Ferguson Introduces Establishment Journalists to Militarized Cops, Obama: More Work to Do in Iraq, European Economy Sputters Anew: P.M. Links

• 

  LiveLeak

  With a peek at events in Ferguson, journalists in the established press discover that modern cops have a lot of stuff that goes BOOM! and like to use it.

• Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) says the "scenes we continue to see in Ferguson resemble war more than traditional police action," while President Obama makes soothing noises.
• The siege of Mount Sinjar has been broken, says President Obama. Now we have the rest of the country to save.
• Rep. Hank Johnson (D-Ga.) wants to stop the free transfer of military equipment to police forces.
• Woodstock was 45 years ago this weekend. Get over it, Baby Boomers.
• The Internal Revenue Service was pretty free with taxpayer data, handing it to contractors without checking them out first, says Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration.
• Europe's economy stalled in the last quarter. Again.
• Berlin bans Uber. That sort of thing can't have any effect on the lousy local economic situation, can it?

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Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

...journalists in the established press discover that modern cops have a lot of stuff that goes BOOM! and like to use it.

Is it shiny enough to hold the MSM's attention?

[Aresen]

Yeah. The MSM "discovered" police militarization. Radley Balko remains an unperson, however.

Also, the comments on the CNN link are depressing.

[Tonio]

Now is not the time, but once the dust settles on the Ferguson situation it will be time to take the MSM to task for ignoring this for so long.

[Root Boy]

And...the left thinks libertarians are absent from the discussion (a blog of a blog of CNN apparently):

http://minx.cc:1080/?post=351169

[Virginian]

Incidentally, I'm very willing to bet an amount of money that the very term "militarization of police" was invented by the writers at Reason. Certainly they've been the ones repeating it, frequently, thus giving L.Z. Granderson the very words he uses to claim that Libertarians (and conservatives) aren't discussing this issue

Nice.

[Ted S.]

Are they just copying the WaPo hit piece from yesterday?

[Brandon]

Nope. L.Z. Granderson is an original moron.

[Knarf Yenrab!]

CNN, ABC, and Wrigley Field are where the unemployed people go during the day.

Those who feed their families while shirking labor troll more refined sites.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Berlin bans Uber.

You know who else tried to move people out of Berlin?

[C. Anacreon]

Allied Van Lines?

[Tonio]

Cute.

[Pl?ya Manhattan.]

Dude! Where have you been? I wanted your take on the Robin Williams/depression situation.

[C. Anacreon]

Just got back from vacation in the north woods of Wisconsin. Had very limited internet access.

[Tonio]

Gen Eisenhower?

[Sevo]

Naah. Marshall Zhukov.

[Tonio]

Better.

[Sevo]

Heisenberg!

[Andrew S.]

You're damn right.

[gimmeasammich]

Are you certain?

[Notorious G.K.C.]

ISWYDT

[Sevo]

NICE!

[CE]

Say my name!

[Bobarian]

JFK?

[Jordan]

What about Unter?

[RBS]

You mean ?ter?

[Jordan]

Don't be a grammar Nazi, bro.

[Invisible Finger]

Schnellzug f?r Fronturlauber?

[Tonio]

Not really a "who", but good anyway.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Uber?

[BardMetal]

Taxis Uber Alles

[Square]

How will Deutschland ever again be Uber Alles?

[Bill Dalasio]

or Uber Allies.

[Ted S.]

Terri Nunn?

[Invisible Finger]

Getting IN is more likely.

[PapayaSF]

The Red Army?

[C. Anacreon]

Woodstock was 45 years ago this weekend.

I wasn't there.
I'm about the only one over 50 in the USA to admit that.

[Citizen Nothing]

I was only 8, but I was running the sound board during Country Joe McDonald's session. True story.

[Tonio]

Sounds fishy to me.

[Citizen Nothing]

Nice.

[Bobarian]

I was 4, and trippin' balls on the brown acid.

[toolkien]

I was 1 and I was Tim Hardin's smack connection.

Sorry about that...

[Zeb]

Over 60 now. Unless there were a lot of pre-teens there.

[Virginian]

My cousin was in the Navy. One Thursday night, a couple buddies came up to him in the barracks and said they were driving up to some concert in upstate NY, and that he should come with. He couldn't go, because he had the duty on Saturday.

So that's his Woodstock story.

[Ted S.]

Bethel isn't upstate.

[MP]

Anything north of Westchester County is upstate.

[Square]

My father in law was there. According to him it wasn't a whole lot of fun. Shitty sound system, overcrowded, raining, etc.

I don't think it became cool until significantly later, and maybe only because of the Joni Mitchell song (who was NOT there, by the way. . .).

[MegaloMonocle]

Can't remember the details, but I read one story of a guy who missed Woodstock.

Of course, he was in the town where all the bands stayed going to and from Woodstock, and they all put on shows there, so he actually came out ahead, as far as I am concerned. What with having a bed, a bathroom, and meals to go with his drugs and music.

[Square]

That sounds awesome. My father in law's biggest complaint was that you couldn't even tell who was actually playing at Woodstock - the music was just a wash of background noise.

[Toom Tabard]

Would it be fair to say it was the LSD or 'shrooms?

[JW]

I'm you're age and wasn't there.

OTOH, my 62-year old B-i-L was there and has a picture of him in the crowd, on a web site, to prove it.

[jmomls]

*Woodstock was 45 years ago this weekend.*

And the stench is JUST NOW BEGINNING TO DISSIPATE.

[Greg83]

My dad claims to the last legitimate ticket holder admitted. He said they ripped his ticket at the gate and then immediately afterwards the loudspeaker announced it was a free concert. What a sucker lol.

My mom says she was going to go but her "friends" convinced her it wouldn't be any fun.

[PapayaSF]

I went to college with a guy who had a chance to go but thought "Naw, I really ought to study this weekend." It was especially funny because he was not at all the sort of person to do that. The one time he tries to be good....

[Fist of Etiquette]

The Internal Revenue Service was pretty free with taxpayer data...

Luckily they'll be nowhere near your medical information.

[Root Boy]

And luckily for them, there are no consequences...unlike for us proles.

[Ted S.]

They only lost 1.4 million taxpayers' info?

[jmomls]

That's pretty much everyone in the country who is still paying taxes, innit?

[rts]

Canada-U.S. price gap measures coming in the fall

The federal government is poised to introduce legislation in the fall to try to narrow the consumer price gap between Canada and the U.S.

Not on the table, of course, are all the tariffs, taxes, etc., that make Canada less competitive and hence more expensive to do business in.

[Dammit, not again]

that make Canada less competitive and hence more expensive to do business in.

???

Note that Canada is #6 here and we're #12:

http://www.heritage.org/index/ranking

[Fist of Etiquette]

The siege of Mount Sinjar has been broken, says President Obama.

ISIS is on the run.

[Tonio]

But what about the siege of Ferguson, MO.

[JW]

Did the undertaker draw a heavy sigh?

[C. Anacreon]

Ha! Just about to leave to join 50,000 others at a Paul McCartney concert, the last event ever before they tear down Candlestick Park in San Francisco. I've never seen a Beatle live before so I'm pretty psyched in that regard. Also, I just heard there will be over 900 pyrotechnic effects during the three-hour show. Plus, we actually have seats on the main "floor" (infield)!

[Sevo]

I hope they prop McCartney up so he looks live!

[kinnath]

while President Obama makes soothing noises.

Not to worry my child, the head Kenyan in charge will take care of everything.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Rep. Rep. Hank Johnson (D-Ga.) wants to stop the free transfer of military equipment to police forces.

Classic teabagger.

[Tonio]

ISWYDT.

[Bobarian]

Is that why he's a Rep. Rep.?

[PD Scott]

Hank's just afraid of reaching a tipping point.

[antisocial-ist]

This is by far the most intelligent, responsible, and decent thing he's ever said.

[JW]

Why, oh why, did it have to be Admiral Guam?

[alan_s]

NTTAWWT

[Sevo]

"Economic growth in the eurozone sputtered to a halt in the second quarter, official data showed on Thursday, as Germany contracted and France stagnated again."

Imagine what would happen if we didn't subsidize their defense! That house of regulations might collapse.

[Corning]

In all honesty I think they simply would not spend anything on defense and Mongolia would conquer it. Modern Europe is defined by its complete apathy towards its own preservation.

Not that that is a bad thing.

[Drake]

Maybe the Golden Horde will actually bring gold this time.

[Sevo]

"Modern Europe is defined by its complete apathy towards its own preservation."

I disagree! They beg us to defend them and then gripe about 'cowboys'.

[Pro Libertate]

Yes, that apathy would end the day we said, "Good luck with Russia and the jihad. Later, suckers."

[PapayaSF]

They're slowly being conquered by Muslims.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Europe's economy stalled in the last quarter.

And they'll get on with fixing that right after their August vacation.

[Jordan]

Did the Republicans drive it into a ditch?

[Restoras]

+1 Slurpee

[Ted S.]

Unexpectedly, of course.

[Jordan]

Berlin bans Uber app, citing passenger safety concerns

As I told Tony in a previous thread, progs define "risk of harm" so broadly that they support criminalizing pretty much every behavior.

[PapayaSF]

Except things like gay male sex, single motherhood, sex work.... (Not that I think they should be criminalized, just that there are interesting exceptions to their perceptions of "risk of harm.")

[Winston]

So why do Canadians love Obama so much? I guess it has do with the fact that he doesn't support bombing Iraq or ousting its government...oh wait.

[Sevo]

"So why do Canadians love Obama so much?"

Duh! 'Cause he'd not ruining *their* country!

[Ted S.]

Is it really Canadians in general, or the Canadian chattering classes?

[Winston]

Canadians in general it appears.

[Fist of Etiquette]

...while President Obama makes soothing noises.

Remember when his speeches fixed everything?

[Sevo]

No, I don't.

[Bobarian]

Remind me again?

[Andrew S.]

I once watched an anime movie about a girl whose voice had the power to create miracles.

Obviously it was secretly about Obama.

[Drake]

Miracle tentacles?

[Ted S.]

The Incredible Mr. Limpet?

[Knarf Yenrab!]

So cynical. The man caused a pause in global warming with a speech, people. Show a little respect.

[Winston]

Didn't Dave Weigel say that Ferguson is the fault of libertarian decentralism? You know for a guy who used to be a Reason editor..

[Dammit, not again]

Didn't Dave Weigel say that Ferguson is the fault of libertarian decentralism? You know for a guy who used to be a Reason editor...

[citation needed]

[Notorious G.K.C.]

"Many were confused by Sen. Rand Paul's (R-KY) apparent silence on the situation in Ferguson. It turned out that he was penning a definitive article for Time in which he insisted that the police must be demilitarized....

"It is shocking to learn today that so many on the left appear utterly unaware of the vigorous debate conservatives have been engaging in over the increasing militarization and heavy-handedness of the police."

http://hotair.com/archives/201.....nt-issues/

[Tonio]

Yeah, they're putting up a good appearance of being unaware. I don't think that will stand up to scrutiny.

[BardMetal]

I don't know, have leftists ever shown any degree of self-awareness? How many rich leftists attack the wealthy for example? Maybe they'll telling the truth about being completely unaware.

[CE]

"Where are the libertarians?", they asked.

Making more sense than you once again.

[Winston]

You Know Who Else in Missouri thought the People should deal with criminals rather than the corrupt and incompetent cops?

[Tonio]

Damn, that's a tough one.

[Notorious G.K.C.]

Lilburn Boggs?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1.....tion_Order

[antisocial-ist]

Josey Wales?

[Drake]

I reckon so.

[Bobarian]

Dying ain't much of a livin', boy.

[Pro Libertate]

Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms.

[Invisible Finger]

Hitler?

[gimmeasammich]

John Ross?

[gimmeasammich]

Ross spent a dozen years and tens of thousands of dollars of his own money to get a Concealed Carry law passed in Missouri in 2003 (and to override the governor's subsequent veto of it), despite not personally needing the law, as he is an auxiliary police officer and firearms instructor for many Missouri departments.

FYI I've shot his personal .500 and it's awesome. Also shot his full auto Swedish K, which was even awesome-er.

[Ted S.]

Robert Ford?

[gimmeasammich]

+1 eating of Jesse's bread and sleeping in Jesse's bed

[PapayaSF]

John Brown?

[CE]

Dwayne Bowe?

[Knarf Yenrab!]

Berlin bans Uber. That sort of thing can't have any effect on the lousy local economic situation, can it?

The Berlin Senate said in a statement explaining its decision Wednesday that it was an unacceptable risk to public safety that passengers be transported in unlicensed cabs by unlicensed drivers. But it added that "the basic thought of protecting the taxi business also plays a role."

What a goldmine of cronyism and public health idiocy.

Germany has made a series of bad economic decisions lately. After years of being Europe's breadwinner, they implemented the nation's first minimum wage law for around $12 an hour, and now this protectionist bs. It's like they couldn't bear to watch the rest of the Eurozone going to hell without joining the party.

At this rate, the EU is going to be courting Canada to bail out the rest of the incompetents.

[Invisible Finger]

Deutschland, the cradle of socialism, the hospice of civilization.

[CE]

The city that made "Uber" a dirty word in the first place.

[Invisible Finger]

Brussels made them do it. (future excuse)

[jmomls]

BACK OFF BRUSSELS!

[CE]

Brussels better not sprout off again.

[Winston]

They said that if I voted for Romney then I would see race riots. Well I did and look what happened!

(PS: No, I didn't actually vote for Romney)

[CE]

There's a 47 percent chance you're still to blame.

[waffles]

Get over it, Baby Boomers.

Seriously.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Randy Marsh's flashback was classic.

[PD Scott]

Know when to sell them: Kenny Rogers's Atlanta mansion is for sale.

"Country music icon Kenny Rogers has listed his Atlanta home for $4.8 million. The 11,964-square-foot mansion features six bedrooms, eight full baths, four half-baths, an elevator, 10 fireplaces, a home theater and a Roman spa. The 1.26-acre property also includes fountains, a sports court, a pool, a spa and a swim-up bar."

There appears to be a copy of Michelangelo's David wearing trunks (or a kilt?) in the exercise room.

[Knarf Yenrab!]

The 1.26-acre property

A mansion situated on a postage stamp. What is the world coming to when filthy rich people have to live within earshot of their neighbors?

[BardMetal]

I always thought giant mansions on tiny lots always looked a little ridiculous. If you can buy a house that big why not buy some land to put around it?

[C. Anacreon]

A lot of people don't want the hassle of lawns and gardens. I agree with you, but that's the explanation I've heard.

[BardMetal]

Just plant an ass load of trees and sell carbon credits to stupid guilt-filled hippies if you don't like mowing.

[thom]

I you can afford that house you can afford a gardener and a lawn service.

[robc]

My Louisville house was on a .15 acre lot. Mowing was a fun biweekly task.

[CE]

It's liberals. They think it will look bad if they pay a bunch of orphans slave wages to tend to the grounds. (Adjusts monocle.)

[PD Scott]

Personally, I agree with you, I'd want a nice big plot of land. How much do tiny lot big mansioners (or most people with tiny lots) actually use the grounds anyway?

Not to mention his place is inside the Perimeter, I believe, and big chunks of land in nice neighborhoods are hard to come by.

[Knarf Yenrab!]

I think that's it. Kenny probably has a ranch-mansion situated on 200 acres for country living, while this was his city-mansion for when he was in the mood to hear his yuppie neighbors' swinger parties and the comforting drone of Atlanta traffic.

[Zeb]

Because you want to be close to town?

If I had the money and wanted a mansion, it would be out of everyone's sight and up a very long drive way.

[MegaloMonocle]

3 acres. Not a blade of grass. Heaven. Kinda peeved about the saguaro that got toasted by a lightning bolt just outside the front door, though.

[Invisible Finger]

Stupid redneck. My basement had a swim up bar last year.

[Ted S.]

And then the floodwaters receded. 🙂

[CE]

And he had to deflate his yacht.

[Jerry on the sea]

Twitter starting to wonder why Hillary Clinton has not addressed events in Ferguson, Mo.

[Tonio]

She's triangulating...

[Knarf Yenrab!]

She was waiting for Sen. Paul to state his position first.

Now she can pound the desk and declare that the deed is done, obviating the need to investigate police militarization further.

[VG Zaytsev]

What difference, at this point, does it make?

[Ichabod]

She is busy organizing a humanitarian aid drop of 21,135 copies of Hard Choices, so that the entire population of Ferguson can read of real hardship and oppression.

[MegaloMonocle]

Give her a minute. YouTube is a big place, and it can take awhile to find a video to blame things on.

[Toom Tabard]

Good one! Although she probably has lots of minions to do her searching for her.

[CE]

Because she's an authoritarian and reflexively on the side of the police, but it might look bad to say so?

[Coeus]

Blogger is pissed that someone forgot to mention a bullshit rape accusation one time.

Max Temkin, one of the creators of the wildly popular indie game Cards Against Humanity, was accused of rape last month. He denied the allegation then, bemoaning how it would "haunt me for the rest of my life." Turns out, it haunted him for about... four weeks.

Today, The New York Times Style section published a nice little puff piece about Temkin and his game with no mention of the accusation. It focuses on Cards' success with young, hip New Yorkers and Temkin's charmingly edgy persona. It does not point out the painfully recent kerfuffle in the gaming community over the alleged sexual assault and Temkin's pat, unapologetic response to the accusation.

For those who missed it the first time: A woman who attended college with Temkin at Goucher accused him of raping her in a Facebook post on July 13. She wrote,

[C. Anacreon]

A woman who attended college with Temkin at Goucher accused him of raping her in a Facebook post on July 13

Raping someone on a facebook post sounds painful. Is that anything like a fence post?

And seriously, now anything someone posts on the internet about someone should be automatically included in their biography?

[CE]

What about the right to be forgotten?

[Notorious G.K.C.]

"accused him of raping her in a Facebook post"

You can rape people over Facebook?

[Coeus]

It's like a poke, but poke-ier.

[Citizen Nothing]

Ok. I laughed.

[MegaloMonocle]

What you might call, a "prick".

[Bardas Phocas]

The 21st century is just getting better and better.

[trshmnster the terrible]

Yeah, you might like it!

[Gluesponge]

Now you know why Facebook bought Oculus Rift...

[BardMetal]

I love how being accused of something by some random person on the internet automatically equals guilty.

[Coeus]

Also. people were pissed that he had the temerity to deny it.

[C. Anacreon]

Of course, because there has never been a false rape accusation.

[Sidd Finch v2.01]

The comments link to this.

Actual examples from the deck include, on a black prompt card: "During Sex, I like to think about _________." White cards include answers like "child beauty pageants," "child abuse," "Morgan Freeman's voice," "coat hanger abortions," and "Former President George W. Bush."

In other words, the game is designed with the sole purpose of bringing out the absolute worst in people.

For 19-year-old Jonah Miller, a one of the cards crossed a line.

Jonah, who identifies as transgender, discovered while playing one evening that one of the white answer cards read, "passable transvestites." Hitting too close to home, Jonah lit the card on fire, posting a photo to his Tumblr and Instagram accounts with the caption "DEATH TO TRANSPHOBIA."

Game cocreator Max Temkin saw Miller's post and responded by expressing regret for including the card, while noting that the particular card has not been part of the newly produced games for some time.

[Coeus]

For 19-year-old Jonah Miller, a one of the cards crossed a line.

Jonah, who identifies as transgender , discovered while playing one evening that one of the white answer cards read, "passable transvestites." Hitting too close to home, Jonah lit the card on fire, posting a photo to his Tumblr and Instagram accounts with the caption "DEATH TO TRANSPHOBIA."

Guess we know why she still goes by Jonah.

[Ted S.]

I'd have thought Jonah was an ex-woman turned man.

[Invisible Finger]

Why would a tranny want transphobia to thrive??

[Invisible Finger]

Pardon my reading comprehension.

But what is phobic about "passable transvestites"?

[trshmnster the terrible]

All transvestites are "passable!" It's a redundant phrase and therefore a micro aggression! /Transplaining

[trshmnster the terrible]

Replace Trans with Islam, and I think I've read this before. I think somebody gets beheaded at the end.

[BardMetal]

Temkin is setting a bad precedent if he is going to start removing cards from his game everytime someone says they're offended.

[Invisible Finger]

I thought offending was the whole purpose of the game.

[Christophe]

Only offending the right type of people, jeez.

[Knarf Yenrab!]

The purposefully offensive humor, it has offended me!

[lafe.long]

Jeezuz... if people get offended by this kind of thing, they must have really sucked at MadLibs.

[Ted S.]

Why should you be anything but unapologetic if you sincerely believe the accusation is bogus?

[Sigivald]

"scenes we continue to see in Ferguson resemble war more than traditional police action"

Riot-busting is pretty traditional.

And I'm unaware of Ferguson PD machinegunning or bombing protestors, or putting them in POW camps without trial.

Paul is increasingly losing his appeal when he opens his mouth.

(Now, I'm all for him on demilitarizing police, especially SWAT, culture. But ... the statement he actually made there is just baffling.)

[Citizen Nothing]

...Tulpa? Is that you, bro?

[trshmnster the terrible]

Nah, too coherent

[Invisible Finger]

But copsucky enough to pass.

[Restoras]

'resemble' not 'actual'.

Do the cops look like cops - or do they look like soldiers? Do the vehicles look like cop vehicles - or do they look like army vehicles?

re?sem?ble
ri?zemb?l
verb
have qualities or features, especially those of appearance, in common with (someone or something); look or seem like.

[Pro Libertate]

It's a pretty strong tradition in the U.S. to not have a military-like police force or to have centralized law enforcement. Naturally, both of those are going away. But Paul is totally wrong to note that.

[CE]

Remember all those people who complained that the German people didn't speak up or try to stop the Nazis before it was too late? That's you bro, and definitely not Rand Paul.

[Corning]

Woodstock was 45 years ago this weekend. Get over it, Baby Boomers.

I was born after 1969...but I will not get over this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjzZh6-h9fM

ever.

[Raven Nation]

I've heard from a number of sources that this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=607eFLYuJ_g

was one of the great live performances of all time.

[PapayaSF]

Based on the movie, my favorite might be Alvin Lee and Ten Years After.

[PD Scott]

Synthetic molecule uses salt to trigger destruction of cancer cells.
A team of international researchers has developed a molecule capable of triggering cancer cell death by carrying chloride into cancer cell membranes. The molecule flushes the cells with salt and causes them to self-destruct, potentially paving the way for new types of anti-cancer drugs.
However
One complication the researchers will have to overcome for its molecule to be used in cancer treatments is limiting it to cancerous cells. As it stands, the molecule triggers the death of both cancerous and healthy cells so the team will need to modify the synthetic transporter to bind only to the more cancerous ones.

[Jordan]

Yeah, that sounds like a pretty bad side effect.

[antisocial-ist]

I can cure any disease with my 45, but the survival rate is kinda low.

[Ted S.]

Or this side effect

[Sidd Finch v2.01]

So they found a really advanced way to inject bleach?

[PD Scott]

Okay, try this: sting the cancer.
Scientists say initial trials show toxins in the venom can attack cancer and stops the out-of control growth of the cells.
However 2:
Lead researcher Dipanjan Pan from the University of Illinois told CNN his team is working to eliminate the toxin's bad side effects like blood clots, swelling, and heart damage.

[Coeus]

Wienstein decides he's balko now, conveniently forgets he's been a champion of arming only police for years.

Don't Call the Police "Militarized." The Military Is Better Than This.

How, then can anyone say that the police in St. Louis County, and all over America, are not militarized? Because the cops aren't acting like soldiers. They're acting like extras in a Michael Bay movie playing soldiers.

Despite their expensive costuming, the police in Ferguson are putting on an unsophisticated, unscripted performance, a copy without an original. If these cops were to take a page out of the Army's book on crowd control, it would be an improvement. But they seem to be making up tactics to go with the gear they've acquired.

[paranoid android]

But they seem to be making up tactics to go with the gear they've acquired.

Gear that they acquired from the...?

[Jordan]

Tea Party?

[PD Scott]

I'm pretty sure it was us libertarians who have been recklessly arming police forces, bribing them with toys to keep the poor down.

[Raven Nation]

That's pretty close to something Tony said on an earlier thread.

[alan_s]

That's dumbfounding, even coming from Tony. Apparently, one can go years arguing with people without ever hearing a word they say.

[Suthenboy]

The person posting under the name Tony is not always the same.

[Invisible Finger]

Don't Call the Police "Militarized." The Military Is Better Than This.

Exactly. It's not like the protesters took over cities in Iraq.

[paranoid android]

RE: Robin Williams

You know, one of the opinions going around the other day, one that's always popular when the topic of suicide comes up, is that taking one's life is an inherently selfish and cowardly act, an attitude typified by the saying that it's a "permanent solution to a temporary problem."

With that in mind, let's turn to the news that Robin Williams was diagnosed with Parkinson's disease before his death.

Does anyone care to discuss whether an inevitable painful death by degeneration of your central nervous system is a "temporary problem" which it is selfish and cowardly to wish to avoid?

[Jordan]

That shit pisses me off. Even if he wasn't in physical pain, the mental anguish caused by depression is still very real and not just something that can be shrugged off.

[Coeus]

I suffer from clinical depression. I've had great personal results with the "man up" attitude. So much so that I used it on a suicidal guy once. Cops and EMTs showed up, but didn't approach. It started when I almost killed him. He was sitting cross-legged on a steep highway off-ramp. I hauled him up by the shoulders and pushed him against a building then started berating him like a fucking drill sergeant. A cop told me later that they didn't intefere because "it looked like i had it under control". Only time the cops have ever been civil to me. By the time it was over, he had stopped crying and was calm and cooperative.

So don't discount the "coward" talk completely. For some of us, it's the only thing that gets through.

[Carl ?s his ? for ?s]

By the time it was over, he had stopped crying and was calm and cooperative.

So don't discount the "coward" talk completely. For some of us, it's the only thing that gets through.

And I'm sure you did a follow-up later, right?

Very few people who are depressed to the point of suicide will helped by being told to man up.

In fact, I don't think it's a stretch to say that being physically accosted and emasculated will often make those people worse off.

In the few cases it does seem to work, they were probably threatening suicide as a cry for help, and not actually serious about following through.

[Coeus]

And I'm sure you did a follow-up later, right?

Cops came and got me after it resolved, since he wouldn't get in the car until I talked to him one last time, so I did and gave him a business card. He sent a christmas card about 7 months later. A simple thank you and that he was feeling better.

In fact, I don't think it's a stretch to say that being physically accosted and emasculated will often make those people worse off.

A) He kept trying to get back to the off-ramp at first. That puts others in danger, and I would not allow it to cater to his feelings.

B)the man up part got through to him, then it proceed logically. Something along the lines of "This is the worst it could possibly be now, right?"

"yes"

"then why not wait til it gets better instead of quitting"

and so on, for about 30 minutes.

In the few cases it does seem to work, they were probably threatening suicide as a cry for help, and not actually serious about following through.

If I had been even slightly distracted at that time, he would have been dead with his brains in my radiator, my passenger and I injured from swerving into the rail on the ramp. So if it wasn't legit, he fucked up his method pretty badly.

[Square]

That's the inherent flaw in the news cycle and modern mass media culture.

None of us, in fact, know anything at all about Robin Williams. We know a fictional character created by him, his agent, and various other interested parties.

He may have been an absolute monster whose demons finally took him down - big stars can get away with some unbelievably horrific things. He may have been a saint who was facing a debilitating disease and took control of his own fate. There are a million different possible reasons behind what happened.

Unfortunately, when someone is such a public figure that we all feel like we've known, for better or worse, for so long, there is strong temptation to believe that you know exactly what happened.

[toolkien]

Chronic depression is enough reason for a person to want to stop living. There's no reason to gin it up with something else.

The meaning of life is the acquisition of positive memories. When the inability to have life's events even register an emotion makes such acquisition impossible, there's not much meaning. I can only assume after 63 years he gave it the old college try and he felt the next "episode" coming on. When depression and anxiety hit their peak, life is pretty much reduced to panic and fear 24/7. Pills may or may not help. The decision to end the input is certainly ones own, and most certainly is selfish. But that selfishness is no interest of anyone else's, even family.

Everyone gets "bummed out" now and again. Life hands everybody a shit sandwich eventually. Depression is different. Depression itself will make even a decent life a torture. It's the brain and its chemistry. You can push artificial chemicals in and see if it makes a difference. Personally, I think it hurts as often as it helps, so one is rolling the bones on that front.

So, for those who have handled some life's misfortunes and persevered and think suicide due to depression is simply failing the test of adversity don't realize that ones life could be all hot fudge sundaes and manna from heaven, but all that is felt is panic and fear. It's not about some hills to climb now and again, it's a constant state of fear and anxiety.

[Invisible Finger]

It is quite common with stand-up comics.

[Coeus]

You can push artificial chemicals in and see if it makes a difference. Personally, I think it hurts as often as it helps, so one is rolling the bones on that front.

You obliviously haven't tried shrooms. Best antidepressant known to man.

[Invisible Finger]

It is selfish. How many doctors were denied lucrative office visits?

[Sevo]

paranoid android|8.14.14 @ 5:12PM|#
...'let's turn to the news that Robin Williams was diagnosed with Parkinson's disease before his death."

Naah, let's not.
Wasn't my life; any opinion I might have on the matter is so much bullshit.
It was his life to do with as he pleased.

[Derpetologist]

I thought the phrase "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem" was gallows humor; sort of like "all bleeding stops eventually". Since life is temporary, all problems are temporary.

Most people who commit suicide do not suffer from painful or incurable diseases. Large numbers of suicides come from things like divorce and bankruptcy.
In Japan and South Korea, many students commit suicide from bad grades.

There world is filled with people who struggle to stay alive. It's odd that so many suicides happen in countries where life is mostly pleasant.

As for Robin Williams, he could have gotten any kind of help if he had wanted it. I can understand his depression, but I'm baffled by his choice.

Suicide does not violate the non-aggression principle, but it does cause enormous grief to those close to the victim. I don't think suicide is cowardly; I think it's insane. I have a hard time thinking of something so terrible I would rather die than face it.

[Coeus]

There world is filled with people who struggle to stay alive. It's odd that so many suicides happen in countries where life is mostly pleasant.

No, it's not. The same mental resources you call upon to survive physically trying times are the same ones you call upon for mentally trying times. Those skills can atrophy through lack of use, or can have never been learned.

[Derpetologist]

True. I never thought of it that way. If hardship is all you've known, it becomes normal. If you've never known hardship, it can be paralyzing.

[hotsy totsy]

I know it's late to comment, but that's one of the most profound statements I've read regarding the whole Robin Williams suicide. Very lucid and insightful.

[Stormy Dragon]

Depression is liked being randomly picked up and dumped in the middle of the ocean. Yes, you should try swimming to shore, but if you're far enough out, you will succumb to exhaustion before you make it. The fact that you did doesn't mean you were cowardly or being mean to your family.

[Coeus]

To continue your metaphor, you can take two people of almost exactly the same physical skill and dump them in that ocean. One makes it, one does not. Why is that?

This helpless attitude aids no one, and is in fact actively harmful.

That being said, if you want to kill yourself in a way that infringes on no one else's person or property, I believe you should be allowed to.

But it's still giving up. Buckling under. Submitting.

And calling it anything else is a disservice to those currently struggling with it.

[Derpetologist]

I've had bouts of depression most of my life. They have been rare and less severe these past few years. I think it's because the 2 years I spent living in Tanzania taught me that my problems are nothing compared to what some other people deal with.

I think the best treatment for depression is to try to help and comfort others.

[Coeus]

Whatever works for you. The important part is that you keep looking for it until you find it. No matter how far away the shore looks.

[robc]

I was born 45 years ago this weekend.

Coincidence?

[paranoid android]

Probably. If you were born 45 years ago nine months from this weekend, that would probably not be a coincidence.

[robc]

I was born 9 months to the day after the Heidi Game. I refuse to ask questions because I might find out that isnt a coincidence.

[Coeus]

What's the Heidi Game? Did that autocorrect from "the Crying Game"?

[Raven Nation]

Sheesh, I grew up in Australia and still know what the Heidi Game is:

The Heidi Game or Heidi Bowl was an American football game played on November 17, 1968. The home team, the Oakland Raiders, defeated the New York Jets, 43?32. The game is remembered for its exciting finish, as Oakland scored two touchdowns in the final minute to overcome a 32?29 New York lead. It came to be known as the Heidi Game because the NBC Television Network controversially broke away from the game, with the Jets still winning, to air the 1968 television film Heidi at 7 p.m. in the Eastern Time Zone.

Whole thing here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heidi_Game

[robc]

11/17?

Maybe not exactly 9 months then, I was thinking it was 11/15.

Still, Im not asking questions.

[thom]

It was a football game that was decided after the network had already broken away to show the movie 'Heidi'.

[db]

That might be the angry sex to end them all.

[robc]

I know for a fact my Mom was watching the game.

Like I said, Im not asking questions.

[Invisible Finger]

Sounds like your father was angry and your mother calmed him down.

[CE]

I was born 9 months after the 4th of July. Fireworks.

[Raven Nation]

For you EPL fans, Crystal Palace boss quits two days before season starts:

http://www.espnfc.us/crystal-p.....tal-palace

[Ted S.]

Why couldn't it be Mourinho getting arrested on corruption charges or something?

[db]

Man, I read that as "ELP Fans" and was hoping for a new album. 🙁

[Invisible Finger]

Cozy Powell's dead.

[Raven Nation]

Could be Emerson, Lake, & Palmer.

[Jerry on the sea]

And did those feet in ancient time kick a ball into the net?

[Invisible Finger]

You're no fun anymore

[Raven Nation]

Actually, I've never really been any fun.

[Invisible Finger]

I only brought up Cozy because I was streaming music yesterday and something from the Emerson Lake and Powell album came up - a hilariously stupid/bad version of The Loco-Motion. At least Greg Lake had the decency to not sing. It was a CD bonus track, but some things are better left unheard. It's nice that ELP had some affinity for 50's rock & roll, but it wasn't good. I contrast that with Blue Oyster Cult's version of Be My Baby which is very well done.

[MegaloMonocle]

The siege of Mount Sinjar has been broken

Umm, everybody trapped on the mountain dying doesn't really count, you know.

[Raven Nation]

Actually, from what I heard on the news today, it was another failure of intelligence: less people than what they thought with more food than what they thought.

[Invisible Finger]

Failure? Probably intentional. How can you gin up military support if only a couple of people are at risk?

[Raven Nation]

That too.

[Game of Thrones fan]

But what about the siege of Winterfell? Second siege of Mereen?

[Dr. Fronkensteen]

What about Masada?

[BuSab Agent]

The Israeli terrorists used themselves as human shields there.
/Roman government

[CE]

Santa Anna reports that the siege of the Alamo is over.

[sloopyinva (previously -inca)]

Ok, those of,you,that have only dreamed of a chance to be included in the Reason H&R J sub D Memorial Fantasy Football League, now is your chance! We've had an early withdrawal from the league by an esteemed member and his spot is now open to the highest bidder. And by bidder, I mean the first of,you,that emails me and says you want in.

But be warned: it can get pretty rough and tumble. And it's a 16-team league. And I'm the commissioner. And it's full of assholes.

sloopy

[hotsy totsy]

Just want to say I miss J sub D.

[Invisible Finger]

Maliki stepping down

http://bigstory.ap.org/article.....hest-level

[Derpetologist]

So today, I felt my eyelids getting heavy, so I figured I could boost my blood pressure by reading the biography of Joe Biden.

It turns out he graduated near the bottom of his law class. I never liked the idea of laws being made by lawyers, but letting stupid lawyers make laws should be right out.

Then I read about the Chicago Teacher Union Prez. Her bio says she was a chemistry teacher, but her degrees are in sociology and music. "Math? What's that?"

[lap83]

Maybe the people with actual chemistry experience were too busy working real jobs.

[userve32]

Sometiems you jsut have to roll with it.

http://www.AnonWays.tk