White Nationalists

Yes, America Faces a Threat From White Nationalists. No, More Laws Won't Fix That.

If your neighbor were unbalanced, armed to the teeth and busy posting social-media messages about how much he hates you, you'd certainly support measures to disarm him. But you'd feel more secure if he didn't hate you in the first place.

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As the cliché goes, "guns don't kill people, people kill people." I'm a gun-rights supporter and own some legally purchased and properly stored firearms, and they are no threat to anything—other than the errant coyote who attacks my herd of goats, or any potential home invader. Still, we all need to face the fact that people armed with powerful weapons can cause a hell of a lot of carnage.

That's why the latest mass shootings are so upsetting. Your family is at a wholesome community festival, or doing some back-to-school shopping and, in the blink of an eye, you're in a scene from war-torn Beirut. This is not a column about gun control. I will evaluate specific proposals as they are unveiled, but this column is about why some people—using high-capacity rifles or whatnot—commit atrocities.

If your neighbor were unbalanced, armed to the teeth and busy posting social-media messages about how much he hates you, you'd certainly support measures to disarm him. But you'd feel more secure if he didn't hate you in the first place. Here's another cliché: "Ideas matter." The people using guns to slaughter people are, in most cases, driven by ideas. What are those ideas and why do they matter? Why do they hate you?

"If foreign terrorists attacked Dayton, El Paso and Gilroy, would America do nothing?" asked a USA Today editorial's headline. Indeed. When it comes to Islamic radical terror, Americans aren't fuzzy headed. They don't ruminate about the need for mental-health services or question the reason why some of these killers stage horrific attacks.

I recall a comedy routine in which the actors, pretending to be TV anchors, try to figure out the reasons for an act of terrorism. They read the Arabic names of the attackers and pretended to be stumped by the motivation for the violence. It was an apparent jab at former President Obama for his reluctance to use the term "Islamic terrorism."

Now, we've got a similar situation on the right. Not all, but some of the latest mass killers appear motivated by a far-right, white-nationalist ideology. A manifesto posted online shortly before the El Paso shooting spree, which may have been penned by the alleged shooter, railed against "the Hispanic invasion of Texas" and worried about "cultural and ethnic replacement."

The suspect in the shooting death of 11 worshipers at a Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, synagogue last year allegedly told the police, "They're committing genocide to my people. I just want to kill Jews." We're familiar with the fatal car attack at the white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, and the 2015 attack on an African-American church in Charleston, South Carolina, that left nine people dead.

Obviously, not all of the recent mass shootings are the work of right-wing fanatics. Last weekend's alleged shooter in Dayton, Ohio, reportedly had made left-wing posts on social media. One of the most infamous, politically motivated murder sprees was the work of the Unabomber, who penned a 35,000-word screed against modern industrial society. I remember conservatives noting the similarity of his ideas to those of Al Gore.

Despite Fox News anchor Tucker Carlson's claim that the nation's white-supremacy problem is a hoax, the evidence suggests otherwise. It's not the nation's only violence problem. But conservatives, including Donald Trump, were quick to pinpoint the reason for, say, a mass shooting in San Bernardino, California, that killed 14 people at a Christmas party. The then-presidential candidate called for a "total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what the hell is going on."

Why is it so difficult to call out what's going on now? I'm not blaming the president for recent violence, although I wish he would knock off the incendiary rhetoric about immigrants. Everyone should tone down the hysterics and anger, which only motivates the nutcases among us.

But the president and some of his supporters have a blind spot about white-nationalist terror, just as the former president had a blind spot about Islamic radicalism. The president's recent talk was more presidential than usual, as he condemned "racism, bigotry and white supremacy," but then he undermined his points with subsequent Twitter tirades.

There's clearly an energized group of self-radicalized white nationalists who "take inspiration from prior acts of vicious mayhem and cheer high body counts on Internet message boards," wrote National Review's Rich Lowry. He called on the FBI to treat these "domestic terrorists and subversives" in the way that they crushed what was once America's most notorious hate group, the Ku Klux Klan.

Using existing laws to stamp out potentially violent extremists is a better starting point than passing new laws that mostly target law-abiding citizens. That means acknowledging that people who kill people with guns often are motivated by twisted ideologies. It's time to confront those ideologies, whether they emanate from the white-nationalist right, Islamic radical movements or any other fever swamp.

This column was first published in the Orange County Register.

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  1. you’re right the Democrats are a threat to the USA.

    First they fought for slavery.
    Then the Lefties fought for segregation.
    Now Lefties fight for destruction of America.

    1. This Reason essay is about Right Wing US terrorism, you stupid dipshit.

      1. Bah. It’s about using the strawman of “Right Wing US terrorism”.

        The author may or may not use it to justify gun control, free speech restrictions, etc. but the Left damn sure will.

        1. Its not a strawman if it is real. The FBI set up a special unit to counter domestic (white nationalist) right wing terrorism.

          The left will use any excuse to impose gun control.

          1. Heh, the fact that the federal government is taking advantage of it doesn’t make it real. It’s just “not letting a crisis go to waste”.

          2. More people died on the last year from blunt objects than died from white nationalist terrorism in the last 20 years. It would be more effective if they went after home depot.

          3. Poor Pedo Sarah’s Palin’s Buttplugger.

          4. Kiddie Raper, you should kill yourself.

      2. Don’t expect any reasoned comments from lc. I thought he/she might be a troll at first but sadly, they’re just that dumb.

        1. Says the person scared by statistical noise.

        2. Says the troll wearingit who never provides anything but word salads.

      3. Is that the terrorism that has 109 deaths in the last 20 years? 5 a year? The horror! Cower under your sheets Palin. Cry yourself to sleep. Nobody except 355 million Americans can escape.

        1. I even question those numbers.
          You’d think each of those deaths would’ve been covered a bit more if “white nationalism” were really the motivations

          1. If they are the ADL number it includes such things as 3 deaths from minority on minority violence and a white nationalist killing his own kid. It is a pretty flawed report. And even stretching it they could only reach 109. Literal statistical noise.

            1. Let’s not forget that a Bernie Sanders supporter shot up a baseball field full of GOPers & where was the outrage from the Left & Lame-stream media?????

      4. He’s subverting the story. Not quite sarcasm, but close. Check your sarcasm meter, it may need new batteries.

        The point he’s making is that the Progressive Left, which calls itself the Democrat Party, has an awful lot of nerve shouting about White Supremacy and Fascism. As Democrats, they are the heirs of the party of the Confederacy, the part of the first three incarnations of the KKK, and the party of Jim Crow. And as Progressives and self-styled Socialists they are the heirs to every Socialist/Marxist/Fascist authoritarian regime that murdered millions of people in the 20th century.

        1. +100

          1. wasn’t all that difficult to grasp … good flip

        2. Although the Democratic party has an abhorrent history, the Republicans embraced progressive politics in the progressive era (late 1800s – early 1900s) they aren’t innocent.
          The Democrats literally are batshit at this point though.

          1. Two thirds of the country, both parties, identified as progressives in the early 1900s.
            FDR, Stalin, and Hitler differed only in style, not function or fundamentals

            1. True, it certainly was a terrifying era. Unfortunately the left of today ignore history and are all too willing to take us down those well beaten paths trodden by the millions of victims of socialism.

              1. We’re only now, hopefully, coming to the end of the progressive era

            2. I don’t like FDR. I think he’s one more elitist ninny. However, I don’t think it’s fair to lump him in with Stalin and the despicable Austrian. A Stalin, a Mao, a Pol Pot…these are the end products of the process of consolidating all power into the structure of the State. When the Intellectual Elitists (and FDR was certainly one of THOSE) have managed to make the State unaccountable, THEN a brutal murdering psychotic takes it away from them…and usually proceeds to have them liquidated.

              1. Opened concentration camps. Praised Mussolini at one time. Was anti-Semitic. Gave Stalin everything he wanted at Yalta over the protest of our closer ally, England. Threatened Congress and the USSC to get his way. Used the law and unions to silence critics of his policies. Stole people’s personal belongings (gold) using the force of the state. Created a paramilitary training program disguised as a jobs program (CCC). Maybe the biggest difference is the US Constitution kept him from going as far as the others?

                1. Yup, I was thinking the same thing.
                  Perhaps if FDR would have been head of state in a nation with far less constitutional restraints on government power he would have been the same as Stalin or Mao.

                2. ^^^ this

                3. You forgot that he was also a racist.

                  1. True. Who opposed anti-lynching laws proposed by the Republicans.

                4. There is a huge qualitative difference between Internment Camps for possible enemy aliens (he so detained Italians and Germans, too, just not as comprehensively), and Forced Labor Camps and Extermination Camps. There is also a certain amount of evidence, as I recall, that the mass detention of the West Coast Japanese-Americans was a reaction to the very real possibility of anti-Japanese race riots.

                  I don’t wish to be a pedantic pain, but conflating various degrees of Prison Camp with the Final Solution is familiar and tiresomely dishonest Leftwing tactic…that they somehow manage to make worse by never mentioning the Gulag or the Laogai.

                  FDR was a sonofabitch. Mencken was entirely justified in calling him “Roosevelt the Lesser” and Mencken detested Teddy. But he isn’t on the same page as Stalin.

          2. “Innocent” and “Functional Political Party” are mutually exclusive. Doesn’t excuse wallowing in slime to the extent the Democrats do, though.

      5. Check out SPB, the Left wing terrorist and kiddie porn poster.

      6. This Reason essay is about Right Wing US terrorism, you stupid dipshit.

        No, it’s about ‘white nationalism’.

        And the Democrats are the creators of white nationalism–from their endless slavery apologia–in which the foundations of modern white supremacy were laid, to their war to keep black people as farm anmals, to the founding of the KKK as the Democratic party’s terrorist arm, to the implementation of segregation and Jim Crow, to their fondness for lynching black people, to their penchant for electing klansmen

        It just goes on and on and on.

        Even today–how many prominent Democrats and leftist activists have been caught in blackface or wearing KKK garb–ACTUAL KKK garb, not maga hats?

        How many support a program of minority self segregation? Have your own dorms, your own study halls, your own graduations and proms–that’ll show whitey…that he can have all the white only spaces he wants so long as the sign over the minority only section is flashy enough and says ‘no whites allowed’.

        No leftist controlled country is known for racial, ethnic, sexual or religious tolerance.

        1. From the article:

          Now, we’ve got a similar situation on the right. Not all, but some of the latest mass killers appear motivated by a far-right, white-nationalist ideology.

          Learn to read, pal.

          1. Your cut out also includes the word appear. It is an advancement of a narrative ignoring the majority of the el paso manifesto. Weird you missed that.

            Even giving you those deaths…. 5 a year. A weekend on chicago. Please, keep being scared.

            1. The El Paso shooter hated immigrants and wanted to kill to prevent Democrats from taking over Texas.

              He is pure right wing Trump Trash.

              1. So you admit you are ignorant. Congrats I guess?

              2. He hated immigrants because he believed they over reproduce and consume too many resources. The result of which was killing the planted. He also hated corporations and believed they had undue influence on the government. Far-left musings.

              3. And you’re pure pedophile.

          2. Define ‘far-right.’ Where I stand far-right is anarchy, far-left is total government. Which would make the ‘white nationalists’ and all nationalists far-left. The European view of left/right is communism/fascism. Both are total government, opposite sides of the same coin.

            1. “Right wing” = privileged class, race, or ethnic group

              Left = egalitarian

              1. Both of those positions require total government to enforce. So you are aligning with communism (egalitarian) v fascism (caste) model. So if we are only left with two totalitarian options, where the concept of freedom from government telling you who you are and what you are worth is complete lost? So you are ok with that nationalist part, as long as it is a kaleidoscope and not monochromatic nationalism?

                1. I align with neither.

                  But a capitalist can go right (Henry Ford was a racist) or go left (Warren Buffett and Bill Gates want higher taxes to pay for social programs).

                  What I truly despise are the FAR left and FAR right (your examples of communism and fascism are appropriate)

                  1. You align with NAMBLA you fucking pedophile.

              2. So Black Lives Matter and La Raza are right-wing? Thanks for clearing that up.

              3. “Left = egalitarian”

                *Gigglesnort*

                Oh, man, I gotta clean my keyboard! Tell another one!

          3. One can ONLY appear motivated by a far-right white nationalist ideology.

            Because no such thing exists in reality.

            The far right is extremely anti-collectivist–much more so that your average individualistic right-winger. Misanthropy is as close as they get to the collectivism of racism.

        2. Democrats are still the party of white nationalism. They proudly accept the Margaret sanger award at a big party every year, Sanger is a noted racist eigenecist. The democrats actively encourage races to self segregate, accomplishing what the KKK couldn’t. They abort tens of thousands of minority babies a year. Look at the outrage Democrats show against First Step as trump frees minorities from prison. They fight charter schools which are shown to be the greatest learning advantage of minorities in inner cities. Democrats rage at any and every minority who dares step off the democrat plantation calling minority conservatives aunt jemima and uncle Tom.

          Democrats never left their racist past, they just switched strategies.

          1. Paternalism is far more effective than antagonism. But it’s all just democrat racism and bigotry at the core of it. Always has been.

      7. There is very little danger from a fake Liberal media invented issue. All FBI statistics point that Islamic terrorism and interracial violence against Caucasians are the real threats.

      8. So where is the article about the left wing terrorism? The ANTIFA and the BLM? How all of the mass shooters in the past were left wing supremacists! Then there was the left wing supremacist who flew his private small plane into a building in San Antonio a few years back? How about the shooter in Dayton that was inspired by the Democrat supremacist candidate talking points that were on his face book page? He was going to vote for the racist Elizabeth Warren for God’s sake! Where the h*ll is the outrage from the left? Where the h*ll was the outrage from the left when 5 Dallas police officers were killed by BLM? Obama condoned those killings! Where the h*ll is the outrage over the Ferguson riots where the black nationalists destroyed their own town? Obama condoned that also! Where the h*ll is the outrage over the racist Tliab calling Trump a mother***er on her first day? Where the h*ll is the outrage over the black nationalist Elijah Cummings not taking care of his district in Baltimore where their is mostly poor black people? Want to talk about racism?? Then we have the main stream conspiracy news media who hates Trump, for 2 years telling us that Trump is going down over the Trump/Russia collusion bulls**t! The news media LIED TO US!! They reported one conspiracy after another and the leftwing Democrat supremacists believed every word of it! Now, if that isn’t mind control then what is?

      9. “Right-wing” terrorism, such as that El Paso shooter, with extreme left opinions about everything but dark-skinned immigrants. In other words, he matches Progressive idol Woodrow Wilson in racism, but is to his left otherwise.

    2. Agreed! Here is the problem. Has any one looked up the meaning of “nationalist”? The main stream conspiracy news media has taken that word and completely anihalated it! The word nationalist means one who loves their country and only wants the best for his country. It has NOTHING to do with race!! You do realize that in Africa their are millions of people that love their country, dies that make them racist? No, it doesn’t! Does that make them a nationalist? Yes, it does! The same goes for Japanese people who love their country! Does that make them racist? No, it does not! Does that make them nationalists? Yes, it does!! So, you see how the news media has twisted the meaning of words and what they mean?!?! Too many dumbed down people are influenced by the news media. The news media actually tells people what and how to think, as shown in the example above with the word “nationalist”.

    3. Then in 1968 George Wallace Dixiecrats carried 22 electoral SPOILER votes. God’s Own Prohibitionists got the message, and again–as in 1928–tailored their policies to attract. The splinter group that danced in the streets when JFK was shot, blew up “colored” churches, murdered rights activists, then lined up to burn Beatles records as Avatars of Satan, became today’s Gee Oh Pee. Just ask Wonder Warthog!

  2. If my neighbor were unbalanced, armed to the teeth and busy posting social-media messages about how much he hates me, I certainly would not support measures to disarm him. Instead I’d take measures to arm myself.

    Even granting the wildly improbable idea that the “measures to disarm him” would be proposed and implemented in good faith, they would still do more harm than good to my safety. Besides it’s the Law (the Highest Law in the Land) that we both be able to arm ourselves, and I would grant the Devil Himself the benefit of that law for my own safety’s sake.

    1. The solution is for all the sane people to be armed.

    2. If I had that problem I wouldn’t worry too much. At some point he would just leave, and never be seen again. Never to return.

      1. Hey, nice Bushmaster you got there. Didn’t your neighbor used to have one just like it?

        1. Bushmaster was my nickname back in college.

    3. Thank you, Sir Thomas!

  3. Mass shooters are much, much more likely to be anti-corporate, anti-Christian, enviro doomsayers. Sure, there is some overlap with “white nationalism”, but going back all the way to Columbine, the above is by far the most common profile.

    I wonder when anyone is going to castigate those who sow fear, hate, and division with all the “12 years left” rhetoric?

    1. More likely? How much more likely? You’re You’re probably lying.

      1. You’re stuttering

        1. Hes still emotionally raging from his incoherent screams from yesterday.

      2. Other than the the Pittsburgh synagogue and Dylan Roof in Charleston, about 100% more likely

      3. In addition to the anti-immigrant stuff, the manifesto from the El Paso shooter included anti-capitalist, anti-Christian, and eco-terrorist rants.

        1. He is a racist right winger who wanted to preserve Texas for the Republican Party.

          Actually millions of Republicans openly worry that Hispanic voters will turn Texas Blue. They just don’t shoot/kill 22 Mexicans to stop it.

          1. Actually millions of Republicans openly worry that Hispanic voters will turn Texas Blue.

            Well, sure, it’s not like the Democrats have been open about doing exactly that.

            Hell, even OM is admitting now that this is all about demographic replacement.

            1. That’s because IT IS about demographic replacement.

              White Americans are the only ethnic group in America that actually give majority support to freedom and the ideals of America. If you’re a totalitarian prick, that means you need to drown out the white people in order to take over. This is exactly what they’ve been doing, by any means necessary. Such as supporting illegal immigration.

          2. He seemed all over the place ideologically. His anti-immigrant stances does not make him a right winger. It may make him a racist.

            1. If he just reversed on immigration, he could write a column for Reason

          3. Except he was a Democrat.

    2. Yes, the El Paso killer was a “deep ecologist”, he opposed immigration because he thought we had too many people of ANY color in the US to be sustainable.

      That’s actually a much more scary ideology than “white nationalism”, because it’s explicitly genocidal.

      1. That position isn’t any different from the one the Sierra Club held for decades.

        They only changed their position after David Gelbaum made a massive donation in the early 90s that was contingent upon them dropping their opposition to mass immigration.

        1. In truth, it’s a legit argument.

          The quality of life of the people here would be FAR higher if we only had saaay 250 million people here now instead of creeping up on 300 million.

          The environment would be far less polluted. There would be less competition for living in the nicest places. We’d need less infrastructure. One could go on for days.

  4. White nationalists as a group, are a threat, about as dangerous as a non-circus employee being trampled to death by an elephant. It’s not something worth claiming a national crisis.

    I’m not saying that two mass shootings in a weekend isn’t troubling, but I don’t think government intervention will find the answer. Even if we do have a few El Paso situations, we’re reaching the point where there’s a lot fewer Ted Bundy’s and John Wayne Gacy’s, so we’re making progress.

    1. This is the point, and this is what “white nationalist threat is a hoax” obviously means.

      Even the “two shootings in a week” didn’t pan out. One was clearly a left wing nutjob. And the other guy? Well, clearly didn’t like immigrants and clearly wanted to make a point about Mexicans… but other than that, his screed seems pretty left-wing. So more of an isolationist, radical environmentalist, socialist kinda take? I don’t know about that one.

      But for those two incidents to be held up as evidence of a huge national crisis of white nationalism is pretty ridiculous. You have 1 arguable case of a nutjob who targeted Mexicans but otherwise seems more of a smorgasbord of fringe ideas. And one clearly left wing dude.

      But even if the base evidence were true, it still doesn’t add up to a crisis. They’ve been trying to get these white nationalist dudes ginned up into real stuffing for their straw man for 3 years now, and they still haven’t managed to get more than a couple of thousand nutcases nation wide.

      No, America doesn’t face a threat. At least not in the sense that it is an existential threat, or even more than a hangnail threat.

      Individual Americans face one-off crazy dude threats. Right now there are a lot of politically motivated threats among the one-off crazy dude threats. But I’ll posit that the reason for this is that “the national conversation” has been about racism and how racist everyone is for the last 10 years – ever since the “grass roots movement” of the Obama campaign discovered the utility of things like #BLM.

      If, instead of racism and white nationalism, the conversation was about bath salts, then every nutcase would be about bath salts…. as it was during the “bath salts” scare. Remember “bath salts guy eats man’s face”? With the crazy guy who wasn’t on any drugs at all?

      Yeah, that’s what we have now with “white nationalism”. We have an entire industry that exists solely to attack racism. And they ran out of racism to attack 30 years ago. So they’ve been working overtime to gin up some racism to avoid going under.

      And it seems like they are having some success at it, unfortunately.

      1. That’s what Carlson should have said. I understood what he meant, but he said it badly.
        Obviously white nationalists exist. And occasionally commit acts of violence (whether you want to call them terrorism is another question). So they are a threat to someone and their existence is not a hoax. What is a hoax is that they are any kind of existential threat to America or have any chance of getting real political power.
        If anything is emboldening them, it isn’t Trump, but all of the idiots in media and on social media declaring that the Nazis have taken over and white nationalism is on the rise. If the media keeps telling everyone that you are this powerful threat, maybe you start thinking that now it your time to act. But even in that climate, there are very few incidents. Which makes me think it’s still mostly just nut-jobs losing their shit.

        1. Yes, we spent all of the 80’s and 90’s ignoring the KKK and Nazis and their rallies… David Duke being the brief detour.

          And it worked.
          They were exiled to the Jerry Springer show as a comedy bit.

          It worked. 100%. They were completely marginalized.

          And who brought them back? It sure as hell wasn’t Donald Trump.

          It was Anderson Cooper and Rachel Maddow and Savannah Guthrie and a hundred other left leaning voices in the media. It was Obama and Holder and HRC.

          Nobody was going to give them a second thought. But you can’t have #BLM and a national conversation on race if you don’t have a boogieman to march against.

          Right after the election there was a flurry of coverage of “hate crimes” of people painting swastikas all over the place. Uniformly they turned out to be hoaxes perpetrated not by Nazis, but by people who were supposedly battling Nazis.

          This entire thing has been a hoax… whether deliberate strategy originating in leftist think tanks, or unhappy accident due to personal biases and wish fulfillment.

          They are right about one thing though…. it is worse now than it was 10 years ago. But that ain’t because of the rise of a 10 million strong American Nazi party.

          1. Meanwhile islamic extremism IS an existential threat and we are always told “don’t be islamophobic”.

      2. You’re nuts. The El Paso shooter said his motive was to stop immigrants and keep Texas in Republican power. His racist ass is pure right wing.

        1. What of his calls for nationalized healthcare? Or the environmentalist screeds?

          Maybe sometimes crazy dude ideology doesn’t fit neatly into one box.

        2. What is that saying about repeating a lie loud enough and often enough….

          1. If turd couldn’t post lies here, he wouldn’t post at all.

            1. He would just focus more on his child porn collection. Or luring children into his ice cream truck that smells vaguely of chloroform.

              He’s like Wendell……

              https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GDqRJvHdwqo

        3. You need to educate yourself based on your language and false biased comments.

    2. You’re more likely to get shot on an average weekend in Chicago or Baltimore than you are by a white nationalist.

      WNMSs are this decade’s version of serial killers or the Satanic Panic.

      1. So? We’re talking about terrorism (political motivation) – not routine homicides.

        1. No, the topic was “America faces threat”.

          Hence the focus on the size and scope of that threat. There’s lots of good points behind “not that much” for the size and scope of the threat of white nationalism in the USA.

          You can put it in perspective by using the “people getting shot” bucket for comparison, where it is barely a drop in the bucket. Or you could put it in perspective by comparing to “all terrorism”, where you can make an argument that it is pretty important, particularly if you narrowly focus your gaze in such a way as to enhance the threat of white nationalists and downplay other threats.

          Or you could do like Neil deGrasse-Tyson and use the bucket of “causes of unexpected death” for comparison, in which case “white nationalists shooting people in large groups” is not even a blip.

          1. If so, then why even write the essay?

            The essay was written because right wing terrorism is a growing threat.

            1. I think you hit the nail on the head. Several people are making that exact point. Why focus so much attention on a minuscule threat?

              Others are making the point “this threat is so great that we must abandon our principles and toss aside the first and second amendments to fight this evil!”

            2. It’s not a growing thread. It’s a Liberal media invention to force people to ignore that White people are expected to become minorities due to immigration.

              1. Well, it’s their plan for scaring white people into not being able to have a legitimate conversation on that subject… America is a weird thing that is a category of its own. We were a nation of WHITE immigrants… But in Europe, the argument that white people have no right to keep the places that have been their homelands for thousands of years majority European… It’s bullshit.

                I personally am of the mind that America would have been far better off and a happier society without all the ethnic tension non European immigration has brought… But even if you want to throw America into the dustbin of history for the feelz, that argument does NOT hold up for Europe. They ARE the indigenous people there, and lord knows if any other group of indigenous people were being swamped out of existence in their homelands, Progs would be shitting a brick.

                They want the chaos and clusterfuck mass migration of incompatible groups brings.

            3. “This essay was written because Greenhut’s new girlfriend won’t give him the back door unless he writes about the growing threat of right wing terrorism”. There, FIFY.

        2. Yes, terrorism bad. Homicide bad. Point, please..?

  5. Every time I read one of these shooter’s/bomber’s manifestos, they make so much more sense to me than any of the sewage I get force fed by sack of shit western civilization hating marxist media. The Tedpill was especially illuminating.

    The faithfully observant Muslims aren’t the only modern group of people to practice cultural destruction from within and have a religiously accepted method of lying to further their supremacist cause. Or, for that matter, to refer to other groups of humans as livestock whose only function is to be exploited for labor and sex. Just sayin’.

    P.S. USS Liberty.

    1. No, most of these guys’ “manifestos” are just exceptional stream-of-consciousness autism. Most of them would have been put in asylums back in the day, instead of being pumped to the gills with psychotropic drugs and allowed to matriculate in normal society.

      Ted K.’s manifesto is the exception, not the rule, and unlike a lot of these other idiots, he could competently make functioning bombs. The Columbine shooters and Holmes would have racked up much higher body counts if the explosive devices they had rigged up had gone off.

  6. It’s hard to take you seriously when you use Vox as a credible source to your assertions on white supremacy.

    Good Lord…

    1. well, they are a mostly pasty white bunch.

  7. “If your neighbor were unbalanced, armed to the teeth and busy posting social-media messages about how much he hates you, you’d certainly support measures to disarm him.”

    The fuck I would. I’m armed to the teeth too. I don’t give a shit what my neighbor is posting on social media. He’s got the same freedom of speech as I do. And the same right to keep and bear arms.

    1. It’s also hard to get upset over anyone being ‘armed to the teeth’ if you’re aware that the threshold for that category appears to be ‘he owns TWO semiautomatic .22 rimfire rifles’.

      1. If that’s the threshold for being “armed to the teeth” what does that make me to a prog… A major international military power? LOL

    2. +100

    3. Strange isn’t how the ‘libertarian’ authors at Reason are so quick to presume a government imposed ‘solution’ to any problem…

  8. “But the president and some of his supporters have a blind spot about white-nationalist terror, just as the former president had a blind spot about Islamic radicalism.”

    If Obama was supposed to treat “Islamic radicalism” the way Conservatives claim they wanted him to, then Conservatives need to condemn all White people because of a few White-nationalist nut-bars.

    Obama’s approach was merely a continuation of Bush’s approach of not conflating Islam with their nut-bars.

    1. Obama’s approach was to lecture Americans for being intolerant immediately after any Islamist terror attack.
      When I say immediately, I mean before anybody even had the chance to react and display the “intolerance” that Obama seemed to think was the defining trait of Americans.
      Fuck off with your racism and bigotry, kumi

      1. No, Obama’s approach was to kill the Islamo-terrorists (he racked up over 30 AG/ISIS leaders including the grand prize Bin Laden) then avoid inciting further violence by needlessly calling all Muslims “terrorists”.

        1. Sure, after he got his lecture in.

        2. And then funded one of the largest state sponsors of terrorism.

          1. You mean the EPA?

            /Sarc

            1. ok, make that two of the largest….

              1. BATFE?

                1. DEA?

                  1. Hell FBI?

    2. Except the whole obama shipping billions to one of the leading sponsors of terrorism. Let us know when trump starts funding white nationalist groups okay?

      1. Liar. He released their frozen funds when they agreed to halt nuclear fuel production.

        1. He released the Shah’s funds, not the mullahs’

        2. “Liar. He released their frozen funds when they agreed to halt nuclear fuel production.”

          If turd was kept from lying here, he wouldn’t post at all.

        3. Pedo Sarahs buttplugger thinks that cash was sitting in a vault for 40 years.

          Haha. God is he dumb.

    3. Obama’s approach was merely a continuation of Bush’s approach of not conflating Islam with their nut-bars.

      Bullshit. Bush called out the difference between the majority of Islam and the homicidal maniac faction of it. Obama denied the existence of the radicals.

      1. Wrong again.

        “In refusing to use the term ‘radical Islam,’ Obama was following a precedent set by his Republican predecessor, George W. Bush, who said after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks that ‘ours is not a campaign against the Muslim faith. Ours is a campaign against evil.’

        https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/06/14/482041137/president-obama-slams-yapping-over-radical-islam-and-terrorism

        1. And how is this materially different to what I said?

    4. Is Kuni a parody account like OBL? If not, he’s a fucking idiot.

  9. “When it comes to Islamic radical terror, Americans aren’t fuzzy headed. They don’t ruminate about the need for mental-health services or question the reason why some of these killers stage horrific attacks.”

    Some Americans are not. Some Americans begin pearl clutching about “Islamophobia”.

    1. Or resort to Islam is a religion of peace so these aren’t true Muslims.

  10. Has the Reason website posted anything with even a hint of integrity this month? I can only recall a deluge of sewage, to which this essay contributes.

    1. You mean have they posted any Trump-fellating screeds about how much winning we’re getting tired of, like they do at Breitbart or Daily Stormer? No, not lately, you white supremacist piece of shit.

      1. Are you really the same OM? You sound like a completely different person. I saw your screed on that topic yesterday, but I don’t remember OM ever going off on this sort of tangent.

        You doing ok? Is it just your personal buttons getting pushed, or is something going sideways for OM? I didn’t have an impression of OM as being perpetually angry.

        1. It’s the only OM I’ve ever seen, but I haven’t been here even 2 years yet.
          Let’s hope whatever troubles him comes to a permanent end

        2. I am still the same but I took the gloves off, Cyto. I’m tired of being so deferential to people who, they say, just don’t agree with me. Bullshit, they aren’t deserving of any reasoned diacussion. These Trumpistas have proven that they’re not only dangerously ignorant, they’re downright homicidal. I am tired of arguing with white supremacists. Again, the gloves are off.

          1. The gloves were helping you to not unintentionally hurt yourself. You should put them back on and start retaking your meds.

          2. ‘Took the gloves off’

            Really?

            You were always a bit blind to the issues one might have with your countrymen, OM, but you would talk, and seemed to be able to see basic precepts such as ‘you can have open borders, or you can have a welfare state, but not both’

            And you talked about issues besides immigration.

            BUT, ever since this–
            ““When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.””

            you’ve been unhinged.

            From that point on everyone who wasn’t openly shrieking about the evil of Trump became a ‘trumpista’–even people you’d been talking to for years.

            And no one has understood why.

            The statement is clumsy and coarse–but it’s not the klaxon to racism that the MSM has made it out to be.

            It’s a simple fact that not everyone coming across the border illegally is a perfect model future American. Criminals DO actually flee across the border (both ways!)

            Or was it the idea that the Mexican government encourages this that got you? But that, too, is a simple fact. It’s the Mexican equivalent of ‘if you don’t like it, leave’.

            Or was it, maybe, that you could see that, unlike all the other times things like this had been said, Trump meant it?

            1. Haha. Yeah. The Mexican government encourages their own people to leave. That’s gotta be frustrating to OM. Or to a YM. Wandering, unwanted gypsies often blame others for their problems.

          3. Nice to see you again old Mexican.

            This website needs you back.

          4. OM can’t stand that some people aren’t idiots, and can rise above their personal in group preference on some issues and think clear headed…

            When he was freaking out on me for being LITERALLY HITLER one time, I informed him that I’m part Mexican… Tan pretty nicely… And still hate illegal immigrants. I don’t think his mind could handle it.

        3. I have to say, I’ve been wondering the same. I’m mostly a lurker here, but have been for, um…I can’t recall how many years. OM used to sound rational. I read all his posts, and tried to consider them seriously. Now, I mostly skip them. Unlike Tony who is often a source of humor, OM just comes across as unhinged, but in a sad way, not worth reading anymore.

          I hope this is just a poorly thought out tactic, and not the level of pain and hatred it seems.

          1. A bad case of TDS.

          2. He’s a joke. He lost his mind somewhere along the way, perhaps when he read some statistics on how awful illegal immigrants are on literally every single metric compared to native born Americans or legal immigrants? That may have pushed him over the edge.

    2. They posted the dont listen to global warming alarmist article a few days ago. And the one democrats are trying to amend free speech protections about a week ago. Only 2 I can think of that were actually libertarian.

    3. Ronald Bailey is still going strong.

      1. Usually. But he is the exception and a holdover, old school Reason writer. This newer, younger group seems almost apologetic for the progressives. Robby used to be the one ridiculed for being squishy Libertarian, now he seems to be one of the most Libertarian writers. Sad.

        1. And I fully admit I am not 100% Libertarian, but am definitely Libertarian leaning conservative. This publication is so much worse since 2016. If it weren’t for Bailey, Stossel and Suave (about half of the time), I would think I was reading the New Republic or Vox.

          1. And the level of discourse in the comment section has gone way down. If you aren’t 100% against Trump you’re a trumpistas and a right wing die-hard, if you aren’t 100% for Trump you’re a socialist/proggie stooge.

          2. Pretty much.

            If this place ever wants to be taken seriously as a libertarian rag again, they REALLY need to get some more right libertarians, or at least moderate libertarians on board.

            The endless left libertarian bunch of nonsense turns off half+ of libertarians because of the sheer stupidity of it. Other than Stossel, there really isn’t anybody here who represents right libertarian sensibilities… Even though probably 80-90% of libertarians I have ever met IRL are right libertarians, not left.

  11. Keep pushing progressive, idenitarian narratives, Reason.
    That’s mighty white of you

  12. Christ on a crutch, your “evidence” comes from Vox and other opinion sources? Unless you can do much much better than that I’m not buying your premise.

    You’re on weak ground to start with, given that mass shootings are outliers.

    1. You don’t need any more evidence when there is some right-wing jackass like the El Paso, Pittsburgh, Charleston or any more of the 109 kills by arch-conservatives since 2002.

      1. “You don’t need any more evidence”. Ha, the battle cry of the Left.

      2. “…109 kills by arch-conservatives since 2002.”

        Which about equals the homicides in Washington D.C. so far this year. Strangely, not too much national outcry about this.

      3. 109 in 20.years is your evidence we should cower? Do you understand how fucking stupid that is? Again. Take the time period one year farther back to 2001 and it is dwarfed by 1 muslim attack. The pulse nightclub is half of that 20 year white nationalist kill count. Your fears are hilarious.

        1. I didn’t say we should “cower” you dumb shit. I just said its a real thing.

          Like airplane crashes. People freak on those too. Right or wrongly.

          1. “I didn’t say we should “cower” you dumb shit. I just said its a real thing.”

            Assuming that number is something other than what you pulled out of your ass, 109 in 20 years is not a “thing”; it’s an outlier.
            Fuck off and die, turd.

          2. It’s a drastically overblown thing. Evidence that it is getting worse is beyond thin.

            It is not a thing that we need to urgently addressed

          3. Do you not see that the left is taking this noise and pushing the nation into gun control? If you are ok with that, WTF are you even doing here? Good luck trying to talk a bunch of libertarians into abandoning their single most favorite amendment (2nd, ICYMI).

      4. “109 kills by arch-conservatives since 2002”

        So 6 people per year constitutes a Threat to America?

        I mean, just for context, that constitutes 1/16th of the estimated annual deaths from flesh-eating bacteria in the US. Where are all the breathless headlines about the threat from Vibrio vulnificus? Oh, yeah, there isn’t any political hay to be made by demonizing people who disagree with you, so it’s boring.

        1. And way more people die from the flu every year than have from all Islamic terrorism in the past 20 years. I don’t think it’s a good comparison to compare violent attacks and disease. People assess those threats in very different ways. I’m not saying people should worry about it as much as they do. It’s a very small threat. And I don’t want the FBI spying on people simply because of their beliefs (as awful as they may be). But it’s probably worth keeping an eye on groups and people who openly espouse violence.

          1. “I don’t think it’s a good comparison to compare violent attacks and disease”

            Fair point. I was just using it to make the point that it’s ridiculous to call white nationalism a serious threat.

        2. The thing is we tried what that the author suggested in the 1990s. Who remembers the big “militia” scare. That turned out so well. Ruby Ridge, Waco and Oklahoma City (at least partially in response to the previous two, though McVeigh was a nutcase who would have found another reason).

      5. arch-conservatives? like the Penguin?

  13. Yet is more than the people killed by so-called Islamic terrorists, of which you never finish hearing about it from FNC and white supremacist (i.e. Trumpista) opinion outlets.

    Bit, look, these white supremacists will be replaced. Which is super easy, hardly an inconvenience, considering they barely fill a college stadium per Tucker Carlson. Right, WS?

    1. LOL make sure you check under your bed before you go to sleep tonight. There’s undoubtedly three or four White Supremacists lurking under there!

      I wonder who will end up being the Left’s Joseph McCarthy.

      1. Oh, I don’t have to, Trumpista piece of shit. I’m the one who makes these Trumpistas cower in fear and call for their dear leader to build them a wall, remember? I’m replacing YOU.

        “Help me, oh Trump! Here, let me fellate you! Build that wall to keep those brown people out!”

        Who fears who, you Trumpista piece of shit? Pathetic. You let a New York con man con you.

        1. Nobody fears your lunatic ranting. We are laughing at you. Keep proving how awful at math you are. Keep proving how much of an ideological dumbass you are.

          1. Any chance that OM has always been a sock? One originally intended to offer a less stridently voiced version of someone else’s preferred position, but now just going full bore?

            1. His constant talk about “replacement” sounds a lot like Artie.

        2. I’m the one who makes these Trumpistas cower in fear and call for their dear leader to build them a wall, remember?

          By that logic, the 9/11 hijackers were absolutely terrified of the US.

        3. I didn’t vote for Trump. You probably won’t believe that; you seem to be trapped in some weird Manichean world where everybody who doesn’t agree with you is a “Trumpista White Supremacist”.

        4. It’s not fear. We’ve just run out of pity, pathetic groveler.

        5. Illiterate peasants from down south will only be replacing real Americans as long as people are dumb enough to allow it… We could put the kibosh on that shit overnight once people get the will to deal with the problem. And with all the problems it’s bringing, I don’t think it will be that long.

          If we’re lucky maybe you’ll self deport back to Mexico!

    2. How fucking utterly retarded are you? 109 since 2002. Now go to 2001. Which body count wins.

      Your rage made you even dumber.

      1. Body counts are only allowed to go back to 2002! For reasons! It’s the law!

    3. Yet is more than the people killed by so-called Islamic terrorists,

      Only by starting the count AFTER a massive terrorist attack.

      An attack that put everyone on alert for Islamic terrorism.

      An attack that killed, in one day, almost 30 times the number of purported ‘white nationalist’ attacks in 20 years.

      It’s as if Germany chastised the US for it’s involvement in Korea and pointed out how peaceful Germans were and used a cutoff date the left the entirety of WW2 on the other side.

      1. I’m not so sure of that.
        So “109” since 2002 is the number we’re looking to hit?
        Maybe add up:
        -DC sniper
        -Fort Hood
        -the ‘workplace violence’ beheadings in OK
        -Boston Marathon bombing
        -Chattanooga National Guard center attack
        -Minnesota stabbings
        -San Bernadino
        -Pulse nightclub

        And I’m probably missing others. Off the top of my head, you can get up to 75-80 deaths just from the DC sniper, San Bernadino, and Pulse…

        So if you want to compare the alleged white nationalist kills to Islamist kills since 2002, I think you’re getting about an even number

        1. Islam is rancid, pal. No one here is defending it.

          1. Context, guy

        2. DC sniper – 17
          Fort Hood – 13
          Boston Marathon – 3
          Chattanooga – 4
          San Bernardino – 14
          Pulse – 49

          That’s 100 right there.

          1. And you could add the college rent a cop to the Boston Marathon, which would bring it to 4

        3. This is in reference to the ADL numbers.

          They count any violence involving people associated with alt-right ideology as “white nationalist”.

          So some dude who says he hates all the mud people and blows up a black church counts. But so does a guy who says he hates immigration and wants to end immigration so that we can have a stronger social safety net including universal free healthcare.

          And so does some trailer park guy who gets into a shootout with another trailer park guy in a drunken argument. Because they were white nationalist trailer trash.

          Meanwhile, a Muslim dude who explicitly says he’s doing something because he feels the call to jihad isn’t in fact an Islamic Terrorist because he isn’t an official member of any recognized Islamic organization.

          Their numbers are a little suspect, to say the least.

          But they do have one point – these people are way too violent and there are way to many crazy people running around trying to kill a bunch of people for no good reason. I suspect that trying to subdivide them into buckets of crazy is one of the least effective methods of addressing the issue, but I might be wrong.

          In either event, restricting your gaze to simply “mass killings in the USA” is probably a little myopic. The difference between white nationalists and islamic terrorists is that one of them is a part of a fairly large global movement that has the aim of taking over the world by violent means and subjugating everyone to their religious rule. They have had enough success to actually control thousands of square miles of territory.

          The other group has no such global ties – and in fact would probably hate anyone from outside the USA who wanted to team up. So no larger threat. And they have managed to take over the back half of that trailer park just the other side of the tracks. Sort of.

          1. Good points

    4. “of which you never finish hearing about it from FNC and white supremacist (i.e. Trumpista) opinion outlets.”

      Old Mexican during ISIS’ reign: Yawn, another thousand slaughtered, cannibalized, or turned into sex slaves in Syria? Get some new material Trumpistas!

      1. Actually, I think the cannibal was one of Obama’s “moderate” rebels

    5. Yet is more than the people killed by so-called Islamic terrorists, of which you never finish hearing about it from FNC and white supremacist (i.e. Trumpista) opinion outlets.

      Number of deaths on 9/11/01: 2,996.
      You used to be sane; seek help.

  14. No, America does not face a “threat” from white nationalists. The amount of harm they’re causing in a nation of 330 million does not rise to the level of a “threat”.

    The only threat is that people will overreact and cause real problems.

    1. Perhaps you’re right. Those white supremacists are going to be replaaced by moral, decent people anyway. After all, they fill a college stadium according to Tucker Carlson, don’t they?

      1. According to me as well.

        I have lived a life at the intersection of black and white since the early 80’s. I would know about it if there was rampant racism. There isn’t.

        In fact, in 15 years of marriage neither my wife nor I ever once heard any white person say anything about our relationship. We never once even had someone look at us crosseyed. And we went to plenty of rural honkey-tonk bars and places in the mountains where you’d expect to find them.

        We did have plenty of “people of color” who thought it was OK to comment. And a couple of times it got a little dicey. But even those incidents were relatively rare. We even attended things like the Prince Hall Freemason national black tie dinner dance without incident – despite my standing out like a sore thumb in a huge conference hall of a couple of thousand.

        No, there are not millions of white nationalists around you. Not even hundreds of thousands. Not even close.

        Nobody gives a crap about race. People just want to go to work and raise their families and be left alone. That’s it.

        1. Of course they want to, Cyto, but Trumpistas want something else. They want safety from brown people. One of them made that very clear juat two weeks ago. Do you need a louder message than that?

          1. Look, if you read the El Paso killer’s screed, he wasn’t a “white nationalist”, he was a “deep ecologist”. That’s a mostly left-wing, (But it does cross over into the right.) genocidal movement, that thinks there are too many people on Earth to be sustainable, and that we need a culling.

            Those people are bad news, actual white nationalists, (And there aren’t a lot of those.) are boy scouts next to the deep ecologists.

            Personally, I’m fine with immigration by people of any color, so long as they do it legally, and meet rational criteria; Law abiding, educated, English literate, not carrying any communicable disease, aren’t some freaking commie. I don’t care a bit what they look like, so long as their coming here represents a net benefit to the country.

            Like I say, you are what you eat, and do we really want to be more like Honduras or Mexico? What about those countries appeals to you, aside from their skin tone?

          2. Old mexico is a deranged racist. He doesnt care about facts. He is a lost modernist in that he has his truth. And his truth can be bothered by facts.

            1. “Lost modernist”
              A fortunate typo I think

          3. They want safety from brown people.

            Considering the level of human trafficking in the Rio Grande Valley, what exactly makes these communities safe?

          4. Nobody give a crap that they are brown. It is the fact that they are coming in large numbers that people care about.

            As evidence I offer up all the other times people cared about this stuff. When it was about boat people it was Asians. When it was Italians they were worried about Italians. When it was Germans they were worried about Germans. When it was the Irish they were worried about Irish.

            Just take a tour of old political cartoons on google images. You go back through time on the immigration issue and the memes are always the same. Dirty, diseased, criminal…. all tied to some racial stereotype. Each time it was whatever group was flooding in.

            So nobody actually cares about race. People at the bottom of the economic ladder do care about immigration increasing the supply of unskilled labor though.

            And in an interesting side twist, highly educated and skilled people in the Tech industry care about H1B visas. Because lots of people are coming here from India competing for their jobs.

            It is economics, not racist ideology that is the driving factor here. Racist tropes just give voice to the fears.

          5. Being for stronger border enforcement is not necessarily about being afraid of “brown” people. It may or may not be a viable concern (their are valid arguments both ways) but to label all border enforcement protagonist as afraid of “brown people” is as myopic as the caricature that you have made of those you oppose. Try this. I am opposed to illegal immigration because of the experiences of my Filipino friends who talked about how hard it is to get visas for their families to come to the states because immigration caps are influenced by illegal alien numbers. The more illegals the less legal immigration allowed. Or my Venezuelan friend who was going to be deported as soon as he graduated college (his family fled when their ranch was nationalized by the government). I am not for open borders but believe in more liberal legal immigration while stronger enforcement against illegals. See the difference?

        2. My best friend married a blasian woman back in the early 90’s. They met in law school, she was an army brat, and pretty much didn’t realize she was black until her darker pigmented friends started asking her “why you dating that white dude?”

          Maybe some of his pale skin friends were wondering about his choice as well, but – even if they were – none ever asked.

          1. “Maybe some of his pale skin friends were wondering about his choice as well,”

            Not if she was hawt. Every dude understands hawt, no explanations necessary.

            **This statement was provided for the purposes of making a joke only. No further messaging is implied or intended. No animals were harmed in the making of this joke. Stereotypes were invoked only insofar as they further the joke. Any resemblance to an actual point is unintended. **

            1. Yeah, good point. And she was hot. Half Vietnamese.

          2. I remember being the white dude in cowboy ha, blue jeans and boots at my (black) squad leaders house parties, one of the only white guys there. We all got along famously. It was always that way. I also remember going fishing and drinking where it was a bunch of redneck servicemembers from Idaho, Montana and eastern Washington and the one black guy was our detachment NCOIC, and we had one Paulauan with us usually, never saw any uncomfortableness from either persons. In fact, when it came to shit talking, they dished it out as good as they took it. It’s true, for the most part, that in the Army we were all just one color, Army green.

            1. Being the white guy at black parties has always been fun.
              Never had any problems.
              Even had a few folks trying to convince me to transfer to Morehouse.
              I found that flattering.

      2. It is amazing watching how racist old Mexican is. He thinks all white people are white supremacists. He thinks all minorities think like him. Despite the fact that 49% of Latinos and 27% of African Americans approve of the job trump is doing. But racist old Mexican thinks every minority is against trump and is for illegal immigration. Old Mexico is literally what he says he despises, a racist. And it’s hilarious watching him prove it comment by comment.

  15. So many Trumpistas here keep themselves occupied fapping over the images of those children whose parents were kidnapped by the State. They get off on that because they can’t other, more normal ways. They need these scenes of unimaginable cruelty against peaceful and defenseless human beings because that’s their porn.

    Someone bring a mop: the floor can get very slippery around here with the cum of these white supremacist pieces of shit.

    1. I think that’s just your tears and spittle

      1. Blah, blah, shut up, Trumpista. You will be replaced. You’re already the minority. Sleep well tonight.

        1. Old Mexican, mostly psychotic

          1. +10

        2. “White replacement is not a thing. White Nationalists are crazy!”

          “Shut up! You will be replaced.”

          Uh-huh.

        3. Impotent. Totally harmless.

    2. You have weird and fevered dreams. And you continue to prove your own racism.

    3. So many Trumpistas here keep themselves occupied fapping over the images of those children whose parents were kidnapped by the State.

      If you’re talking about adult migrants and their children, nobody is forcing them to stay; they can choose to leave any time they want to. The reason they are separated and detained is because they choose to wait for admission into the US.

      Someone bring a mop: the floor can get very slippery around here with the cum of these white supremacist pieces of shit.

      And you wonder why people don’t want more people like you to come into the country.

  16. Yes, the solution is to keep doing the same thing- it’s clearly working right?

    Get over it- not being able to have military hardware to compensate for something isn’t gonna hurt anyone. If you need more than 15 bullets to take down anything anyway then you need to work on target practice, not buy bigger magazines.

    1. Blah, blah, shut up, Trumpista. You will be replaced. You’re already the minority. Sleep well tonight.

        1. No hes is white. Continue your racist attacks.

      1. Fucking LOL. Old Crab Bucket is so off the rails that he dunked on a self-loathing white liberal.

      2. Blah, blah, shut up, Trumpista. You will be replaced. You’re already the minority. Sleep well tonight.

        Thanks for being honest about it. And yes, you’re right: if more racists and imbeciles like you move to the US we “will be replaced”, by the simple expedient of moving to greener pastures. Nobody who has a choice in the matter wants to live in the kind of impoverished, racist hellhole you are trying to create.

    2. Hate to break it to you but the AR15 is not military hardware. It is like comparing a stock Ford Mustang to the car that won the Nascar championship last year.

      1. If only I could still get a full auto for reasonable money…

  17. #MAGA

    Lefty White Nationalists dream of the day they can become National Socialists.

  18. Give me a break: All the real white nationalists in this country could meet in a Holiday Inn, and still have room for a Shriner convention. They’re a tiny, tiny fraction of the population.

    The left claims otherwise, but that’s because the left defines “white nationalism” as, “Any white person who doesn’t agree with my politics.”

    Is it “a” problem that there are white nationalists in America? Sure. Not as big a problem as that there are Communists in America, or deep ecologists, or any of a dozen political movements that are larger and more threatening.

    1. There are probably more psychopathic sexual sadists in the US than white nationalists.

    2. And the Shriners will cause more mayhem. Have you ever seen them guys party?

    3. “The left claims otherwise, but that’s because the left defines “white nationalism” as, “Any white person who doesn’t agree with my politics.”

      Winner, winner, chicken dinner.

    4. This is nothing new. In the 1980s the made a big deal about all the Aryan Nation’s living in Harrison, Idaho. I grew up less than an hour from there and we shopped in nearby Coeur d’Alene and I only ever saw one. Later we learned there were 25, TWENTY-FIVE, in a county with a population of about 100,000.

  19. Of the preplanned mass shootings in the US, how many of them are attributable to someone acting on a white racialist ideology? Because it does not seem like it is that many,, or that they represent some kind of coordinated political movement, rather than some disaffected lone young men looking for a reason to go down in infamy.

    1. That’s the thing. White nationalism does exist to some extent. But the attacks attributed to them appear to be mostly the actions of deranged individuals, not planned by some committee of racists. Charlotteville was ugly, but the killing that happened was one guy who went over the edge. But to hear about it, you’d think that all the tiki-Nazi assholes had planned the killing.

      1. Charlottesville was 2nd degree murder. No way it was premeditated.
        He was pissed off that the Antifa were harassing him maybe violently not sure and we’re blocking him and banging on his car

        1. It was premeditated, i.e. he intended his actions to harm one or more persons. It was not preplanned in that he intended going to the rally to run down a crowd of people.

          1. Yeah… but even then….

            If he had really had “I’m gonna mow a bunch of people down with my car” in mind, he is a pretty terrible driver. Because there were hundreds available, close at hand, and he missed all but one.

            Seemed a lot more like one unhinged asshole who was in a situation that he couldn’t handle. But he was in possession of a weapon that had the potential to be deadlier than an AK-47 in that situation and didn’t rack up a big body count.

            So I see where that characterization is coming from, even if it probably isn’t the most politically palatable position to take.

          2. 1st degree requires premeditation that is pre-planning
            That wasn’t the case he was reacting , crime of passion anger
            DAs over charge in politically charged cases

          3. Intent to harm is not premeditation. Premeditation requires the intent to cause a death. That’s why he got off with 2nd degree.

  20. I wonder why we have white-supremacist terrorists at all, given how the whole country is a white-supremacist paradise – they should be content, not crazy and murderous.

    /sarc

  21. Other than having the FBI infiltrate organized white nationalist groups, to look for terror plots before they happen and then prevent them, what do you suggest for stopping the “white nationalist” ideology? Repeal the 1st amendment?
    Every decent American denounces domestic terrorism but that won’t stop the few and far between nutjobs – of any political persuasion – from carrying out attacks. Look back through history and see if there were any periods of time when lone wackos didn’t commit terroristic acts.

    1. Kind of a running joke that half the “members” of white nationalist groups are actually FBI informants and/or FBI agents who have infiltrated the groups.

      Which is to say, there are so damn few actual white nationalists out there, and that they have no power of any kind, that they are not a threat worthy of violating the rights of hundreds of millions of people over.

      1. saw an article this week about tow undercover cops shooting each other. its clown shows all around

      2. Wasn’t that a “Get Smart” gag from back in the 60s?

        They sent Max to infiltrate a terrorist cell, and they kept bringing in people one at a time. First was Max, from Control. Second guy was FBI. Third guy was CIA. Fourth guy was British MI6. Fifth guy was DEA. The only actual terrorist was the sixth guy and once the other five were in a room together, he locked the door and made his escape.

      3. In one form or another, that jokes been around for over 60 years. E.g., in the 1950’s:

        Q: How do you identify the FBI infiltrators in a meeting of the CPUSA?
        A: Their dues are paid in full.

    2. Other than having the FBI infiltrate organized white nationalist groups, to look for terror plots before they happen and then prevent them, what do you suggest for stopping the “white nationalist” ideology? Repeal the 1st amendment?

      The usual approach to people rejecting the idea that the “workers of the world should unite”: government indoctrination in public education systems; reeducation camps for subversive behavior; and if all that fails, mandatory commitment to mental health institutions (because “if you are not a socialist, you are obviously irrational and hence insane”).

      It doesn’t really matter whether Greenhut is merely confused or deliberately promoting socialist and neo-Marxist ideas, the outcome is the same.

    3. And the FBI has a poor record of infiltrating these groups. Randy Weaver anyone?

      1. He wasn’t FBI. The FBI wanted to hire him to be a mole in the white supremacist movement, because he was a known white separatist, and they’d have believed he’d come around to supremacism. Then they used him for target practice when he refused to do the job.

        1. It is the same principle. They tried to force him to become a mole, and it ended up in his son and wife killed. They tried to force him because the group was so small getting an actual agent inside was impossible.

          1. Weaver instead was a somewhat known commodity as he was at least somewhat sympathetic and had even attended a few church services there. This is the problem, these groups, unlike the old Klan, are usually small and isolated. They tend to be very paranoid of outsiders. Infiltrating will be nearly impossible.

  22. Highly misleading connect-the-dots type article, but white nationalism isn’t a threat and expressing concern over immigration is not white nationalism. It’s common sense. If the Marxist hordes were flowing into Libertopia and people started to worry about closing the border, you wouldn’t cry foul just because a lot of the Marxists happen to look the same or come from the same country. Why is it any different when America defends its borders?

    1. White socialism is a threat.
      Of course, Reason is something of a white socialist rag, so they have to screech about “white nationalism” to distract from their own racism and act as good little water carriers

      1. Yeah, that’s not fair.

        Their TDS has driven them to undertake some pretty serious mental gymnastics, but I don’t see them running toward socialism.

        The Open Borders thing has a pretty libertarian tradition, and isn’t traditionally associated with socialists or communists. So that one doesn’t really auger in that direction as much as you might think, given the far left’s current obsession with getting as many illegals into the country as possible.

        1. The complete submission to Marxist narratives and framing everything in terms of identity classifications, and as primary cause and effect, is rather socialist.
          The screeds explicitly calling for alliance with socialists is socialist.
          Almost everything they publish comes from a progressive perspective, even when they disagree with some isolated policy.

          1. Whether or not they want to admit to themselves what they’re doing, it’s all directed at advancing the neoMarxist agenda

          2. The complete submission to Marxist narratives
            When was that?
            The screeds explicitly calling for alliance with socialists is socialist.
            That would be a point if such screeds existed.

            1. Well there have been numerous fluff pieces about Yang and universal basic income, Buttgreig (sp?), even Beto.

              1. I mean even their week Shikha did an article about how Trump’s order to enforce existing laws in regards to welfare and immigration is akin to white supremacy.

            2. https://reason.com/2019/04/12/steve-bannons-economic-nationalism-is-th/

              “Watching The Brink made me think that for all the other differences Reason has with the socialist magazine Jacobin, it may matter far more that we share a belief in open borders.”

        2. “So that one doesn’t really auger in that direction as much as you might think, ”

          Generally? Yes.

          Specific to Reason? No. I think that shipped sailed with Dalmia’s recent article. One of the very libertarian arguments against open borders is the existence of the welfare state. The government’s recent steps to limit immigrant access to welfare should be hailed by libertarians as an effective means of removing that impediment to immigration.

          Instead Dalmia treats it like a crime against humanity. Thereby revealing the true nature of the enterprise, and the true editorial slant of the publication. It’s socialism at core, not libertarianism.

  23. I agree with most of the article. Is “white nationalism” a problem? Yes, we just witnessed a guy who was motivated by it but other than immigration he seems to be a liberal. But in terms of significance, white nationalism is tiny compared to radical Islamists who are actually an organized force and who also have inspired lone wolfs.

    If you look at home grown terrorists Antifa is much more a threat. For example, the upcoming Patriot Prayer rally in Portland is only significant in that Antifa will violently try and repress their free speech. Heck, Antifa feels the need to violently try and shut down Ben Shapiro and Ann Coulter.

    There is nothing comparable on the right. Feel free to give me an example where an angry right-wing mob has attempted to shut down a liberal speaker. I know of none. If anything, law enforcement, University officials, mayors etc, who wink at Antifa and are complicit might be creating a backlash that inspires lone wolf white nationalists.

    So yes it’s a problem but its blown out of proportion in relation to other more serious problems. Anything that can be spun by the media into a racial issue, that is white man bad , never black man bad is emphasized.

  24. The article makes a hash of ideology and personal preference; culture, ethnicity, and race; and national sovereignty and globalism.

    What many people want is an end to government promotion of multiculturalism and letting in larger numbers of people who consume government resources and on top of that, instead of being grateful, accuse people of “white nationalism” for not getting even more.

    I’m an immigrant. I came to the US decades ago because of its Anglo-Saxon culture and free market principles. I chose the US over other nations because most of them were awful. And I didn’t come here to be abused or exploited by racists and multiculturalists like Warren, Harris, or Greenhut.

    If you think that the reaction to a frustration with how the country is going culturally is violence, you’re merely projecting your own rotten beliefs. Conservatives and actual liberals don’t get violent. We react to your kind of abuse by voting at the ballot box, voting in the market, and if that doesn’t work, voting with our feet. It’s the 21st century and there are a lot of nice places around the world that are a lot better to live than a the kind of socialist utopia Greenhut is (intentionally or unintentionally) promoting, and that are begging for people with money and skills. The brain drain that made the US wealthy and powerful can easily reverse; just look at Europe and California for examples.

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  26. I’m going to be a White Nationalist for Halloween. It will be the scariest costume yet. The only thing is…has anyone ever seen one and lived to tell about it?

    1. I actually did see a guy who was dressed as a Klansman once. When he got close, you could tell his outfit was the real deal.

      1. Nah, that was just Elizabeth Warren getting in touch with the roots of the Democratic party!

      2. Saw one teeneager in KMart in Coeur d’Alene wearing Aryan Nation’s jacket with shaved head. The amount of hostility towards him was palatable. He paid for his stuff and literally ran out of the store. But we were assured that Kootenai county was a hotbed of neo-nazi activity. Lived there for 25 years or so (not counting my time in the service) and he was the only one I ever saw.

        1. I did see more on the North Side of Spokane, and they did control the illegal drug and gun trade there but they still were rare.

  27. How many “The Problem of Whiteness”, and “Why it’s OK to Hate White People”, and “Why shouldn’t I hate white people” and “All I want for Christmas is white genocide” articles and opinion pieces in main stream media outlets does it take before you guys stop saying “self radicalized”?

    The left has blood on their hands, they want this stuff to happen. Their politics is at the root of any (or at least some) blow back from of these episodes. The left claims that ALL white people are to blame for EVERYTHING. Democrats have completely embraced this “get whitey” stuff.

    The term “white nationalism”, for example, is a propaganda attempt to conflate nationalism with racism. Nationalism is a reaction to globalism. There is nothing wrong with putting America interests first, and there is nothing wrong with being white, or to put it more succinctly, it’s ok to be white.

    1. So many dog whistles… so little time…

    2. Combine that factor with the feminist denigration of masculinity to which boys are subjected in school and elsewhere, and the massive drugging of boys with prescription psychoactive drugs, and you have the ingredients for creating Crazy White Boy Shooters. What’s surprising is that more white boys don’t fly off the handle.

    3. Well sure, if you live in a radicalized bubble, where one professor’s tweet on “all I want for Christmas is white genocide” is distorted and manipulated into absurd claims like THE DEMOCRATS WANT TO KILL WHITE PEOPLE, then yeah, it’s all the left’s fault.

      1. Whereas citing one nutjob who mentions immigration (albeit rather forcefully) with a cornucopia of left wing ideologies, to paint a narrative of rampant white supremacy on the right is so much more intellectually honest?

      2. The “radicalized bubble” is called “public school”. That’s where boys live in a concentrated fog of anti-male, anti-white, and anti-freedom rhetoric and attitudes, and where boys who resist are drugged.

      3. The white genocide guy is a university professor. How many of his students have been radicalized by his obvious racism?

        Universities are a root cause of the chaos in the west. Universities, in the social sciences particularly, have been completely infiltrated by left wing Marxists. This cannot be undone in less than a couple of generations, if at all.

    4. “There is nothing wrong with putting America interests first, and there is nothing wrong with being white, or to put it more succinctly, it’s ok to be white.”

      A white nationalist puts white interests first. They don’t even have to be American.

      1. No, that would be a white supremacist. A white nationalist would put the interest of white people in their own country, in this case the USA, first.

    5. I recall reading an article recently where the author asked “why there are so many angry young white men” and I had the same thoughts as you.

      I mean *OF COURSE* there are going to be a lot of young white guys who are really angry right now because they’ve grown up hearing nothing for the last decade except how hateful, sexist, misogynistic, racist, and downright evil they are simply because they were born white and male. And even if the kid tries to be reasonably woke, it doesn’t really help because it’s still all his fault!

      Like Vernon says, “What’s surprising is that more white boys don’t fly off the handle.”

  28. I fear Antifa, the media and democrats far more than a few marginalized white nationalist. People can’t even wear a MAGA without being attacked, we are just fortunate that no one has died at the hands of the anti-right yet and thats not because they haven’t tried they just aren’t very good at it yet

    1. I don’t know if anyone will follow this point, but I think it is illuminating:

      How many places in America could wearing a MAGA hat get you assaulted? How about fired if you wore it to work?

      Now, there really isn’t a parallel on the other side, but I’ll pick #BLM. How many restaurants do think would kick you out for wearing a #BLM hat? How many major employers would fire someone for wearing a #BLM hat?

      Wear a MAGA hat to work at Google. How’s that gonna go for you? Wear a #BLM to work at the NYSE. How’s the reaction gonna look.

      Now push that thought outward a bit… what about wearing an actual white nationalist t-shirt. How many places is that gonna get a pass?

      And what of an actual black nationalist or Hispanic/Mexican/etc. T-shirt? Where are you gonna get assaulted for wearing a Farrakhan T-Shirt. That guy has said that white people were literally not human, created in a lab by an evil genie and blue-eyed devils. Think you’d get fired for wearing that shirt to work at Facebook? Or Che’?

      Tolerance for hateful ideologies is definitely a weirdly skewed thing. And I just don’t see how you can square those observations with “White nationalism is rampant in America”.

      1. BLM is not a bad example but a “Resist” hat or shirt is directly analogous

      2. Thanks for equating MAGA types with the despicable racist Farrakan. I fully agree with you on that.

        1. Yeah, you were apparently too dumb to follow the point. Or the analogy. Or even simple sentence structure.

          That was really weak. Your stuff is never very good, but making a fake version of someone else’s point is always weak.

          1. You did equate them.

            You noted the difference is how OTHER people would react to them.

        2. He didn’t
          You and Tony are butt buddies aren’t you?

          1. I don’t think Tony would even stoop that low

    2. That’s because you pay attention to FOX News instead of reality.

      How many people have Antifa killed? I’ll wait while you look it up.

      White nationalists have recently surpassed Muslim jihadists in number of Americans dead. Guess when Antifa did that? I’ll wait while you look it up. The answer is never, because they haven’t killed anyone.

      1. The Dayton shooter was a Antifa member.

        You are a total dip shit

        1. Maybe, but he didn’t seem to be motivated by politics, and even if he was, then he would be the first. Guess how much that makes white nationalist mass murder better?

          1. What a sick fuck you are. Nothing makes the other murder better.
            So you’re mind reading now.
            You must not be such an asshole in person. Otherwise you be getting the shit kicked out of you every 10 minutes

            1. Anyone hiding in their closet out of fear of Antifa is a right-wing media propaganda victim. It is absolutely fucking absurd to us normal people.

              I’d feel sorry for you, truly, but you people have so much goddamn influence over my life right now.

              1. Tony
                August.16.2019 at 3:06 pm
                “Anyone hiding in their closet out of fear of Antifa is a right-wing media propaganda victim. It is absolutely fucking absurd to us normal people.”

                Typical hyperbole from shitbag, but try here:
                “Antifa adds Andy Ngo to list of victims. Meet some of the others. ”
                […]
                “Members of Antifa attacked conservative writer Andy Ngo at a Portland, Ore. rally on Saturday, capturing national headlines and shining a spotlight on the tactics of the far-left extremist group. But, as Gabriel Nadales, a Regional Field Coordinator for Campus Reform’s parent organization, the Leadership Institute, pointed out Tuesday, Antifa’s roots live on America’s college campuses.
                Campus Reform has for years documented instances where Antifa and those affiliated with the group have intimidated, vandalized, disrupted, and threatened certain individuals and groups at colleges across the country, simply because of their political beliefs.
                “Antifa…ha[s] intimidated, vandalized, disrupted, and threatened certain individuals and groups at colleges across the country…”
                Here are just some stories Campus Reform has reported involving Antifa:
                1. Antifa vandalizes Purdue College Republicans adviser’s home with ‘Nazi lives here'”
                https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=13402

                There’s more, shitbag, in case you really want to know rather than spout bullshit.

                1. I oppose violence and property destruction.

                  I feel I didn’t need to clarify that, but nonetheless, there it is.

                  Now your turn! Proud Boys vs. Antifa today. I don’t support either. What about you?

          2. “Maybe, but he didn’t seem to be motivated by politics, and even if he was, then he would be the first.”
            Several claims, no cites. Shitbag hopes no one notices.
            We do, shitbag.

        2. The Dayton shooter was a Antifa member.

          So why didn’t he shoot up a Neo-Nazi rally?

          1. Who the fuck knows
            Another psycho

          2. Because they’re so hard to find?

            1. Any Trump rally is easy to find.

              1. Honest question, can you post without attacking caricatures of your own bigotry?

                1. I am a white middle aged straight male from Athens, Georgia. That is what is so fucking funny here.

                  Progressives think I am a Trump supporter because I hate Bernie and Liz (who would both have worse policies than Trump).

                  1. Haha. Socialist Athens, Georgia. Go Dawgs!

                  2. It would seem that you are motivated by hate of those that disagree with you in the slightest then. So, maybe you may have issues? You seem to have quite a bit of anger and willing to denigrate anyone who disagrees with you in the slightest.

                  3. Oh great, and UGA adjunct who thinks he’s a centrist because his peers are all further left.

                  4. “Sarah Palin’s Buttplug
                    August.16.2019 at 1:08 pm
                    “I am a white middle aged straight male from Athens, Georgia. That is what is so fucking funny here.”

                    You’re a loser day-trader with what seems to be coke and some other nasty habits, a constant apologist for both Clintons and that lying PoS Obo. You assume we don’t recognize diminished capacity from either your stupidity or your drug habits; in short you’re a fucking ignoramus.
                    What’s funny is your idiocy in imagining you are somehow held in other than utter contempt here.
                    Fuck off, you pathetic piece of shit.

          3. So why didn’t he shoot up a Neo-Nazi rally?

            He was planning to–right after his successful unicorn hunt.

          4. Why would the Lefty Dayton shooter shoot up another Lefty ideology like Nazism?

      2. How many people have Antifa killed? I’ll wait while you look it up.

        Over a hundred million.

        They’re communists, Tony.

        1. Nazis (far right) killed over 30 million. And how Hitler hated the German Communists. He Trumped them out of power in the 30s.

          1. He was originally a member of the German Communist party, who left because they didn’t give him the power he felt he deserved. Like many disillusioned narcacist he turned against them, not for ideological reasons but because he felt slighted.

          2. What ‘far- right’ things did the Nazis do exactly?

            Limit the size and scope of government power?
            Promote free speech and a free press?
            Support independent entrepreneurship with minimal regulation?
            Support a voluntary military?

            The things you and yours like to call ‘far right’– nationalism, support for a massive military buildup, ethnocentrism, and killing the undesirable by the campload—well, these are all things that the Soviets were doing AT THE SAME TIME AS THE NAZIS.

            What was the ‘right wing’ doing over in the states at that time?

            Trying to limit the size and scope of government power,
            promoting free speech and a free press,
            supporting independent entrepreneurship with minimal regulation and encouraging a voluntary military.

            Huh. How about that? No jew killing at all.

            But there WERE people talking about them evil jews in the states–progressives, Democrats, leftists.

            People like….well, like you.

            But you know what, in the interests of amity, of creating a dialogue, we’ll let you call the Nazis ‘right wing’–and take that 30 million hit.

            So, One hundred million, minus thirty million is what? 70 million. Two and one third times more than the ‘right wing’ people who believed in total state power. The ‘right wing’ people who believed that the collective was more important than the individual.

            So, even with us accepting your ridiculous conditions, you still lose massively.

            1. Who did FDR mention as one of his inspirations for the New Deal? Oh it was Mussolini (and Hitler) so right wing.

          3. Nope. Like usual, you’re a product of the public school system believing Nazis are ‘far right’. They’re ‘far right’ ON THE LEFTIST SCALE which includes Marxists, socialists, communists and fascists and now modern Western progressives.

            It’s a retard fight.

            They were socialists and collectivists. Just like Mussolini (and his father) were SOCIALISTS. Fascism is just a derivative of that thought.

            Idiot.

          4. “Sarah Palin’s Buttplug
            August.16.2019 at 12:45 pm
            “Nazis (far right) killed over 30 million. And how Hitler hated the German Communists. He Trumped them out of power in the 30s.”

            OK, turd, who wrote: “Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state”.?
            Stuff “far right” up your ass; you have no idea what you’re posting about.
            I suggest you try reading nearly anything by Anne Applebaum but most importantly “Iron Curtain”
            That is, if you can read and process more than 20 words at a time.

      3. The only reason so far has been because they’re incompetent. Or did you forget the attack on the Republican congressional softball team?

      4. The guy who tried to kill a random guy with a bike lock comes to mind. The guy in Dayton comes to mind. The guy in El Paso was motivated by environmental extremism.

        In my opinion, anybody who murders random people for ideological reasons is mentally ill.

  29. Greenhut endorses Thought Crime. When will we be disarming Al Gore and his guards?

  30. White Nationalism: A fiction brought to you by the mainstream media and perpetuated by leftist globalists everywhere.

    1. You can just say Jews. We’re all friends here.

      1. Wait, I thought Jews were Zionists who wanted a singular nation state defined on their Jewishness. now they are leftist globalists?

        I can’t keep up with this stuff.

      2. Pretty sure assholes like Lemon and Cuomo are not Jewish. Is Maddow? Not sure and don’t fucking care. Nice straw man there.

        1. Hell is Greenhut?

      3. You don’t give a shit about Jews except when it accidentally matches a group that opposes one of your special victims groups
        No one on the left gives a crap about them
        Next anti Semitic rant from the squad and Tony and Butt head will be all for it

        The Nazis exterminated Jews but also dislike blacks
        There is the special victim group of interest. If they just hated Jews no one would care.
        They don’t care since radical Islam groups are a thousand times more a threat to Jews than neo Nazis
        But Tony and Butt head support the jihadis

      4. You ought to be launching missiles into Jerusalem, Tony. To show your love of Jews.

      5. Tony
        August.16.2019 at 12:08 pm
        “You can just say Jews. We’re all friends here.”

        We have an embittered gay drunk who edits ‘Dog Walker’s Weekly’ or some such in a gated compound in fly-over country who posts nothing but lies.

  31. >>>we all need to face the fact that people armed with powerful weapons can cause a hell of a lot of carnage.

    he’s a Straaaaaawmaaaan waiting in the sky …

  32. Well, this is the end of the road for me, Reason. I’ve been on this site reading articles for over a decade. You contributed greatly to my conversion to libertarianism.

    However, this website has unabashedly joined the marxist chorus and that every story now drips with TDS is just too much.

    You got woke, Reason. We all know what the next step is.

    So long, everyone (there’s only a handful of intelligent commenters left anyways, no clue why y’all stick around but w/e).

    1. I hope more of those who insist that Reason is all secret Marxists will follow your lead.

      1. Nice!

        +1

      2. This column was first published in the Orange County Register.

        Yeah, the ‘secret’ isn’t very well kept.

      3. I guess we’re supposed to ignore the constant Vox citations and cuddling up with Pro Publica

  33. The people using guns to slaughter people are, in most cases, driven by ideas. What are those ideas and why do they matter? Why do they hate you?

    No they aren’t driven by ideas. They are driven by emotions – rage, resentment, fear, frustration, hate, etc. The idea is just what they latch onto because the idea provides a superficial explanation for that set of emotions or is going in the same direction.

    If America is having a problem with violence, it is because we have a problem developing impulse/cognitive self-control among (almost entirely) young men. Not that that’s easy to fix since I suspect it is deeply embedded in our culture. And who knows, it may also have some positives. But most assuredly, focusing on the ‘ideas’ of those who get an F in self-control is a waste of time/effort.

    1. Maybe not denigrating masculinity and keeping fathers in the picture might be a good first step.

    2. Oh horseshit. It’s all ideas.

      You think you diminish them by belittling their motivations, and their intellect (e..g. “superficial” – as if you think you really know what should matter.) But you are both factually wrong and sadly misguided. They are not diminished by your opinion of them, mostly because they do not give a shit about your opinion. If they did then they might not want you quite so dead.

      But also because their opinion of you is equally dismissive of your ability to understand, much less recognize what they in their own minds know to be true. You selling them short does not make them any less effective nor any less dangerous.

      But I suppose it does help with you maintaining your sense of moral superiority.

    3. “No they aren’t driven by ideas. They are driven by emotions – rage, resentment, fear, frustration, hate, etc. The idea is just what they latch onto because the idea provides a superficial explanation for that set of emotions or is going in the same direction.”

      Kinda like Reason writers

  34. “When it comes to Islamic radical terror, Americans aren’t fuzzy headed.”

    Has the author been living in a cave for the past 19 years?

  35. Fully 90% of these comments are about how it doesn’t matter how many white people commit mass murder because there might be brown people who commit mass murder. What a shithole this place has become.

    1. It matters
      It’s just not unique to one race you racist dip shit

    2. Everything Trump touches turns to shit.

      (I believe that was the title of a book a real conservative wrote)

      Rick somebody

      1. Sarah Palin’s Buttplug
        August.16.2019 at 12:20 pm
        “Everything Trump touches turns to shit.
        (I believe that was the title of a book a real conservative wrote)”

        Pick them cherries, turd; it’s all you got.

    3. What I want to know is, if there is such a full and complete separation between Trumpism and white nationalism, then what is the danger in cracking down on terrorism associated with white nationalism?

      I think it’s because of reasons displayed here:

      http://www.netarrantteaparty.com/index.php?date=20190713&event=127&fbclid=IwAR3CJJTnuMiQN4WnKyMggEjtbt4iUGbEqzjGUqb1PHmd-9KmnS0C6nKMsKY

      “To move the needle on this debate, as well as all other issues, we must allow AND give cover to those with more extreme views on the right wing of the party.”

      So while most people here may not subscribe to white nationalism per se, they are on board with providing cover to them as convenient allies in the war against progressivism.

      1. Maybe, I kind of see your point. I don’t agree with White Supemacists, but I do believe that they have a right to believe whatever they want. They also have the same rights to recruit followers as Republicans, Democrats, and Libertarians. It’s up to an individual to choose what paths they would like to follow. And who am I to say what is right and wrong. All I can do is account for myself and my dependents.

      2. Ruby Ridge?

      3. what is the danger in cracking down on terrorism associated with white nationalism?

        Shouldn’t an equal and neutral law crack down on all terrorism regardless of motivation? If we add the criteria of being efficient, effective, or minimally burdensome shouldn’t we just be targeting actual murders, violence, and threats of violence rather than whatever falls under the umbrella of terrorism (wherever terrorists may live)?

      4. Please clarify what you mean by “providing cover.”

        Do you have any examples of people defending violence or criminal acts?

        Or does respect for “Free Minds” sometimes involve “providing cover” for something you don’t “subscribe” to? And if so why is this a problem for libertarianism?

        And why the fuck is a ‘radical individualist’ so concerned with any of this at all?

        Maybe this all just CollectivistJeffy whinging about people being mean to progressives.

      5. On a more serious note: can the Government legally infiltrate these groups solely based upon the groups’ statements or do they need to establish a criminal connection? If they are being investigated because their ideology is repugnant that sounds fairly authoritarian to me. How many of these (mainly small groups, most number around a couple dozen at most and appear poorly organized) are actively committing crimes, or even suspected of committing anything but thought crimes?

      6. Because we don’t buy your bullshit, psychoticjeff, and refuse to support a crackdown in the name of your delusions

      7. “What I want to know is, if there is such a full and complete separation between Trumpism and white nationalism, then what is the danger in cracking down on terrorism associated with white nationalism?”
        As a victim of TDS, of course you would ask that question.
        1) Define “Trumpism”.
        2) Ever hear of false positives from an overzealous imagination, such as you seem to have?

    4. I’m sorry you think that. Here’s an honest question for you that will take us out of hypotheticals and back into reality. When you define “Mass Shooting” does the definition change for you depending on who the shooter is? For example, nearly everyone classifies what happened in El Paso and Dayton as a mass shooting, as they should. A shooter went and indiscriminately killed more than 2 people. But, if a gang member indiscriminately shoots a 9mm pistol out of his window killing his target and a few innocent bystanders along with some innocent child asleep in their bed, do you still consider that a mass shooting? Most people don’t. But statistics do. Which is the reason why we have 251 mass shootings to date in 2019. Most of those “mass shootings” do not take place in schools, or Walmarts, or at night clubs.

      1. I’m more of a body count kind of nerd. Mass murder is especially unsavory to the public, but we’re not entirely rational creatures. I’d ban all the guns.

        1. Because England totally isn’t pushing knife control after nearly banning gun ownership and China totally doesn’t have mass knifing attacks (hell they’re even happening in the US). And the worst school massacre wasn’t perpetrated with explosives.

          1. Imagine running away from a guy with a knife. Then imagine running away from a guy with an AR-15. Which situation would you rather be in? Are there tens of thousands of knife deaths in countries that ban guns? And if knives are such a menace, how does permissive gun laws affect the great knife threat one way or the other in America?

            is your point here to recite the worst possible talking points available for your position?

            1. Depends on the situation. In a crowd a knife is pretty dangerous and running away is not necessarily an option. Also, have you not heard the old saying about bringing a knife to a gunfight. Yes, will give me better protection from a knife attack. And worse case scenario? It is fucking happening in England on a daily basis numbnuts.

              1. How does more guns mean fewer knife deaths!?!?!?!?

                Because there are more gun deaths?

                1. No, because guns are an equalizer. A 200 lb assailant attacking my 5’2″ 125 lb wife is not going to have much trouble hurting her with a knife if she is unarmed. Give her her Springfield XD40 loaded with 140 grain PDX1 defender loads and she has at least a better than average chance of surviving

                  1. I look forward to seeing the data on this little theory.

                    America has a lot of guns, so it therefore must have among the least number of homicides. Data…. go!

            2. Tony
              August.16.2019 at 7:51 pm
              “Imagine running away from a guy with a knife. Then imagine running away from a guy with an AR-15. Which situation would you rather be in?”
              Totally irrelevant.

              “is your point here to recite the worst possible talking points available for your position?”
              Look in the mirror, shitbag.

      2. Why is “mass shooting” defined by the number killed rather than the number shot?

        1. Because the gun banners want the number to be as large as possible, as long as race isn’t mentioned. Once you bring up ethnicity, then only shootings by whites count.

    5. Fully 90% of these comments are about how it doesn’t matter how many white people commit mass murder because there might be brown people who commit mass murder.

      There was a time when Reason stood on the objectivity of the action rather than the race of the perpetrator. I’m a pretty racist guy but I believe in that principle. Yourself and Greenhut, however, are the one’s who (continue to) inject race into the issue.

    6. “Fully 90% of these comments are about how it doesn’t matter how many white people commit mass murder because there might be brown people who commit mass murder. ”

      I have seen literally no comments that said anything even vaguely resembling that. Maybe you should see a psychiatrist?

    7. Tony
      August.16.2019 at 12:09 pm
      “Fully 90% of these comments are about how it doesn’t matter how many white people commit mass murder because there might be brown people who commit mass murder.”
      We have an imbittered gay drunk who edits ‘Dog Walker’s Weekly’ or some such in a gated compound in fly-over country who posts nothing but lies.

      “What a shithole this place has become.”
      When did you show up?

  36. One recent incident where a racist killed some people does not mean that White Supremacists (an actual group) are becoming more of a threat in this country. Sadly, the biggest threat to Americans is driving, heart disease and cancer. If you keep going down the list, trees are more likely to kill you than a white supremacist. It is sad that stuff like this happens, but when we feed ourselves misinformation at the rate that we do, this stuff is bound to happen. It’s just a theory, but if MSM actually took the time to get the facts right before they present a story instead of being first, then maybe the emotional pull would be a lot less. Because lets face it, logic and reason don’t make people shoot each other, but emotions (positive or negative) will.

    1. Got in a tussle with a tree today.
      I won.
      Fuck you, fauna!

  37. Framing this as an issue of ideology doesn’t address the fact that most of the people in North America who commit homicidal acts are mentally ill. It doesn’t matter what they believe, the fact that someone would leave a manifesto is evidence of delusional thinking. Not only is violence justified in their mind, they think that others like them will agree once the case is laid out. We should be cautious when conflating the motives of the mentally ill with historical movements that have produced atrocities such as genocide. Calling delusional thinking an ideology justifies it as a rational response to an irrational belief and also compels an irrational response with ideas such as “combating ideology”. No matter what you do, you can’t stop people from having ideas regardless of how deviant that idea is from acceptable norms. It doesn’t matter if that idea is the public seizure of the means of production, or the sincere belief in the genetic superiority of your skin color. If you try then you get laws that arbitrarily punish speech, or encroach on enumerated rights of law abiding citizens for the greater good of ideological combat.

    I think we also give too much power to social media in regard to how we let it influence discourse. Forums like this (or what this used to be) are much better places for discussion of topics that require some nuance because I’m not limited to a character count or restricted by the use or disuse of gendered pronouns. I would like to see the regression analysis that shows the predictive value online activity has toward radicalized behavior (whatever that means). If anything, I think that all of the sponsored content we see in “reputable” news sources has made people jaded and untrusting of the vast majority of online content. Laws regulating these company are inherently unjust in my opinion because it not only infringes on the right of the private company but also lends validity to their perceived power. Maybe that’s just me, but I think it’s our own fault if we use any media to such an extent that we end up giving it the power to influence our opinions-especially if it contradicts our own experience.

    /end rant

    1. No one is talking about “most”. The article references a growing problem that happens to be high profile (like US plane crashes).

      US carrier plane crashes are rare but the media goes into freak out mode when they do occur. When I fly Delta I never think about the media freak out.

      1. “No one is talking about “most”. The article references a growing problem that happens to be high profile (like US plane crashes).”
        -That’s my point. I don’t think it’s helpful to say we have a growing White Supremacist movement when it seems clear that the two most recent shootings are related by mental health issues much more than being ideologically driven. When we blame ideology it reinforces their delusion.

        1. The guy who short up El Paso has about as many mental health issues as the 9/11 terrorists. There’s no way he’d be declared innocent by reason of insanity. All killers have mental health problems. These types who kill due to hate and have political motivation are terrorists. We should call a spade a spade and admit they are terrorists.

          1. And his politics were all over the place, just like the Christ Church shooter. The media has focused on a portion of his manifesto while largely ignoring the rest.

          2. And what is the proof it is a growing problem?

      2. “When I fly Delta I never think about the media freak out.”

        I just wonder when that cart will come by.

  38. But the idea of deporting or murdering all non-white Americans is horrific. Many have been here at least as long as the whites, and have done as much to build our country.

    The shooter was certainly not a white supremacist and likely not a white nationalist, maybe an ethno-purist.

    The best solution to this for now would be to divide America into a confederacy of territories with at least 1 territory for each race.

    He, aside from *some* of his violent tendencies, presents ideologies not at all inconsistent with pro-diversity and pro-equality sentiments that any college student clamoring for safe spaces would share.

    1. “He, aside from *some* of his violent tendencies, presents ideologies not at all inconsistent with pro-diversity and pro-equality sentiments that any college student clamoring for safe spaces would share.”

      The safe space at college is largely a thing among black students, isn’t it? I understood that it was a space where police are not welcome, relieving the students of their oppressive presence. It seems a radical idea, treating police as the enemy, but the idea is not violent and don’t seem to share much with a mass murderer of Mexicans.

      “The shooter was certainly not a white supremacist and likely not a white nationalist, maybe an ethno-purist. ”

      I don’t know enough about the man to judge, but wouldn’t an ethno-purist want to purge the nation of the impure, implying an ethnic cleansing? A supremist is content to be supreme, most easily accomplished by surrounding oneself with the less supreme.

      1. The safe space at college is largely a thing among black students, isn’t it? I understood that it was a space where police are not welcome, relieving the students of their oppressive presence. It seems a radical idea, treating police as the enemy, but the idea is not violent and don’t seem to share much with a mass murderer of Mexicans.

        No, not at all. They were regions (of campus) of designated and/or enforced intersectional homogeneity free from any/all oppressors majority or other. Presumably, that would need some manner of enforcement and details grow sketchy, but the point was that certain portions of campus would be designated ethnically (and sex, gender, orientation, etc.) pure for any given minority. And, while you may lump everyone with a shade of skin slightly darker than your own together as ‘black students’, there were plenty of other minorities of a variety of races calling for it.

        I don’t know enough about the man to judge, but wouldn’t an ethno-purist want to purge the nation of the impure, implying an ethnic cleansing?

        Ethnic purity is nation agnostic. Either way, his statement makes it exceedingly clear that his goal is not to purge any given race of people from anything so far-reaching or encompassing as a nation.

        A supremist is content to be supreme, most easily accomplished by surrounding oneself with the less supreme.

        ‘Content to be’ is a pretty shitty metric for just about anything. Historically, supremacists considered their race superior and sought to purge their nation/homeland/world of the others. It’s pretty clear that he didn’t consider large portions of the white race inherently superior to other races/nationalities and there’s no evidence that he felt the white race to be supreme among the races.

        1. “They were regions (of campus) of designated and/or enforced intersectional homogeneity free from any/all oppressors majority or other.”

          It seems that safe spaces differ. Some bar the police from entering, providing relief to those students who feel threatened by their presence. Some are places to watch puppy videos, blankets, pillows, soft music and other non threatening things. Others claim that students of all ethnicities and life styles are welcome. I haven’t come across segregated safe spaces but I suppose they exist too. But I don’t see how your ethnic purity is supposed to make a safe space. A white person may perpetrate violence against another white, whether or not other ethnicities have been barred.

          “Ethnic purity is nation agnostic.”

          Typically it is not. USA is exceptional in this sense. One can be an American nationalist while accepting the whole panoply of the nations and ethnicities that make up America. I think this is a common view and people on the left tend to mistakenly conflate American nationalists with White nationalists, adding an element of racism that doesn’t necessarily exist. That’s not to say White nationalism doesn’t exist. Regardless, the shooter was a bigot and his views on race and ethnicity are probably crackpot and won’t enlighten us much anyway.

          “‘Content to be’ is a pretty shitty metric ”

          Perhaps, but a content person isn’t likely to start shooting random people for no good reason.

        2. You are engaging a fucking idiot who posts bullshit or sophistry:

          mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
          “Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”

  39. self-radicalized

    I would be disappointed in my kids for using such a blatantly disingenuous word.

    “I didn’t do anything! He just self-radicalized and hit me!”

    Not to generate sympathy for the shooter of course, but the term seems pretty deliberately concocted to make it seem like the problem is 100% internal to (these) groups of white people. Not even Trump and the anti-Islamists are so disingenuous.

  40. /scrolls up to make sure this is Reason.

    It’s Reason.

    Wow.

    1. You don’t belong here. Bratfart is more your style.

      1. Lol.

        /makes coo-coo motion.

      2. “You don’t belong here. Bratfart is more your style.”
        Are we all required to be idiotic pedos with daddy issues, turd?

    2. Lots of Beavis and Butthead
      Butthead left you a love note

  41. To refute Tucker Carlson the author links to….Vox. Who in turn use SPLC as a reference. Take a bow Reason. Take. A. Bow.

    It’s funny how they claim this is happening in Canada too. And in places like Italy where Salvini is kicking everyone’s ass and is a rock star there.

    White supremacy is about as much a threat as climate change is. It may not be a hoax, heck there may be an uptick of some kind but not worth getting scared over.

    What I do see on Liveleaks, youtube and other sources is Antifa violence, blacks punching out white kids killing them, running rampant in Walgreens etc., lynch mobs on social media and episodes like Covington, lies about events like Ferguson and Trump’s alleged racism, continued anti-semitism, the rise of the socialist scourge.

    White supremacy doesn’t control public education, Hollywood or the media. Those levers of power are firmly in the hands of the left and its progressive leanings. It’s a joke and claiming mass shootings are a result of WS is specious and possibly a spurious correlation on the magnitude of irresponsible behaviour.

    Produce a damn better article than this crap if you want to make such a serious charge.

    I’ll tell you one thing though. You keep listening to stupid illiberal ignoramuses like AOC on race and you’ll make good real racists out of people who weren’t.

    So excuse me if I going to file my nails chalking this up to bull shit.

  42. I think it’s important to distinguish between individual nut jobs and an organized network.

    You can’t go to war against individual nut jobs. They are exceedingly rare and your false positive rate is likely to be unacceptable.

    When there is an organized financial network, providing material support, that’s something a government can actually engage.

    And I think it’s safe to say that no one on the right or left would support drone strikes within the US.

    1. You can’t go to war against individual nut jobs. They are exceedingly rare and your false positive rate is likely to be unacceptable.

      +martyrs

  43. But the president and some of his supporters have a blind spot about white-nationalist terror, just as the former president had a blind spot about Islamic radicalism.

    Just as Reason authors have a blind spot about radical, pro-illegal immigration terror:

    Aug. 13 – San Antonio, TX
    July 16 – Washington, DC
    July 14 – Tacoma, WA
    July 12 – Aurora, CO

    The thing is, you can’t have it both ways. If you’re going to blame Donald Trump’s rhetoric on immigration for shootings targeting minorities, you can’t simply turn around and ignore this. We have Democratic presidential candidates, “squad” activists, cable news anchors and editorials from major newspapers constantly demonizing ICE, calling for it to be abolished and blaming all manner of human misery on immigration enforcement offices who are simply upholding the law.

    How can you observe all of this in context and not blame their rhetoric for the fact that people are shooting up or trying to bomb ICE offices and last night came within inches of murdering someone? The answer is that you can’t, at least if you want to label yourself as an unbiased observer of events.
    More on the San Antonio ICE office shooting, Jazz Shaw

  44. White nationalism is no more a threat than is presented by black, polka dot, or any other nationalism.

    1. Nationalism is national collectivism, just like racism is a Newspeak version of racial collectivism. The best way to oppose collectivism is to be an individual individualist and vote like one.

  45. What are White Favorites or whatever they’re called?
    I don’t think I’ve ever seen one.

  46. Holy hell – white people in a white country love their country.

    Insanity.

    Meanwhile. . .
    Asia for Asians.
    Africa for Africans.
    Israel for Israelis.

    Fuck off – there is no “white” anything problem.

  47. of course you leftists run with your race baiting because you are constitution gating, open borders anarchists…….
    ——————
    White Nationalist term is a media created term bringing up thoughts of the KKK..
    White Nationalist: the term itself, as in anything with the word White before it is a racist term bringing up thoughts of the KKK. how about his, American nationalist? the media would also call this a cover name for the KKK… and the thought process, if you are white, voted for Trump, support a Constitutional Rep then you are by that alone a KKK supporter, racist, and of course privileged,

  48. So Patrick the “no mixin” Unashooter was successful in triggering Greenhut into running to the looter press with ways to weaken the Second Amendment in the name of a soi-disant libertarian mag. If that don’t merit the Kristallnacht medal for distinguished service to the ku-klux Reich of Texas, what does?

  49. I’m a gun-rights supporter and own some legally purchased and properly stored firearms,

    I’d respect you more, if your guns were stolen from outlaw bikers, and stored in your fridge, you fucking slave.. And, never link to vox again..

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