Brickbat: Your Money Is No Good Here

The Mexican government is reportedly considering banning cash purchases of gasoline and the use of cash to pay highway tolls. The goal is to reduce tax evasion and money laundering and to identify stations that are selling stolen gas. Cash is used for 80 to 90 percent of purchases in the country.

Comments

[Rat on a train]

Can you still pay cash for drugs?

[Adans smith]

Cash, grass or ass.

[Inigo Montoya]

I just realized “cash, grass or ass” in Mexico is a variant of the old Reason manta “pot, ass sex and Mexicans!”

It’s been a few year since that slogan was bandied about.

[Rat on a train]

Is it time for another Glibbening?

[SQRLSY One]

I'm not sure...

To my mind, a more important question is...

Can we get Mexico to pay for my gas, grass, and ass? I could use some of THAT, and I don't need no stinkin' wall, ANYWHERE near as badly!

[loveconstitution1789]

They might come back if reason got rid of all the non-Libertarian staff, enforced bans on socks of trolls, and ENB made them sandwiches.

[Cyto]

The conversation here has been notably worse since that crew left. A few jump back and forth, and the conversation over there is much more intelligent in most cases, even if it is decidedly choir preaching.

I really miss a vibrant community of smart, liberty minded folks talking primarily about directly libertarian issues. "The Agitator" was a really good, if tiny community. HnR and Reason (the publication) were much better in those days as well. But those days are long gone.

All that being said, I do miss one stupid thing. Creating fake handles just to make a stupid joke work better was a lot of fun - even if the consequence was 50 different people being versions of the same troll. Yeah, it was stupid and sophomoric, but it made me laugh.

[bignose]

+1

[Mobile Price All]

Cash, grass or ass everything is ready for drugs... lol :V

[Juice]

Yes, and police bribes.

[Longtobefree]

How will the migrant caravans survive?

[Mickey Rat]

In WNY they eliminated cash tolls over bridges that are the Interstate connection from the bridges to Canada in Niagara County. It seems there is no way to charge Canadians who don't have an EZ Pass device for the tolls because the provinces will not agree to give the NYS toll collection agency access to their license tag database. Some local people are upset about that.

[loveconstitution1789]

I love those EZ Pass HOT lanes and toll roads that dont take cash.

I refuse to get a tracking beacon and they won't accept cash, so I don't pay. They send demand for payment and I ask for a jury trial. They never send anything again.

[creech]

Are you then in some scofflaw data base that will flag you to the cop that pulls you over for, say, speeding?

[loveconstitution1789]

Nope. All that stuff is considered civil violations for out-of-staters because there is no real Due Process to fight those EZ Pass violations. They can never prove who is driving. Additionally, Georgia does not have compacts with most states so my license plate stays valid.

I got a notice from Maryland one time where they wanted you to tell on the actual driver and give their drivers license number info. I just laugh and laugh. This shit is such a violation of the Constitution. No jury trials. No Due Process. No presumption of innocence. No appeal process.

This issue is fairly representative of how Americans let the government run all over them.

[Cyto]

I wonder.

I suspect that where that all ends is with a license suspension that gets enforced nation wide through cross-state agreements.

[loveconstitution1789]

I dont see how. The EZ Pass private companies have no idea what my drivers license number is and Georgia wont tell them. All these companies have is my license plate.

The states dont have a system to suspend license plates when the issuing state keeps it valid. Full Faith and Credit Clause and all that.

Pretty funny loophole.

Sometimes I get a second letter from an attorney begging me to pay because I am at the top of some bullshit scofflaw list (like Hihn's list). The lawyers get pressure to clear the top people, I'm sure.

[Cyto]

We had a variant of this conversation a week ago or so.

Someone had a license issued so it could be suspended. I'm not sure, but I think it was exactly analogous. Red light camera tickets in AZ, out of state plate. So they issued an AZ license to the owner of the out of state car and suspended it.

Same conversation I told of my tale. I got a ticket in Charlotte NC on my GA license. Paid ticket. 10 years later, my GA license is suspended. For not paying the ticket. So I had to get an attorney who got the entire ticket tossed. Cost me $330 bucks. Didn't get back my $86 for the ticket that they didn't credit to the right account though.

Fast forward another 15 years. I go to renew my FL license. Can't. My NC license is suspended.

"But I don't have a license in North Carolina."

After back and forth I call NC Dept of Transportation. "I need your NC driver's license number to look that up."

"I don't have a license in NC. I have not lived in NC since 1988"

"But I need you NC license number to look up why it is suspended...."

Round and round... they finally agreed that they had made a mistake in transferring electronic records that resulted in a suspension when the states were all tied together electronically.

"Great! So how quickly can you get this cleared up?"
"We need a $65 reinstatement fee."

"What?"

"A reinstatement fee. To reinstate your NC DL."

"The NC DL that I don't have, that was not suspended? That one? You want $65 to reinstate the license that I don't have and that wasn't suspended?"

"Yes, sir. It won't let me reinstate your license until you pay the fee."

"OK (realizing when I'm beat). Can I give you my credit card?"

"No sir, but if you come down to any NC DMV office they can take your payment...."

[loveconstitution1789]

Interesting story but it seems very different.

None of the other states have my drivers license number and Georgia wont give it to them. Therefore, these other states have no idea who is driving. Not that they can prove that anyway, but they assume the registered owner is the driver.

If you mean license plates... my license plates are registered in Georgia. Another state is not going to make up some license plate that is not on a vehicle to try to get money from an out-of-state driver. It makes no sense. If a cop stops my vehicle, the tag I have on the vehicle pops up as valid or not based on the registering state. All state are required to accept that valid registration pursuant to the Full Faith and credit Clause of the US constitution. I have never had an issue with this.

Maybe I misunderstood your comment.

As of now, there is no remedy for other states and they are pissed. I know this because I get letters with their pleas and they never stop me for having a valid Georgia license plate. I occasionally pass those cops with the license plate scanners, so you would they would stop me.

[albo]

I refuse to get a tracking beacon and they won’t accept cash, so I don’t pay.

So, you pick and choose the laws you want to follow? Very social of you

[loveconstitution1789]

I don't follow unconstitutional laws.

No law is valid in the USA that seeks to take my property without Due Process.

I offer to pay cash every time and they wont accept it. Then I demand a jury trial for them to prove a violation of the law and they refuse.

[loveconstitution1789]

I also have whatever Armaments that I want because all gun control laws are unconstitutional.

I had catastrophic health insurance and no regular health insurance when unconstitutional ObamaCare was on the books.

I dont have a social security number or birth certificate yet worked for decades.

[Vernon Depner]

I dont have a social security number or birth certificate yet worked for decades.

That would be impossible today.

[loveconstitution1789]

My kids dont have those either.

They were born at home with a mid wife and they were homeschooled. Their college was paid for in cash and they now own their own businesses.

All they needed was a tax ID number just like me.

[Bubba Jones]

I think it's an important distinction that you are deliberately choosing to use a toll lane without paying the toll.

You know they won't take cash on the spot. And you refuse to pay with an alternative form of payment later.

There is nothing unconstitutional about any of this. As evidenced by the fact that you face no consequences.

You are simply choosing to steal in this case because you know you can't be punished.

[loveconstitution1789]

I mean, Jesus, pull the bag of government dicks out of your mouth. All crimes require proof of guilt before a trier of fact beyond a reasonable doubt. The state is trying to steal money without following the constitutional, so fuck them.

Uh, no. Some take cash and some dont.

I am deliberately taking advantage of an unconstitutional tolling scheme that sometimes wont take cash and then refuses to give me my Due Process rights to prove a violation had actually occurred.

Your rights can be violated without you suffering any serious injury, like arrest.The injury is the violation of the right.

[loveconstitution1789]

I do find it hilarious that you are peanut butter and jealous.

[GroundTruth]

Bubba, as I point out below, what does it say on the paper they issue as "money"???? If they won't take that, then they are just being a PITA. Sorry, but I completely agree with loveconst on this one. They can't have it both ways. Either it's money for ALL debts, or it's not.

[NashTiger]

Legal tender, all debts, public and private

[loveconstitution1789]

+100

[GroundTruth]

A man after mine own heart!

What the frack does it say on the paper they use in place of real money? "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private"... yes I know it's not technically a debt until you have consumed the wares, but if it is collected at the end of a tolled stretch or road, then isn't is a debt?

[Fist of Etiquette]

It's bueno to know banks own the Mexican government, too.

[Jerryskids]

The goal is to reduce tax evasion and money laundering and to identify stations that are selling stolen gas.

While it should say "the stated goal..." because it may be that the real goal is to identify sketchy characters with lots of cash the local policia might hit up for contributions, it's still refreshing to see "the goal.." rather than the flat "this will.." announcement that usually accompanies new programs as if the outcome of any given piece of legislation is necessarily going to be the intended outcome.

[AlmightyJB]

There's no way money launderers will find away around that.

[crufus]

What about people who do not have credit cards?

Won't this act as a ban on buying gas or using toll roads for them?

[Vernon Depner]

...that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

[GroundTruth]

I may not be of your faith, but I certainly know the verse, and it sure looks to be where we are headed PDQ.

[TangoDelta]

Oh the humanity! Where are our elected officials who whine when stores don't accept cash? Why aren't they seeking to punish the Mexican people for the actions of their government?

[Bubba Jones]

I don't get it. People are laundering their cash by paying tolls?

Perhaps the real issue is that toll operators are skimming the cash, and that detail is left out of the article.

[GroundTruth]

One more reason that I have no interest in visiting the UMS.