Immigration

Trump's Student Visa Disaster 

There are 1.2 million foreign students in the United States, and ICE keeps leaving them in the lurch, threatening to kick them out (and then rescinding that guidance).

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There are 1.2 million foreign students in the United States, enrolled in 5,300 American colleges and universities. Most come to America on nonimmigrant F-1 and M-1 visas that require them to maintain a full course load at universities approved by the Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) Student and Exchange Visitor Program. In order to guard against diploma mills, the program grants accreditation mostly to universities that offer classroom instruction and usually limits foreign students to three credit hours of online instruction per semester.

When COVID-19 hit and colleges moved online, ICE did the sensible thing and allowed international students to finish their spring and summer semesters by taking their classes online without voiding their visas. The agency rescinded that guidance in early July, however, ordering international students attending online-only programs to either leave or face deportation and risk getting barred from the U.S. for 10 years. This meant several hundred thousand foreign students would have had to quickly terminate leases on apartments, uproot the lives they've built here, and find exorbitantly expensive flights back home without any idea of when they would be allowed to return to complete their education.

Lawsuits by Harvard University and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology prompted the Trump administration to issue new rules in late July allowing foreigners who are already enrolled to continue their studies online. But even though students who are here will be allowed to stay, the new rules will still deny visas to incoming freshmen from abroad whose universities are offering only online courses in response to the pandemic. They can either defer for a semester or begin their programs online from their home countries—a logistically challenging proposition for many due to time differences.

Roughly 80,000 people, or about 30 percent of new international students, even before the new pandemic visa rules, had decided not to come this fall, according to Brad Farnsworth, vice president of the American Council on Education. Given the political uncertainty, many of them might permanently abandon their plans to study in the U.S. and go to more welcoming countries instead.

The ban is a major hit to American universities. International students constitute 5.5 percent of all students. They pump around $41 billion into colleges annually and support nearly 460,000 jobs on campus and in surrounding communities. Many of them pay full tuition, which subsidizes the price tag for American kids. Universities also depend on foreign graduate students to assist in classroom instruction, especially in science, technology, engineering, and math (STEM) fields.

America was already facing declining international enrollment for three years straight. The administration's move will only intensify that trend.

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  1. They pump around $41 billion into colleges annually and support nearly 460,000 jobs on campus and in surrounding communities. Many of them pay full tuition, which subsidizes the price tag for American kids.

    Maybe their departure will push some of these baby sitting services to close their cafes, infinity pools, climbing walls, diversity training, and gender studies departments. Good news.

    1. If there is one thing easily proven, it is colleges don’t operate on a market basis if you look at costs vs inflation. Shikha is full of shit.

      1. It is a seriously distorted market, but a market. Else podunk u could charge the same as Yale.

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    2. Those amenities exist for feckless American students. I doubt many foreign students come here for anything other than a rigorous education.

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    4. They pump around $41 billion into colleges annually and support nearly 460,000 jobs on campus and in surrounding communities. Many of them pay full tuition, which subsidizes the price tag for American kids.

      This is completely wrong and shows a complete lack of understanding of how higher education operates and is funded.

      A large percentage of those students is graduate students on research grants. Even undergrads are paid for from research grants. That includes who pays for those “jobs on campus”. Even the small percentage of students that actually pays full tuition doesn’t even come close to paying their way because tuition only pays a fraction of university budgets anyway, the rest made up for mostly by government.

      The reason universities are so desperate over this is because the majority of graduate students in STEM fields are international. In computer science and electrical 80% of graduate students are international. Lush departmental budgets and large numbers of faculty positions wouldn’t exist without international students coming in to fill the positions and work on research grants. That is, foreign students are used as placeholders in a massive scheme of subsidies that funnels government money to universities.

      Of course, the professors themselves are mostly foreign born as well, again paid for lavishly by tax payers. And most departments are utterly unrepresentative of the US population, just not in the way diversity advocates claim: they are overwhelmingly minority and immigrant.

      High tech companies like this because it amounts to a massive tax payer subsidy of their interests: they get to pick the best people who come out of that pipeline, and those who don’t make it are again picked up by the taxpayer, because they usually stay anyway.

      How any of this serves the American tax payer is unclear. The idea that this massive scheme of subsidies and government handouts has anything to do with “libertarianism” or free markets is absurd. Local economies would be far better off if they got tax breaks instead of government subsidized consumption by foreign students.

      Government funding of universities has massively increased over the last 40 years, and the resulting increase in faculty and students has meant that quality of US university education has been sharply declining. The US university system used to be the best in the world; these days, it’s mediocre, not because of too little funding, but because of too much funding.

      The libertarian approach would be simple: eliminate all government research grants and eliminate all tax breaks for universities and force them to operate like a normal business. Then we can hand out student visas like popcorn, and I guarantee you, the number of international students who would come under a free market regime would be very, very small.

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  2. Get rid of foreign students and tuitions would stabilize. They’re one of two reasons for the crazy increases in tuition rates.

    The second reason is student loans given so much, but it’s not as bad as all the foreign students.

    They pay full cash tuition, so schools raise rates on everyone to extract more cash. It hurts everyone else hi has to take out crazy loans.

    Plus, they’re the worst kinds of students: privileged idiots who get in based on wealth. Awful to teach such brats.

    And they steal IP.

    And….Many use their time here to have babies that become Democrats in 18 years.

    So get rid of foreign students.

    1. No. Get rid of loans to students pursuing non-STEM and non-classical degrees (not history, English lit, etc, but gender studies, black studies, etc). Or perhaps charge higher interest to students following those fake studies, based on historical default data.

      1. i.e., get rid of the federal student loan guarantees. the market will figure out the risk adjusted rates.

  3. Trump is trying to destroy America because he hates our country.

    1. Love Trumps Hate, remember?

      1. Hitler was missing a testicle. Trump has a mushroom dick. Both had abusive fathers.

        1. Youre not a very good student of history are you.

          1. English wasn’t your strong suit?

            1. Logic and reasoning don’t appear to be your strong suit, Pod.

            2. Time to go back to Huffpo.

            3. It doesn’t seem to be yours either, Strazele.

              (Looks like our class clown Kirkland got a new handle?)

              1. Nah…Strazele is Pod reborn. The writing style betrays him. So does the use of mfer.

        2. You’re continued obsession with Trump’s penis is noted.

        3. Strazele, keep trying this humor thing, you’ll surely improve!

    2. Either your professors, drugs or both are making you delusional.

      1. He’s still in 8th grade, and unfortunately, I’m afraid he was born this way.

    3. You’re funny, but not quite as good as OBL.

    4. The Russian bot has spoken.

  4. Indeed. Sheesh, for one second, you’ve almost convinced me to vote for Biden in November, almost… that said, I’m still voting for Trump.

    1. You’ve been a loser in America’s culture war for the entirety of your deplorable life . . . why change now?

      1. Your autistic screeching is not nearly as entertaining as it used to be.

  5. Memo to foreign students: Buh bye. Shrieka can join them.

    When the covid crisis passes, we’ll invite you back.

    1. Or January 20 arrives . . . whichever comes first.

      I hope you’re stocking up on hankies, clingers.

      1. You know Arthur, I can always tell when washed up former loser Democrat politicians are worried. They dial up the dreck.

        The only thing I am stocking up on are the names of the next 100 federal district court judges POTUS Trump will get confirmed. And the 2-3 dozen circuit court judges. And maybe even another SCOTUS justice.

  6. So let’s see. It’s all right for The Metropolitan Transportation Commission to require that 60% of the employees of large businesses in the Bay Area telecommute, but it’s wrong to tell foreign students that if they’re telelearning, the don’t have any need to stay in the U.S.

    Okay.

    1. Apparently Ms Dalmia thinks the virus should only cause disruption and economic loss to Americans. Foreign students are a class apart and should be protected from any loss.

  7. I’ll start a poll of all the small business owners who’ve had their livelihoods destroyed from shutdowns d/t Wuhan virus if theses students should be exempt from the pandemic response.

  8. “new rules will still deny visas to incoming freshmen from abroad whose universities are offering only online courses ”
    The metropolitan transit commission approves

  9. Three and one-half months, clingers.

    Then, the reckoning begins.

    1. Nah, I’ll be fine either way.

      1. Same here, R Mac.

    2. I’m wondering what will happen if the election doesn’t go to Trump. I doubt he and his faithful will accept the results if they don’t go his way.

      1. It is quite simple, actually. We will get our asses to work, and get Biden out of office in 2024 via the ballot box. What the hell else do you expect? That is the way it works.

        1. What I expect is that if Biden wins, Trump and his faithful will claim the election results aren’t valid because fraud or whatever, and there will not be a peaceful transition of power. I really hope I’m wrong.

          1. Look at the lefty project.

          2. sarcasmic….take a deep breath. Let’s have the election first before we declare failure.

            I will say that mailing out ballots to all registered voters where the voter registration lists have not been cleansed (either by happenstance or design) does not inspire confidence. That is certainly the case in the People’s Republic of NJ where I have received ballots for a child (moved away years ago) and a dead relative (died from Covid).

            In the People’s Republic of NJ, there will not be in-person voting in a voting booth. You only get to cast a provisional ballot. Phailing Phil Murphy has compromised our vote.

      2. You can tell the left is planning coup 2.0 when its acolytes start throwing hints.

        1. Hey Bitch’s Bitching, got an example of me supporting the left? C’mon, loudmouth. Show just one.

          1. Poor thing. You should take a break. Is there a park nearby you can take a walk in? I promise it will help.

          2. Like when you came out as an Anarcho-socialist?

            sarcasmic
            October.4.2020 at 3:11 pm

            Socialism works for families and small groups where everyone knows each other and everyone is accountable. Shirkers can be shamed. Worked great for tribes for thousands of years. So it’s hardwired into our brains. But when the groups get bigger, like towns, counties, states or countries, there is no shame effect. People don’t know who the shirkers are, and worse the shirkers become protected.

            It can work on a very small scale. But it is not scalable.

            1. Wow, dude. Talk about reading comprehension fail on your part. Seriously.

              My point was that when everyone know each other, like say in a family or in a tribe, “From each according to ability and to each according to need” works. But when imposed by force through government on larger groups it will always fail.

              If you interpret that as support of the left then you’re either dishonest or very, very stupid.

    3. Three and one-half months, clingers. Then, the reckoning begins.

      For people with above average skills and savings electing socialists and progressives is merely an inconvenience: we just leave for greener pastures. Of course, you’ll be stuck here and without others to pay for you.

      Thatcher got it wrong when she said “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people’s money.” In fact, the real problem with socialism is that you can’t force people to be productive and that people vote with their feet.

      Let’s hope for your sake that you won’t get an object lesson in this, because you’d be in trouble.

    4. You’re so cute when you try to be threatening.

  10. “Universities also depend on foreign graduate students to assist in classroom instruction”
    Classes run by foreign graduate teaching assistants were the worst

  11. Good Trump supporters understand that immigrants aren’t human beings, and don’t deserve to be treated as such. Only progressive liberal Democrats like the people running Reason would think otherwise.

    1. Good Trump supporters understand that immigrants aren’t human beings, and don’t deserve to be treated as such.

      Please learn something about immigration. International students aren’t immigrants, they are temporary visitors, the same status as tourists. They have neither a right nor expectation to stay in the US.

      1. Furners bad, Trumptardz

        1. Privileged, ignorant Americans like you have no idea how the world outside US borders works, or how the US immigration system works.

          It takes immigrants like myself to keep morons like you from destroying your birth country.

      2. Of course they’re immigrants.

        If they wanted a world class education, they could study in Russia or France or China, too. They come here, however, because their goal is to make babies and scam the immigration system to get in.

  12. They can either defer for a semester or begin their programs online from their home countries—a logistically challenging proposition for many due to time differences.

    What a fucking travesty. College students able to work a day job. When will the madness end!

    1. Why are Trump supporters like school at five in the morning?

      No class.

    2. a logistically challenging proposition for many due to time differences.

      And it’s not even remotely logistically challenging. Millions of people do this every day.
      As usual, Shikha’s manufacturing concerns that don’t really exist, because the whole student visa thing is a nonissue.
      She only has one drum to bang and Covid poked a hole in the top.

  13. OK, Shikha, please openly state what you really want. Is it more international enrollment in US universities, which under the New Normal means most students can participate from home (and truly provides more access regardless of family wealth and logistics)? Or is it more brown bodies moving here?

    1. Shecky, like the Old Beaner before her, simply want to anchor in those last few remaining cousins.

  14. Here’s an idea, stop discriminating against White males, they’ll do the classroom instruction. Oh wait, no we don’t want that, do we? Wrong narrative. We’re trying to convince the world the men who built the west are suddenly stupid, weak, and incompetent. Sure, keep pushing that. I’m certain there will be no backlash whatsoever. When the shtf, the women and foreigners will defend us – I’m certain.

    1. Hell, stop discriminating against Asian students! That’s the big stinky elephant in the room no one wants to recognize. Asian students do much better in college admissions (and college performance) than Whites, Blacks, Latinos, other POCs and BIPOCs, etc. Why? Because for the most part, American Asian culture figured out long ago that a degree from a good college, not government handouts, was the best avenue to success. So they make their kids study. It’s not just Tiger Mom stuff, it’s the culture of putting an emphasis on bettering oneself.

      White folk are losing that. We’re soft and complacent and write letters to Hahvard demanding the limit Asian enrollment so Junior the party animal son can get in. And Black and Latino folk are still trying to get that, but are battling a political structure that trains them to think they can’t do it.

      Gross generalities, of course. And “Asians” cover half the world’s population. But I say dump the quotas and setasides and racial/ethnic admission standards, and place blindfolds on admissions personnel. If Hahvahd ends up 80% Asian, that’s a Good Thing! If Whites don’t like it they know how to boost Junior’s grades. If Blacks don’t like it they can stop depending on government step stools and make their own.

  15. “. . . international students attending online-only programs . . . “

    So, the colleges being ‘hurt’ by this could fix their own situation by offering in-person classes in addition to the online ones?

  16. “Given the political uncertainty, many of them might permanently abandon their plans to study in the U.S. and go to more welcoming countries instead.”

    Such as……?

  17. Why is this article tagged for “Immigration”?

    People visiting the US on student visas are not immigrants.

    1. They are regulated through immigration policy and enforced by U.S. immigration agents. I guess that makes it fall under “immigration” as a tag.

    2. Of course they’re immigrants.

      If they wanted a world class education, they could study in Russia or France or China, too. They come here, however, because their goal is to make babies and scam the immigration system to get in.

  18. Funny. All classes online. Students will be require to stay home. Shikha, “but what about all those foreign students; why do they have to stay home for class?”

    1. Oh yeah; I forgot about TDS. This has got to rank up in the top 10% of pathetic excuses to complain about Trump. Oh, considering the history of pathetic complaints maybe the top 80% most pathetic?

    2. Harder to over-stay a student visa at home?

  19. The solution is simple. Just have ICE accept college accreditation as meaning a college is accredited. No need for an extra layer of rules on top. Foreign students on certain visas need to attend accredited schools. Done. See, simple!

  20. Nothing like blaming Trump for the incompetent and fear mongering shutdowns of universities and other schools (as well as all other so-called nonessential businesses) by anti Trump Democrat governors, mayors, university presidents and faculty.

    People under the age of 50 (and especially those under 30, who comprise the overwhelming majority of undergrad and graduate students) are less likely to die from the China virus than from the annual flu.

  21. There are 1.2 million foreign students in the United States, and ICE keeps leaving them in the lurch, threatening to kick them out (and then rescinding that guidance).

    Let’s be clear: it’s universities who are leaving them in the lurch, by going to online education without a sound public health rationale.

  22. Universities want foreign students because they pay far higher fees. This is about cash flow. Appeals to nonsense don’t work.

    1. I wrote this exact thing before. Hours and hours before.

  23. Just sitting here waiting on that article about Gina Haspel holding up the declassification of Trump/Russia documents because such documents put her and the CIA in a bad light.

    Being a libertarian magazine, I assumed corruption in the CIA by someone like Gina Haspel would definitely deserve attention. But alas, I guess even someone like Gina Haspel is now cool to Reason as long as she is thwarting Trump.

    1. Wait, what? You were expecting a libertarian magazine?

      1. Reason is a forum for ex-Shoprite employees

        1. My Next-door neighbor still works for ShopRite. I’m trying to get him to quit.

  24. Again, my daughter goes to vet school in Grenada. No one would dream of ger having to be in Grenada for the online classes

  25. Why do they need to be in the US to take online courses? Makes no sense.

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