Reason Roundup

Is Asymptomatic Spread of COVID-19 Very Rare? Depends How You Define 'Asymptomatic'

Plus: Netflix out-trademarks the U.S. government, contraception shortages, and more...


New confusion over asymptomatic transmission of COVID-19. We've been told by public health experts for weeks that COVID-19 is being spread in part by masses of sick people who show no symptoms. Now, World Health Organization (WHO) epidemiologist Maria Van Kerkhove says spread by asymptomatic people is "very rare." What?

Former Food and Drug Administration head Scott Gottlieb said WHO is making premature conclusions. "Clearly there is some asymptomatic spread—the magnitude of it is going to take time to determine…and it's going to take a lot better data than what WHO is basing this conclusion on quite frankly," he said.

Still, some are already interpreting this as "another early scare about coronavirus [that] has been tamped down." But Bloomberg News points out that WHO "had said as far back as February that it did not see asymptomatic cases as a major cause of viral spread."

But the whole thing may be a miscommunication. Here's more of Van Kerkhove's comments on asymptomatic spread of COVID-19:

"When we actually go back and say, 'How many of them were truly asymptomatic?' we find out that many have really mild disease…They're not quote-unquote COVID symptoms, meaning they may not have developed fever yet, they may not have had a significant cough, or they many not have shortness of breath. But some may have mild disease."

As Slate's Will Saletan sums up: "Van Kerkhove said many people thought to be asymptomatic were actually mildly symptomatic. So we might just be reclassifying the undetected spread."

Overall, people seem to be mixed up about what asymptomatic means.

"Some of the confusion lies in the distinction between the roles played by truly asymptomatic people and those who are merely pre-symptomatic—and later go on to become ill—in spreading the disease," writes Bloomberg's Jeff Sutherland. "Pre-symptomatic individuals, who develop a higher viral load just before the onset of symptoms, may be infectious, the WHO said."

A lot of our talk about asymptomatic carriers of COVID-19 has included a) people who don't yet have traditional symptoms (fever, cough, etc.) but will soon develop them and b) people who may never develop traditional COVID-19 symptoms but still show other signs of illness. However, the WHO does not seem to be including these people in its definition of asymptomatic. Its group of asymptomatic coronavirus carriers—those for whom passing on the disease is "very rare"—includes only people with the disease who never develop any symptoms.


• Video contradicts a police story yet again:

• Netflix has a new show, released May 29, starring Steve Carell as the head of the U.S. Space Force and, currently, "Netflix … is outmaneuvering the U.S. government to secure trademark rights globally to the armed services name," notes The Hollywood Reporter.

• Parts of the world might be facing condom and birth control supply-chain interruptions due to COVID-19.

• "Where are libertarians on police reform?" Right where we've always been, writes J.D. Tuccille.

NEXT: House Democrats' $500 Billion Transportation Overhaul Would Require Doubling the Federal Gas Tax

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  1. New confusion over asymptomatic transmission of COVID-19.

    Has it been milkshake ducked? Read to find out!

    1. I guess if we’re going to be wrong 18 ways from Sunday, it’s best if it is about a nothing burger virus.

      1. Think of this one as our practice pandemic.

        1. If only the lead scientist was named Mulligan.

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    2. Hello.

      It’s over. They lost the plot.

      The second they went from ‘the virus will kill us all because of irresponsible open up MAGA protests’ to ‘Yay! Racism pandemic! It’s ok to protest!’ while HEALTH CARE HEROES applauded in public in their PPEs.

      Now that Trump is about to resume his campaigning and all the big crowds that come with it, I presume the ‘OMFG VIRUS WILL KILL US ALL’ will be back.

      1. Now that Trump is about to resume his campaigning and all the big crowds that come with it, I presume the ‘OMFG VIRUS WILL KILL US ALL’ will be back.

        Which will make them look like even bigger morons in the eyes of anyone with half a brain.

        1. More likely not-so-veiled celebration if there is a COVID-19 outbreak among Trump rally attendees.

      2. Who stood to gain from the lockdowns? Would it be the DNC keeping Ol’ Sniffy out of the spotlight for 3 months so he couldn’t torpedo their chances?

        1. Oh, please. You may disagree with the lockdowns, but they were motivated by trying to keep people healthy. Also, both Republicans and Democrats supported stay at home orders.

          1. When the orders were supposed to last only fifteen days to flatten the curve.

  2. “Defund the police” isn’t polling well and is being walked back.

    1. Because even with the qualifications of “oh, they’re just shifting money to social services,” or “they’re just going to re-brand, or shift everyone to the county sheriff and hire the old employees,”

      Ellison showed how confused they all are when he said that the whole process of figuring things out could take up to a year. The problem is that they are working with groups like MPD150 who appear to genuinely believe that the entire law enforcement apparatus needs to be eliminated (google their website, there’s a number of unverifiable “just-so” stories, and a cartoon they did with lunatic declarations about how an ethnically diverse population will sit around and work things out peacefully in criminal disputes). That’s insanity on a level that even most liberals won’t accept.

      Gen-X politicians are really going out of their way lately to show all that time in front of the TV when they were kids ended up rotting all semblance of whatever future-time orientation they might have had. Now they can’t even run a lemonade stand much less a complex society, because they think life’s problems can all be solved in 30-60 minute segments and with sweeping declarations, with the inevitable result that they look like jackasses later on when they have to explain themselves or walk back their idiocy.

      1. The Gen-X part is perplexing to me.

        I know we were a cynical and cool bunch but there was always a line of values we never breached being still in close contact with the Greatest Generation and Boomers. We were the original gamers but we were still mentally tough and respected our common heritage though we did question authority a lot. We did notice the inconsistencies of our history but weren’t prepared to destroy it.

        We weren’t fucking nihilists.

        In my view, because of where we’re placed in the scale betwixt two giant generations in the Boomers and these brain dead millennials, we’re actually the responsible ones who will have to clean up their messes and we’re going to get screwed.

        So fuck ’em both.

        I’m not overly surprised there are Gen Xers buying into this bull shit because we did have those moronic movements in the 80s too. The BDS and TDS, recall, were preceded by Reagan Derangement Syndrome. I remember teachers in school making fun of him. Everyone was dumb to those assholes.

        I’m rambling but the point is Gen X is perfectly suited to hold the line and tell everyone to fuck off.

        1. we’re actually the responsible ones who will have want to clean up their messes but will be outvoted

    2. who would have thunk it. Just because no one’s wanting to openly question it because they don’t want to get beaten up doesn’t mean anyone supports them.

      I don’t know if you saw, but Linkedin made the mistake of having a company-wide meeting on “teh racism” and then made the mistake of allowing anonymous questions. Everyone started asking uncomfortable questions like “wait, are you saying that promotion ISN’T just based on merit” and “why should we support people burning down our homes” and my personal favorite, someone brought up some of the white guys who’ve been shot and never got any attention..

      1. Missed it, but that sounds absolutely hilarious.

      2. LinkedIn sucks. It’s the TedTalks of whatever the fuck they do.

        1. but if a silicon valley tech company isn’t onboard with this shit, what do you think the attitude is amongst us little people? No one wants this, they just don’t want to lose their jobs and homes over it.

          1. Rational play. My wife is pragmatic that way. It sucks yes but shut the fuck up, get paid, go home.

            There’s no way in hell you’re going to win whatever ‘sane point’ you want to make however salient it will be.

            If the wind blows in a certain direction, you have two choices: Go with it or quit.

            I quit and went and did my own thing.

            I couldn’t handle corporate culture on any level. It was an insufferable shit hole filled with illiterate morons who knew they were illiterate morons but still were opinionated anyway.

            And the the Peter Principles, Dunning-Kruger effect was rampant. And this was c. 1995-2006 when all this crap we see now (with those stupid black squares the sheep proudly display) started to gather steam. They were already sending us to trainings on diversity and the like. They just didn’t call it that. I forget what it was but it was so spectacularly dumb NO ONE – not even the fucking minorities – bought into it.

            But here we are.



            Honk, honk.

            1. Garrison Keillor, 20 years ago…

              Tomorrow morning you go to work at Amalgamated Potato and find an envelope on your desk with the CEO’s name in the upper-left corner, and you sit down and draw a deep breath. After 22 years working your way up through the Skin Division, you are about to become road kill, one more confused raccoon smeared across the corporate highway.

              Amalgamated has been downsizing like crazy for two years now. Everyone works 60 hours a week and goes home with a briefcase as big as a garment bag. You have languished at your present salary, in the mid five digits, for quite some time, and the new management team, guys in their mid-30s, who came here from pasta, and are trying to bring pasta-type glamour and growth to the humble potato so that Amalgamated can turn a humongous profit and be sold and make top management dizzyingly rich, is cutting costs by decimating the drones, and now it’s your turn to walk the plank.

              But you open the envelope, and it isn’t your final notice. It is a memo announcing that Amalgamated Potato is about to transform itself through Total Quality Organization, a team-oriented leadership process in which power flows holistically, and you will spend three days next week at a seminar being empowered.



              1. FTR, I disagree with his apparent opinion of government vs. business.

      3. Remember, they don’t want a discussion on racism. They want a lecture on racism.

        1. It’s the lecturing that’s nauseating.

          Shut up and listen. We accuse you of baseless racism and you’re not allowed to be part of this conversation. Take your licks because slavery.

      4. Just look at the difference you see on message boards like here, using usernames and pseudonyms compared to Facebook or anything else with a full name attached.

        Anyplace with anonymity gives significant “Don’t riot”, “We need police, what’s wrong with you”, and “what’s the point of all this”.

        On the other hand, anyplace you can be identified is almost universally “get on your knees”. A statement that only recently was reserved for fictional villains.

        1. Based on the response to the anonymous questions, those employees would be fired if they posted with their names. Don’t you dare ask if your company is committed to hiring based on merit.

          1. The reason that was asked was because the CEO made a statement about ensuring that minorities were “fully represented”. And working at one of these tech companies myself, I have very little doubt that they can’t figure out who asked what, it would just destroy any trust the company has in its leadership, but since when have liberals cared about that.

        2. Anonymity has really elevated the level of discourse here. Yes, sirree. Just look at my hero, “tulpa”.

        3. Yes, because no one can make a sock-puppet Facebook account…

          Oh, wait, absolutely anyone can. The days of needing a .EDU email to register are long dead.

    3. Deservedly so, ‘cause, as slogans go, it is confused as hell.

    4. Bigoted police is polling worse.

      So are authoritarian, bigoted Republicans.

      See you in November, clingers.

      1. I like your attitude! If we get rid of the bigoted police and their enablers plus the bigoted Republicans, that leaves us libertarians as the only alternative! Or did you not notice the worst police seem to be in Democrat-run cities? Does anybody really believe the Democrats who created these hellholes are the ones to be trusted to fix them?

      2. Is this a repeat of what you said in 1968?

      3. Open wider, Rev, there’s prog on your face.

    5. The whole thing – the cries of racism, the ‘defund the police movement, everything has been nothing more than Mel Brooks style harumphing in order to protect their phoney baloney jobs.

      Useful idiots like ENB merely playing along.

      1. Oh, please. No matter how misguided the response, there is genuine concern about racism and police brutality.

        1. Genuine concern doesn’t mean shit if it results in idiotic policies.

          1. Of course it means shit. It means that there is genuine concern.

            Some real reform may well come out of this crisis, such as qualified immunity reform.

            Cynicism can be fun, but cynicism is ultimately a sickness. Cynical people didn’t make America the wonderful country it is.

            1. Of course it means shit. It means that there is genuine concern.

              “As long as we have good intentions, nothing bad could possibly happen!”

            2. Cynicism can be fun, but cynicism is ultimately a sickness. Cynical people didn’t make America the wonderful country it is.

              It’s not cynicism, it’s observation based on past performance.

            3. Check out the unicorn farts on this guy!

            4. If you read the Federalist and Anti-federalist Papers you’ll find that the Founders were the most cynical people ever, who had a deep understanding of how people actually think, believe and behave, not how utopians want them to be, and they organized the Federal government to reflect that cynicism.

              1. Oh, yeah. Like Ben Franklin, really cynical guy.

                1. All of the founding fathers were pretty cynical when it came to the crown, you know.

        2. There isn’t “genuine concern”. About as far from “genuine” as humanly possible. What we have is a fvckton of opportunism. And a gaggle of idiots who will repeat whatever slogan is programmed for that day.

          People want to defund the heroes they were worshipping two weeks ago. Over something that happens to whites more than blacks. Because Racism

          1. Tjhse same people, who accuse the police of being racist sociopaths who habitually gun down unarmed black men, will say that only the polcie should have assault weapons, after some gangbangers gun down a bunch of kids in a drive-by in front of a school.

            This is what exactly happened three years ago!


        3. Nope.
          This crossed into farce about 2-3 days ago

    6. To me, it seems like big city police departments need to increase their police budget. The top candidates coming out of police academies want to go work in the nicer suburban police departments that pay better, while the not-so-top candidates have to settle for working in the crummier police departments.

      1. To me, it seems like big city police departments need to increase their police budget.

        Hey Pod, I’m not sure if you’ve been asleep the last couple of days, but that’s exactly the opposite of what’s being proposed.

        1. Yes, I know that. I’m saying that I don’t agree with the idea of defunding the police.

          (Actually, nothing coherent is being proposed under the flag of “defund the police”.)

        2. Good catch, Red Rocks.

          Less angry than Pod’s usual socks.

          1. Wait, who was Pod, again?

  3. Now, World Health Organization (WHO) epidemiologist Maria Van Kerkhove says spread by asymptomatic people is “very rare.”

    Now is the time to start believing again what the WHO says?

    1. Dude, don’t get fooled again.

      1. Let’s See Action was clearly the wrong approach.

    2. When you define asymptomatic as “never even has a single cough”, it’s almost a trivial statement.

      However, given that this occurred in the middle of allergy season, and symptoms are extremely common. It’s almost impossible to say that someone is truly asymptomatic.

    3. This just in: WHO walks back comments on asymptomatic coronavirus spread, says much is still unknown.

      Fuckers can’t even keep their own story straight.

      1. “The Science is settled!”
        Wait x days
        “Wait, no, NOW the Science is settled!”
        Wait y days
        “Okay, now we really mead it, the Science really is settled!”
        Ad nauseum

        1. Often wrong; never in doubt. The mark of incompetent leadership.

  4. If You Want to Know What Dismantling the Police Looks Like, Look Across the Pond

    Police in the U.K. are largely disarmed. Fewer than one in twenty officers carry a firearm. This is a tradition that goes back to the 19th century in England and Wales. Armed and unarmed police wore different color uniforms.

    In the face of current rioting in London, which has destroyed property and defaced monuments, unarmed community police were chased by citizens with weapons and several were injured.

    1. citizens with weapons

      Impossible! (Except as a nice band name.)

      1. No, even as a band name it might make some pussy Britts feel frightened, and will not be allowed.

        As for legal band names, maybe Pussy Brits?

        1. How about Pussy Riot?

          1. That would be Pussy Protest. Get woke.

          2. best Russian chick protest band ever.

    2. WATCH: London Police Run Away As BLM Protest Turns Violent Over Arrest Of Black Man

      1. HA. Ya know, after the 2nd American Civil War happens, maybe we should liberate Great Britain from their own incompetence.

        1. Why bother?

          The legacy of old word Europe is peasants and serfs bowing to petty kings, and going off to die in petty wars between incestuous royal cousins.

          The legacy of the Americas is adventurous travelers and ambitious entrepreneurs (even before Columbus), who, at least before recent times, expected little from government–and got it.

          I would rather declare the Americas a sanctuary for individualism, free enterprise, and fun. And provide one-way passage for those seeking collectivism, nanny states, and serious social engineering to their own Euro-topia. We might rescue a few libertarian survivors from the old world.

          1. Because we have a manifest destiny to collect ALL the stars for our flag, and it ain’t gonna get done by itself. /sarc

    3. I guess the UK has yet to bravely pass common sense spork control measures?

    4. Dismantle /= Disarmed. I hate the idea of ‘dismantling the police’, but comparing the US’s situation to Britain’s bobbies is disingenuous at best. Whatever kind of group shows up here instead—-anything from Sheriff’s Deputies are the new police, to autodefensas, to Anarchy Now!—-survivors are going to be armed with some sort of firearm.

      While this is going to burst a few bubbles in the worldview of Reason’s writers, any ad hoc policing below the level of fellow POST-certified deputies is going to be a lot less professional with using force, much less discriminatory about how they use it, less accountable, and more bribable than was the case before. In short, they’ll be a lot like Third World cops. Which fits, if you think the end goal by our elites is that the US turn into an analogue of Brazil.

      1. Like I said the other day, the inevitable outcome of any kind of mass “abolish the police” movement will be the rich faggot overlords hiring Blackwater-type mercs on high-security compounds, militias in the suburbs and small towns, and the typical street gangs in the urban ghettos. The country will become even more balkanized than it is now.

        1. Private security doesn’t roam around your neighborhood looking for reasons to pull you over. They stay in the neighborhood they are paid to protect. It’s a much better setup.

          1. None of these entities are equipped to deal with natural disasters or even simple shit like domestic violence disputes, though. And the idea that they would be in any way reliable over the long term is highly optimistic. The Blackwater mercs would only stick around as long as they know they’re getting paid, and they damn sure won’t risk their life in the face of overwhelming force. They’ll fuck off and leave their employer to get disemboweled. The militias would inevitably become homogenously ethnic, because neighborhood ties would crumble the minute some infiltrator went out on patrol and led the other patrol members into an ambush. The street gangs would do the same thing they always do, extort from the neighborhood and flat-out murder anyone who didn’t comply.

            I promise, the last thing you want is for the classical liberal concept of rule of law to crumble and no standardized police force around to represent that principle. And I say this as someone who agrees that a lot of cops are straight-up assholes, and the whole concept of community policing in an increasingly complex, balkanized society needs to be re-examined and reformed.

      2. …any ad hoc policing below the level of fellow POST-certified deputies is going to be a lot less professional with using force, much less discriminatory about how they use it, less accountable, and more bribable than was the case before.

        ^This^ But I suspect many of the people saying it are just mouthing a slogan with not thought as to what it actually means.

        In short, they’ll be a lot like Third World cops. Which fits, if you think the end goal by our elites is that the US turn into an analogue of Brazil.

        Brazil the country or Brazil the movie? Eh, either one works.

  5. Everything is a lie. And that’s the truth.

    1. Thank you, Captain Kirk.

    2. Everything is a lie.

      Especially the cake.

  6. A lot of our talk about asymptomatic carriers of COVID-19 has included a) people who don’t yet have traditional symptoms (fever, cough, etc.) but will soon develop them and b) people who may never develop traditional COVID-19 symptoms but still show other signs of illness.

    Oh, FFS! Just admit that *anyone* *could* be a “carrier” and be done with it.

    1. Nothing more scary than the stupid, selfish, disease carrying individual. Hate them and fear them. Love the State.

    2. [looks around suspiciously]

      1. ^ This guy gets it.

      2. Endgame achieved

    3. Asymptomatic carrier is one thing. Asymptomatic infectious carrier is another. Let’s agree there may be plenty of the first group. If they can’t unknowingly pass it to someone else, who gives a shit?

      All of the mask brouhaha and quarantining healthy people was because health officials were scared that Group 2 was significant, that you could pass this to someone else while not knowing you were infected or not. It’s becoming clearer that there never was a significant chance of Group 2 occurring.

      So, if you’re sick, stay home. If you’re not sick, chuck the mask and it should now be business as usual. Sucks for the allergy ridden, but life is hard.

      1. I’m sorry, but the fact that the quarantine on essentially every nursing home has been breached is clear evidence that there is a substantial asymptomatic carrier and/or extremely mild symptom carrier spread.

        Unlike the general population, many nursing homes have been locked down completely. Employees only. Minimal contact. However, the residents still get infected. The only way is that these trained nurses who know the risks and are doing everything possible are still getting infected and spreading the disease.

        1. Trained nurses don’t work in nursing homes. Cheap home health aides work in nursing homes. Trained nurses know about PPE, donning/doffing, sterile fields, containment on biohazardous material. Health aides can barely be bothered to put down their phones and pay attention to their charges. Nurses might stay home if they feel ill, or they’ll practice sufficient protective procedures such that even if I’ll, they won’t contaminate their patients. LOL at aides doing any of that, though they might call in if they can get paid to stay home.

          In short, you get what you pay for, and nursing home reimbursement rates don’t pay for much as far as human capital. I’m sure the isolation procedures are rigorous. On paper. In practice with their staff? I’m less convinced.

          I don’t

          1. Ill for I’ll. Stupid autocorrect.

      2. This.

        We could actually get some sort of an answer for whether the asymptomatic are really infectious by looking at antibody testing results by age and by occupation. But I have yet to see that breakout of any of that testing.

        The young – under 20 – are pretty clearly heavily asymptomatic. That entire demographic is simply missing from confirmed cases where the testing has been on the symptomatic. But until we can know whether they have actually been exposed and developed antibodies, we can’t know whether and to what extent they are missing from the symptomatic cases because they ARE asymptomatic or simply because they have been protected from exposure. Which would also tell us whether they have been a transmission vector or not.

        Likewise, medical workers have clearly and obviously been more heavily exposed as always to a new disease. I suspect that is also why the elderly got so hard hit this wave. Because the elderly (and those with comorbidities) spend a lot of their time in contact with medical workers. Obviously. But until we know exactly – and I mean exactly – how many medical workers have been exposed, we can’t even know the true nature of this disease for adults. That’s the one group of people that should have been 100% tested – starting with PCR and now serological. It’s one of only two public health rationales for a lockdown for everyone else – buy time to test medical workers to see how vulnerable the medical system itself is as a vector, and contact trace/test to isolate existing positives from the overall population. And we chose to have a lockdown and do neither of those.

    4. Retarded eh?

      We’re all asymptomatic of something all year round.

      Proceed accordingly?


      1. Think I’ll go for a walk…


        2. you’re not fooling anyone, you know…

          1. I feel happy!

    5. it is literally “joe vs the volcano” in real life. you don’t know you have it and no test can prove if you do or don’t so everyone wear a mask. We have been had for political purposes.

  7. …they may not have developed fever yet, they may not have had a significant cough, or they many not have shortness of breath. But some may have mild disease.

    Science is on it.

    1. That’s a nice list of what a person might NOT have. How about an example of what a “mild disease” symptom WOULD be?

  8. Its group of asymptomatic coronavirus carriers—those for whom passing on the disease is “very rare”—includes only people with the disease who never develop any symptoms.

    Which is probably what the majority of people took it to mean before everyone went characteristically apefuckingshit.

  9. the mass protests have changed the game on lockdown orders, putting churches in a stronger legal position to challenge restrictions than they were ten days ago

    Never underestimate the dipshittery of the judiciary.

    1. Cops ain’t gonna arrest Baptists now; they need all the support they can get.

      1. The cops pander to the left as much as any other institution.
        Expect more church arrests than ever in a fruitless attempt to placate the progressives.

  10. some may have mild disease.”

    Emphasis added. “Some may not. Who TF knows? NEED MORE TESTING!!”

    1. “She said that although findings are positive, more research needs to be undertaken if scientists are going to be able to “truly answer” whether the virus spreads easily from asymptomatic patients.”

      needz moar mullah

      1. needz moar mullah

        What good would a Muslim cleric trained in religious law and doctrine do?

  11. The chief said the store owner – who called them to report a robbery – was reaching for a gun when he was punched.

    Well, even so… you can’t deny the officers feared for their safety, which makes it all legal.

    1. If the Union’s ok with it, I’m ok with it.

  12. “Overall, people seem to be mixed up about what asymptomatic means.”

    And yet those of us who maintained that people should be free to isolate themselves (or not) if they please were never confused about the anti-libertarian stupidity of elitists using the coercive power of government to inflict their own qualitative preferences on those of us who don’t share them.

  13. Netflix … is outmaneuvering the U.S. government to secure trademark rights globally to the armed services name…

    Is Netflix going to protect us from a meteor or Space China-men? If not, then cough it up.

    1. I would say 90% of the giggles in that series are all in the second episode. I’d suggest watching the second episode (without the first, even), and skipping the rest.

      1. Malkovich is entertaining in just about every episode.

        1. Entertaining, yes. He’s good enough to be great in a bad movie–not that this was bad. It just wasn’t what ti could have been.

          The climax was the chimpanzee in the second episode. That should have been in like the seventh episode. You’re supposed to exceed people’s expectations to make them happy. If you never do better than you did in the second episode, then you’ve done the opposite of exceeding their expectations. In 1966, people couldn’t wait for the next Beatles album–and it was Revolver. That’s the way you exceed people’s expectations. After Revolver, people were looking forward to what they would do next–and it was Sgt. Pepper’s. That’s the way you exceed people’s expectations.

          Ever heard of Chekhov’s Gun?

          That’s about managing an audience’s expectations.

          Shakespeare didn’t put the St. Crispin’s Day speech in the First Act of Henry V. Henry V would be a bitterly disappointing waste of time if he had.

          When we see something hilarious in the first act, we expect it to get even funnier. When it doesn’t get funnier, it’s a disappointment. If they’d moved the chimpanzee issue to the point of climax rather than as an introduction, it wouldn’t have felt like such a long slog to nowhere. It could have been great, and maybe the next installment will be.

          1. You’re supposed to exceed people’s expectations to make them happy.

            Unless you’re Rian Johnson, then you subvert people’s expectations and tell them if they’re not happy with it it’s because they’re whiny man-babies and probably some kind of “-ist” as well.

      2. I’ve been somewhat curious about the show. Steve Carrel is usually pretty funny in just about anything, even that Get Smart remake was largely funny because he made it work. At least, I can’t imagine anyone else in that role actually pulling it off.

        But I’ve been somewhat hesitant about Space Force because I just can’t shake my suspicion that if Trump hadn’t talked the concept up they wouldn’t be making a show poking fun at it. Not that I mind criticizing Trump, mind you, it’s just that the “Orange Man Bad” crap gets tedious very quickly because it’s everywhere. I watch TV to escape a lot of that kind of political crap, not to be reminded of it constantly.

        1. The show was disappointing to me. Malkovich is great. Carrell just seems to be out of his normal shtick. Some of the Joint Chiefs scenes are actually pretty funny, they sarcastically poke fun at the military mindset.

          As for Trump, they never mention him by name, so it’s not in your face TDS. They do however poke fun at “POTUS” using Twitter, etc. Pretty mild compared to the much more direct political comedy out there.

        2. For what it’s worth, it doesn’t make President Trump look bad. Just . . . demanding and intolerant of failure.

          It does make AOC look better than she is.

          It makes Pelosi look like an ice queen power machine.

          From a, “let’s offend the right’s political sensibilities”, it isn’t that bad at all. A Trump voter isn’t likely to see anything that makes them angry.

          If anything, it makes the Chinese out to be real assholes.

          1. If anything, it makes the Chinese out to be real assholes.

            That’s surprising given how much the entertainment industry panders to China. Is Netflix blocked in China? That might explain it.

            Maybe I’ll check it out at some point. Sounds like it’s not that great though so I won’t get my expectations too high.

    2. I want to know how Trump, the great capitalist, got out maneuvered by those commie* bastards at Netflix? If this is how the China negotiations are going then I best stop making fun of Emperor Pooh.

      *Vox partnership, enough said.

    3. It wouldn’t surprise me if the government and courts say a private entity can not copyright a government entity since that is a public use.

  14. “Parts of the world might be facing condom and birth control supply-chain interruptions due to COVID-19.”

    Do you want the government to do something about that?

    1. The national strategic stockpile was left bare

      1. *Archer voice*

        Wait, I had something for this… something about getting screwed bareback style.

    2. Most parts of the world are not ‘sponge-worthy’.

    3. Yes and this is why abortions must continue unabated while cancer patients die waiting for their elective surgeury

  15. But the whole thing may be a miscommunication “miscommunication”.


    1. But the whole thing may be a miscommunication “miscommunication” “clusterfuck”.



  16. Parts of the world might be facing condom and birth control supply-chain interruptions due to COVID-19.

    So I was right. The Vatican is behind it.

    1. Luckily activist judges were able to insure child abattoirs abortionariums were able to evade the repercussions of societal shutdowns, so their knives are sharp as ever and they stand ready to thwart any baby boom.

    2. Yeah well all you had to do was decipher the statue of David to understand that plot. Not exactly Da Vinci code science.

  17. “Where are libertarians on police reform?” Right where we’ve always been, writes J.D. Tuccille.

    Yes, but now that it’s white officers and a black victim, where have libertarians been? #RepublicanLite

  18. Parts of the world might be facing condom and birth control supply-chain interruptions due to COVID-19.

    Gives a whole ‘nother meaning to “coitus interruptus”.

    1. Is providing people with free condoms an essential role of government now?

      I don’t get it.

      Food prices have also gone up.

      We’re libertarians. We know how markets work.

    2. coitus interruptus interruptus?

    3. we also would have accepted covitus interruptus

  19. I thought only Nazis burned books.

    His bookstores burned. Don Blyly wants to keep selling

    Don Blyly has owned and operated a bookstore for 46 years. Whether there’s a 47th depends on what he hears from his insurance agency.

    Blyly’s twin bookstores, Uncle Hugo’s and Uncle Edgar’s, were among the Minneapolis businesses destroyed amid the unrest that followed the police killing of George Floyd on Memorial Day. Burned to the ground five days later in what appeared to be an intentionally set fire, the bookstores were located on Chicago Avenue just one block north of Lake Street and about nine blocks north of the intersection where Floyd died.

    1. Something like the country’s oldest or second-oldest independently owned science fiction bookstore. A tragic loss.

      1. If he has any self-respect, I mean any at all, he’ll take whatever insurance payout he receives, GTFO of Minneapolis, and retire somewhere in the hinterlands. No point trying to re-establish a business in the middle of a zoo.

  20. “Every report is confusing…now WHO also says if asymptomatic, you are not contagious? And then see below? Which is it?”

    What is so confusing? The people who were hospitalized but didn’t have fevers obviously had complications and/or other symptoms. As for being contagious, maybe they were maybe they weren’t…just like everyone who is admitted to the hospital

  21. Ro Khanna to Daily Beast: “I began my career in public service running against Bush’s war in Iraq in 2004. But no one doubts his commitment to tolerance and inclusiveness.”

    1. Ro Khanna must be a homophobe then.

  22. BREAKING: An army of geriatric terminators just appeared from the future. Several of them malfunctioned and the rest wandered away.

  23. “HONG KONG—Thousands of protesters rallied Tuesday evening in downtown Hong Kong, facing off with police who had banned recent demonstrations, to mark the one-year anniversary of a million-person rally that thrust the city into its biggest turmoil in decades.

    Marching through roads flanked by dozens of riot police, hundreds of people wearing masks held umbrellas and phones with flashlights shining. Police used pepper spray and made several arrests, cordoning off roads, in scenes that evoked last year’s seven months of unrest by an opposition movement that authorities are seeking to crush.”

    The protest on June 4th to commemorate the Tienanmen Square Massacre went ahead without the proper permits. The police apparently used pepper spray and made plenty of arrests then, too.

    China’s approach appears to be like what they did in Xinjiang in one sense–it isn’t about one big media spectacle with a show down and a dramatic climax. They just slowly, methodically, inevitably pick up and arrest more and more people. Like a lava flow headed towards the sea, nothing can stop it. It just keeps going forwards one step at a time. Average people who are never arrested won’t be able to point to the moment when things changed forever. If things keep going as they are and China gets its way, they’ll just look back and remember that things used to be different.

    1. And our news is silent about people peacefully protesting real suppression. Of course if they had guns there and did get violent unfortunately China can out man anyone so there is that.

      1. Yeah, protesters in Hong Kong is not a popular topic to cover now for whatever reason, and the contrast with what’s going on here in the USA is probably a big part of that reason.

        News editors are being forced to resign over comparing the demands of BLM to concern that architectural gems are being destroyed in the riots.

        If I were a news editor, I might be worried about losing my job if I ran stories that were insufficiently woke in their coverage of the protests in Hong Kong compared to the coverage of BLM, too.

  24. Chinese Propaganda Outlet Has Paid US Newspapers $19 Million For Advertising, Printing

    1. So what?

      1. Media is much more willing to do China’s bidding if both

        a. fellow socialists
        b. giving them $$

    2. Whew! Thankfully it wasn’t Russians!

  25. Kinda.

    You actually have good laboratories for disease transmission- prison (cue police state allusions).

    While there have been relatively few active cases (fever, coughing, etc.), the numbers of prisoners testing positive have gone through the roof in some areas, even after lockdowns.

    While you have guards as possible disease vectors, the numbers suggest asymptomatic spread, or at least symptoms mild enough to be confused with other maladies (allergies, etc.). And that’s with testing more frequent than seen in the general population.

    Fact is there are too many unknowns, and all policy is reflective of incomplete data. Be conservative with the approach, people state you are over-reacting. Be looser, and people state you aren’t doing enough.

    It’s a no-win situation.

  26. ‘Bloody Sunday’:18 Murders in Chicago in 24 Hours as Calls to ‘Defund the Police’ Escalate

    Chicagoans are calling it “Bloody Sunday.” In one 24-hour period, 18 people were murdered in the city. That’s the highest number of murders in Chicago’s modern history. You have to go back 60 years to find a bloodier day.

    1. Like the cops are going into Austin or Garfield Park anyway. Other than to scoop up the dead and get told, “I didn’t see nuttin’.”

      1. I thought it was ‘nufifn’?

        I’m axsting a question.

        1. “Oh stewardess! I speak jive.”

          1. momma didn’t raise no dummies.

    2. Bro, do you even know how to make an omelette?

    3. The real irony is that if George Floyd had been killed by another black person like these people were, no one would give a squirt of piss for him other than, maybe, his immediate family.

    4. The police don’t stop murders from happening. they investigate murders AFTER they happen.

      reducing police presence in Chicago will have no effect on the murder rate.

  27. Adding to the not at all news about asymptomatic spreading Doug Gotlieb reason’s favorite doctor in all this admitted of CNBC that fever isn’t actually a symptom in the vast majority of hospitalizations they have. These fucking people are a joke. We’ve had to operate on the fact that low grade fevers were the leading indicator for covid testing for fucking 2 1/2 months and the whole fucking thing was a giant sham.

    1. Watching the MSM narrative in the last two weeks has been like watching “1984” in real-time, particularly the scene during Hate Week where the speaker is handed a slip of paper and immediately changes the narrative on who Oceania’s enemy is from Eurasia to Eastasia.

      We were scolded for weeks to stay inside, with dire warnings and “grim milestones” as cities and states started to grapple with the fiscal reality that you can’t force the economy to shut down for long without fucking your own budgets. Right on a fucking dime, thousands of people get out in mass protests, with some limp-wristed “concern” pieces getting released mentioning that, as long as everyone is wearing masks, it shouldn’t be a problem. One of the bobbleheads on CBS this morning even went out of her way to mention that at Floyd’s second funeral service, “everyone was wearing masks and practicing social distancing.”

      They’ve completely fucked their narrative, and are trying to figure out now how to get people back into compliance, but it’s too late. In Seattle, they’re in the process of recreating the mistakes of Occupy Wall Street and setting up a barricaded square. Can’t wait to hear about the tent rapes in a couple of weeks.

      1. Found the tweet.
        Steer clear for the foreseeable future. The local red guards might ticket you for excessive displays of white privilege.

        1. My sides would go into orbit if Trump declared it a terrorist training site and sent an F-16 on a bombing run. That would solve half of Seattle’s problem right there, and probably a few other areas besides.

  28. Meanwhile, mainland China’s official unemployment figures are complete horseshit.

    “In April, the [Chinese government’s] survey method showed that 6% of the total workforce was out of a job. Independent analysts estimate China’s actual unemployment rate is hovering near 20% — nearly 80 million workers. The discrepancy between the two figures likely comes from China’s large numbers of migrant workers.

    “The survey may not fully capture the employment situation of the self-employed or rural migrants who work in micro-firms or in non-farming jobs in the rural areas,” wrote Tao Wang, chief China economist at UBS investment bank.

    China’s official statistics show 50 million fewer migrants returned to cities this February than during the same time last year, likely because they had no work, and instead farmed the land.

    So China’s official unemployment statistics show that unemployment was around 5.6% before the pandemic and is about 6% now. This despite COVID-19 shutting down the economy for months–and now the markets they export to all in recession? If you believe that, I’ve got a Ming dynasty vase to sell you.

    I’ve seen that 80 million unemployed number from UBS reported elsewhere, and 50 million people going back to subsistence farming because they have no better way to feed themselves isn’t indicative of an unemployment rate barely inching upwards.

    The only person in the world happier than Donald Trump’s campaign manager to see the surprise bump in hiring in the U.S. last month was probably Emperor Xi. As supply chain continue to diversify, however, Emperor Xi may not have seen the worst of this yet.

    1. that could be bad. If they’re desperate enough, they might try something before we’re ready to fight them.

      1. I believe Emperor Xi is moving on Hong Kong now in anticipation of what might happen with 100 million unemployed people in China–something they haven’t had to contend with since they joined the WTO in 2001. They don’t have much in the way of unemployment insurance or social programs. And that’s an awful lot of people to have out there looking for someone to blame. And one of the problems with being an emperor is that there’s only one person to blame. Can’t blame Congress. Can’t blame the governor of Michigan.

        I mean, you can try to deflect blame, but it’s a convoluted mess. Does the Emperor have control of the local government or doesn’t he? If he does, then why is he blaming someone else? Does he know what he’s doing or doesn’t he? If he knows what he’s doing, then why are these terrible things happening to us? Is it his plan for terrible things to happen to us? The Emperor’s best bet is pretend that everything is going according to plan and don’t let any fires get started in the first place. Over there in Hong Kong, that’s a fire that’s been trying to spread since last summer. What used to be tolerable when things were going well become intolerable when there are 80 million unemployed people trying to grow enough food to feed themselves–’cause that’s their best bet.

  29. You lost me when you quoted a writer from Slate.

    1. I definitely cringed when I read that.

    2. Slate with the big-brained takes: “Please Stop Making Protest Signs That Reference “Black Dick”

      I haven’t been able to embed links in my comments for a couple of months, so you’ll just have to do a search for the article. Even more notable intersection here is that George Floyd apparently did amateur porn.

  30. Are we really at the point in this medical drama where we are debating what “asymptomatic” means? If so, I think I’m about done with “medical expertise” at this point.

    1. Pro Tip:

      Imagine someone with symptoms. Then imagine that person with none of those symptoms.

      1. But what if someone with symptoms identifies as someone without symptoms?

        1. +1

        2. That person must add or subtract a penis.

        3. Then that person would be transymptomatic, duh.

          1. But do they engender the disease or not?

        4. Give them their own restroom

  31. I’d say this is some major fucking news, yet no one is covering it. Almost as if they don’t want to hurt “their” side. TLDR, a “libertarian” active duty service member killed a cop and wounded several others, and might be responsible for the van shooting during the riots. He had bombs, guns, and “elite counter-terrorism training”.

    1. Did someone leave the closet unlocked where we store our “I am libertarian” pins?

      1. He’s “self-proclaimed”. Everyone do a headcount and see who’s no longer posting… Does anyone have eyes on chemjeff?

        1. OBL is AWOL

        2. Sevo?

          1. OK, he posted below, so I guess not.

            The anger management problems seemed like a definite match.

      2. We stopped locking the closet because we couldn’t trust whoever we gave the key to not be corrupted by the power that came with it.

    2. This story is full of fuck for several reasons. What caught my eye at first was, he works at Travis (big Air Force base, far northeast side of San Francisco Bay Area), but lives in Ben Lomond (hippy-ish village in Santa Cruz Mountains, well South of the Bay Area.) So he allegedly drives over the hill into San Jose, fights through San Jose traffic and 680 traffic, to go all through Contra Costa county to get to Travis? And Ben Lomond houses aren’t cheap. Did he inherit the land or something? Most Travis guys, if they live off base, live in the Valley. Or the opposite direction from where this guy was commuting. Just weird. And makes me wonder whether this shitbag had help.

      Condolences to the wounded and deceased officer.

      1. Yeah, I was wondering that too, based off the van shooting. I didn’t see the video, but the description made it sound like there was at least two people involved.

    3. TLDR, a “libertarian” active duty service member killed a cop and wounded several others, and might be responsible for the van shooting during the riots. He had bombs, guns, and “elite counter-terrorism training”.

      Sounds like a pretty clear cut violation of the NAP to me.

      Purity test: failed.

      1. Can we do the same thing the socialists do and say it’s not true libertarianism since he failed?

    4. The word, libertarian, doesn’t seem to be in the story, anymore.

      1. weird, the original article that I saw said that he was a self-described libertarian on social media.

        1. Don’t doubt you. It would be interesting to know the story of how/why it got edited.

  32. “Where are libertarians on police reform?” Right where we’ve always been, writes J.D. Tuccille.

    True. We have long supported things like ending qualified immunity, requiring police to have liability insurance, and reducing (or ending) the power of police unions.

    All of those ideas are fucking terrible now that people on the left have come around to supporting them. If conservatives supported those ideas then they would be great.

    Remember folks, we must always judge ideas by the politics of those who support them, not on the merit of the ideas themselves.

    1. All of those ideas are fucking terrible now that people on the left have come around to supporting them.”

      There’s no point in just making shit up and yelling about strawmen conservatives, when you’re this bad at it, Sarc.

      1. Except that when I have recently brought those things up I’ve been accused of being a leftist by the conservative ilk on this forum, and from what I’ve heard in the news conservative politicians oppose all of the above because Democrats like the ideas.

        1. Arm-wave some more; ‘somebody said something, mumble, mumble’.

          1. sarcasmic’s recounting sounds pretty darn accurate.

            1. Okay sackasmic’s sock. Thanks for the impartial “outside” opinion.

              1. You are most welcome. Any time.

                And I’d be proud to be sarcasmic’s sock. I’m not, but I’d be proud to.

                1. That’s pretty fucking pathetic.

      2. Yet, has even one Republican congressperson signed on to Amash’s bill? Not that I’ve heard.

        1. Shhhhhh! You might upset him with actual facts.

          1. IKR

        2. You mean the bill that hasn’t been fully released by Amash yet, even though it was introduced last week, and is currently just a publicity stunt? Fuck off.
          Unless your just signaling you’re not going to sign up for a bill with unreleased content.

          But I bet you two fucking idiots were feeling smart because you thought it was properly submitted.
          Choke on the real facts, retards.

          1. Lots of Democrats are endorsing it.

            I don’t think that it’s not having been fully released that’s stopping the Republicans. I think it’s that they are afraid of breathing without being told by Trump and the Republican Party what they should think and say. I think it’s that Democrats are endorsing it, so they must automatically oppose it, because the other party is always evil.

            1. Just like Amash those Dems are showboating. If they had the senate and the Presidency to worry about, they wouldn’t say shit until they read it either.

              Oh, and yes, as a Canadian looking in, I think your Democrats are monstrously fucking evil, and have been since Slavery and the Trail of Tears. The only Western party in the modern period that exceeded them was the Nazis. Even the Italian Fascists and the Argentine Junta weren’t quite as bad, although they admittedly had a shorter run.
              Even today it’s a party of race-hustlers and grievance-mongering, baby-killers, Hollywood rapists and billionaire kleptocrats.

    2. It’s less lack of support for police reform, but lack of support for other things, like disbanding the police with no ideas of what would follow.

      Even police protestors have expressed consternation at others using it as a springboard for other concerns, like free healthcare. Look at Breonna Taylor. The family has asked for an end to no-knock search warrants. That isn’t even on the radar for much of the protesters in Kentucky.

      You could see the same thing with the TEA Party. When it was mostly about reforming taxes, it was championed by libertarians. As it started to have mission creep, including culture war aspects, libertarians withdrew their support.

      1. In my opinion the calls to disband the police are intended to cause all potential reform ideas to fizzle.

        1. ad hominem ftw!

          1. that was to Sevo above

        2. That’s actually a distinct possibility, considering the history of most radical left movements. They don’t want reforms, they want a no-kidding revolution.

    3. The oddest thing to watch, for anyone who has followed Reason’s coverage of Kamala Harris, is her posturing as a police reformer.

      Rand Paul suggests some sensible amendments to the lynching bill. She could have incorporated the changes and gotten his vote, but instead she grandstanded and publicly painted him as a racist.

      1. You mean a politician cares more about pandering to the base than creating meaningful legislation?

        I’m shocked I tell you! Shocked!

      2. She is one of the biggest scumbags in congress. And that’s a high bar. She is absolutely vile. how any Democrat could possibly support her is beyond me.

  33. By the way, heard a news story this morning that SOME organization (I missed that part) is claiming that “Cower in place” saved THREE HUNDRED MILLION lives worldwide, so far.


    1. I heard it was 300 Billion Imperial College lives.

    2. Funny, I heard that Sweden’s essentially managed to suppress COVID to the same extent as the UK without having to, you know, crash their economy.

    3. No, no. It was 300 million grant dollars were saved.

    1. The conflation of private property rights and “collectivist” property rights over all of the USA is where Nationalists really show their principles.

      It’s as clear as the difference between boarding up (or otherwise protecting) your private property vs the government imposing a blanket curfew for all public property in a city. Immigration laws have much more in common with curfews than boarded windows.

    2. Cato doesn’t support or not support anything. If you’ve been paying attention to Cato over the years, you’d know that they encourage a wide range of thought and don’t dictate to their fellows that they have to support a particular libertarian point of view.

      1. It’s meant as a joke. Click on the link.

        1. Aha! Thanks!

      2. Also, “The Church of Tulpa” would have been a better handle.

        1. Thanks, I’ll put that one in my queue!

          Tulpa, or more accurately the dude who stole Tulpa’s identity, really is wonderful.

  34. When I hear the WHO I hearken to Daltry’s haunting echoes of…..


    1. You could have just said geriatric music.

      1. You forgot ‘Ok Boomer’.

        And it still whoops any of this soulless, manufactured dreck of today.

        /waves fist.

        1. There’s still a lot of good tunes being made today. Doesn’t appear that way because you don’t hear it on commercial radio, but it’s there. Try listening to a college radio station sometime. You might be pleasantly surprised.

          1. Oh I know. I own a substantial record library and don’t disagree there’s some good stuff out there but as a whole? It’s not the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s. But now? The crap surpasses the good stuff.

            1. The crap surpasses the good stuff.

              Hasn’t that always been the case?

          2. >>There’s still a lot of good tunes being made today.

            no, no there is not.

            1. Or music has changed past your tastes.

              Music is VERY decentralized right now, with a ton of sub-genres and variations to allow you to find something you might like.

              1. sure. not better than Le Who.

          3. I guess I’m a Boomer, but much more interesting to listening to the same Boomer music over and over, or listening to modern music, I’m finding there’s a fascinating world of even *older* music on YouTube. Great stuff from the early 20th Century that’s been forgotten.

    2. I hearken to Keith Moon’s “Fiddle About”

  35. “Parts of the world might be facing condom and birth control supply-chain interruptions due to COVID-19.”

    It is a mere economic concern.

  36. Also, remember how Floyd had a counterfeit $20 bill? The chinese are pumping counterfeits into our country, they seized a bunch right before the riot shitshow started, and even more back in January.

    1. How’d Floyd get the funny paper? He doesn’t sound capable of making it himself. Did he get it from the club he worked security for?

      I just find implausible the coincidence that, in a giant city like MSP, the cop who shows up later at the scene on Floyd is one that also just happens to work at the same nightclub as Floyd. First cop? Maybe. Floyd may have simply just committed the crime in his section/beat. Follow up cop showing up to assist? Not a coincidence. That one of the other cops is Chauvin’s brother in law is straight out of Mayberry.

      1. wait, WHAT. I had not heard that, that’s some fishy shit right there.

        1. They had worked at the same nightclub but in different departments over a year prior. They didn’t work together, and there’s no serious evidence that they knew each other well or even recognized each other.

      2. How’d Floyd get the funny paper?…

        I just find implausible the coincidence that, in a giant city like MSP, the cop who shows up later at the scene on Floyd is one that also just happens to work at the same nightclub as Floyd.

        I’ve been kind of curious about that myself. Seems odd that a random nobody (no offense intended to Floyd) somehow got hold of a fake $20 bill. Also, did he even know that the bill was fake?

        I suppose if you wanted to come up with a nice little conspiracy theory around it maybe the club was operating as a front for distributing the funny money, the cop was in on it and he killed Floyd to make sure he couldn’t talk about where he got the funny money from.

        *adjusts tinfoil hat*

        But who knows. Maybe the Secret Service is investigating the source of the funny money but I kind of doubt it. Unless they’ve seen a lot of other phony bills showing up in Minneapolis lately they’re not going to bother with a single fake $20, and that aspect of the story will be conveniently forgotten about amid the protests and riots.

        1. Even leaving aside pop culture references like the Sopranos, it’s not like it would be the first time that a strip club was used as a front for criminal activities.

        2. What I want to know is how bad a fake it was. Was it just a photocopy of a $20 that anyone would know was fake upon cursory inspection, or was it only detected by use of the “magic marker?” If it’s the latter, it is vastly more likely that he was innocently passing along a bill that was similarly passed on to him. I know a pretty, cute, innocent looking white girl who got passed a counterfeit $100 when selling an extra concert ticket in NYC who then used the $100 to buy concert merchandise. She was questioned by police/security somewhat intensely, but no one got physical with her or tried to arrest her.

        3. I heard an interview with the store owner that they received counterfeit bills fairly regularly. Often enough that the employee knew the procedure was to call the cops to be questioned about who gave it and to turn over the bill for tracing. Of course, never in the past had any of the suspects been arrested or physically hassled.

      3. Eh, nevermind on the BiL story. Officer Tou Thao is not related to Kelly Chauvin.

        The article claims she’s of Hmong ancestry—I don’t think she looks Hmong at all, but what do I know—and a name like Tou Thao suggests Laos to me. Close, but not the same. Just ask a Laotian.

        That really would have been a funny coincidence. Too good to be true.

        1. CA, I can buy that Chauvin intended to kill him. Any world with the LA Rampart Division in it puts paid to the idea that some police behavior is too crazy to believe.

          But Chauvin’s too stupid to live if he thought that killing Floyd this way, in front of a bunch of filming witnesses, was how to go about it.

          AIUI, there were four cops there. Two were rooks. I don’t expect them to challenge a veteran officer’s handling of the situation, though they really should have. If Officer 4 was related to Chauvin, it would make his deference a little more understandable. But he’s not related.

          We’re left with four officers restraining a guy in defiance of their training of how to do that particular thing, and on a guy who may not even have been resisting all that aggressively. It’s hard to explain, as it’s such a stupid, against their self-interest, thing they were doing, so possible explanations for their behavior get wilder and wilder.

          1. The fact that they did all this in front of a crowd, knowing they were being recorded, says something. To me it says “We do whatever we want because fuck you that’s why.”

            1. To me it says “We do whatever we want because fuck you that’s why.”

              I think that’s the most likely explanation of their behavior. They’re probably so used to getting away with shit like this with little to no accountability beyond paid administrative leave vacation that they thought they’d still be able to get away with it, and worse case scenario their union will go to bat for them and get them out of trouble.

              But conspiracy theorizing can be fun as long as you don’t take it too seriously.

            2. It tells me one dude brainlocked, maybe because of a personal beef with Floyd, two newbies didn’t know what was what, and another guy maybe had a clue, but didn’t want to get in the way of the senior officer. Somebody on tape mentioned ‘excited delirium’, so the prospect of Floyd dying on them was starting to be present in at least one of their heads.

              As to the FYTW, and indifference to the crowd, I’m not a cop, but AIUI, having a crowd heckle you and spout all kinds of bullshit is simply the norm when doing an arrest anymore certain places. Cops tune it out until the crowd starts interfering with the arrest.

              Though they really should have done a better job of being aware: besides being ignorant or indifferent to their suspect going into respiratory and cardiac arrest under them, they failed to maintain any consistent watch on the crowd. If the crowd did have hostile intent, and someone in the crowd was armed, those cops would have been dead before they knew they were in a fight.

              Plus, “I can’t breathe”, post Eric Garner, is the new “My cuffs are too tight. I can’t feel my hands.” But what of it? Just take him to the hospital/ER and take him to jail afterwards. Chill in a/c while on the clock. Win-win.

          2. But Chauvin’s too stupid to live if he thought that killing Floyd this way, in front of a bunch of filming witnesses, was how to go about it.

            The CT stuff will really get interesting if Chauvin “pulls an Epstein.”

            But like I say below, the most likely explanation is that they’re so accustomed to not being held accountable they thought the same pattern would play out here: some minor outrage that blows over, paid vacations all around, maybe a minor slap on the wrist that the union gets overturned on appeal and then everyone just forgets about it and life goes on. Obviously they were wrong.

          3. Apparently additional footage of the arrest made it out into the Interwebs. It shows Floyd acting pretty beligerent and refusing to get into the car for several minutes, which is going to be a significant piece of evidence in the trial.

            That footage is going to really fuck up the murder 2 charge unless hard evidence comes out that Chauvin and Floyd knew each other personally, and Floyd had done something like one of his amateur porn videos with Chauvin’s wife.

  37. This is about the stupidest thing I’ve ever seen in my life:

    “City Council President Lisa Bender in Minneapolis told CNN’s Brooke Baldwin that wanting to call the police after your home is broken into “comes from a place of privilege” in an interview Monday on CNN.”

    You can watch her say it yourself at that link.

    She says it clear as day: Being able to call the cops when there’s someone breaking into your house comes from a place of privilege!

    That is coming from the “president” of the Minneapolis City Council.

    1. Looks like a whole lot of cluelessness. It’s as if she thinks police actually do their job and investigate home invasions. They don’t. If you push them they might make a report that you can give to your insurance company, but otherwise they’ll just laugh and tell you to pound sand.

      1. The problem is the idea that we need to give up the privilege of being able to call the police when we’re being victimized by a criminal–in order to make other people feel better.

        Being able to call the police when you’re being victimized by a crime is not a privilege. There’s really nothing you’re entitled to from the government–except the protection of your rights.

        The government doesn’t owe you a place to live. The government doesn’t owe you food. The government doesn’t owe you free healthcare. The government doesn’t owe you an education.

        The government is obligated to protect your rights from criminals. Protecting people’s rights from criminals is not a privilege.

        1. Maybe her point is that she doesn’t fear calling the cops after being a victim of a crime because she doesn’t fear being treated like a criminal.

          If someone who is relatively poor calls the cops after being broken into, chances are the cops will say “Sure, we’d be happy to search your home and arrest you if we find something illegal.”

          So maybe she has a point.

          1. Did you watch what she said in the video? I think you’re only hearing what you want to hear.

            She’s saying that people will need to give up the privilege of calling the police when there’s an intruder.

            If there’s any assumptions to make, it’s that she supports getting rid of the police in order to make BLM and their supporters feel better–because there are no more police.

            1. Oh, I get it. She’s a feel-good idiot.

              1. When I read the term, “feel-good idiot”, I think of someone who’s virtue signaling without actually doing anything.

                She’s the president of the Minneapolis City Council, and from what I can tell, they really are going to do away with the police.

                This will have consequences in the real world far beyond making herself or other people feel good today.

                1. My understanding is that they’re replacing the city cops with county cops. Like canning the town force and contracting with the sheriff department.

                  1. They presumably don’t have control over the Sheriff’s department.

                    That just means they’re getting rid of the police.

                    Aren’t the sheriffs mostly just there to enforce court orders and warrants, etc.?

                    There are 1,100 cops on the force in Minneapolis. You think you can eliminate all those patrols and get the same crime statistics using just the Sheriff’s department?

                    “The Hennepin County Sheriff’s Office is the sheriff’s office for Hennepin County in the U.S. state of Minnesota. HCSO serves one million residents and is located downtown in the city of Minneapolis, the county seat. The office manages the county jail, patrols waterways, provides security for the District Court, handles home foreclosures, participates in homeland security activities and in law enforcement, and by state law is responsible for handling applications for permits to carry a firearm for residents of Hennepin County.[1][2][3]

                    Do you see anything on that page about responding to burglary calls or armed robberies in progress?

                    1. I didn’t say it was a good idea. I’m just saying that, in my understanding, they are planning to replace the city cops with some “county model” or something. As opposed to no police at all, which is what you appear to be saying is the plan.

                      All of this missed the biggest problem, which is the long list of victimless crimes on the books that take priority over crimes with victims because they are less dangerous to enforce, less work to investigate, and easier to prove in court.

                    2. I used to live in a small town without its own force. They contracted with state troopers and the sheriff department to respond to calls.

                      Will that scale up to the city level? I doubt it.

                    3. The reason they aren’t defending the sheriffs are probably 1) because the sheriffs don’t patrol for crimes in progress and aren’t responding to calls and 2) because the county Sheriff is an elected position, and they can’t simply eliminate that power by fiat.

                    4. Round here sheriffs do plenty of patrolling, though it’s mostly in rural areas.

                    5. They’re probably looking for someone who didn’t show up for their court date.

                    6. How many armed robberies in progress do the Minneapolis Police respond to in a given year? Have a special force of armed cops sitting around the cophouse like firemen do at the firehouse, and they can run out and fail to stop armed robberies when the calls come in. Send the rest home.

                    7. “How many armed robberies in progress do the Minneapolis Police respond to in a given year?”

                      I looked it up yesterday.

                      There were 1,100 armed robberies in Minneapolis in 2018.

                      If there are no police patrols in 2021, I would expect that number to go higher.

        2. “The government doesn’t owe you a place to live. The government doesn’t owe you food. The government doesn’t owe you free healthcare. The government doesn’t owe you an education.”

          In case someone was wondering–no, the government doesn’t owe you free condoms either.

          1. But free abortions are the most important function of government of course.

        3. The government is obligated to protect your rights from criminals.

          Not according to the government.

          1. If government has any legitimate purpose at all, it is to protect our rights. We have a military to protect our rights from foreign threats. We have courts to protect our rights from the police. We have police to protect our rights from criminals. That makes the police a legitimate purpose of government.

            Because you are entitled to the protection of your rights by the government doesn’t mean rape victims get to sue the government for failing to protect them from rapists. I didn’t think it was necessary to explain that to point out that protecting our rights from criminals is a legitimate responsibility of government.

            1. Because you are entitled to the protection of your rights by the government doesn’t mean rape victims get to sue the government for failing to protect them from rapists.

              If a rape victim is obligated to pay for “protection of their rights” and they are “entitled” to that protection and the government is “obligated” to provide protection as you claim, how should the rape victim not be able to sue them for utter failure to live up to their obligation to provide the victim to that which they are entitled?

              1. Buying the services of a surgeon entitles you to surgery. It doesn’t entitle you to success.

                If you’ve been raped, the person responsible is the person who raped you.

                Meanwhile, semantics aside, protecting people’s rights from criminals is a legitimate responsibility of libertarian government.

                1. It entitles you to an attempt. If you pay for a surgery and the surgeon does nothing but keeps your money, you can definitely sue for a refund or perhaps even damages from neglect. And if they botch the surgery, you can indeed sue them for malpractice.

                  When you say that the government is obligated to protect a person’s rights, the government disagrees. It’s not semantics.

                  1. “If you pay for a surgery and the surgeon does nothing but keeps your money, you can definitely sue for a refund or perhaps even damages from neglect. And if they botch the surgery, you can indeed sue them for malpractice.”

                    Actually, if there’s a 10% chance that having heart surgery will kill you on the operating table and a 70% chance that it will lengthen you life substantially, and you decide to go ahead with the surgery anyway, despite the risk of dying on the operating table, your family has no business suing the surgeon if you die–unless the surgeon did something out of the ordinary.

                    You’re just entitled to the surgery–not the hoped for results.

                    When you pay to take a class in college, you’re not entitled to an “A”. The professor is obligated to put forth a good effort in teaching you the material, but if you don’t get the results you wanted, well, life is like that. There are no guarantees of success. You don’t always get the results you wanted. If you hire an investment manager, you certainly shouldn’t get to sue him if the stock market crashes. That’s beyond his or her control.

                    We’re only responsible for things within our control. If you call the police and tell them there’s an intruder, the police ought to come help you. The ultimate outcome of that situation isn’t necessarily within their control. If the intruder does something to violate your rights despite their efforts, that doesn’t mean the police weren’t obligated to help you. It just means their efforts failed. The government is not obligated to ensure success.

                    They are obligated to protect your rights. At the very least, protecting our rights is their primary and maybe their only responsibility.

                    I’m not an anarchist, and one of the reasons is because it seems to me that liberty is not maximized when the government does nothing. If we were invaded by a foreign power that was hostile to our rights, our liberty would not be maximized. If the government fails to protect our rights from criminals, our liberty is not maximized. Another way to look at the idea that the legitimate purpose of government is to protect our rights is the idea that the legitimate functions of government are those that maximize liberty. We’re so used to the government doing thing that are outside their legitimate functions, but they do have legitimate functions, and when they fail at those, our liberty suffers.

                    When they protect us from murderers, armed robbers, arsonists, rapists, thieves, etc. they are maximizing our liberty–so long as they continue to respect everyone’s rights even as they protect us from criminals.

                  2. “It’s not semantics.”

                    If we’re talking about whether the government has an “obligation” to protect our rights, a “responsibility” to protect our rights, a “duty” to protect our rights, or whether we’re “entitled” to the government protecting our rights, we are talking about semantics.

                    Whatever different words you want to use and whatever you think they mean, the point is that the legitimate purpose of the government is to protect our rights–and that means protecting from criminals among other things. And in that situation, in the case you cited, the issue wasn’t the police didn’t arrive in response to the call. The issue was that the police were unsuccessful in their efforts.

            2. If government has any legitimate purpose at all, it is to protect our rights.

              This is literally the only legitimate function of government.

      2. It’s as if she thinks police actually do their job and investigate home invasions.

        I’m sure if her house got broken into they would investigate it to the full extent they are able to. You or me? Nah, but we’re not part of the governing class so we don’t matter.

        And this bitch has the gall to lecture other people about “privilege.”

        1. true

    2. She went on a….dons sunglasses….Bender with that.

      RIP Alamanian!

    3. The other things this quote underscores is . . .

      There’s a big questions floating around about whether the defund the police people really want to do away with the police or if they’re talking about something else.

      She’s literally telling you that calling the police for help with an intruder is a privilege that’s going on the trash heap. We’re now only left with the hope that they don’t really mean what they’re saying–not that we’re misinterpreting what they’re saying anymore.

      1. She’s literally telling you that calling the police for help with an intruder is a privilege that’s going on the trash heap.

        And she probably also believes that people shouldn’t be allowed to own the means to defend their own life and property either.

        1. Looks like Minnesota has a state preemption law, and I don’t suppose that’s because the gun laws in Minneapolis would be freer than they are statewide without it.

        2. Read ‘Bloodlands’ and try and tell me these degenerates don’t think like Stalin.

          Go ahead and try.

          Trump my ass. It’s the modern left that fit like a glove into that commie/fascist paradigm.

      2. Nice eh?

        Well, people vote for that socialist shit so….

      3. gonna be fucking sweet watching Mad Max Minneapolis play out right in front of us.

        1. I would agree except my parents volunteer at a charity located there, although they lived in the suburbs. Minneapolis is pretty uniformly liberal and retarded, but innocent people on the outskirts will be affected too

          1. starring in Escape from Minneapolis.

    4. If she truly believes this, then she should post her address on line. Let’s see her put her money where her mouth is, or if she’s just like the protesters, screaming for the cops the instant they fuck with the wrong driver or store owner.

      There was a case in Seattle the other day where an antifa idiot reached in and punched a guy who was driving, the guy shoots him in the arm, stops, and gets out of the car. All of a sudden all of the ACAB “Fuck the police” bitches are screaming for the cops to come save them. The media is already trying to make it sound like he was trying to do a Charlottesville Round 2 , despite video evidence to the contrary.

      1. They’re also calling him a “white Hispanic” when he’s clearly a brown-skinned mestizo.

        1. Yep. Read some of the comments “wHy WoUlD hE hAvE a GuN iF hE’s InNoCeNt?”

          Maybe because he knew there were a bunch of liberal cunts willing to drag anyone who’s “other” out of there car and beat them? Maybe he’s seen that happen before multiple times in Seattle and Portland by Antifa assholes?

          1. During a protest in Alamosa, Colorado, some dude got shot in the head while trying to navigate through a line of protestors going through a stoplight. The protesters straight-up lied and told the police the driver was speeding at them, but there’s a video showing that he’s barely edging through the light at about 2 mph trying not to hit anyone.

            The shooter is a shitlib local lawyer called John Marshall and his practice, hilariously, is called “Marshall Law LLC.”

            1. Alamosa??? WTF?

              This state sucks.

              1. If it makes you feel somewhat better, the lawyer isn’t from the state, he’s from a suburb of Cincinnatti. Oh, and his name is James Marshall, not John, my bad. Anyway, check out the dude’s bio from his web page:

                He became involved in fighting for the rights of oppressed people while studying Political Science and Spanish in college. He graduated Magna cum laude from the Ohio State University in 2015, where he was President of both the Rifle Club and the Cigar Culture Club.

                Basically, just some overcompensating, guilt-ridden white boy trying to feel virtuous for helping the poor brownskins. It’s honestly too bad, considering he appears to have had a promising career representing blue-collar folks around the San Luis Valley charged with minor traffic/criminal violations (something that demographic desperately needs), if he hadn’t been such a trigger-happy doofus.

  38. I love how Reason buried the story of Chicago’s nightmarish weekend without law enforcement in the Volokh blog where they know most people won’t see it. Of course Welchie Boy and his minions don’t want to talk much about Chicago’s most bloody, violent 24-48 hours in at least 60 years (and almost certainly much longer).

    Rogue, violent cops are a scourge and of course need to be rooted out and punished to the fullest possible extent. But they don’t really have much to do with the root of the systemic dysfunction and pathology within the black community, especially in the urban core.

    Until black America collectively decides that they’ve finally had enough of the depraved culture of drug gangs and the celebration of senseless violence and they decide to redirect their focus to more productive pursuits like education and family, I will never believe that they are completely serious about black lives mattering.

    1. I also like how everyone’s just forgotten that Project Veritas had some of these people on camera earlier this year saying that they’d burn these cities down if Bernie didn’t get the nomination

    2. Like I said above, if Floyd had been killed by a random black hood rat instead of a cop, no one would be giving a squirt of piss for him. Even as bad as cops in the hood are, they pale in comparison to how urban black people treat each other in their own neighborhoods.

    3. I think a lot of them do care. But someone keeps putting Al Sharpton and his ilk in charge of speaking for the “community”. Isnt there some kind of not so nice term to describe people like him who have special privileges with the white Democrats who live in the plantation big house, yet claim to be just like the other workers in the field who happen to have the same skin color?

      1. People like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson (and now, apparently, Kamala Harris) don’t wait for someone to put them in charge of speaking for the “community”. They just call a press conference, step up to the microphones, and declare *themselves* as spokespersons.

        1. One of the best South Park episodes concerns Jesse Jackson and is so relevant right now. Best line:

          Token: Jesse Jackson is not the emperor of black people!!!
          Stan: He told my dad he was…

  39. Reddit cofounder gives up board position and urges company to replace him with a black person. You can’t make this stuff up.

    1. Translation: “I’m not sticking around to possibly get lynched by the mob, I’m stepping down and living off my stock dividends. Have a nice day.”

  40. Its coughing and sneezing.

    That’s how its spread. You cough, you spread it if you have it.

    Coughing does not mean you are sick, though. It could be allergies. Maybe that sip of water went down the wrong tube. Perhaps a bit of dust got in the back of their throat. Who knows why people cough. I cough all the frickin time without being sick.

    But let’s say I am an asymptomatic carrier. It doesn’t matter why I cough, what matters is I’m spreading when I cough. Just because its dust, the virus doesn’t say “oh that cough has the wrong cause so I’ll wait for the next bus outa here.” That’s just silly.

    So, since I cough a lot normally, I pop a throat lozenge before going in public un masked. If I’m having particular coughing fits, I’ll wear a mask.

    What’s shocking, though, is that since all this started, I haven’t needed to cough. It’s like Covid cured my chronic cough.

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