Rising Prosperity Means Getting to Eat More Meat and Seafood
That's ok, because human ingenuity and free markets satisfy increased demand.
One of the interesting side effects of rising prosperity around the world has been the change in eating habits in formerly poor countries. In China, for example, people historically relied on cereals, such as rice, for nutrition. Following economic liberalization and increased living standards—Chinese income per capita adjusted for inflation and purchasing power parity rose by an astonishing 1,300 percent between 1978 and 2015—consumption of cereals decreased. Conversely, consumption of animal products skyrocketed.
Consumption of fish and seafood, specifically, has been rising meteorically since the early 1980s. Today, a typical Chinese consumes more seafood than a typical American. And that, of course, has led to many an article about the imminent depletion of global fish stocks and subsequent environmental catastrophe.
But people who worry about the new and more expensive eating habits of people in formerly poor countries need not worry too much. Human ingenuity and free markets have a way of satisfying demand in affordable and environmentally sustainable ways.
Consider aquaculture. According to a recent Bloomberg story, scientists in Australia "are attempting to unlock the genome of the Black Tiger prawn to make a super invertebrate that will grow faster, fight disease more effectively and taste better than its free-roaming brethren… The prawns will grow on a 10,000 hectare… slice of the Legune cattle ranch, near the border of the Northern Territory and Western Australia."
If successful, "The first offspring from the project could be ready for sale at the end of 2018, and the site is targeting full output of 162,000 tons of prawns a year. That's more than four times Australia's current annual prawn consumption."
According to Chris Mitchell, director of the Seafarms Group, which plans to spend $1.5 billion building what will be the largest shrimp farm in the developed world, "the goal is to breed such hardy and tasty prawns that the project will never have to catch wild ones again."
Somewhere out there Julian Simon and Norman Borlaug must be smiling.
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Mmmm...food desserts...
as opposed to non-food desserts?
+1 Baked Sahara
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Wait'll those greedy bastards start wanting cars and air conditioners and color TV sets. Then you'll see their quality of life drop as they destroy the environment creating wealth disparities. If you cared about the poor, you'd work your ass off making sure they stay poor. For the common good.
What good's a TV?
Food channels!
Next they'll be walkin' around in pants and acting like white people.
1) Ornish, Greger, and McDougall offer compelling reasons to avoid or minimize eating processed flesh and the undercurrent social adjustment toward this science-based medical philosophy is something Libertarian-think should reflect on circumspectly. I grasp the deep-vein sprawling capitalism tendrils that form the basis for the existence of this site but, Jesus Christ, don't let the gold poison yo' cogs, nigga.
Gathering creaky wagons tightly and strictly around goddamn meat does not bode well for the open-society/free-thought stature of the last remaining vestige of societal common sense rubbing body parts with this planet. Brisket and black bean eaters unite, fuckers!
2) Someone needs to shove a fucking bung down the demented throat of that spluttering unconstitutional swine bazaar called R. Frisk Guiliani.
So you're saying the idea I have for a restaurant where the chef cooks at your table your made-to-order Steak-umm based meal is not a good one?
Sliced sizzling flesh should sell well if liberally-seasoned with sprinkles of FoE.
I bake a little love into all my creations. Sometimes a lot, if I'm really into it.
*invests in companies making gout treatments in China*
Actually saw someone holding up a sign along the road that read "MEAT, DAIRY AND EGGS REQUIRE MURDER" yesterday.
I felt bad for the dude.
Did he really think that was a convincing argument? Was he under the impression that someone driving by would go "Hrm, drinking bovine excretions or eating poultry menstruations mandates just as many dead non-sentient beings as directly consuming their flesh."?
Did he realize people were laughing at him?
My guess is he was trying to score with some college hippie chick and he thought this was the fastest way into her pants. The funny part was that he was standing on the sidewalk in front of a CVS.
BEEF JERKY IS GENOCIDE!
Should have been on the corner of healthy and horny.
Sort of On Topic.
So called "Farm to Table" restaurants are feeding a shit ton of slick advertising.
http://www.tampabay.com/projec.....staurants/
Here's the live chicken you ordered.
Having lived the "overalls, rich soil and John Deere tractors" lifestyle as a kid (minus the overalls- who the fuck wears those..)I am both smdh and triggered by this article.
In 2004 when traveling across NE Afghanistan, our interpreter said "it looks like much better times here". We asked what told him that, and he replied that there was mutton for sale now. People could afford to buy it again.
That means we could be facing bigger and stronger Chinese soldiers, the kind that could finally defeat the Vietnamese in battle and do we really want that?
Golly. And yet here in the US, all the 'rising prosperity' that Reason keeps trying to convince us has occurred here has resulted in meat/poultry consumption falling. From a peak of about 145 lbs/year in 2002 to about 132 lbs/year now (which is basically the same as it was throughout the 1970's and 80's).
I look forward to the next smoke-blowing article from Reason about how the US middle class is only getting smaller cuz everyone is getting richer.
That's due to misguided health crazes not poverty.
Of course it is. Because the US is getting richer. That must be the given - or everything kind of falls apart. All else (moving from steak to hamburger - or from red meat to poultry) is just therefore increasing human choice/preference/fashion - not getting squeezed. And yeah - I've noticed that everyone is eating tofu now too.
You cannot deny that the following consumer attitudes have played at least some part in all of this:
- Red meat is "bad for you"
- Fat is "bad for you"
- Chicken has to be "real, white meat"
Meat production is largely unchanged over the last hundred years. Poultry production, however, has ramped up and been "industrialized" substantially to match changing demands. That has driven down the cost of poultry. If the sole explanatory factor was that people just don't have the money for red meat, you would also expect to see more people raising chickens at home.
I think there WAS some element of consumer choice in the switch from reduced red meat to increased poultry during the 80's and 90's. There was also however even then some element of being squeezed - esp at the lower incomes. During those decades however it was also a pound-for-pound switch. Since 2002, it hasn't - meat/poultry itself is now dropping and cereals/beans are increasing.
The reality is that putting ALL of that into the category of 'free consumer choice' merely allowed the govt to change the weighting for 'food' in the inflation stats - keep the weighting for 'rent' (the one big expense that is usually the source of squeeze) low - and thus distort all inflation stats in order to produce illusions of higher income and lower prices over time and pretend that there is no actual economic cost in blowing housing bubbles.
Since 2002, it hasn't - meat/poultry itself is now dropping and cereals/beans are increasing.
But cereals are "heart-healthy" and "whole grain"!
Rent is another metric that ain't looking so hot, I'll give you that. Maybe making it difficult to evict people, subsidizing rents through Section 8, and seeking higher property tax revenues through tighter zoning rules weren't such good ideas?
The main problem with 'rent' in the inflation numbers is NOT those sorts of govt rules. The problem with 'rent' in the inflation numbers is its weighting of 9% in the CPI basket. With that sort of weighting, annual rent increases are fucking INVISIBLE in the macro inflation picture. And they get MORE invisible, the more food/etc gets 'squeezed' and instead gets deemed 'consumer choice'. Because deeming those food decisions 'consumer choice' simply means that the weighting of spending changes to reflect the spending of the rich - less on food, more on iphones/recreation/clothing/vacations/etc.
The main problem with 'rent' in the inflation numbers is NOT those sorts of govt rules.
But it IS the cause of the rent increases in the first place. Maybe CPI has the weights wrong (although they haven't changed in at least 30 years), but that doesn't change the underlying dynamics.
Maybe CPI is a poor choice for adjusting incomes. Then, propose a cost-of-living index which works better and can be tracked with actual data. Pew's "67%-200%" crap doesn't explain anything about underlying costs.
But it IS the cause of the rent increases in the first place. Maybe CPI has the weights wrong (although they haven't changed in at least 30 years), but that doesn't change the underlying dynamics.
Well one could also argue that Henry George was right (as Adam Smith, Milton Friedman, William Buckley, and David Nolan thought). Which leads to a slightly different way of dealing with those govt-created distortions.
All of which unfortunately becomes irrelevant when the weighting is so far from reality that the dynamic becomes invisible.
And yes the housing weights/formulae/methodology was changed in the 80's based on a 1982-1984 consumer survey when mortgage rates were 15+% (and homeowners were being squeezed - but NOT because of 'rent' but because of interest rate effect on principal), SS was bankrupt for the first time (ie it was going to tap general funds starting in 1983). All of which now, in today's environment, means that the 'deflationary' effects of pricking a housing bubble by even allowing the market to determine interest rates has 2.5x the weight of actual 'rent'. And like it or not, that is an environment where there becomes even MORE pressure for govt distortions re land/property/taxes to keep housing asset prices high and mortgage debt secure - which will distort 'rent' even more.
If you are trying to say that interest rates need to go up, I agree wholeheartedly.
If you are trying to say that interest rates need to go up, I agree wholeheartedly.
Will you still agree when all the financial markets collapse, 80% of all paper wealth disappears, and the money/exchange system locks up (which means no one can be paid)? Because that is the risk. Just as was on the way to happening in 2008.
And until libertarians can focus on making that scenario survivable for society (vs the nutjob 'survivable for me and screw you all here's some lead'), then libertarian economic ideas are totally hypocritical and deserve to be marginal. Even if 'making that scenario survivable' means using some non-libertarian means to get rid of that most basic economic/market distortion and achieve a libertarian end.
You don't make any sense.
You decry phony wealth then get upset that it might disappear. So fucking what?
Moreover, the interest rates were raised to 10%+ in the early 1980s. The apocalypse did not follow.
I don't know what you want but whatever it is it makes no fucking sense.
Moreover, the interest rates were raised to 10%+ in the early 1980s. The apocalypse did not follow
Yes interest rates were raised then to reduce inflation that was already present (and highly visible) in the economy. It lagged inflation. And even that final tightening created a recession where unemployment peaked at 11% nationally (and 25% in some places).
The difference is that back then, the iceberg (the debt that needs to be rolled over when interest rates rise or that can be paid down if inflation results in higher wages) was equal to roughly 150% of GDP. That sort of leverage could apparently be handled by a decade of stagnation followed by a big painful purge at the end. Today the debt leverage is just under 400% of GDP. There is no 'same amount of pain' here. The only scenarios are Japan (generational stagnation/decline) or the Great Depression (25+% unemployment) or perhaps Greece/Brazil/Zimbabwe (assuming we nationalize all the debt then repudiate the debt and just print money).
I don't know what you want but whatever it is it makes no fucking sense.
It only makes no sense if you are trying to keep annual income/expenditures changes separate from asset/debt changes. But the two aren't separate. Not in real life and not in theory. And one of the effects of the CPI is to link the two precisely so that the 'cost of capital/leverage' can supposedly be determined by the market.
The only scenarios are Japan (generational stagnation/decline) or the Great Depression (25+% unemployment) or perhaps Greece/Brazil/Zimbabwe (assuming we nationalize all the debt then repudiate the debt and just print money).
Can this be averted?
If so, how?
If not, then what is it exactly that should be done? You previously posted your postal bank idea, but a postal bank solves nothing if the government can't pay its own bills (Greece, etc.) or actively wants to subvert its purpose (Japan, maybe Germany). Moreover, people would still need an incentive to want to save their money as such. A bank account that pays no interest and is used to fund transfer payments to the idle is not an investment in any sense of the word.
Can this be averted?
I don't know. I wish I had an easy solution but I don't. Whatever happens, I suspect there will be massive pain. I do think the postal bank helps solve two problems - banking system lockup and dependence on reserve dollar status. Assuming all it does is take deposits and back them with either silver coins and/or very-short-term T-bills (NOT lending to anyone else - and it certainly can't be used simply to justify bigger deficits in future) and sets up some giro thang so no overdrafts possible. It's a checking system not a savings system. That provides a competitive domestic alternative to the Fed's open-market operations and the Fed's settlement/clearance system and can't have the balance-sheet mismatch that messes with bank liquidity. Realistically, probably need to change the tax system too so it is more like Switzerland - three-legged federal base with low marginal rates on consumption, income, and wealth - otherwise a crash just creates bogus tax losses/shelters for one group who will also have inside info.
None of this is intended to fix 'investment' or be an investment. Just simply to be a monetary airhose that is in place and thus prevents threats of extortion/bailout when the next crisis happens. Anarchos would hate it cuz its a govt system. Sanders/Warren/progs hate it cuz it can't fund the free lunch machine. Bankers hate it cuz its cartel competition. Goldbugs hate it cuz it can actually happen. So its prob exactly what will work.
Interest rates can't go up. We would be unable to service the debt if they did.
cereals are "heart-healthy" and "whole grain"!
Except not in China ehhh? In China, they are Reason's evidence of poverty.
That was sarcasm. Hence the scare quotes.
US middle class is only getting smaller
... according to what definition of "middle class"?
If you go by the income quantile definition, strictly speaking the size of the middle class never changes in proportion, only in absolute numbers. The population has grown, thus the middle class has grown. Moreover, when you look at the boundaries of those quantiles over time, they have remained the same or slightly increased in CPI-adjusted dollars since the 1970s. So the middle class, as so defined, is as large and as rich as ever.
If you go by a different definition, well then you're going to have to present that definition.
I personally like to look at the middle class as those individuals and households whk have sizable assets (car, house, etc.) but whose primary source of income is wages. Unfortunately, seeing as that is a personal definition not shared by many professional economists, it would be difficult to gauge the size over time since nobody has bothered to collect the numbers.
There are a number of metrics that are troublesome. The most notable are LFPR and debt-to-asset ratios. However, both of those track pretty clearly with government policies. Pay people to do nothing, and that's what they'll do. Reduce interest rates to zero, or nearly zero, and they'll take on debt instead of saving their money. Fix those policies (and others), and the picture will change substantially (although not overnight).
Oh hell - lets use the definition Reason uses when they blow smoke - http://reason.com/blog/2015/12.....because-th
Just for shits and giggles
... that would be Pew's definition, not Reason's. And it is:
The fundamental counter-point is that, in CPI-adjusted dollars, "67% of the overall median household income" is more than it was in 1970. Everyone is making more money. Some people are making a lot more. So what?
And the reason the middle class is shrinking is that the upper class is growing.
If you take Pew's study at face value, that is only half the picture. According to their analysis, the middle class has shrunk on both ends. But their definition is arbitrary. "Two-thirds of the median" and "twice the median" are statistically meaningless values.
Particularly since it isn't the same people being compared over time. US's immigrants are disproportionately uneducated and poor, plus poorer people disproportionately reproduce.
Yes, but the "movement" to the upper class has been much larger than the "movement" to the lower end.
So what? The whole effect of ignoring PHYSICAL food consumption (here in the US - but not China) is to distort CPI itself - and therefore to distort all those 'CPI-adjusted dollars' over time.
The purpose might also be to juice the agriculture subsidies. Meat and poultry are evil; vegetables and grains are good. If you believe the USDA, CSPI, and other "mainstream" sources.
CPI is being gamed, but it's being gamed both ways. What presently constitutes a telephone is nothing like what constituted a telephone in 1970. How do you even compare things like Internet access to a time when the Internet did not even exist? A lot of things that were luxuries or not even available yet in 1970 are part of today's "basket of goods".
No. The purpose is to distort inflation. That decision started in the 1980s specifically to reduce the annual Social Security increases/expenditures. And that is also why the decision was made to ignore the squeeze. The elderly didn't actually pay a lot in rent (because they tended to be homeowners and mortgage-free) - so the distorted inflation numbers could 'pass' the sniff test for longer.
No. The purpose is to distort inflation.
Well, government policy is to drive inflation and then pretend it doesn't have any negative effects. I don't know if it's true that CPI has been gamed to hide inflation, but I wouldn't be surprised. Maybe the people should stop voting for morons who think Paul Krugman is still an economist.
That decision started in the 1980s specifically to reduce the annual Social Security increases/expenditures.
Whether that justifies gaming the CPI or not, SS should not be increased, period. Increasing SS benefits means people spend more without having contributed increased productivity to justify their spending. You already worked and made your contributions. Once you're collecting, you're out of the workforce (or, at least, your SS check is not for any work you're presently doing). That's more money in circulation with no more to show for it. Bam, inflation. It's not the only or even primary cause but there is a feedback effect.
If people had been allowed to keep their money in savings and use it as they saw fit, the situation would be different. But forcing them to contribute to a Ponzi scheme then using the "solvency" of that scheme as justification to increase the money supply is a recipe for trouble.
SS should not be increased, period
Clarification: SS should be increased for an individual who's already started collecting. The sum total of that person's contributions to SS from the moment they start collecting checks (unless they continue working, but that's a different animal) is never going to change. The only way thus to fund those increases is by taking more from current workers (hence reinforcing the Ponzi scheme nature of SS, i.e. setting up for bigger problems in the future) or by selling/transferring bonds (which is not really all that different from the other option, in the long run).
SHOULD NOT
ffs
We don't disagree about SS. Or probably most govt distortions either. I consider myself libertarian (or classical liberal - not anarcho). What I am saying however is that post-1980's libertarian economics (esp of the Reason type which takes all those govt stats at face value) paints an economic picture (and prescriptions) that are starkly at odds with reality. In large part BECAUSE it relies on those govt stats.
A world where we can just assume/quantify the 'factuality' of people spending less on 'necessities' (the 'shelter' part of housing rather than the 'investment' part, food) and more on importable 'discretionaries' is a VERY different world from one where one of those necessities is squeezing the other necessities for part of the population (while all is irrelevant to the other richer part of the population). The economic prescriptions are different. The assumptions for how the market is currently actually dealing with the problem are different. The recognition of what govt distortions are really the most significant are different.
Accept that these numbers may not be reality - and you can immediately understand both the appeal of Trump (to older voters) and Sanders/Paul (to younger voters). Which is the opposite from the Reason stance of accepting those numbers and thus (basically) defending the establishment/status quo.
I already understand the appeal of those candidates. But voting out of frustration is often no better than voting out of ignorance (esp. the combination of frustration and ignorance). People had 8 years of George W. Bush and decided to elect Barack Obama, who replaced Ben Bernanke with Janet Yellen. That idiot Sanders wants to turn the Federal Reserve into a Soviet politburo. I don't know what Donald Trump is going to do with appointments or policy, although he can hardly be worse than what we've got.
Who the fuck even remembers Paul Volcker, never mind wants to bring about the necessary changes to strengthen the economy?
^THIS^
They changed the formula for calculating CPI specifically to reduce the COL indexing for SS and large labor contracts.
"But, daddy, that's not possible! My social studies teacher in my Amerikan Pulbic Skool Whair I am Bean Tought to Red an Writ told us that our greed is killing the planet and thus we must embrace socialism.... and early death!"
"But people who worry about the new and more expensive eating habits of people in formerly poor countries need not worry too much."
Sure, if you are the type that ignores what science and the seafood industry itself is warning us all about. You would think, Marian, that you're not aware that the acidification of the ocean is increasing from all the CO2 we humans are creating and that is getting absorbed into the oceans.
Coral reefs are dying, the once thriving cod industry in New England is nearly gone, and just this week scientists in Maine said that lobster larvae won't survive if the water temperatures in the gulf keep increasing.
You say human ingenuity and free markets will solve the issue. Sure. If we are smart enough to listen to the warnings from science. And sure, if we create a true free market by accounting for all costs (which is required on a true free market) in energy, by putting a carbon tax in place.
You would do well to read through this.
http://www.seafoodexpo.com/nor.....dustry.pdf
In science, you have to actually test your hypotheses. Just saying "I believe X causes Y" is not science.
"not science."
But it is. It's the first and necessary step in any scientific enquiry. And it's free. Testing is the second step and it'll cost you plenty.
A hypotheses is not a theory, nor is it a fact, and it is never settled.
Almost ALL of the Climate Science is stuck in the hypotheses stage, but marketed as both fact and settled.
"Almost ALL of the Climate Science is stuck in the hypotheses stage, but marketed as both fact and settled."
I disagree. It predicts warmer temperatures and this has been borne out by measurements. That counts for something. Whether it's a theory, a hypothesis, dream or a LSD fueled vision (which was where DNA got its start) is immaterial.
The testing you would be satisfied with is impossible. The world is not a lab.
" but marketed as both fact and settled."
because this is a political issue. Best you come to terms with this.
Thank you, dumb-shit Malthus wanna-be.
You're an idiot of the first order, but you're right about one thing: the fisheries. Stopped clocks, and all that. More exapansive property rights in them seem like the best solution to me.
"Human ingenuity and free markets have a way of satisfying demand in affordable and environmentally sustainable ways."
Nobody is demanding GMO shrimp raised in ponds. This scheme exists thanks to funding from the Australian government, an institution not noted for its ingenuity or its love of the free market.
Nobody is demanding GMO shrimp raised in ponds.
I am.
"I am."
Step forward and name yourself if you're serious about it. Start a petition or something.
I shouldn't have to. Given reasonable property rights in fisheries we'll have the GMO shrimp I desire as a matter of course.
"Given reasonable property rights in fisheries we'll have the GMO shrimp I desire as a matter of course."
You'll get it because the Australian government and others besides thinks it's best for you and is willing to spend tax dollars regardless of the risks.
If this is your sideline, are you Chicken Little in your day job?
I'm pointing out there are reasons why Libertarians should be wary of these schemes.
me too.
me too!
RE: Rising Prosperity Means Getting to Eat More Meat and Seafood
That's ok, because human ingenuity and free markets satisfy increased demand
Not to worry here.
Prosperity will be diminished very quickly once Heil Hitlary is elected.
Her redistribution of wealth program will make Karl Marx, may his name be blessed, red with envy.
"...a 10,000 hectare ... slice of the Legune cattle ranch..."
Nice try, but that would require someone to know what a hectare is. Might as well be measuring land by the tsubo.
I'd thank you for making me look up tsubo but I had to go to the second page to find a result that wasn't a shoe ad. Now instead of learning about a land measurement started by the Shang Dynasty I am wondering how much stock you own.
Since that isn't a good thought I will ponder how badly the media will skewer me if Japanese land measurement becomes an issue in my, imaginary, presidential candidacy. I am certain the word is not pronounced in the way I think it should be.
Nandaka, ore ha weaboo desukedo... tsubo to iu koto ga wakarimasu yo.
*ore wa
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