country’s:

“Turning to Washington, the president’s large spending plans remain broadly popular. Support for the Bipartisan Infrastructure deal (BIF), which was signed into law last month, stands at 66%, similar to November and down just a few points from prior polls. Support for the Build Back Better (BBB) plan to expand access to health care, college, paid leave and other services remains fairly steady at 61%. Furthermore, 56% of Americans support the climate change funding part of the BBB bill (compared with 60% in November). Partisan support for each of these three spending elements stands at 92%-95% among Democrats and at 56%-67% among independents. ”

https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/reports/monmouthpoll_us_120821/

[sarcasmic]

Ken’s opinion is the only opinion. Anyone who disagrees is an evil, horrible, stupid, irrational, need-to-die piece of dogshit whose opinion doesn’t matter.

[Mike Laursen]

Which is to say we are progressives. Ken says so, even though I haven’t expressed a single progressive opinion.

I don’t believe you have, either.

[sarcasmic]

It’s not what we say or do. It’s what we don’t say and do. We don’t go around saying “Fuck Joe Biden” like angry teenagers, we don’t condemn every BLM protester as a rioter, we don’t dismiss Jan 6 as mere tourism, we don’t cry about the election being stolen, and we don’t condemn people who get vaccinated.

That means we’re progressives. It’s the only explanation.

[JesseAz]

This is just embarrassing that you two stroke each other off complaining about len woth strawman faily.

[JesseAz]

God damn phone.

About Ken with strawman daily *

[Chumby]

The poll listed inflation as the second most important issue they/we are facing (behind covid). Ken nailed it.

[Joe Friday]

Nice knee pads you have on Chumby.

[Mother's Lament]

Fuck off troll, this isn’t your date night at sarcasmic’s.
Ken was right and Chumby simply agreed.

[Joe Friday]

Precious, Mother.
Isn’t that sweet?

[Mother's Lament]

Yeah, sort of. At first it was just sarcasmic flirting, but now it’s like “Get a room you crazy kids”.

[Chumby]

Just a room? Why they could rent a $500,000 house!

[Mother's Lament]

Why that’s a half a million dollars!

[Chumby]

Still in the original package. Yours seem all worn out and you are longing for another set?
You about to swallow your pride and ask me to give it to you?

[Joe Friday]

Keep you hands above the desk Chumby.

[Chumby]

Joe, I suggested you would ask but I didn’t say I would let you. You mad that most of your sloppy Joe recipients pull your hair?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Nice knee pads you have on Chumby.

Speaking from experience?

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

Nice knee pads you have on Chumby.

This is the guy Sarc claims is not a dick.

[JesseAz]

No kidding. Sarc is so broken.

[Chumby]

I’m moving up the rankings on Joe’s list too. Like AP and UPI.

[Bill Godshall]

Polls cannot objectively assess support/opposition to the Democrat’s massive spending bill because nobody has read the 4,000+ page bill, whose cost is $2+ Trillion more than Pelosi (and her left wing media propagandists) claim, while Biden has repeatedly claimed the bill would cost taxpayers “nothing”.

[Joe Friday]

Bill, that’s exactly what polls do.

[Dillinger]

polls are useless.

[Joe Friday]

Yeah Dillinger. let’s just listen to Ken’s bloviating to find out what Americans think.

[Dillinger]

I like Ken’s take on baseball and california punk rock.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

let’s just listen to Ken’s bloviating

Again, not a dick?

[sarcasmic]

Only when you don’t like the results. When you like the results they’re very useful.

[JesseAz]

Youre saying you are too stupid to read the questions of polls and understand their limitations? Is that really what you are saying?

[Bill Godshall]

Virtually every poll (many/most of which were conducted by Democrat supporters) predicted Hillary Clinton would win in a landslide in 2016.

[Ken Shultz]

Market data is a better indicator of where people are than polls, as well, because market data factors in the costs that people are willing to pay.

If you interview people waiting in the checkout line at Walmart on their views on trade with China, you’ll get one answer. If you look in their shopping carts for Chinese manufactured products, you’ll get the real answer.

The state of West Virginia has been devastated by the loss of coal jobs–mostly due to automation and fracking for natural gas. Polling them on the popularity of the Green New Deal after their communities have been impoverished by the loss of coal jobs is like polling the people of Haiti on the popularity of earthquakes.

Joe Manchin doesn’t need to read that poll to know what the people of West Virginia think about the Green New Deal, and any progressive who does is an idiot.

[Bill Godshall]

If Americans knew about just 10% of the policy changes and wasteful spending in Pelosi/Schumer/Biden’s BBB, the vast majority of Americans would vehemently oppose it.

But the lefty Dems and their media propagandists have been knowingly and intentionally lying to Americans about the massive policy changes and costs of BBB (which is the biggest expansion of federal government and socialism since FDR), which is why many/most Americans tell pollsters they support the bill.

[Bill Godshall]

In sum, polls about politicians and single issue policy changes are far more accurate and reliable than polls about a massive omnibus federal spending bills that contain thousands of different policy changes and that waste Trillions of taxpayer $$$$$$$$$$$$.

The entire purpose of massive omnibus federal spending bills is to hide the many policy changes and costs from Americans (most of whom rely upon bogus and exaggerated claims by politicians and media propagandists).

[Joe Friday]

That’s false Bill. Before Comey’s announcement 2 weeks before, she had a very comfortable lead but by election day she was predicted to win by 2-4% in national polls and she did.

State polls were not accurate.

Similarly, Biden won by the margin most national polls showed. Again state polls were not reliable.

[Bill Godshall]

Is that why all the lefties at CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, NYT, WaPo, etc were stunned and crying election night when Trump was declared the winner.

[Joe Friday]

No Bill, that was because the clear loser was the EC winner for the 2nd time in 16 years but only the 4th in our entire history. You can Comey for that.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Comey didn’t make The Wicked Witch of the Swamp neglect campaign efforts in the upper Midwest while trying to run up the popular vote score in the cities. The dumb bitch made the EXACT SAME mistake that she did against Obama in the 2008 primary.

[Joe Friday]

‘Hillary Clinton would probably be president if FBI Director James Comey had not sent a letter to Congress on Oct. 28. The letter, which said the FBI had “learned of the existence of emails that appear to be pertinent to the investigation” into the private email server that Clinton used as secretary of state, upended the news cycle and soon halved Clinton’s lead in the polls, imperiling her position in the Electoral College.

The letter isn’t the only reason that Clinton lost. It does not excuse every decision the Clinton campaign made. Other factors may have played a larger role in her defeat, and it’s up to Democrats to examine those as they choose their strategy for 2018 and 2020.

But the effect of those factors — say, Clinton’s decision to give paid speeches to investment banks, or her messaging on pocket-book issues, or the role that her gender played in the campaign — is hard to measure. The impact of Comey’s letter is comparatively easy to quantify, by contrast. At a maximum, it might have shifted the race by 3 or 4 percentage points toward Donald Trump, swinging Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin and Florida to him, perhaps along with North Carolina and Arizona. At a minimum, its impact might have been only a percentage point or so. Still, because Clinton lost Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin by less than 1 point, the letter was probably enough to change the outcome of the Electoral College.

….The story dominated news coverage for the better part of a week, drowning out other headlines, whether they were negative for Clinton (such as the news about impending Obamacare premium hikes) or problematic for Trump (such as his alleged ties to Russia). …”

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-comey-letter-probably-cost-clinton-the-election/

Of course Comey protected Trump by not announcing that Hillary wasn’t the only presidential candidate being investigated by the FBI at that time. That of course is inexplicable and created an advantage that MAGA idiots haven’t thanked him for yet.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

That post was classic copium from Nate for blowing the election prediction so badly.

[Chumby]

This is like people calling Tom Brady a cheater for The Tuck Rule. It was a rule. Just like the EC.

Air Force One Stairs: 1
Botcher Biden: 0

[Joe Friday]

Announcing FBI investigations of only one candidate when both were subjects was and is not the rule Chumby.

[Chumby]

So four years of investigating Trump along with two impeachment hearings wasn’t enough?

Trump: 1
Hillary: 0
Benghazi: -4

[Dillinger]

>>State polls were not accurate.

zero polls are accurate.

[dbruce]

If you add the margins of error, they are almost perfect.

[Ken Shultz]

And Manchin doesn’t need a poll in West Virginia to see what the people there think of the Green New Deal portions of the BBB budget reconciliation bill.

The people of West Virginia voted 70% to 30% against Biden, in no small part because of his support for the Green New Deal, and Joe Manchin doesn’t represent the American people.

Joe Manchin represents the people of West Virginia.

[Joe Friday]

Strike 2 Ken:

“Overall, a majority of Americans want action on climate. According to a newly released survey from Monmouth University, 60 percent of U.S. adults said that climate change was “very” or “extremely” important for the federal government to address. Furthermore, 56 percent of U.S. adults said climate change was a “very serious” problem — up from 41 percent in the same poll in December 2015. A recent study from Pew Research Center found that 60 percent of U.S. adults said they were worried about the personal impacts of climate change.

Republican lawmakers have become slightly more open to climate proposals, but there’s still a big partisan divide on the issue. Monmouth found only 30 percent of Republicans said they supported government action on climate change, versus 92 percent of Democrats. A Gallup survey released earlier this week yielded similar results. Combining survey data from 2017 to 2021, Gallup found that 65 percent of U.S. adults said they “worry a great deal” or a “fair amount” about global warming. Among Democrats, that number jumped to 91 percent; among Republicans, it was only 32 percent. ..”

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-want-the-government-to-act-on-climate-change-whats-the-hold-up/

[sarcasmic]

I’m sure he’s got you on mute. Anyone who disagrees with him, contradicts him, or takes his words to their logical conclusion gets muted.

[Joe Friday]

His loss sarcasmic.

[sarcasmic]

Just means I don’t reply to what I don’t read. The master baiters do their best with their lies to tempt me into correcting them, but I don’t. I figure anyone who reads their words and believes them doesn’t read what I write, so fuck ’em. And anyone who does read what I write can see the trolls are full of shit.

[MT-Man]

Full disclosure I’ve muted Joe too. He’s worthless.

[sarcasmic]

I haven’t. Yet. I don’t agree with the guy most of the time, but he can have a debate without calling people names, accusing people of saying or doing things they never said nor did, insulting their families, quoting them out of context, and all the other crap that those I have on mute do all the time.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

he can have a debate without calling people names

Sarc ‘doesn’t agree with’ Joe yet defends him once again. And lies to boot. Joe calls people names all the time.

[Ken Shultz]

If Joe isn’t Dee, he has the same problems as Dee.

He doesn’t seem to care whether his facts are true or false. He doesn’t seem to care whether what he says is rational or irrational. He doesn’t seem to care whether he’s wrong or right.

What’s the point of reading comments written by someone like that?

[sarcasmic]

How would you know? You mute anyone who disagrees with you.

[soldiermedic76]

How long is your enemies/mute list by now sarcastic?

[Joe Friday]

Ken, it is not possible for facts to be false.

If you have a brain, use it and criticize the substance of what others post. This isn’t junior high.

[Bill Godshall]

What percentage of the folks who checked the “more action on climate change” box on the survey actually want the price of gasoline, heating, electricity, cars and all other carbon based industries to double, triple or quadruple in the next several year(s)?

Surveys that ask people about getting more government freebies (while failing to inform respondents about the costs, tax hikes, and inflation caused by the new freebies) are dishonest, and little more than lobbying tools.

[Joe Friday]

Maybe Bill, but the intelligent voters – and by education Democrats clearly beat Trump Republicans – want investments in the new technologies that will replace carbon based sources while we can still afford it. China is taking over the field.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

China is taking over the field

Haha, China is one of the most polluted countries on the planet.

[Chumby]

Thankfully, the coal plants they are building will address that.

[Joe Friday]

Irrelevant to their taking over manufacturing of green technologies Red, and by the way, we are worse polluters on a per capita basis and our accumulated carbon deposits – they last almost forever – from the industrial revolution onward is a level China is not close to overtaking.

[Chumby]

What is this “we” shit? I’m carbon neutral. Clean up your own house before Karening others.

China leads the world in manufacturing an electronic product that requires cheap labor and lax if not ignored environmental laws?

Maybe the US can raise the minimum wage more, require additional employer subsidized days off and enact even more stringent discharge requirements. That will boost domestic PV panel manufacturing for sure!

[soldiermedic76]

Carbon deposits? Like in the soil? Where they are actually beneficial? And this is because prior to the 1970s China was basically a non-infustrialized country. Nice cherry picking and using scary words you don’t understand (once again).

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Irrelevant to their taking over manufacturing of green technologies

Not when that manufacturing produces pollution, you moron. Contrary to what you dipshits believe, buying carbon credits doesn’t offset that.

[The Encogitationer]

There is a documentary series on Pluto.tv called Avoiding Apocalypse and one of the things suggested to address excess CO2 is to collect it via these artificial “trees” with “needles” that actually absorb CO2 1000 times more efficiently than natural trees. The Carbon could then be pumped underground and absorbed into rock, possibly even made into building material or other commercial products.

So Free-Market Capitalist innovation rather than Eco-Wacko Sociialism may just be the way to go towards addressing the “Carbon footprint.”

[Joe Friday]

Chumby, by “we” I met Americans. You can recycle plastic bottles all you want, but if you oppose large scale action to reduce releasing carbon you’re wasting your time.

[Joe Friday]

No, soldier, from the atmosphere.

How is stating a fact you cannot dispute about our historic carbon emissions – which we still benefit from in the built environment, infrastructure, and wealth – relative to China’s “cherry picking”? Thanks for confirming the fact that they have not similarly benefitted or polluted at our level.

The clear point is we both live on this limited globe and blaming each other goes nowhere.

[Chumby]

Clueless Joe, who said anything about plastic bottles? Keep demanding that expensive broken solutions are implemented to support your carbon polluting lifestyle. By the way you are acting, being a carbon polluter and all, methinks your “curing the climate” path is about control and taking as opposed to doing something meaningful. Be the change you want to see. Or you can keep polluting carbon and demand someone else fund some spurious project.

[Bill Godshall]

Calling government subsidies and pork barrel spending to big Democrat campaign donors “investments” by the federal government is the same deception deployed by Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, McConnell and the left wing media propagandists.

[Bill Godshall]

China is taking over the field because the US and Europe are banning carbon emissions, while mandating solar panels and wind turbines that are manufactured by Chinese.

Meanwhile, China has doubled its carbon emission during the past two decades, and will continue increasing carbon emissions for at least the next decade (unless a war, economic collapse, famine, etc. occur).

[Joe Friday]

Maybe true Bill and so what are we going to do about it? They can correctly claim we’ve got ours and we still pollute on a per capita basis more than they do. Now what?

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

They can correctly claim we’ve got ours and we still pollute on a per capita basis more than they do.

China has 1.5 billion people while we have about 330 million. “per capita basis” doesn’t mean shit, only actual pollution does.

[Chumby]

How many of the pro climate action folks have made appreciable changes in their lifestyle to support this? 1%? Climate activism is great until they must pay for it.

I look forward to the time when Greenland and Antarctica will be habitable and tillable.

[The Encogitationer]

So literal Green-Land and Anti-Arctic-a? Noyce!

I’d also love to see a Manhattan Skyline of fruit trees on the building rooftops to feed the apiaries making honey for the bodegas below! And grape vines and window baskets of kitchen herbs and marijuana lining the walls of the skyscrapers, as well as 8 million stories of make-and-grow bounty in the naked but leafy-covered city!

It might give ’em a hobby that’ll make them better people!

Some hip and sexy human fauna to go with the flora would be very noyce too!

Roof Garden–Al Jarreau (Official Video)
https://youtu.be/AD7PQySHAZc

[Chumby]

I’m fine with never seeing Manhattan or NYC ever again.

Overpopulated countries that border oceans may want to warm up to Denmark.

Al Jarreau’s late 70s rendition of Take Five is excellent.

[dbruce]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kensilverstein/2021/05/16/the-dam-has-broken-and-west-virginia-is-waking-up-to-solar-power/

[CE]

When polled, most people want free stuff.
When asked if they still want free stuff if the FICA tax rate is increased to cover it…. no wait, no one polling asks about that.

[JimboJr]

“Sarah Silverman on backlash over calling out Joy Reid:

“I did not criticize Joy Ann because she’s black, but because she’s a Harvard educated journalist with the responsibility ideally of showing the whole picture”

Surprised it came from Silverman, honestly. She is the queen of hypocritical, uneducated hot takes. But she didn’t realize she was committing the cardinal sin: Calling a person out that has more victim points on the intersectional chart. This is the level of their discourse/argument today, and it is a directly a result of embracing CRT praxis. It is why Joy Reid fights so hard to keep CRT in schools. Its nice having the power to shout down anyone who would dare criticize you as a bigot (see also: heretic, as this is just a new religion).

Joy Reid could be running an actual pedophile ring and if you are a wHyte cis gendered person?!…you better stfu because otherwise you WILL be called a racist for daring to undermine a capital B Black person.

[raspberrydinners]

Yeah they should probably do nothing (or actively hurt attempts) like Missouri so their hospitals overflow.

If we just told all the unvaxxed idiots they couldn’t go to the hospital to be treated for covid then I’m sure not many would give too many fucks. Deal with your “freedumb”- if you don’t take medical advice to get a vax now then surely don’t clog up hospitals later trying to get it because you were a fucking moron.

[Don't look at me!]

Explain the situation at the Vermont college.

[sarcasmic]

If we just told all the unvaxxed idiots they couldn’t go to the hospital to be treated for covid then I’m sure not many would give too many fucks.

On the one hand yes it’s their own damn fault and they’re idiots, but on the other I wouldn’t want to set a precedent of refusing access to hospitals based upon politics (which is what it all comes down to in this country anyway).

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Yeah they should probably do nothing (or actively hurt attempts) like Missouri so their hospitals overflow.

Which hasn’t actually happened in the last two years.

[ElvisIsReal]

Actual stats in Missouri:

80% beds taken (20% free)
12.9% beds taken by covid-positives

Compare to Michigan:

83% beds taken (17% free)
21.8% taken by covid-positives

Obviously it’s Missouri that should be lambasted as a backwater hellhole.

https://protect-public.hhs.gov/pages/hospital-utilization

[I, Woodchipper]

i’m now beginning to finally understand how the red guards and the color revolution of china etc could happen.

I never really could believe it but now I’m seeing the kind of people who would do it open their mouths without fear.

[JimboJr]

Exactly this. The wanna be fascists really let their masks drop pretty easily. They almost seem to wish for these scenarios where the govt forces things on people at gunpoint because it happens to be on their side today.

You can see how a lot of communist revolutions happened. Lots of people eager to snitch on, and lord over their neighbors for having the audacity to not agree with their worldview.

[ElvisIsReal]

It’s especially hilarious that they think they’ll always be on the ‘correct’ side of the force. They’re the type of people who are dragged in front of the firing squad claiming there’s been a mistake, if only they could talk to somebody in The Party everything could be cleared up!

[soldiermedic76]

Yeah maybe they should study the Soviet Purges or the Cultural Revolution…

[soldiermedic76]

Or (despite them denying their akinship to fascism) what happened to the SA after Hitler consolidated power.

[JimboJr]

Unfortunately you live in a country that will continue to treat all comers, so long as we remain free. Perhaps Australia would be a better place for your authoritarian impulses.

This country aint for you. Best you move on to the communist shit hole you desire rather than try and turn America into it.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

Sarah Silverman on backlash over calling out Joy Reid:

“I did not criticize Joy Ann because she’s black, but because she’s a Harvard educated journalist with the responsibility ideally of showing the whole picture”

Herpetologist’s handshake. I really couldn’t care less.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

California Reinstates Mask Mandate as Omicron Panic Devours Team Blue

Told you.

[Dillinger]

>>The select committee investigating the January 6 riot at the U.S. Capitol

is a fraud.

[soldiermedic76]

Does anyone care at this point? Other than party diehards?

[Dillinger]

all the lefties I know are certain a coup! was going down. coup!

[BigT]

They are keeping Jan 6 in the headlines and trying to remind people why they didn’t like Trump. Guilt by association rubs off on all Heffalumps.

[Dillinger]

also it wasn’t a riot ffs. and that may be the most correct thing Sarah Silverman ever said.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Branch Covidianism taken to the next level:

Billie Eilish believes she ‘would have died’ from COVID-19 if she was unvaccinated
Brendan Morrow, Staff Writer
Mon, December 13, 2021

Pop star Billie Eilish has revealed she was sick with COVID-19 for nearly two months this year, and she believes the “amazing” coronavirus vaccine saved her life.

The 19-year-old “Bad Guy” singer, who hosted Saturday Night Live over the weekend, appeared on The Howard Stern Show Monday, revealing she contracted COVID-19 in August, per Uproxx.

“It was bad,” she said. “I didn’t die, and I wasn’t gonna die, but that does not take away from how miserable it was. I mean, it was terrible. I still have side effects. I mean, I was sick for like two months almost.”

Eilish said she was vaccinated against COVID-19 at the time, though she emphasized this isn’t evidence the vaccine doesn’t work. “I want it to be clear that it is because of the vaccine that I’m fine,” she said. “I think if I weren’t vaccinated, I would have died, because it was bad.”

Eilish is a typical idiot youth, but still, fuckin’ LOL at this circular reasoning. If you’re sick with the coof for two months (and this is all assuming she isn’t exaggerating for effect just like any other idiot teenager), then clearly the vaccine didn’t work for you, and it’s likely that you got sick from one of your vaccinated relatives. Better get that fifth jab just to be sure.

If a vaccine doesn’t stop you from getting infected, it’s not a vaccine. It’s a therapeutic with varied results depending on the person.

[Joe Friday]

Red, the covid vaccines – like all flu vaccines – are not perfect (about 90% so) but they will limit your chances of catching or dying from it. This is not news and you have to be an “idiot”, liar, or both to try and deny it.

[sarcasmic]

If it’s not 100% effective then it’s 0% effective.

[ElvisIsReal]

No matter how many times we explain this to you, you keep repeating it. That’s how we know you’re 100% full of shit all the time.

But one last time — the jab doesn’t stop transmission, so eventually the virus goes through the population no matter how many people are jabbed.

[sarcasmic]

Like I said, it isn’t 100%. Which means it’s useless. Like masks. You know, they’re supposed to stop spittle, not the viruses themselves. But because they don’t stop the viruses they’re 0% effective. QI reform isn’t a silver bullet to stop police abuse, which means it’s useless.

Anything that isn’t perfect is trash.

[Dillinger]

>>Anything that isn’t perfect is trash.

in the case of the Vaccines v. the Covids, yes they are trash.

[sarcasmic]

Kewl. Don’t get vaccinated. I couldn’t give two shits.

[Dillinger]

have a lovely morning.

[sarcasmic]

It’s afternoon in my time zone, but thanks. You too.

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

I couldn’t give two shits.

Three posts in defense of Joe’s utterly ridiculous claim say otherwise. The vaccine has nowhere near 90% efficacy.

[sarcasmic]

What’s upchuck? Barf. Dude, I muted you. Not exactly sure why, but my experiment in unmuting ended in dancing to the tune of the master baiters. So fuck off. Please.

[Don't look at me!]

Ha Ha Ha

[Chuck P. (The Artist formerly known as CTSP)]

Ha! Mother is not the only Mute’nt for the day!

Homo Superior FTW!

[Joe Brandon]

“The Muteneers” ?

[ElvisIsReal]

Thanks for proving that you’re full of shit immediately after I say that you’re full of shit.

[sarcasmic]

And no, I’m not full of shit. I’m just repeating what you said in a slightly different way. The vaccine is not 100% effective. More like 90%. That means 10% of vaccinated people can get sick if exposed. That 10% can spread the disease. Because of that the vaccine is totally pointless, since it’s not 100% effective. That’s the logic of your words, like it or not.

[ElvisIsReal]

That’s not what 90% effective means at all. Learn something before you start spouting bullshit.

[sarcasmic]

Then edumicate me. I’m not afraid to be wrong.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

He’s not here to educate. He is here to sow doubt. He doesn’t have to prove that the vaccines don’t work. All he has to do is to create enough doubt to persuade people, fairly or not, that they don’t work.

[sarcasmic]

If he’s telling me I’m wrong and that I should learn something, then he could at least tell me how I’m wrong and what I should look up.
Otherwise he’s just farting in the wind.

[Joe Friday]

So explain why deaths in Trump counties from Covid are 5.7 times those in blue counties Elvis. I’m all ears.

https://twitter.com/charles_gaba/status/1470727799170347013/photo/1

[ElvisIsReal]

They aren’t overall. They were for a small period during the seasonal summer spike, and now the stats have shifted — exactly as we said that it would as the virus moves back into the north during the winter.

We mocked you at the time because these stats were obviously bullshit, just like the ‘anti mask’ states were so terrible last summer.

[ElvisIsReal]

This time I’ll start out with the *NONPARTISAN* graph: Here’s the county-level COVID death rate since 6/30/21 by vaccination rate. Each bar includes ~33.1 million Americans.
———————
Just ignore everything that happened before 6/30/21!!!

[Joe Friday]

Look at the chart doofus.

[Joe Friday]

Uh, prior to 6/31 there were not nearly as many people vaccinated and the discrepancies would have been less. Maybe you can explain what you think is significant about this date and the resulting 5.7 MORE DEATHS PER CAPITA IN THE REDDEST TRUMP COUNTIES VERY THE BLUEST BIDEN COUNTIES.

[ElvisIsReal]

The significance of the date is that it’s cherry picking when the north is in their seasonal low but the sunbelt is ready for the summer spike.

We explained this all as it was happening, and told you the numbers would look very different as the north moves into winter.

And wouldn’t you know it? That’s exactly what happened.

[Mike Laursen]

Idaho isn’t in the south. Northern Idaho really isn’t in the south. It hasn’t just had a short-termed “surge” in ICU wards being full of unvaccinated patients. It has had a sustained problem for months.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

“Because everyone gets sick eventually, no need to attempt to prevent it.”

“Everyone dies eventually, so go ahead and live recklessly!”

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Sad the fat tub of shit who can’t keep from shoving snack cakes down his gullet.

[sarcasmic]

Where did the ‘jeff is obese’ meme come from, and what is gained by throwing playground insults at him?

[chemjeff radical individualist]

From the same place where all of their other insults come from.

They have taken Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals to heart. They try to “win” an argument by any means necessary, and if that means trying to personally destroy their opponents, they’ll do that.

They’ve long since realized that to “win”, they don’t need to have a superior or more logical argument. All they need to do is to get the other guy to give up. And if they can get the other guy to give up by trolling and insults, then they’ll do that.

Also it is virtue signaling to their tribe that they remain loyal members of the tribe, by offering “vicious takedowns” of those outside of the tribe. The more vicious the takedown, the higher one’s standing rises in the tribe.

[sarcasmic]

That’s why I put JesseAz, Mother’s Lament and R Mac on mute the moment I saw the button. That’s literally all they do. Ad hominem, tu quoque, and strawman fallacies are embraced as convincing arguments. They’re just like the leftist asshats they hate.

[soldiermedic76]

This from the person above denigrating someone for using the mute button against people who disagree with him. You don’t understand self own do you?

[Mother's Lament]

Shit, Jesse beat me again.

[Joe Brandon]

its a “Muteny!”

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Hey, I’m not the one who complained that not allowing child molesters to claim refugee status was oppressing them, or that a voter ID system wasn’t fair if the ID wasn’t delivered directly to your doorstep, or that parents should shut up and let teachers determine what to teach their kids, or that colluding with the DoJ to declare parents who complained about this as “domestic terrorists” was “just having meetings.” That was you.

There’s no need to make a “counter-argument” against such hilariously stupid takes.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

And every single one of those are complete misrepresentations of my actual positions, because you cannot rebut my actual positions with liberty-based logical arguments. You can only lie about them and laugh at them. How sad is it that you cannot offer up a liberty-based arguments and instead have to construct strawmen to knock down. You’d think you would be better at this by now. You are proving my point quite well.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

And every single one of those are complete misrepresentations of my actual positions, because you cannot rebut my actual positions with liberty-based logical arguments. You can only lie about them and laugh at them.

Dude, you LITERALLY said that not allowing child molesters to claim refugee status was “reducing their liberty.” That’s not misrepresentation or a lie, you actually said that. You said all the other things as well.

How sad is it that you cannot offer up a liberty-based arguments and instead have to construct strawmen to knock down.

How the fuck is the DOJ colluding with the NSBA to declare parents as “domestic terrorists,” or whining that having to waddle your fat ass into a DMV to get a voter ID, “liberty-based arguments”? There’s no strawmen here, it’s just you making dumb arguments and getting assmad when people with more brains and less BMI call you out on it.

You’d think you would be better at this by now. You are proving my point quite well.

Magnificent circular reasoning from the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Where did the ‘jeff is obese’ meme come from, and what is gained by throwing playground insults at him?

1) He admitted that he is obese;
2) Reminding the fat fuck what a prissy scold he is.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

1) No, I didn’t.
2) You’re an ass.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

1) Yeah, you did.
2) You’re a fat sack of shit and a pederast supporter.

[Mike Laursen]

“The jab” reduces the severity and total time of viral infection (if the jabbee has a heathy, functioning immune system — not everyone has). The viral load “area under the curve” is less.

The more people get that get vaccinated, the lower the odds of the virus spreading to everyone.

[dbruce]

all vaccines require a booster, except yellow fever, because the first is not 100% effective. Your statement is not 100% correct.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Red, the covid vaccines – like all flu vaccines – are not perfect (about 90% so) but they will limit your chances of catching or dying from it.

” I mean, I was sick for like two months almost”
“I think if I weren’t vaccinated, I would have died, because it was bad.”

Except, as has been explained to you a zillion times, having a coof shot does not prevent you from actually catching it, as vaccinated people have been shown to spread the virus. That makes it a therapeutic, not a vaccine.

If it’s not 100% effective then it’s 0% effective.

If it doesn’t actually prevent infection, then it’s not a vaccine.

[sarcasmic]

Except it does for like 90% of the people who get it.

[sarcasmic]

If it stimulates the body into making antibodies that attack the virus, then it’s a vaccine. That’s what they do. They’re not perfect. Nothing is. But 90% or so of the people who get jabbed will fight it off. They won’t get sick and they won’t infect others. I’d say that’s pretty good.

But it isn’t perfect.

Seems that the prevailing attitude around here is that anything that isn’t perfect is useless. You know, don’t bother if it isn’t perfect. 90%? Fuck that. It’s not perfect.

[Red Rocks White Privilege]

Uh, if you can catch and spread the virus, that’s an infection. Whether you’re asymptomatic or not is hardly the point. If these things had been promoted from the beginning as therapeutics instead of vaccines, then I wouldn’t have an issue with it. It’s something you can take to reduce your chances of getting hospitalized. But they were promoted in conjunction with these stupid “zero COVID” policies, which is impossible and has been ever since China allowed people from Wuhan to travel internationally while locking them down from the rest of the country. And every time another variant pops up–which is fucking INEVITABLE with a coronavirus–these same people shift the goalposts because we are NEVER getting to a fucking zero-COVID world. Ever.

Seems that the prevailing attitude around here is that anything that isn’t perfect is useless.

No, my attitude is that politicians and public health officials shouldn’t redefine what a vaccine is when their magic coof juice doesn’t actually prevent viral spread.

[sarcasmic]

If you say so. I thought a vaccine was something that got the body to produce antibodies, and that’s what these jabs do.

[chemjeff radical individualist]

If these things had been promoted from the beginning as therapeutics instead of vaccines, then I wouldn’t have an issue with it.

I find that difficult to believe.

[sarcasmic]

I don’t. RR may be a dick, but he’s a rational dick and a fairly honest dick.

[Ken Shultz]

“If a vaccine doesn’t stop you from getting infected, it’s not a vaccine. It’s a therapeutic with varied results depending on the person.”

The “vaccine” does limit the probability of being hospitalized or dying, and I think it’s important for people to understand that beyond those two concerns–there is no reason for the government to care about Covid-19. The object is to limit the number of people in the ICU and the number of people dying, and that’s it–even from the progressive perspective. So long as the ICU’s are not likely to be full, there is no need for lockdowns, mask mandates, etc. So, to the extent that the “vaccine” limits the number of people hospitalized and limits the number of people dying, people really should get vaccinated, from all kinds of perspectives–including the the perspective that opposes lockdowns and mask mandates.

[Ken Shultz]

I will say that the herd immunity argument seems to be a dream that will never come true.

“The first large real-world study of how vaccines hold up against Omicron found that two shots of Pfizer Inc. and BioNTech SE ’s Covid-19 vaccine lowered the risk of hospital admission by 70% for patients infected with the highly mutated variant.

The study, by South Africa’s largest private health insurer Discovery Ltd., found that while Omicron reduced vaccine effectiveness against infection to 33% from 80% for Delta, its effect on protection against hospitalization was less marked, falling to 70% from 93%.

—-December 14, 2021

https://www.wsj.com/articles/first-big-omicron-study-finds-two-doses-of-pfizers-vaccine-cuts-hospitalization-risk-by-70-11639495432?

The herd is not immune to Omicron, but if the risk of hospitalization is down to 70%, we don’t need to worry about there not being enough ventilators to go around–and that’s the only thing that really matters. The legitimate purpose of government is not to ensure that no one ever gets the flu.

[Bill Godshall]

If Fauci, CDC, State/Local Health Depts, health and medical groups, and the news media were actually interested in preventing/reducing the risk/harm caused by covid, they’d be urging (and providing incentives to) the half of Americans who are obese to lose weight.

Most covid deaths and hospitalizations among people under 70 have occurred among the obese (and especially the severely obese).

Unfortunately for public health, the mass lockdowns during the past 20 months have increased obesity rates.

[Mike Laursen]

No, no, no. At this point, with vaccinations, treatments, and more experienced doctors if someone ends up on a ventilator that is a big failure. Ventilators are a horrible, tortuous last resort.

[MT-Man]

But why push it for people already recovered? Shouldn’t our gov also consider recovery as vaxxed status too or do we now not consider our bodies natural antibodies ever to be sufficient for protection (General question not specific to you)

[Mike Laursen]

Immunity from having had COVID-19 should count.

A couple of cautions, though:

There are some people who believe they have had COVID-19 but actually had a cold or allergies or whatever. So, they should do an actual immunity test.

Also, in some individuals, natural immunity may have faded, and vaccination would boost their immunity. Again, an actual immunity test could determine that.

[Joe Friday]

Mt-man, as many as 30% of those who have had covid and are unvaccinated did not develop anti-bodies and studies show that vaccines benefit those with “natural immunity”.

[Overt]

For the record, Joe has demonstrated that he doesn’t understand the significance of historical life expectancies. And he has demonstrated that he doesn’t even understand what it means for a vaccine to be XX% effective. Getting your science advice from the internet is ill advised, but trusting him for science is the height of insanity.

This is Joe trafficking in his preferred cherry picking and manipulation of the science to strengthen a very specific narrative (thou shalt vax no matter what!!!!). I would ignore it but then, after playing these silly games where he quotes science he doesn’t even understand, Joe will act like an arrogant asshole who knows the science.

For the record, numerous studies have shown that people who have recovered from COVID retain stronger ability to fight the virus for longer periods than the vaccinated. And these narrowly focused studies on antibodies do not tell the whole picture on whether someone is or is not able to effectively fight the virus (because the body is able to fight the virus in several ways that don’t require the antibodies circulation through the blood that these studies test).

[Ken Shultz]

If the real problem is whether there are enough ventilators to go around, then the government’s question should be tied to the vacancy rate at the local ICU–rather than the vaccination rate.

[Chumby]

A doctor out of Alberta was using inhalers and vitamins to address those suffering from covid.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

What’s horse dewormer, chopped liver?

[Chumby]

He used that too. Two of the three patients recovered in one day and we able to be discharged. His schedule was suddenly changed and lost all of his shifts.

[ElvisIsReal]

Sounds like the jab interfered with his ability to fight the virus. This is getting more and more obvious as we move into winter.

[Mike Laursen]

How in the world could getting vaccinated interfere with the ability to fight the virus? What would be the supposed mechanism?

[The Great Negro]

It’s not a vaccine.

[JimboJr]

I guess I should reply to her that I know someone that got bad side effects from the vaccine, and that I know multiple people in her age group and demographic that got the coof no vax and had mild to no symptoms.

If we are just going to base things on what we “feel” the vaccine does or doesnt do, why not just use my anecdotes rather than hers.

[soldiermedic76]

Because science dammit.

[dbruce]

Some vaccines can be very successful at preventing illnesses or reducing the severity of it, but no vaccine is 100% effective on an entire population. This is because immune responses vary from person to person.
The measles vaccine is one of the most successful vaccines, which is 99 per cent effective at preventing the disease.

[Mother's Lament]

“the omicron variant of COVID-19… many municipalities are regressing into full-blown panic and reimposing mitigation measures”

That’s the feature, not a bug.

[I, Woodchipper]

Outside of the bay area and LA, no one is going to follow a new mask mandate in California. no one.

[Don't look at me!]

Those with guns pointed at them will do so.

[MT-Man]

I also love how television is exempt and it magically just can’t happen on screen or that putting people on television maskless is a more noble and needed profession than anything else.

[Number 2]

What’s the over/under on how long it will take Newsom to violate his own mandate?

[sarcasmic]

Since when did the law apply to people in government?

[The Great Negro]

It applies to republicans only.

[Moonrocks]

Better question is if he will ever abide by it.

[Catch33]

Getty boy just can’t let go of power can he…

[Sevo]

And this for a spike of 5-one thousandths of one percent in diagnosed cases.
Not sick, not hospitalized, not deaths, just those diagnosed with something being compared to a common cold.

[Mickey Rat]

Anyclip and their godforsaken embedded videoes can go to hell. Anyclip is making the world a worse place.

[Don't look at me!]

I can’t guess that anyone watches them.

[Overt]

I have reported this multiple times to the tech support people and other than once telling me “could not reproduce” they have never said (or evidently done) anything about it.

[TJJ2000]

Thank goodness it is staying in CA.
There’s a reason the federal government was suppose to be very limited.

[Weigel's Cock Ring]

You know what? I no longer have any sympathy left for the people of Commiefornia. They just reaffirmed that they want this fucking asshole as their leader, so they got him, and I don’t want to hear any more complaining.

So put your fucking muzzles on like the third world peasants you are, enjoy stepping around the tent cities and the piles of human shit, deal with your stores being targeted by the smash and grab gangs, and hopefully you aren’t the next victims of your skyrocketing homicide rates.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

is the third Trump ally to face the threat of possible criminal charges stemming from the probe of the deadly attack.

By the by, this is some seriously mendacious reporting. “Deadly attack”.

Ok, I’ll run with that.

Antifa committed a deadly attack on Kenosha Wisconsin.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

The D.C. Metro is currently functioning at greatly reduced capacity due to various issues with the train cars. Rep. Gerry Connolly (D–Va.) plans to call Metro leaders to testify before Congress about hiding details of faulty cards for years. According to NBC:

Oh, and literally no one cares about the sorry state of the DC Metro. If you don’t like the DC Metro, move to another city with a better transit system, like you would head down the street to a different pizza parlor because the crust is better.

[Chumby]

I got the fuck out of there 20+ years ago. There are some amazing museums in DC…and…hmmm. The Metro was cleaner than Baltimore’s light rail.

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

So the crust in DC’s parlor is better than the one in Baltimore… good to know.

[middlefinger]

Why are they doing this? Everyone knows this is a bunch of bullshit. What is really at the bottom of all this? Is it money laundering revenue RE taxes dried up? Are they waiting for BBB to pass for bailout transfers? Are the pensions in free fall? WTF

[jdgalt1]

There’s a reason these outbreaks always consist only or mostly of vaccinated people. And until the stupid authorities figure that out, they will keep happening.

The reason is that the vaccine IS the vector. We skeptics are safe.

[dbruce]

Here is a little math for you. Masks are NOT 100% effective. Social distancing is NOT 100% effective. Vaccines are NOT 100% effective.
Washing your hands often with soap and water for at least 20 seconds is NOT 100% effective. If you’re not able to wash your hands, use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol is NOT 100% effective.
Cover your mouth and nose with your elbow or a tissue when you cough or sneeze. Throw away the used tissue. Wash your hands right away is NOT 100% effective.
Avoid touching your eyes, nose and mouth is NOT 100% effective.
Clean and disinfect often-touched surfaces daily is NOT 100% effective. Were you able to add that up or NOT?

[Diane Reynolds (Paul.)]

This disease is so dangerous that… hang on, I’m getting a text… Governor Newsom is going to delay the vaccine mandate.