Free Trade

Free Trade Not Discussed at Veep Debate, Not Getting Much Needed Positive Play in 2016

Big league miss

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Bao Dandan/Xinhua/TNS/Newscom

There have been many troubling trends in the 2016 election, not least of which has been the shift to decidedly anti-free trade rhetoric from both major party presidential nominees.

The topic, unfortunately, was not brought up by CBS' Elaine Quijano, the moderator, and only came up twice in passing, brought up by Republican vice presidential nominee Mike Pence, who had a relatively pro-free trade record while serving in Congress from 2001 to 2012.

In response to a question on the growing national debt and balancing budgets in his state, Pence eventually explained that his and Donald Trump's economic plan would fix the problem. That plan included cutting taxes, "ending the war on coal," repealing Obamacare and "all of the executive orders that Barack Obama has signed that are stifling economic growth in this economy" and, finally "the kind of trade deals that'll put the American worker first."

Toward the end of the debate, Pence was asked how he would "unify the country." He launched into an attack on how the Obama administration and Hillary Clinton had "weakened America's place in the world" that included a complaint about "the kind of trade deals that have put American workers in the back seat."

That comment, buried in a longer answer, ought to have yielded a follow up. It's hard to figure out which trade deal exactly Pence was referring to. In his 12 years in Congress, he voted in favor of no less than 10 various trade deals with other countries—Singapore, Chile, Australia, Morocco, Oman, Vietnam, Peru, and Colombia, as well as voting in favor of the failed Central American Free Trade Agreement.

For his part, Democratic vice presidential nominee did not bring up trade once, and was not asked about it. Kaine, who has served in the Senate since 2012, has a much shorter and inconclusive voting record on free trade. He voted for a trade preferences extension bill and for trade promotion authority in 2015, and for sugar subsidies reform in 2013. He also voted for an anti-free trade "Buy American" expansion in 2013 as well as in favor of the Export-Import Bank. Pence consistently voted against Ex-Im while in Congress.

Absent the inclusion of Gary Johnson in the final two presidential debates, Mike Pence was the last candidate on a debate stage who might have been forced to give some kind of defense of free trade, which has been a great force for prosperity in the last half century.

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  1. Pence eventually explained that his and Donald Trump’s economic plan would fix the problem. That plan included cutting taxes, “ending the war on coal,” repealing Obamacare and “all of the executive orders that Barack Obama has signed that are stifling economic growth in this economy” and, finally “the kind of trade deals that’ll put the American worker first.”

    Those all strike me as the kinds of things that libertarians should support, with the possible exception of the last one.

    I have no idea what they might mean by that. Since what are commonly called “free trade” deals are anything but that (protip: if it requires a multi-thousand page set of rules and an administering bureaucracy isn’t a “free” anything), I wouldn’t assume that any change to a managed trade deal is necessarily anti-free trade.

    I have no idea if what Trump would do would increase, or decrease, the freedom of international trade. I doubt it will increase it, but I’m not assuming it won’t.

    1. Unfortunately, that last one is the most loaded. Tariffs, which I believe are mentioned in the old document written by white slave owners was about putting American workers first. The UAW is as enthusiastic about import Tariffs as is GM.

      1. Foreigners can’t be the POTUS. That’s the ultimate protectionist policy and maybe we need some foreign help right now.

        1. You guys want PM Zoolander? We can let him go if you really want him. Please?

          1. If you take back Justin Bieber and throw in a live sasquatch, deal.

            1. You got it.

              “YO, STEVE SMITH? Vacation’s over buddy. Get in the box with in the Prime Minister, we’ll probably remember to drill some air holes.”

        2. You can’t tell me you wouldn’t want Herman Mashaba to be President.

          1. That. Is. Awesome. I am worried he is gonna get himself shot.

  2. Big league miss

    Oh Ed do you still think that the MSM actually cares about any issue beyond getting Democrats in office?

    Also compare this title to Sudermann’s article. Can Reason’s pro-Hillary tilt be anymore obvious?

    1. MSM? Majorly Smug Motherfuckers?

  3. “unify the country.”
    OK, Pearl Harbor unified the country. JFK’s death unified the country. 9/11 unified the country.
    For short periods of time. The U.S.A. is split nearly down the middle in terms of issues and solutions.
    All the promises to unify the country are as bogus as they were in 2008 when it took the President about
    ten seconds to say “Hey, we won.”

    1. Pearl Harbor unified the country….For short periods of time

      Provided you weren’t of Japanese descent natch…

      All the promises to unify the country are as bogus as they were in 2008

      Funny that Welch and Gillespie started their libertarian moment spiel in 2008…

      1. If we’re not united at least we’re federated. Okay, over-federated.

    2. …Pearl Harbor unified the country.

      Do we really want to have to rely on the Germans again?

      1. Just bomb Chicago to smithereens. Instant stimulus!

      2. That was the Japs.
        Also, you know who else relief on the Germans?

        1. Forget it, he’s on a roll.

    3. Actually, it’s more of a scattergram.

  4. Mike Pence was the last candidate on a debate stage who might have been forced to give some kind of defense of free trade…

    He’s in bed with populist protectionism. There will be no defense of free trade to be had from any main stage from this point forward.

    1. Free trade is gay trade, and we won’t be having any of that.

  5. TPP is not free trade. In fact the more shady they act about its content the more I think it is just a crony IP law FYTW not-free treaty.

    1. Agreed. Thousands of secret pages aren’t needed for free trade. For some crazy reason I just don’t quite trust my government or any of the others when they pat me on the head and tell me I don’t have anything to worry about.

  6. Waddya mean no free trade? We’re all free to trade in our future for free healthcare/childcare/college/birth control/etc.

    1. and by “free” we mean that the 1% will pay for it, with “trickle-down” confiscatory tax grabs once that golden goose has been exhausted.

      1. The 1% don’t have THAT much fucking money……

  7. “Don’t mention the (trade) war.”

    1. “I think I got away with it.”

  8. Has Obama learned nothing in 8 years of being president?

    Apparently not.

    Obama’s tragic admission: He’s learned nothing as president

    1. It is not like it wasn’t obvious to everyone or anything.

    2. How can he learn anything if he already knows all there is to know? Pleb…

    3. Committed ideologues rarely learn. They have their ideology and that’s all they need.

      Just check out that video of Obama at 20 in Kenya. He has been spouting the same bullshit for nearly 30 years or more. And he knew everything back then, too!

    4. I like the part where more people in the soup line is a success for the government program that administers the soup line.

      1. Was that Obumbles or Uncle Bernie?

    5. “Never mind that the world is on fire, that America is polarized, angry and scared. Or that ObamaCare is a sick patient, that the economy is growing at a snail’s pace and that many cities are racial war zones.

      It’s not Obama’s fault. None of it. He would do it all again.

      …he expressed no regret. He was right and everybody else was wrong.”

      The guy is a brainwashed useful idiot to the bone and a narcissistic personality disorder. People like that cant learn. All of this was painfully obvious from the first day he was in the public spotlight. All of it. The more obvious it became the more his cultish sycophants doubled down. Fuck every idiot that voted for him.

      1. And truly fuck those who put him in power.

        He didn’t do it own his own.

        Everybody knows that.

        1. Fuck them all to death!

          1. Dang it, I had Mr. Garrison tags on this but it just threw them out….

    6. Just think of the upcoming generation of millennials arriving just in time to teach you what you need to know about the world they came to inhabit all of five minutes ago.

  9. TPP is not free trade. In fact the more shady they act about its content the more I think it is just a crony IP law FYTW not-free treaty.

    I get the impression there’s a whole lotta consolidation/synchronization of labor and environmental regs buried in there.

  10. Speaking of the Clown hysteria what about Pagliacci? Or Jimmy Stewart in the Greatest Show on Earth? Both feature killer clowns…

  11. Sitting here listening to Meet the Press clips. Chuck Todd is tut-tutting over the lawyerly evasions and rhetorical niggling about Pence’s Russia comments.

    Hillary laughs.

    1. Todd is just another democrat hack pretending to be a journalist.

  12. Now Ed Rendell is making the shameless claim that Kaine was “substantive”.

  13. Populist pandering actual policy. Trade deals aren’t going anywhere.

    1. Populist pandering does not equal actual policy. Guess html doesn’t appreciate math symbols.

      1. You not knowing how ? html not appreciating.

        1. Not knowing ? Not able

      2. Populist pandering parsing poses peculiar posting problems.

        1. Proper prior planning prevents poor performance.

  14. Just saw this on facebook

    http://bluevirginia.us/2016/09…..ry-johnson

    1. Every single one of these I see only makes me want to vote for Johnson harder. ( ? euphemism)

      1. Right. They could replace the whole list with one item. Freedom. Hillary and Trump Opposed. Johnson Supports.

    2. Wow, that is pretty dishonest.

      On taxes it says both The Johnson and The Donald want to lower taxes for the rich instead of lower taxes for everyone. That tells me what I need to know about who composed that chart.

      Trump opposes women’s reproductive rights. Huh.

      Johnson opposes equal pay, I assume for women. That’s good to know.

      1. Johnson wants The Fair Tax, a federal sales tax, to replace the federal income tax. Are you telling me that would lower taxes for everyone?

        1. It would raise taxes on nearly everyone. There’s no way it would “remain” revenue neutral either. Hell it wouldn’t even pass unless it was projected to be revenue-positive.

      2. I’m waiting for one of my progressive idiot friends acquaintances to post this so that I can point out that eliminating federal student loans will reduce student debt.

        1. I’m stealing that one. Thanks.

    3. There should be a per-voter dollar amount next to every item that HC supports.

    4. Women’s reproductive rights … opposes funding

      I wasn’t even aware that rights required funding. You learn something new from the progs every day.

      Collective bargaining … opposes

      Yes, supporting right-to-work is literally the same as banning collective bargaining guys.

      Thanks for the laugh JB.

    1. the same Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) free trade agreement …

      The TPP isnt a “free” trade agreement.

      Its just a trade agreement. Arguments for or against the deal say absolutely nothing about the subject of “Free” trade.

      Have you even read that guy’s piece? His recommendations in the last 2-3 paragraphs are a combination of “theoretical nice-to-haves (which will never happen)”, and a broad-brush demand for more ‘enforcement’…

      it would be nice if the guy actually bothered, after wasting 1000s of words explaining the history of trade, to specify any single countries or single markets (other than ‘china’ and ‘steel’) which provided examples of what he believed needed that sort of enforcement.

  15. So, essplain to me dis, the last few weeks, if I go to cnn, there’s around 100% chance that the top, blaring story will be trump. Is this coverage positive or negative?

    1. There’s no such thing as bad publicity.
      –Keith Richards

      1. I think Barnum and Houdini said it earlier.

    2. Yeah, I noticed that as well. BBC news US & Canada has mostly been the same thing although they actually seem to be more concerned right now with the major hurricane headed towards the U.S. coast than CNN is.

      1. That hurricane just might get me out of working over the weekend. W00t!

      1. You have provided the most accurate answer. I now bow at your hem.

  16. “In a modern economy, no one is self-sufficient. Instead, people are specialized. The work you do probably does not produce something you could consume. Even more striking is the fact that almost everything you consume is something you could not possibly produce. Your daily life depends on the cooperation of hundreds of millions of other people.”

    ?Arnold Kling

    1. Funny how supporters tried to spin Obama’s comments into an Adam smithian understanding of a complex economy when he was essentially singing the praises of a command economy.

      1. Let’s make America better off by cutting ourselves of from the work of the hundreds of millions!

        1. Let’s make America better off by insuring free trade that benefits all, rather than managed trade that benefits some at the expense of others.

          / me

    2. Let’s finagle the definition of ‘self sufficient’ until we can use it to justify collectivism. By their definition no one in the history of the world was self sufficient since even our ancestors lived in groups with division of labor.

      1. Whoa, whoa that came out wrong.

        I quoted this paragraph because I thought it neatly summarized I, Pencil nicely, not to support the idiotic “You didn’t built that” meme. Are we giving up on the word cooperation?

      2. goodspeak is for the people

  17. I know it’s been 5 years but what is the harm here. How big of a dick do you have to be to enforce this?

    http://www.aol.com/article/new…..p00000058&

    1. They get their rocks off on bossing people around.

    2. The fuck? I’ll donate to the legal fund that burns that city government to the ground.

    3. How did this article make you feel?

      Only get those five choices? Number 6: Pic of tar and feathers.

    4. Bradley said the city told her there was an anonymous complaint about the signs,

      6A lawsuit to reveal the name of her accuser.

    5. Or be the anonymous asshole who reported it?

    6. Great suggestion in the comments to just have the signs painted onto the house.

      “Someone complained about the signs, so we took them down. The speech we wish to convey is still there though.”

    7. Anonymous complaints about signs drawing attention to a kidnapping. I wonder who might have called that in?

      *scratches head staring off into space*

      What a puzzler.

  18. If a singing blistering wind of angel knees smashed into the tepid frail faces of reality news spraying from all the pipes nothing would change the angle of their fucking hurricanes because these vicious twisting soul-swept hells were built a fucking long time ago on the raging flats of psychostorms. Nothing about these charlatans will ever breed respect for their fucking slippery goddamn con. Butcher’s kitchens are built on scribes.

    1. This is the case for Mars, people.

    2. I’ll have what he’s having. No, really, I want some.

      1. But he just ate the entire world supply.

  19. Let’s go Mets.

  20. Global debt reaches $152 trillion.

    The figures highlight the apparent paradox between ultra-low interest rates imposed by many central banks in an attempt to encourage borrowing and boost sluggish economies, and the dangers that arise from excessive debt levels.

    How is this a “paradox”?

    1. Alternatively, there’s $152 trillion of credit.

      1. No, credit is unlimited. We’ve used $152 trillion of it.

      2. Do I want $152 trillion dollars of credit that’s worth $75 to $100 trillion worth of liquidity ?

        I think not sir !

        Good day to you I say !

  21. We’re going to drown ourselves in a sea of domestic regulations while complaining about the squall of potential downsides to free trade deals. Shit, you don’t have to love the TTP, but let’s have some perspective here. It’s not China subsidizing our consumers with cheap shit that regulates your business to death.

    1. Today I worked with some materials grown in Bangladesh, some manufactured in Italy and Germany, some manufactured in Ohio and New Jersey. A tarriff wall will make my life awesome! The union shakedown on my scab status the other day was just icing.

  22. What’s this about Trump getting us involved in a Trade Warty?

    1. Warty doesn’t “trade.” Warty’s all about giving. He’s very generous that way.

      1. No rough trade? Hmph.

      1. 2 spoopy 2 live
        2 creppy 2 die
        m9

  23. I haven’t watched regular TV in years. Has everything devolved into a version of NCIS?

    1. Wife is watching NCIS now. Yes, yes it has. Propaganda for the total state.

      1. Sevo wife is also a “fan”. Seems broadcast TV is now required to show Mark Harmon’s ‘serially’ mug 23 hours each day. At least.
        I don’t blame him for doing it; the residuals are gonna make his progeny wealthy for several generations. I’m sure I’m not alone in hoping they don’t turn into another ‘Meathead’; hell, go to Vegas and blow it on drugs and wimmyn!

  24. See? Clowns are scary!

    “Amid viral frenzy, clown-suited man grabs for toddler in Concord”
    […]
    “… But suddenly, Blakely said, the clown grabbed the girl’s left arm and gave it a big tug, forcing the mother to kick the assailant in the shins….”
    http://www.sfgate.com/crime/ar…..792865.php

    There all all sorts of possibilities here, and only one of them fits the ‘creepy clown’ idea. I’m going with ‘arranged to suit the narative’.
    BTW, it was earlier claimed to be an “attempted kidnapping”.

    1. “clown-themed threats of violence”

      Stop the world, I want to get off.

      1. Don’t you love a farce……

        1. Why, we could bring in the clowns…

    2. “Officers were called to the area but were unable to locate the assailant. The girl was not injured.”

      I am sure there is some common thread in these events. I bet if they put a crack detective on it he could find that common thread…

      This clown got away. He must have slipped away and blended in with the crowd.

      1. You know, its bad enough when they scare people about things that actually do, rarely, happen.
        But to gin up a shit-storm of anxiety over something that has, quite possibly, never happened, is simply insane or inane, whichever your auto spell chooses.

  25. Johnson commits another gaffe, says US is guilty of killing civilians in Syria and Afghanistan

    Once again, the media takes a rather sapient point and pearl-clutches over Johnson’s refusal to submit to the consensus view on US foreign policy.

    Doesn’t he realize that when the US kills civilians in places it has no business being it does lovingly and with noble intentions?

    1. Doesn’t he realize that there’s a Democrat in the White House? Dem wars never cause anything bad…

    2. I think there is a pretty good argument to be made for moral almost equivalence between the two. The wars in Syria and Libya were started for….what? I have never gotten a good explanation. Ego? Chess pieces sacrificed in the game against Putin?

      Starting a war with no serious national interest in mind, a war in which many thousands will be collateral damage, isnt that far from deliberately targeting civilians. Also, I am skeptical of how many civilian casualties were targeted by enemies and how many were false flags planted by their ostensibly own forces; forces backed by you know who.

      Clinton’s hands are pretty goddamned dirty.

      1. I agree, except for the part about “isnt that far from deliberately targeting civilians”. It is deliberately engaging in actions where the consequences for the civilian population are entirely predictable. When we firebombed Dresden, we knew that we were targeting civilians.
        Purposely fomenting civil war in one of the least stable places on the planet is insane, inane, and probably a war crime. Hillary for president.

    3. this made me smile =

      Article after article in the New York Times from 2012 on described how the United States was arming or supporting the arming by allies of Syrian insurgents. For New York Times reporters to not understand the involvement of the US in Syria for years is shocking to me. A political candidate is not the point, the point is knowing what US policy has been for years as reported in the Times.

      Failing to understand US involvement in Syria for years, for Times reporters, is saddening and scary.

      one person seems to get it. also = very nice rhetorical turn of the knife.

    4. It’s the Times. Intentions trump everything else.

    5. This is going to make liberal media types really go into a panic. Nothing scare them more than someone seizing anti-war votes, a voting bloc they have shoved into corner the last 8 years because they’re only useful for when a Republican is in the White House.

      He must be destroyed.

  26. fuckin stabbed the goddamn usb with a fucking 3.5mm and the windows beast screamed at me for not being a goddamn digital cousin. FUCK YOU MOTHFUCKing glass pane!

  27. little dog paws on the carpet
    still like a sleeping thing gentle
    on the moments of things, man

    odd todays walked into the doorways
    of eyes that are too narrow
    following skirts on mystical trains

    not even sure when this is real or tomorrow will be better
    or was yesterday today? numb thoughts at the
    edge of trains that don’t run in the country

    mountains filled with brains and collapse
    dripping elevations and appeal mounted
    into the visceral sensations of
    shrubs carved into lions and lost goddamn lines
    built to evoke joy for decades wound behind
    the mines they left behind where only

    the fucking shadows and leaves tremble
    goddamn gods and queens of
    lines and superduper fucking pictorials of awe
    go to fall into forgotten dwelling emptiness gone

    and the new laces their minds on the threads of the
    fucking ghosts of beastly alley tomorrows so goddamn super tomorrow

    1. Agile! Glad to see you, most mellow of the yellow. The Poet of the Commentariat! I hope all goes good in your universe.

  28. I just had a thought on this whole “prosecutor as political tool” thing.

    NY AG Schneiderman has had no trouble going after political opponents using his office’s powers. Most recently he sent a cease and desist to Trump’s charity in response to a newspaper hit piece.

    So we have very strict laws on the privacy of IRS records, including tax returns. Where exactly is the prompt action from the NY AG office against the New York Times and their (likely Clinton-affiliated) source? And more interestingly, where is the public outcry?

    We have a state attorney general using his office to score political points during an election while simultaneously avoiding a clear duty of his office in order to avoid political damage to his friends during the same election. You’d think that would be enough to have people a little bit up-in-arms.

    1. ZZZZ….says Gillespie and Welch.

    2. There are all kinds of outrages. The thing is, most people don’t follow politics and news like we do. Most people are busy with kids and work and all. They get their news from watching local channel 2 waiting for the sports scores. That local news reporter grabbed an already biased, half-assed, and simplistic write up, stupided it up a little more, and BAM!!!
      Hillary is a victim, and the next POTUS.

  29. little boxes are playgrounds for fingers, man
    my little fingers play in this fucking box, sister queen
    fucking grey lines contain all that shit and endless
    bounty of explosion minds forcing the art arms to
    spray their millions of dappled ethos into this
    little playground of this shit box and so on

    1. I misplaced my AC Cliff’s Notes.

      I don’t think being drunker makes AC any more cromulent, but goddamnit I’m willing to try.

    2. If you have shit on your fingers, you’re in the wrong box.

  30. Your lines cannot be distorted
    your voice should never echo murder
    your arms should resist taking life
    your spirit should rise into the ethos of conscience clouds
    building pianos and ponds in the sky
    life is eternal deft and rivers dappling under the forever joy of
    horizons melting colors on golden stoves.

  31. if life was a glass lane
    that ran for miles into the
    heart of the sun
    and my tears were
    the incidental comets
    that smashed into those goddamn
    dark orbs
    floating out there, bro

    letters punch into the glaze
    like that fucking whiteboard
    is a fucking tap scrox
    spooling the trimming ships
    underneath the glass
    man if you peer beneath
    the sounds the edges reveal
    the dreams of the screams
    and the lost cries
    cages rust when forgotten
    and dreams oxidize under the
    paralysis of fucking goddamn bullshit

  32. angry blood fell
    smoky tile gleamed
    in the fight of powerful
    egos smashing and
    grasping the coiled hearts
    of magicians beating tanks
    into the living rivers
    of raging selves
    and lines with no winners

  33. red honey trips in the vines
    of our fucking shit
    and trips should be as smooth
    as possible from the fucking start
    because if you trip super real deep
    with a bad captain your shit
    will live a fucking movie no dollar can buy

    1. Don’t know what that’s a link to, but I’ll assume it’s Weld saying something no libertarian ever would say.

      1. Naw, MuffinDiver, it was about the VP debate thingy

        1. Oh no, it was MuffBomber

        2. Kaine? Yeah, but Pence’s inability to knock the stuffing out of Kaine’s idiotic economic policies was a major letdown.

          1. Lol. Dude, you looking for a bright spot? Here’s what’s up: no matter who wins, things will get worse. There is no libertarian moment until the Empire falls, and that’s not happening this election.
            But, government isn’t the end all be all. Fuck the government. Fuck Trump. Fuck Hilary. Smoke a bowl and go fishing. Or go shoot Bambi. Or go bet a hundy on a game of pool.
            Fuck the police.
            Live. Live your life for all you can, and any slaver that gets in your way? Well, fuck him.

  34. trip gone awry is the longest fucking realest fucking film especially if your shit is
    mixed deep with certain arrangements and this is where Dennett doesn’t get it. His
    lifelong fucking books and fucking vast intelligence and agile owns all his shit but Dennett
    can’t cross over until the real thing tracks his cognition into trip horror.
    Dennett trips with old Vienna Jew Kandel but these geniuses are way too fuckin Harvard for the real
    alternative dribble drobble where the fucking trips get thick and your fucking shooters crank
    this wobbly bowl of reality, brothers.

  35. It’s time to play “Let’s Compare Agile Cyborn to Very Important Modern Poets.”

    How about Sandra Cisneros

    Before you became a cloud, you were an ocean, roiled and
    murmuring like a mouth.
    You were the shadows of a cloud cross-
    ing over a field of tulips.
    You were the tears of a man who cried
    into a plaid handkerchief.
    You were the sky without a hat.
    Your
    heart puffed and flowered like sheets drying on a line.

    1. This Fusionist is obviously massively
      deeply loved by the monster of this thing
      called unearthly alcoholic dripping pinkies
      and this strange demon The Fusionist
      was found jamming his large long dong
      into Asian princesses sailing long ships
      and these sweet Asian princesses demanded
      the cum of long cocks because their ships needed
      the cum of long cocks to sail into space and
      indeed they did…..

      I fucking . so .what/ the fuck? jesus fuck

      1. Better watch out, Sandra, you may have some competition for the Poet Laureate position.

  36. What about the fucking voices beneath
    the basements of our rainy minds
    where the shoulders of our chins smash into
    the elders of our minds we don’t even FUCKING know about
    because all of us today cocks and vaginas are generally lost assholes
    living like dragons under the long lost sun because this shit new sun
    is a worthless bitch and so on

  37. Now for some Richard Wilbur

    The eyes open to a cry of pulleys,
    And spirited from sleep, the astounded soul
    Hangs for a moment bodiless and simple
    As false dawn.
    Outside the open window
    The morning air is all awash with angels.

  38. Now for the optimistic musings of Sylvia Plath

    The day you died I went into the dirt,
    Into the lightless hibernaculum
    Where bees, striped black and gold, sleep out the blizzard
    Like hieratic stones, and the ground is hard.
    It was good for twenty years, that wintering –
    As if you never existed, as if I came
    God-fathered into the world from my mother’s belly:
    Her wide bed wore the stain of divinity.
    I had nothing to do with guilt or anything
    When I wormed back under my mother’s heart.

  39. For a change of pace

    Oh, the heads that turn
    Make my back burn
    And those heads that turn
    Make my back, make my back burn

    The sparkle in your eyes
    Keeps me alive
    And the sparkle in your eyes
    Keeps me alive, keeps me alive

    1. I always liked this one:

      Love Removal Machine

        1. I always liked the The C…. bands: The Cult, The Cure, The Call, The Church, and, of course, The Clash.

          Could we get Morrissey to put AC’s poetry to music?

  40. David showed his foot that day
    and all his toes were gone
    and his ass skin was cut off
    and sewed onto his stumps
    and so on but this was when
    jeeps and Fords were actually
    cool and maybe even when toes
    were cool but

    like old video stores tonight
    might be a concert of dreams
    and wishes but
    always remember that when
    you do drugs time is never the
    same today when you started
    in 1988

    1. 1988? that is a very long time to be on drugs… jesus fuck…

  41. Frank O’Hara

    I walk through the luminous humidity
    passing the House of Seagram with its wet
    and its loungers and the construction to
    the left that closed the sidewalk if
    I ever get to be a construction worker
    I’d like to have a silver hat please

  42. I think this is from one of John Milton’s sonnets:

    Just plug me in just like I was eddie harris
    You’re eating crazy cheese like you’d think I’m from paris
    You know I get fly you think I get high
    You know that I’m gone and I’m a tell you all why
    So tell me who are you dissing maybe I’m missing
    The reason that you’re smiling or wilding

  43. this space is bland and my eyes hurt
    like grunting gods and the voices of this
    creeping finger fuck festicles or festivals
    scram like large breasts of consenting large cock
    fuck into the boobs and all these letters keep
    moving like an island all over the fucking sex weeping
    sweep of this finger plod and prod and
    shit dude ….
    tripping again… fuck…
    back to fake normal but … fuck…

  44. Audre Lord – “black, lesbian, mother, warrior, poet”

    Is the total black, being spoken
    From the earth’s inside.
    There are many kinds of open.
    How a diamond comes into a knot of flame
    How a sound comes into a word, coloured
    By who pays what for speaking.

  45. Why doesn’t Reason care about the poor 3rd world children being enslaved in sweat shops by evil capitalists to make these cheap ‘free trade’ goods for filthy rich Americans?

    Obviously, Reason hates the children and wants the terrorists to win.

    1. Bring them here. There are great opportunities in the monocle mines.

  46. I feel my spine sinking into rainbows… loves and monster men
    I am falling into the prisons of long ankles and hairy ear lobes and fuckers who think
    they can kill me but agile has secrets even in trip land..

    you have to have serious fucking skill to crack this trip

    i would love to trip deep into this world with one of you becuase this shit is jus t starting and I can be your captain and if you are a dea guy I’d educate you even more so because I am and xpert on not dying on these things

    1. these things are heavens brook underneath the obsolete gods and where gentle steel angels live behind the trip most of those fucking nasty shits who enforce and create the hells don’t know jack shit about this world but all the holocausts are created by their type anyway right

  47. I believe that this one got first prize in this year’s Vogon Poetry Slam:

    A mere eyelid’s distance between you and me.

    It took us a long time to discover the number zero.

    John’s brother is afraid to go outside.
    He claims he knows
    the meaning of zero.

    I want to kiss you.

  48. This is of course one of the most famous works of the 17th-century Cavalier poet, Richard Lovelace:

    Have you seen her?
    So fine and pretty. Fooled me with her style and ease.
    And I feel her from across the room.
    Yes, it’s love in the third degree.
    Ooh, baby, baby.
    Won’tcha turn your head my way?
    Ooh, baby, baby.
    Come on, take a chance.
    You’re old enough to dance the night away.

  49. I got bored and skipped to the end of the thread. What are we talking about?

    1. We were talking about the Cavalier Poets.

      This is one by Robert Herrick (1591-1674), and it reflects the stylistic and metaphysical influences of John Donne and Ben Johnson:

      She was a fast machine she kept her motor clean
      She was the best damn woman that I ever seen
      She had the sightless eyes telling me no lies
      Knocking me out with those American thighs
      Taking more than her share
      Had me fighting for air
      She told me to come but I was already there

    2. eddie’s hoping someone will pay attention to him and maybe mistake him for AC.
      Other than that, the Giants got three runs in the 9th.

      1. No, there’s no mistaking AC’s distinctive style.

        I’m simply trying to educate you ungrateful Philistines about other aspects of our great cultural heritage.

          1. Come on, sevo, let the lead singer of this cover band cheer you up with the sight of his awesome moustache.

            1. Go pet your doggy. Maybe he’ll pay attention to you.

  50. “Free trade agreement”, “Patriot Act”, etc.

    1. There have been more than enough puff-jobs here regarding the supposed Pacific ‘free’ trade agreement, including some from Cato (I think).
      Regardless, it’s a (largely secret and very complicated) plan from the guys who brought you “O-care”! The wonderful product guaranteed to grow hair on bald men and cure cancer, all at a price you can’t refuse!
      So, you’ll forgive me if I pass on a ‘free trade’ agreement which has to be crafted in secret and runs to thousand of pages of copy.
      Fuck you, Obama, with Hillary’s dick.

  51. As someone how makes their living from trade, both export and import, I think America already has essentially free trade. Tarrifs are low – the highest I pay is 3.5% on one item. Mexico charges 15% for that item.

    Most of our trade deals now involve cajoling others to open their markets, really. This is why US voters don’t care so much.

    1. Not sure I’d characterize it as “free”, but our export bizz is far more hampered by (supposedly) ‘free markets’ in Euro-socialism than any problems with our imports.

  52. BTW, I don’t need Playa’s ‘dead’ internet to find out the Giants won over the Mets. They’ve been stinking worse than a sewage-treatment plant in the back half of the season, but they’ve done it before.

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