White House Appears Ready to Ignore NSA Reform Panel, California Souring on Unions, Huckabee May Run Again: P.M. Links

• 

  Credit: Aaron Webb / Foter.com / CC BY-NC-SA

  The White House is already apparently ignoring the recommendations of the group it put together to analyze the operations of the National Security Agency and will allow the agency to retain control over U.S. Cyber Command rather than switching to civilian leadership.

• As far as the other recommendations go, which have not been released yet, reports indicate that the panel is pushing for bulk records collections to continue, but will be held by third parties or the phone company with tighter controls on access. Some are disappointed by the extremely predictable outcome when you ask for recommendations from former government officials.
• The golden goose is running out of eggs. California voters are increasingly turning against unions in the latest polls.
• The White House press corps is starting to get upset over lack of access to President Barack Obama and is lashing out.
• Mike Huckabee may be gearing up for another run for the president, because "more government" and "social conservatism" are polling so well right now.
• Even though Reason's webathon is done, please keep us in mind if you win tonight's $425 million Mega Millions jackpot.

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Comments

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

The White House press corps is starting to get upset over lack of access to President Barack Obama and is lashing out.

They're finally figuring that out?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Cool. Lashing out like Django.

Oh. You meant metaphorically.

/sad eyes.

[Ted S.]

/sad eyes.

You knew there'd come a day when we would have to say good-bye

[Rufus J. Firefly]

/sad eyes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHPRCaXEd5M

[wareagle]

the WH press corps only seems to get uptight with POTUS when it's affected.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Mike Huckabee may be gearing up for another run for the president...

Luckily for us it's probably not his turn in the GOP yet.

[playa manhattan]

RuRoh. Another school shooting.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

So far only the shooter is dead, but at one other person is reported in critical condition.

It appears the cops recovered only one weapon, a shotgun. Which would make for one messy crime scene given that he reportedly shot himself.

[Bam!]

Shotgun? He took Biden'a advice.

[Fist of Etiquette]

A military style assault shotgun?

[Sevo]

"A military style assault shotgun?"

Well, someone painted it black, so pretty scary.

[playa manhattan]

The police response is fucking ridiculous, and is traumatizing the kids far more than the original incident. They sure love playing G.I. Joe.

[Sudden]

BAN SCHOOLZ!!!1!!!1!!

[Certified Public Asskicker]

A ban I would support.

[lap83]

I hope someone points out the fact that guns are allowed at places that arent the school. Therefore thats why the school wasnt safe. Also chilrunz

[playa manhattan]

For anyone interested, you can listen to the radio traffic live on any smartphone app. It's the Arapahoe, CO Sheriff's Dept.

They are doing pretty much what you would expect. Even though the gunman is already confirmed dead from a self-inflicted gunshot wound, every cop from a 50 mile radius is on scene holding the rest of the students hostage at gunpoint and searching for bombs and nukes.

[playa manhattan]

It's really amazing. There is fucking nobody in charge. The SWAT team is currently clearing the science lab for the 4th time

[Mad Scientist]

I hope they're yelling, "Hut! Hut! Hut!" the whole time.

[Brandon]

Canadian Bacon reference?

[Medical Physics Guy]

Surely a Blues Brothers reference.

[Agammamon]

Surely a 'Life of Brian' reference.

[Mad Scientist]

Winner winner chicken dinner

[Eduard van Haalen]

Well, columbine was supposed to be a bombing, they were just too dumb to build workable bombs.

So looking for bombs makes sense.

[Clich? Bandit]

FUCK Hickenpooper is going to make a statement from the scene...probably gun grabber jibberish.

[SweatingGin]

"If you hadn't recalled our state senators that supported gun control, this wouldn't have..."

[Clich? Bandit]

thankfully he avoided that.

[jesse.in.mb]

The White House press corps is starting to get upset over lack of access to President Barack Obama and is lashing out.

It's hard for them to stretch their necks that far to lick his asshole.

[fish_remote]

It's hard for them to stretch their necks that far to lick his asshole.

They're just not trying hard enough....Chris Matthews pulled it off!

[Fist of Etiquette]

It was a rimarkable feat.

[jesse.in.mb]

I don't even...

[Fist of Etiquette]

Wait a minute, I had something for this.

Anilingual... leg tingling... something.

[Mickey Rat]

Few can achieve the depths of Matthew's abjectness.

[Brandon]

Did anyone else('s wife force them to) watch the History Channel stuff on the Kennedy assassination anniversary? Matthews was a commentator for some reason, and it was almost as slavishly devoted as his Obama commentary.

[mr simple]

The White House is already apparently ignoring the recommendations of the group it put together to analyze the operations of the National Security Agency and will allow the agency to retain control over U.S. Cyber Command rather than switching to civilian leadership.

Look, they put the story out, they had hearings so everybody knows about it. What more do you want?

[wareagle]

sort of like the Bowles Simpson group cobbled together over the debt/deficit. Make a big show of forming the commission, an equally big show about its findings/recos, then move on.

[Warrren]

Yes, turn against those unions!

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Even though Reason's webathon is done, please keep us in mind if you win tonight's $425 million Mega Millions jackpot.

If I won $425 million I'd buy Reason, bring back Postrel and Lucy, and make the rest of the current staff fight in a Mortal Kombat-style tournament to earn their place.

[SweatingGin]

And raise money off the proceeds from selling the pay-per-view?

[Pro Libertate]

Hmm, what is that, around $150 million lump sum? I could accomplish much with such money. In fact, the lottery should simply award the money to me and not bestow it on some doubtlessly less capable recipient.

[Fist of Etiquette]

You would be broke in three years, just like every other lottery winner who took the lump sum.

[Ted S.]

I'd die with the lump sum intact since I'm too much of a cheapskate to spend any of it. 😐

[Pro Libertate]

I suspect I'm not going to blow half the money on a diamond-studded Ferrari.

What are you suggesting, anyway, that I trust the government to pay it out over the next thirty years or whatever? Or that that money will have remotely the value it does now in that time frame?

[Fist of Etiquette]

From everything I've read, people who take the lump sum always go bankrupt in a surprisingly short amount of time. You think you're somehow smarter than people who play the lottery?

[Pro Libertate]

Yes. It's why I never win, the few times I do buy a ticket.

[playa manhattan]

That guy with the ponytail from Florida was a prime example. The guy who looked and acted like a circus carney.

[Brandon]

He was a circus carney.

[Mad Scientist]

The geniuses who play the lottery are already economically and statistically challenged, but you'd think they'd at least learn to not spend the principal. You could rake in several million a year, tax free, with $135 million invested in crummy municipal bonds. If you can't live on $500,000 a month, you're doing something wrong.

[prolefeed]

You just have to not spend the money.

What's going on is that people who A) play the lottery a lot and B) take the lump sum are unlikely to be the sort who don't blow the money.

[prolefeed]

Shorter: I wouldn't blow the money, but I also don't waste the money I do have by buying FN lottery tickets.

[Medical Physics Guy]

"Lotteries are a tax on people who are bad at math"

[Enough About Palin]

I wouldn't be broke in 3 years. I'm 100% debt free and have a very above average net-worth; I didn't achieve that by blowing all the money I make on shit.

[Warty]

Oh look, a hoarder. Haven't you ever heard of the paradox of thrift, scumbag? You are the reason the economy sucks.

[Pro Libertate]

My consumer confidence decreased just reading about his hoarding ways.

[Brandon]

That pretty much justifies asset forfeiture, doesn't it? What's your address, Kulak?

[Mad Scientist]

I didn't achieve that by blowing all the money I make on shit.

Like lottery tickets.

[Certified Public Asskicker]

Wealth tax!

[Corning]

nah...i would spend 50 million fucking up the bitcoin market 50 million on my island made out of naked supermodels and just live the rest of my life off of the interest of my 250 savings accounts.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

I'm young and there's only so much good fortune a man needs, so I'd take the annuity.

[Pro Libertate]

It's not good fortune. It's recouping some small portion of the wealth stolen from you and your forebears by government over the millennia.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

I guess. I just wouldn't know what to do with the money after I pay off all my debts and give some to my family.

[Enough About Palin]

YOU FUCKING INVEST IT.

[playa manhattan]

IN PRIVATE TROPICAL ISLANDS.

[playa manhattan]

Buy a higher yield annuity than the one offered by the lottery. Or shop here:
http://www.privateislandsonline.com

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Okay, I am bookmarking this thread for future reference should I win the lottery.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The better whores can be expensive. I'm told.

[Bobarian]

You win the 425 Mil, the whores will (seem to) be free.

[Pro Libertate]

Dude, you have no idea what plans I have for any wealth I acquire in excess of my needs. It's why you should send your extra money to me. You'll like the way I spend it, trust me.

[Sevo]

"Dude, you have no idea what plans I have for any wealth I acquire in excess of my needs"

There is no such thing. Everybody needs a yacht, a twin-engine plane, a place in the wine country.
That's the reason the gummint has to gimme money for my needs.

[Pro Libertate]

I didn't mean it that way. I just meant I have plans within plans within plans for such wealth.

[Bobarian]

"Send your extra money..."

That shit is hilarious. WTF is 'extra money'.

[alan_s]

It's better to take the full amount and earn interest on the lump sum. And use it only for evil, as all good libertarians would do.

[Sudden]

An army of peasant children! An army!

[BiMonSciFiCon]

Definitely. And like someone said above, who trusts the gov't to pay it out over time?

If I won $150 million, I would

1. Pay off my student debt. And then chug a bottle of whiskey to celebrate.
2. Set up college funds for my little cousins and future children.
3. Buy a generous retirement annuity for my parents (not that they need it, but a little more wouldn't hurt.
4. Do the same (but slightly less generous) for my other family members.
5. Quit my job and go on the reason cruise.

[CatoTheElder]

I'd definitely take the annuity. It would make my future trips to Vegas tax-deductible since I could write off gambling losses there against the annuity income derived from gambling.

[Ted S.]

FINISH HIM!

[EDG reppin' LBC]

I'm pretty sure I'm going to win. I bought two tickets last night.

[Ted S.]

How much would it cost to buy Taboola and destroy all evidence that it ever existed?

[Agammamon]

Our organization is looking for an aggressive young go-getter, but we only have room for one (drops knife on ground). Make it quick.

[Rufus J. Fisk]

wasn't it a broken in half pool cue?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Why are you nearly stealing my name?

/puts up fists.

[Agammamon]

Not all of us blindly copy. Anyway a knife was all I had, I wasn't given them my gun.

[Agammamon]

I mean hypothetically - none of that really happened.

[Certified Public Asskicker]

Not to dash spirits, but since they increased the white balls to 75 your chances have gone from impossible to very impossible.

[Killaz]

If you brought back Postrel I would have you kidnapped and soled into gimp slavery to Danny McBride.

[Killaz]

Sold, not soled. I was thinking what a red starburst nova your sphincter is gonna look like when McBride is finished with you.

[Agammamon]

KENNY FUCKING POWERS!

[Crusty Juggler]

"Fuckin GI Joe, Dude. Fuckin loves me."

[CE]

If I won the lottery, I'd buy Reason and discuss my polling ideas with the staff. And I did buy a ticket. And I'm great at math.

[gaijin]

Mike Huckabee may be gearing up for another run for the president,

He must need a new car

[Fist of Etiquette]

California voters are increasingly turning against unions in the latest polls.

Like having a problem with frozen water after the iceberg has been struck.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Catholic Conservative Promotes No Fapping Group

-You may be called to join the Fapstronauts. They are an online community gathered at a place called NoFap around a pledge of non-fapping. What's fapping? I had never heard of it either. Fapping is masturbation.

Fapping has always been a problem for men but never more so since the explosion of pornography, and most especially Internet porn. It is probably at epidemic proportions right now.

Enter an increasingly large number of guys, and some women, who grew weary of the tedious fap-treadmill. In the summer of 2011 someone posted a note on the wildly popular Reddit website that said, "When men don't masturbate for 7 days their testosterone levels increase by 45.7 percent" This little remark began a conversation and by the end of the day a movement was born. By the end of the month a guy named Alexander Rhodes founded NoFap.

NoFap has 70,000 members and hosts what it calls "challenges" to abstain from pornography and masturbation for a period of time. They say, "Join the movement. Gain control of your sexuality and turn it into superpowers. Quit porn and live a more awesome life."

http://www.crisismagazine.com/.....kely-place

[Bam!]

Orgasm control is hot.

[tarran]

How does an epidemic of masturbation work, I wonder?

Do they imagine one guy sees another shining the purple helmet and decides that he should do it too? 🙂

[EDG reppin' LBC]

I'm jerkin' it right now.

[playa manhattan]

Go on...

[EDG reppin' LBC]

Uhhhh never mind. The grocery store manager just told me to stop or he'll call the police. But that meat department was turning me on...

[playa manhattan]

What was it? The rump roast, or the boneless breast?

[EDG reppin' LBC]

Oddly enough it was the beef tongue.

[Lord at War]

"Pork butt rules!"

/john

[Rich]

Come off it!

[Mad Scientist]

Show off!

[Corning]

I heard that Diogenes would go to parties and jerk off on the food.

If everyone did that then it would be an epidemic.

[Apatheist ?_??]

I haven't seen any evidenced that /r/nofap has anything to do with Catholic conservatives.

One of the funniest things on reddit though.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

The article is from Crisis Magazine, a magazine of, and for, conservative Catholics.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Catholics, who everybody already knows think masturbation is a sin, recommend a secular anti-masturbation forum. Whooped dee doo.

Might as well skip straight over them and mock the nofappers directly.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Surely this, which is all the Crisis author, is worthy of mocking?

-Masturbation used to be shameful, so was pornography. Now they are jokes and everybody does them. Yet each are traps that have ensnared hundreds of millions of men and boys around the world, and a sizable portion of women, too.

It is a shameful testament to our societal institutions, even the Church, that pornography has run so rampant over our culture. Though porn was discussed at the just concluded bishops' meeting, to date only two US bishops have issued letters warning about its dangers. And when was the last time that this issue was mentioned even tangentially in a sermon? And how much more effective would be there already successful mission if these young men were taught about their own human dignity? NoFap does not allow religious appeals on their site, which is too bad.

Even so they are doing amazing work and it is a moving testament to the human spirit that young men and women would band together to help themselves and help others overcome the scourge.

If you want to join a real resistance to the sexual revolution, go to http://www.nofap.org right way.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Certainly mock worth. I think my resistance came off a bit too strongly, I just think nofap is one the more interesting things to mock because it's not primarily some religious hoodoo.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Fair enough.

[SusanM]

So, they'll take a firm grasp of the situation and pull together?

[Bobarian]

golf clap

[Warty]

Nofap is one of the saddest subcultures I've ever encountered. To paraphrase John, no one dies wishing they'd had fewer orgasms.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Indeed, from the article

-Who are these guys? Project Know, a program that helps addictions of all kinds, did a survey of the NoFap community last year

and found a startling 31 percent are between the ages of 13-19, 75 percent are single, 90 percent are heterosexual, 16 percent started porn use before the age of 12, 53 percent started between 12 and 14, prior to NoFap 59 percent had used porn 4 and 15 hours per week, 64 percent noted their tastes in porn has grown more deviant over time, and nearly 50 percent had never had real sex.

The study showed reasons why these young people are seeking help. Respondents reported negative psychological effects from masturbation including "depression and social anxiety." They believe chronic masturbation sabotages "their chances of finding a partner" and "compromises the quality of sex in their current relationship" not to mention that it shows an "undesirable lack of self-control."

They also reported that among 27-31 year old NoFappers that 19 percent suffered from premature ejaculation, 25 percent are not interested in sex with their partner, 31 percent have trouble reaching orgasm, 34 percent experience erectile dysfunction, and 37 percent have decreased sexual sensitivity.

[robc]

Avi in Cryptonomicon didnt masturbate, even when travelling. He thought it made him a little crazy and the time with his wife better.

Of course, he was fictional.

[Michael S. Langston]

They believe chronic masturbation sabotages...

Depending upon how one defines "chronic", then sure, "chronic masturbation" can sabotage all factors of life.

"Sorry I was late for work again"

But I don't think most would consider once very couple or three days "chronic" - therefore why would one need to abstain for 7 days to mitigate most of these things supposedly sabotaged by being human?

& WTF? Is it that as religion gets more and more downgraded, people have to replace it with other magical thinking all of which starts with "original sin" - in this case, self pleasure?

Maybe Obama was right on O-care - after all, if it's allowed to continue and completely destroys the economy, people won't have near enough free time to discuss, promote, care about, support, etc things such as "no fap".

[Suthenboy]

"Fapping has always been a problem for men..."

Huh?

[0x90]

I do not avoid women, Mandrake...

[Brett L]

NoFap has 70,000 members and hosts what it calls "challenges" to abstain from pornography and masturbation for a period of time.

I do this every day... its called "work".

[playa manhattan]

This.
The most shocking part: "had used porn 4 and 15 hours per week".
That's jerkin' it for over 2 hours every day. Yer doin' it wrong.

[Gbob]

You're working in the wrong place. You need your own office.

[Eduard van Haalen]

You note below that the site doesn't allow religious appeals.

It's a catholic magazine praising what looks like a secular initiative.

[Eduard van Haalen]

You jote above...

[Eduard van Haalen]

This subthread is why there are no libertarian Popes. It's a voluntary initiative - there's no Saudi-style Virtue Police enforcing the initiative, so why are so many freedon-lovers all...butthurt?

[robc]

So many?

Looks like just Bo to me.

I think he veers to the libertine.

[Eduard van Haalen]

I would add apatheist and Warty. Maybe some of the othets. But maybe I did over-broad conclusions from three guys.

[Apatheist ?_??]

What? I criticized him for dragging the Catholics into this. Discussing catholics and masturbation is terribly boring. /r/nofap on the the other hand is hilarious. I don't know how much time you've spent on reddit but that subreddit is a ball of hilarious crazy and it's even funnier when the pop in around other places on the site recommending it and telling people to free themselves. Making fun of them is not butthurt.

[Eduard van Haalen]

1, 000 pardons.

I guess I'm down to Bo and Warty.

Anyway, "butthurt" is an offensive term, I feel kind of bad for using it.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Continue to use it, it is a hilarious and rather light term. I was merely objecting because I basically made a lengthier version of this post 45 mins before you did:

You note below that the site doesn't allow religious appeals.

It's a catholic magazine praising what looks like a secular initiative.

[SForza]

What other term would you use to describe the pain you feel after falling on your butt?

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I just thought it was uncommonly silly, not a violation of the NAP.

[paranoid android]

I also believe that people have a right to voluntarily seek help from psychics and witch doctors for their problems, but would you claim I was "butthurt" if I also declared that they were knaves for doing so?

[Eduard van Haalen]

These folks seem to have...intimacy issues. It's not witch-doctoring to think their onanism may have something to do with it. The figures they give of self-pleasuring activity would put any H&R commenter other than warty to shame. Sounds like they are right to cut down.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Oh come now, a lot of the rhetoric in that article is uncommonly silly. Read it.

[Brett L]

Even though Reason's webathon is done, please keep us in mind if you win tonight's $425 million Mega Millions jackpot.

If I happen to pick up the winning ticket from the side of the road, I'll set aside a million for reason before starting my hooker and blow run. With about $135M after taxes, I expect my heirs will see about $100M depending on how often I take food breaks.

[Sudden]

I would like to be the Bob Crachet to your rich Ebenezer Scrooge this Christmasnon-denominational Holiday season. You just go ahead and hand deliver a pile of blow and a few tied up South American hookers to my apartment to alleviate the guilt you feel over your indulgences.

[Brett L]

Guilt? Shit. My wife and kid will get the vast majority of the money, but I'm gonna die by a paranoid hooker driving a spike heel through my eye after a three-week orgy of sex, drugs and drink.

[EDG reppin' LBC]

At least you have a plan.

[CE]

The only way my heirs will see $100M will be if I take a picture of it before I spend it all.

[Bam!]

The golden goose is running out of eggs. California voters are increasingly turning against unions in the latest polls.

That actually makes me hopeful.

[CE]

Don't worry. They'll still vote for multi-billion dollar bond measures to build TRAINZ. And new taxes to fund SKOOLZ.

[mr simple]

Another EPA official under investigation in CIA scheme

[playa manhattan]

Here's a Friday nut punch:
http://articles.orlandosentine.....xual-abuse

[Brett L]

Fuck. Those people maybe genetically homo sap, but they aren't human.

[playa manhattan]

Remember, that guy isn't looking at a life sentence, but people who sell a little weed are.

[Brett L]

Thanks. I wasn't hating the world quite enough before that reminder. Now, daddy needs a drink.

[robc]

could land 25-year-old Jonathan Adleta in prison for life.

[tarran]

Wow.... just wow.....

[MJGreen]

On the one hand, I'm curious as to just what kind of "sex acts" these people commit on toddlers and how the hell they get off on it. On the other hand, I'd like to keep my lunch down.

[BakedPenguin]

As much as I dislike Huckabee, he is a decent bassist.

[playa manhattan]

He is actually pretty funny and a sharp public speaker, too. His beliefs are frightening, though.

[CE]

You know who else had a modicum of artistic talent, sharp public speaking skills, and frightening beliefs?

[Bobarian]

Bill Maher?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shU3SpWAzR0

Yeah, but can he rock like Harper?

[Brett L]

North Korean executed for wishing Tinkerbell dead. (I know this has been posted before, but the part about Dear Uncle not clapping hard enough is too awesome.)

When his cunning move proved futile and the decision that Kim Jong Un was elected vice-chairman of the Central Military Commission of the Workers' Party of Korea at the Third Conference of the WPK in reflection of the unanimous will of all party members, service personnel and people was proclaimed, making all participants break into enthusiastic cheers that shook the conference hall, he behaved so arrogantly and insolently as unwillingly standing up from his seat and half-heartedly clapping, touching off towering resentment of our service personnel and people.

[BakedPenguin]

If the CIA or NSA were on the ball, they'd be sending incriminating emails to 2/3'ds of the NK Army leadership. By the time Kim got finished murdering them, the remainder would be ready to stage a coup.

[PapayaSF]

The Nazis did that to the Soviets to create effect. If your enemy is a paranoid and bloodthirsty totalitarian, you can often trick them into paranoid purges of their own ranks.

[PapayaSF]

To "great" effect.

[Andrew S.]

King Joffrey certainly has taken to his role as dear leader, hasn't he?

[tarran]

You guys should read the press release the NORKs put out.

Basically, what they are saying was he was trying to create chaos by fucking up the economy, while amassing and hoarding as much wealth as he could. Then, as everything collapsed, he was going to use his ill-gotten wealth to but off people to abandon the Kims and place him in charge of the state.

No matter how much water flows under the bridge and no matter how frequently a generation is replaced by new one, the lineage of Paektu will remain unchanged and irreplaceable.

Our party, state, army and people do not know anyone except Kim Il Sung, Kim Jong Il and Kim Jong Un.
Our service personnel and people will never pardon all those who dare disobey the unitary leadership of Kim Jong Un, challenge his absolute authority and oppose the lineage of Paektu to an individual but bring them to the stern court of history without fail and mercilessly punish them on behalf of the party and revolution, the country and its people, no matter where they are in hiding.

It's really impressive.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Has Rodman been reached for comment?

[MJGreen]

It's comforting to know that the divine right of kings is still respected in some corner of the world.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Some are disappointed by the extremely predictable outcome when you ask for recommendations from former government officials.

Still, it's nice to have independent confirmation.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-A controversial initiative requiring women to buy additional insurance if they want abortion coverage in their health insurance plans passed the Legislature Wednesday afternoon and will take effect 90 days after lawmakers adjourn for the year.

The initiative would require most private and all public health insurance plans to offer a separate rider for an abortion. And a person would have to buy that rider before knowing if they needed an abortion. They would not be able to buy the rider after getting pregnant by any means, including rape or incest.

Michigan will join eight other states that have instituted policies prohibiting public and private insurance plans from including abortion coverage in health care policies

http://www.freep.com/article/2.....-insurance

[Agammamon]

And a person would have to buy that rider before knowing if they needed an abortion.

Kinda like . . . INSURANCE!

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Interestingly enough this, which is the silliest part, is what progressive pro-choicers are latching on to.

The part I thought relevant to libertarianism was that the law seems to private insurance as well as public.

[#]

If the pro lifers were smart they would let you buy it after the fact and that would cause a death spiral for that rider destorying the utility of the insurance. They could let the progs hang themselves.

[Agammamon]

I don't see it as especially relevant - I saw it as part and parcel of the already huge regulatory burden that is placed on insurers, similar to things like not being able to sell insurance over state lines and such.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

100 wrongs plus one still does not make a right.

[Bobarian]

There is no such thing as private health insurance anymore

[The Other Kevin]

Someone on FB posted a link to the Jezebel version of this story. You would have thought the world was ending tomorrow.

[Virginian]

So now it's an outrage that the government is requiring certain things be covered by insurance?

How the fuck does a leftist simultaneously hold that Obamacare is good because mandates and this bill is bad because mandates.

[Eduard van Haalen]

So it's moderately more difficult in Michigan for insurance companies to pay for the killing of human beings? It'an outrage, all right - an outrage that killing these human beings is legal at all.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Restricting liberty for the babiez.

[Corning]

How god damn expensive is an abortion anyway?

Like $200?!??!

Why does this need insurance at all?

[Apatheist ?_??]

Well and the best insurance against an abortion is using birth control properly.

[Agammamon]

'Cuz if you can't afford the condoms without government paying for them then how are you going to scrape together the money for an abortion?

Some people have weird ideas like, if you can't afford to handle the consequences of an act then you shouldn't do it in the first place.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

There is no reason to make people 'pay for the consequences of their action' when they can do something that negates it and is not a violation of the NAP.

If abortion is a legal, available medical procedure people who want to should be able to insure for it with a willing insurer.

[Kid Xenocles]

If their proposed solution violates the rights of someone else, then barring them from executing that solution is well within the NAP. This is in no way an attempt to open an abortion discussion, just a note that the alternative viewpoint exists.

[Brett L]

Daily Fail says zero Senate 'Phants support the budget agreement. Could it be that the GOP is no longer the Stupid Party? Letting the chamber that is in the majority look responsible and the chamber in the minority do the knife fighting?

[Ted S.]

Boehner didn't think to throw any pork their way?

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Boeing in contentious fight with union over pension plan

This week's back-and-forth battle between Boeing and its biggest union over the future has come down to whether to keep the traditional pension plan, an enormous issue for both sides.
In a letter to Machinists District Lodge 751 union members Friday, President Tom Wroblewski said the fact that Boeing's latest proposal removed the defined-benefit pension system for new hires was a key reason why he and business representatives decided not to take the deal to a vote.
The union had a problem with: "Freezing your pensions, eliminating them for new Machinists and replacing them with a 'savings plan' so vague we couldn't tell you anything about how it would work."
Instead of sending out a fixed pension check each month for a retiree's life, Boeing wants to substitute a part-company-funded 401(k)-style savings account whose ultimate value to each retiree depends on market swings.
For workers, many of whom have committed themselves to Boeing for 30 years or more, a defined pension is something they've fought for over many years, something to guarantee a dignified and relativity solvent retirement.

South Carolina seems nice.

[paranoid android]

Why, there'll be plenty of money for pensions once the workers seize the factory and start somehow pumping out socially-useful electric trains!

[robc]

Defined contribution is more relatively solvent.

It wont go away in bankruptcy, for example.

[Sevo]

..."replacing them with a 'savings plan' so vague we couldn't tell you anything about how it would work.""....

I'm sure the union reps are incapable of explaining how retirement works for 90% of those working for a living.

[Enough About Palin]

I just bought a dress shirt and then noticed that the collar has two tabs attached to it. One tab has a button and the other has a buttonhole. Never seen anything like it. Anyone here have any insight (apart from the fact that I am broadly ignorant)?

[Brett L]

You don't know about tab collars?

[jesse.in.mb]

What's the placement on the tabs? At first I thought you were talking about those shoulder strap things that became briefly popular a few years ago, but on the collar?

[Brett L]

They button under your tie. Keeps the collar wings down and pushes the knot forward.

[Enough About Palin]

Turns out they's snap tabs

They're purpose here

Learn something new every day (and I've been wearing dress shirts t work since the 80's

[Mickey Rat]

Which is sinister.

[Isaac Bartram]

I had a couple in the 60s. They were quite popular then but then they went out of style.

I believe there have been a couple of revivals since but I pretty much decided I didn't like the style so I won't wear them even if they are in style. But then I can't remember the last time I wore a necktie anyway.

[Ted S.]

I just bought a dress shirt and then noticed that the collar has two tabs attached to it.

Welcome back to the age of jive.

[Fist of Etiquette]

It's one step above a button down collar. Which is to say terrible. When you wear a button down collar you might as well wear bib overalls with it, Jethro.

[SusanM]

Where have you been hidin' out lately, honey?
You can't dress trashy till you spend a lot of money.

[EDG reppin' LBC]

This is a Joel Free Zone, thank you.

[Agammamon]

WEDIDNTSTARTTHEFIRE!!!!!

[SusanM]

Sorry. Let me balance the scale somewhat

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKhTk0IynHM

[Warty]

In what should be news to no one, life in The Middle Ages fucking sucked.

[Brett L]

You don't like suffering from chronic pain, malnutrition, and disease ALL THE TIME?!

[Warty]

I like the OH NOES MEAT bit, too.

[Brett L]

Didn't everyone know nobility were carnivorous?

[Warty]

What I liked is that the nitrogen ratios in the bones of a 500-year-old syphilitic fat tub of goo prove that you should eat less meat. Science really has trouble with its reflexive political correctness.

[Brett L]

I'm surprised that the malaria section didn't have an AGW editorial comment added.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Sex musta been stinky back then.

[Fist of Etiquette]

This isn't a link to one of those terrible SugarFree time travel stories, is it?

[Pro Libertate]

There's no such thing, so no.

[CE]

I kind of enjoyed life in the Middle Ages. Of course, I was much younger then and not so bored with it all.

[jesse.in.mb]

New documentary (featuring my former therapist!) makes it clear that some people are gay because they were touched too little by their fathers and some people are gay because they were touched too much!

So it's easy to find gays who seek therapy who didn't live in some fantasy Goldilocks Zone of paternal affection? I wonder if you polled* straight men in therapy how they'd describe their relationships with their fathers. I guarantee most of them aren't saying "I felt truly loved, but in a gruff, 1950s kinda way."

*polled...snicker

[Mad Scientist]

How many were touched too much by their uncles?

[Suthenboy]

So...some gays were born at night, and some during the day?

I think some people are gay because....they are gay? Is that a fair guess?

I have never had the slightest inclination towards homosexuality, and I cant imagine anything that could have changed that. I am pretty sure I was just born heterosexual. I assume the same is true of homosexuals. It is not an affliction, and you cant pray it away. Geeez.

[Apatheist ?_??]

You went to gay conversion therapy? What was that like?

[Warty]

Ineffective.

[jesse.in.mb]

Mostly what Warty said.

We got stuck pretty early on when I declined to agree with my therapists assertion that I must have been molested or I wouldn't have a confused sexuality. At one point he called me one of his most difficult patients, a moment I will cherish until senility sets in.

[Suthenboy]

Heh Heh. Good for you.

[Warty]

Was it at least a good place to pick up dudes to fuck? My brother had to go to a court-ordered drug counseling thing when he was a teenager, and it was the best place imaginable to meet dealers. Pray the gay away therapy has to be similar.

[jesse.in.mb]

I don't actually remember meeting any of the other patients.

[Warty]

What a waste.

[Warty]

What a waste.

[Warty]

So true, I had to say it twice, apparently.

[Pro Libertate]

I thought you were highlighting the general concept of waste by wasting aether, screen space, your time, my time, the time of others, and probably many other things in commenting more than once.

See? You're responsible for this comment, which is a complete waste.

[jesse.in.mb]

It's waste all the way down?

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Geez. Haven't you watched the Bob Newhart Show to know how psychology works? Or learned through one Dr. Fraser Crane?

[Entropy Void]

Read that with an Ian Drury accent ...

[Fist of Etiquette]

You don't remember? So it wasn't group therapy. Or did your therapist hypnotize you? Did you wake feeling rested but with your shirt untucked? Odd taste in your mouth?

I want to recommend you for recovered memory therapy.

[jesse.in.mb]

No group therapy. I don't even remember seeing other people in the waiting room though.

I was sent to the Love Won Out conference with an ex-gay aunt (bitter, single and dying alone in a convalescent home as we speak).

I tried to get the attention of a cute guy, but I was 17, timid and totally inexperienced.

[playa manhattan]

Did he refund your money?

[jesse.in.mb]

Lol. If they had to refund money for failed ex-gay conversion therapy they would've ceased to exist as soon as they started.

[Sevo]

..."I wouldn't have a confused sexuality."...
Don't sound 'confused' to me...

[Mad Scientist]

How old were you when your parents subjected you to this quack?

[jesse.in.mb]

I didn't get outed until I was 17 (I'd started a soft roll-out with people I trusted and one of them told someone who told my parents). The doctor was glad that he got me before I got to college and my head was filled with liberalism and the pleasures of man-flesh, but was disappointed they hadn't gotten to me earlier when I might have been more pliable.

I wasn't forced to go, just strongly encouraged even after saying I thought it was a waste of time.

[Mad Scientist]

Did they know what a charlatan this guy was, or did they honestly think his sort of therapy would help with your "condition?"

[jesse.in.mb]

He is (or at least was at the time) the most reputable of the ex-gay therapists. My parents still make references to their belief that God will reach into my heart and change my sexual desires so I can marry and raise kids. When I bitched about him being stuck on the idea that I'd been molested my mother went so far as to say that I probably had been and just couldn't remember it, so they certainly bought in to his authority on the matter.

[Virginian]

Yeah gotta love how convenient repressed memories are for shrinks.

"This is a result of your past abuse"
"I've never been abused"
"Not that you remember, you just repressed it. Poor thing."
"No, I'm sure of it."
"You can't be sure, you have to prove it didn't happen. Trust me, I'm a doctor."

[Mad Scientist]

For some reason I'm reminded of that episode of the Twilight Zone with the "ugly" girl, who can't be fixed after multiple surgeries, so she's taken off to live with other people of her "own kind."

[Tejicano]

It reminds me of Monty Python : "Bring out your gays! Bring out your gays!" - with the subject denying that his being gay makes him bitter, psychotic, or damaged in some other way.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Did he make you do drawings?

They did for me.

It went nowhere.

In case you can't tell.

[jesse.in.mb]

Nope, no drawings. I had to do that when I was in grief counseling when I was 7 or 8 though.

Can you imagine the Reason comments had we all been successful subjects of therapy?

[Agammamon]

Can you imagine the comments if we could do drawings?

[Corning]

At one point he called me one of his most difficult patients, a moment I will cherish until senility sets in.

You do realize that that was part of his bullshit snakeoil salesmanship act right?

It is like when a dentist tells you how great your teeth are while he caps them or wrenches down on your braces.

[jesse.in.mb]

What was he trying to make me over confident so I'd let my guard down and suddenly decide I'd been touched by a random male figure in my life?

[Enough About Palin]

That's what they said about lesbians: either too much tit from mom or not enough.

[Lord at War]

jesse-

I guarantee most of them aren't saying "I felt truly loved, but in a gruff, 1950s kinda way."

I've always described my relationship w/ my father as, "I knew he loved me, but he didn't like me that much."

He was an alcoholic steelworker that got "gentleman's C's in school while I was a bookworm pothead that he couldn't help do his trig homework when I was 13.

Straight guy, born in 1964.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-One narrative about Muslim immigrants in Europe is that only a relatively small proportion holds views that are sometimes labeled as "fundamentalist." Ruud Koopmans from the Wissenschaftszentrum in Berlin argues that this perspective is incorrect. He conducted a telephone survey of 9,000 respondents in the Netherlands, Germany, Belgium, France, Austria, and Sweden

He then looks at hostility toward out-groups. Fifty-eight percent do not want homosexual friends, 45 percent think that Jews cannot be trusted, and 54 percent believe that the West is out to destroy Muslim culture. Among Christians, 23 percent believe that Muslims are out to destroy Western culture. Koopmans says these results hold when you control for the varying socio-economic characteristics of these groups

Religious fundamentalism is the strongest correlate of out-group hostility both among Muslims and Christians.

-Although Muslims are more likely to be fundamentalist and hostile toward out-groups than Christians, there are many more Christians in these countries. So, the overall numbers of Christians who feel hostile toward Muslims still vastly outnumber the Muslims who believe the West is out to destroy Muslim culture.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....4&hpid=z22

[Virginian]

A disturbingly high percentage of British Muslims supported the Tube bombings.

[robc]

Any idea where the quotes end and Bo starts?

I have no clue in that post.

[Irish]

Soon it shall all be Bo.

[Pi Guy]

I have to words for you: HTML

[Pi Guy]

"Wissenschaftszentrum"

I don't know what it means but, Jeebus, that's a lot of syllables.

[Suthenboy]

I have a question. Some reference was made to Groovus Maximus recently.

Does anyone know anything about how he is doing? It seems a bit suspicious to me that he just disappeared altogether.

[jesse.in.mb]

Last I heard sloop was still in touch with him, but that was a while ago.

[Warty]

He's fine, as of a few months ago. I imagine he's still having fun banging his Ukrainian bride 24/7.

[Suthenboy]

I certainly hope that is the case.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Rethuglicans hate old people

A U.S. bankruptcy judge ruled that Detroit could go forward with its plans to cut city workers' pensions. He did so despite a state law making such cuts illegal, and despite his observation that Kevyn Orr, Detroit's unelected city manager, "did mislead the public about the status of pensions in bankruptcy."

In the kind of Bizarro-world inversions common to today's corporate-funded politics, Orr and the Republican governor who appointed him argued against the conservative principle of states' rights in order to move forward with their plan. When principles conflict with profits, apparently profits win every time.

Detroit's manufacturing industry was outsourced, with no thought given to preserving our industrial heartland -- or, for that matter, to preserving its covenant with working people. Wall Street banks were hired to manage Detroit's pension money, and large sums vanished from the fund. Bankers may be asked to compromise on outstanding fees as part of a pension deal, but they won't be asked to account for the missing money -- and they've already been paid millions.

"Detroit ruling opens door to pension cuts across the nation," said a headline in the Los Angeles Times. That's the point. Pro-corporate politicians have been planning to break pension agreements all across the country, and they've been looking to Detroit for a green light.

[Andrew S.]

Wait, how can a state law make a ruling in federal bankruptcy illegal?

[Bam!]

When principles conflict with profits, apparently profits win every time.

What? How can a government profit during a bankruptcy?

Oh wait, it's Huffington Post. "Ooog, profits bad; must link think I don't like to profit."

[Ted S.]

Government profited during the GM bankruptcy. Just ask Shreeky; he'll tell you.

[Suthenboy]

A negative profit?

[Sevo]

Hey, just 'normalize' it by changing the sign!
Solyndra is profitable!

[Sudden]

or, for that matter, to preserving its covenant with working people.

Dafuq?

[Michael S. Langston]

Detroit's manufacturing industry was outsourced, with no thought given to... preserving its covenant with working people.

WTF does that mean? IE - can some explain precisely what is/was Detroit's manufacturing industries covenant with working people?

& how does an industry and a set of people, defined as "working people", enter into any covenant ever?

Or maybe they don't know what covenant means?

[Entropy Void]

Oh, yes they do- it's the Proglatarian Covenant with Glorious Workers and Middle Class Families.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

"Even though Reason's webathon is done, please keep us in mind if you win tonight's $425 million Mega Millions jackpot."

Parasites.

In any event, if I were to buy Reason you wouldn't want me as a boss. First order of business would be to introduce 'Topless Tuesdays.'

[Warty]

What about Mammarial Mondays? Or Wazonga Wednesdays? Did you forget about Titty Thursdays and Funbag Fridays? Surely you remembered Silicone Saturday.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Titty Thursdays? The one where we're allowed to touch any titties all day long?

I used to hop around the office pinching tits shouting 'Titty, Thursday! Titty Thursday!'

Best job for one day ever.

[Old Man With Candy]

We have Facial Fridays.

[SusanM]

You forgot sweater-stuffer Sundays!

[Pro Libertate]

Huh. So, like Playboy, but with more politics and economics.

[playa manhattan]

I read it for the articles!

[Mad Scientist]

I don't want to question your business plan, but I certainly hope you'll include more lobster girl.

[Mike M.]

Global warming strikes the Middle East!

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-Since the beginning of May, I have been writing about unintentional child shooting deaths in America?tracking their frequency, suggesting legislative remedies, and, more than anything, trying to understand how and why these so-called accidents happen. They do not happen often, in absolute terms. Mother Jones' Mark Follman recently estimated that just 84 children aged 12 and under have died in gun accidents since the Sandy Hook shooting last year. When they do happen, though, the pattern always seem the same. Again and again, kids shoot themselves or other kids with their parents' guns, guns that were left in the corner, or on a nightstand, or under a pillow. These firearms were put away loaded, or with a forgotten round in the chamber.

For now, I believe that passing and enforcing child access prevention laws is the best of a set of imperfect legislative strategies.

CAP laws provide criminal penalties for parents and guardians who unlawfully allow children to access their guns without supervision, either under direct permission or through unsafe gun storage practices.

http://www.slate.com/articles/.....hem.2.html

[Agammamon]

So, are *you* Justin Peters and are pointing us towards an article you wrote or are you quoting him?

[Bo Cara Esq.]

Just quoting him, hence the -

Peters seems quite horrible on gun rights, advocating licensing, state mandated safety courses, and pretty harsh storage laws. But when I clicked through his link describing the variety of CAP laws there were some as a libertarian I could actually support (making it easier to sue someone who did not do enough to prevent access to their gun and then the gun was used by a child to harm someone).

[Virginian]

What if someone kept a chef's knife in an unlocked drawer, and that knife was removed and used to murder.

Is the knife owner to be held civilly liable?

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I can certainly imagine circumstances where a parent not taking reasonable steps to keep a chef's knife out of the hands of a small child, and then that small child harming another child, should be liable for a tort action.

[Virginian]

Reasonable steps of course to be decided post facto by a panel of idiots who can't muster enough cunning to get out of jury duty.

Sounds like a great plan there.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

We use that method for every other tort action. Just as guns should not be seen as exceptionally targeted I do not think they should be exceptionally protected in this area.

[BakedPenguin]

I've tried to be patient, but robc is right to be pissed that you refuse to either get fucking reasonable for Chrome, or learn to do very, very basic tags when you're quoting someone.

Italics.

blockquote

Either work, and italics are stupid easy. It's really not that hard. And it will decrease your trollometer readings by at least 25%. Give it a go, Bo.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-robc is right to be pissed that you refuse to either get fucking reasonable for Chrome, or learn to do very, very basic tags when you're quoting someone.

I am sorry, I do not mean to offend by the format or lack thereof I use. But frankly I think it is a pretty silly thing to be angry at someone about.

[jesse.in.mb]

I don't think they're upset about your formatting specifically. You're showing disrespect for your reader by choosing a format so out of alignment with community norms that we have to work to interpret where your quotes begin and end. It's fundamentally an issue of you being inconsiderate.

If you want to be judged by the content of your posts, stop making them unnecessarily difficult to parse.

[Raven Nation]

Hell, I'm clueless on how to use italics, etc. in a post, but I at least have the courtesy to use "quotation marks" if I'm quoting someone.

[Tejicano]

All the guns I own, except for the really rare and expensive ones in the bank safety deposit box, are in a safe which is a minimum of 1/2 homogenous steel on all surfaces. Anything which is not in there is either on me or if set down is on a surface at about eye level for me or higher, out of reach of my children.

The biggest penalty possible that I would pay, should one of my children get their hands on a loaded gun, would be any injury or death to happen to anyone as a result. No law will make that better or worse.

Otherwise, keep your government out of my household. Molon Labe, mutherfucker.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

If* you allowed your or any other child to get ahold of one of your guns unsupervised, and they then accidentally or intentionally used that gun in hurting someone, then that someone or loved one should be able to sue you for that, your guilt notwithstanding.

*It certainly sounds like you take your responsibilities as a gun owner seriously, so I do not mean you personally, but a general 'you'

[Tejicano]

What, in the current legal state, prevents anybody from suing anybody for the scenario you present? The NRA? Gremlins?

Responsibility can always be decided in a court of law without it necessarily being spelled out in law beforehand. The law you are proposing if rife for further constraints and tightening to the point that I would never consider it.

[Suthenboy]

Here are some things to keep in mind when analyzing gun control measures Bo.

No one ever wants to disarm you and make you helpless for your own good. In the end that is what every gun control advocate has as a goal, complete disarmament of civilians. They want a monopoly on force so they can more easily get their boot on your neck.

These arguments about the children are horseshit emotional appeals to try and incrementally disarm us. These people never ever ever argue in good faith. EVER.

The best answer to any suggestion of gun control;

"Fuck you. No."

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I do not see what I am talking about as gun control at all.

All would be free to own a gun, but if you allowed your child to get it and harm another you would be liable for damages.

[Suthenboy]

Isnt that already the case?

This is what I mean about them not arguing in good faith. Handwringing and urging measures that do not improve things on the liability front, but you can be sure will inch forward on the confiscation front.

[robc]

Who the fuck quotes with a dash?

And where does the quote fucking end and your commentary start?

I assume at the paragraph break, but if so, fuck you.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-Who the fuck quotes with a dash?

Me.

-And where does the quote fucking end and your commentary start?

I explained this in this very discussion.

[Agammamon]

No you didn't. You explained that you are sorry that it upsets others but you think its a silly thing to get upset about.

What you didn't explain is how to distinguish between when you are quoting something and when you are commenting on it.

*Your* format looks like either one large excerpt or one large piece of commentary, not a combination of the two and its fucking difficult to tell which is which without opening the original article, finding the place you're quoting from and then comparing where the two start to differ.

Tags are difficult (well, inconvenient at least) so you can fall back on quotation marks - something we've been using for a couple of centuries for this very purpose.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-What you didn't explain is how to distinguish between when you are quoting something and when you are commenting on it.

Bo Cara Esq.|12.13.13 @ 5:00PM|#

My comments are always before the - or after the link, everything else are quotes from the linked article.

[Michael S. Langston]

Seriously - if a fair number of your audience says the way you are formatting is unnecessarily confusing and have offered advice on what else to do - but you still absolutely refuse to modify this minor thing to help others - it is not just about you being inconsiderate and arrogant, but stupid.

I don't mean that to be personal - so please let me explain quickly - I say stupid because I assume you post things to spark discussions about the things you post.

Therefore, refusing to make very minor changes in your formatting to help others understand it more clearly, defeats the f**king purpose of posting any comment ever.

But do what you will - just don't be surprised when people start ignoring you.

[Agammamon]

When we quote, its traditional to use " at the beginning and end of the quote.

[tarran]

That's odd Bo.

Do you really think that stacking more charges on a grieving parent is going to deter other parents from leaving firearms where their kids can get at them?

Moreoever, if I leave my kid alone, I want him to have access to tools for my defense. Why do you want to disarm him?

[Warty]

I thought Bo's schtick was to quote ridiculous passages from articles that he wants to make fun of.

[tarran]

Doesn't he do the minus sign thingy when he's quoting?

I am getting a little fed up that Bo seemingly can't figure out how to use HTML tags. Fuck, even shriek manages it, and he's dumber than a chimpanzee raped in the ear by Warty.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

My comments are always before the - or after the link, everything else are quotes from the linked article.

[tarran]

What you are doing is stupid. Learn how to use HTML tags.

[Pro Libertate]

Wish we could use more tags than we have. You know, like unordered list tags, underline tags, special characters of all sorts, blink tags, in-line video, the works.

[Apatheist ?_??]

If you are lazy/uninformed about html tags like me just install reasonable and it'll do all that shit for you. Once you've used it for a while you'll quickly see how to do it without reasonable too.

[Pro Libertate]

Look, if a fucking lawyer can do it, so can you. So can all of you.

[BakedPenguin]

Ha ha ha. I wished I'd read a bit further so I could have piled on instead of writing my comment upthread.

What you are doing is stupid. Learn how to use HTML tags

Yes!

Look, if a fucking lawyer can do it, so can you. So can all of you.

Damn straight!

[Apatheist ?_??]

Look, if a fucking lawyer can do it, so can you.

I'm quite sure that no one else in my office even knows what an html tag even is. They all think I'm a wizard even when I do pretty basic computer stuff.

[Sevo]

"I am getting a little fed up that Bo seemingly can't figure out how to use HTML tags."

That's the least of my complaints with Bo; see those quotation marks? Makes it clear that my post is "quoting" someone else.
Hey, Bo, look down there on the right of the keyboard!

[tarran]

Yeah, but then you have to go through the quote converting double quotes to single ones.

HTML tags are so much easier.

[Sevo]

tarran,
I have no idea how to use HTML tags and if I never learned, I'd be quite happy.

[Pro Libertate]

Refusal to speak HTML is gauche and uncultured. I shun you. SHUN.

[Sevo]

Gee, wonder if I'll live through it...

[Pro Libertate]

With HTML, I can kill you with a single tag! Except not here, because they shut off all of the good stuff years ago.

[Sevo]

"With HTML, I can kill you with a single tag! Except not here, because they shut off all of the good stuff years ago."

And the intent it to make what you're trying to communicate clear, so you quote and perhaps space between that and your comments.
Try to make it easy on the reader.

[Enough About Palin]

Just block the fucker. It's heavenly.

[BakedPenguin]

Fair enough. Also, what Sevo said. Even damn double quotes would suffice. It's hard to think Bo's trying to be anything other than a troll.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I never thought of a troll as being defined by the format with which they post, but by the content of their posts.

[Agammamon]

When you post something that is difficult to parse (deliberately so) then yeah, that's got some trolling in it.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

The only CAP laws I saw that I could support were laws that made it easier to sue someone who allowed a child to get a gun and shoot someone else. I do not think such lawsuits would target the parents of children who were harmed by access to the parent's gun, but they should be available if someone allows their child to use their gun to harm, say, the potential plaintiff's child.

[playa manhattan]

I was unaware that winning a wrongful death suit was so damned difficult under current law.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I value gun rights as much as anyone here. The right to defend myself and my property, from thugs governmental or non is fundamental.

My father owned guns and taught me to use and respect them. Guns come with responsibility, because they are so potentially dangerous. Just like a parent who would leave their keys in their running car and a child in the front seat should be liable for damages that follow from the child putting the car into gear and running over someone, so should a parent be liable for not taking reasonable steps to keep their gun from a child's hands in an unsupervised situation. To be honest, I am not sure I would oppose making it strict liability like torts involving dangerous animals.

[Agammamon]

HIs point is, why does there need to be *another* set of laws dealing with this? Why isn't existing tort law sufficient?

If its because people aren't bringing up these suits now, maybe that's because most normal people don't think its useful to do so.

We already have a general tort covering wrongful death, injuries, etc. It makes no sense to have another law covering specifics that are already included in the general set.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

-Why isn't existing tort law sufficient?

Existing tort law varies from state to state. Here is a sampling of different standards for civil liability in this area:

-California imposes civil liability on the parent or guardian of a minor for damages resulting from the minor's discharge of a firearm, where the parent or guardian permitted the minor to have the firearm or left it accessible to the minor. Connecticut imposes strict liability in civil actions on persons who fail to store firearms securely, where a minor gains access and causes injury or death. In Illinois, when a minor under the age of 21 legally acquires a firearms license by obtaining the permission of a parent or guardian, that parent or guardian becomes liable for civil claims for damages resulting from the minor's use of firearms or ammunition. In Nevada, a parent or guardian is jointly and severally liable with the minor for civil damages caused by permitting the minor to possess a firearm, where the parent or guardian knows that the minor has a propensity to commit violent acts or has been previously adjudicated delinquent or has been convicted of a criminal offense, or knows or has reason to know that the minor intends to use the firearm for an unlawful purpose

http://smartgunlaws.org/child-.....y-summary/

[Agammamon]

Wait, so *now* you don't support federalism? What's wrong with state by state variations in tort to meet the differences that those populations have in expected behavior?

[Agammamon]

To be honest, I am not sure I would oppose making it strict liability like torts involving dangerous animals.

I would suggest that the similarities here are not between owning a dangerous animal and a *gun* but between owning a dangerous animal and having a child.

Maybe we should have strict liability tort for *any* damage caused by children.

[Tejicano]

With a few seconds of consideration I can see the steps from your "modest" proposal so the end goal :

Legal penalties for leaving guns unsecured which end in crime by children

- then becomes : Legal penalties for leaving guns unsecured which end in crime by others

- later to add : Legal requirements constraining the type of containers for guns (materials and thicknesses, lock types, access to keys or combinations, etc.)

- further tightening : Legal penalties for unsecured guns (effectively no bathroom breaks while cleaning a gun)

- as long as we're this far : Ammunition storage requirements (how many rounds, proximity to guns, locked cases, etc.)

- since that didn't work : periodic inspections by LEO (leading to surprise inspections at some future time...)

Yeah, I'm SURE you didn't intend any of this and everybody would promise this would never happen. Just like NY state promised that registration would not lead any further than recording gun ownership.

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I would draw the line at the last line excerpted below:

-Legal penalties for leaving guns unsecured which end in crime by children

- then becomes : Legal penalties for leaving guns unsecured which end in crime by others

[Tejicano]

Thanks for the hard line in the sand.

Next week the next proposal will not stop there. That is the way the left has been fighting this from the beginning.

[Agammamon]

Yeah - I was told my remains identification DNA sample would never be used by law enforcement.

That promise lasted less than a year - and I even had it on paper!

[Rufus J. Firefly]

It makes no sense that in response to violent crime we want to disarm the victims.

It's retarded. You'll never get me to intellectually agree to that. Legally I have no choice.

The fuckers.

[Virginian]

I love when leftisit fuckheads discover something that us gun toting rubes learned before our voices broke. I mean seriously, I could recite the four rules from memory before I turned 11.

[Warty]

What I like is that these scumbags are unable to think of any solution to any problem that doesn't involve government violence. I imagine the conversation at Slate's offices (do they have an office?) went something like this:

"Holy shit!!! Accidental shootings sometimes happen!!! We've got to do something!"

"That's terrible. We could start a public awareness campaign about the rules of gun saf..."

"Shut the fuck up, faggot! THREATEN THEM WITH JAIL!"

[Virginian]

It's almost like these terrible tragedies are just used as cover to push to a preexisting agenda of state control.

[Suthenboy]

Yep, almost. I am tempted to think they never argue in good faith.

[Ted S.]

You don't think having to bury a child is punishment enough?

[Bo Cara Esq.]

I think if my child were shot by someone else's child who got ahold of their gun then I should be able to sue that someone else. I even think I could support that kind of suit being strict liability (we have strict liability for cases where the keeper of a dangerous animal gets loose and harms someone).

I can not support a coercive measure to disarm anyone, or force training or what have you. But the NAP allows for tort lawsuits and holding people responsible. People should act to keep their firearms away from children in an unsupervised situation, and those that do not, and their omission leads to harm, should be responsible for that harm.

[Agammamon]

But, you already *can*.

[Rich]

I've seen no evidence to suggest that gun-owning parents somehow intrinsically understand and adhere to ideal safety practices.

How hard did you look, Peters?

[Michael S. Langston]

I don't know if I'm blocking Peters... but to this:

I've seen no evidence to suggest that gun-owning parents somehow intrinsically understand and adhere to ideal safety practices.

I reply to the author: I see no evidence to suggest your not raping underage children, small animals, and the disabled.

To mitigate this damage, you'll need to be removed from society and held for close observation.

[Michael S. Langston]

you're

[kinnath]

Use the fucking italics or block quote.

[Eduard van Haalen]

Wait - you're quoting social libetals now?

[Bobarian]

Wait, who are you quoting after the dash?

[Irish]

They do not happen often, in absolute terms. Mother Jones' Mark Follman recently estimated that just 84 children aged 12 and under have died in gun accidents since the Sandy Hook shooting last year. When they do happen, though, the pattern always seem the same. Again and again, kids shoot themselves or other kids with their parents' guns, guns that were left in the corner, or on a nightstand, or under a pillow. These firearms were put away loaded, or with a forgotten round in the chamber.

84 in a year? Why not mandate that every parent put a certain amount of padding on their stairs? I'm sure that would save more than 84 children.

[Agammamon]

At what cost to people with poor balance. You just wanna kill granma!

[jesse.in.mb]

StopDataMining.me
A directory of Opt-Out links to stop data brokers from selling your personal information.

I realize most of the commentariat is more concerned with government surveillance, but this could be an interesting resource for those who aren't excited about companies trading your info for marketing purposes.

It's also a neat example of private interests filling in when a Federal "recommendation" was ignored.

In 2012, a report by the Federal Trade Commission recommended that the industry set up a public Web portal that would display the names and contact information of every data broker doing business in the United States, as well as describe consumers' data access rights and other choices. But, for years the data brokers have been too busy to build a centralized Web portal for consumers. So, we decided to help them out and StopDataMining.me was born!

[Apatheist ?_??]

Is there going to be a Reason bowl pick-em again this year?

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Illinois woman arrested for attempting to poison former housemate

A Pekin woman remains behind bars after allegedly trying to poison a friend with rat poison.
Amanda Pollard, 28, is charged with tampering with food, a class 2 felony, and criminal trespass, a misdemeanor.
Police said Pollard was living with the victim until December 1, when he called police to have her evicted. She took her possessions and left the home.
A few days later, the victim asked a friend to check his house while he was at work because he was afraid Pollard may do something.
The friend went to the house and found Pollard inside. He told police he saw her put rat poison in both a coffee container and cereal container. He said she also cut a cord on his electric blanket and urinate in a mouthwash bottle.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Europe: Italian court releases pedophile after 11 year old girl tells court she loves him

A court has annulled a five-year jail term for a 60-year-old man who was caught in bed with an 11-year-old-girl on the grounds they have a 'romantic relationship'.

The supreme court in the southern Italian town of Catanzaro ruled that it was a 'real relationship', according to local media reports.

The young girl is said to be from a disadvantaged background and was in the care of a man who works for the town's social services department.

However, police raided the man's seaside villa to find the pair naked in bed together.

The man was given a five-year sentence for sexual violence against a minor, as the age of consent is 14 and rises to 16 when one of the partners is in position of authority or care over the younger participant.

However, the child sex victim reportedly claimed to be in love with the elderly man and the court ruled the pair have a 'romantic relationship'.

The case is being sent back to the Catanzaro court for a retrial and there are expected to be several levels of appeal before a sentence is confirmed.

That's sick.

[Brett L]

Maybe he's Batman.

[tarran]

The Italian court system is fucking medieval. As in they believe in witches and shit.

Personally, I advocate avoiding that put of stupidity entirely.

[Rufus J. Firefly]

Meanwhile they put scientists in jail for not having predicted earthquakes accurately.

Messed up. This is a G7, first rate civilization we're talking about here. Not some third world, parking lot we call a 'country.'

[jesse.in.mb]

Can't imagine why the international community is panicked about what's happening in Russia.

During Novosibirsk tour "Spiritual talks" on December, 8 Russian actor Ivan Okhlobystin, 47, made several harsh homophobic remarks while fully packed venue greeted them with applause.

I myself would shove all live gays into furnace. This is Sodom and Gomorrah, I as a beliver [sic] in God can not treat this indifferently, this is a live threat to my kids!? I do not want my kids to think that faggots are normal. This is lavender fascism. If a person can not choose someone of an opposite sex for procreation ? this is a overt sign of mental abnormality, so they should be denied of voting rights.

Oh look, people are applauding the idea of shoving gays into ovens because we're coming after the kids, mentally ill, and sapping national morality and well being. This will end well.

[Enough About Palin]

Then just stop coming after the kids then, okay? Is it really that hard?

[playa manhattan]

Lavender fascism? It sounds so threatening!!!

[jesse.in.mb]

At least lavender smells nice when being incinerated. God forbid you put actual people into a furnace. You can't get that smell out.

[Sudden]

Perhaps it was something lost in the translation when he suggested that gays should be flaming?

[jesse.in.mb]

Homer: I like my beer cold, my TV loud and my homosexuals flaming.

[Agammamon]

If a person can not choose someone of an opposite sex for procreation

Hmm, I thought that was what gays did. They just choose persons of the same sex for *recreation*.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Daily Mail helps New Zealander track down love interest

The American girl who was the focus of a worldwide Facebook search for a lovesick New Zealander today told MailOnline that romance may still be on the cards and she's 'waiting for him to get in touch'.
Reese McKee launched the campaign last week with a heartfelt plea for help in tracking down the mystery 'Katie' who he met just once on New Year's Eve in Hong Kong.
His plan was successful, but after being bombarded with messages from strangers, student Katie Capp, from McLean, Virginia, deleted her online profiles.
Reese took it badly and believed she wanted nothing to do with him. But MailOnline can reveal that Miss Capp is single and waiting for his call.
And with a little Christmas magic, the pair may even be able to set a date? for a date.
The 20-year-old - tracked down by MailOnline to a small town in the south of France on the Italian border - even admitted that she might have feelings for him too.
She said: 'I haven't made up my mind yet about whether I like him or not. I'm still waiting for him to get in touch.'
And even more heartening for Reese, the pretty brunette added that she hasn't got a boyfriend at the moment.

Her? I guess she's okay.

[jesse.in.mb]

So how long do we have to wait for a sappy British holiday rom-com based on this scenario?

[Warty]

"How about, like, Adam Sandler, is like, from New Zealand, or something, and he meets a girl, and he, like, loses her, or whatever, so he asks people on facebook to find her. Or something."

"I love it! We'll call it Cyberstalk Me!"

[BiMonSciFiCon]

+4000

[Warty]

Weren't the Jezzies pissed about this guy? Good for him.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

A Slate Double X feminist wrote a blog post about how even though she explicitly told the guy to find her she couldn't possibly have meant it that way and that he was creeping and the internet is sexist and blah blah blah.

[Apatheist ?_??]

I don't know, she's already pretty homely at 20.

[playa manhattan]

Yeah. What the fuck is wrong with this guy? Psych issues for sure.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Maybe she's funny and has a nice personality?

[Virginian]

Yeah this is just a sad little story. He had an awesome time in a cool city with this chick, and now he's built this elaborate fantasy based on the fact that they hung out randomly one night, likely both intoxicated.

She's just a girl dude. Maybe she's your one true soulmate, but odds are she isn't.

[Tejicano]

He's a Kiwi. I suspect he's tired of sheep.

[Mad Scientist]

She said: 'I haven't made up my mind yet about whether I like him or not.'

Translation: She doesn't yet know how much money he has.

[Agammamon]

. . .the pretty brunette added that she hasn't got a boyfriend at the moment.

Hmm, I wonder why. Nothing to do with the smell of crazy emanating off her.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Learning cursive is a basic human right

Takoma records trumpeted Williams' illiteracy?with the printing of the signature they signaled to the audience the thrill of a hardened criminal life and raw emotion of the primitive musician. But the single line of scrawl is more deeply emblematic of the evils of the segregated society.

The signature, the ability to sign one's own name with grace and confidence, has long been an essential marker of society. Today more and more I meet high school students who, though they can read, sometimes well and sometimes poorly, are ashamed whenever they are confronted with the need to sign a document. Students are sometimes too embarrassed to admit that they can't read a piece of an important historical document or the comments of a teacher who writes in script. Script is not seen by students as some quaint relic of the past. Even among kids for whom academic achievement is hardly "cool," students recognize the pedigree that the knowledge of the cursive alphabet and the ability to write it fluently represent. Cursive has become a status marker.

My signature is illegible but that hasn't stopped me from being accepted by society. I think.

[jesse.in.mb]

You can't see it, but every other commenter has just turned their back to their screens.

[playa manhattan]

Your signature should be illegible. It's safer.

[Eduard van Haalen]

Illegible handwriting used to be a stereotype about *doctors.*

[jesse.in.mb]

I have an easier time reading Korean than I do our older doctors' hand writing.

[Tejicano]

I learned Kanji the old school way : 2 to 3 hours every day for a year with brush and ink.

But my handwritting in English still sucks. Maybe not illegible but not pretty by any measure.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

My issues with handwriting stem from my left-handedness and how I hold the pen.

[jesse.in.mb]

Did I realize you were part of team sinister?

Do you do the upside-down hand thing or just smear the shit out of everything you write? I do the latter.

[EDG reppin' LBC]

Lefty here. I smear the shit out of everything. Thank god for computers.

[jesse.in.mb]

I really like writing in pencil but the entire side of my hand ends up looking like one of those robot street performers a few lines in.

[The Rt. Hon. Serious Man, Visc]

Smear the shit out of everything. But apparently even by lefty standards I hold the my writing utensil odd.

Oh well, no one really needs to penmanship anymore

[jesse.in.mb]

I developed a completely alternate form of printing because I was writing on whiteboards for students and would just make a mess. so now I have fast, illegible left handed writing and a quirky, but very legible version of it.

Remind EDG or I to hand you a pen when we get together for drinks so we can judge you.

[cavalier973]

Southpaws, huh?

Buncha weirdos.

[paranoid android]

Yeah, and whatever happened to shorthand?

[Agammamon]

My signature is illegible but that hasn't stopped me from being accepted by society. I think.

Yeah, it certainly wasn't your signature.

[jesse.in.mb]

Google removes awesome privacy/security feature from latest iteration of Android calling it a mistake.

Google had introduced more granular control over per-app permissions, which it has since retracted. Android nerds are a-twitter about what it means.

[Corning]

that is nothing. you should see how the youtubers are reacting to all the new IP violation notices they have been getting.

Google has really been fucking up lately.

[Eduard van Haalen]

Expert says debate on Santa's race could spark a "national conversation."

http://www.politico.com/story/.....01152.html

[Pro Libertate]

Jesus. Oops, I just cursed with/prayed to a white man.

[Kid Xenocles]

"and will allow the agency to retain control over U.S. Cyber Command rather than switching to civilian leadership."

What? No other unified command has civilian leadership.

[Agammamon]

To be fair, no other command is as pointless and desperately looking for relevance.

[Kid Xenocles]

I just don't get Reason's apparent shock that a military command will continue to be led by the military.

[Agammamon]

Mainly because its barely a military command - dreamed up by the Air Force to get first dibs on new missions (they're still laughing at the Army for stealing the land-based ICBMs from them and pissed at the Navy for rendering them obsolete) and to maintain relevance as the air warfare paradigm shifts.

[CE]

I thought the NSA was civilians. They don't get guns, do they?

[Agammamon]

They are, but for some reason there's a general in charge.

[RishJoMo]

Sam diddy soso is not going to like that.

http://www.Anon-Go.tk