A.M. Links: U.S. Bungles Edward Snowden Extradition Request, Republicans Mull Responses to Gay Marriage Decision, Judge Rules on Starbucks Tips

• 

  rocket ship/foter.com

  U.S. officials got Edward Snowden's middle name wrong in the extradition request sent to Hong Kong, which could be why Hong Kong declined to grant it. Top. Men.

• Barack Obama arrives in Senegal to start a week-long trip in Africa meant to assuage criticism he's ignored the continent in his presidency so far. Now cut taxes to assuage criticism you're a tax and spend liberal.
• Republican congressman Tim Huelskamp suggests a constitutional amendment to reverse the "radical" Supreme Court's gay marriage decision. Justin Amash, meanwhile, warns fellow Republicans not to say anything stupid in response to the decision, which he says is supported by many young conservatives. Too late.
• A military appeals court overturns the murder conviction of a Marine sergeant who led a squad in Iraq that captured, bound, and then killed a civilian because the sergeant's statement to a military investigator should've been ruled inadmissible.
• The leftie gossip blog Gawker, which once ran an item suggesting a maximum allowable wage, is being sued by three interns who say the company violated minimum wage laws by not paying them anything for their work.
• Kimberly McCarthy becomes the 500th inmate executed by the state of Texas since the death penalty came back to use in 1982. Rick Perry, meanwhile, has called a second special session to reconsider new sweeping restrictions on abortion in the state.
• A court rules shift supervisors can share tips with the service staff at Starbucks but not assistant managers.
• Pope Francis wants to audit the Vatican Bank, long accused of corruption and money-laundering.

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Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

Republican congressman Tim Huelskamp suggests a constitutional amendment to reverse the "radical" Supreme Court's gay marriage decision.

Hopefully they can slip flag burning into the amendment as well. Really fix the country.

[LTC(ret) John]

So... no burning gay American flags unless they are married?

[DontShootMe]

Maybe if you burn a flag at a gay wedding, a couple of Congress critters will explode?

[jesse.in.mb]

a couple of Congress critters will explode

Bah, now I need to find someone to marry, and find a shop that carries real canvas flags (nobody wants the smell of burning synthetic fabric on their special day). Let's make this happen.

[DontShootMe]

Isn't Barney Frank single again? Wow, that's nasty, even for me.

[jesse.in.mb]

Hmm, it could work if we had Ann Coulter officiate, but then I'd be a widower on my wedding day. Doesn't someone at the Reason staff have a great rapport with Coulter? We can still make this happen.

[Ted S.]

You'd think these fucking idiots would learn from the Democrats' idiocy over Citizens United.

[RBS]

You'd think so, but you'd be wrong.

[Nooge.]

You'd think these fucking idiots would learn from the Democrats' idiocy over Citizens United.

I wouldn't think that, actually. Most of the tribe is too stupid to learn anything.

[Dingus]

I want to start a dada protest movement where I stand next to these folks, the westboro baptist church, and any other moral majority type with a sign that says "God Hates Flags!"

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

I like that! Can I join your movmeent?

[invisible furry hand]

You cannot join a dada movement. You can however leave it

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Nonsense!

[T]

I'm fond of a protest sign I saw once: "Down With This Sort of Thing!". Stand next to the Westboro folks and see who gets the joke.

[invisible furry hand]

Careful now

[T]

So that's the original. I've seen one in the wild somewhere, though. I didn't realize it was from Father Ted at the time.

I aspire to be Father Jack when I get old.

[invisible furry hand]

Bishop Brennan demands they protest against a blasphemous movie. Their protest is so successful that the film is a huge hit - "People are coming from Gdansk!"

Re Father Jack, tis a noble ambition but why wait for old age?

[T]

I have to wait for the wife to not mind first. That may take a while.

[KMA Too]

Lie it wait, brave T...

[KMA Too]

Careful now

+100 Feck Arse Industries

[robc]

I want to go to a Westboro protest with a sign that says:

GOD HATES FIGS
Matthew 21:19

[Loki]

+1 Fig tree.

The sad thing is most of them won't even get it.

[Fatty Bolger]

Awesome. One of my all time favorite bible verses.

[Jon Lester]

Mine is Revelation 22:17

http://biblehub.com/revelation/22-17.htm

[db]

"Kmmggglggppmmmmm!"

[Zeb]

I had a sort of similar idea. I wanted to go stand next to the old hippies who protest war in front of the town hall (which, to their credit, they are still doing), with a sign reading "FUCK PEACE". Not that I'm unsympathetic to their opposition to optional wars, but it would be really marvelously absurd.

[Rasilio]

Please let him try it, so they can finally see just how outnumbered they are

[Don Mynack]

Stupid. Party.

[Nooge.]

Republican congressman Tim Huelskamp suggests a constitutional amendment to reverse the "radical" Supreme Court's gay marriage decision.

Please, Mr. Brave Congressman, protect us from THE GAY! /sob

[Matrix]

IRS needs MOAR MONIES!!

[BigT]

And it's on tax filers' behalf that she is urging Congress to stop cutting the IRS budget while adding mightily to the agency's to-do list.

How about adding to the DO NOT DO list? That would save them time and money.

[Brett L]

1) Zero out the conference budget and re-allocate it to this for FY2014.

[Certified Public Asskicker]

And this is what I meant yesterday when I said the taxpayer advocate was full of shit.

[mad libertarian guy]

"I advocate on behalf of the Taxpayers, and conclude that they need to have more money taken from them so that the IRS can be more efficient in taking yet more money from them!"

[Gbob]

Look, crushing political enemies isn't cheap. You wouldn't want any of those nasty tea party types to walk around un-audited.

[Matrix]

Nintendo is EVUL!!!

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Jesus. While I understand the drive for conflict free materials. The electronics supply chain is fungible. Good luck trying to get enough truth out of your component suppliers as to where your capacitors came from originally. Only Intel may have enough clout to pull that off.

[Matrix]

companies are supposed to be omniscient, Scruffy... except when it comes to personal data... and then they are also supposed be omniscient at the convenience of whomever is demanding such data.

[BigT]

A court rules shift supervisors can share tips with the service staff at Starbucks but not assistant managers

Presumably Congresscritters will be sharing their bribes with their constituents now.

[LTC(ret) John]

No, no! Just their staffers - not constituents.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Barack Obama arrives in Senegal to start a week-long trip in Africa meant to assuage criticism he's ignored the continent in his presidency so far.

Also to assuage that criticism he has directed Edward Snowden to release all the documents he has on Obama's spying on Africans.

[BigT]

He is just assuring himself a good seat for the Mandela funeral.

[Rich]

He's getting better ....

[Ice Nine]

And of course "there is a racist element" to the int'l press trying to get the story, according to his daughter, though the cretin doesn't bother to explain her hallucination.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Imagine if Obama had given Africa $5 billion of US taxpayer money like Bush did.

Wingnuts would really riot.

[BigT]

Are you saying that $5 bn to fight AIDs in Africa was a bad investment? Or are you saying that a $100 MM vacation is bad?

If you are indicating that all foreign aid is wasteful, then we are in agreement.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Yes, a bad investment. Not the role of the federal govt either.

[GroverinCA]

I.e., BOOOOOOOSH!!!!1!!

Seek help, numbskull.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Bush makes Obama look much better than he really is.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Now that's some flamebait

[WTF]

BUSHPIG!!!!!CHRISTFAG!!11!!!!

[Enough About Palin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlYlNF30bVg

[Matrix]

Worried about accidentally 3D printing a gun? YOU NO LONGER NEED TO FEAR!
A Danish company is working on software to shutdown 3D printers if it detects a firearm component being printed

[Live Free or Diet]

That's easy. Use someone else's software.
Does that make me a hacker?

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

The derp is strong with this one

[Matrix]

yeah, it's not like it can't be easily cracked.

[db]

Will it shut down if you try to print a Pop-Tart?

[itsnotmeitsyou]

Oh, heavens, no! It will immediately call in a drone strike on its location. We can't have people making Pastries of Mass Destruction, now can we?

[sarcasmic]

Polygamists welcome Supreme Court rulings on gay marriage predicting relationships with multiple people will be next

'The nuclear family is not the majority' after marriage ruling, says activist
Court decision 'blazes a trail' for polygamous marriage, according to some

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....-next.html

But, but, but....

[Andrew S.]

Nothing in the DOMA decision would have an effect on polygamy.

SLD1: State shouldn't be involved in marriage, yadda yadda yadda.

SLD2: I really don't care if 3 people want to get married, or two guys, or two girls, or 3 women and 2 men.

[Auric Demonocles]

But 2 men and 2 women is an abomination.

[Rasilio]

yeah but 1 man and 3 women is a party 😉

[AlexInCT]

Not if you are married to them...

[Rasilio]

While I believe in and practice polyamory I gotta disagree.

Gay marriage was trivial to retrofit into the standard legal marriage model, polyamory in all it's forms is not

In any binary marriage regardless of the genders of the participants there are still only 2 people so thinks like default inheritance, social security survivors benefits, insurance sharing, and assumed power of attorney in cases of impairment are exactly the same for all. Add a 3rd or more party to that marriage and all of a sudden the legal framework surrounding those issues and hundreds of others falls apart.

True, laws against plural marriage should be struck down under the same reasoning that allows gay marriage but full legal "recognition" of plural marriage is a much tougher nut to crack and is likely to end up being unfair to someone no matter how they tried to do it.

[Xenocles]

Just make it like an LLC with each spouse getting an equal share of the corporation's assets upon mutually agreed dissolution. For inheritance the assets of the deceased simply get absorbed back into the corporation. Insurance companies could write policies for multiple spouses and just charge more.

I've never heard of an assumed POA. Frankly, the general one I signed for my wife seems to be useless. Despite the warnings not to do it because it gives your spouse power over "literally everything," every office I've dealt with wants me to sign their specific POA before they'll let her do anything. At any rate, the family can figure it out for themselves.

At the end of the day it's not for the law to make sure a marriage is fair. That's the job of the adults in the marriage.

[Rasilio]

Oh I agree these things can be done between the members of the family, the issue is that "legal recognition" is supposed to resolve all the issues by default.

Right now if I had a stroke and ended up in a coma no paperwork required my wife is authorized to make medical decisions for me, not my parents, not my siblings, my wife. But if I had 3 wives and 2 husbands and we didn't think to designate one of them with Medical POA for me? Which of them gets to make the decisions? The law has no answers.

With plural marriage all the law can really do is get out of the way and let the families establish the rules and practices that make the most sense to them

[Xenocles]

It could be as simple as requiring the first parties to join the marriage to designate one or more "senior members" or a seniority list to determine who by default makes the decisions. Then make it easy to override the default with a POA. They might not like having to document "seniority," but tough shit. It prevents them from tying up the courts in twenty years with their bickering.

And of course I'm all for the law getting out of the way of the family dynamic, aside from extreme and obvious cases of abuse.

[Brett L]

Someone needs to tell Miley Cyrus to watch the Selena biopic.

Miley Cyrus has hired one of her biggest fans to help her break records online.

The pop star and actress credits her "stalker" pal with boosting her profile in cyberspace, and she's rewarding her by flying her out to spend the summer with the Cyrus family.

[invisible furry hand]

Someone needs to tell her to shoot her stylist

http://www.tomandlorenzo.com/2.....nyc-2.html

[Rich]

That's pretty cool.

[Zakalwe]

No she doesn't.

[Spoonman.]

I was in Corpus Christi on business and one of my coworkers wanted to make sure I got a picture with the Selena statue (coworker is from Mexico, not sure if that has anything to do with it).

I gotta say, for a statue, it's pretty hot. I am surprised they don't have more trouble with drunk people with it.

[Zakalwe]

I grew up in Corpus Christi and I hate that fucking thing so much. It took about eight years for every radio station to stop playing her one(?) English language "hit" twice an hour.

[Spoonman.]

Was C101 not around then? That station seemed pretty intense for the week I was there.

[Zakalwe]

You kids and your rock and or roll.

[Fist of Etiquette]

U.S. officials got Edward Snowden's middle name wrong in the extradition request sent to Hong Kong, which could be why Hong Kong declined to grant it.

Ironically, his middle name is Treytur.

[LTC(ret) John]

*applauds*

[Locke]

I think *slowclap* would be more fitting

[Fist of Etiquette]

I'll take whatever.

[sarcasmic]

Sure you've only got eight pairs of shoes, Emma? That's what she claimed this week. So how does she explain this ?14,000 collection?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/fem.....ction.html
Busted!

[DontShootMe]

She meant 8 pairs of shoes in every room of every house she owns.

[Ted S.]

Each pair of shoes cost ?1,750?

[Zeb]

That's not inconceivable.

[T]

8 pairs, but she got each pair in all the colors. To a woman, that's only one pair of shoes. Different colors don't count.

[Live Free or Diet]

U.S. officials got Edward Snowden's middle name wrong in the extradition request sent to Hong Kong, which could be why Hong Kong declined to grant it.

Heehee hehe ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

Pardon me.

[Brett L]

Oh boingboing you're so brave.

Yesterday was George Orwell's birthday, and to celebrate, people in Utrecht perched little party hats atop CCTV cameras in public places.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The leftie gossip blog Gawker, which once ran an item suggesting a maximum allowable wage, is being sued by three interns who say the company violated minimum wage laws by not paying them anything for their work.

How very delicious.

[LTC(ret) John]

Indeed, irony - medium well done.

[invisible furry hand]

what's ironic? They're only ensuring these young people aren't corrupted by filthy lucre

[Ted S.]

what's ironic?

Ten thousand spoons, when all you need is a knife?

[T]

A black fly in your chardonnay?

[RBS]

They also have an article calling for a international minimum wage.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

It's delicio.us

[robc]

They were worried about going over the maximum and were just playing it safe.

[AuH20]

Waiting for articles from Gizmodo, Jalopnik, Jezebel, and Kotaku to give us the tech, automotive, feminist, and video game reasons why underpaying your interns is cool.

[Rich]

"'Oh, sh--,'" she said Trayvon told her. "'The n---- behind me.'"

Contest!

'Oh, show. The noose behind me.'
'Oh, shim. The neice behind me.'
'Oh, shoe. The nasty behind me.'
...

[El Vira]

Oh, shhh. The noise behind me.

[Nephilium]

Oh, shhh. The nagger behind me.

/South Park

[Red Rider24]

'Oh,shiv. The nimby behind me.'

[Rich]

OK, have to call this off, since the correct answer may have been deleted.

[sarcasmic]

Hotter than ever! Gwyneth Paltrow, 40, strips to racy lingerie in new trailer for sex addiction movie Thanks For Sharing

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvs.....aring.html
Not bad for 40. Not bad at all.

[RBS]

Very nice. Then Pink almost ruins it.

[SugarFree]

Why a guy would go by the stage name "Pink" baffles me. I mean, I guess if you followed it with "Floyd" or something.

[Matrix]

I am just a new boy.
Stranger in this town
Where are all the good times?
Who's gonna show this stranger around?

[Ted S.]

How much retouching has been done?

[sarcasmic]

I dunno. She shows up to movie premiers and awards shows in dresses that have open patches in places where mere mortal women over the age of 25 would have less than perfect skin.

[RBS]

So, those internships at Gawker, did they know they unpaid when they accepted them? If so, fuck them and if not fuck them for interning at Gawker.

[Brett L]

Does anyone who writes for Gawker get paid?

[invisible furry hand]

Should they?

[Brett L]

Unless its charity make-work for the mentally handicapped, no.

[AuH20]

Well, if they were to ever hire a copy-editor, especially for Jezebel, I don't think that person could be paid enough.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Justin Amash, meanwhile, warns fellow Republicans not to say anything stupid in response to the decision, which he says is supported by many young conservatives.

The GOP doesn't care about young conservatives. They don't shovel enough lobby money.

[DontShootMe]

If they didn't say anything stupid, the silence would be deafening.

[Don Mynack]

Do the Kochs?

[Fist of Etiquette]

Probably not on this topic.

[sarcasmic]

Suspect arrested after his 'accomplice "butt-dialed" 911 and accidentally told police about murder plot'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....-plot.html

How do you butt-dial the cops? I don't get it.

[Zakalwe]

Factory preset one button autodial. My first cell phone had a "hold down 9 to dial 911" feature.

[Matrix]

people still have dumb phones?

[T]

dumb people, dumb phone.

[Zeb]

I've been butt dialed from a smart phone.

And I don't even have a cell phone at all. Why woudl I want people to be able to call me wherever I am?

[PS]

The only reason I have a smart phone is because my wife got a smarter phone, so I lent my old Nokia to someone who never returned it. Now it takes me twice as long to dial or SMS someone.

[mad libertarian guy]

Now it takes me twice as long to dial or SMS someone.

What is it like to be functionally retarded?

[Rasilio]

no clue, but my kids phone somehow managed to dial 911, supposedly when no one was even on the same floor as it.

I got home at the exact same time as the cop arrived fortunately and it was one of those rare instances where the cop was entirely reasonable, personable, did his job of making sure everything was ok and went on his way

[The Late P Brooks]

Oops

It has been a tough year for many in the electric vehicle industry, and the new technology just scored another negative headline. On Tuesday night in the German city of Ludwigsburg, a Porsche prototype with an alternative drive went up in flames due to a technical defect, causing extensive damages, the police said. That's bad news for the whole industry.

Authorities estimated the damages at nearly ?3 million. Porsche itself declined to comment, though a spokesman said the damages were below ?1 million. According to the sports car maker, the employee drove the car home after work. He later noticed the fire in the garage and alerted the fire department. The employee as well as his wife were slightly injured and were taken to the hospital for examination. Four fire trucks and 19 fire personnel were required to extinguish the fire, police said.

Bonus fanboi butthurt in comments.

[Ted S.]

Any photos of the car burning up?

[John]

If Porsche can't build an electric car, one cannot be built.

[Sevo]

"Republican congressman Tim Huelskamp suggests a constitutional amendment to reverse the "radical" Supreme Court's gay marriage decision."

'Jeeze, guys, this boat's sinking! Let's blow a hole in the hull to let the water out!'

[Andrew S.]

The Republican Party should be for more gun control. Maybe it would prevent them from repeatedly shooting themselves in their own feet.

[Rich]

Once again -- It's not known as "The Stupid Party" for nothing.

[Jordan]

Damn you!

[Jordan]

We don't call 'em the Stupid Party for nothing.

[Rich]

The Libertarians aren't known as "The Slow Party" for nothing. 😉

[Lord Humungus]

we're not all from Canada.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Rep for Kansas, no surprise there.

"OH MY GOD, THERE ARE COCKS TOUCHING EACH OTHER SOMEWHERE IN THE UNTIED STATES AND I HAVEN'T SUFFICIENTLY HAD A CHANCE TO EXPRESS MY DISAPPROVAL"

Fucking Neo-Inquisition Assholes

[Ted S.]

Rep for Kansas, no surprise there.

Because there aren't idiot legislators in the other 49 states.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Kansas has a strong penchant for this particular type of stupid. Each state seems to have its own flavor of derp.

[AuH20]

Speaking of Kansas, the new Superman was pretty meh.

Just had a really odd, disjointed feel to the whole film.

[LTC(ret) John]

And they gave us Sibelius...Whats the Matter with Kansas, indeed.

[Ted S.]

Jean Sibelius is Finnish. Kathleen Sebelius is a Kansan.

[LTC(ret) John]

Kansaslandia?

[LTC(ret) John]

At least mine was a cultured typo, ne?

[db]

They should be in favor of gay marriage, since all my friends tell me that after a few months of marriage, PENIS GOES NOWHERE.

[Jumbie]

My married brother tells me different.

And he's got his fourth kid on the way.

[generic Brand]

Supreme Court overturns part of the VRA, states start going forward with Voter ID

I tried discussing this on Facebook with a few friends who were pissed off about Texas. They absolutely REFUSED to see any connection to the plight of people trying to legally obtain a gun, and their argument boiled down to "It's harder for minorities to get ID, therefore this law is racist!"

They also kept asking me to look into how often voter fraud actually happens. I know this type of stuff was covered previously on H&R, but for the life of me I couldn't remember all of the cogent arguments for or against Voter ID. "Because... RACISM!" does not count as a cogent argument.

[Spoonman.]

It's not like Texas passed a more restrictive law in response to the decision. They were just waiting on preclearance to put it in to effect.

Now, the law could easily be intended to eliminate minority votes. But the decision makes sense - why is Arizona on preclearance, but not all of North Carolina or Florida is?

Arkansas has zero jurisdictions requiring preclearance. ZERO.

[jesse.in.mb]

Now, the law could easily be intended to eliminate minority votes. But the decision makes sense - why is Arizona on preclearance, but not all of North Carolina or Florida is?

I had a similar conversation and it didn't seem to end in me being called a frightening libertarian hate monger, so I'll consider it a win.

[mad libertarian guy]

Do you really mean to imply that society has changed pretty drastically since 1965? You must be one of those deniers!

Burn him!!!

[tarran]

I shut down several proggie FB friends when I pointed out that the ID requirements for opening bank accounts, starting businesses or even accepting an employment offer were more onerous than voter ID laws, and asking them for their support in my lonely campaign to get the economic ID laws repealed.

No takers. I'm starting to suspect that my rich private school classmates want the poor to vote Democrat and then shut up, not to get all uppity by building themselves up economically.

[Ted S.]

I just find it easier not to deal with Facebook in the first place.

[generic Brand]

I guess I should just be happy that you didn't call me out on posting something that has probably already been covered ;-D

[generic Brand]

I'm starting to suspect that my rich private school classmates want the poor to vote Democrat and then shut up, not to get all uppity by building themselves up economically.

Just now starting to think that? 😉

I pointed out something similar when I said that an ID is required to purchase tobacco or alcohol, get a job, or drive. What number of voters is not doing any one of those three things, not to mention the various scenarios that you laid out. The answer I received was first "Students and the elderly." And then when I said that the law provided for distributing a vote-specific ID--that is, an ID issued just for voting--the goalposts were again shifted to point out how none of the DPS locations are in typically high minority population areas.

You don't even want to know what happened when I suggested carpooling.

[tarran]

You don't even want to know what happened when I suggested carpooling.

They took it well and said "Good Point!"? 😀

[T]

the goalposts were again shifted to point out how none of the DPS locations are in typically high minority population areas.

Bull and shit. I can think of three DPS locations off the top of my head that are in the ghetto and/or barrio. That would also imply El Paso has no DPS locations, which I can't quite believe.

[Somalian Road Corporation]

Why, it's almost like these "ID desert" arguments are actively intellectually dishonest.

[db]

Yeah, that is almozt completely bullshit. In my experience, in Pennsylvania, Driver License Centers (also where state IDs are issued) are located in either the shittiest areas of a town or in rural bumfuck...you know, where real estate is cheap.

[itsnotmeitsyou]

The best I've been able to do is to get a few of them to stop talking to me, which is a win in and of itself.

I always get the moving goalposts and the RACIST rants. It still baffles me how they will argue that ID laws are targeted at minorities because getting the ID requires a trip to a BMV and minorities won't be bothered to travel to the BMV because they are "ignorant and lazy" (an actual dem friend's words) so they just won't vote instead.

And then they call me racist for suggesting that it falls on the individual to prove their identity and eligibility to vote. Yeah, "minorities are ignorant and lazy" isn't racist at all, but "take some responsibility for your life" is horribly bigoted.

[Zeb]

Ha. That also sort of suggests that the Democrats need a lot of ignorant and lazy voters if they are going to win. Which I woudl agree with, though it also applies to republicans.

I think too many people vote anyway. If you don't care that much and can't be bothered to learn anything about the candidates beyond what your idiot friends on Facebook say, or how politics works, you shouldn't vote.

[AuH20]

^ THIS.

I fucking hate the people who don't know shit about politics but insist on voting. I am that asshole who is the first to tell people, "Don't vote. You don't care, and that's fine, but then just don't vote."

You should actually know the candidates, know their positions, know your positions, and be able to coherently explain WHY you hold the positions you do, if you plan to vote.

[Zeb]

Yeah, the idea that voting is a virtue unto itself is a terrible one. I want to punch people I see wearing those "I Voted" stickers on election day.

[Locke]

THIS- I once dated a Chinese girl (she was adopted by American parents when she was like , 5,) who went to Berkley. She said she started to lose a lot of respect for the left there because they were still racists, they just dressed it up in a "minorities can't do it for themselves so we have to do it for them" kind of way. She was always pressured into joining the Asian American groups and was expected to have Asian friends.

She said "At least the rednecks who are overtly racist are at least honest"

She became a libertarian convert by the time she moved to Arizona. (on a sad note she died in a car accident 4 years ago)

[Locke]

That was in response to "Yeah, "minorities are ignorant and lazy" isn't racist at all, but "take some responsibility for your life" is horribly bigoted."

[Palin's Buttplug]

Why should libertarians care about voter ID? It's not like there are any narrow losses where the LP got fucked out of a seat.

[generic Brand]

Well if someone votes illegitimately it effectively cancels out my already under-represented vote.

[Palin's Buttplug]

So you're GOP?

I knew that already.

[generic Brand]

Did you, now? What gave it away, me posting on reason?

[tarran]

Actually, it doesn't matter.

The only benefit of voting is that it acts like a pressure relief valve in the face of tyranny.

In close elections where the fraud starts to play a significant role, the fraudster already has significant support and thus his election over the non-fraudster is just not a catastrophic failure of representative govt.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Using that rationale, libertarians should just forget about anything near and dear to their hearts, because it's not like our pet issues get any real traction in DC.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Libertarians are slowly winning against the Drug Warriors, porno warriors, gay marriage, gun rights, privatization of industries, and other relevant topics.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Yeah, let's revisit this in 2016 after the next election. Because the way I see it, the country is having a temporary reaction to a government that turned the heat up on the stove a little too fast, but that frog is still going to get boiled.

[Locke]

I'd hope not. If Paul wins the nod, it might be first president I ever voted FOR in my life. He's shaky on some libertarian issues, but I think he can advance the cause and reverse a lot of this bullshit

[Locke]

by bullshit I mean the IRS, NSA, foreign intervention, all-pervasive gov't, etc

[edcoast]

Principles. How do they work?

[Don Mynack]

I don't care one way or the other. Why are dems so against it?

[Zeb]

I sort of object to voter ID laws because I find it annoying to have to show ID to someone who already knows who I am, as is usually the case when I vote (I live in a town with less than 2000 people). I also don't like the idea of needing photo ID for so many things, and it seems like another step toward mandatory ID just to go out in public.

[generic Brand]

That's a good argument, and one that I actually agree with for the most part.

That was NOT the argument that they were making though.

[Zeb]

No indeed. The racism argument against it is absurd.

[Locke]

I had my Dutch in-laws visit the US. We took a roadtrip on the East Coast. They were constantly complaining about showing their ID when buying beer, and that we couldn't have our beer in a can on the National Mall in DC.

My sister-in-law's boyfriend said "Where is this freedom I hear so much about?"

[Locke]

This was after being yelled at by Secret Service agents because god forbid someone gets within half a mile of our God-King.

[Don Mynack]

Why is it harder for minorities to get ID's? I've never heard of this...

[Zeb]

It isn't. It is harder for the poor and ignorant to get IDs. And because of the facts of history, black people are disproportionately poor and ignorant. I think you have to compare apples to apples. A middle class black person has no more trouble getting ID or voting than a similarly situated white person. And a poor white person has no easier a time with it than a poor black person. Just about every issue that is framed in terms of race today would be much more accurately framed in terms of socioeconomic status.
But that's not so good for riling people up.

[itsnotmeitsyou]

Well, you see, it's like this. *morphs into progderp mode*

Minorities are unequally affected by voter ID laws because fewer of them have IDs than whites. You're showing your privilege by assuming that they could get an ID as easily as you. They are by far poorer so they can't afford to pay for an ID. Even if and ID will be provided for voting purposes for free, they still would be less likely to get an ID. You see, minorities are generally less informed about things like this, so many won't know that they need to get an ID and will be turned away at the polling place. Further, we already have to send buses to poorer neighborhoods to get people up and to the polling places, I doubt they would be willing to take the extra trip that would be required to go get the proper ID on their own. So, as it is plain to see, these laws are discriminatory and racist.

*puts brain back in head*

Unfortunately, I didn't make any of these arguments up. They are actual arguments that were used by a dem friend right before she called me a racist for calling her out on her bullshit.

I need some advil now.

[Locke]

I find it hilarious that the left always screams "RACISM"! When their defense is that poor blacks are just too stupid to take care of themselves.

[itsnotmeitsyou]

The more I live and experience (and have to deal with lefty idiots), the more I am proven right that the majority of the ad hom attacks that come from the left are nothing but projection. They don't trust themselves holding a gun, everyone holding a gun is dangerous (except for the King's Men, of course. They have training and stuff)! They harbor racist feelings and opinions, you're a racist if you disagree with them. They need someone to make decisions for them and tell them how to live their life, so they can't fathom anyone being able to make their own decisions.

I've met small children that were more self aware and better at making life choices. It's kinda sad.

[SugarFree]

DAY TWO OF THE NATIONAL TRAGEDY OF GAY MARRIAGE. HUMAN CIVILIZATION HANGS BY A THREAD.

[MP]

Deaths outnumber births.

All the fault of the GAYZ. Damn non-breeders. Civilization is DOOMED.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Malthus approves this message

[Zeb]

Well, as long as they continue to stivk with the one drop rule, this is good. I hope that within a few generations, there won't be any white people at all. Let's get the races all mixed up so that no one can tell the difference anymore.

[robc]

Didnt one of the dictator's of Paraguay mandate that a few centuries ago?

[Locke]

It's already getting to this point. My white Irish/German father married a Dutch/Mexican woman. I wondered if I should answer "Hispanic" on those college application. I kindly chose the "go fuck yourself I'm not answering that question" option. Though answering Hispanic might have gotten me into some of those sweet Hispanic scholarships... ooh, imagine if I chose "Hispanic and gay"

[Zeb]

Someone I went to college with changed her last name from some normal white people name to Ochagavia to get that extra edge in admissions.

[db]

I heard that if you wanted a gay university scholarship you had to provide pictures to prove it showing the applicant as the receptive partner.

[Locke]

So.. you have to show buttsecks pictures?

[Tejicano]

A buddy of mine with the last name of "Ramos" tried to apply for a hispanic scholarship when we were in college. They turned him down because he was "Spain"-Hispanic (parents came directly from Spain), not ethnically Hispanic-American.

[Pro Libertate]

I mentioned the likelihood that polygamists could win an equal protection argument given the state and federal precedent. But something just occurred to me: GAY POLYGAMISTS [Runs screaming into the streets.]

[Bardas Phocas]

Bear Packs!

[SugarFree]

TWINK TRIBES!

[WTF]

For some reason I initially scanned that as "TWERK TREES!"

[Enough About Palin]

I'm not gonna lie to you, I busted a nut in the oak.

[Locke]

John's (and Glenn Beck's) argument against this is "Well this means the POLYGAMISTZ are going to use the precedent to have legal marriages!!"

My response: "Um, so?"

[Zakalwe]

A military appeals court overturns the murder conviction of a Marine sergeant who led a squad in Iraq that captured, bound, and then killed a civilian because the sergeant's statement to a military investigator should've been ruled inadmissible.

...after serving 5.5 years. I foresee something similar for Manning.

[Robert]

Somebody's pay should be docked for the time it takes people to parse that sentence the way it was intended. I took the "because" clause as the reason the civilian was killed before I eventually realized it was the reason for the overturn. Why couldn't you have started the damn sentence with that clause?

[sarcasmic]

Hero police dog injured in the line of duty is given a K9 guard of honor as he is released from animal medical center? and even managed a woof for TV cameras

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....meras.html
I wonder how many family pets those cops killed while their "hero" was recovering.

[WTF]

Some animals are more equal than others.

[Lord Humungus]

2 Men Rob Erie Man Of Condom At Knifepoint
http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com.....nifepoint/

Emergency dispatchers say a northwestern Pennsylvania man reported being robbed at knifepoint by two men who took only a condom from the victim.

[invisible furry hand]

Two guys, one condom? I think I've seen that on YouTube.

Seriously, Sugarfree was right - civilization is hanging by a thread. See, first you allow gay marriage and before you know it men are robbing decent people for a condom. But at least the safe sex message is still being observed

[Bardas Phocas]

I kind of expected, with all this talk of gay marriage, that sodomy would decrease.

[tarran]

I wonder how the robbers are going to split the proceeds?

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

That's a winner, right there

[Zakalwe]

Well, at least they won't have to split a baby.

[AuH20]

Isn't it obvious to everyone else?

These guys only need 1 condom because they are about to have gay sex, and one of them is a top and the other a bottom.

Jesus, you guys are dumb sometimes.

[invisible furry hand]

i believe i hinted at this in my perhaps too subtle comment

[AuH20]

You should have gone with YouPorn as your reference, you silly Kiwi.

[invisible furry hand]

Kiwi? Why you damned Canadian, i'll have your carcass dripping blood by midnight for that

[LTC(ret) John]

Sic a drop bear or him!

[jesse.in.mb]

Sharp objects and condoms do not mix!

[Warrren]

Reservoir Tip Dogs.

[Lord Humungus]

Mom, 2 kids, chihuahua trapped in E. Wash. park restroom
http://www.kboi2.com/news/local/213165231.html

Peter closed the metal door to the building out of habit, and it jammed. Jennifer's cellphone was in the car with a dead battery.

"I'd been taking pictures of the boys," she said.

The next two hours were the stuff of nightmares, stuck in the restroom with a howling Chihuahua as joggers ambled past on the bike path, oblivious to her screams from the window.

movie rights!

[B.P.]

Is this movie going to be the urban version of the film depicting hiker Aaron Ralston sawing his arm off to free himself from a fallen boulder in Moab?

[Rich]

"I am not going to be scrambling jets to get a 29-year-old hacker," said Mr Obama

They might collide with the drones.

He also said he had not called China and Russia's presidents about the case.

"Heckuva job, Kerry!"

[DontShootMe]

They might collide with the drones.

+1

[John]

Think how pathetic it is that the President now has to reassure the country he won't murder an American citizen wanted for a crime.

[mad libertarian guy]

Think how pathetic it is that the President now has to reassure the country he won't murder an American citizen wanted for a crime.

And that he brought it up at all is a sign that Snowden should be worried. I see that as a direct threat.

[sarcasmic]

Gotcha! Spectacular moment a great white shark leaps 8ft in the air as it clamps its jaws around a fleeing seal

15-foot-long great white shark showed its strength as it jumped eight feet
The predator was attempting to catch seals and decoy bait for food
Photographer Peter Verhoog, 58, said that the sight of the great white shark hunting is 'unbelievable' and makes you feel 'humble'.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....-seal.html
Wow.

[LTC(ret) John]

HURRAH! DIE MOAR SEALZ!

/Penguins

[Lord Humungus]

Wanted man takes shots at cousin over birthday party slight
http://www.gainesville.com/art.....29758/1139

A 33-year-old Gainesville man with previous felony convictions, who had a warrant out for his arrest, is back in jail after sheriff's deputies said he took four shots at his cousin Tuesday in revenge for not being invited to a birthday party for children.

that'll show 'em!

[Brett L]

Hogtown is the best place in FL!

[Pro Libertate]

It's just like Tallahassee without the politicians.

[BakedPenguin]

Gosh, why wouldn't you want him at your kids' birthday party?

[NeonCat]

Thousands of years later and people still haven't learned from the story of Eris and the apple.

Either invite the troublemaker or find something else for them to do out of town.

[Lord Humungus]

25 bike cops catch pair having sex in park
http://www.philly.com/philly/b.....-park.html

These cops needed this image burned into their minds like a fish needs a bicycle.

A pack of 25 police officers who were participating in an Upper Darby bicycle school for cops were shocked when they rode up on a man and woman having sex on a bench near the baseball diamond at Naylor's Run Park yesterday afternoon, said Upper Darby Police Superintendent Michael Chitwood.

"Imagine being arrested by 25 cops," Chitwood said."They were as shocked as the police were."

[Rich]

"Is there a problem, Officers?"

[AuH20]

And now both of them are going to be registered sex offenders.

THE SYSTEM WORKS!

[Elspeth Flashman]

Imagine being arrested by one cop while having sex, that's bad enough.

[db]

24 cops were embarrassed to find each other watching two people having sex when anotger cop showed up to arrest the couple?

[The Late P Brooks]

Bunglers, in the United States Government?

Impocerous!

[Lord Humungus]

Squirrel causes massive Wichita power outage
http://news.msn.com/us/squirre.....wer-outage

Authorities in Wichita, Kan., say a squirrel crawled into a power substation and caused a transformer blast that led to a fire that cut power to much of the city.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Squirrels continue their plot to bring America to its knees

[Zakalwe]

Authorities in Wichita, Kan., say a squirrel crawled into a power substation

He'd heard there was a cache of ampersands hidden there.

[LTC(ret) John]

+&

[Palin's Buttplug]

Anyone else watch 'Naked and Afraid' Sunday night? The chick held up much better than the survivalist guy did. 21 days in the Central American jungle and he lost 46 pounds.

I might have lasted 5 days tops.

[sarcasmic]

It was a fake.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....-told.html

[MP]

That's disappointing. I don't think "fake" is the right word, but you know what, if they are fucking dehydrated and have broken toes...that's shit I want to know. That's the whole point of a show like this. To show how fucking hard it is. Not to focus on them whining.

[Clich? Bandit]

"Naked Castaway" was pretty cool. That guy really did his time. 60 days. He openly disclosed all the "modern" he had with him (emergency sat phone, and camera related equipment) and he called in help just once, they showed it and he basically got some antibiotics and then continued on.

By the end he was "self sustaining"

pretty cool, having been a scout with wilderness survival experience I can attest to how difficult it is, dude did an awesome job.

[MP]

I'm not sure I can watch that show again. Too much whining.

And WTF...why make underwear but no footwear?

[sarcasmic]

He said a 'creepy-a** cracker' was watching him: Trayvon's girlfriend takes the stand and recounts last phone call in moments before he was shot by Zimmerman

Rachel Jeantel said she told Trayvon to run after he said: 'The n**** is still behind me'
She said she heard Trayvon ask the man 'Why are you following me?' and that he said, 'What are you doing around here?'
Defense expected to call her credibility into account
Admitted she lied about being sick on day of funeral
'I felt guilty...I was the last person that talked to their son', she said
Earlier a neighbor said she heard a boy's voice cry for help before a gun shot rang out

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....-call.html
Look that the rolls of neck-fat on that... that... whatever it is. *barf*

[generic Brand]

I live in central Florida, so this trial is on in the breakroom throughout the day. When she was being cross-examined by the defense attorney, the channel 13 news line at the bottom of the screen stated that she said she was NOT Trayvon's girlfriend.

Damn, how you gonna disown a dead nigga?

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

That's a man baby

[Ted S.]

He said a 'creepy-a** cracker' was watching him

this never gets old

[T]

An ass-cracker would be pretty creepy.

[Lord Humungus]

what kind of spread do you put on an ass-cracker?

[sarcasmic]

fumunda cheese

[itsnotmeitsyou]

Fromunda cheese.

[Locke]

I wonder what white powdery substance is on her thumb in that picture of her nails?

[sarcasmic]

Nice.

[Lord Humungus]

4 Questions To Ask During The Upcoming ObamaCare Public Relations Blitz
http://www.forbes.com/sites/pa.....ons-blitz/

The battle over ObamaCare will reignite soon, and the next front will be the war for public opinion. The American public remains deeply skeptical of the new law. Many Americans say they will not sign up for insurance in the new "exchanges" scheduled to open October 1, 2013. As a result, the Obama administration is preparing a high-profile public relations blitz to again sell the law to the public.

Here are 4 talking points ObamaCare advocates will attempt to promote ? and 4 questions Americans should ask in response.

[Palin's Buttplug]

It is past time to stop playing prevent defense and wait for the law to be put into force then criticize it. It isn't going away.

Speculation now is worthless.

[John]

Translation. Sure we completely destroyed the American health care system, but fuck you its too late.

But at least Obama stopped the NSA from spying on people and ended the wars in Asia.

[MP]

You forgot how he closed Guantanamo and eliminated the deficit.

[some guy]

And how he legalized gay marriage and ran the most transparent administration in history.

[Locke]

And how he slowed the rise of the oceans and began to heal our planet

[Palin's Buttplug]

Cigna, Aetna, United Health, the AMA, etc all disagree.

That mandate is just lovely to them - and was almost unConstitutional.

[T]

Yeah, corporations hate it when the government forces people to buy their products. Hate, hate, hate it.

[John]

Your talking points are getting increasingly pathetic. I am sure if the government passed a law that said everyone had to buy a Cadillac GM would like that too.

They using the force of law to make people buy product that they don't need or want. Amazingly, the people who sell that product love it. Wow.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Point being that as repulsive as the mandate is it won't "destroy the US medical system".

You are full of shit as usual.

[John]

Point being that as repulsive as the mandate is it won't "destroy the US medical system".

Oh its repulsive now? You were not saying that in 2010. Fuck you dickhead.

And it will partially destroy the healthcare system. Making companies treat pre-existing conditions and mandating every insurance plan be gold plated will complete the job.

[jesse.in.mb]

We just had a presentation from Kaiser and the rep kept assuring us that even though all of our premiums were going up significantly it would get better because the real cost saving was coming soon. Mind you he's telling this to a room full of medical billers, so everyone just looked at him like he was nuts.

[John]

Real cost savings is coming soon. Right after we get the death panels stood up and work with the IRS and NSA to ensure non of the Republicans get any health care.

[Gbob]

He also saved the economy from disaster. Imagine if we had to live in the terrible economy of 2007 all over again.

[some guy]

Instead we should be spending our energy reminding people that the penaltax is relatively small and will often be a more cost-effective choice than buying insurance, even through an exchange. This will be even more true after SCOTUS points out that the law says subsidies can't be provided to people who buy their "insurance" on federally managed exchanges.

[mad libertarian guy]

Submit.

That'll get 'em to make changes!

Fuck off sockpuppet.

[DK]

It is past time to stop playing prevent defense and wait for the law to be put into force then criticize it.

Ah, the "We have to implement it before we know what's in it" strategy. Shrike is Pelosi's fistpuppet.

[LTC(ret) John]

THIS!

[Lord Humungus]

Karl Rove: More White Votes Alone Won't Save the GOP
To win the presidency in 2016, the party needs to do better with Hispanics.
http://online.wsj.com/article/.....on_LEADTop

[John]

That may or may not be true. But Karl doesn't bother to explain how letting the Democrats get credit for amnesty is going to help that. Maybe if they made it clear amnesty is never going to happen no matter who is President, Hispanics would start voting on other issues?

[Palin's Buttplug]

Rove knows that in a few years no one will remember who passed the bill.

Just like dumbasses blame Obama for TARP and Patriot Act spying now.

[Somalian Road Corporation]

Too obvious.

[John]

Yeah, just like everyone remembers it was the majority of Republicans who passed the CRA and it was nearly all Southern Democrats who stopped it from happening.

With an army of retards like you who will do nothing but lie, the truth never matters. That is how fascism works.

[John]

The fact that Obama supported and voted for Tarp in the Senate, cotinuted TARP once in office and signed a reauthorization of the Patriot Act does mean he owns those things.

Yes shreek, warrantless spying, trillions of dollars to crooked bankers, and assassinating American citizens is Obama's legacy. That and destroying the American healthcare system.

That is who you are Shreek.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Quit lying. The Big Banks all repaid their half of the $700 billion TARP program plus 10% interest.

[John]

Their half? They only stole half the money. I feel so much better now. And not a single person was ever prosecuted. Biggest banking collapse since the 1920s and not a single person went to jail.

Wall Street got their money's worth from Obama. Vote Democrat, make sure any big banker can commit fraud, get the government to cover his debt and never worry about being prosecuted.

[T]

Which invalidates the point about trillions of dollars to crooked bankers how, exactly?

Face it, TARP was about Goldman Sachs bottom line and not much else.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

So there's no problem when outright fraud occurs and the government uses taxpayer dollars to perpetuate the problem?

[VG Zaytsev]

Quit lying. The Big Banks all repaid their half of the $700 billion TARP program plus 10% interest.

And $2Tn in QE had nothing to do with. Shrieky pinky swears.

[Palin's Buttplug]

QE does not go to banks, idiot.

QE bought US Treasuries and GSE bonds only - nothing else.

And Goldman paid $1.4 billion interest on a $10 billion short term TARP loan:

[John]

QE does not go to banks, idiot.

Only if you don't count the fed giving essentially no interest or negative interest loans under QE. The fed allows the banks to borrow money at no cost. That is giving money.

[Whahappan?]

Also, the FED buys treasuries through Goldman and other big banks, and pays them for the privilege.

[sarcasmic]

'I'm going to go shoot up a school full of kids, lol': Teenager jailed for posting 'joke' threat on Facebook after row with an online gaming partner

18-year-old made joke after argument with online video game player
Austin police say they take comments seriously after Sandy Hook

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....oking.html

He's looking at eight years in prison. For one comment on Facebook.

[Brett L]

He's looking at eight years in prison. For one comment on Facebook.

He's looking at a nice civil rights payday.

[John]

Although the teenager, who turned 19 while in prison, added 'lol' (laughing out loud) and 'jk' (just kidding) to his post, a woman from Canada who saw it reported Justin to police after finding out that he lived near an elementary school.

And people say we don't get the government we deserve or the government is some kind of outside force separate from society. Sadly, we get the government people like this woman deserve. What a stupid fucking bitch. How could anyone be that stupid and that fucking irrational? Turn off the fucking Fox News and Nancy Grace for ten minutes and get your head out of your ass lady.

[Nikkis enthusiastic dissent]

Who doesn't live near an elementary school, beyond the most rural of rural populations?

[John]

No one that I know of. This is why people on sex offender registries end up living under bridges.

It also serves as a great sentence enhancer for any poor bastard caught with a joint. Having drugs "near a school" makes possession a felony in most states.

[John]

Oh yeah, I'm real messed up in the head, I'm going to go shoot up a school full of kids and eat their still, beating hearts.'

It is not a threat unless a reasonable person could find it to be one. This reads like a law school exam. Apparently the DA didn't do so hot in criminal law.

[Brett L]

eat their still, beating hearts

Commas, kid, turn your gruesome statement into an oxymoronic impossibility.

[some guy]

Maybe he's only going to eat during the diastole?

[sarcasmic]

Zero tolerance means zero tolerance.

[John]

Zero tolerance is not compatible with concepts like mens rea and specific intent. But it is the childrenz, so who needs 700 years of the common law.

[sarcasmic]

Zero tolerance is not compatible with concepts like mens rea and specific intent.

Which is why mens rea and specific intent don't matter anymore. We're at war with terrorism. This kid made a terrorist comment. That is all.

*clink*

[John]

That is what they think. That DA basically just threw it out and turned threats into a strict liability crime. I doubt the courts will let him get away with it. But he has successfully sent that kid to jail and cost his parents thousands of dollars. The fact that the kid will probably be vindicated in the end is no big deal. The DA made his point.

[sarcasmic]

Serious question: Haven't some of these laws been rewritten so that intent doesn't matter?

[John]

Some laws have. But not criminal laws like threats. That collides with the first amendment. The laws that are strict liability tend to be administrative laws. Environmental laws are notorious for being strict liability. Customs laws are that way. But old school crimes like treat and assault still require intent.

[some guy]

Unless you're a union member like that principal from the morning brickbat.

[Zeb]

It really bothers me that people think that something like Sandy Hook changes anything. As if people couldn't conceive of someone shooting up a school before that. Or it somehow is more of a threat now. The guy who shot up the school didn't announce it beforehand online. It's fucking irrelevant. Atrocities committed by lone nutjobs teach us nothing and it is dangerous when people think they do.

[Fatty Bolger]

Land of the free. Home of the brave.

[Lord Humungus]

Ryan: House Going to Do Immigration Reform 'Our Own Way'
http://www.nationalreview.com/.....-grudnicki

The House plans to offer "probationary status" to illegal immigrants for five years and will only consider legalization once the border is secure, Ryan explained. This approach by the lower chamber aims to "make sure that people who didn't do things the right way make amends with the law" and that Congress, not the executive branch, will determine when the border is secure.

Ryan admitted that he was "suspicious" of reforms because immigration legislation has failed in the past. He believes that "among the best ways to secure the border" is to allow economic immigrants to enter the country "through the front gate with a guest worker card." Ryan referred to this as the "wide gate, high fence approach." "You have to have a workable legal immigration system" so that people can come here legally, the Wisconsin congressmen said.

[John]

The House plans to offer "probationary status" to illegal immigrants for five years and will only consider legalization once the border is secure

In other news Ryan promises his wife he won't cum in her mouth. Is Ryan so stupid he believes that or does he think the country is so stupid they will believe that?

[AuH20]

Chicks who swallow are the fucking best, aren't they?

[John]

Yes they are.

[Lord Humungus]

old joke:

What's better than a 10?

A 7 that swallows.

[Don Mynack]

Questions for Ryan: Why do they have to be citizens? Why not make them resident aliens?

[Enough About Palin]

California man faces 13 years in jail for scribbling anti-bank messages in chalk

Jeff Olson, the 40-year-old man who is being prosecuted for scrawling anti-megabank messages on sidewalks in water-soluble chalk last year now faces a 13-year jail sentence. A judge has barred his attorney from mentioning freedom of speech during trial.

http://rt.com/usa/california-m.....banks-237/

[Palin's Buttplug]

'John' here is also an anti-bank weirdo. He claims the CEO's should all be in prison.

[VG Zaytsev]

PB like all good proglodytes defends criminality by the politically powerful.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Name any law Jamie Dimon (or any other CEO) broke.

You can't.

[VG Zaytsev]

Suborning perjury.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

The entire relationship structure between the banks/investment houses and the ratings agencies was based on fraud. If our government can't find anyone to prosecute in that mess, it's only because they don't want to.

[Rasilio]

I'm pretty sure that if I had unfettered access to their books I could nail the CEO of 80% of the Fortune 500 companies for some combination of perjury or fraud, .

In Dimon's case he'd almost certainly get both.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

He ain't the only one. When outright fraud gets you bailed out with taxpayer dollars, there's a problem.

[VG Zaytsev]

And people say that we don't already live in a police state.

[DJF]

You would think that the courtroom would be the place where the first amendment would be followed to the letter, but instead its the place where you have no first amendment rights.

[Fatty Bolger]

WTF? A man spends months in jail for an obvious joke, and now this? We're turning into Singapore, but without the economic freedom.

[sarcasmic]

Starbucks' baristas must share their tips with shift supervisors after court battle

The New York Court of Appeals has ruled that baristas must share their tips with colleagues who do a similar job
The ruling was a response to two lawsuits and backs Starbucks' policy of divvying up tips

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new.....uling.html
What a bunch of shit that is.

[generic Brand]

Ted S., do you want to take this one?

[Ted S.]

Sure. Which of John or Sarcasmic would fuck the lady baristas?

[generic Brand]

Haha. I guess I meant that this had been an actual AM Link provided above.

[itsnotmeitsyou]

Time to ban assault knives

But seriously, how the fuck do 10 people kill 36 people with knives AT A POLICE STATION? Are the Chinese police like UK police and only a few of them actually have guns?

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Knives are badass. Within ten feet, give me a knife over a gun.

[some guy]

Depends on the type of gun and whether its holstered. A loaded shotgun in hand gets my vote at any range up to 100 feet.

Also I'd take a baseball bat over a knife any day.

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

OK, pistol grip short barrel shotguns are good at close range, but hard to carry around. A good knife is easy to put in your pocket.

[some guy]

Well, if we're considering stealth too then yeah, knives are good. I'd still rather have a baseball bat, though.

[Zeb]

Unless the range is less than the barrel length.

[itsnotmeitsyou]

yeah, I get that knives are dangerous. I'm not wondering how they managed to kill 36 people. I'm wondering how they managed to do it in a police station. Are the Chinese as dumb as the UK and don't let their police carry guns?

Basically, I'm trying to verify my thought that this only happened because it was a "gun free" area.

[db]

If that had happened in the U.S., the police in the station would have unloaded 200+ rounds on the attackers, killed them plus 15 police, and the headline would have been

"Violent Tea Party Ninjas Attack Police Station in Assassination Attempt; 17 Shot."

[John]

http://www.nationalreview.com/.....-john-fund

John Fund on Justice Kennedy's destroying of the ballot initiative process. The more I think about it, the worse I find that decision. Basically Kennedy said that even though the people of California passed the initiative process and even though they passed the initiative, none of that matters and is still subject to the veto of the governor. It is just a horrible decision.

[VG Zaytsev]

Why just initiatives?

The way I see it, the courts just ok'd the executive branch ignoring any law they don't like, with the only remedy being impeachment.

[John]

I see it that way too. Fund thinks it just applies to initiatives. But I don't see how. It is pretty appalling that Reason has bought onto this. They want their gay marriage pony so badly, they are willing to ignore a horrible precedent to get it.

[VG Zaytsev]

Just like they think expanding state power via E-Verify is an accpetable trade off to giving the socialist 20 million new voters. But don't dare call them the C word.

[Eduard van Haalen]

Crustaceans?

[invisible furry hand]

corporations?

[LTC(ret) John]

You misspelled that - it is "KKKorporashunz"

[Scruffy Nerfherder]

Ends justify the means, obviously.

[some guy]

But don't the CA courts have a say in the matter? Can't they force the executive to act on a matter?

[John]

But don't the CA courts have a say in the matter? Can't they force the executive to act on a matter?

No. If CA passed a law that said the executive had to defend the law, maybe. You could possibly save the process through further legislation.

[Apatheist ?_??]

Well the CA courts allowed others to defend the law, it was the federal courts who didn't. Seems like this issue could be easily solved by congress passing a law setting up a system of standing when the executive refuses to do so.

I'm uncomfortable with saying the executive should have to defend a law they believe to be unconstitutional. The President takes an oath to the constitution and shouldn't have to defend a law they believe violates that oath.

[John]

I'm uncomfortable with saying the executive should have to defend a law they believe to be unconstitutional.

I am not at all. They don't get to decide what is unconstitutional. And to the extent that they do, it is through the veto and political process. Once the law is passed, the executive has to treat it as constitutional and enforce it and defend it like any other law. To say they can pick and choose is to give them a second bite at the apple. Not only would they get to veto, they would also get to just not defend the law. That is not how it should work.

If you let the executive refuse to defend and enforce a lawfully enacted statute for whatever reason, you give it the power to decide which laws have effect and which don't. You might as well have a dictatorship at that point.

If the law is unconstitutional, the executive should have vetoed it. If they were overridden or public went around them via the referendum process, then they had their vote and lost. At that point only the courts should be able to kill it.

[Eduard van Haalen]

w/r/t initiatives, if the people of Cali - that is, the AG's client - approve a law, then the AG should defend it unless it would be clearly frivolous to do so (eg, a bill of attainder to sentence John Jones to death). There's nothing frivolous about defending a law which embodies thousands of years of human experience, no matter what opponents may say.

[John]

Exactly Eduard. I can't wait for a conservative governor refuses to defend some environmental statute. The liberal screaming will be yummy.

[Eduard van Haalen]

I haven't crystallized my thinking on acts of the legislature, since they're subject to separation of powers considerations, unlike the sovereign people acting directly - but laws approved directly by the people themselves are like instructions from the client to the AG - so long as they can ethically defend the client, they need to do so.

[alan_s]

"U.S. officials got Edward Snowden's middle name wrong in the extradition request sent to Hong Kong."

It's not my fault that Buttle's heart condition didn't appear on
Tuttle's file!

[John]

Sure DOJ is totally politicized and evil. But at least they are incompetent.

[Rich]

It's all part of the plan, John.

You'll see.

[Enough About Palin]

Who would fuck this bitch anywhere?

[sarcasmic]

John?

[Lord Humungus]

see above, amigo.

[tarran]

Damn! What is seen cannot be unseen!

Yech!

[Rich]

Naylor's Run Park

Haw!

[invisible furry hand]

Well, Richard McBride did...

Best line: "Chitwood said he didn't know if the two were dating but he said police don't suspect prostitution."

[MP]

"he's alleged to have bent over a bench"

You can look straight up at the sky and not care a whit about the nature of the rolls you're grabbing onto for your thrusting.

[Lord Humungus]

26% of Obama Supporters View Tea Party as Nation's Top Terror Threat
http://www.rasmussenreports.co.....ror_threat

[sarcasmic]

Bitter clingers!

[Rich]

To be fair, half of that 26% thought that meant the Tea Party is the nation's top threat *to terror*.

[AuH20]

Fail.

Try again. You'll probably fail again, but next time you can fail better.

But seriously, you can do better in the joke department, Rich. I believe in you.

[Rich]

But I was being *serious*!

*** pouts ***

[some guy]

Only 26% of Obama supporters are completely ignorant of modern politics. I'm surprised actually.

[The Late P Brooks]

A judge has barred his attorney from mentioning freedom of speech during trial.

How in the fuck does this survive an appeal? How does this judge not get recalled?

Oh, right- it's a post 9/11 America.

[John]

The problem is the definition of vandalism. Look, if I came onto your property and spray painted "fuck Brooks" on the front of your garage, my freedom of speech would not be a defense. My freedom to say "fuck Brooks" does give me the right to destroy your property. So in a vandalism case, the 1st Amendment is not an issue and should not be something the defense can bring up.

The problem here is that they are considering writing on a sidewalk to be "vandalism". And that is bullshit and why this case is so outrageous.

[Rich]

The problem here is that they are considering writing on a sidewalk to be "vandalism".

Even writing in, shall we say, WATER?!

[VG Zaytsev]

if I came onto your property and spray painted "fuck Brooks" on the front of your garage, my freedom of speech would not be a defense. My freedom to say "fuck Brooks" does give me the right to destroy your property. So in a vandalism case, the 1st Amendment is not an issue and should not be something the defense can bring up.

This is an example of why the courts shouldn't be able exclude anything.

The defense should be able to bring it up and the prosecution should be able to call bullshit on it, like you just did.

The larger problem is prosecuting this as a criminal offense.

[John]

I disagree. The law is I don't have a right to deface Brooks property. The jury can't legally decide, sure he destroyed Brooks' property but Brooks is a dick. For that reason, I shouldn't be able to introduce the fact that Brooks is a dick. By letting me introduce it, we invite the jury to consider it to be relevant. The jury only gets information that is relevant to the decision.

[VG Zaytsev]

I know the argument for excluding evidence / arguments but I reject them.

[John]

I agree with them. It lets the defense put the victim on trial and makes it such that less desirable people get less justice. Sure Brooks is an epic dick. But that doesn't mean I should be able to victimize him.

[WTF]

Just like in NJ if someone is up on firearms charges, especially the bullshit administrative ones, they are not allowed to reference the Second Amendment as a defense.

[The Late P Brooks]

26% of Obama Supporters View Tea Party as Nation's Top Terror Threat

Must be the GUNZ.

[Auric Demonocles]

Or the fact that they are terrified someone might disagree that Obama is hip and cool and if he wants to spend a trillion dollars on something that's A-OK.

[AuH20]

I don't get it, but it seems like a lot of people have this impression of Obama as a generally nice guy who is trying his best. And that causes them to forgive a lot of bullshit, because they think even his fuck ups are just mistakes, and never malicious.

Like I said, I don't get it.

[John]

They don't pay a lot of attention and when they do it is to the network news. Watch the Today Show or Good Morning America or the six o'clock network news sometime. Watch how they soft peddle everything about Obama. If you only watched that stuff, you would think he was a nice guy too.

[AuH20]

I have tried watching the Today Show. I could actually feel my brain cells dying. Holy fucking shit is it vapid.

[John]

Watch it on the weekends. It is marginally less vapid and the hosts are a lot hotter.

[John]

Not only are these people completely ignorant, they are also paranoid. If you really think that the Tea Party is the top terror threat, are you going to object when Obama starts locking them up?

About 26% of the country has gone full on fascist. I have always wondered what it must have been like living in 1920s Germany and seeing so many people believe such insane things. Now I am living it.

[Auric Demonocles]

26% of Obama supporters. Not 26% of the country.

[John]

Fair enough. Considering that his support is down in the 40s, that means it might only be 10 or 15%. But still.

[Palin's Buttplug]

William F. Buckley hated the Tea Party too (called Birchers back then).

[VG Zaytsev]

WFB is one of them good republicans - a dead one.

[Eduard van Haalen]

Yeah, the key is to watch what the progs say about a prominent conservative while he's still alive and active, not after he's safely buried. Gore Vidal called Buckley some kind of fascist.

Likewise Goldwater, Reagan, etc. Only after they died (or in Goldwater's case "evolved") did we hear about the liberals' "strange new respect" for these conservative icons.

Let's try this experiment: Which of the conservative figures active today, who are currently being denounced as nihilist granny-starvers, will in the future be held up by liberals as role-models for conservatives?

Maybe liberals can start nominating candidates now, rather than waiting for them to croak.

[thom]

The lie, of course, is that there is a "top terror threat". The actual threat of terrorism is such a rare and minor problem, that there really isn't a "top terror threat", there are just groups of all colors that represent infinitesimally small threats of terrorism. Terrorism is an event so rare that trying to project with any confidence where the next terrorism attack is likely to come from is nearly impossible.

[Jumbie]

According to this guy, we may soon know how to reverse the obesity epidemic.

http://www.ted.com/talks/peter.....betes.html

I enjoyed most of the video, especially the way he talks about medical research not doing enough to establish good science...

BUT, near the end where he talks about his organization's 3rd goal, getting people to accept lifestyle changes, I got the feeling he might just be another statist.

[John]

BUT, near the end where he talks about his organization's 3rd goal, getting people to accept lifestyle changes,

What a great euphemism for "our organization's goal is to control people's lives".

[Auric Demonocles]

According to this guy, we may soon know how to reverse the obesity epidemic.

Convince people to exercise more or eat less?

[John]

Mandatory exercise and diet re-education camps.

[AuH20]

John, a Great Leap Forward is such a simpler and more cost effective way to thin the population a bit, in more ways than one.

[LTC(ret) John]

Comrade Stalin's Ukraine programme worked, nyet?

[Jumbie]

Actually the point of the video is that the conventional wisdom you reference may not be backed up by reliable science.

[John]

You mean public health officials lied and or relied on dubious science? Well knock me over with a feather.

[Auric Demonocles]

The first law of thermodynamics is reliable science.

[AuH20]

That's what BIG THERMODYNAMICS want you to think!

[Auric Demonocles]

They must be pretty powerful, as they've managed to lobby so hard that everything I've ever seen or done conforms to their narrative.

[Jumbie]

Well his talk is about insulin regulating whether food energy is stored as fat or burnt in cells, so I suppose he's being consistent with the laws of thermodynamics.

[Zeb]

True, but eating food is not the same as throwing a log on the fire. A lot more different things can happen with the energy contained in the food.

[robc]

A lot more different things can happen with the energy contained in the food.

Three.

Used, stored, or excreted.

That is it. Three things can happen to it.

Exact same for the log on the fire.

[robc]

From a thermodynamics perspective, you can treat the human body as a black box. How it operates internally matters not at all.

[Zeb]

It matters to the question at hand which is why people get fat. Some people store less fat and burn more energy in cells, regardless of activity. I'm skinny as fuck and sitting on my ass eating high carb junk food won't change that. I've tried.

[robc]

It matters to the question at hand which is why people get fat.

I thought the question at hand was:

"The first law of thermodynamics is reliable science."

Im in complete agreement on the nutrition/internal body question, but you seemed to be arguing against basic thermo.

[Zeb]

Sorry for the confusion. Threaded comments are tricky.

[Brett L]

I think the idea that people have any good studies on what is absorbed by different body chemistries versus what is excreted is bull. I asked a guy for references on caloric studies of excreta by by persons of differing body composition and got a blank look.

I bring this up because I have a 280lb roommate with Krohn's disease whose gut works far differently from mine. Assuming that the averages are accurate on these calorie listings is utter shite.

[Zeb]

Used can happen in a lot more different ways in the body than in a fire. And whether and how it is stored or excreted is also rather more complicated than in a fire.

[robc]

Used can happen in a lot more different ways in the body than in a fire. And whether and how it is stored or excreted is also rather more complicated than in a fire.

But for thermodynamics, THAT DOESNT MATTER.

[Brett L]

But for thermodynamics, THAT DOESNT MATTER.

But rob, nobody gives a shit about the energy balance. Nobody. It is not a useful tool for predictive modelling of body mass or composition. So your science is absolutely correct and totally worthless in practice. If every person ever studied has a starvation mode in which their body will expend fewer calories than taken in pretty quickly regardless of their exercise level - which can only realistically move the needle by maybe 1000 net calories per day, best case - than its worthless.

[Auric Demonocles]

No, that means you aren't burning a lot of calories. So burn some more, or take in less. Just because not everyone uses the same

If you burn 1000 calories a day with conscious exercise, you can eat few enough calories to lose weight regardless of your metabolism. It's true that burning 1000 calories in exercise sucks, but that's a different matter.

[robc]

nobody gives a shit about the energy balance.

A thermodynamicist does.

It is not a useful tool for predictive modelling of body mass or composition.

Im not trying to do that. Heck, Im not looking for a useful tool at all.

So your science is absolutely correct and totally worthless in practice.

All I cared about was being absolutely correct.

[Auric Demonocles]

So if you're storing calories in fat, consume less calories.

Different people operating at different efficiencies does not change the basic formula.

[John]

AD,

Your body adjusts to fewer calories and your metabolism slows down. That is why weight loss slows after you are on a diet for a bit. Even though the calorie intake and burn rate say you should lose one pound or whatever a week, you won't.

Now there is a limit to that, otherwise no one would ever be thin or starve to death. But it does make it harder to lose weight as you go and more complex than just calories in and calories out.

[Outlaw]

That's because a lot of people don't adjust their caloric intake properly after they start losing weight.

If your caloric deficit is too high you will start losing more muscle mass and way less fat.

A daily 300 calorie deficit (the amount of calories your body expends every day just to live, minus 300) is the best way to combat muscle loss and keep fat loss going. Anything over 500 and your body usually thinks you're starving and holds onto the fat.

Proper nutrition and weight training is essential for dieting too.

So yes, it's still calories in and calories out.

[Auric Demonocles]

But it does make it harder to lose weight as you go and more complex than just calories in and calories out.

Now, that just means your "calories out" portion has gone down.

[Clich? Bandit]

This is not accurate in light of the findings of the last 30 or so years. WHAT type of calories matters a great deal more than how many. The confusion people have about the over simplistic "eat less, exercise more" is that eating less poison is still eating poison. Eating the proper food means you don't NEED to exercise that much at all.

See Warty and SF for references.

[Clich? Bandit]

that was for AD

My apologies to Brooks for fukin up a post threaded thread.

[John]

This is not accurate in light of the findings of the last 30 or so years. WHAT type of calories matters a great deal more than how many.

I don't know if I would say a great deal more. If you don't eat much and exercise a lot, you are going to be thin, I don't care what you eat. And if you eat enough of any food other than raw vegetables, you will gain weight. All of these things are true at the margins.

[Rasilio]

Actually yes it does.

The problem is that for a lot of people effectively losing weight means literally a starvation diet, not starvation as in "I'm so hungry" but starvation as in "My body is eating itself to sustain life, not just burining fat but eating muscle and causing long lasting harm far worse than being fat".

This idea also does not explain why it is that lab animals have gained weight in proportion to the human weight gain over the same period of time even though we know through meticulous record keeping of their diets that they have not changed in 30 years...

http://www.scientificamerican......ce-obesity

If the issue were as simple as calories in/calories out then lab animal species with strict regemented diets would not also be experiencing an identical "obesity epidemic" as their human researchers.

[Outlaw]

It's almost like people who eat terrible stuff and don't care about their own health feed their pets in the same way they feed themselves!

[John]

f the issue were as simple as calories in/calories out then lab animal species with strict regemented diets would not also be experiencing an identical "obesity epidemic" as their human researchers.

Assuming that lab animal and human metabolism were the same, sure. But that is a big assumption. If this were true to any degree, we should be able to devise what amounts to super diets where someone eats very little but still manages to keep their weight. Think about it, if losing weight doesn't really have anything to do with calories, then there out to be very low calorie diets that would allow people to still maintain weight. Such a diet would be very valuable for people who have cancer and can't digest food very well or for astronauts sent on long missions some day. Yet, to my knowledge no such diets exist. Until I see one, I am skeptical of this.

[Xenocles]

Except the nutrients that are used for energy also have other uses. Fats are used in hormone creation and cell wall repair. Protein is used for a lot of things. Food isn't just a fuel source.

[LTC(ret) John]

Fires excrete logs?!

[Loki]

Justin Amash, meanwhile, warns fellow Republicans not to say anything stupid...

That's like asking the sun to come up in the west instead of the east. Of course they're going to say stupid shit, it's THE GAYS!!!!! It's KULTUR WAR bullshit. Just what the doctor ordered to get people to stop paying attention to the NSA shit.

[Fist of Etiquette]

The district whose voters are all about traditional marriage are always going to vote Republican, no matter what. The rest of the voting public doesn't give that much of a shit about the subject to swing votes based on legislative inaction against this decision. I just don't know what they gain by cocking off about fighting it.

[LTC(ret) John]

Avoid getting primaried in a SoCon district?

[The Late P Brooks]

According to this guy, we may soon know how to reverse the obesity epidemic.

Anti-GMO activist, is he?

[Auric Demonocles]

That would perfectly line up with my previous post.

[mad libertarian guy]

Justin Amash, meanwhile, warns fellow Republicans not to say anything stupid in response to the decision, which he says is supported by many young conservatives. Too late.

The Old Wing? of the GOP cannot be voted the fuck out soon enough.

[Lord Humungus]

IRS auditor reaffirms that conservatives, not liberals, were targeted
http://www.washingtontimes.com.....iberals-w/

The IRS' auditor told Congress this week that it stands by its determination that conservative groups were uniquely singled out for special scrutiny by the tax agency, rebutting Democrats' contention that liberal groups also were targeted.

The Treasury Department's inspector general for tax administration (TIGTA) sent a letter Wednesday to congressional Democrats telling them that while several liberal groups may have gotten extra scrutiny, the IRS didn't necessarily target those ? but it did do so for conservative groups.

"TIGTA concluded that inappropriate criteria were used to identify potential political cases for extra scrutiny ? specifically, the criteria listed in our audit report. From our audit work, we did not find evidence that the criteria you identified, labeled "Progressives," were used by the IRS to select potential political cases during the 2010 to 2012 timeframe we audited," Inspector General J. Russell George said.

[AuH20]

STOP CLOUDING THE NEW NARRATIVE!

[John]

There was no political targeting. Pay no attention to those people taking the 5th.

[mad libertarian guy]

Caf? of Lost Dreams

[Warty]

Obama's gun report is out, and someone's getting fired.

[NoVAHockey]

memory hole

[Rich]

Thanks, Warty. It would have been great watching some of the desperate attempts to massage the data.

[Lord Humungus]

Drudge: Weiner's lead peters out...
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/l.....jcrkK9dtNJ

[Fist of Etiquette]

Reason 24/7 said support was inching up.

[VG Zaytsev]

His supported has softened.

[invisible furry hand]

He still thinks he can rise to the occasion, however

[Xenocles]

Uhh... boner.

[AuH20]

How has no one created a Supreme Court JRPG? I have no idea on the plot, but I do have RPG Maker VX.

Now to go learn Ruby.

[Enough About Palin]

Kimberly McCarthy becomes the 500th inmate executed by the state of Texas since the death penalty came back to use in 1982. Rick Perry, meanwhile, has called a second special session to reconsider new sweeping restrictions on abortion in the state.

I'll take non sequiturs for a thousand, Alex.

Seriously, REASON, WTF?

[John]

The old "how can be for the death penalty and against abortion" is one of the dumbest arguments there is. Beyond the obvious problems with it, last I looked most of Reason is anti death penalty and pro abortion. By their own standards they are just as big of hypocrites.

[Clich? Bandit]

It is not hypocritical to believe the government has not authority to revenge kill while an individual is subject to the responsibility for their actions.

[John]

It is not hypocritical to believe the government has not authority to revenge kill while an individual is subject to the responsibility for their actions.

It is only wrong for the government to do it because life is not something anyone has a right to take. If it is wrong for the government to take the life of a convicted criminal, it is also most certainly wrong for a mother to take the life of her child.

Both argument are retarded and beg the question. There is nothing inconsistent about saying that someone who murders someone else forfeits their life and mothers should not be able to murder their unborn children out of convenience.

[Clich? Bandit]

You assume a fetus is a child/life. An ignorant assumption considering the raging abortion debate.

[Xenocles]

Both statements are about Texas, I guess.

[The Late P Brooks]

Sure Brooks is an epic dick. But that doesn't mean I should be able to victimize him.

Just claim you're performing a needed public service. Just like putting up a hand lettered "Bridge Out" sign.

[Joe M]

Post-DOMA, Rand Paul fears humans marrying non-humans

In fact, the senator went even further than Beck. Here's the entirety of Rand Paul's response, in which the senator said he's "kind of with" the unhinged host.

"I think this is the conundrum and gets back to what you were saying in the opening -- whether or not churches should decide this. But it is difficult because if we have no laws on this people take it to one extension further. Does it have to be humans?...

Thoughts?

[Apatheist ?_??]

He also said he supported the DOMA decision:

Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., told ABC News he believes the Supreme Court ruling on the Defense of Marriage Act was appropriate, and that the issue should be left to the states. He praised Justice Anthony Kennedy for avoiding "a cultural war."
"As a country we can agree to disagree," Paul said today, stopping for a moment to talk as he walked through the Capitol. "As a Republican Party, that's kind of where we are as well. The party is going to have to agree to disagree on some of these issues."

I think he's mixing up his personal opinions and his political opinions.

[mad libertarian guy]

I think he's the media is mixing up his personal opinions and his political opinions in order to purposefully obfuscate his position.

FIFY

[The Late P Brooks]

I don't get it, but it seems like a lot of people have this impression of Obama as a generally nice guy who is trying his best.

I was told by a progressive "Obama is a Man of Peace."

It was really hard not to laugh in his face.

[Citizen Nothing]

How could he not be a man of peace? He won the prize!

[The Late P Brooks]

But it is difficult because if we have no laws on this people take it to one extension further. Does it have to be humans?...

Rand wants people to know he's a Serious Candidate.

[fried wylie]

A court rules shift supervisors can share tips with the service staff at Starbucks but not assistant managers

And this is anyone's business besides the company and employees involved, because?

[Rabban]

Modern biology, how does it work? The idea that killing a viable baby at 20 weeks plus is not a form of murder is pretty absurd given what we know scientifically.