Ron Paul Leads Obama In Iowa, According to New Poll

Peter Suderman | 2.18.2012 8:39 PM

A new poll of Iowans shows three of the four remaining GOP primary candidates ahead of President Obama in a head-to-head contest—and Ron Paul winning by the largest margin. The results of the latest Iowa Poll show the Texas Congressman up by seven points over Obama, while Mitt Romney's two point lead over the president is within the poll's margin of error. Santorum leads the president by four points. The Des Moines Register reports:

The Republican with the biggest lead: Ron Paul, who would defeat Obama by 7 percentage points, 49 percent to 42 percent. Rick Santorum, winner of the 2012 Iowa caucuses, leads Obama 48 percent to 44 percent. Mitt Romney, edged in the caucuses by Santorum, leads Obama 46 percent to 44 percent.

The president defeats only Newt Gingrich, 51 percent to 37 percent.

Maybe Ron Paul is the most effective not-Romney after all?

More on the poll here.

Start your day with Reason. Get a daily brief of the most important stories and trends every weekday morning when you subscribe to Reason Roundup.

NEXT: Paul Wins Washington County, Still Loses Maine

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Ron Paul 13 years ago

First!
1. Reason 13 years ago
  
  Mayhem to follow.
  1. "I disavow." ~Newt Paul 13 years ago
    
    I disavow:
    
    ? Marriage contracts with sick women.
    ? Investment newsletters in my name.
    ? Ayn Rand.
    ? Murray Rothbard.
    ? Walter Block.
    
    "Things happen."
    1. Paultards gonna stroke 13 years ago
      1. Primitards... 13 years ago
        
        ...will suffer from a myocardial infarction.
        
        Goldbugs = Primitards 13 years ago
        
        LULZ
        
        Jason Godesky 13 years ago
        
        Haha! I make funny!
  2. "I disavow." ~Newt Paul 13 years ago
    
    I disavow:
    
    ? Marriage contracts with sick women.
    ? Investment newsletters in my name.
    ? Ayn Rand.
    ? Murray Rothbard.
    ? Walter Block.
    
    "Things happen."
    1. Pope Paul 13 years ago
      
      Who else will be the intercessor between the Invisible Hand and you sinners except me?
      1. Jason Godesky 13 years ago
        
        Haha! I make funny!
2. sd 13 years ago
  
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  1. Eduard van Haalen 13 years ago
    
    Bi? Take your bimetallism elsewhere, you fiat-money fascist!
3. sg 13 years ago
  
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  1. Rick Santorum 13 years ago
    
    Who wants bi when you've got a dead baby to play with?!
    1. Realist 13 years ago
      
      ^^^This^^^
      1. Pi Guy 13 years ago
        
        I can't wait til that hits the mainstream - as well as his stance on gay marriage:
        
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0vG1CM95Js
        
        F#*&ing; douche nozzle
    2. shamalamadingdong 13 years ago
      
      Oh, man, that is just the sort of sick humor I have come to expect from this place. More please.
WWNGD? 13 years ago

Silly Ron Paul, limited government and personal freedom have no place in the republican party.
1. Reason 13 years ago
  
  Awesome sarcasm!
  +3.14
  1. 1592653589793238462643383279 13 years ago
    
    5028841971 6939937510 5820974944 5923078164 0628620899 8628034825 3421170679 8214808651 3282306647 0938446095 5058223172 5359408128 4811174502 8410270193 8521105559 6446229489 5493038196 4428810975 6659334461 2847564823 3786783165 2712019091 4564856692 3460348610 4543266482 1339360726 0249141273 7245870066 0631558817 4881520920 9628292540 9171536436 7892590360 0113305305 4882046652 1384146951 9415116094 3305727036 5759591953 0921861173 8193261179 3105118548 0744623799 6274956735 1885752724 8912279381 8301194912 9833673362 4406566430 8602139494 6395224737 1907021798 6094370277 0539217176 2931767523 8467481846 7669405132 0005681271 4526356082 7785771342 7577896091 7363717872 1468440901 2249534301 4654958537 1050792279 6892589235 4201995611 2129021960 8640344181 5981362977 4771309960 5187072113 4999999837 2978049951 0597317328 1609631859 5024459455 3469083026 4252230825 3344685035 2619311881 7101000313 7838752886 5875332083 8142061717 7669147303 5982534904 2875546873 1159562863 8823537875 9375195778 1857780532 1712268066 1300192787 6611195909 2164201989 3809525720 1065485863 2788659361 5338182796 8230301952 0353018529 6899577362 2599413891 2497217752 8347913151 5574857242 4541506959 5082953311 6861727855 8890750983 8175463746 4939319255 0604009277 0167113900 9848824012 8583616035 6370766010 4710181942 9555961989 4676783744 9448255379 7747268471 0404753464 6208046684 2590694912 9331367702 8989152104 7521620569 6602405803 8150193511 2533824300 3558764024 7496473263 9141992726 0426992279 6782354781 6360093417 2164121992 4586315030 2861829745 5570674983 8505494588 5869269956 9092721079 7509302955 3211653449 8720275596 0236480665 4991198818 3479775356 6369807426 5425278625 5181841757 4672890977 7727938000 8164706001 6145249192 1732172147 7235014144 1973568548 1613611573 5255213347 5741849468 4385233239 0739414333 4547762416 8625189835 6948556209 9219222184 2725502542 5688767179 0494601653 4668049886 2723279178 6085784383 8279679766 8145410095 3883786360 9506800642 2512520511 7392984896 0841284886 2694560424 1965285022 2106611863 0674427862 2039194945 0471237137 8696095636 4371917287 4677646575 7396241389 0865832645 9958133904 7802759009 9465764078 9512694683 9835259570 9825822620 5224894077 2671947826 8482601476 9909026401 3639443745 5305068203 4962524517 4939965143 1429809190 6592509372 2169646151 5709858387 4105978859 5977297549 8930161753 9284681382 6868386894 2774155991 8559252459 5395943104 9972524680 8459872736 4469584865 3836736222 6260991246 0805124388 4390451244 1365497627 8079771569 1435997700 1296160894 4169486855 5848406353 4220722258 2848864815 8456028506 0168427394 5226746767 8895252138 5225499546 6672782398 6456596116 3548862305 7745649803 5593634568 1743241125 1507606947 9451096596 0940252288 7971089314 5669136867 2287489405 6010150330 8617928680 9208747609 1782493858 9009714909 6759852613 6554978189 3129784821 6829989487 2265880485 7564014270 4775551323 7964145152 3746234364 5428584447 9526586782 1051141354 7357395231 1342716610 2135969536 2314429524 8493718711 0145765403 5902799344 0374200731 0578539062 1983874478 0847848968 3321445713 8687519435 0643021845 3191048481 0053706146 8067491927 8191197939 9520614196 6342875444 0643745123 7181921799 9839101591 9561814675 1426912397 4894090718 6494231961
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    2901618766 7952406163 4252257719 5429162991 9306455377 9914037340 4328752628 8896399587 9475729174 6426357455 2540790914 5135711136 9410911939 3251910760 2082520261 8798531887 7058429725 9167781314 9699009019 2116971737 2784768472 6860849003 3770242429 1651300500 5168323364 3503895170 2989392233 4517220138 1280696501 1784408745 1960121228 5993716231 3017114448 4640903890 6449544400 6198690754 8516026327 5052983491 8740786680 8818338510 2283345085 0486082503 9302133219 7155184306 3545500766 8282949304 1377655279 3975175461 3953984683 3936383047 4611996653 8581538420 5685338621 8672523340 2830871123 2827892125 0771262946 3229563989 8989358211 6745627010 2183564622 0134967151 8819097303 8119800497 3407239610 3685406643 1939509790 1906996395 5245300545 0580685501 9567302292 1913933918 5680344903 9820595510 0226353536 1920419947 4553859381 0234395544 9597783779 0237421617 2711172364 3435439478 2218185286 2408514006 6604433258 8856986705 4315470696 5747458550 3323233421 0730154594 0516553790 6866273337 9958511562 5784322988 2737231989 8757141595 7811196358 3300594087 3068121602 8764962867 4460477464 9159950549 7374256269 0104903778 1986835938 1465741268 0492564879 8556145372 3478673303 9046883834 3634655379 4986419270 5638729317 4872332083 7601123029 9113679386 2708943879 9362016295 1541337142 4892830722 0126901475 4668476535 7616477379 4675200490 7571555278 1965362132 3926406160 1363581559 0742202020 3187277605 2772190055 6148425551 8792530343 5139844253 2234157623 3610642506 3904975008 6562710953 5919465897 5141310348 2276930624 7435363256 9160781547 8181152843 6679570611 0861533150 4452127473 9245449454 2368288606 1340841486 3776700961 2071512491 4043027253 8607648236 3414334623 5189757664 5216413767 9690314950 1910857598 4423919862 9164219399 4907236234 6468441173 9403265918 4044378051 3338945257 4239950829 6591228508 5558215725 0310712570 1266830240 2929525220 1187267675 6220415420 5161841634 8475651699 9811614101 0029960783 8690929160 3028840026 9104140792 8862150784 2451670908 7000699282 1206604183 7180653556 7252532567 5328612910 4248776182 5829765157 9598470356 2226293486 0034158722 9805349896 5022629174 8788202734 2092222453 3985626476 6914905562 8425039127 5771028402 7998066365 8254889264 8802545661 0172967026 6407655904 2909945681 5065265305 3718294127 0336931378 5178609040 7086671149 6558343434 7693385781 7113864558 7367812301 4587687126 6034891390 9562009939 3610310291 6161528813 8437909904 2317473363 9480457593 1493140529 7634757481 1935670911 0137751721 0080315590 2485309066 9203767192 2033229094 3346768514 2214477379 3937517034 4366199104 0337511173 5471918550 4644902636 5512816228 8244625759 1633303910 7225383742 1821408835 0865739177 1509682887 4782656995 9957449066 1758344137 5223970968 3408005355 9849175417 3818839994 4697486762 6551658276 5848358845 3142775687 9002909517 0283529716 3445621296 4043523117 6006651012 4120065975 5851276178 5838292041 9748442360 8007193045 7618932349 2292796501 9875187212 7267507981 2554709589 0455635792 1221033346 6974992356 3025494780 2490114195 2123828153 0911407907 3860251522 7429958180 7247162591 6685451333 1239480494 7079119153 2673430282 4418604142 6363954800 0448002670 4962482017 9289647669 7583183271 3142517029 6923488962 7668440323 2609275249 6035799646 9256504936 8183609003 2380929345
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    1. Mr, Spock 13 years ago
      
      Irrational.
      1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
        
        Looks like Jason Godesky has decided to spam with numbers instead of his irrational theories.
        
        AlmightyJB 13 years ago
        
        Definately an improvement.
      2. Ted S. 13 years ago
        
        I'm sorry to say that's not irrational at all.
        
        Irrational would be something like sqrt(2).
        
        Ted S. 13 years ago
        
        And if you were referring to the troll's continuing the decimal sequence of pi, that's not irrational either; it's transcendental. :-p
        
        Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        Transcendental numbers are irrational.
        
        shut the fuck up 13 years ago
        
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcendental_number
        
        "All real transcendental numbers are irrational"
        
        "that's not irrational either; it's transcendental. :-p"
        
        Stick your tongue back in your face idiot.
    2. Haps 13 years ago
      
      but then I got high.
      1. Afroman 13 years ago
        
        Because I got high!
        Because I got high!
        Because I got high!
        
        La da da da da da!
    3. Sevo 13 years ago
      
      Vermin shit is vermin shit; you should scrape it off your shoe before it stinks up the place.
    4. rather 13 years ago
      
      OK, daj mi wskaz?wk?, Michal
    5. Colonel_Angus 13 years ago
      
      Onetwothreefour-five-sixseveneightnine-ten-eleventwelve. Twelve.
      
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnBAMQhtjEk
      1. Heroic Mulatto 13 years ago
        
        So damn funky. How many people know that the Pointer Sisters sang that?
        
        sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        We all know. The question is, how many knew the Pointer Sisters sang it?
        
        /pedant
        
        Heroic Mulatto 13 years ago
        
        Really? You're going to be pedantic about a tense shift in a comment that uses the word 'funky'?
        
        You, my friend, make Sir Nose D'Voidoffunk proud.
      2. Alligator King 13 years ago
        
        Seven!
    6. BlueBook 13 years ago
      
      Looking for the pi lover? === pilover*c-a'm === is a site for pisexual and picurious singles and friends. Here you can find hundreds of thousands of non-repeating, open minded decimal places looking to explore their pisexuality. Sign up for free, or purchase a premium membership for only $3.14!
      1. Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        +e, would read again.
    7. Tulpa 13 years ago
      
      That's actually wrong in the 43rd digit.
    8. Robert 13 years ago
      
      Looks like we've got the numbers on our side. No, sorry, they're above us.
    9. gaoxiaen 13 years ago
      
      69
2. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  Silly Ron Paul, limited government and personal freedom have no place in either major party.
God of the Reefer Stick 13 years ago

Belted, high and deep, away out there, it's gone! Home run, Ron Paul!
1. Reason 13 years ago
  
  Oooh, but the umpires are reviewing that homer...
  
  We'll be right back after this commercial message, brought to you by Budweiser, the King of Beers?.
  1. Contrarian P 13 years ago
    
    If ever there was an argument to be made for the abolition of monarchy, that's it.
2. gaoxiaen 13 years ago
  
  Ron Paul has a hit now and then.
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L84N7sVvFXs
db 13 years ago

Chicken. Fucking. Dinner.
1. Colonel_Angus 13 years ago
  
  Racist.
2. Colonel_Sanders 13 years ago
  
  Finger fucking good.
"Furious" Styles 13 years ago

OT: I'm watching the first season of SNL and it's PAINFULLY obvious that this show will never be as great as it once was.

RIP, Gilda.
1. "Furious" Styles 13 years ago
  
  Not as painful, nor sad, as The Simpsons, but still....
  1. Reason 13 years ago
    
    Noted. Thanks.
  2. Greg 13 years ago
    
    Here's an interesting question my buddy and I had the other day... has The Simpsons now been bad for more years than it was good? It's gotta at least be getting close, right?
    1. PantsFan 13 years ago
      
      The Simpsons was good through the first half of season 9.
      1. db 13 years ago
        
        I didn't watch it past the first 3 eps on "The Tracy Ullman Show."
      2. David 13 years ago
        
        The Simpsons hasn't been good ever since Family Guy burst on to the scene.
        
        Meg 13 years ago
        
        You're being hweird.
    2. Proprietist 13 years ago
      
      I dunno. I still enjoy the Simpsons. It's not transcendentally amazing as it once was, but it's still fun to watch.
Vote Prohibition 13 years ago

http://www.prohibitionparty.org/index.html
1. PZ Myers 13 years ago
  
  www://www.ragetarianparty.org/killtheselfish
  1. PZ Myers 13 years ago
    
    I'm a giant douche.
    1. Not Jason Godesky 13 years ago
      
      I suggest this:
      
      http://www.vhemt.org/
      1. Sounds like Jason Godesky 13 years ago
    2. Ted S. 13 years ago
      
      We already knew that, PZ.
2. cw 13 years ago
  
  Since the WOD is such a raging success, you want to outlaw drinking, right, teetotaler?
MSM 13 years ago

Look. We already told you Iowa doesn't mean anything.
Bingo 13 years ago

Youtube has the best comments:

Only Singer Tina Tunrer Could Play Uhura's Mother in a Cameo in Star Trek 12.Which is now Filming. Uhura's mother would be a Starfleet Admiral in Charge of the? Intelligence Division at a Starbase near the Klingon Neutral Zone.
Roadracer987654321 1 week ago
1. Realist 13 years ago
  
  "Uhura's mother would be a Starfleet Admiral in Charge of the? Intelligence Division at a Starbase near the Klingon Neutral Zone."
  Now that is true science fiction!
  1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
    
    The Klingon Neutral Zone? Wasn't that one of the results of the War of 1812?
    1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
      
      The Klingon Neutral Zone? Wasn't that one of the results of the War of 1812?
      
      But I thought those were Canucks on the other side of Lake Erie.
      1. Realist 13 years ago
        
        "But I thought those were Canucks on the other side of Lake Erie."
        The Klingon is a crafty warrior.
      2. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        "It's a good day to die, eh?"
        
        Bob & Doug McKenzie 13 years ago
        
        So, like, we're Klingons, eh?
        
        Klingadian Weapons Officer 13 years ago
        
        Sir! The back-bacon beam is ready to fire!
  2. gaoxiaen 13 years ago
    
    Isn't that called a "taint"?
e 13 years ago

http://wattsupwiththat.com/201.....en-letter/
Mario Mano 13 years ago

Yeah but the real question is....does Ron Paul gets to count the votes ?
1. Team Red 13 years ago
  
  As far as we're concerned, he didn't GET any votes.
  1. Team Blue 13 years ago
    
    No, he didn't and let's keep it that way.
AlmightyJB 13 years ago

I'm not sure this means much of anything. Not trying to be a smartass but really, is this supposed to make me feel warm and fuzzy?
1. Haps 13 years ago
  
  but then I got high
  1. AlmightyJB 13 years ago
    
    yeah. i'm with you.
AlmightyJB 13 years ago

To all you west coast partiers getting here three hours from now, I was wasted waaaaayyyy before you:) And to White Indian, fuck you!
PantsFan 13 years ago

SNL has always been hit and miss. We only remember the hits.
Even Phil Hartman made a few stinker sketches, I'm sure.
Reck 13 years ago

Really? We're rehashing this again in late February?
I thought we had already done the "Ron Paul polls well in Iowa" thing and then everything after that put a bullet in the belief that translates to anything meaningful for the rest of the country.
Tony 13 years ago

This is great news for libertarians who prefer a president that would repeal the Civil Rights Act over one who is part African-American.
1. Nyarlathotep 13 years ago
  
  Eat buffalo shit, Tony.
  1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
    
    You're fucking lying again, Tony.
    1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
      
      Appears to me, he's calling everyone here a racist. Is that part of his usual schtick?
      1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, he's your typical liberal hypocrite - thinks it's okay for him and his ilk to say nasty things, but calls for "hate speech" laws for everyone else.
        
        You know... typical liberal.
        
        Typical Fibertarian 13 years ago
        
        Primitards and libtards... 13 years ago
        
        ...sitting in a tree...
      2. MNG 13 years ago
        
        "Appears to me, he's calling everyone here a racist. Is that part of his usual schtick?"
        
        Lord, don't tell Rev. Blue Moon!
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        It's far too easy to accuse people of racism. One of the side effects of the First Amendment.
  2. Querulous Yellow 13 years ago
    
    ... and then die, Tony.
2. Rubicon 13 years ago
  
  Right Tony,Libertarians are really out to enslave us while the big government statists you enjoy fellating so freely only want to liberate us.
  1. "To Serve Man" 13 years ago
    1. Admiral Ackbar 13 years ago
      
      IT'S A TRAP!!!
3. cw 13 years ago
  
  You see, Tony believes in "might makes right." If the majority of folks want to bash your face in, even if for no reason whatsoever, they have the right.
  1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
    
    Especially if it's for the children!
  2. Might Makes Privation Property 13 years ago
    
    Officer, am I free to gambol about plain and forest?
4. Leon the killer Panetta 13 years ago
  
  Any decent person should prefer a non-killer over a proven, war-mongering civilian killer.
  1. African Children's Club 13 years ago
    
    We're for Ron Paul.
  2. Pakistani Little Village Kids 13 years ago
    
    We're afraid for our lives with that O-Bomb-a guy, but Ron Paul we think is OK.
smartass 13 years ago

So now all we need to do is have a tidal wave or something temporarily wipe out everything but Iowa, just before the election. Then RP can win. Then we can restore everything but Iowa. Which we're going to put in deep freeze right after the election, to be thawed and reused at the next election.

Oh, but don't tell anyone because this is a secret.
Mr. FIFY 13 years ago

The stoopid... it burns...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....n=comments
1. Francisco d Anconia 13 years ago
  
  Thanks for that. *pops another blood pressure pill*
PS 13 years ago

I really had to laugh when I came across this quote in Gardner Dozois introduction to The Year's Best Science Fiction: Twentieth Annual Collection (2003)

The operative word here, though, is "good." Most of the deliberate attempts to create YA (Young Adult) SF novels in the past few years have produced only dull, pompous, and condescending books, usually stuffed to the gunwales with didactic libertarian propaganda. This isn't going to do it for kids raised on MTV, CGI-drenched movies, and computer games. You need something that will be as exciting to kids in the Oughts as Heinlein's "juvenile" novels were to kids in the '50s. And, frankly, rather than being as safe and politically correct as possible, a whiff of nonconformist rebellion and outlaw danger wouldn't hurt either.

Gardner, I think this word libertarian does not mean what you think it means.
1. Haps 13 years ago
  
  but then I got high.
Informant 13 years ago

I'm disappointed that Reason hasn't gotten a post up yet on the Republican congressional candidate, and Romney campaign co-chair for Arizona, who was just outed as not only being gay, but possibly having a relationship with illegal alien. http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/azdc/155462
Informant 13 years ago

I'm disappointed that there's not a post up yet about Sheriff Babeu yet. It's even better than the Sheriff Pat Sullivan story last year since Babeu is not only still in office, he's running for a congressional seat and was co-chairing Romney's campaign in Arizona.
1. Jerry 13 years ago
  
  Expelling an illegal immigrant who is also gay should get you extra brownie points with the GOP base. At least he wasn't waiting for Obama to do something about this problem - Babeu took matters into his own hands.
  1. Fluffy 13 years ago
    
    Babeu took matters dick into his own hands.
    
    FIFY
Gregg 13 years ago

Santorum constantly voted against the 2nd Amendment but voted repeatedly to give Penn State pedophile Jerry Sandusky the congressional Angels in Adoption award. Newt loves illegals (amnesty) more than Americans (Newt wants to bring back child labor for US kids). Mitt thinks corporations are people (killing his general election chances). Ron Paul is the only candidate with a plan to end the TSA and end the endless wars for Israel, it all started a decade ago after a false flag attack.
9/11, US and Israel:
http://www.amazon.com/America-.....1450257437
1. Xenocles 13 years ago
  
  Please keep supporting Paul, but never say why again.
  1. Coeus 13 years ago
    
    Sometimes I'm happy about the widespread Paul support, and sometimes it makes me feel dirty. This time is one of the latter.
0x90 13 years ago

Maybe Paul has played his cards wrong; all those times that he said he had no plans for running 3rd party -- he should have said "yes, I will be doing that, if I do not get the Republican nomination." I wonder what the effect of that would have been -- a threat is only an empty threat when it's empty.
1. protefeed 13 years ago
  
  The effect is that Rand Paul would never get the Republican nomination in 2016 after Romney or Santorum loses to Obama.
  1. 0x90 13 years ago
    
    I don't see how that follows. If, in 2012, I pull away 20% of your support, either in or out of your party, how does that put me in a poor position in 2016? The threat is just as valid then as it is now, assuming my base doesn't evaporate -- in which case, the whole question is moot.
Dominy Dominee 13 years ago

Santorum claims Obama's theology is non-Biblical. Obama spokesman calls comment "ugliness".
1. Joe Wilson 13 years ago
  
  When asked about the statement at a news conference later, Santorum said, "If the president says he's a Christian, he's a Christian."
  
  You lie!
  1. Hugo Longbone 13 years ago
    
    If I took everyone who claimed they were christian at face value, there would be no schisms, but that shit ain't the truth. Then both Santorum and Obama are probably both in error on something, but their religious doctrine doesn't matter as much as their errors on the role of the federal government.
2. Born-Again Barry 13 years ago
  
  That's an unfair attack. I read the Bible every night. Jesus whispers in my ear to tell me when to slaughter Asian and African civilians.
  1. Xenocles 13 years ago
    
    I dropped Facebook months ago, but I wonder how my Obama-fanboy acquaintances reacted to Obama's admission that he talks to God for policy advice just like Bush did.
    1. Obama Fanboy 13 years ago
      
      [::blank stare::]
joshua 13 years ago

reason, thank you for putting ron in the spotlight. ron paul 2012.
1. Haps 13 years ago
  
  I was gonna vote Ron Paul, but then I got high
  1. Generic Skyrim Hold Guard 13 years ago
    
    I was going to vote for Ron Paul, but then I tool an arrow in the knee.
    1. Dovahkiin 13 years ago
      
      I was going to vote for Ron Paul, but someone stole my sweetroll.
      FUS RO DAH!
MNG 13 years ago

More Lin-Sanity!

Jeremy Lin inspires other Asian Americans to pursue sports

"Lin's athletic prowess has surprised many in the United States who believed the stereotype of Asian Americans as violin-playing bookworms who think sports are a time-waster.

Asian Americans who never watched basketball now gather to cheer for the Knicks ? on Sunday Lin will appear in his first nationally broadcast game. And for those who didn't see much value in sports, Lin's success may be changing the conversation about what is acceptable for their children."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....story.html

Of course, according to some folks, like our own Rev. Blue Moon, these people are racists and dopes for being so encouraged and inspired.
1. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
  
  It's not racist to judge people based on their race?
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    As I tried to explain to our Rev. it's not racist to cheer someone who is busting racial stereotypes by succeeding in places where the groups they are members of are wildly under-represented. But see, in order to do that you have to notice that they guy is a member of a group that is wildly under-represented, and that is a necessary part of what you are cheering. Yes, I don't see that as racist.
    1. MNG 13 years ago
      
      When people say they are cheering for Lin "because he's Asian" they are saying "I'm cheering for him because he's an Asian guy who is busting the racial stereotype and barriers that have Asian guys being unable to ball."
      
      But note: you have to have that first part ("because he's an Asian guy") to have the rest make sense. I don't think that's racist, no.
      1. protefeed 13 years ago
        
        he's an Asian guy who is busting the racial stereotype and barriers that have Asian guys being unable to ball."
        
        I would say that the existence of billions of Asians is pretty strong evidence that Asian men know how to ball.
        
        Playing basketball, however, appears to be a significantly greater challenge.
        
        sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        rimshot
      2. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        Okay, so when Tim Tebow finally switches to running back, it will be cool for me to cheer for him because he's a white guy busting the racial stereotype and "barriers" that have white guys being unable to run the ball?
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        I'd say part of the dynamic with Tebow is that he's a rare white "running quarterback."
        
        Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        So is that a yes? You're saying it's okay to support Tebow because he's white?
        
        Note: Tebow blows. I spent 2 hours taunting him in the blowout at Gillete.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Most certainly it is great to root for a member of Y which is under-represented in X, succeeding in X. Note that is different than what you and several others keep coming back to: "is it ok to root for X [solely, just because, etc] they are a member of Y?"
        
        I said a few days ago I thought it was cool to root for Peyton Hillis because he was a white rb doing well in the NFL.
        
        As one black commentator on ESPN said discussing Hillis "imagine how many young white aspiring running backs, who have been told that whites don't make good running backs, gain from seeing Hillis succeed."
      3. Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        Never mind that basketball is huge in China and Yao Ming has been a star over here for years.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Do you think Ming's performance equalled that of Lin's recent performance?
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        I am grossly unqualified to evaluate basketball skill, but does it matter? I seem to remember Ming being a megastar and still somewhat big in this country today. He certainly played longer. Rookies have a habit of being flashes in the pan in baseball and I'd not be surprised to hear the same thing happens in basketball.
        
        Contrarian P 13 years ago
        
        Absolutely Yao Ming's performance not only equalled, but surpassed Jeremy Lin's recent performance. The guy has had a good month. A good month. Yao was a multi-time all star and considered to be at least the second best center in the league, if not the best, at one time. Nobody is arguing that Lin is the best point guard in basketball, or even in the upper echelon. Frankly, his numbers have come largely against poor teams or teams who are weak at point guard. Certainly he's played well and been the recipient of media hype way out of proportion to his actual accomplishments (largely because he's playing in New York), but he needs to keep it up for a whole season, let alone several, before anyone can begin comparing him to Yao. The point made about rookies in baseball is well taken. Someone may tear up the league for a little while until teams figure out how to pitch to him. Similarly, Lin is putting up big numbers now, but we'll see how he does once teams have a chance to really dissect his game and design their defense to contain him.
    2. sloopyinca 13 years ago
      
      it's not racist to cheer someone who is busting racial stereotypes by succeeding in places where the groups they are members of are wildly under-represented.
      
      It is if you're cheering them on or supporting them solely because of their race.
      
      See: Obama, Barack
      1. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        It's racist to point out that many Obama supporters voted for him because he is black.
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Really?
        
        http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/racist
        
        Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        Do you need an explicit sarcasm tag?
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Oh, sorry. I'm not picking up sarcasm well today.
      2. MNG 13 years ago
        
        "It is if you're cheering them on or supporting them solely because of their race."
        
        But that's the thing, it's not "solely because of their race", there's the added context that members of that race are amazingly under-represented.
        
        I think it was perfectly fine for people to vote for Barak because he would be the first black President. It's not them voting for him "solely because he's black" but because he's the first person from a group that makes up over 1 in 10 Americans and yet amazingly has never produce one of the forty plus Presidents. And of course all that history of massive racism. It's as non-racist to be supportive of that as it is to be happy about Jackie Robinson breaking into baseball.
        
        Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
        
        I think it was perfectly fine for people to vote for Barak because he would be the first black President. It's not them voting for him "solely because he's black"
        
        ...
        
        Rev. Blue Mooon 13 years ago
        
        He's precious isn't he?
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Poor Rev. still thinks those sentences cancel each other out or something, so anyone who says them both must be...
        
        DISHONEST!
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        So he's black and has good timing. Got it.
        
        Jackie Robinson could have sucked with very little consequence for the country. If Barack Obama sucks it's kind of bad for everyone. It turns out that maybe cosmetic factors aren't the best criteria to evaluate when choosing whom to vote for.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        I don't think it is racist for people to have cheered Jackie Robinson's breathrough, do you?
        
        Now it's one thing to cheer the breakthrough, and another to refuse to acknowlege if he performed poorly. I'm glad this nation has gone from one that would never have a black man come close to being President to one that has elected a black President, but that President has done poorly and I don't feel any pressure to ignore that.
        
        Two different things.
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        The only good thing Obama has ever done, is to get elected... which proves Americans WILL vote for someone who isn't white.
        
        Even if they're hAlfrican-American.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        In about ten years conservatives who lamented that people voted for him to elect the first black President will love Obama, at least in this sense, whenever someone says this is a racist nation they will say "yeah right, the nation that elected a black president is racist."
        
        Suddenly it will mean something to them to. But you know, being ten-20 years behind everyone else is kind of what it is to be a conservative....
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        Robinson was a good player in the Negro Leagues and did quite well in the Majors. Obama was never anything more than a middling pol. He rode a dual wave of anti-Republican sentiment and racial cheerleading into the presidency. The warning signs of his bad administration were all there. It's as if Branch Rickey had hired a random black guy as a gimmick rather than actually trying to improve his team. (Actually, Futurama dramatized pretty much exactly that situation.)
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        "Obama was never anything more than a middling pol."
        
        Er, who won the Presidency. Winning the Presidency to a pol is like winning the Super Bowl for a football player.
        
        He's been a terrible President, and yes, I called that too waaaaay before he got elected or even nominated.
        
        But it's hard with a straight face to argue anyone who won the Presidency is a "middling pol."
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        What I meant is that Obama had zero executive experience and weak legislative experience (state legislator and < 1 term as a US Senator) prior to the formation of the craze surrounding him.
        
        I'll buy the Super Bowl analogy if you accept that the Republicans were the 1996 Saints and somehow made it to the Super Bowl by default. Anyone with a D next to their name would have had a significant advantage in 2008.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Many teams have won Super Bowls when the opponent that year was thought less than usually great. They still get the ring and are Super Bowl champions.
        
        Face it: to a politician there is no bigger win.
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        I think you're deliberately avoiding my actual point. The skill I actually care about is executive ability, not electoral ability. Obama may be the best in the world at the latter but everything I said is about the former.
        
        Night Elf Mohawk 13 years ago
        
        Winning the Presidency to a pol is like winning the Super Bowl for a football player.
        
        If the Browns got to win a Super Bowl because people voted that way because it would be their first win, maybe they would be like each other.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, well politics is different from many things like that, it kind of is a popularity contest rather than a skills challenge.
        
        shut the fuck up 13 years ago
        
        "I don't think it is racist for people to have cheered Jackie Robinson's breathrough, do you?"
        
        Look at MNG pretending that people cheering for and end to segregation, and not Robinson's race, is the same as cheering for a guy because he's asian.
        
        God you're fucking stupid MNG.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        You're hilarious. In Jackie's case no one noticed he was black, they were just cheering an end to segregation (but of whom? not blacks right, because, you know, no one knew Robinson was black, right?).
        
        And in Lin's case no one is cheering because the NBA which had virtually no Asian superstars now has one, they are cheering just because of his yellow skin.
        
        I'd comment on your intelligence, but I think your last line there says it all for me.
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        "And in Lin's case no one is cheering because the NBA which had virtually no Asian superstars now has another one..."
        
        FIFY.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        I'm not sure going from one to two, and those two not concurrent btw, dissolves the under-representation...
        
        By that logic whoever the second black player to succeed in MLB was should have been ignored. After all, "they had one already."
        
        el Commentariosa 13 years ago
        
        what about Black/Asian hockey players?
        
        Xenocles 13 years ago
        
        Can you name the second black player in the MLB without looking it up?
        
        Contrarian P 13 years ago
        
        I can name literally dozens of major league baseball players who are black. Did you mean another league?
    3. shut the fuck up 13 years ago
      
      "As I tried to explain to our Rev. it's not racist to cheer someone who is busting racial stereotypes by succeeding in places where the groups they are members of are wildly under-represented."
      
      It is if you're cheering for them because of their race.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        "But that's the thing, it's not "solely because of their race", there's the added context that members of that race are amazingly under-represented."
        
        I like that I answered you hours before you asked the question.
2. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
  
  I have to say this:
  
  Asains were not, to my knowledge, forbidden to play professional sports.
  
  Therefore, Lin should not be such a big deal.
  1. protefeed 13 years ago
    
    I think part of the Lin thing isn't about race -- it's about the narrative of this underdog that was relegated to the bench and the minors, and then they put him in the game once and he proved they had wildly underestimated him.
    1. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
      
      That would be fine. A lot of my favorite players in sports are the undrafted or underdrafted guys.
  2. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
    
    And I'll say the same thing about NASCAR, unless there's some "No Negroes Allowed" signs in the pit-crew locker rooms I'm not aware of.
  3. Xenocles 13 years ago
    
    Indeed, Morning Edition this week had an interview with an earlier Asian-American pro basketball player. He was of Japanese descent and played right after WW2. That sounds like a slightly more significant barrier to me, but who knows.
  4. MNG 13 years ago
    
    "Asains were not, to my knowledge, forbidden to play professional sports."
    
    And yet, contrary to all statistical probability, they were amazingly under-represented.
    
    Gee, it kind of makes you think there may be barriers other than explicit legal ones in life...And one's worth cheering about when they are overcome...
    1. joe mama 13 years ago
      
      "Gee, it kind of makes you think there may be barriers other than explicit legal ones in life..."
      
      Like genetics? Overcoming this obstacle isn't worth praise.
      1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        What I'm saying, MNG, is there was - to my knowledge - anything preventing Asians from playing basketball, or any other sport for that matter.
        
        Maybe up until recently, few Asians *wanted* to play such sports.
        
        Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        My armchair outsider impression of most Asian families is that they would be seriously pissed if Tetsuo Jr. decided to ease up on academic work to pursue a basketball career.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        "Maybe up until recently, few Asians *wanted* to play such sports."
        
        And you don't think someone like Lin providing precedent, inspiration and such to the few that did is not worth celebration? Or is that racism?
        
        Or..DISHONESTY?
    2. shut the fuck up 13 years ago
      
      "And yet, contrary to all statistical probability, they were amazingly under-represented."
      
      and blacks are amazingly over represented.
      
      Make a point.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        I did.
        
        You've just yet to get it.
    3. MNG is racist 13 years ago
      
      "And yet, contrary to all statistical probability, they were amazingly under-represented."
      
      so are white people.
    4. Tulpa 13 years ago
      
      Golf, baseball, and figure skating aren't sports? Figure skating in particular is heavily Asian.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        What point are you trying to make Tulpa? Asians are well represente in some sports. So if an Asian started to excel in one of those sports it would not be a big deal, even to most Asians.
        
        But they were not well represented in this particular sport called pro basketball. And then Lin-sanity! so Asians, and others, got excited about that.
        
        Actually, that kind of lends support to my long held contention that the cheers are not "solely because he's Asian" but are about a member of group Y that is underp-represented in sport X excelling in sport X. Right?
        
        Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        underp-represented
        
        RC'z Law?
        
        I think it's seriously collectivist thinking to think that Asian* kids are going to be attracted to a sport more because someone of a loosely related ethnicity is getting attention doing it.
        
        * I should mention that I absolutely hate glomming together the ethnicities of half a heavily populated, wildly diverse continent under one name. Saying that Japanese, Korean, and Thai kids are going to be encouraged to get into basketball because of Lin is like saying an Irish guy like me would be encouraged to get into basketball because of Vlade Divacs.
        
        MNG 13 years ago
        
        And yet many Asians themselves are saying this (that's what the first article I linked to was about).
        
        I guess you'd like to argue that Tiger Wood's success didn't lead to any increased interest in golf by blacks....
        
        I actually do think that the presence of many of the Eastern European white NBA players has likely supported many whites aspiring to NBA careers...It's certainly harder for coaches, scouts, team-mates, parents, etc., to overlook, discourage, etc., white ball players under the belief that "white guys just can't play pro ball" when you have a bunch of Kukocs, Divacs and Petrovics starting for NBA teams...
        
        Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        Maybe I'm giving Asians too much credit.
        
        But the less Asian kids going into math the better; less competition for me.
  5. Pi Guy 13 years ago
    
    Isn't it actually a bigger deal that he _graduated_ from Harvard and still has success in the NBA?
    
    That seems to me to be an even greater anomaly.
3. Proprietist 13 years ago
  
  I liked Lin. Then he played the Mavericks and kicked our ass. Now I hate him.
  
  But I respect him.
MNG 13 years ago

And more Lin-Sanity, the WTF was ESPN thinking edition:

"ESPN has apologized for a headline that included a racial slur after Jeremy Lin and the New York Knicks lost to the New Orleans Hornets on Friday night, ending a seven-game winning streak that had sparked "Linsanity" over the unheralded Asian-American player's rise to stardom.

ESPN said that its headline, "Chink in the armor" appeared for about 30 minutes on its mobile site and was visible on tablets after Lin scored 26 points and had nine turnovers in the Knicks' loss. "

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....ml?hpid=z4

Did they hire John Rocker recently?
1. cw 13 years ago
  
  Ha.
2. Ted S. 13 years ago
  
  I think their Italian-American intern made a wopper of a mistake.
3. BakedPenguin 13 years ago
  
  Who the fuck thought Asians couldn't play sports? Were they aware of the Japanese players in MLB or the Asian (mostly S Korean) women who nearly dominate the LPGA?
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    C'mon BP, sports=Football and Basketball. Welcome to the Real America!
    
    Seriously though, I don't know for sure but I'd bet that in the US Football and Basketball, pro and college combined, might pull more viewers than all the others combined...
    1. BakedPenguin 13 years ago
      
      Sure, you'd think that. You live in Maryland, which hasn't had a baseball team since the early 1980's.
      1. MNG 13 years ago
        
        What do you think the O's are?
        
        BakedPenguin 13 years ago
        
        Fodder.
        
        Brett L 13 years ago
        
        Aren't they like the Astros of the American League? You know, a farm team that plays all their games against pros.
  2. Yao Ming 13 years ago
    
    What am I, chopped liver?
    
    ...or chopsticks?
  3. protefeed 13 years ago
    
    Who the fuck thought Asians couldn't play sports?
    
    Well, no, it's that they thought Asians couldn't play well at sports that put a huge premium on height and mass, namely football and basketball.
    
    I predict a similar phenomenon when some woman makes it into the NFL.
    1. PS 13 years ago
      
      That's why there are so many Asians in UEFA.
    2. Tulpa 13 years ago
      
      Why aren't there more Asian jockeys and race car drivers?
      1. Apogee 13 years ago
        
        Racism
el Commentariosa 13 years ago

Justin Timberlake as Bon Iver? You bet it was funny.
http://www.pitchfork.com/news/.....ight-live/
MNG 13 years ago

Last Lin-sanity post of the day from me: An interview with Jeremy Lin's pastor (so far no "godd*am America" quotes).

On Faith: What do you make of all of these comparisons to Tim Tebow?

Stephen Chen: The comparisons are apt if we're talking about his faith. If we're just talking about who he is as a Christian and what makes up his identity. They're brothers in Christ.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....l?hpid=z11
1. Mike M. 13 years ago
  
  Lin is fortunate that he's of Asian heritage. If he was another white guy, the media would have turned him into a "controversial" figure just like Tebow because of his devout Christian faith.
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    Strangely, I don't think the media turned Tebow into the controversial figure, the fans did.
    
    As I recall it most of the coverage was favorable until one ESPN commentator, or maybe a pro player, made some comments about his religion and the Twitter universe exploded with support. Then the commentariat took sides.
    
    As a sad irony a lot of the controversy surrounding Tebow focused on the fact that he was white, with some black sports analysts saying "if he were white no one would care" blah, blah, blah.
    1. cw 13 years ago
      
      I'm a Christian myself (Roman Catholic, no doubt!), but I find his ritual a little annoying. His public displays of piety border close on this: Matthew 6:5-6.
      1. Tebow the Christfag 13 years ago
        
        http://encyclopediadramatica.ch/Christfag
        
        Jason Godesky 13 years ago
        
        Haha! I make funny!
      2. NAZI Catholic Priestcraft 13 years ago
        
        http://encyclopediadramatica.c.....riests.jpg
        
        Jason Godesky 13 years ago
        
        Haha! I make funny!
      3. Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        iirc the context makes clear that he was referring to acts that are performed publicly with the express intention of increasing one's own reputation for piety. A sincere display of piety that happens to take place in public is not a problem.
el Commentariosa 13 years ago

"At 9, he settled a dispute with a pistol. At 13, he lit out for the Amazon"

but he's got nothing on this guy
1. MNG 13 years ago
  
  I thought maybe you meant the Dos Equis guy.
  1. el Commentariosa 13 years ago
    
    even the Dos Equis guy has a role model.
2. Brett L 13 years ago
  
  "When not clad in the lederhosen of his homeland, he cultivated an air of sophisticated complexity by appearing in women's clothes, set off by lipstick and fishnet stockings. "
  
  I fucking love Brit obit writers.
3. Bingo 13 years ago
  
  he made friends such as Darius Guppy and Viscount Althorp and became an enthusiastic, rubber-clad member of the Piers Gaveston Society and the drink-fuelled Bullingdon and Loders clubs.
  
  I need more friends named Darius Guppy and Viscount Althorp.
  1. R C Dean 13 years ago
    
    Screw that. I need to join more drink-fuelled clubs.
    
    I'll pass on the rubber-clad members, thanks.
4. Robert 13 years ago
  
  What disagreement could a pistol have with a 9 YO?
MNG 13 years ago

Here's the main reason Obama will never get my vote again:

"the Obama administration has quietly unleashed a multi?agency crackdown on medical cannabis that goes far beyond anything undertaken by George W. Bush. The feds are busting growers who operate in full compliance with state laws, vowing to seize the property of anyone who dares to even rent to legal pot dispensaries, and threatening to imprison state employees responsible for regulating medical marijuana. With more than 100 raids on pot dispensaries during his first three years, Obama is now on pace to exceed Bush's record for medical-marijuana busts. "There's no question that Obama's the worst president on medical marijuana," says Rob Kampia, executive director of the Marijuana Policy Project. "He's gone from first to worst."

http://www.rollingstone.com/po.....t-20120216
1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Hey MiNGe, I wanted to make sure you didn't think I was being a dick yesterday on the ag gag subthread. I accidentally hit enter partway through a post, so it may have come across dickish. Please go back over and read my following post.
  1. MNG 13 years ago
    
    I absolutely did not take it that way, I enjoyed debating it with you too. But thanks for the following post anyways (which I read this morning).
2. God of the Reefer Stick 13 years ago
  
  "...first to worst..."
  
  Well goddammit, make sure you don't vote for him AGAIN! With Obama you got War on Drugs, War on the World and War on Civil Liberties.
  1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    90% of his pro-pot voters will vote for him again once he trots out the "kultur war" meme on the SoCon turd Team Red trots out.
    
    As soon as the GOP realizes the War On Pot is a net loser for them and they stick someone on the ballot that is for personal liberty where it is concerned, like Paul, they will demolish Team Blue for at least two election cycles.
    1. MNG 13 years ago
      
      In fairness Sloop, the GOP will help him there. Remember when the GOP attacked Bill Clinton for being soft on drugs?
      
      http://reason.com/blog/2012/02.....nt_2850486
P Brooks 13 years ago

Campaigner-in-Chief on the trail.

Obama paid a visit to a Boeing facility that remains, at 4.3 million square feet, the world's largest building to give symbolic heft to his call for tax breaks for companies that relocate jobs from overseas. The president took the stage with a high-production flourish, emerging from the rear cabin of a new 787 Dreamliner and bounding down a set of red-colored stairs to his lectern as a crowd of workers cheered and snapped photos.

Citing renewed demand for commercial aircraft that helped boost orders at the company by more than 50 percent last year, Obama said Boeing hired 13,000 workers to fill the need.

Strangely, he omits any mention of the NLRB in his comments.
1. db 13 years ago
  
  How are these big events held at factories, etc. not considered to be donations to the politicians who use them for campaigning? Boeing must have spent a fortune setting that up and providing time for their employees to attend.
  
  You also never read about how many employees refuse to attend these assemblies.
  1. Tulpa 13 years ago
    
    The heavily subsidized 230 jet "order" that BO just arranged for Boeing more than pays for it.
Realist 13 years ago

"Ron Paul Leads Obama In Iowa, According to New Poll"
Now that is meaningless information.
1. Sanjuro Tsubaki 13 years ago
  
  Not in River City it ain't.
P Brooks 13 years ago

John McCain says SUPERPACS ARE DESTROYING DEMOCRACY!!!!

Also wants to continue killing Afghans.
1. el Commentariosa 13 years ago
  
  I read that as SUPERCARS and was ready to become angry.
2. Realist 13 years ago
  
  Democracy is destroying Democracy.
  1. db 13 years ago
    
    It's built into the system.
    1. Dennis 13 years ago
      
      Come see the violence inherent in the system!
    2. Realist 13 years ago
      
      "It's built into the system."
      Yes, indeed.
      
      "Democracy destroys itself because it abuses its right to freedom and equality. Because it teaches its citizens to consider audacity as a right, lawlessness as a freedom, abrasive speech as equality, and anarchy as progress."
      ? Isocrates
P Brooks 13 years ago

Robert Gibbs is shocked (SHOCKED!!) by the viciousness and partisanship in American politics today.

Money, no doubt, is the cause.
1. Realist 13 years ago
  
  "Money, no doubt, is the cause."
  It is....after all... the root of all evil.
  1. A Rand 13 years ago
    
    Have you ever asked what is the root of all money?
2. God of the Reefer Stick 13 years ago
  
  "Oily Robert" Gibbs. What a joke. That new sleazebag Carney is even worse. Those guys are your President talking.
sloopyinca 13 years ago

OK, so Banjos and I spent the day at Magic Mountain yesterday, and are getting ready to head back to the park in a couple of hours. Lots of fun, but here's how our night ended:

We were in line for our last ride of the night, when lo and behold, we spotted a man with a heavily tattoed neck, a handlebar mustache, short greased back hair, flannel shirt and huge disks in his ears with the Miller High Life logo on them.

My initial reaction was to remove him post haste from the gene pool, as was The soon-to-be Mrs Sloopy. Unfortunately, that goes against the non-aggression principle I ascribe to.

So question for reasonoids: would it be OK to break the non-aggression principle to ensure this kind of person is unable to procreate?
1. NAP = debate convenience 13 years ago
  
  "Protecting" Privation Property breaks the "Non-Aggression Principle" every day.
  1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    Are you serious? Are you serious?
    
    /Pelosi
  2. Uh oh 13 years ago
    
    Here come the EcoCops. Watch out for your quads and reefer stash.
    1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
      
      Jason's just upset because he can't shit in every living room in the country.
      1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        It's certainly not for lack of effort.
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        I don't own a gun, but if anyone tries to shit in MY living room, they're getting a beat-down.
        
        sloopyinca 13 years ago
        
        You don't own a gun? Interesting. How come? (Just curious)
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Oh, I could, I just don't. May get one, though.
  3. Uh oh 13 years ago
    
    Here comes the anti-PRIVACY Secret Police.
2. Police 13 years ago
  
  Join us, first.
  1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    I'd rather be a hipster than a cop.
3. Binky 13 years ago
  
  Sorry, but need more information before I can advise you. Was the Miller High Life logo on the discs, or on the ears per se?
  1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
    
    The logo was on the disks. And these things were HUGE. I'd say 2" diameter.
    1. Binky 13 years ago
      
      OK, then, let him be.
4. db 13 years ago
  
  My eyes would roll very far at such a sight, but live and let live, I say. I wonder if Mr. High Life would think the same of my hobbies.
P Brooks 13 years ago

would it be OK to break the non-aggression principle to ensure this kind of person is unable to procreate?

Because he drinks Miller High Life?

Sloopy, I am disappoint.
1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  Not because of that, Brooksie, but because he used his hipster checklist to get dressed. I sincerely doubt the guy drinks High Life, unless it's ironically.
  
  Did I forget to mention that he and his girlfriend both had on horn-rimmed glasses, and she had the bullring in her nose and two-tone monochromatic hair?
  
  This has nothing to do with drinking High Life, Brooksie.
  1. Brett L 13 years ago
    
    Sadly, that may have been my brother's former roommate and his gf. Although they're far more likely to be at Disneyworld. They're good people, just, you know... Let me try again. If I close my eyes when I talk to the guy, he's a great guy.
  2. ryan 13 years ago
    
    When the fuck did that stupid shit become 'hip'?
P Brooks 13 years ago

Dee Dee Meyers thinks compulsory free provision of contraceptives to womyns is a WINNER fore the Demos.

What kind of misogynist troglodyte would dare to suggest women (couples, even!) put their grubby little paws in their own pockets to buy their own preventive measures.
P Brooks 13 years ago

a man with a heavily tattoed neck, a handlebar mustache, short greased back hair, flannel shirt

Jesse James was at Magic Mountain? Ans he now has a handlebar moustache?

Actually, the first time through I read that as "stereotypical East L A Latino gangster" who drinks MHL. He's probably packin' anyway; approach with care.
1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  I should have mentioned his whiteness. Then the picture would have been more in focus.
  
  And I've never seen a Latino with a handlebar mustache, so I assumed everyone would have known he was a honkey.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Now Dee Dee is on about how if you work hard and play by the rules you can't make it.

There are only a handful of Americans who are not starving! Hand out the pitchforks, Dee Dee, if your malnourished frame can stand up to that sort of effort.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Speaking of hipster douchebags...

I caught a few minutes of one of the ubiquitous Hipster Douchebag Focus Group shows on MSNBC; they were talking about the drug war, so I thought I'd see what they had to say. In a truly impressive display of mental gymnastics, they managed to describe it as an effort by conservatives to conduct an ethnic cleansing program in the Outer Boroughs in order to skew political representation for the Greater New York Area.

How can you possibly refute that?
1. sloopyinca 13 years ago
  
  How can you possibly refute that?
  
  You can't. That's why it's best to cleanse it with fire.
  1. Homeland Security 13 years ago
    
    We're interested in your theories, sloopyinca. Mind if we send some men over to discuss them?
    1. General Dynamics 13 years ago
      
      We still get paid for tracking his comments, right?
2. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
  
  By using a mustache drawn on your finger. Duh.
P Brooks 13 years ago

Preview.

As rich suburbanites sit in their McMansions and laugh...

ONE county jail here is so crowded that some inmates sleep on the floor, while the other county jail, a few miles down the road, sits empty.

There is no money for the second one anymore.

The county roads here need paving, and the tax collector needs help.

There is no money for them, either.

There is no money for a lot of things around here, not since Jefferson County, population 658,000, went bankrupt last fall. There is no money for holiday D.U.I. checkpoints, litter patrols or overtime pay at the courthouse. None for crews to pull weeds or pick up road kill ? not even when, as happened recently, an unlucky cow was hit near the town of Wylam.

"We don't do that any more," E. Wayne Sullivan, director of the roads and transportation department, said of such roadside cleanup.

Our own little Greek tragedy, as it were. It would be helpful if the NYT reporter would give us a hint about just what exactly the county *does* spend its money on (besides the bankruptcy trustee, that is).

And some nuanced economic analysis from the cheap seats:

"I don't accept the legitimacy of this debt," said Allyn Hudson, 32, an Occupy Birmingham organizer camping near the bankruptcy court. "It shouldn't ever have been issued, and therefore it shouldn't exist. It shouldn't have been spent. Since it shouldn't have existed, we're not going to pay it."
1. db 13 years ago
  
  "I don't accept the legitimacy of this debt," said Allyn Hudson, 32, an Occupy Birmingham organizer camping near the bankruptcy court. "It shouldn't ever have been issued, and therefore it shouldn't exist. It shouldn't have been spent. Since it shouldn't have existed, we're not going to pay it."
  
  Wow. What does he mean "it shouldn't have been spent?" I tend to agree with him on this point, but he probably means it wasn't spent on the right things.
  1. NEWT PAUL: "I disavow." 13 years ago
    
    Only libertarians know the right things government should spend money on.
    
    1. Gambol Lockdown.
    2. Protecting any white person's Right To Take.
    1. Proprietist 13 years ago
      
      What's that sound, Jason? Is it the call of the wild?
      
      Alas! It's just your mom yelling at you to stop jacking off down in the basement and go take out the trash.
2. Auric Demonocles 13 years ago
  
  Yeah.... that's not the way debt works. I agree that it shouldn't have existed... but it does.
  1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
    
    Wasn't spent on the right things by Top. Men.
    1. Top. Men. 13 years ago
      
      We. Rule. Your. Asses.
  2. MNG is racist 13 years ago
    
    I do wonder though, about the idea of refusing to pay an illegitimate debt.
    
    Say, as a taxpayer who got milked. If the local government engaged in fraud, and that fraud is being passed to me, why should I eat it?
    
    Not, "why legally", but "why should I bear the cost of someone else's crime"?
Mr. FIFY 13 years ago

Once again, The Onion puts up fake news that has eerily-realistic overtones:

http://www.theonion.com/video/.....rme,27410/
1. Sharon Stone 13 years ago
  
  That was great. TY
Homez 13 years ago

Look ma, real libertarians. Bless their naive little souls.
1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
  
  Oh, my, folks... we have another idiot in our midst. Give it up for Homez.
  1. NEWT PAUL: "I disavow." 13 years ago
    
    "Things happen, especially my signing shit I don't read."
2. Homez 13 years ago
  
  I'm a turd sandwich.
  1. Homez 13 years ago
    
    On a sesame seed bun.
Sevo 13 years ago

OMG! Billionaires contribute to BOTH parties!
See how the CU decision makes things UNFAIR?!
At least according to Reich:
http://www.sfgate.com/columns/reich/
I guess prior to the HORRIBLE decision, billionaires could only contribute to one party, right?
1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
  
  It's okay when billionaires contribute to Democrats, though.
  
  (According to Democrats, that is.)
  1. George Soros 13 years ago
    
    I, alone, am a greater human being than every wealthy right-winger.
    1. Media Matters 13 years ago
      
      We couldn't agree more!
      
      Uh... where's our weekly stipend, Sir?
    2. Ghosts of the Holocaust 13 years ago
      
      Ahem...
      1. George Soros 13 years ago
        
        I ain't afraid of no ghosts!
        
        $oros 13 years ago
        
        It's ok and profitable to be a war profiteer as long as I contribute to OBAMA 2012.
        
        Team Blue 13 years ago
        
        WE OVERLOOK YOUR OBVIOUS FLAWS AND THE FACT THAT YOU'RE WEALTHY AND USE THAT WEALTH TO EFFECT POLITICAL ACTIONS!!!ONE!
        
        Team Blue 13 years ago
        
        ...but it's evil when the Koch brothers do it.
        
        Occupiers 13 years ago
        
        We're waiting for the signal to start looting and burning down rich white men's houses!
        
        Barack the Jaunty Future King 13 years ago
        
        Not yet, My minions. Bide your time.
2. Sevo 13 years ago
  
  And since Reich is such a believer in the 'correctness' of government, why doesn't he think the presidential race is as valuable as, say, the snack-food market?
  The US spends $24Bn on potato chips over a four year span ( http://www.sfa.org/potato150.aspx ), while we wasted only $730M electing the liar-in-chief in 2008 ( http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/ )
  1. Beavis 13 years ago
    
    Heh. He said "firm". That's cool!
  2. mustard 13 years ago
    
    That's not a fair comparison. Obama is only one president so you have to compare his worth to a single potato chip. I think he comes out ahead.
    1. Sevo 13 years ago
      
      "I think he comes out ahead."
      Nope. A potato chip doesn't stick his hand in my pocket.
      1. Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        Depends on the chip. BO may beat out one of the nasty dark "charps" you find at the bottom of the bag.
Homez 13 years ago

Workers for Apple supplier Foxconn get a 25% raise amid criticism of its labor practices
http://techland.time.com/2012/.....pay-raise/
1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
  
  Nothing about China's horrible human-rights record, eh, Homez?
  
  Sounds like you're fine with it.
  1. Homez 13 years ago
    
    Are you making sure nothing you buy comes from China?
    1. The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
      
      That's virtually impossible, and you damn well know it.
      
      Do YOU do that?
      1. Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        Don't expect a straight answer from a liberal, Pointer. They love China's human-rights record, because that's what they want here in America.
        
        The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
        
        I can see why they'd want that kind of power. Government control of the internet, using political dissidents as slave labor... that fits their agenda.
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        It's okay when Team Blue does it!
        
        /snark
        
        Homez 13 years ago
        
        I got nuthin'. Back to the basement!
      2. Homez (REAL) 13 years ago
        
        as much as I can, yes.
        I also try to purchase goods Made in the USA union shops as much as possible.
        
        Fatty Bolger 13 years ago
        
        You're a (REAL) idiot.
        
        Mr. FIFY 13 years ago
        
        And you do this because... you *care*, right?
        
        The Pointer-Outer 13 years ago
        
        Hmm. ONLY union-made?
        
        Homez 13 years ago
        
        If possible.
        
        /stop sprawl!
        /think or do something green
        
        A fan 13 years ago
        
        I blew a green snot out of my nose and it became Homez!
2. Colonel_Sanders 13 years ago
  
  Still, the fact that Apple initiated third-party inspections at all is unusual for a consumer electronics company; paired with the Foxconn pay increases, it's a sign that Apple is committed to combatting all of the negative press it has received following the most profitable quarter in the company's history.
  
  Yaeh, Apple. My heroes.
3. Colonel_Sanders 13 years ago
  
  Still, the fact that Apple initiated third-party inspections at all is unusual for a consumer electronics company; paired with the Foxconn pay increases, it's a sign that Apple is committed to combatting all of the negative press it has received following the most profitable quarter in the company's history.
  
  Yaeh, Apple. My heroes.
4. e 13 years ago
  
  I don't care how much they pay anyone. Their products make people dumb and lazy.
  1. Homez 13 years ago
    
    Apple is not the only company using Foxconn. Here is a partial list:
    Acer Inc.
    Amazon.com
    Apple Inc
    Cisco
    Dell
    Gateway
    Hewlett-Packard
    Intel
    Microsoft
    Motorola Mobility
    Nintendo
    Nokia
    Samsung
    Sony
    Toshiba
    Vizio
    
    Own any of that? Linksys router? Motorola cable box? Microwave? Coffee maker? Prob all made by Foxconn.
  2. Homez^2 13 years ago
    
    Apple is not the only company using Foxconn. Here is a list:
    Acer Inc.
    Amazon.com
    Apple Inc
    Cisco
    Dell
    Gateway
    Hewlett-Packard
    Intel
    Microsoft
    Motorola Mobility
    Nintendo
    Nokia
    Samsung
    Sony
    Toshiba
    Vizio
    
    Own any of that? Linksys router? Motorola cable box? Microwave? Coffee maker? Prob all made by Foxconn.
  3. Sam Grove 13 years ago
    
    I thought they started out that way.
  4. Amakudari 13 years ago
    
    If this is an argument for *nix, proceed.
    
    But if it's an argument for Windows, it's worth pointing out which system comes without make utilities, common cross-platform scripting languages (Python/Perl/Ruby), a terminal that's a bash shell, built-in SSH, a package management system, a revision control system, a decent text editor, etc. If you want to develop native applications, prepare to shell out for Visual Studio (most *nix/Mac dev is done with free stuff like Emacs, Vim, TextMate, Eclipse, Xcode). Windows has done everything possible to discourage users from learning about code, compilation and the command line; in other words, computing. The result for companies is scores of professionals whose jobs revolves around pointing and clicking about MS Office GUIs and who have a Pavlovian fear of anything resembling code.
    
    And I say this as someone with a Windows desktop at home and work (and some real experience with .NET development), an Ubuntu laptop and a MacBook Air. I use the latter two unless I can't avoid it.
    1. Tulpa 13 years ago
      
      You're talking about Mac OS X, which is indeed awesome. Unfortunately, Apple's emphasis now is on iOS which is a horrible project that may as well have been invented by super-intelligent ravens from the future who wanted to cause humans to de-evolve so as to hurry along their inevitable dominance.
      
      If you doubt this, look at Lion. The process of morphing OSX into iOS is moving apace.
      1. Amakudari 13 years ago
        
        Honestly, having used iOS, Android, WinMo and Symbian (not so much Blackberry), I'm not sure which one's supposed to make people smartest. Mobile phone users really just want to call people, read stuff online, listen to music, and maybe send an email or play a game. It feels like complaining that a video game console or handheld abstracts everything; yeah, but it's only good for that one thing. People who want to actually produce anything should have a computer.
        
        iOS has made the roundtrip back into OS X, but it's not enough to worry me. Launchpad and Mission Control suck a lot, but damn I love multi-touch, and that comes straight from the phone. It makes all other implementations feel half-baked.
    2. Tulpa 13 years ago
      
      And while I'm a Mac guy in general, ripping Windows for not having stuff built in is kind of low. It takes two seconds to download PuTTY and then you have ssh; two seconds to download WinSCP and then you have sftp, etc.
      1. useful tips 13 years ago
        
        http://xkcd.com/627/
      2. Timon19 13 years ago
        
        Yeah, a ton of that shit is really pretty readily available. Mac fanbois who keep harping on that shit are a big part of why they earn their reputation as insufferable.
        
        Vim and Emacs (eww) are already on most Windows boxes where I work if the person does any sort of coding. I can get either in seconds.
        
        Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        I used to write code in WordPad when I used Windows. But I'm also reviled for using nano rather than vi on Linux machines so I should probably shut up.
        
        usergroup.org 13 years ago
        
        You never coded in MS Word?
        
        usergroup.org 13 years ago
        
        When I click on the START all that happens it Outlook.
      3. usergroup.org 13 years ago
        
        I double click on the AOL and it doesn't go to google. can you fix that?
      4. usergroup.org 13 years ago
        
        How do I get my work e-mail and my personal e-mail together, but when I send I only want home email. Unless it's for work. Then I don't want my kids seeing it.
      5. Amakudari 13 years ago
        
        My point is that people have to figure out why a particular feature is important, then what the best tool is, then how to and whether you can install it. If you're in a company, that last point is crucial. Most just curl up reflexively, and it's a major bummer for me when most code I write is Windows-based and related to my job, and I see that look (like telling someone their dog died) whenever I try to teach anything command line-related. The same thing goes for distributing code; sure you can tell people to download Python, but a quarter won't, another quarter will struggle figuring out how to keep it local and avoid needing admin privileges, and you think, damn it would be nice to just have everyone start out with a sensible environment.
        
        In any case, the point in contention is whether Apple has abstracted the essentials and dumbed down computer users. My experience is that with the things that dumb people down -- like a GUI for everything -- Microsoft is at least as guilty. They're true for iPhones, sure, but it's a phone, not a computer. Same thing for iPads. Apple identified pure data consumers, and by the looks of it MS and Google agree. When producing data matters, OSX is real Unix and offers good tools and considerable control over the system.
        
        My point also is not that you can't download these things; it's that defaults say a lot about the best path for the typical end user. For Windows, it's downloading precompiled binaries and sticking to GUIs, never learning code or why someone would compile from source or why command line is good (Windows 8 gets props for finally including PowerShell). That's what most people will do, and it's that lowest common denominator you have to aim for. That is dumbed down.
        
        For a good example of what I'm talking about, look at Office. It's hobbled by a language, VBA (that I sadly am capable at), that is already the ugliest kid in an ugly family (VB), hasn't updated in over a decade and the only possible replacement is .NET and VSTO, which is pay-only (for VSTO) and has crippling deployment, interop and data binding issues. In the meantime MS has seen fit to flit from Win32 to COM to .NET to WinForms to WPF to Silverlight to (horrors) HTML5/JavaScript. If you make stuff for Windows or use the MS Stack, you know what these things are, but they haven't made you more knowledgeable; they're mere costs of dealing with a system where nothing shows direction. I remember when I figured out that if you wanted to programmatically overwrite a paragraph in Word without altering its formatting, you had to a) create a range out of the start and end indices of the paragraph, b) subtract one from the end for the newline, c) select the range, d) move the beginning down a line until one paragraph remained (the last line of a table cell fucks everything up), then e) have Word type text over the paragraph. And this is the flagship product, for which bazillions of lines of script exist. It has prevented people from wanting to learn anything and forced those who did want to learn to waste time on stupid things.
        
        As for Lion, stuff like Mission Control is indeed shit, but you don't have to use it or even see it, whereas the multi-touch stuff really is quite nice. Besides, Windows has pushed out its share of stinkers in the recent past, like UAC, and Linux has only gone downhill with Gnome 3 and Unity. IMO both Windows and Mac have gotten a bit better.
        
        Also, nano, seriously? How? You're not talking about extended editing sessions, are you?
        
        0x90 13 years ago
        
        The thing is, though, where MS has never broken my code, Apple does it all the time. Also, WinForms is .NET, and all the technologies you mention, you can still use concurrently. And WinRT (it's not just JS/HTML) looks pretty interesting, for someone who has done a lot of C++/CLI interop between the C/C++ and .NET worlds. For me, computing is about productivity, both for me, and for my user, and if I could be granted one wish toward achieving that, it would be for osx (*nix is such an outlier as to be of no consequence, in practice) to vanish. Writing cross-platform code is not difficult (MS supports enough of POSIX to make most chores fairly easy), but compared to writing for one platform, the implementation and maintenance costs are not trivial. Qt can be of help, but its future is somewhat uncertain, and when you use it, you get platform adherents complaining that it violates the intended 'experience' of the platform, and who therefore demand you write at least three separate UIs for a given product.
        
        Amakudari 13 years ago
        
        The thing that gets me is that .NET suffers heavily from fragmentation. How many different runtimes are there now? WinRT, Silverlight, WP7, the full runtime, and the micro/express versions? LINQ to SQL and LINQ to Entities (Entity Framework and ADO.NET) solve very, very similar problems. So yes, you can still use every flavor of the year, but it's nice when there's a Golden Path and real focus behind making it easier instead of just piling on shiny, new things. Ultimately, I wouldn't be shocked to see another abstraction layer on top of .NET.
        
        Developers who get these technologies aren't the issue. Most devs can tolerate near-endless complexities and scour man pages. But computer literacy is abysmal for the typical Windows user, and it's not helped by the Microsoft's throw-everything-at-the-wall approach. You don't start off with a sensible environment for even minor development, every new version brings extreme changes, and it's hard to figure out the best tools for each situation.
        
        That underlying mentality is also why IT departments are loathe to switch and we still have to support OSes and browsers that are 10 years and Office suites that are 8 years old. Adding complexity (and breaking changes) needs to have a firm value proposition over consistency.
        
        For me, computing is about productivity, both for me, and for my user, and if I could be granted one wish toward achieving that, it would be for osx to vanish.
        
        Standards > single-provider dominance
        
        I'd much rather see convergence than see the emergence of something like IE's dominance over the web or Hotmail's dominance of email or Office's (ongoing) dominance of productivity suites. I've had to debug differing treatment of HTML, CSS and JS in IE5, IE6, and IE7 versus standards-compliant browsers and that was probably the most painful thing you could do in web dev.
        
        Competition has been great for computing. Maybe it's just because "proprietary standards" are a crock, but new participants in all of the above heralded enormous gains. (The same is true for Android competing with iOS, FWIW.)
        
        0x90 13 years ago
        
        A big problem with standards, though, is that I want to provide my user a good experience now, not ten years from now. Look at HTML; HTML4 in 1998, HTML5 in 2014, maybe. Compare that with the development of Silverlight. In one product, I've been using SL in production since V2, and it's been great -- everything just works, and people rave about the UI, which is going up against other HTML-based offerings. By the time HTML5 is useable, I can't even guarantee that this part of the UI (it runs in another app) will be browser-based. The point is, the user doesn't understand any of this stuff; all they know is that my UI is far nicer than those of my competitors.
        
        So, I'm not really big on standards religiosity; if MS (just for example) has a better idea, and a large installed base, the standards bodies should be capable of moving in that direction. If they're not, people out in the real world are going to do what they have to to provide the best product, regardless.
        
        Also, there are a lot of situations where none of this applies (that's where I happen to be), where you are working in the context of multiple other apps, rather than in your own space. Here, you don't have the luxury of just choosing what you get to use, and the fragmentation you reference above can actually be quite an asset.
        
        Amakudari 13 years ago
        
        HTML5 is, in practical terms, an evolving standard. All of the most recent browsers support its most important parts. Even older browsers can have many features enabled.
    3. Timon19 13 years ago
      
      In the process of switching just about everything over to Ubuntu, keeping XP partitions around for laughs and the inevitable slow-ass migration of data ('cuz I'm easily distracted).
      
      What say you about Unity?
      1. Amakudari 13 years ago
        
        I dun like it, mostly because it gets in the way and I prefer stuff to get out of the way. You can fiddle with ccsm to make the launcher auto-hide or whatever, but it always feels awkward. Plus my laptop choked on some of the newer eye candy in Oneiric Ocelot. It's not terrible like some say, it's just a big step back from uglier but more useable things like Gnome 2. And not much else out there is great; the best way to say it is that my favorite of Unity, Gnome 3 and KDE is whichever one I haven't been using. Open source programmers are a dime a dozen, but open source UI designers are few, hence the open source community is great at command line tools, new languages, etc. but often lacks the resources and vision to create a clean, functional UI. That, along with hardware compatibility issues (which have most to do with OEMs not supporting the OS), are the only things I don't like about *nix.
        
        I'd probably go with Mint (which uses Gnome 2 as a DE) if I felt like setting everything up again, but that's not a big priority. So I'm just waiting around for the issues to get fixed.
Toby Willis 13 years ago

lol, another corrupt pompous bought and paid for windbag!

http://www.totally-anon.tk
Newt Gingrich 13 years ago

Last!
1. NEWT PAUL: "I disavow." 13 years ago
  
  Signatures ain't worth shit anyway when "things happen."
Drake 13 years ago

Can somebody teach Ron Paul how to make a fist?
1. Goody Two-Shoes 13 years ago
  
  Oooh! I can!
  1. rather 13 years ago
    
    If there is any man who knows how to make a proper fist, it's a gynecologist: He's received years of instant feedback
rather 13 years ago

I didn't know Ron Paul was Jewish
1. Colonel_Sanders 13 years ago
  
  Funny, he doesn't look Druish.
The RIGHT to TAKE 13 years ago

Does "any white person" have the "right to take?"

"[The Native Americans] didn't have any rights to the land ... ANY WHITE PERSON who brought the element of civilization had THE RIGHT TO TAKE over this continent."

~Ayn Rand, US Military Academy at West Point, March 6, 1974
1. Any White = Collective Right? 13 years ago
  
  Or is any white person's "right to take" an individual right?
  1. Right to Take = Positive Right 13 years ago
    
    Or is any white person's "right to take" a negative right?
    1. Come on Fibertarians, Hit it! 13 years ago
      
      "I disavow Ayn Rand when it's convenient, and tell people to read her when they're not as smart as White Indian."
      1. Pretty Little Hate Machine 13 years ago
        
        Something I Can Never Have
        
        db 13 years ago
        
        Something I Can Never Have
        
        Sad Kermit 13 years ago
        
        Trent Reznor goes green.
      2. Sevo 13 years ago
        
        "when they're not as smart as White Indian."
        Can't find anyone of that description.
        
        Quit looking in the mirror 13 years ago
        
        You're so vain, I bet you think this song is about you.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQZmCJUSC6g
        
        Sevo 13 years ago
        
        Quit looking in the mirror|2.19.12 @ 8:22PM|#
        
        Maybe we have a candidate for "when they're not as smart as White Indian."
Jayna Oso 13 years ago

This is like the worst chat room ever.
1. Tulpa 13 years ago
  
  Please don't ever get implants.
  1. name withheld 13 years ago
    
    rather already has testicular implants.
Tulpa 13 years ago

OK, raise your hand if you're watching Celebrity Apprentice now.
1. el Commentariosa 13 years ago
  
  you're a sick bastard
  1. Tulpa 13 years ago
    
    None of the models/beauty queens have been fired yet and they're cooking. The two Costanza turn-ons, how can I resist?
    1. el Commentariosa 13 years ago
      
      It's the first episode.
      I think Paul Sr. and George Takei are having an affair.
      1. Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        Sulu is creaming his non-basketball pants over Lou Ferrigno right now.
        
        Sanjuro Tsubaki 13 years ago
        
        Sulu has a thing for men who wear green makeup.
      2. Tulpa 13 years ago
        
        Maybe the guys should have Takei out on the street kissing people?
2. el Commentariosa 13 years ago
  
  so this was filmed in October then. They referenced the Dan Wheldon crash.
the Donald 13 years ago

Where's that dimwit Eric?
LittleCupcakes 13 years ago

When did Joseph-Gordon Leavitt get so old?
1. the Donald 13 years ago
  
  That's Arsenio
Tulpa 13 years ago

Donald loves P. Diddy? Where's his birth certificate?
1. the Donald 13 years ago
  
  Donald loves the little children
  All the children of the world
  Red, brown, yellow
  Black and white
  They are precious in His sight.
  Donald loves the little children
  Of the world.
Tulpa 13 years ago

I think it comes down to Lou Ferrigno vs. the Miss Universe chick.
1. the Donald 13 years ago
  
  Don't tell anyone, but I'm letting Eric pick the winner.
Sanjuro Tsubaki 13 years ago

Well, that's swell. Anyone here from Iowa? Hi there!
Tulpa 13 years ago

This batch looks pretty boring though. No Gary Busey, no Star Jones, just a bunch of Marlee Matlins and Mark McGraths. We were spoiled last year.
1. the Donald 13 years ago
  
  Wait til Arsenio tries to convert Penn.
Almanian 13 years ago

lol wut?

NHRA FULL THROTTLE DRAG RACING ON ESPN! NITRO FUELED FUNNYCAR MADNESS! DOOR SLAMMER PRO STOCK RACERS WITH NOOOOOOOOOOOO BRAKES!! THESE GUYS MUST BE CRAZY! DONKEY MUD WRESTLING WHEELCHAIR BASKETBALL FOR THE KIDS! SUNDAY, SUNDAY, SUNDAY!!! BE THEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERE!

I am.
Killazontherun 13 years ago

get your own Randomly Generated Adolescent Poem

http://www.elsewhere.org/hbzpoetry/

i am he is my love from a
boy who
cut her
like a wounded dove. you shared
my feelings still
inside. the way it seems
so very funny
always between us, there is no
reason, but to me,
white, black, and
indian, all are the same, to
others keep the truth
within like a fulfilling song, life is
every where, a flower, a child,
life is like a dance sweet little
bird in russet coat, the
livery of the game pokemon for
12 hours
(non-stop!) time goes by without a sound,
watery eyes
and know that
i'm not
important in
your heart instead
of an
eye. i have set myself
apart from us beyond the marsh
death is quiet death is harsh death
lies beyond the marsh
death is
the best,
the greatest
there ever was.
but please, you simple
tiny star. we all loved and
adored you we are
not the end as
if all my heart, or will i
just want you to
do some no-no's.
SIV 13 years ago

I see Reason is celebrating the most Holy of Holy days in respect to our Chief Executives. Not even a Steve Chapman syndicated column?

All Hail the Presidents! All hail the State!
1. Rev. Blue Moon 13 years ago
  
  Oops - turns out you're a moron.

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