Afghanistan

We Need To Get Afghans Out of Afghanistan Too

What Afghan civilians need now is resettlement, not remilitarization.

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After 20 years of U.S. military intervention, trillions of dollars lost, and thousands of soldiers and civilians killed in Afghanistan, that conflict's conclusion is now written. Afghanistan has fallen to the Taliban. President Ashraf Ghani has fled the country.

The Taliban's quick takeover defied even the most pessimistic projections from America's foreign policy elites. Critics spent the weekend decrying the withdrawal as premature. But those years, dollars, and lives invested in training Afghan forces produced a guard that wouldn't—or couldn't—defend its own country. It's highly unlikely that the U.S. could change that reality if only American troops had stayed a bit longer.

Afghans can no longer find hope within their country's borders, and the U.S. shouldn't attempt to install that hope there. But America can still give many Afghans what they need the most: an escape route.

Other countries have already stepped up to the challenge. Canada promised to admit more than 20,000 vulnerable Afghan citizens. The U.S. has taken a far less concrete approach. Reuters reported last week that officials were "scour[ing] for countries willing to house Afghan refugees" while their U.S. visa applications are processed. They've pestered Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, and Uzbekistan to take in at-risk Afghans who worked for the U.S. government, but they have not reached an agreement with any of those countries. Albania, Kosovo, and North Macedonia have graciously offered to house some political refugees, but only "temporarily."

American options exist. Guam, painted by advocates as a viable visa processing point since early in President Joe Biden's withdrawal, offered its territory as a landing pad back in June. "Guam has stood ready to serve as a safe and secure route for this type of humanitarian effort throughout our history," wrote Gov. Lou Leon Guerrero to Biden. "I assure you that my administration is prepared to assist in executing your plans on this matter should Guam be chosen."

There are now reports that the Department of Defense is preparing to bring thousands of Afghan refugees to American military bases, including Wisconsin's Fort McCoy and Texas' Fort Bliss. So far, around 2,000 Afghans who assisted the U.S. military and applied for special immigrant visas (SIVs) have been airlifted to the U.S. with their families. But it's a drop in the bucket, since up to 50,000 SIV applicants and their family members are estimated to be waiting on answers and evacuation flights. When factoring in civilians in other vulnerable groups, there's no telling how many Afghans would migrate if given the chance.

Since the beginning of the year, the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees reports that about 400,000 Afghans have been internally displaced. Nearly 120,000 of them fled from rural areas and smaller cities to Kabul Province—though that government stronghold has now also fallen to the Taliban. Of those who have fled within Afghanistan's borders since the end of May, 80 percent are women and children.

Nobody is safe from the Taliban's terror. Women are being forced to leave their jobs. Afghan interpreters who assisted Western militaries are in hiding or on the run, fearing they will be murdered. Thousands of people, desperate for any way out of the country, have flocked to Hamid Karzai International Airport. Videos from today appeared to show people clinging to a military plane while it left Kabul, falling to the ground as the aircraft climbed.

"This is not the moment for bureaucracy," says Adam Weinstein, a Quincy Institute research fellow and an Afghanistan veteran. "Washington needs to evacuate as many special immigrant visa applicants and human rights defenders as possible and sort out the details later."

To Weinstein, "the U.S.-led war in Afghanistan was never really about Afghans." It was "driven by terrorism," even if human rights gains sometimes served as a public justification. "President Biden had the fortitude to end the charade."

More than just ending the charade, Biden has the opportunity to allow Afghans into the U.S. for what past presidents claimed they would be getting in their own country: liberty, opportunity, legal equality, and safe living. Even if the war in Afghanistan wasn't about the Afghans, the withdrawal can be.

"A more sustainable foreign policy would be informed by the expertise of local voices while acknowledging the limits of American influence," says Weinstein. American military influence couldn't keep Afghanistan from falling to the Taliban. But the power of refuge could still save thousands.

NEXT: Biden's Determined Humility Regarding Afghanistan Is What America Needs Right Now

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  1. President shits his pants can’t even keep track of when his afternoon nap is. How could he be expected to handle something like what to do to help the Afghans that have aided the US for the past twenty years?

    1. SleepyJoe doesn’t like Afghans. Too itchy to nap on.

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    2. If he did, don’t worry about it man. Because remember: his butt’s been wiped…..

      1. The American media has the brown noses to prove it.

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    3. If they were “woke” or “LGBT’ or “socialist” or “communists” or “anarchists” or “atheists” Biden would be using every resource to get them out.

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  3. America owes the members of Afghanistan’s LGBTQIAP+ community safety after allowing them to live as their true selves for these past two decades. Now, the Afghan people should be allowed to share their unique culture and customs with the people of Europe and America.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi

    1. Go on…

      /chemjeff

    2. Bacha_bazi

      Hell yeah! I’ve been wanting one forever. They’re expensive, break easily and are only good for four or five years, but they beat the hell out of the Dark web.

      1. Fake buttplug.

        1. Easy to tell. turd lies.

    3. Are you sure you aren’t a sock for Misek?

  4. There is zero way the Rs would allow these refugees to be allowed into the US.

    1. Tell it to the State Department folks over at Proggie Bottom that bungled their visa applications. Reason’s been reporting on it for months.

      Dumb Fuck.

      1. Unicorn is right. The state department and lawmakers who could have changed policy on this are to blame. As far as party affiliation, this has been ongoing for 20 years. The only people I know who have made it through the visa process spent years and a lot of money and time traveling back and forth to Kabul to make it work. Very few Afghans were in a position to do that. One gave up and smuggled himself to Turkey, got caught and deported, and only then did he try again and succeed at getting a visa…3 years later. No amount of paperwork can possibly take 3 years. No fucking excuse.

        1. It’s what you campaigned for

          1. Trump would not have improved this specific problem. His administration was happy to restrict Afghans getting into the country.

            This is something that the US government has been consistently, universally awful on for 20 years.

            1. We’ll never know now, but he had a plan for it

          2. No, it’s not. Not even what I voted for. Hilarious that on a libertarian site, you still can’t comprehend more than 2 sides to anything. Pure black and white, childish simpleton.

            1. Didn’t mention your voting, just your campaigning

            2. You’re getting what you argued for. Are you not happy?

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    2. Funny, tons of R publications are demanding that right now, while D publications aren’t uttering a peep.

      1. You didn’t expect this steaming pile of lefty shit to, oh, check, before making a public ass of itself, did you?

        1. So steaming pile of lefty shit Mike is bragging about a stopped clock!

        2. Yes. Yes it is.
          The Sulzberger’s are longtime Party royalty, and Dean Baquet takes his marching orders directly from Tom Perez.

    3. The Republicans only oppose the ones that practice the branch of Islam that is gay-friendly and supportive of women’s rights. Militaristic religious fundamentalists are their core constituency.

      1. The Republicans only oppose the ones that practice the branch of Islam that is gay-friendly and supportive of women’s rights. Militaristic religious fundamentalists are their core constituency.

        That’s a pretty braindead comment given that it was an R administration that went to war with the militaristic religious fundamentalists, booted them out of power and installed a regime friendly to the rights of women and others oppressed by the former. And under which party is it that the militaristic religious assholes have regained power?

    4. Molly, stop kabullshitting.

      1. That kabuloon whoosed right past here.

    5. No, just males of fighting age allowed

      https://twitter.com/realjuliasong/status/1427373241350373379?t=1iEEeR9clIjwTygHUR1Oyg&s=19

      Fuck! I literally dont see ONE woman or child?!?!! WTF is going on?? [Pic of your new neighbors]

      1. Pwhem Biden does bring Afghans here, it will be radicalized extremists ready to commit acts of terror. At the same time he will leave those that he,led us to be killed by the Taliban.

    6. Romney just tweeted in support of doing exactly that you stupid cunt.

      1. Wow, glad the Senator could take the time now to express that opinion in a tweet, too bad for Afghans though, he didn’t champion legislation tirelessly while setting aside personal/political grudges to get it done.

        Few of our politicians gave two shits and now they are running around acting like they do. Fuck ’em all. By the time they get around to figuring out the catchy name for their bill the Taliban will have already massacred the populace.

        1. How many Afghans do you want to move here?
          Put a number on it.
          Should it just be military age males, as it looks to be now, or women and children too?

    7. Second term, rent free in your head.

    8. Are you implying non ‘R’s’ would actually P on the graves of our fallen soldiers and consider making it happen?

  5. Yeah, right. How about we let them stay at your house?

  6. Vote for political hacks, career corrupt idiots, and party machine outputs, and you get exactly what you deserve.

    Trump should have called him Angry Joe. Biden is not a nice person; just listen to how he acts when he doesn’t have the press sucking his dick

    1. He called one of his own campaign volunteers a “lying, dog faced pony soldier”

  7. Who is this “we”, and why does it “need” to do this?

    1. Exactly. Libertarian case for taxpayer funded immigration.

  8. I agree that we should do whatever we can for those whose lives are on the line because they were foolish enough to trust us and truly helped us out while we were there.

    Most of the rest of them can go fuck themselves. I know that sounds harsh, but it’s my honest opinion. The entire lot of them folded like a bunch of cheap suits in about ten seconds to a bunch of lightly-armed stone age throwbacks in bathrobes.

    The truth that for some reason still nobody wants to admit is that this is what the overwhelming majority of the people there want, period. Their culture is not our culture. They don’t want a modern nation-state with a modern democratic republic form of government. They want the 15th century medieval regional tribal system! Not everyone there feels this way of course, but most do.

    I don’t know why we can’t just accept this already. The ones in the minority who want something different and more modern will eventually find their way out and go somewhere else, which has already been going on for decades.

    1. I agree that we should do whatever we can for those whose lives are on the line because they were foolish enough to trust us and truly helped us out while we were there.

      DoL and White Mike have assured us that traitors deserve what they get. They certainly cannot attest that they would never conspire with foreign governments.

      Besides, the precedent is set. The US hung the Hmong people out to dry 45 years ago and left them to be liquidated by the commies.

    2. I genuinely look forward to the beheadings. Fuck those faggot coward grifters.

    3. Otter : “Flounder, you can’t spend your whole life worrying about your mistakes! You fucked up… you trusted us! Hey, make the best of it! Maybe we can help.”

  9. It is not enough that Afghans have Afghanistan to call home, they need our country to call home, too.

    1. I mean, just the ones who are going to get beheaded for helping us. Seems reasonable.

      1. Is there a reason they haven’t left in the intervening 20 yrs.?

        More cogently, is there a reason why you haven’t been calling for them to be evacuated for the last 20 yrs.?

        1. I imagine they were told they could get the visa when things quieted down, or after x more years, ad infinitum. I doubt very many of them waited that long out of enthusiasm for getting themselves noticed more and more.

          1. My point was more aimed at DOL directly. He’s supposedly helped other translators get out. The remaining few, apparently and for whatever reason, even in his own personal priority queue, weren’t a concern. Now, at the 11th hour, he comes around shrieking about the human aspect to the conflict and saying we should all feel shame for not being able to do more for the translators that *he* knows well enough to swap phone numbers with.

            Attention or not, it’s not like the entire rest of the EU isn’t so full up with refugees from the ME that some of even their most refugee-friendly states are having to pull back on the reins. Is the argument really that Iran, Kazahkstan, Uzbekistan, etc.’s borders are really more air tight than the US’s?

  10. I’m not sure what to think about this until I hear OBL’s take.

  11. Well, so much for President Cheney and Little Dumbya’s great plan of “spreading democracy” via nation-building. Both Iraq and Afghanistan were unmitigated disasters that cost us over $3 trillion.

    Thanks, Bushpigs!

    1. Obama “surged” in both. Bush gets the majority of the blame, but every president who kept this going could have stopped it.

      1. Senator Biden voted for the invasion. VP Biden helped oversee the occupation for eight years. And now President Biden completely screwed the pooch on the exit.

        1. It took him 6 years to say something slightly negative about Obama. In 5 years he will agree with you.

          1. I’ve never been an Obama fan or voter. I don’t enlist in creepy political cults, unlike you.

            1. OK, that got a chuckle.

        2. Notice how Biden has failed upwards. It’s the democrat way.

    2. The time to prepare an exit was the first purple finger day. I think that was Oct 2004.

      Except that we screwed the pooch at Tora Bora and let OBL escape because we weren’t willing to do our own dirty work.

  12. To be fair, they just need to safely get to Mexico and they’ll be in the US soon thereafter.

    1. There is some reasonableness behind this snark. This was an allied operation. If the US fails to bring in Afghan civilians caught up in this mess, there are other involved countries who could without hesitation.

      This US-centric view of the world is getting tedious.

      1. I support housing them all on Martha’s Vineyard.

        1. I support this perfectly reasonable proposition.

        2. Only the really sophisticated ones.

        3. Most of them would fit in perfectly on Epstein’s island.

      2. Brits, Aussies, Turks just to name a few

        1. Merkel said today that Germany needs to talk about (Afghan) immigration. Which means Berlin leans on Brussels to order Budapest, Sofia and Bucharest to take any refugees that Germany wants on the continent. That last part wasn’t from the DW story.

          1. Sorta like the French never killed Jews during WWII. They shipped them to Germany.

            1. Many admit now that many French collaborated and participated in the holocaust.

              It’s the Le Pens and what not who refuse to admit it.

  13. I heard about those news and i was shocked how they are….

    YouConvert

  14. The US military cou.d have prevented this from happening, it had preventing it from happening for over 10 years. And no, we cannot import every Afghan whose life and liberty are now in immediate danger. It is a facile suggestion. If you favored withdrawal, you have to accept that was going to screw a whole bunch of people, and you don’t care about that result.

  15. Are the agencies responsible for processing the visa applications of those who helped us in Afghanistan the same agencies that are being inundated with asylum claims to the tune of 200,000 a month across our southern border?

    Would it have been less difficult to process the visa applications of these brave Afghans if our border were secure?

    1. Those are two totally separate situations. One is Trump’s fault, the other one is Trump’s fault.

    2. You really had to reach, but you got there. It’s mexicans’ fault!

      Doesn’t explain why this visa process has been like this for 20 years now, but good on you for making your bias heard.

      1. Doesn’t explain why this visa process has been like this for 20 years now, but good on you for making your bias heard.

        Talk about reaching… so, 20 yrs. and not one Afghan translator has gotten out of Afghanistan? Not just as a refugee and (per Diane Reynolds’ point above) not just to the US? These translators couldn’t have gotten to Egypt, Turkey, Greece, Germany, France, Poland, Spain, Portugal, India, the UK, Norway, Finland, Sweden, Romania, Ukraine, Belarus…

      2. It’s not the Mexicans’ fault, and that’s your stretch. It’s Biden’s fault (and Obama’s) for signaling to Latin America that if they sent their kids here, they could get in and get fast tracked to free healthcare. That isn’t a stretch. That’s literally what happened. Then they were surprised when they showed up.

      3. Doesn’t explain why this visa process has been like this for 20 years now, but good on you for making your bias heard.

        Right, and that visa process wasn’t designed for over 200,000 immigrants per month.

        Arizona Governor Doug Ducey is calling on Biden DHS Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas to step down after leaked audio revealed Mayorkas saying the border crisis is ‘unsustainable’ and ‘we’re going to lose’ with illegal crossings at a 21-year high.

        Mayorkas privately admitted to Border Patrol agents in Texas that Joe Biden’s government is struggling under the influx of migrants and admitted he knew the infrastructure in place to deal with it was near ‘breaking.’

        ‘If our borders are the first line of defense, we’re going to lose, and this is unsustainable,’ he said in audio obtained by Fox News.

        ‘We can’t continue like this, our people in the field can’t continue and our system isn’t built for it.’

        Arizona Governor Doug Ducey called for Mayorkas’ resignation just hours after the leaked audio became public.

        In a statement he accused Mayorkas of having ‘confirmed our worst fears.’

        Mayorkas announced on Thursday that Customs and Border Protection (CBP) encountered more than 212,000 migrants along the U.S.-Mexico border in July – a record 21-year high.

        Remember when:

        1. This wasn’t happening.
        2. Well, ok, it’s happening but it’s not as bad as Fox says it is.
        3. It’s happening, it’s even worse than Fox said it was, and we better get used to it because it’s normal (and a good thing).

        1. VP Harris took care of the border crisis a few months ago after President Biden, with humility, assigned this task to her.

          1. She slapped climate change right in the face and said “you stop it now!”

        2. Also, per your point above, I’m a little befuddled at how, from Uzbekistan to Finland, the borders are more closed than they are in the US… for 20 yrs.

        3. Be careful. He will accuse you of blood libel for not slobbering on the executive state.

          1. I’ll accuse you of falling for a rehashed blood libel when you repeat the blood libel verbatim with the jews subbed out for deep state or whichever scapegoat du jour. Moron.

            1. “with the jews subbed out for deep state”

              Lol, did you actually intend to write this, Stolen Valor?

              1. Yes, he’s said it a few times lately.

          2. Abortion is proof that blood libel is real.

      4. It is amazing how fucking stupid you are. You don’t think 1 million applications a year takes resources??? The backlog for court hearings is approaching 2 years you ignorant fuck.

        1. Now do the last 20 years, dumb fuck.

          1. You do the last 20 yrs. You’re the one asserting we should take more and special action now dumb fuck. Recruit, organize, train, and lead the indigenous force was your job. Go cry to your mom or your platoon sergeant about how shameful we were not to take care of *your* translators *for you*.

    3. And it might be more accurate to blame Ted Cruz for holding up all state department appointments, if we are stretching credibility to make a partisan point.

      1. You failed.

      2. How is this a fucking partisan point? It’s a matter of resource management and we chose to prioritize economic refugees over political ones. Go pound sand, you ignorant hack.

        1. A single source on any relation between the two would be helpful to make a point. These visas have been taking this long for 20 years. So unless your point is that Bush’s policies toward the southern border were equally causal, then you’ve got nothing.

          You guys love the “feels true, must be true” facebook-tier bullshit.

          Read this, then remind yourselves who was president in 2019 and 2020. And look for any connection between mexican visas and afghan visas outside of your own heads: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/afghanistan-us-special-visas/2021/01/21/51f73368-5a97-11eb-a849-6f9423a75ffd_story.html

          More than 7,000 special visas allocated to Afghans by Congress in 2020 went unissued, compared with about 5,000 the year before, according to State Department data. Nearly 19,000 visa applications were stuck in processing as of September 2019, according to a State Department audit last year, a number that was all but guaranteed to grow with the coronavirus disruptions.

          Created to support Afghans and Iraqis who came under threat for their work with the United States, the special visa programs have lengthy applications processes that have prolonged the average wait time to three years. And as they wait, Afghan applicants to the program are increasingly vulnerable: The Taliban and other militant groups view them as traitors, putting them in a perilous position as the Taliban expands its influence and as thousands of U.S. troops have withdrawn from Afghanistan.

          Half a dozen special-visa applicants interviewed by The Washington Post this month said they believe their lives have been put at greater risk due to the processing delays last year. The program, called the Special Immigrant Visa, offers a fast track to U.S. citizenship and benefits such as housing assistance that other immigrants to the United States are not entitled to.

          Advocates are expecting “a waterfall of delays” after interviews were halted for nearly a year, according to Deepa Alagesan, a senior attorney with the International Refugee Assistance Project, an advocacy group supporting program applicants.

          “Because this is a multistep process . . . if one step is put on hold, it’s inevitable that a bulge will form at that point in the system,” Alagesan said. She and other refugee advocates believe the backlog created by the 2020 slowdown will be felt for years to come unless the Biden administration makes dramatic changes.

          All Special Immigrant Visa applicants already hold some kind of security clearance that allows them to work closely with U.S. military or government personnel but are vetted again by multiple U.S. security and intelligence agencies. Applicants are also required to sit for multiple interviews and a rigorous medical examination. In all, 14 steps are required before an applicant and his or her immediate family is cleared to travel.

          1. These visas have been taking this long for 20 years.

            First, they haven’t been taking 20 yrs. They 2-3 years? Absolutely. 4-6 yrs.? Occasionally. 7-10 yrs.? Not really. 10-15 yrs.? You’re just going to keep trying to kick that football aren’t you Charlie Brown? Even then, 2 yrs…. a decade… all doable unless you sit on your ass for 20 yrs. and wait until the day of the widthdrawal to finally get moving.

            Second, so fucking what? Kids from Guatamala are birthed and walk here in less than 20 yrs. Millions of immigrants from all over the ME living all over Europe. The US is like 6% of the world’s land mass, how long do you wait for the magic dirt to pay off before you realize it’s not magic?

            Third, what the fuck do you want people to do, storm the Capitol?

            1. “Third, what the fuck do you want people to do, storm the Capitol?”

              Well, considering he gets off from citizens being executed by the government, yes he does.

              1. Given the way DOL recruited, organized, trained and led in Afghanistan, my money’s on buffalo hat guy.

                1. I love how DOL has been saying for months that insurrectionists should be shot in the face, until the insurrectionists he recruited are facing a similar fate.

          2. They ARE fucking traitors and deserve everything that’s coming to them.

      3. Yeap. Youre fucking retarded.

        1. Strong argument. Really. Wow. Well crafted. You’ve got nothing, you know nothing. Once again, you think your ignorance and strong opinion is equal to people with actual first hand knowledge and experience. Sit down, man baby.

          1. Very well crafted and exactly what you deserve.

          2. equal to people with actual first hand knowledge and experience

            You win. I haven’t personally left any translators stranded in a war zone. Good work recruiting, organizing, training, and leading. If you think any failures on your part are because your government betrayed you, maybe you should take your grievances to the Capitol building personally.

  16. When the Brits were first driven out, about 60,000 people lived in Kabul When it was the Russians turn, there were 1 3 million

    Now it’s pushing six million.

    That’s a lot of airplanes.

    https://vvattsupwiththat.blogspot.com/2021/08/the-afghan-decadal-overtuning.html

    1. 6.6 average kids per woman, per this admittedly sketchy link: https://womennewsnetwork.net/2012/05/29/afghanistan-large-families/

      2nd highest in the world. That’s a whole lot of screwin’. And a whole lot of aid, if those kids are reaching puberty.

      1. And just think, all the TradCons, the Quiverful Movement, and other Pro-Natalists want us to be just like this.

        1. What a weird thing to say.

  17. Just what we need 400,000+ collaborators and kleptocrat-lackeys too dumb to steal enough to get out on their own.

    I don’t mind the US helping to find them sanctuary in the region but why the fuck would we want to resettle them all here at taxpayer expense? If they want to come to America let them apply, stand in line and pay their own fucking way.

    1. At least you’re honest. I can respect that.

      1. And you’re not. Which I don’t.

    2. Further point:
      The US has been ‘helping’ the supposed government(s) of Afghanistan for 20 years. You’d think that 20 years of assistance would have somehow had an effect on Afghan political life, especially through the efforts of all the folks who are now demanding sanctuary.
      Wanna guess some weren’t making much of an effort beyond skimming the pass-through?
      Not sure how it could be done, now that droolin’ Joe has screwed the pooch, but we need something more than ‘THEY’RE GONNA KILL ME!’. Perhaps a good number deserve some justice.
      “Battlegrounds”, McMaster. His conclusions suck (we ought to stick our noses everywhere!), but his research looks good, especially concerning the corruption in Afghanistan.

    3. “I don’t mind the US helping to find them sanctuary in the region but why the fuck would we want to resettle them all here at taxpayer expense?”

      To keep the Vietnamese company?

      1. OK, I’ll concede we should let all the Afghan shrimpers in. So long as they can prove commercial fishing experience and at least one of the following 3:
        A. Catholic
        B. Buddhist
        C. Can make and profitably sell tasty sub sandwiches for <$5

  18. In the interest of maintaining zero population growth, here’s my suggestion. We accept the refugees, with the provision that for every Afghani we admit we dump one immigration/open borders advocate in the middle of international waters, preferably by helicopter. Given their contempt for the concept of “nation”, I don’t see why any should have to suffer their presence.

    1. We only take the women 16-35 but they have to prove assimilation by dressing like skanks and hoes, no burqas allowed.

    2. How about we drop them in the northern Afghan mountains?

  19. Yup, that’s what we need to do, import more Taliban. They can keep the M-13 members we’ve been importing company.

    That’s what diversity is all about: Importing a wide variety of people who hate you, and mean you ill.

    1. That’s what I call putting the die in diversity!

    2. Right on Brett! These people helped us for 20 years!!! But only 20!! Why, they almost certainly saved the lives of American soldiers!!

      Fuck’em!! Amiright?!?!

      1. Then you house them, beavis.

      2. By “us” who do you mean exactly? The criminal regime that’s enslaved our nation?

    3. Right, because so many Taliban members are clamoring to leave a country that is now ruled by Taliban.

      1. If there are any relevant numbers of refugees from a terrorist infested region, terrorists always mix some of their own in with them. How naive can you be?

        I said this when Germany was overrun. A year later I heard German politicians seemingly wake up to that “possibility”. Of course we will get some terrorists in the mix. They WANT to spread. Are you retarded?!

        1. Astroturfing – n. The practice of masking the sponsors of a message or organization (e.g., political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from and is supported by grassroots participants.

          The US flew us over here and resettled us but this guy keeps pointing out how terribly they treat us refugees and how they’re ultimately responsible. He couldn’t possibly be a terrorist, he’s one of the refugees! I’m sure the Taliban is above radicalizing people.

    4. You realize these are the people the Taliban are trying to kill, right?

  20. Any chance we could take the 300,000 that used to be the Afghan Army and line them up on the Mexico border pointing south?

    1. What? So they could desert like they did in Afghanistan?

  21. Kamala Harris to Afghans: Don’t come… don’t come.

  22. That picture of the Taliban posing in the capital building after taking it today is very much reminiscent of the Jan 6 storming of Washington DC. by the Trump QAnon cult.

    1. Oh my stars and garters!
      I hope the taliban stayed inside the velvet ropes!

    2. Correct. In both cases progressives have no idea what either is or how either happened.

    3. Dumb bitch.

      1. turd lies. If turd posts, it’s a lie.

    4. Maybe because both were organic resistance movements against a criminal global regime of central bankers and dipshit sjws.

  23. Probably most of you watched the Biden speech, which just concluded… He said, at length and point by point, what many of us have been saying: that we should have left Afghanistan long ago, as soon as the original mission having to do with Al-Quaeda was accomplished.  He had the authority to say that, because it had been his stance all along, even while he was the vice president of a president who believed otherwise.

    He made the point several times that if Afghanistan’s own forces, even with our training and equipment, would not even make an attempt to stand up against the Taliban, what was our purpose in staying there? 

    He pointed out that we had essentially been attempting to intervene in another country’s civil war.  What he did not say was that that was exactly what we did in Vietnam 50 years ago—and we are now seeing exactly the same result.  He could rightfully have pointed that out, but he probably wanted to stick to the issue at hand.

    As for the chaos we are now seeing, he promises to address that by sending in more troops, temporarily, strictly to oversee the evacuation of our troops and Afghan allies (his term) and their families, and for no other purpose.  He said that he has warned the Taliban that if they attempt to interfere they will be met with “devastating force”.  I expect the Taliban to comply; it’s certainly in their own interests to do so.

    It remains to be seen how many “allies” can actually be gotten out.  That process should have started months ago.  Biden explained that it was not done specifically at the request of the then-government of Afghanistan, supposedly our allies, so as not to create a panic situation.  I’m not sure what else he could have done under those circumstances.

    Perhaps now that we have followed this script twice, we will not be subjected to it for a third time, 50 years from now.

    https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2021/8/16/2046269/-Joe-Biden-Said-What-He-Needed-To-Say

    1. If only Biden had been a member of an administration after bush that could have ended the war.

      1. Obama got accused of founding ISIS when he withdrew troops from Iraq and he was being fed bs about the state of the Afghan army so it’s not surprising he stayed with a smaller presence of troops. This isn’t just about America though. It was NATO telling us that we needed to stay and train the Afghan army. It was a massive mistake and worsen. But our “mistake” was the only hope for freedom loving Afghans which is too bad.

        1. His administration did fund ISIS in Syria. He called them “moderate rebels”. The funding expanded when he decided for regime change in Libya which was a travesty of a blunder.

          1. Cite?

            1. Look it up yourself, TDS-addled asshole.

        2. So youre saying Obama was a pussy?

          1. And a world-class liar.

          2. When he was in office, I had supported an international mma event between Obama and VVP. I don’t do pay-per-views but would have bought that one.

    2. He had the authority to say that, because it had been his stance all along, even while he was the vice president of a president who believed otherwise.

      Did the King of Busing just throw Obama under the bus?

      1. No, it’s not new info.

        1. Neither is Joe voting for the war dummy.

          1. He cared so deeply for the American soldiers and troops dying in Iraq and Afghanistan that he sat quietly while the war raged on.

            Well, quietly except for the part where he extorted a job for his son from Burisma and then bragged about it. That wasn’t quiet.

            But, you know, he was quietly busy extorting jobs from people rather than ending the war that was much more important to him.

            Oh, and the sexual assault comission. He did the legwork to support the ‘Dear Colleagues’ letter. That wasn’t very quiet either. So, other than extorting jobs and effectively expanding his ‘tough on (non-)crime’ bona fides, he sat quietly rather than ending the war that was much more important to him.

            And then, during his candidacy, when he had the world as his stage, he was quietly putting his primary issue of ending the war in Afghanistan at the bottom of his platform. So quiet it was almost like it didn’t exist as part of the platform.

            Then, finally, when he had his golden opportunity to enact his hidden agenda of ending the war, the agenda that he had 18 yrs. to perfect, he accidentally pushed the date back to 9/11. Then up to 8/31. Which which doesn’t sound like much of a plan at all, doubly so considering if he’d just kept quiet, like he supposedly did for the previous 8 yrs., we’d have been out on 5/1.

            Jesus fuck, the idea that he was quietly in favor of getting out of Afghanistan makes him look even more incompetent.

    3. intervene in another country’s civil war. What he did not say was that that was exactly what we did in Vietnam 50 years ago

      A stunningly naïve comparison to a completely inaccurate assessment of historical events. You are clearly the pinnacle of a lefty public education.

      I’m not sure what else he could have done under those circumstances.

      Of that, I have no doubt.

      1. “…Of that, I have no doubt.”

        Several years of trying to get out of the 6th grade will have that effect.

    4. And you felt the need to immediately come here to defend it because……

  24. Why not do a massive airlift to Mexico and then let the Afgans cross the border? It is not like we are going to stop them, or even investigate them…

    It wasn’t getting out that was the problem; it was the way it has been incompetently executed that is the problem.

    1. And all the ‘experts’ are missing this point on purpose.

  25. They should go crush these Taliban who are surrounding Kabul,” Pompeo added. “We should do it with American airpower, we should put pressure on them, we should inflict cost and pain on them. We shouldn’t be begging them to spare the lives of Americans, we should be imposing costs on the Taliban until they allow us to execute our plan in Afghanistan.”

    But Wallace objected, noting that President Trump had in fact expressed a desire to withdraw from Afghanistan, and even led peace talks with the Taliban back in February of last year that ended in a U.S. vow to withdraw all troops by May of 2021. 

    “Critics say that for the U.S. to cut a deal with the Taliban without the Afghan government even in the room was hugely demoralizing and led inevitably to where we are today,” Wallace shot back. 

    Pomeo disputed this depiction, telling Wallace to “​​go read the deal, go read the conditions that were built into the deal.” But Wallace stuck to his line of questioning, continuing to press Pompeo on whether any deal should have been made with a terrorist organization in the first place. 

    “Do you regret giving the Taliban that legitimacy?” Wallace asked. “Do you regret pressing the Afghan government to release 5,000 prisoners? Which they did, some of whom are now back on the battlefield fighting with the Taliban.”

    “You make peace with your enemies,” Pompeo said, adding that he “never trusted the Taliban.”

    The former official continued: “We didn’t take the word of the Taliban, we watched their actions on the ground.  When they did the right thing and helped us against terror, that was all good, and when they didn’t, we crushed them.”

    On Sunday, CNN National Security Analyst Peter Bergen echoed Wallace, claiming that the Trump administration had emboldened the Taliban with a poorly structured deal. “It was the Trump administration, Secretary Pompeo’s staff that negotiated with the Taliban beginning in 2018 and they did a rather crucial thing that I think has been part of the failure here which is they excluded the Afghan government from the negotiations,” Bergen argued. 

    Despite the Taliban’s takeover of Afghanistan, President Biden has stuck by his decision to withdraw all U.S. troops from the country, citing that the U.S. had already quashed Al Qaeda and eliminated Osama bin Laden.

    https://www.salon.com/2021/08/16/pompeo-put-on-the-spot-by-fox-news-wallace-do-you-regret-giving-the-taliban-that-legitimacy/

    1. Pompeo is a Wahabi Christian. You can’t trust anything he says.

    2. No link to the nation?

      1. President Biden was right to withdraw US troops, ending a 20-year US war that never should have been waged at all. But we should have no illusion that this will end the war for Afghans. As women’s rights activist and former Afghan parliamentarian Malalai Joya reminds us, women and civil society in Afghanistan have three enemies—the Taliban, the warlords disguised as a government, and the US military occupation. If you can get rid of one of them, she said, we’d only have two.

        It won’t be easy for Afghans going forward, but the withdrawal of US troops is a necessary, if still insufficient, precondition for ending that war.

        For those of us working to press the US government for some level of accountability, perhaps these demands would be a good place to start:

        • Make the end of the recent bombing/drone raids and CIA death squad activities permanent.

        • Support UN and other international efforts to create a humanitarian corridor and guarantees of safe passage for Afghan and international humanitarian workers.

        • Fund a massive international Covid assistance program for Afghanistan.

        • Expand qualification categories for Afghan refugees and asylum seekers to come to the United States, reduce paperwork required to qualify, and add 20,000 new slots to match Canada’s commitment to accept 20,000 additional vulnerable Afghans for resettlement.

        • Given the legacy of US actions in Afghanistan, begin the process of officially acknowledging US responsibility for the war’s impact on Afghan people.

        https://www.thenation.com/article/world/washington-afghanistan-taliban-women/

        1. I’ll trust a Nation link more, because they’re just far-left, rather than being a dedicated party organ like Salon.
          Still, it’s like quoting Breitbart or Alex Jones and expecting a lefty to nod along.

        2. Also, nobody is saying Biden shouldn’t have pulled out.

          Instead they’re saying that there was a timetable and a process mutually agreed upon by the Afghan government, the tribal leaders, the US and the Taliban.

          Then Biden and his neocon pals took a hot shit on it, broke their word, started another fight and then suddenly decided to book it.

          You couldn’t have fucked it up more if you were trying to… and maybe you guys were.

        3. • Make the end of the recent bombing/drone raids and CIA death squad activities permanent.
          • Support UN and other international efforts to create a humanitarian corridor and guarantees of safe passage for Afghan and international humanitarian workers.
          • Fund a massive international Covid assistance program for Afghanistan.
          • Expand qualification categories for Afghan refugees and asylum seekers to come to the United States, reduce paperwork required to qualify, and add 20,000 new slots to match Canada’s commitment to accept 20,000 additional vulnerable Afghans for resettlement.
          • Given the legacy of US actions in Afghanistan, begin the process of officially acknowledging US responsibility for the war’s impact on Afghan people.

          What a steaming pile of feel-good bullshit absent any concrete notions on how to accomplish those ends, especially now that Biden has fucked up the execution of his first real mid-east policy initiative. Do they expect this all to come about in the next two days? When’s the last time the UN actually accomplished anything at all?
          Hey, pod, do you want a pony, too?

        4. MORE FUCKING MONEY???????????

    3. What ever would the Taliban do if they hadn’t been given legitimacy?

      1. Good old fashioned religion!

        1. ^ Good, old fashioned lefty bigotry!

          1. It’s called honesty.

            1. Something you know nothing about.

            2. It’s called honesty.
              You.
              Are.
              Full.
              Of.
              Shit.
              Steaming pile of lefty shit asshole.

  26. There’s a lesson here about forcing democracy down the throats of people who really don’t want it that badly.

    1. It’s the same lesson we didn’t learn in Iraq.

    2. Weird that Trotskyists didn’t understand
      democracy.

    3. Nobody actually wants democracy. Everyone wants their tribe to triumph over its enemies. It’s that fucking simple.

    4. But enough about Rev. Kirkland…

  27. This is why Obama’s approach in Libya was so beautiful.

    “Look Libya. We’re gonna throw enough Tomahawk’s at you to chase Qaddaffi out of his spidey-hole. Then you pull the motherfucker out and drag him through the streets until he is sufficiently dead”

    No ground troops! Obama = winner!

    1. And as a bonus, the slave markets were
      brought back. Yay Obama!

      1. Also, those pesky women can’t be educated anymore! Yay Obama!

        1. And gays get free flying lessons off of rooftops. Yay Obama!

          1. Obama ramped up how many troops in the near east? Yay Obo.
            BTW, turd lies. turd lies like most people breath; turd lies always and everywhere about everything.
            turd is incapable of posting without lying.
            turd is a pathological liar who is too stupid to understand that others already know this.
            turd lies; it’s what turd does.

      2. Nothing says ironic more than the fact that an African American reintroduced sub-Saharan slavery to North Africa.

        1. The twist is it actually isn’t ironic.

          1. Considering they effectively, if not inadvertently, introduced it to N. America, one might be inclined to see an MO.

  28. No. I have no interest in importing tens of thousands of medieval barbarians to the US. They can stay and make the best of it in their homeland or flee to neighboring countries.

    1. Reason: “Who will run our 7 11s”

      1. Joe biden said it was Indians.

        1. “They’ll steal your feet!”

      2. And drive our Shashlik food trucks? Where we will get our authentic hash oil infused Afghan pita?

    2. Can we export the ones who are already here?

      I’m talking about all Republicans.

      1. You should go door to door and get rid of them yourself nazi.

        1. But I’m going to assume you don’t think it’s “Nazi” to want to export millions of people who aren’t Republicans, based solely on their race or culture.

          1. I know you’re a communist fuckwit, but traditionally members of a nation state get to decide who is allowed to live there.

          2. “Neo-colonialism and population redistribution aren’t fascist as long as we get to pick which race goes where” t. Tony

          3. Was that intended to communicate something to those who speak English, or just to those who’ve sucked down a 5th of liquor?

      2. People are gonna die because of our dishonesty and incompetence.

        Good time for you to ignore that and zealously grind your tiresome ax. The way you think and act, I’d afraid of you and your ilk in power as your republican taliban. Hate is hate. Yours is no more attractive.

        1. Look in the mirror, asshole.

    3. They’re far more civilized than your average Chicago dinger.

  29. What no one seems to realize is what going to war means. You have to knock the sober out of the enemy. There was no doubt in the minds of the Germans at the end of WWII who the winner was. Same with Japan.

    Problem with Korea and Vietnam is the pols prevented the military from doing it’s job. When MacArthur wanted to bomb the bridges over the Yalu River Truman told him he could only bomb the Southern half of the bridges not the Northern half. It does not take a military genus to understand bombing bridges over a river prevents troops from crossing the river, but the pols preventing the military from bombing. Same in Vietnam bombing was restricted and prime military targets were off limits.

    Point is if you go to war go to war and don’t play war games.

    1. The Russians went medieval on those dumb mfers but it didn’t work and pretty much gave us the Taliban.

      1. I think you mean; the Soviets.

        1. Russia is currently maintaining its embassy there. Apparently the other European nations have or are withdrawing their personnel.

    2. America won the war handily within weeks after it started. It was the 20 year occupation that we botched.

      1. fuck off and die, asshole

  30. People should only be allowed to own weapons commensurate with the century their beliefs come from.

    1. You would be unarmed then.

      1. Actually you wouldn’t even have arms.

    2. Seeing as you can’t into basic chemistry or math, and your historical knowledge doesn’t predate the seventies, your get to be armed with a sharp slice of apple.

      Don’t cut yourself.

    3. “the century their beliefs come from”

      Tony is like a living encyclopedic list of fallacious reasoning.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recency_bias

    4. What does that leave you with, a used syringe?

  31. Critics spent the weekend decrying the withdrawal as premature.

    Where’s the hyperlinks to 3 or 4 center- right/left neocons?

    Must of been too hard to cherrypick among all those strawmen.

  32. At some point – should we reassess how competent a volunteer Army really is for the US? does it really serve our national interest or does it mostly serve to prolong warlettes into a state of permawar?

    1. “At some point – should we reassess how competent a volunteer Army really is for the US?”

      The cowardly piece of lefty shit JFree supports slavery; discuss.

    2. A few hundred thousand Afghan refugees relocated to the US will probably be an improvement. It will ease the burden of Taliban score settling in Afghanistan, and will give the US an infusion of new blood.

      “should we reassess how competent a volunteer Army”

      It’s not their competence at issue. It’s their resolve. The Taliban are a volunteer militia of part time goat herders. It was their resolve over the years that returned them to Kabul. Americans have nothing but contempt for the people of Afghanistan. They were doomed to fail from the start.

      1. Fuck off and die, asshole

  33. https://twitter.com/ElectionWiz/status/1427415744770449411?t=sGoUSBghQGlQ51Ug9sIdKA&s=19

    NEW: Joe Biden has arrived back at Camp David and the White House has called a lid, according to the pool. An unknown number of Americans remain trapped in Kabul.

    1. How humble of him.

    2. How dare you!

    3. “An unknown number of Americans remain trapped in Kabul.”

      They should probably lie low for a while until things cool down, and then give themselves up to the authorities.

      1. The Dept of State has been advising them to shelter in place. There are apparently some at the Kabul airport as well. The WH would not release the estimate hinting that they had no idea how many it is.

        1. It’s a long way from the white house to the Kabul airport.

          1. fuck off and die, asshole

    4. It’s after 8 p.m. somewhere.

  34. Pakistan is that way ———>

    Good luck.

  35. We need to get Allied boots off Arab ground.

    The Arabs of the Middle East have been living a red white and blue dawn scenario for over a century ever since the Allies made a deal with the devil called the Balfour declaration.

    There’s nothing equal in that shithole apartheid state calling itself Israel. You don’t have to take my word for it, listen to a Jew with a conscience.

    Miko Peled is an Israeli, an author, a public speaker and the son of a famous Israeli general.

    He is also opposed to Israeli apartheid of Palestinians.

    In the following video he puts into perspective what you won’t see in our western propaganda.

    Between 40:40 and 43:45 in the video he describes Israeli terrorism.

    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TOaxAckFCuQ

    1. You do realize, RabbiHarveyWeinstein, that Afghans are not Arabs, right?

    2. This is very odd, because a lot of actual Arabs seem to have no problem with Israel. Saudi Arabia and UAE seem to basically accepted Israel as an ally

      Iran hates them, but they aren’t Arabs. They are Caucasians, actually. So are a lot of Afghans, except along the border with Pakistan

      Turkey also has been hostile to Iran, but again, they aren’t Arab. They are Turks (and basically occupying what used to be part of Greece)

      1. This is very odd, because a lot of actual Arabs seem to have no problem with Israel. Saudi Arabia and UAE seem to basically accepted Israel as an ally

        There are Arab citizens of Israel who ars defenders of Israel, but be not fooled by Saudi Arabia and U.A.E. What they’re doing is what is called hudna, where Islamic forces have a temporary truce with the Kufir (Unbelievers) until they get theemselves together and start the Jihad again.

        The Islamic members of OPEC have lost their lock on petroleum production, since the U.S. is finally starting to tap the vast oil and shale reserves in North America, since Europe has new oil discovery in the North Sea, and since even Israel has discovered it has more oil than Saudi Arabia. This means the Islamic OPEC nations are desperate. They won’t be able to bankroll terrorism with less oil revenues. So they have stopped fighting until they can fight another day.

        Perhaps the Islamic OPEC nations will see they need more than just one commodity to have prosperity, will diversify their economy, and free their economies and minds with them. Then the death-grip of Islam will be smashed. We’ll know for sure if we see a Six Flags Over Tehran and A Whole New DisneyWorld In Mecca and Medina.

    3. If you can’t refute what you deny you might as well focus on irrelevancies.

      Before the Balfour declaration, with Zionists fooling the US into WW1 in exchange for Palestine, the entire Middle East was part of the Ottoman Empire. Afghanistan isn’t even part of the Middle East.

      The Allies dismantled the Ottoman Empire and have sowed discord for over a century throughout the region with the help of some truly corrupt Arab states like Saudi Arabia.

  36. “Nobody is safe from the Taliban’s terror.”

    Then why the hell didn’t they fight? We armed and trained them for 20 years and they quit in a day.

    No, we owe them nothing more.

    It’s unsettling that Reason’s answer to every issue seems to be Admit More Third World Refugees.

    1. “We armed and trained them for 20 years and they quit in a day.”

      They knew something we didn’t (don’t).

      “It’s unsettling that Reason’s answer to every issue seems to be Admit More Third World Refugees.”

      Reason understands they will be an improvement over the whining, self indulgent blimps who are the current occupants.

  37. No. America spent the last 20 years trying to teach cowards how to defend themselves. The moment they were on their own, they gave their country to tyrants. The world has enough cowards. We don’t need to export them from Afghanistan to everywhere else.

    1. ” America spent the last 20 years trying to teach cowards how to defend themselves. ”

      This is nothing to boast about.

      “they gave their country to tyrants.”

      You prefer the tyrants who were running the show until yesterday? You picked a fine time to tell us.

    2. They are not cowards. They are just doing what they have been doing for thousands of years. Afghanistan has really never had a central government. It is a loose collection of tribes and ethnicities who often fight each other.

      The idea that the US was going to create some kind of western democracy there was preposterous. The Taliban hardly had to fight. They just made deals with the local warlords which seem to pretty much amount to “just put down your weapons and go home”. So they did.

      Now the Taliban are again going to have to confront the harsh reality that conquest is easy. It is dismounting and ruling which is hard.

  38. “400,000 Afghans have been internally displaced”

    Why couldn’t these people pick up a weapon and fight? They’d have outnumbered the Taliban over 4-1. They’d rather submit to an guerilla army mounted on pick-up trucks than stand up for themselves one iota.

  39. No the Allies destroyed infrastructure, military and destabilized governance installing weak puppets for over a century.

    Resistance evolved from the strength and resilience of courageous people to fight and succeed against overwhelming military superiority.

    The red white and blue dawn Allies call them terrorists.

  40. Afghan refugees account for over half sexual assault cases in Austria. I can countenance allowing in those who can verify their employment with us, but otherwise keep them as far away as possible. If they are just fleeing immediate danger no reason they can’t be hosted in neighboring countries. I’d even support us paying them aid there.

  41. I say we do a swap. Take all those in the USA that though invading was a good idea and send ’em all over there, swap them out for Afghans on a one-to-one basis.

  42. What’s this “WE” shit Fiona and how many “refugees” can we put you down for?

    1. She means “Thee not me”
      The woman’s a NIMBY asshole.

  43. “We Need To Get Afghans Out of Afghanistan Too”
    Brilliant idea.
    Absolutely brilliant.
    Not as if thousands of people aren’t entering the USA illegally from South America.
    It worked out so wonderfully for the Europeans.
    It’s not as if the Turks aren’t shitting themselves thinking about thousands of Afghans coming into their country through Iran.
    Germans are getting fed up.
    Some areas in Sweden are ungovernable and living standards are dropping like a stone.
    Places like Turkey are still suffering in a major way from Syrians immigrating from their war-zone.
    It got so bad Erdogan tried, and failed because the Greeks told him to go to hell, to palm off a few thousand onto the rest of Europe.
    But I’m sure Harrigan can house a few hundred Afghans in her house.
    They can watch and laugh at her every time she takes a dump.

  44. Their leader just embezzled 169 million dollars; we owe them nothing. What they owe us for the past 20 years can never be repaid and we won’t ask them for it; but, we owe them nothing.

  45. The British government said it would take in 5,000 Afghan refugees this year, primarily women and children, as lawmakers packed Parliament Wednesday for a heated emergency debate on the U.K. response to the Taliban’s seizure of power in Afghanistan.

    Prime Minister Boris Johnson, who has come under fire for the chaotic turn of events in Afghanistan, said a new “generous” refugee settlement program would allow up to 20,000 vulnerable Afghans to seek sanctuary in the U.K. in the coming years. That number is over and above the 5,000 or so Afghan allies the U.K. is trying to evacuate from Kabul’s international airport.
    https://worldabcnews.com/british-government-details-plan-to-settle-20000-afghan-refugees-in-heated-emergency-debate/

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