Bernie Sanders

Bernie Sanders Said Something Sane About Campus Rape—Activists Are Attacking Him

Sanders isn't crazy: rape really is a violent crime that the police should handle.

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Sanders
Sanders

That didn't take long. Victims' advocacy groups are going after Bernie Sanders for asserting that campus sexual assault—like all other kinds of sexual assault—is best left to law enforcement.

In his comments earlier this week, Sanders stated explicitly that rape must always be dealt with as a criminal manner, rather than as an education issue. While that might seem like a stridently anti-rape stance, it actually puts him at odds with the vast majority of campus advocacy groups, who agree that rape is an epidemic and yet believe campus-run show trials that result in mere expulsion are the best way to deal with rapists.

The Huffington Post interviewed several such activists who were dissatisfied with Sanders' comments:

"Advocating for requiring survivors to go to the police shows his lack of understanding of what constitutes equity on campus," said Andrea Pino, a survivor and co-founder of the activist group End Rape On Campus, "and also demonstrates an ignorance of the current lack of police preparedness on this issue." 

Alexandra Brodsky, a Yale Law student and co-founder of the advocacy group Know Your IX, said Sanders has "a lot to learn." 

"Without key interventions by their schools, many survivors won't be able to continue their educations," Brodsky wrote on Feministing, where she is an editor. "An extension on a paper due the week after an assault might make the difference between a victim staying in school and dropping out. No police force can provide that kind of accommodation. Don't want victims 'sitting in a classroom alongside somebody who raped them'? A school can often make that happen more quickly than a student can get a restraining order, particularly if he or she has trouble accessing a court."

The most charitable explanation of their argument for why colleges rather than (or at least, in addition to) the police should handle rape is this: sexual assault is not merely a crime, but a violation of Title IX, the provision of federal law prohibiting gender-based discrimination in higher education. Student-victims of rape have been deprived of their legal right to an education, and thus campuses are obligated to put certain practices into place to help them cope—practices that neglect the due process rights of accused students.

Of course, this argument is something of a tautology. Unelected bureaucrats in the Title IX agency—the Office for Civil Rights—invented the idea that sexual assault is a deprivation of a student's civil rights rather than just a violent crime, and these same bureaucrats are the ones proscribing all the solutions for it.

Activists maintain that students should have the option to report to campus administrators, the police, or both. But it's worth wondering whether this extra path—where innocent people are treated too harshly, and guilty people are not treated harshly enough—deters victims from going down the road that would actually protect the broader community (beyond just the university) from dangerous predators: reporting to the police.

It would not surprise me if the pushback from activists persuades Sanders to walk back his comments. But he should stick to his guns: he's right, in this case. As he said, rape is a terrible crime, and the way it's handled by campuses is insulting.

NEXT: When Should the Supreme Court Overturn One of Its Own Precedents?

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  1. It’s interesting that these activists who ordinarily want everything handled by the government and only the government, want rape–considered a crime by virtually everyone in our society–taken out of the government’s hands. What are they, a bunch of tinfoil hat-wearing teabaggers or something?

    1. Because men must be reduced to second class citizens whose lives can be destroyed on the mere say-so of any woman, without any evidence or right to due process. Because Patriarchy, or something.

      1. The internets were bursting with “David Bowie is a child rapist” soon after he died, because apparently he had sex with a teenage groupie at some point in his life.

        1. I just googled “David Bowie rape” and the allegations against him are pretty ridiculous. One woman claimed he raped her and then said “I JUST EXPOSED YOU TO AIDS,” which is a) cartoonishly villainous and b) somewhat unlikely since to my knowledge David Bowie did not have AIDS.

          1. Oh, and he was cleared of that charge but the article still says “we know he was an abuser.” Again, they really do think an accusation is proof of assault even if there is no actual evidence and the story is unlikely.

            1. Again, they really do think an accusation is proof of assault even if there is no actual evidence and the story is unlikely.

              Exactly.

            2. Maybe he didn’t rape her, but he clearly abused her enough to make her accuse him of something so awful.

              1. “As a groupie, I’m just so shocked that all these rockstars want to fuck me!”

                1. You can’t just fucking allow any bitch in the room when you are on heroine and cocaine.

                  1. Which heroine are you on? Katniss? Jessica Jones?

                    1. Good catch Chipper. Never thought these homonyms until now.

                    2. The heroine that I am on (or at least, wanna be on) is Hillary-Bob Klingon…

                      I WANNA BE HER INTERN!!!!

                      And/or, a threesome, me & her & Billary-Blob…

          2. That is fantastic. Can’t decide if that would be a better addition to dirty talk in the bedroom or trash talk on the basketball court, but it’s such a ludicrous announcement that I need it in my life.

          3. He did have a twisted sense of what some call humor, however.

        2. Isn’t the age of consent in some European countries like 16? So everyone in those countries are rapists according to the SJW puritans, right?

          1. It used to be 16 here as well, at least up into the ’80s, with the stipulation that the minor was no more than 5 years younger (at least that was the law in NJ then). I don’t know when the definition changed to 18. This creates quite a problem with a young couple who are 17 one day, the boyfriend turns 18 the next and she’s still 17. It’s already happened; young men getting the ‘sexual predator’ label for doing something that was consensual and legal for the two of them to do just before he turned 18.

            It also used to be that the parents would have to be the ones to file charges. Now it’s the prosecutor that does, even if all the other parties, including the parents, weren’t having a problem with it. Of course it really only applied to males being the older then (mostly still does really), no one really cared much back in the day if a 16 yo male was making it with his friends mom. A ‘life experience’ it was then, something that would have been publicly frowned upon but not a crime.

            Times have changed.

            1. In WA, whereI live, both pot and 16 year olds are legal. You just can’t give pot to the 16 year old that your’e banging. Or take pictures of any of it. Or sext with them.

        3. Pretty much every one of his colleagues was banging teenage groupies back then.

    2. Well, they also want all colleges to be effectively nationalized so there’s no real hypocrisy – they just want this handled by a branch of government with as low a standard of evidence as possible.

      1. The standard should be low, just as it is in cases of criminal academic “parody” which, of course, are also handled by the police. With higher standards it could be difficult to secure convictions and jail sentences for the perpetrators. See the documentation of America’s leading criminal “satire” case at:

        http://raphaelgolbtrial.wordpress.com/

        1. give it up, dude.

          1. Good point! Just the kind of quality discourse we should be encouraging on our campuses.

            1. Oh come on. You copy-paste this comment in every other thread.

    3. They want rape moved to a less constitutionally limited portion of the government’s hands, since universities are either literally part of the government or are closely aligned with it.

      1. Exactly and the point here is to cripple the futures of white, straight men since they were the cause of the societal disadvantages of everyone else.As is typical, the solution isn’t to open up the world to everyone else through less intrusion, no, the solution is to bring the advantaged down to their level. Brilliant.

        1. harrison. bergergeron.

    4. They’re pulling some judo. They still want the government handling it, they just want to have school inquisition boards be part of the government with the force necessary to punish the accused.

    5. Cops are not the part of the government that they like.

      1. Cops are not the part of the government that they like.

        Oh, yes they are.

        Crushing the throat of Liberty with a pink leather jackboot.

        Manolo, of course.

    6. Most of these universities operate under federal guidelines particularly title IX. There really isn’t a governmental disconnect per se’, triple E.

      In fact, it might be even more pronounced since modern universities are expected to go far above fed rules and provide each student a warm placenta rooted to the sustaining hearth of the earth where chocolate butterflies flit and cozy blankets with soft eyes wander sunlit glades oozing persistent warm breezes that wash ceaselessly across dimpled cheeks ruminating pleasantly on sanguine hammocks strung gently between delightfully bantering clouds wearing slippers and drinking hot cocoa as creamy snacks handed to them from Buddha appear to twinkle with tiny angels wearing nothing but silk pajamas.

      1. That sounds amazing

      2. Sign me up. Who doesn’t love curling up inside a warm maoist placenta.

        1. Please, please tell me that’s a typo.

      3. And all I wanted from my school was a good education. Expectations have changed for sure.

      4. Heroine’s heroin. Just picked up that homonym from another poster and couldn’t wait it use it myself.

    7. It makes about as much sense as having a homeowner’s association handle the investigation of residential burglaries.

      Note to self: Gain control of homeowner’s association and form a secret Star Chamber sub-committee.

      1. If the police regularly either refused to file reports on burglary, made it as difficult and mortifying as possible to report one, or suggested when confronted that the burglary was the victim’s fault because they had windows in their house, people might start going to the homeowner’s association just to try something new. It’s definitely not a good solution, but when the best solution is barely better than none in a lot of cases, people get creative.

        I absolutely see where Bernie is coming from, but his position requires some serious improvements in policing, as well as the resources available to police departments. Conversely I can see how taking rape investigations to the school isn’t a good solution, but the logic in that conclusion is there, given the state of things. It’s a really tortuous logic, but unless you’re extremely fortunate in this country, going to the police can be an extremely tortuous experience.

        1. I should say, too, that while I spoke solely of the police (who are the front line in rape reporting), the deep dysfunction of course goes all the way back into the legal and court system.

          A disturbing amount of people seem to be approaching this, ironically or not, from the perspective that anyone in favor of schools handling sexual misconduct investigation is doing it intentionally to attack white males, as if malice and extremism is of course the only motivation any person in favor of it is capable of.

          But pragmatically, that would be a sensible alternative avenue to pursue for anyone who is dissatisfied with the current possibilities for recourse and feels like we need to try something different. It’s an initial acknowledgement that the whole legal system is woefully lacking. I genuinely DO hope this leads to improvement there, though I bet the hope is unfounded.

          1. Yes, the legal system is lacking., In fact, most of the government is. The Congress, the White House, the Courts. The entire bureaucratic system.

            But you don’t embed within an activist organization all the rights, powers, and privileges of those above institutions simply because you disagree with their functional ability. Especially when that activist organization is not bound by any limits of power, such as the fourth amendment and due process – especially when that activist organization doesn’t care that men are raped far more than women simply because they don’t want to care.

            1. But think of the FEELZ you cisgendred shitlord!

              1. I do think of the feelz of those poor people put out of a crappy education they paid (too much) money for.

          2. I find it bizarre that people claim there should be a low burden of proof on a type of crime that necessarily leaves one of the most useful and damning pieces of evidence behind virtually every time it’s committed.

            So, yes, allow the University to investigate this with their absolute and total lack of even the most basic investigative tools let alone knowledge of criminology or basic civil rights. This ensures the truth is unknowable in a situation where the truth is very knowable.

            Would you fail to report an assault and battery? How about a stabbing? A robbery? A violation of your civil rights? A violation of -your good and warm fuzzy feelings-? Then why would you fail to report a rape unless, in fact, it never happened in the first place.

            Perhaps this is all just a giant admission by the left/feminists/SJW that women really aren’t logical and can’t be trusted to take reasonable and timely action even when it directly benefits them to do so, but I don’t want to believe that myself. It just appears to be what others think of women. I find it baffling that feminists themselves appear to be more driven to reduce women to simple victims than anyone else.

            As far as it relates to the article, it would appear Sanders is setting out to prove that a stopped clock can indeed be correct twice a day.

        2. This is not a good analogy. My homeowners association does do investigations of things like minor thefts and vandalism, because the perps are often children of the residents, and it is considered wise to have the HOA security manager talk to the parents and seek (1) restitution, and (2) corrective action without involving the police. I think that it is a wise policy for things like this. The HOA does NOT investigate rapes or murders or anything serious.

          Problem is the the SJWs like the shaming punishment, and the best way to do that it thru university kangaroo courts. The population of young men see what is happening, and they do change their ways – at least some of them – and this is what the SJWs want. I don’t think they have thought thru this very well, however.

          1. You HOA can’t take your house away. University admin can expel students.

    8. Equally interesting that antigovernment libertarians insist on getting the piggies involved as a first course of action.

      1. Sure, libertarians are totally against due process.

      2. It might seem counterintuitive, but if a person genuinely does believe rape is a myth and that rape reporting is a festival of women lying to destroy men, the police would be that person’s friend in that they have a reputation of making things as impossible as they can for a rape victim to report an attacker. Due process, in the mind of someone who may think this way, invariably means allowing the innocence of the defendant to be known.

        So for the subset of libertarians who are drawn to anti-government movements simply because they feel it’s an expression of their own supremacy, and who identify with victimizers, it makes perfect sense.

        I say subset because every platform has its nutjobs. I don’t purport to conflate libertarianism with said nutjobs. But there are definitely some Infowars folks in the Reason comments.

        1. Or people believe in due process, which is not handed out by an activist organization given the power of the police state by an institution that is paid for and governed by the state.

          If you want to accuse someone of rape, go for it. If you can’t prove it, unfortunately it doesn’t go further. Sad, but that’s true of all crimes.

          1. And that just does not fly with activists.

            I have a close relation who was raped, forcibly, at a campus party, The guy was a friend/visitor of another student so the school had no leverage over him. She did go to the police and prosecutor but it came down to her word against his, as often happens with this crime that can be difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. They decided to not prosecute the offender and he went on his way [and will likely do more of the same]. She did apply for a restraining order which resulted in a hearing and will provide some type of trail at least.

            However, if it were not for that level of proof, many persons would be subject to loss of their inalienable rights to specious accusations. That is clearly not the concern of these activists, as their agenda is to make it as easy as possible to go after guys with as little burden of proof as possible: basically an accusation will do, because the accused are presumed guilty. And they will site whatever studies, statistics [lies, damn lies…you know the rest] and “documentaries” to support their cause to deal with an “epidemic” for empowering schools to sanction and expel without any pesky interference of rights of the accused or due process.

            And thus far, our government has been happy to oblige and even mandate such a practice. My bigger concern is that our future leaders are being inured to this mentality and this does not portend well for the future.

        2. “It might seem counterintuitive, but if a person genuinely does believe rape is a myth ”
          Because there’s a significant number of people who believe that.

          “the police would be that person’s friend in that they have a reputation of making things as impossible as they can for a rape victim to report an attacker. ”
          A reputation that may have been deserved DECADES ago.

          ” Due process, in the mind of someone who may think this way, invariably means allowing the innocence of the defendant to be known.”
          No due process means actually making a case.

          ” and who identify with victimizers,”
          Yet don’t indentify with the biggest vicimizers.

          “So for the subset of libertarians who are drawn to anti-government movements simply because they feel it’s an expression of their own supremacy,”
          No idea what you’re saying here. Are we supposedly all white, rich, straight men who don’t like the government interferring in our privilege?

          ” I don’t purport to conflate libertarianism with said nutjobs. ”
          And yet you’re saying that what libertarians are saying makes sense if they’re all like this, and presumably no other way.

      3. this is absurdly stultifying. Libertarians believe in the nonaggression principle, and rape is an aggression. I cannot believe you are this thick.

        1. He’s not. He’s just a disingenuous troll who’s been haunting this blog for nigh on a decade now, probably operated by a variety of different people over the years for that matter.

          1. A decade…? Damn, has he no life?

      4. Tony|1.13.16 @ 3:57PM|#
        “Equally interesting that antigovernment libertarians insist on getting the piggies involved as a first course of action.”

        Very interesting that a guy who supports murderous governments wants the government out of the issue.

      5. The adjudication of accusations of, and enforcement of violations of, the rights of citizens is nearly the only (or at least, for those of you who prefer a more expansive state, the first and foremost) purpose of government.

        In other words, my disdain for the morbidly obese does not make it ironic that I enjoy eating.

      6. Tony has a point and Bernie is wrong yet again. The victim should be able to choose how to handle this. If a victim does not want to press criminal charges, it should be her choice.

        1. The victim should be able to choose how to handle this. If a victim does not want to press criminal charges, it should be her choice.

          I disagree. The victim is indeed free to decline to press criminal charges, but she is NOT entitled to the choice of punishing her alleged attacker in an extrajudicial kangaroo court.

      7. As you surely know if you’ve paid the slightest bit of attention, minarchist libertarians most certainly do support the role of the police in real crimes like rape (as opposed to fake crimes like owning a gun). Anarcho-capitalists would want the crime handled by private entities, but not unaccountable activists, and they would insist on proper rules of evidence being applied.

        Another thing that’s interesting is how you “progressive” types call the cops “pigs” and the like, but are vociferously cheering for them to slaughter those folks in Oregon for the horrible crime of…well, I don’t know what.

    9. They don’t want to take it out of the hands of the government. What they want to do is sent more men to prison my reducing the evidentiary required standards for conviction to essentially zero (in other words, an accusation is sufficient for a conviction). But they know trying to impose this change on the justice system is – for now at least – impossible, as not enough lunatics are in power yet to get it through. So instead they want to impose such changes on universities and make them serve as a proxy court through which to punish men who are probably innocent of rape and therefore no sensible prosecutor would actually prosecute them or get a guilty verdict if they did.

  2. “An extension on a paper due the week after an assault might make the difference between a victim staying in school and dropping out. No police force can provide that kind of accommodation.

    Because the two are somehow mutually exclusive? Going to the police to report a violent crime precludes the university from accomodating the victim of said crime? This blatant dishonesty says all you need to know about the agenda of these vile people.

    1. I’d actually say that the involvement of the police makes it a lot “easier” for the school to provide such accommodation. “Hey prof, I need some more time because I’m having to deal with a serious sexual assault. Her is my report number from the PD”.

      1. Here’s the problem. They want you to “feel” that sexual harassment is the same as rape, but they don’t want you to “act” like sexual harassment is the same as rape.

        They want access to the petty bureaucracy of trivial complaints.

        “I need a week to regain my composure after living a Katy Perry song” doesn’t get you an extension from the prof.

        1. “I need a week to regain my composure after living listening to a Katy Perry song” should get you an extension.

        2. Exactly. What they want to do is use the accusation of rape as a reason to blackball you out of the school even if you did nothing wrong. They know they will not be able to get the police to take 10% of the cases for which they would toss men out of school for due to lack of evidence.

      2. ^^This!^^

      3. Their opposition to police reporting is telling; it’s not even a matter of being required to report it, obviously no one should have to report a crime. But filing a police report really bears no cost at all (beyond filing a report with the university) for sexual assault victim – unless, of course, they’re lying. One can even file a report and then completely refuse to cooperate with the investigators, thereby avoiding all those horrible things feminists say are evil like police asking the accuser what happened, and there is still no consequence. If the police find no evidence whatsoever of a crime, they simply stop pursuing. The only way it comes back to bite the accuser is if they find positive evidence that the accusation is false.

        And that, I think, is why rape activists are so opposed to the idea of automatically reporting claims of rape to the police: “too many” of the claims would turn out to be decidedly false and the accuser could end up being charged with filing a false report. They know a lot of their stories aren’t merely bullshit, but conspicuously bullshit, and they have to protect the stories and the greater narrative from having a real chance of being subject to rigorous investigation.

        1. ^^This^^

    2. An extension on a paper due the week after an assault might make the difference between a victim staying in school and dropping out.

      Render unto school that which is school’s, and unto law enforcement that which is law enforcement’s.

  3. Prog on prog warfare….delicious.

    1. even more so with fava beans and a nice Chianti

    2. Not gonna lie, there’s something tremendously satisfying about a self-avowed Socialist being eaten alive by his ideologically cousins.

  4. “and also demonstrates an ignorance of the current lack of police preparedness on this issue.”

    But that tenured Women’s Studies professor with her dissertation on “The Cabbage Patch: A Fertile Field for White Cis-Gendered Male Oppression” is clearly MORE prepared to handle the investigation of a violent crime.

    1. Yes, the government agency tasked specifically with investigating violent crime is less prepared and capable of doing so than some random college professors.

      1. Not that the police don’t constantly fall all over themselves trying to prove this numbskull’s point, mind you.

        1. Too true, but they are still a better venue than the school.

          1. It seems like the argument for either requires some wishful thinking/serious structural improvement.

            Like, right now, the comparison is between college administration (as they are at their worst, right now) and police (at the very top of their game, in the future and/or with some serious additional resources and understanding of how to handle complicated sex crime reporting).

            Meanwhile the people on the other side are arguing between college administration (in a future they would like to see where colleges allocate resources to this and are much better equipped to handle it) and police (as they are right now, at their worst).

            So there is kind of a tacit agreement that neither, right at this point in time, is looking good at all.

            1. Of course, the simple solution, to restore parietal rules, is completely off the table. Which is part of the reason why the people complaining about this “problem” come off as completely disingenuous.

            2. Police understand complicated sex crime reporting. And if they don’t, there is a readily available resources with hundreds of years of collective experience in the Department of Homeland Security that’s a phone-call away, just in case the police that have had a college in their town for hundreds of years somehow didn’t get all of the memos.

              But, no, following due process or asking the victim for a rape kit is somehow beyond the pale just because it means that sometimes a crime can’t be prosecuted?

              If a crime cannot be prosecuted, it shouldn’t result in summary action by a third party. I feel the same way about civil suits following criminal suits that were lost. The crime wasn’t proved beyond a reasonable doubt, it shouldn’t still get a punishment. And that certainly shouldn’t be decided by a biased tribunal where you are guilty because of an accusation.

    2. But that tenured Women’s Studies professor with her dissertation on “The Cabbage Patch: A Fertile Field for White Cis-Gendered Male Oppression”

      You talkin’ ’bout Melitha Hawith Pewwey?

  5. Campus advocacy groups oppose rapists being tried in court because that raises the burden of proof. They want it handled “in house” so they can punish accused rapists with little or no proof that something actually happened.

    1. To be fair, most charges are resolved by a plea bargain, and the “burden of proof” in a plea negotiation is not like it says in the textbooks.

      1. Still, there is still an opportunity to go to court, even though the risk of a draconian sentence discourages it.

    2. Something I can’t believe the critics of the rapedemic bunch don’t get. The lack of due process and Constitutionally-guaranteed protections is not a bug to these people, it’s a feature. Arguing the due process angle to them is like arguing the internet is bad because it has so many pictures of naked women on it angle to a teen-age boy.

      1. You’re making the assumption that those pushing this are looking to impose justice on what they perceive as a wrongdoing. They aren’t. They’re interested in power. If they control an avenue to power for young women, they have power over the young women. The young women, in turn, have power over the young men.

        1. I’m not the one making that assumption – I’m assuming that the rapedemic critics are making that assumption. Due process and all that Constitutional protections nonsense only matters if you think they’re pursuing legal justice against criminal assailants, and they’re not. If some guy actually raped you, you want him in jail, not just kicked off campus. If some guy eye-raped you by looking at your ass as you walked by, well good luck trying to get the cops to even listen to your story about how the guy needs to be locked up in jail. But you damn sure can get a panel of Title IX bureaucrats to listen to arguments about aggravated ocular assault with intent to commit bodily scopage as a very-real-and-totally-not-silly thing.

      2. In my case, I’m not make the argument to the rapedemics. As you say their motive is to do away with due process. I just don’t want them to be able to fool the public at large if I can help it.

      3. I would say the bigger error is people thinking they can argue with histrionic activists that they should let the police handle it because they’re are better equipped to do so than the university: that’s precisely what the advocates are afraid of. That some cop might actually do his job and find out that the accused probably didn’t commit the crime, that some jury might dare to look at the evidence and vote not guilty. By keeping everything in their show-trials they can all but guarantee a guilty verdict no matter how preposterous the accusation.

    3. Close. But, not quite. Yes, the burden of proof is part of it. But, not all. Another distinct element is that, since actual rape on campus is exceedingly rare, they want to redefine rape in a way that would never pass muster in society at large.

      1. Sure, since a lot of their careers depend on the presence of the Patriarchy and Campus Rape Crisis. If no real crisis exists, why then just invent one.

        1. Partly. But, also, if you redefine guilt so broadly that virtually anyone is guilty, you have them by the short hairs.

          1. Absolutely, power plays into it as well.

          2. “the short hairs?” Rapist!

          3. “Partly. But, also, if you redefine guilt so broadly that virtually anyone is guilty, you have them by the short hairs.”

            And if everyone is guilty then by selectively enforcing the rules you can create a client relationship based on favoritism and punishment.

            1. How…. is this being presented like a new idea when it is actually how our entire criminal justice system already works?

              1. Even if we accept your outlandish claim that our entire criminal justice system is “selectively enforcing the rules,” why would we then setup the exact same problem but with fewer failsafes for those being convicted by a mere accusation?

                The answer to widespread government dysfunction isn’t exporting that dysfunction to schools and/or private corporations.

  6. … Sanders stated explicitly that rape must always be dealt with as a criminal manner…

    I actually agree with the Berntard about something. Weird.

    1. My socialist friends are lighting up my media devices because of a logical, sound argument from Sanders. It’s like Chrismahannukwanzikah over here.

      1. Stopped clocks, blind squirrels, etc.

  7. “”Advocating for requiring survivors to go to the police shows his lack of understanding of what constitutes equity on campus,” said Andrea Pino, a survivor and co-founder of the activist group End Rape On Campus, “and also demonstrates an ignorance of the current lack of police preparedness on this issue.” ”

    The immense stupidity of statements like this is really breathtaking. First of all, if someone is a dangerous rapist, society is not helped by booting him off campus and then basically leaving him free to rape again. You’re actively putting other people at risk. But if someone isn’t a rapist and is booted off, then he’s been a victim of injustice. Therefore, adjudicating this before deans or campus officials is at best useless and at worst actively harmful to the innocent.

    Secondly, if there is a ‘lack of police preparedness,’ then surely our resources are best spent improving the preparedness of police rather than creating equally unprepared campus tribunals with no actual ability to jail rapists and thereby protect future potential victims.

    1. Stop it Irish. You’re ruining their dreams of becoming Red Guard 2.0 with your stupid logic.

    2. Which shows that it is more about having power than anything else.

      1. There’s a massive rape kit backlog which is a legitimate scandal and instead of spending our resources making sure those kits get tested or improve the system that allowed such a backlog to occur, we waste our time and effort worrying about a college rape culture which doesn’t exist and should be handled by the police even if it did exist.

        1. We should recruit an army of SJW to slog through the testing. Cross contamination would probably wind up with a lot of SJW DNA “found at the crime scene.”

        2. Warty has a rape kit at home. Fully stocked with rope, duct tape and handcuffs.

          1. Warty doesn’t use Gorilla tape?

            Pft. Amateur.

          2. Actually, Warty carries his rape kit in his pants.

            1. It’s like a Swiss Army knife, if a Swiss Army knife was all penises.

              1. The saw penis is the most deadly, and also the most beautiful.

                1. Huh, you are clearly unfamiliar with the corkscrew penis.

                  1. Clearly there is an ass for every dick.

    3. Therefore, adjudicating this before deans or campus officials is at best useless and at worst actively harmful to the innocent.

      No male cis shitlord is innocent, because patriarchy and power structures or something. So whether or not he commited the actual rape in question, he is still guilty of rape.

      1. So, fake but accurate.

        As usual.

    4. g. First of all, if someone is a dangerous rapist, society is not helped by booting him off campus and then basically leaving him free to rape again. You’re actively putting other people at risk. But if someone isn’t a rapist and is booted off, then he’s been a victim of injustice. Therefore, adjudicating this before deans or campus officials is at best useless and at worst actively harmful to the innocent.

      I think you accidentally stumbled upon why activists are specifically against taking these issues to the police.

    5. There you go mansplaining again. Logic and reason are tools of TEH PATRIARCHY, you CIS-HETERO MALE SHITLORD!

      1. I liked it back in simpler times when I could just take pride in being a male chauvinist pig. That was easy to remember. This CIS hetero patriarch shitlord stuff is too difficult to get straight for an old male chauvinist pig.

    6. When these piece of shit Progressive SJW fuckheads say “equity” as if it isn’t an actual word with meaning I just about lose my mind. Hearing them say it causes an almost irresistible urge to punch the speaker right in the face. “Equity” is their “Mao Zedong Thought” and it makes me want to launch a friggin’ one-man pogrom before these little bastards get any more momentum.

  8. First Sanders gets hijacked by the Our Loud Demonstrations Matter people, then by the We’re Against Rape, What About You? people.

    Almost enough to make me feel sorry for him.

  9. “Thank you for choosing Anti-Rape University as your preferred choice of higher education. Anti-Rape University has a lot to offer the next generation of online academics, social justice warriors, and internet advocates. With courses ranging from the post modernist approach to life, to the post modernist rejection of empiricism, Anti-Rape University specializes in educating the ignorant with uneducated material. Courses like, “Is it just me or do you smell RAPE?”; “How to tattle in the 21st century, effectively”; and “How to balance minding your own business with someone else’s business;” Anti-Rape University has just what your overbearing parents had in mind when you were born underweight and jaundice; an obstacle free, feelings-based accreditation so they don’t have to be embarrassed by your stupidity. All this is available for merely 120,000 US so that you can get a job to wean yourself off of your parent’s swollen teat before your mid 40s.”

    “ARUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!” This message brought to you by the downfall of western education.

  10. An extension on a paper due the week after an assault might make the difference between a victim staying in school and dropping out.

    In other words, establishing star chambers and suspending due process for the accused turns on weighty considerations like term paper extensions.

    1. If a student actually gets arrested, I’d think the college should suspend him/her until the charges are resolved. If the student is cleared, he/she should be compensated for the unfairness by getting a couple semesters’ free tuition.

      Sound good?

      1. I mean arrested for a serious offense like assault, rape, burglary, murder etc.

      2. If you get accused of rape as a working person you don’t get shit, so no, no free tuition.

        1. Yeah, but exonerated people *should* be compensated.

          And the college under my suggestion wouldn’t be compensating the student for what the justice system did, but for what the college itself did.

          As for prosecuting someone wrongly, I think your average Joe *should* be compensated in that situation.

          I’m no expert, but I understand that you only get compensated if you’re wrongly *convicted,* and if you’re wrongly *charged* you have to suck it up.

          But that can change, it should change.

          The state should compensate wrongly-prosecuted people, and then the state can reimburse itself out of the salary of the prosecutor.

          1. salary of the prosecutor.

            Which is paid by the tax payer. The college shouldn’t suspend anyone. If they make bail and can handle school while being prosecuted, they should be allowed to do that.

          2. Segregated schools. Boys go to one school, girls to another and xis to somewhere else.

            There. Fixed it for you.

            1. Did I mention that I identify as a Bryn Mawr coed?

              More like Bryn *Rawr!*

              1. Impossible. Xis get their own special place amongst their own special people. Caitlyn Jenner University.

        2. If you get accused of rape as a working person you don’t get shit, so no, no free tuition.

          How’s about a “Free Rape” card?

          Redeemable at any State University?

          /SARC, just in case your meter is broken.

    2. “An assault claim might make the difference in getting an extension on that term paper” I think is the rather obvious sub-text of what she’s saying here. We really have to spell it out for the dimmer-witted amongst us, which is kinda ironic if you think about it.

      1. It’s almost like she doesn’t believe the victims herself . . . .

  11. Sort of on topic. I haz much sad for my alma mater.

    http://www.courier-journal.com…../78655014/

    Since 1846 the law school at the University of Louisville has provided nonpartisan space for individuals to teach, discuss, and research matters of law and public policy. Despite the thousands of partisans who’ve walked its halls, the law school as an institution has remained nonpartisan, preserving its neutrality, and refusing to embrace an ideological or political identity.

    Unfortunately, this long run of institutional neutrality seems headed for an abrupt end. Promotional materials for the law school now proclaim its institutional commitment to “progressive values” and “social justice.” Incoming students and faculty are told that, when it comes to the big issues of the day, the law school takes the “progressive” side.

    1. Sue them for damages to your earned and paid for degree.

    2. “For starters, the chosen brands are divisive, alienating about half the people in the country.”

      Ah, but leftists are never divisive, it’s only divisive when someone *opposes* what they’re doing.

      1. Of course. They have good intentions. Anyone who disagrees must have bad intentions. It is the only explanation.

        1. I was so pissed off by this I broke my rule of “don’t post political shit on Derpbook.”

          Flame war has ensued.

          1. Mention it when they come begging for alum money.

            1. The irony is that they haven’t called me begging since last year when I responded “you’ll get cash from me when you get rid of the Interim Dean.” That was before her support for all this disgusting “I pledge allegiance to the progressive flag” bullshit.

    3. Mitch McConnell hardest hit.

      He is an alum, right?

      1. Yeah, the McConnell Center is located one building over from the law school. Not that I particularly want to have my education associated with HIS ideas either.

    4. Why?

    5. Why?

  12. Looks like the Sanders campaign is going to have to go to the mattresses on this one.

    1. Think he’ll take down Hildebeast?

    2. I think he was a little to quick on the trigger this time.

    3. Well, people are gunning for him.

    4. Only if its a Moscow Mattress

  13. Alexandra Brodsky, a Yale Law student and co-founder of the advocacy group Know Your IX, said Sanders has “a lot to learn.”

    We all have a lot to learn from Yale law students.

    1. What with all of their hard-won wisdom.

    2. Sounds like she wants send him for re-education. Maybe to an isolated plasce where he can learn better, like a camp.

    3. The edifices of that place spill authoritarians like Niagara, babe. We have no choice BUT to learn a lot from Yale fucks.

    4. “Many machines on Ix. New machines.”

      1. Is Dune an artistic or engineering achievement? I was just thinking about what recommends it as good literature, and to be honest very little comes to mind. I can’t recall particularly relatable characters, the plots are high-minded multilayered affairs but there’s no Shakespeare-like poetry to them, Herbert’s prose is plodding and not at all poetic. And yet they’re easily among my favorite books and I have reread the original series several times.

        1. you dont really appreciate just how bad his writing is until you get to the third or fourth book (messiah?). the plot is too convoluted and uninteresting to distract you from his writing and the novelty of giant worms and telepaths and weird genius space amphibians has way worn off. damn is the first one good though (I dont think there’s some deep meaning, it’s just a fun story)

    5. Yeah, I know. Like, free speech is just a social construct and hate speech is a crime.

      Besides, that guy who wrote the Bill of Rights? A slave owner! What the hell does he know about free speech, since he never gave his “property” that freedom?

    6. I recently had an acquaintance simultaneously reveal to me that he’s in Yale law school and that he was thinking of telling his advisor that the reason he’s not doing well in Yale law school is because he’s gay and experiencing severe emotional distress from internal conflict, while laughing about how wicked he is because he’s not gay, you see.

      He’s just mediocre and painfully entitled.

      Evidently, no matter your politics, if you’ve made it that far in life it still doesn’t necessarily say anything good about you.

  14. Huh, Bernie may actually sink his own campaign by being too genuine.

    Kinda makes me feel sorry for him.

    1. I know. I think he said also that gun manufacturers shouldn’t be liable for crimes committed with their weapons. I believe he used a kitchen table analogy

    2. I never feel sorry for socialists. NEVER.

      I gloat when they get their comeuppance.

      1. I worry about that actually, given that whatever is coming up under them is probably far worse.

  15. If you’re serious about addressing rape on college campuses, then you should push for lowering the drinking age to 18. Let American college kids do their drinking legally and out in the open instead of in grubby frat houses where we all know they’re binge drinking anyway.

    1. This presumes there’s a unique problem with rape on campus.

      1. Sometimes fake problems require fake solutions.

        1. Or real solutions. The problem may not exist, but the solution is still a good idea on its own.

          1. And very real to the people suffering them.

      2. There’s a not-unique substance abuse problem on campus!

  16. Sanders will cave. He has to. Sanders’ campaign simply can’t survive without the college student/faculty/administration vote.

    1. I dunno, I’m kind of enjoying the game of chicken the left is playing with itself.

      They can swerve and forgive Sanders for what he says– or ignore it entirely like they did Obama in ’08, or drive on with their point and vote Hillary– which no self-respecting progressive in earnest would ever do.

    2. I don’t think so. Sanders has got the unions. The union is far more effective at getting out the vote than the SJW nitwits.

      1. Except Clinton actually has more national union endorsements than Sanders.

        Clinton – https://goo.gl/eAlCLh
        Sanders – https://goo.gl/tZfIvh

        1. Well, if Sanders has the [X] vote, then Clinton has the [Rich X] vote, that seems to be the pattern.

  17. Is it wrong that I feel some schadenfreude now that the left is starting to eat itself?

    These SJWs are veering dangerously close to becoming this century’s Maoist Red Guards, and you know what happened to those eager young revolutionaries once the Chinese power elite grew afraid of the attack dogs they had created.

    And what is going to happen to these folks once they graduate and attempt to get jobs in the real world? What company, even among lefty ones, is going to consider hiring a candidate who will cry rape and insist on immediate firing of anyone who so much as says “Good Morning” or “Welcome Aboard” to them where they detect a subtext of mild sexual interest in the speaker’s body language or something?

    There’s no doubt that the main reason these activists will keep expanding the definition of rape to include any unwanted gaze, gesture, or even perceived thought. They know the cops would probably never act on a report like, “I felt I was raped because he looked at me wrong,” (unless there was a good chance to get a civil forfeiture out of it, of course) which is why they’d rather keep the entire process on campus where they can count on an always sympathetic audience.

    1. What’s gonna happen? My god, I hope in ten years these vicious little shits are all panhandling on the streets fighting the rats for scraps because no one will hire anyone with a trace of association with the SJW phenomenon. Their spiteful yuppie spoiled brat hissy fits have already ruined the lives of decent people who actually contribute to the world, and they’re busily fucking up what’s left of our culture. If there’s any justice in the world, the acronym SJW will be seen in the same light as NAMBLA.

      1. “fighting the rats for scraps because no one will hire anyone with a trace of association with the SJW phenomenon”

        Are you genuinely envisioning and welcoming another Communist blacklist, in which anyone with political power can for any reason claim that someone is associated with a movement and ruin that person’s life forever regardless of that person’s actual actions or affiliations? You know, like how things will actually work because petty cronyism IS, across the board, our culture?

        Or is every single person who suffers from being associated with SJWs actually guilty of being SJWs in your fantasy? I assume that you are always on the winning side of that little apocalyptic vignette, and that all the people who get the Commie axe are legit Commies as well? Not just someone’s pet enemy?

        Because wow, your guillotine-side tirade sounds a whole lot like the phenomenon you’re decrying in the same breath. You might want to take a look at that, Napoleon.

        1. You preach it, comrade! Your intersectionality is totally non-problematic!

      2. I see them as first into the landfill when everyone gets tired of the progressives pushing too hard.

    2. In the Nineties, there was much hand-wringing over what will do all those English majors do.

      Well, they became university administrators of Diversity and Equity.

      This set of graduates will have jobs, too: they’ll create jobs for themselves in the ever-expanding administrative state and its appendages.

      1. i think the endgame is very slightly under half the population in jail and the other half(+) employed by the prisons. genius! (assuming we can narrow down who is deserving of prison to get under 50%)

        1. Well, since we already know 6 out of 7 men are rapists or abusers, that right there is over 40%.

  18. OT: I am not sure if this has been shared yet, but it sincerely worries me:

    Obama’s Chief of Staff Promises ‘Audacious Executive Action’ in Final Year

    “Process is your friend, but process also dictates what you can do,” McDonough said. “And we do want to make sure that the executive actions we undertake are not left hanging out there, subject to Congress undoing them.”

    TW: National Review’s website.

    1. White House is considering executive action on any and all issues, and that the main question President Obama plans to ask himself is “Why not?”

      1. To some people, “why not” is kind of like “hold my beer and watch this.”

    2. subject to Congress undoing them.

      Nobody told me about this Congress shit when I ran for presidente!

      1. In Obama’s case, that’s probably close to the truth.

        1. Which is sad, since he came out of Congress.

    3. we do want to make sure that the executive actions we undertake are not left hanging out there, subject to Congress undoing them.

      So… he’s going to dissolve Congress permanently, giving regional governors direct control?

      1. Fear will keep the local systems in line.

  19. It would not surprise me if the pushback from activists persuades Sanders to walk back him comments. But he should stick to his guns: he’s right, in this case. As he said, rape is a terrible crime, and the way it’s handled by campuses is insulting.

    Hillary sure is crickets-quiet about the sexy-crime these days. Minefield for her.

    1. Yeah, ever since Trump bitch-slapped her over covering for her husband, she seems to be laying low on that issue.

      1. Not to mention that Hillary defended a rapist at trial when she was a lawyer.

        And frankly, why shouldn’t she? Everyone deserves a trial. Ironically, this may be one position that she will actually be forced by her past to be right about, simply because if she attacks Sanders (or even disagrees with him publicly), the Sanders campaign can come back at her twice as hard and make her own historical participation in the horrid system of trial by jury and unforgivable unwillingness to simply “listen and believe.”

        Imagine that, a progressive feminist politician tricked into unwillingly having to tacitly support due process.

        1. She shouldn’t because it makes her a hypocrite, given her professed ‘belief system’ (I know, Clintons are sociopaths who have no real beliefs, other than in acquiring more power).

          1. I am assuming that she defended him before she ostensibly held her currently stated beliefs (since, after all, it wasn’t politically advantageous at the time to hold such beliefs).

        2. Defending a rapist is one thing, but you don’t have to laugh about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tor00iWUhDQ Not to mention that she’s insinuating that her former client was guilty, which seems unethical for a defense lawyer to do.

          Reminds me of her laughing with glee about Qaddafi getting raped to death: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fgcd1ghag5Y

  20. Sanders isn’t crazy: rape really is a violent crime that the police should handle.

    Wellll…. Sanders is crazy, just not when it comes to campus rape.

    What these activists want is kangeroo courts with no due process for men accused of rape, and the ability for any woman to get any man kicked out of school, ruining his life. They’re not going to get that anytime soon through the normal criminal justice system, so that’s why they’re pushing so hard for these campus star chamber tribunals. It’s as simple as that.

    1. And they figure once they can establish a widely-accepted precedent that a woman’s accusation against a man needs no proof, they will seek to expand that power.

    2. The police are there to handle victimless crimes and the associated asset forfeiture. That’s all.

      For actual victims, you need specious, half-assed, kangaroo courts to extract revenge.

      It’s the only way to ensure that due process is avoided for both victim and victimless crimes.

    3. Guilty until proven innocent.

      And of course, with no procedure allowed that could enable the accused to prove himself innocent.

    4. Guilty until proven innocent.

      And of course, with no procedure allowed that could enable the accused to prove himself innocent.

    5. Yeah, the two aren’t mutually exclusive. I mean, Sanders also believes that child poverty is somehow related to an excessive variety of deodorant, so, let’s not go jumping to any conclusions about the guy.

  21. “Advocating for requiring survivors to go to the police shows his lack of understanding of what constitutes equity on campus,” said Andrea Pino[.]

    Sounds to me like Ms. Pino wants instant justice, ? lex talionis if you will, rather than bothering with filing a complaint with the local constable and presenting evidence.

    1. Andrea Pino – you really want criminals running around campus and not behind bars? Isn’t that true “equity on campus”?

  22. “”Advocating for requiring survivors to go to the police shows his lack of understanding of what constitutes equity on campus”

    Ok. What constitutes equity on campus?

    What does that mean?

    Anyone?

    1. Unisex bathrooms and a urinal in every dorm.

    2. I assume it means Wellesley and Barnard will soon stop discriminating against male applicants. Haha.

  23. “”An extension on a paper due the week after an assault might make the difference between a victim staying in school and dropping out. No police force can provide that kind of accommodation””

    That has nothing to do with Schools “adjudicating” claims of crimes.

    They can certainly make accommodations to claimed victims without playing judge and jury?

  24. Ah, Reason – are you finally seeing the light of reason? After your love affair with Jared Polis, it appears the thrill of find a libertarian among the big government crowd is gone.

  25. “pushback from activists persuades Sanders to walk back him comments”

    Rape Shamans have much federal wampum, wield strong medicine.

    1. After much outcry, Blizzard removed the Rape Shaman character class from their latest update to World of Warcraft.

      1. It was my favorite class to play. At least the totems are still phallic and rapey.

    2. I just assumed this was Robbie’s cryptic way of telling us that he’s an Indian native american aboriginal american first people descended from the beringian land bridge walkers.

  26. Bernie’s really so far off the plantation that he’s eventually going to be ostracized from the party and prevented from getting the nomination in favor of abuela abominable.

    Particularly annoying to the dem establishment is his refusal to go bat shit insane over gun control. The fact that the guy just goes his own way is a huge no no in democrat politics. You will conform, comrade, and you will toe the party lion, or you will go away.

    1. “‘Particularly annoying to the dem establishment is his refusal to go bat shit insane over gun control.””

      Not seeing it

      Nikki said the other day that lefties are very much still frustrated with sanders insufficient gun-grabbiness. I’ve mostly seen papering-over (a la above) his deviation from dogma…. rather than direct criticism.

  27. Some liberals, including both women and men, have tried to be realistic about campus rape claims and the expanded, epidemiological definitions that it is a campus-based phenomenon (and that it became prevalent because of a young woman’s supposed new-found autonomy.) See Zoe Heller in the New York Review of Books regarding Lena Dunham’s extraordinary efforts to include herself as a ‘survivor’.

    BTW, Alexandra-from-Yale has been a longtime proponent of the 1 out of 5 myth, and not just in American publicatons.

  28. In 1992 I was accused of sexual harassment by a female subordinate, saying I exposed myself to her, in West Virginia. I was an officer in a rapidly growing start-up. It was determined, through re-enactment, that her allegations were impossible to have happened. No matter. Her lawyers would not drop the case. And, for a mere $10K, she agreed to drop the charges, charges that she affirmed scarred her for life. All this happened at a sensitive time for me: equity distribution negotiations. As a direct result of her allegations, and the cloud they cast over me, I lost $2 million dollars.

    I am aware sexual harassment/abuse is a reality. But every time I read about a case, I’m dubious. Which is a shame. Because women falsely accusing men of sexual misconduct do a tremendous disservice to actual victims, creating an environment where their accusations are questioned and, sometimes, disbelieved, to the detriment of the true victims.

    1. Dang that stinks. I feel like a lot of lawsuits are extortion schemes anyway.

    2. I hope she rots in hell. I don’t believe in heaven or hell, but nevertheless – I hope she rots.

  29. Dear Colleague: You’ll lose your federal funding if you don’t comply with all Title IX regulations. What’s more important – getting federal money or kicking out a white heterosexual guy? Sure, he’s probably innocent, but that’s not the point. He needs his privilege checked and you need a check from us.

    Get the picture now?

    Your friend – Arne Duncan

  30. It’s because campus “Salem Witch” trials take just an accusation as evidence and rely on the accused to prove their innocence. They can’t be hampered with due process or anything. Didn’t we already know this?

    1. Yes, Alexandra Brodsky has brought back spectral evidence into the hallowed halls of Yale Law School.

  31. Well, he’s hardly the first pol to get in trouble for saying something stupid about rape. It’s just that “stupid” used to mean something like “women don’t get pregnant from rape, because their lady parts magically neutralize evil sperm”; now “stupid” means “rape should be investigated and punished by the criminal justice system”

  32. these same bureaucrats are the ones proscribing all the solutions for it.

    Prescribing?

  33. where innocent people are treated too harshly, and guilty people are not treated harshly enough

    This is the key. If someone on campus really is a rapist, then this pretty much guarantees they’ll never go to jail (until they’re in the “real world” and hopefully get caught & prosecuted).

    Reinforces my thinking that these people don’t give two shits about rape or its victims. It’s just another tool to be wielded, like mass shootings.

  34. It may very well be the case that the nature of the crime of rape means that rape is a particularly difficult crime to prosecute under the principles of American justice–innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and convicted by a jury, and all that. I’m tempted to say “oh well,” given how fond I am of those principles.

    1. Tony – this has nothing to do with your sort. Except the lying shit sorters.

    2. Difficult doesn’t mean impossible. With any witness, whether it’s a purported victim, a foolish defendant who wants on the stand, a random bystander, the cop working the case, or a forensic witch doctor, juries/judges have to try to assign them a credibility value. That applies to any crime, not just rape — even with physical evidence, they have to judge the competence and integrity of the people that collected it, and whether they agree with the assessment of the people who analyze it. It’s unavoidable in any rational justice system.

    3. what is it about “the nature of the crime of rape” that makes it particularly difficult to prosecute? considering rape any differently than, i dunno, beating someone up seems like a remanent of victorian morality, doesnt it? you have to be extra punished for sullying her purity?

      1. Rape is uniquely dependent on the involved parties’ states of mind. Having sex is something people regularly do, so finding traces of the dude’s semen or otherwise proving that intercourse took place doesn’t do shit to prove that a crime actually occurred. The prosecution has to show lack of consent, which is extremely difficult.

        Beating beaten up or robbed or murdered aren’t things people volunteer for, so proving that the act took place is sufficient.

        1. Not sure about that. Lots of assholes regularly volunteer to be beaten up by me, based on their driving.

  35. This is a matter that can only be resolved by lawyers. If Nungesser and the plaintiffs against Rolling Stone wins big, the legal counsel for colleges will very quietly advise the school to defer rape and other criminal matters to the court.

    I would be surprised if “false rape on campus” didn’t become the next slip and fall industry for lawyers. Some of these colleges are loaded.

  36. hey since free -speech zones work so effectively perhaps rape-free zones are next. Then we can make gun-free zones and child-abduction-free zones and pick-pocket-free zones… soon criminals will have nowhere to go and peace will reign, yadda yadda yadda.

  37. You stole my thunder: “It would not surprise me if the pushback from activists persuades Sanders to walk back his comments.”

    I sincerely believe it all could have been so very different — so much better — between men and women. Maybe there’s still hope. See:

    “The Sexual Harassment Quagmire: How To Dig Out” http://malemattersusa.wordpres…..-quagmire/

  38. So my english professor knows more about dealing with rape than a trained police sex crimes investigator? Get the fuck out of here with that bullshit. Expelling a rapist means you’ve just sent a rapist out of his little pond into a big one. Dumbfucks.

  39. I am a pretty extreme libertarian, but here I side with the colleges and crazy feminists. University administrators don’t have the power to fine or jail people, so due process of law really has nothing to do with the issue. The issue is whether a private organization has the right to expel or fire any member or employee at any time for any reason. How can one oppose this as a libertarian? I suppose one could argue that, as recipients of public funds, the universities should be required to follow the same standards as public servants, but this is more an argument for full privatization, not imposition of legal constraints.

    1. jgress|1.13.16 @ 7:41PM|#
      “I am a pretty extreme libertarian, but here I side with the colleges and crazy feminists. University administrators don’t have the power to fine or jail people, so due process of law really has nothing to do with the issue.”

      Neither does your boss at work; that’s the reason you call the cops. Oh, and those universities are NOT private; they are government agencies, or at least largely funded by taxpayer money.

      1. But, as a libertarian, you must concede that your boss should have the right to fire you on similar grounds, e.g. if an accusation of rape brings a bad name on the company?

        I address the point about public funding at the end of my comment.

        1. “I address the point about public funding at the end of my comment.”

          Yes, but that’s a hoped-for hypothetical, not existing conditions.
          When they fore swear all the ‘filthy lucre’ they can make their rules as they please. Now, they work for me.

          1. But what about my point that the university can’t fine or imprison the accused, as a proper court would do in case of conviction for rape? If the penalties were the same as what you’d find in a court of law, then I would say they should also follow the standards of law courts in determining guilt.

      2. Of course, the accused may then sue for defamation – taking down the entire university and the lying accuser.

        Rape accusations qualify for defamation per se (arguably on as many as three theories), so that unless the claim can be substantiated by a preponderance of evidence in a court of law (not a kangaroo court), the plaintiff wins and damages are imputed and need not be proven.

        That could be millions per case.

        1. Sure, I absolutely agree. But suit for defamation is different from the principle that the university should be able to set its own terms for employment or attendance. As a public university, of course, that does give the public some say in what those terms are. The public, or rather the politicians representing them, may certainly decide that students accused of rape should be treated as innocent until proven guilty, but then again they may decide otherwise. I guess what I’m saying is that it’s difficult to make a principled case that administrators should apply the same standards to college attendance as the law does to criminal conviction.

    2. A libertarian should also understand that debating what colleges ought to do is not the same as debating what they have a legal right to do.

      1. This is why the article is mistaken in referring to “due process”. Libertarians don’t, or shouldn’t, believe “due process” has any role outside of law courts; private individuals and organizations can set their own terms in dealing with their subordinates. Often in private business it doesn’t make any sense at all to assume innocence until guilt is proven, e.g. if you’re selling insurance and don’t want to make a risky investment.

    3. But the campuses aren’t doing this simply because they want to. They’re being compelled to with the large government club that is Title IX.

      That said, it’s possible that you may have a point in regard to the use of the term “due process”. Being as I’m not a lawyer, I may be misusing the term. I still think it’s unprincipled and wrong to accuse a student of a serious crime without letting him defend himself.

      To my knowledge, no libertarian here or elsewhere is calling for the use of government force to stop colleges–at least, genuinely private colleges–from mistreating male students in this way. But any involvement by a government official or politician should absolutely be stopped.

  40. Forcible rape is a crime, and MUST be dealt with as such. Now, as to all the “extras” a campus environment could provide, reporting to the police does nothing to preclue any or all of that. Come ON…. report the crime, then take a copy of the report to admin, and if you need time for that exam, let the admin deal according to reason, protocols, whatever. Criminal activity is NOT a campus issue. If Susie came home to her dorm room having been kicked in and her stuff stolen, police are the proper authority to deal with it. Now if its another student, that student should be expelled, with prejudice, IN ADDITION to his criminal charges for breaking and entering, and the robbery.

  41. Just more proof that feminism is driven by hate of men and only by hate of men and cares nothing for equality, the rule of law or democracy!

  42. If the NBA can forcibly remove Donald Sterling for being racist off the clock, the whack-o libs on college campuses will sure as hell hold witch hunts of their own.

  43. Bernie has gone head to head with Obama’s DoE on this one, since it is they who created the “epidemic.”

  44. $85 an hour! Seriously I don’t know why more people haven’t tried this, I work two shifts, 2 hours in the day and 2 in the evening?And whats awesome is Im working from home so I get more time with my kids. Heres where I went,

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  46. And with about half of all rape complaints being false we certainly wouldn’t want to require guilt be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, would we? Just think how embarrassing that would be to the women who lie. (Never mind the men falsely accused.)

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  49. I have a close relation who was raped, forcibly, at a campus party, The guy was a friend/visitor of another student so the school had no leverage over him. She did go to the police and prosecutor but it came down to her word against his, as often happens with this crime that can be difficult to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. They decided to not prosecute the offender and he went on his way [and will likely do more of the same]. She did apply for a restraining order which resulted in a hearing and will provide some type of trail at least.

    However, if it were not for that level of proof, many persons would be subject to loss of their inalienable rights to specious accusations. That is clearly not the concern of these activists, as their agenda is to make it as easy as possible to go after guys with as little burden of proof as possible: basically an accusation will do, because the accused are presumed guilty. And they will site whatever studies, statistics [lies, damn lies…you know the rest] and “documentaries” to support their cause to deal with an “epidemic” for empowering schools to sanction and expel without any pesky interference of rights of the accused or due process.

    And thus far, our government has been happy to oblige and even mandate such a practice. My bigger concern is that our future leaders are being inured to this mentality and this does not portend well for the future.

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  52. These Kangaroo Kourt Kampus trials are an affront to every citizen. The legal process is designed for the greatest fairness, protecting the rights of the falsely accused (think 4th thru 6th Amendments) and the rights of the victim-and potential future victims (think legal penalties). And the percentages for falsely accused are staggering, from the FBI statistics.

  53. What do colleges do in those rare cases where men are the victims?

    Nothing.

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  61. Victims’ advocacy groups are going after Bernie Sanders for asserting that campus sexual assault?like all other kinds of sexual assault?is best left to law enforcement.

    RE: Comrade Bernie’s Believing Campus Sexual Assault is Best Left to Law Enforcement
    Sarcasm Switch On:
    Comrades! Please forgive Comrade Bernie for this statement. He is off his stupid meds and is currently thinking like a sane person instead of the socialist slaver we all know him to be. What Comrade Bernie really meant was that public opinion is more than sufficient to try, condemn and even sentence any one even suspected of sexual assault. He will be the first to tell you that, in any true socialist slave state the suspect is guilty until proven innocent, and then found guilty anyway…just to be on the safe side. This tried and true method has worked in Stalin’s Soviet Union, Mao’s China, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, Castro’s Cuba, and in most of our re-education camps of higher education. Even our ideological cousins, the fascists, have used this method with considerable success in weeding out the weak, the doubters, the apathetic and the innocent. So please forgive Comrade Bernie for his temporary insanity and continue to believe him when he says he can lead our beloved republic into a true socialist slave state.
    Sarcasm Switch Off

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  65. Vote for Bernie. Free LSD for everyone!!

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