Woman at the Center of a Viral 'Creepy Uncle Joe Biden' Photo Says It Wasn't a #MeToo Moment
Stephanie Carter says the image from 2015 is misleading.

Several women have accused former Vice President Joe Biden, a likely 2020 contender, of inappropriate physical conduct.
One of those women—Lucy Flores, a former candidate for lieutenant governor of Nevada—writes that Biden smelled her hair and kissed her on the back of the head during a campaign stop in 2014. Another woman, Amy Lappos, says Biden put his hands on her head and pulled her closer during a 2009 political fundraiser.
These and other accusations lend credence to the media caricature of Biden as "creepy Uncle Joe," an idea the former veep's critics on both the left and the right have been eager to popularize. The #MeToo movement has made the public more attuned to sexual misconduct, and warier about powerful men in government, media, and entertainment who stand accused of wrongdoing. Biden's reputation as a man who is overly familiar with women could hurt his campaign for the presidency—though anyone who thinks this is guaranteed to doom him should be gently reminded that the current president is Donald Trump.
At the same time, it's important not to mischaracterize matters. Some forms of #MeToo advocacy have eroded careful distinctions, particularly on college campuses.
For instance, one of the viral images most associated with the "creepy Uncle Joe" headline is this picture of Biden rubbing the shoulders of Stephanie Carter while her husband, Ashton Carter, was sworn in as secretary of defense. But as she explains in a recent Medium post after the picture started making the rounds again, it does not depict a #MeToo violation. Biden's contact with Carter was welcome and consensual.
Carter had slipped and fallen on some ice just before the ceremony, she writes, and the incident had left her shaken:
By the time then–Vice President Biden had arrived, he could sense I was uncharacteristically nervous—and quickly gave me a hug. After the swearing in, as Ash was giving remarks, he leaned in to tell me "thank you for letting him do this" and kept his hands on my shoulders as a means of offering his support. But a still shot taken from a video?—?misleadingly extracted from what was a longer moment between close friends?—?sent out in a snarky tweet?—?came to be the lasting image of that day.
In that context, Biden's touching of Carter wasn't inappropriate. It wasn't inappropriate, because the sole person with the authority to judge that—Carter—says it wasn't.
Carter's experience does not invalidate Flores's or Lappos's. But it should serve as a reminder not to lump together a bunch of unrelated or misleading moments when discussing Biden's fitness as a candidate. At the very least, the media should give Carter the final say on the 2015 photo and stop recycling it for "creepy Uncle Joe" coverage.
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"It wasn't inappropriate, because the sole person with the authority to judge that?Carter?says it wasn't."
She has nothing to say about it. A man touched a woman in public. Unacceptable. Period.
Homework assignment; find picture(s) of Joe Biden in a public setting with women present where he is NOT touching one of them.
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Exactly! Plus, the balance of power is off. My husband's boss kissed me a little but it was okay because I don't want him to get fired.
My husband is a retired CPS investigator. He couldn't finish watching the video I sent him of Biden touching all the women and girls. He said he's retired and his days of dealing with perverts is over.
I hope you're kidding, but just in case: chaste touching isn't wrong before the touched individual makes it pretty clearly known they don't want it. Because we're talking about "unwanted touching" and our species doesn't read minds reliably. Otherwise, a millionaire-lady on my publicly-traded company's board of directors awkwardly hugged me once, and I'm retiring.
Why would anyone think that someone, who is not a significant other, wants to be touched this way. It's weird and gross.
Saw that when it happened.
She looked creeped out as he slithered up behind her.
She's 'brave-facing' it now.
TBH, I wouldn't doubt that this ends up as the talking point. "Women decide what is sexual assault and what isn't, until they decide that it isn't sexual assault -thats when you know it was DEFINITELY sexual assault!"
Yes, but you don't understand, Azathoth. Didn't you see the "D" by his name?
That means it's okay to fondle, because then you're a feminist and one of the good guys.
Didn't work for Al Franken.
There was ONE time the Ds abided by their own rules - and they haven't stopped bitching about it since
Or your interpretation of her facial expression is wrong.
Women are hypocritical sex clowns.
Look at all the effort they make, hours of makeup, cosmetic surgery and sex accentuating clothing in an attempt to appear sexually attractive.
Fucking clowns.
Then after all that effort has the desired affect on men, the fucking hypocrites call men out as perverts.
Pennywise has nothing on you.
Your comment is a bit creepy. 'She's asking for it' much?
Seems appropriate when pointing out that sometimes they literally *are* asking for it (sexual attention, that is, not rape, at least not rape rape).
That really is something that should be talked about more.
What would the male equivalent of what is considered professional female attire be? I don't think there is really an equivalent male outfit that is both professional and as revealing and figure-accentuating as women's business apparel can be.
I'm not saying it's a problem. I'm happy to have women make themselves look good. But it is a double standard that seems to favor women in at least some ways and something you almost never hear discussed.
I just show up at the office wearing a bright yellow zentai suit with a hole cut out for my penis.
Zoot suit w/codpiece?
It's a simple problem to deal with unless you have no control over yourself (which means you're a danger to yourself and others and probably need help stat).
Talk to a woman before touching, stroking, kissing, smelling to find out if she's interested.
If you're not sure but you think she is and she pulls away or freezes when you touch her, you back off because her body language is telling you she's not interested.
And I'm not saying this in a you-have-to-have-consent-every-step-of-they-way way but, jeesh, don't come up behind me and stroke my hair and kiss me when you don't know if I even like you.
Bullshit. The forces driven by human needs are not simply overcome.
Women make great efforts to manipulate one of men's basic needs, to get whatever they want. They don't ask first and their efforts are directed at all men every day, not only the ones who can get what they want.
Have you seen women at a male strip club? They're a groping bunch of sluts. They don't ask first. Women make great effort every day to have that affect on all men to manipulate some of them.
They're fucking sex clowns, pennywise.
I haven't been to a strip club but I would assume that by entering a strip club you are basically paying to be sexually groped because the purpose of the club is for men to be sexually stimulated and, from what I understand, the groping costs more than just watching. Whose manipulating whom?
I can tell you as a woman, most women don't wake up in the morning trying to figure out who to be as provocative as possible to get what they want. Men wish that's what they were doing but it's not. They want to look nice and work hard. I would say most women dress to impress other women. If you haven't figured that out yet, I hope your company has your back when the sexual harassment suits start because you're a pervert.
You are a clown.
Obviously, you have mommy issues. Good luck to you in the future and I hope you can find some sort of normalcy in your life.
I prefer reality and I'm working on it.
At least I don't see pennywise when I look in the mirror.
Good luck with your delusions.
I think being attracted to someone, and acting on that without their consent are two different things.
You miss the point of harassment. It's not about attraction or love. It's about someone getting your jollies from making other people feel uncomfortable and powerless so they can feel powerful.
If I hung pork chops off my clothes and walked through town, how long would it be before a hungry person grabbed one without asking?
Would I then be an innocent victim?
"It wasn't inappropriate, because the sole person with the authority to judge that?Carter?says it wasn't."
She has no say in whether or not it was appropriate. Even if she wanted Biden to touch her shoulders, the contact was inappropriate unless she affirmatively said so, i.e. "You may touch my shoulders."
I just start kissing them. It's like a magnet. Just kiss. I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything.
Bush: Whatever you want.
Trump: Grab 'em by the pussy. You can do anything.
Bush: Uh, yeah, those legs, all I can see is the legs.
Trump: Oh, it looks good.
That's PRESIDENT Trump.
Get over it
But it should serve as a reminder not to lump together a bunch of unrelated or misleading moments when discussing Biden's fitness as a candidate.
Nah, those are the old rules.
Go ahead and challenge Azoth's take down of Leo K's cucky assertion that support of anti-racism is not evil, per se under libertarian principles.
What for, I ain't no libertarian.
You still lose on logic because Azoth was taking Leo's assessment to task by evaluating it through the lens of libertarianism.
Cool story. I see that Leo posed a question at the end of his comment which was ignored by both you and Azathoth. Why don't either of you answer it?
I don't give a shit about your libertarian principles, but I think you both missed a point that Leo made in order to make irrelevant speeches.
Cool story. I see that Leo posed a question at the end of his comment which was ignored by both you and Azathoth. Why don't either of you answer it?
What question did I ignore?
It's really funny how hard you'll fight to defend your racism. As far as I'm concerned, let your flag fly high. Be proud of who you are. Don't start whining when somebody calls you a racist. I don't think anyone here has said it should be illegal.
No, Leo missed the point and you apparently do as well.
Azoth covered the question posed by Leo. As Azoth noted, support of anti-racism means support for coerced association. Do you favor coerced association?
How about examining the tenets of anti-racism? Part and parcel of anti-racism are the following:
(1) affirmative action;
(2) minority set-asides;
(3) reparations for black people;
(4) anti-discrimination laws enacted for the "protection" of people of color, generally;
(5) anti-discrimination laws enacted specifically to prevent white people from refusing to rent their homes to black folk;
(6) anti-discrimination laws enacted specifically to prevent white people from refusing to sell their homes to people of colah;
(7) anti-discrimination laws enacted specifically to prevent white people from entering into agreements whereby they covenant not to sell their homes in a given neighborhood to black people;
(8) support for hoaxes which depict whitey in a false light;
(9) support for Black Lives Matter and other nihilistic negro organizations; and
(10) support for special pleading for negroes at the expense of merit.
Thus, support for anti-racism is patently anti-libertarian. You may prefer that the state uses violence in order to effect the objectives of anti-racism. Only a douchebag slaver would support the same.
support for anti-racism is patently anti-libertarian
And being different from your principles is evil. Funny that you call me a slaver.
You may prefer that the state uses violence in order to effect the objectives of anti-racism.
You assume that because you're either stupid, lazy, or some combination of both. You think you get to define reality as either A or B so you can use your flawed "logic" to tell people that if they don't agree with A then they agree with B. I'm not letting you define my options. More than A and B exist regardless of whether or not you acknowledge that fact.
Only a douchebag slaver would support the same.
You can give yourself that label if you like, I'm not going to stop you.
You don't have to support all that stuff to be anti-racist. You can just think that racism is stupid and counterproductive. I think that's what most libertarians think. There is nothing anti-libertarian about a desire for voluntary, organic, realistic changes in people's attitudes and beliefs about race.
I can be anti-racist, against racism (by definition) without supporting any of the things you've listed here. In fact, I'm against all the things you've listed here, and I think racism is stupid and illogical.
Racism ignores the individual and holds individuals responsible for group behavior. Racism is incompatible with libertarianism for this reason, because libertarians believe actions and decisions are made by individuals.
Azoth covered the question posed by Leo. As Azoth noted, support of anti-racism means support for coerced association. Do you favor coerced association?
I'll have to admit that I either don't remember an exchange with Azoth or I didn't see his reply.
It is however incorrect if it is what you claim here. I can think that racism is illogical and immoral, yet still believe in your right to be racist and not associate with those of another race. I happen to whole-heartedly agree that you should be able to not associate with anyone you want for any reason you want. Full stop.
Anti-racism need not be a concept enforced by government. It can, and has, been enforced by the free market by people who are anti-racist freely choosing not to associate with known racists.
Zeb, attitudes and beliefs are what bigotry is about. Racism isn't bigotry. Racism is bigotry systematized. That's what the "ism" on the end of the word signifies. And that's why some folks who aren't bigots themselves can be racists?if they act to systematize for their own advantage the bigotry of others. Hillary Clinton wasn't above doing that.
And it's also why plenty of bigots are not racists?because, believe it or not, there are bigots who think of their inner feelings about race as inappropriate, or even sinful?and who would not act to systematize those feelings, or organize others who felt similarly to join in racist action.
That distinction, between bigotry on the one hand, and racism on the other, is important, and too often overlooked. It is by making that distinction that society is able to identify objectively when racism is being practiced, without having to look into the unknowable hearts of all those who are doing it. And conversely, it is the right basis for making moral distinctions which give full credit for the virtue of bigoted folks who nevertheless do not practice racism.
With that said, the typical libertarian take on racism?which your comment expresses?is a cop out for which libertarians are rightly criticized. A just society can leave an end to bigotry to private consensus, but not the practice of racism.
You're free to call your shoe a hat, but don't be surprised when others don't understand you. That's not what most people understand those words to mean.
I can think that racism is illogical and immoral, yet still believe in your right to be racist and not associate with those of another race. I happen to whole-heartedly agree that you should be able to not associate with anyone you want for any reason you want. Full stop.
Exactly this 100%.
Then you are, according to Stephen and others like him who support 'anti-racism', a racist.
Then you are ... a racist.
If you say so. And I suspect you believe that you aren't a racist. Because that's all that would make sense in Backwardsland.
You misunderstand me. If $park? is the Worst chooses privately to avoid association with others on the basis of his bigotry, his action does not meet the definition of racism I suggested. It is when he participates in an organized system?of exclusion, or the denial of opportunity, wealth, honors, service, etc.?based on combining his bigotry with that of others, or on building social systems (including government) premised on mutual bigotry that he becomes a racist.
When that happens, the libertarian appeal to individual rights and individual initiative as a corrective has already failed. At that point, claims ring hollow that libertarianism, or the free market, or whatever, will solve in the future a problem those means have not solved previously.
It is then time for socially organized protection of those targeted?by means of private social action, or by government force?to take priority. Just societies can not tolerate among them people who, based on bigotry, paradoxically claim an individual right to act collectively and systematically to disadvantage others.
If you think that sounds tyrannical, understand that from the point of of view of those targeted by racism, it is anti-tyrannical. Public policy has no moral reason to prefer your view over your targeted victims' objections.
Looking at the collage they have on Drudge report, and half of the pictures are more or less obviously completely acceptable contact. Handing a microphone to a kid? If that's the worst they have available, then I don't really think there's anything here.
His behavior does say something about the man. How anyone can go through life in our culture and not know this is very bad behavior is beyond me. No one wants what Creepy Joe is doing. It's just weird. Go be weird on your own time Joe, not on the tax payers' time.
Ok, now the mask has slipped. Robby is a parody writer! Right? I mean seriously? "Don't rush to judgement!"
Kavanaugh's accuser was "credible", remember that? But now after years of creepy behavior called out by a number of women, we shouldn't rush to judge a true statesman like Joe Biden.
No one here is more critical of the #metoo mafia than me, but, the picture of Uncle Joe with Mrs. Carter is creepier than Robin Williams in One Hour Photo.
There's that pic of him with a girl who can't be more than 12.
That is a bit creepier.
"Kavanaugh's accuser was "credible", remember that?"
That should never be forgotten.
She never became not credible. Sometimes Fat Hannity talks and people just believes what he says.
No, she never became credible.
Not for one second
Just keep repeating it enough and a Republican will get a hand job.
That's more than I've ever gotten as a libertarian. I'm switching.
Just because there are pictures doesn't mean it happened - - - -
The 'accusation defines guilt' thing is only for those without a "(D-)"
believe Democrats.
No offense Robby, but what did you expect the wife of a high Obama Administration official -- and likely member of the Democrat Party -- to say? Her body language at the time said something completely different.
Now I can understand why she's probably tired of being in the internet limelight, and she obviously doesn't think it's a big enough deal to derail Biden's career, but the pictures and video don't lie: she was not comfortable with the interaction.
Ironically, I see Biden getting grief for groping women who based on the pictures obviously didn't mind being groped by him. It's strange that this one would be the one used to exonerate him for being handsy.
It also illustrates the pitfalls of the bystander intervention campaigns pushed by #MeToo advocates: if a woman says she's fine with being groped, even though it may look bad, who are we to say otherwise?
I'm not sure who told this Carter person she has a say in any of this.
"Biden's reputation as a man who is overly familiar with women could hurt his campaign for the presidency?though anyone who thinks this is guaranteed to doom him should be gently reminded that the current president is Donald Trump."
I'm not going to lie - that made me laugh.
And the irony there is that Trump didn't say he grabbed women by the pussy. He claimed that they LET you if you're famous --- and undoubtedly factual statement. He did admit to kissing women.
Sounds like Robby hasn't seen the creepy uncle Joe compilation videos. It's not an isolated incident but a very long pattern of behavior. Once you've seen how many preteen girls he's gotten handsy with you start to wonder if he really does like them young.
It's really weird for you to seize upon this one lady who says it was fine, given the broader context. It may be that none of the behavior crosses the threshold of #MeToo but you can't explain away the pure creepiness of it all. Trump would eat him alive.
#MeToo is only for Republicans, so it doesn't matter what the behavior was.
Al Franken is a Republican?
Congratulations, zeb, you've found the exception that proves the rule.
That's not what "the exception that proves the rule" means.
That is literally the opposite of the truth.
"In that context, Biden's touching of Carter wasn't inappropriate. It wasn't inappropriate, because the sole person with the authority to judge that?Carter?says it wasn't."
Well hold on now, we'll have to see what the tribunal's report says. Check back with me in... 2 years.
How about that 13 year old girl he was grabbing and kissing on while she tried to lean away?
Of course. It's not because Democrats have been hurt enough. Just like after the witch trials involving sexual harassment in the early 90's, Clinton wasn't guilty because he only groped underlings once.
Rules are fluid.
Won't somebody (other than Biden) think of the children?!?!
R Kelly?
It wasn't a #MeToo moment because the person doing it wasn't a Republican.
FIFY
sexual harassment is about unwanted advances. if the advances are wanted, the guy is in the clear. good luck knowing in advance though.
as the Tom Brady skit on SNL pointed out, the 3 best ways to avoid sexual harassment claims: be good looking. be attractive. don't be unattractive.
I'll remind people that Moore was a creepy guy for doing the same shit Biden did.
Both are equally God awful elected officials, mind you.
I'll remind people that Moore was a creepy guy for doing the same shit Biden did.
If you had a Biden-equivalent photo montage of Roy Moore, dude would almost certainly be behind bars.
Even hint at a Moore-equivalent salacious scandal against Biden and you get dudes like Robby white-knighting for him.
But as she explains in a recent Medium post after the picture started making the rounds again, it does not depict a #MeToo violation. Biden's contact with Carter was welcome and consensual.
Jules: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Stop right there. Eating a bitch out and giving a bitch a shoulder massage ain't even the same fucking thing.
Vincent: It's not, it's the same ballpark.
Jules: It ain't no fucking ball park neither! Now look, maybe your method of massage differs from mine, but you know touching his wife's feet and sticking your tongue in the holiest of holies ain't the same fucking ball park. It ain't the same league. It ain't even the same fucking sport! Look, shoulder massages don't mean shit!
Vincent: Have you ever given a shoulder massage?
Jules: Don't be telling me about shoulder massages, I'm the shoulder fuckin' master.
Vincent: Given a lot of them?
Jules: Shit, yeah. I got my technique down and everything, I don't be tickling or nothing.
Vincent: Would you give a guy a shoulder massage?
Jules: Fuck you.
Is there a sign in my front yard that says...?
According to most progs, a man has to ask permission from a woman for a kiss.
Man - My lady, may I kiss you?
Woman, Well, let me think about it. Where are we going for dinner?
Also, it is advised that all contacts be documented by witnesses and video streams.
Love aint what it used to be. No sir.
Meanwhile, did the Lt. Gov. of Virginia ever resign? Or was forced out?
Breaking News !!!
Accuser Still Wants Virginia Lt. Governor To Resign
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDID5LL4SA8
WARNING: CRINGEWORTHY - Joe Biden, The biggest pervert to ever be protected by the liberal media
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tK9Fe15I5rI
If the contact was viral, then its definitely creepy
Joe is def not woke enough for the current dems. It'll be even funnier when the super delegates put him in anyways and give a middle finger to their crazy base
I don't care. What are they going to do in office? That's all that matters. The president can go flash people in the park for all I care if he can actually manage to reduce the size and scope of the federal government.
Of course, Biden won't do that. But he'd be less awful than most of the Ds running.
There's no hidin' from Joe Biden.
At the very least, the media should give Carter the final say on the 2015 photo and stop recycling it for "creepy Uncle Joe" coverage.
Yes, they should. It should be item #14,388,512 on the list of Shit The Media Should Stop Repeating, right after all the other myths and lies and smears and half-truths and misleading and context-less stuff they repeat.
I wonder he uses Nancy Pelosi's face person.
So one of the many times he groped a woman, she didn't mind? Good to know,
Biden's from a previous generation -- men were more handsy back then.
I'm from a previous generation and the only handsy guys were the perverts.
All you have to do is change the particulars around a bit. How would a man feel if a guy they didn't know well stroked their hair, smelled their hair and then kissed them? Most men I know wouldn't let a friend they knew well do that let alone someone they were meeting causally. Most men wouldn't let another man grab them by both their shoulders from behind without doing or saying something about it.
And what if this was your boss? Your daughter's teacher doing it to your daughter? The cop who pulled your wife over doing it to your wife? My grandfathers never showed affection in a way that made me pull away or call for my parents. Why would I expect someone else's grandfather to be allowed to do that to me or my daughters?
You don't have to be a rapist to be a pervert and when I see men making women uncomfortable and then continuing it when it becomes obvious, pervert is the only work I can think of. Normal people understand and respect the body language of others. Perverts don't. Uncle Joe is a pervert.
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I don't care about old Joe and hair sniffing. I care about Hunter Biden and Burisma. Is the gas in that pipeline really from "friendly" (to Hillary and other Dems) Ukrainians or is a lot of it from Russia, as all of originates from regions under control of Russian puppets. No one really knows who controls Burisma. Very murky ownership trail.
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you may want a better example of Biden's "critics on the left". the item you linked that refers to him as "Creepy Uncle Joe" is one of the Washington Post's HUMOUR columns.
One woman, the wife of a Democrat politician who worked in the same administration that Biden did, says it wasn't creepy. It's not like her family wouldn't benefit from a Biden Administration. Maybe her husband would be a logical candidate for Secretary of State? Or he might be up for a very nice Ambassadorship to New Zealand or
Dozens of videos show Biden acting very weird. What he is doing in these videos is very inappropriate. The vast, vast majority of people see the behavior for what it is: gross, weird, invasive, presumptuous, entitled, creepy, and wrong. The fact that he doesn't think he did anything wrong makes him an absolute jackass.
I understand he hasn't committed rape or sexual assault. But he has done something else that is very messed up.
Joe Biden: NO ONE WANTS YOU TO TOUCH THEM THIS WAY YOU FRIGGIN CREEP. STOP IT!