Protests

Score One For Hobbes at Zuccotti Park

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Political philosophers for centuries have been arguing over what the state of nature before the advent of civilization looked like. Thomas Hobbes famously noted that in the SON life was "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish and short" because everyone was at war with everyone else. Jean Jacques Rousseau thought that Hobbes was full of it because, in his view, SON was a lost Eden where noble savages full of natural goodness roamed the bountiful earth free and happy. It was society and all its material seductions that corrupted humans, making them envious, deceitful, vain, unfree, and miserable. 

But New York Post's Candice M. Giove, after spending a night at the Zuccotti Park, offers a riveting account suggesting that life for those who opt out of the civilized world is more savage and less noble. She notes:

The parcel is now a sliver of madness, rife with sex attacks, robberies and vigilante justice.

It's a leaderless bazaar that's been divided into state-like camps—with tents packed together so densely that the only way to add more would be to stack them.

And despite an NYPD watchtower overhead and the entire north side of Zuccotti lined with police vehicles, it is quickly becoming one of the most dangerous places in New York City.

At around 3 a.m., she recounts, a vagabond gumshoe dubbed "Conscience" tells her, "there's a situation." Apparently, Fisika Bezabeh, 27, a Zuccotti squatter, who had allegedly clobbered a manager with a credit-card reader at a local eatery earlier in the night, had returned to the eatery. "We can't take him in by ourselves," an OWS security-force member yelled. She describes:

The Zuccotti "cops" had just spent an hour and a half tracking Bezabeh through goat paths in the park armed with a description from the manager.

"We cannot take him in by ourselves, the cops have to come!" reiterates the OWS security force member.

They call the NYPD—and it becomes abundantly clear that the cops down there are sick of the antics.

"Every single night it's the same thing. I mean, some guy was a victim of rape!" an officer snarls. "There comes a time when it's over. This is a disaster. It's all we're doing, every two seconds, is locking somebody up every time. It's done.

"It's done," he repeats. "Occupy Wall Street is no longer a protest."

Nor is this an isolated occurrence, apparently. Giove reports:

As I cautiously walk the Zuccotti perimeter, picking up photocopied literature on anarchy, there is a poster on a tent bearing a set of park rules that includes: "If you want to hook up, go to a singles bar."

There is literally no space to unfold my sleeping bag. I ask around for help.

Out of nowhere, a man pushing a shopping cart with his friend inside rammed the thing "Jackass"-style into a police barrier and walked off laughing like a hyena.

A woman emerges from a makeshift tent that looks more like a layer cake—a clear tarp draped over a sleeping bag that is on top of a filthy mattress. It even has a welcome mat missing the "m" and the stench of a vagrant.

"There's not much space left," she said and walked off into the darkness.

Every camp tent is like its own state. There is "Camp Anonymous," the group best known for anti-Scientology protests.

It's neighbored by a tent full of vampires, the "Class War" tent and the "Occupy Paw Street" tent, whose residents hand out treats to occupying pets.

There's also "Camp France" and the "Nic at Night" tent, which supplies the protest with smokes.

I settle on a sliver near Broadway by an OWS library—which frighteningly has a children's section. On a bulletin board, there are personal messages like, "Call your sister!"

I'm wedged between a newbie from Brooklyn and some guy from Toronto, who preferred the experience of urban camping to his buddy's couch or a hotel.

"My knees will crush you," a hulking squatter shouts. "I don't want to hurt you.

"You're in my doorway. I'm going to crush you."

Someone takes offense and yells, "Manners!"

He's much kinder when he emerges later from his green tent and hands me a shiny Mylar blanket for extra warmth. "It's going to get cold," he said.

This spirit of generosity and the naivete of the original OWS protesters is devolving into a state of distrust and paranoia, however.

They speak of theft, about government infiltrators and tales of Rikers Island castoffs being dropped off to roam and ravage the site.

From underneath my blanket, I hear allegations of financial corruption and intimidation over sexual orientation.

"I'm in a tent that keeps getting flooded, ransacked and robbed," fumes a transgender group leader—a female who identifies as a male.

He said that the transgender group would create its own police force for transgender protesters and females, since an immense distrust loomed over the OWS-created authority.

That group is also demanding financial transparency amid growing concern over the use of the $750,000 war chest.

They have a point. I notice supply-station cupboards are dangerously lacking any blankets, tents, tarps or Mylar.

"Someone forgot to get that stuff out of storage," an attendant claimed.

"We have three-quarters of a million dollars in the bank and all these f–king people are not doing financial accounting while we're calling for it from the larger corporations," says the transgender leader. "A lot of good people are quitting."

A day later, a female-only "safety tent" would be erected to shield women from predators.

Organizers plan to add a medical tent, as well as others designed to provide safe sleeping for gay, transgender and co-ed groups.

The threat of rape is very real here—for women and men.

I think from all of this we can conclude that so far at least the Zuccotti Park experiment is bearing Hobbes out.

Giove's whole piece is well worth a read.

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252 responses to “Score One For Hobbes at Zuccotti Park

  1. BRANCH DAVIDIANS DERP!!!!!!1!1111!!!11

    1. squeak squeak squeaky squeak

  2. But New York Post’s Candice M. Giove, after spending a night at the Zuccotti Park, offers a riveting account suggesting that life for those who opt out of the civilized world is more savage and less noble.

    Welcome to a world without property rights!

    1. and yet there can be no theft w/o “ownership”. > as ive experienced at zucotti, the drunk homeless must be ejected.

      1. Ownership has to exist at some level. If I go kill a rabbit, gut it, clean it, make a fire and cook it, are you saying that I should be just fine with someone coming along and taking it?

        1. Was it ever really yours to kill in the first place?

          1. That’s deep, man.

          2. the rabbit must be free to frolic und gambol

            1. Everything White Indian says is funnier if you imagine him saying it with a German accent.

        2. That is exactly what the socialist think. You brought that meal to the table so that all could eat. End of story.

        3. Sure, just think of it as bait for an even larger meal.

  3. Hobbes, Rousseau, State of Nature?

    DUCK! White Indian bait!

    1. So, are we to conclude the WI is solitary, nasty, brutish and short?

      1. Solitary, nasty, brutish, and short in the way that he counts coup all over your failed religideologies.

        End the gambol lockdown of Marx and Mises!

        1. MmmmMMMM…..you can smell the crazy. Mmmm satisfying!

          1. That explains it, for a minute there I thought my cat had took a shit under my desktop!

  4. Oh lordy – this is a blaring neon invitation for a certain special someone…

    1. I have to think it’s intentional. It’s like the Pinker article all over again.

      1. I’m sure GoogleAds makes reason a pretty penny from those thousands of page hits, even if it is only one or two perseverative assholes doing it.

      2. Or Welch’s “Bailouts For Me But Not For Thee.” They’ve been feeding him all week.

  5. Wait, Rousseau was a gamboler? I had no idea. With that, I am outta here.

    1. Wasn’t Rousseau a mooch who lived off David Hume for a while? And didn’t Hume complain about his personal hygiene?

      Yeah, he was a gamboler who’d have fit right in at OWS

      1. IIANM, Rousseau wrote a book about raising the perfect child in a state of nature. In spite of siring several children by various women who were not his wife, he never tested his theories, instead abandoning them all to live in poverty.

        1. Poverty for thee but not me?

  6. Couldn’t this be interpreted as a point for Rousseau, since “society” made these people what the are today, and this is how they react in this environment? Jes’ sayin’, it isn’t the best test group.

    1. The weather is getting too cold for them, so how about we send them to Somalia for a while? There’s no real society there to speak of so they won’t have anyone to blame but themselves!

      Maybe I just want to white bread hipsters to deal with real problems like child soldiers, assassins, rape slaver gangs, drought, famine, plaque and American Laser Cannon Satellites randomly frying the occasional warlord!

      Now that I think about it, maybe letting Zuccotti Park turn into Little Somalia is the point Uncle Sam is trying to make?

  7. Oh lordy – this is a blaring neon invitation for a certain special someone…

    Mewhommad?

    1. Hey groove, my neighbor just to the south, how did YOU enjoy Quakenado?

      1. Quakenado’s over already?

  8. It couldn’t be any more clear at this point that the reason NYPD is allowing this to go on is because the pathetic, cretinous Bloomberg has ordered them not to do anything until he gives the go-ahead.

    Obviously he’s hoping that they’ll eventually go home on their own, and they just might around Thanksgiving. The problem with this is the increasing risk that someone will be seriously hurt, or even killed. What will the pathetic, cretinous Bloomberg going to say if that happens?

    1. I’m sure he has wide selection of excuses lined up, ranging from “homeless” to “Faux News provocateurs.”

      1. It does sound like there are a lot of homeless crazies mixed in. These people were out there in the city before. It’s just that now they are suddenly more visible in the context of the protest.

        1. drunk homeless crazies

          1. homeless are VICTIMS, remember. so what if there are homeless in there? they are part of the 99%. just like all those disenfranchised POLITICAL PRISONERS oops i mean violent felons etc.

            1. no the homeless are in zucotti to get drunk in public, w/o being arrested & steal stuff.

              1. oh, so they aren’t part of the 99%?

                then what are they? the 1%?

            2. I can’t wait to blow you after your shift at the mall, honey.

              1. pip, get your mama to wipe yer arse for you. she should be home soon from the mall with your copies of Modern Warfare 3 and Skyrim.

                1. That’s unfair dunphy.

                  Skyrim’s not even out yet.

                  1. i didn’t make you run down to the store did you? that’s my bad. otoh, today IS the final table of WSOP. this WSOP handtohand live (15 minute delay) coverage has been some of the greatest game theory in display i have ever seen. i’d put it right up there with some of the best chess ever.

                    it’s been great. i am DVR’ing it right now.

                    i am seriously considering Skyrim… when it comes out! 🙂

                    1. Were it me, I’d probably wait for 6 months before picking up Skyrim…it’s a Bethesda game, so it’s going to be glitchy as heck until the fans have some time to patch it.

                    2. Yes. That’s pretty much what I’m doing (well, more like waiting until after Christmas when people sell their old gear). No sense in getting disappointed or having things broken pre-Unofficial Skyrim Patch. I still have no idea what drives people to play TES on an Xbox.

                      It’s easily my favorite series, but that owes a lot to the modding community. Oblivion’s default level-up system alone almost made it unplayable for certain characters.

    2. the increasing risk that someone will be seriously hurt, or even killed transition into a dead-bodied person

      1. “Non-living Persons” still retain the franchise in certain Chicago districts.

        1. Don’t you mean, Ketchup Hitler?

  9. Meow-ses?

  10. I hear Jerry Sandusky’s moving to the park.

  11. It’s kind of interesting to watch the OWS guys reinventing cultural wheels. Culture broadly speaking is human means worked out by trial and error of dealing with everyday problems. Course they won’t see that maybe the strict segregation of male and female in many tribal cultures is a response to a high prevalence of rape brought on by a lack of property rights…nah it’s Teh Patriarchy.

    1. I don’t see how the progressive ideology can even object to rape. If someone has something that someone else needs, it’s perfectly OK to take it by force, right?

      1. Now you’re going to start recycling old Louis CK jokes? Get a modicum of pride already.

        1. The OWSers would have some pride if they actually went out and looked for a job.

          Oh wait, they wouldn’t, because no company with any self-respect would hire these apes.

      2. stick to something u know cause rape & progressives aint it. thx for playing

        1. cuz i now lotz about rape

          just ask my 12 year old “guest” in the celler

    2. I thought it was more to prevent consensual nonmarital sex than rape.

      1. I mean, if it were rape they were worried about, they wouldn’t have a problem with people of different genders mixing in crowded places.

        The fear is of the wrong people of opposite gender meeting up and going someplace non-crowded together.

  12. The threat of rape is very real here — for women and men.

    STEVE SMITH LIKE ZUCOTTI PARK!

    1. I fucking TOLD everyone that was you on CNN!

  13. Welcome to a world without property rights!

    Serious question for all the legal eagles out there in H&R land: Since Zucchini Park is private property, as I understand, are the owners liable or even considered culpable for the crimes that have/are being committed here? Do these OWS’ers have a case for negligence on the park owners for not supplying adequate security or is this a big, fat, blood engorged case of caveat emptor?

    Also, Shikha, make up your damn mind: either this OWS shanty town is a Bartertown paradise or a wretched hive of scum and villiany. I lean towards the latter.

    It cannot be both.

    1. I don’t remember Bartertown being a paradise.

    2. Huh? If you are referring to her post yesterday, you really missed the boat, Groovus Minimus Brainus! She was making fun of the barter society. How did you do on your SAT reading comprehension?

    3. Its more like a co-op with the city.

    4. Do these OWS’ers have a case for negligence on the park owners for not supplying adequate security

      I don’t think so, since the Occutards are there illegally. Duties to trespassers are very limited and don’t include any duty to provide goods or services.

      1. I’d think you’d have to assert your property rights in some manner lest the trespasser gain tacit approval status.

  14. MAN RAPE? I always wondered about this. I can see if it’s a guy raping a guy, because there’s orifices and whatnot, but a girl raping a guy? I’m not sure I could…you know….under that kind of pressure. Seems like it would just be an all around disappointment for all parties involved.

    1. The body can betray the mind.

      And who says it has to be male-to-female penetrative sex? She could be raping him with a bottle or a tent stake.

      1. Technically, wouldn’t that be sodomizing?

        1. Yes, but sodomizing is a vague and overused term. It would technically be foreign-object irrumatio.

          1. it would technically, under the model penal code be RAPE. if you are forcibly penetrating an orifice against (or in some cases w/o) consent – it’s rape

            also, under model definitions, if you force another to invade your orifices that is also rape.

            thus, a woman “forcibly” fellating a man is rape under the model penal code… and in most states.

            “but he was erect” would be about as good a defense as “but she was self lubricated” i would suspect.

            1. “but he was erect” would be about as good a defense as “but she was self lubricated” i would suspect.

              I recently came to the realization that yes, I probably could be “raped” by a woman. Even though I might intellectually wish to not have sex with her, if she gave some wicked head, my penis would cease to care what “I” thought.

            2. if you are forcibly penetrating an orifice against (or in some cases w/o) consent – it’s rape

              My eyes and ears have been raped repeatedly by White Indian, Your Honor. Then it gamboled all over me.

              1. *ahem*

                Uh…you gotta a little something in your hair.

          2. “irrumatio”?

            I get it now. You hope to become some future, Libertarian, William Buckley. Try talking with your cheeks full of cotton.

    2. Double sided dildo rape. Think about it. She’s going ass to ass whether you want to or not.

      1. I get that unwanted penetration is “equal opportunity” as I said above, but if you aren’t gonna do that then what next?

        Oral maybe? I guess? It’s the whole “performance anxiety” factor that I’m curious about. I’m probably thinking about this too much.

      2. Great. Now we’re back to “Requiem for a Dream.”

    3. it reminds me of an old Benny Hill Joke – from memory:

      BH: Yes, I admit it, I was a victim of a [inaudible]

      interviewer: A what?

      BH: A GANG BANG!

      interviewer: You mean all those woman had their way with you?

      BH: All but the short, fat one.

      interviewer: And why’s that?

      BH: I didn’t fancy her.

      1. “Grape! Grape”
        “Don’t you mean RAPE?”
        “No, there was a bunch of them.”

        1. Wait a minute!

          You mean that the purple king kong that I just gunned down was saying “GRAPE APE”?

      2. God, I miss him.

    4. Also a guy can be drugged, passed out,or otherwise incapacitated, and still have biological function.

      And it’s a horrible, horrible thing.

      1. Gets lonely on the range, Cowboy?

        1. No. I guess it’s horrible story time.

          It is psychologically scarring to go home from the bar alone and pass out, only to wake up an hour later with a complete stranger inexplicably in your locked house. And even worse when you realize that you’re naked and this hambeast is fucking you while you’re unconscious.

          Needless to say, I flipped my shit. but the girl wouldn’t get off of me. she was huge. and surprisingly strong. Whats worse, is while I was struggling, she said “hasnt it always been your fantasy to wake up to a beautiful girl fucking your brains out?” I flipped out harder. I think the only thing I managed to say was What the fuck!” loudly and repeatedly.

          I was eventually able to get her off me, yell what the fuck a few more times for good measure,and chase her out of my house.

          My sister called shortly after and asked wtf happened. Apparently my sister met her friend at another bar,and her friend was drunk and horny. Sister thought I was lonely so unlocked my door, and let her friend in to do her thing.

          She doesn’t have a house key any longer. That was one of the scariest strangest and scariest things to happen to me. And lets never talk about it again.

          1. Your sister sounds like an awesome practical joker.

          2. Dear Penthouse Forum…

            1. hah. not even close. the girl was probably about 300lbs, and wasn’t even close to attractive, think trollface.

              Even if she was it wouldn’t change the fact that someone invaded my home and had sex with me without my consent.

              1. Hey, it could be worse; what if you had ejaculated and she came after you for child support?

              2. hah. not even close. the girl was probably about 300lbs, and wasn’t even close to attractive, think trollface.

                Man the harpoons!

              3. I just wanted to be held for awhile, you bastard.

                1. Not to one up you or make light of your trauma but it could be worse!

                  During fleet week in Ft. Lauderdale one year, a shipmate of mine turned 21 and got completely fucking three sheets to the wind. No one is 100% of how it happened, but he woke in a Miami back alley with the cops arresting his rapist. They were having a bit of a problem putting the cuffs on since this BAGLADY had her fist “elbow deep in his ass” and that is a direct quote from the cops who brought him back to the ship!

                  At first, the skipper decided to not punish him for being so intoxicated due to the trauma and the ration of shit he knew the crew was gonna give him. THEN, the captain decided that punishment was in order about a week or so later. You see, the hobo (hobette?) had given him a SERIOUS case of the crabs AND lice!

                  In the tight confines of a submarine it wasn’t long before EVERYONE was given the gift that keeps on itching! We had to cut out time out short and head back to port so the crew could get treated along with the ship being sterilized. Took nearly a week for the skipper to make the call and pull into port but during that time it was a miracle no one killed the poor bastard.

                  People would just walk by and slug him in the face as casually as you’d say hello. Put him in a head lock and wrote “HOBO MEAT” on his face with an industrial Sharpie. Duct taped him to the deck, cut his clothes off him, then used wire brushes and a power washer to “CLEAN THE IMPURITIES FROM HIM”!

                  They had to transfer him of the ship after we got back since there was real fear for his safety and not many cared about him any more. The fact that he had been raped was mostly buried by the fallout from the creepy crawlies.

                  I felt genuinely sorry for the poor kid but, right or wrong, you NEVER go against the will of the team you go to war with!

          3. This sounds like something from the life of Jason on True Blood. Raped by a tribe of were-panther women.

  15. where noble savages full of natural goodness roamed the bountiful earth free and happy.

    Would you say they frolicked? Bandied about? No. I can’t remember the word. Where’s my thesaurus?

    1. I believe the word is gambled. I know I like to do that in my free time.

    2. Romp? Caper? Frivol? None of these?

      Damn.

    3. I’d wager $20 you’d get it eventually, but I am philosophically opposed to gambling.

    4. I’ve got it! It’s trotted. I think. . .

      1. No, I’m certain it begins with the letter G. Gallivanting maybe?

    5. CAVORTING?

    6. Mr. Official, are we allowed to gallivant?

      I think that’s how it goes.

  16. “if only we could have a culture where we all work together, sharing in a community of kindred souls. There would be no more want, pain, or uncertainty in life – just a happy place with smiling flowers and planted children, basking in the sun.”

    1. Unfortunately, the corporations make that impossible.

      1. Maybe we should switch to co-ops

    2. community of kindred souls

      The non-kindred souls will be sent to the ovens.

    3. Lord Humungus|11.8.11 @ 2:00PM|#
      “if only we could have a culture where we all work together, sharing in a community of kindred souls. There would be no more want, pain, or uncertainty in life – just a happy place with smiling flowers and planted children, basking in the sun.”

      …. and 3 hours later, the raping had begun.

      1. Three hours?

        It would seem that even the hippie rapists are lazy!

  17. I think this is unfair to Hobbes. His SoN was not loaded with pacifists, people who don’t believe in enforcing their rights but rather “handling” violations by some peaceful means.

    1. Sorry, I meant “unfair to Rousseau.”

      1. rouseeau’s lyricalism is just more rubbish noble savage state of nature crap.

        OWS degeneration (much like lord of the flies in literature) offer a counterexample – what REALLY happens when societal more, taboos, rules (and yes, law enforcement) etc. are taken away.

        anarchy

        and not in the way all these stupid anarchists want, because to paraphrase the DK’s, in a REAL anarchy, they’d be the first to go

        1. …and not in the way all these stupid anarchists want, because to paraphrase the DK’s, in a REAL anarchy, they’d be the first to go

          Nah, the real anarchists I know are well armed and well practiced in the use of those arms.

        2. Yep, anarcho-capitalism is definitely now discredited because a bunch of young, entitled leftists weren’t able to make it work over the space of a couple of months. That is the standard for debunking political beliefs.

          1. anarcho-capitalism was never CREDITED, thus to say it’s discredited is kind of meaningless.

            it’s like saying somebody just discredited alchemy. or phrenology

  18. SUCK IT anarchists! Without an all-powerful state to protect you, this is what you get! Somalia has come to NYC!

    1. Mmmm….you can smell it here too!

    2. But dont even ancaps say you need central legislation, if not central enforcement. I believe that was Rothbards position, no?

      1. I think the diehard ones say you can have competing law as well as competing enforcement.

        1. But it’s the anarcho-communists/primitavists that claim that man would naturally organize into peaceful collectives.

        2. Competing enforcement no problem. Competing laws would naturally develop into a common law or admiralty law type consensus based on peaceful agreements between the competing protection agencies.

    3. Without an all-powerful state to protect you, this is what you get! Somalia has come to NYC!

      You must have missed the part where the park is surrounded by NYPD’s finest. And the part where private, cooperative protection facilities are evolving naturally.

  19. MAN RAPE? I always wondered about this. I can see if it’s a guy raping a guy, because there’s orifices and whatnot, but a girl raping a guy? I’m not sure I could…you know….under that kind of pressure. Seems like it would just be an all around disappointment for all parties involved.

    Serious response to this, Tman: it is possible. With the advent of the little blue pill, “under-served” spouses have “added a little something special” to their partner’s food and drink. Wish I could provide a linky, but I don’t feel like violating HIPAA today (or ever, FTM).

    Generally though, when a woman rapes a man, it is by instrumentation. And it does happen, just not oft publicized. Otherwise, there may be restraint, blackmail or some other use of psychological force, fallatio follows and nature takes over.

    1. She could also insert a straw or chopstick in his urethra. Or use the straw to blow air into his bladder. Or festoon his scrotum with dozens of safety pins soaked in kerosene. Or rubberband the scrotum until the testicles die. Or core his anus like an apple and pull out his colon.

      1. I like your ideas and wish to subscribe to your newsletter

      2. I love you, NutraSweet.

      3. You are a magnificently disgusting creature, sugarfree.

        You nauseate me like no other.

      4. I thought I understood the word “offensive.” Evidently not.

      5. GAHHHH!!! MY MENTAL EYE!!!!

      6. I need details! If you inflate the bladder via a urethral straw, which is then withdrawn, at what pitch does the urethra queef?

        1. It’s actually very hard for the air to come back out and the experience is quite painful. Much more painful than retrograde ejaculation, for example.

          The air usually can only be expelled during urination, which can cause the stream to stutter and spray. (Think explosive diarrhea, only through your penis.)

          1. Dear….GOD….

          2. How do you know this?

            1. Everything awful I ever hear or read never leaves my brain. It’s like I have a photographic memory for horrible concepts.

              1. Everything awful I ever hear or read never leaves my brain. It’s like I have a photographic memory for horrible concepts.

                I can understand that except for one thing.

                Until I came here and read your dementia, I had never, ever heard of such disgusting things as you write. Ok, you don’t forget. That doesn’t explain why you hear/read it in the first fucking place!

                But don’t take that as a criticism.

          3. Stutter AND spray? Brilliant!

          4. Now I know why people are afraid of you.

            *shudders*

      7. CALL ME.

    2. I saw that on 1000 Ways To Die the other night.

      Wife slips blue pill into hubbie’s food because she hasn’t been getting her fill lately.

      Hubbie eats food but “gets called in to work”, which is really his mistress, before screwing his wife can commence. On the way, he pops a blue pill of his own to make sure there won’t be problems.

      Meanwhile, mistress is preparing a drink for him with another blue pill to prevent problems too, and when he arrives he drinks that too.

      And of course, the Bane of Priapus strikes down yet another soul.

      1. Hey…we told you to call if things got out of hand!

        1. If you’re erection last longer than four hours…

          CALL A DOMINATRIX!

    3. Tman are you saying you’ve never had a boner when you desperately didn’t want one? Say being called up to the blackboard in school?

      1. At that age (school, blackboards and such) mine was all but permanent and tight pants were in style. Embarrassing as hell.

      2. I have no such memory of a junior high swim meet. That was some other fellow with a similar name.

  20. “Jean Jacques Rousseau thought that Hobbes was full of it because, in his view, SON was a lost Eden where noble savages full of natural goodness roamed the bountiful earth free and happy. ”

    Ha! Ha! Ha!

    What a moron.

  21. Private property is truly the most civilizing concept, since these people renounce it, I am not surprised that their place is in chaos.

  22. I think Rousseau would object to Hobbes’s apparent win here by saying?rather like the Occupants who blame the evident corruption and incompetence and U RAPED BRO? attitude of their (non-)leaders on infiltrators/provocateurs/etc.?that “score one for Hobbes” is of course what you get when a society is really a fallen or pseudo-society that, unlike the true society found in the Rousseauian SON, has more than a single will, and so of course it can’t regard itself or behave as a single body, Adam-before-Eve style.

    The Occuppant body is impure, so…ass-rape.

  23. OK. We’ve heard from Hobbes.

    What does Calvin have to say about it?

    1. He’s just planning on peeing on it.

      1. Did they have cart nutz back then?

        1. Yes, but they used actual nuts and–depending on the temperature–they had to castrate a new bull about every 10 days to replace them. The fad waned after a fresh set of cart nutz lead a pack of frenzied dogs to tear the cart owner apart at a Gr?fenberg street fair in 1542.

          1. You are clearly mistaken. It was in 1540.

            1. You are an illiterate jackanape. That’s why your dissertation was rejected by the committee.

              1. ::Wiggles fingers up::

      2. he’s predetermined to pee on it.

    2. Calvin thinks it was all predestined.

    3. Calvin would have just put up a G.R.O.S.S. tent and let nature take its course.

    4. What does Calvin have to say about it?

      He says we have no free will and that 99% of us are going to hell so it does not matter anyway.

      Why history even remembers Calvin is still a mystery.

      1. It was his line of designer jeans I think.

  24. http://globalresearch.ca/index…..&aid=27479

    I put this on the morning links a couple of days ago. It is as compelling reading as the Post article. All that donated money is being stolen by a small group of elites.

    1. a small group of elites

      What’s 1% of 99%?

      1. LOL. There is always a vangaurd of enlightened who lead the thugs into doing the dirty work. As soon as the dirty work is done, the thugs are discarded for new thugs (see for example the SA or Yezhov)

        1. Actually, there were relatively few NKVD personnel purged when Yezhov fell and Beria took his place.

          A few of Yezhov’s close associated got the bullet in the back of the head, but most of the rank and file thugs just carried on as before.

          Yezhov got it because Stalin viewed him as a threat. Same thing happened to Beria at the hands of Malenkov and Khruschev.

          1. “associates”

          2. Yezhov got it because he knew that Stalin was behind the purges. Killing Yezhov allowed him to end the purges without admitting any culpability for them. It was all Yezhov.

            And of course the purges were done, in addition to finally get rid of all of the old Bolsheviks who might have been a threat to Stalin, to also kill all those involved with the great famine in the Ukraine. It was just a case of killing the witnesses.

            1. Certainly. That’s part of the reason Yezhov was a threat, as were the Old Bolsheviks.

              My point was more that the vast majority of the underlings – the “front line thugs”, if you will – essentially carried on as before. Purging Yezhov and blaming him for “the excesses” of the 1936-37 purge was window-dressing.

              Sort of like replacing one White House Counsel with another.

        2. Will a mass-murdering nerd (Robbespierre, Lenin) arise to lead the Occupiers?

          1. Unlikely.

            Unless you count the current POTUS.

      2. What’s 1% of 99%?

        1.01%

        1. 0.99%

          *Damn liberal arts types can’t do math.* ;P

      3. The “.0099%”, duh…

        1. Jesus fucking christ, they really can’t.

    2. I’m still wondering:

      (1) Where’s the bank account with the money in it?

      (2) Who set up the account? Who are the signatories?

      (3) By what right was money put in that account, under the control of those signatories?

      1. “We’re going to have to take things away from you on behalf of the common good.”

      2. #4 and most importantly why the hell did they not use bitcoin to begin with?

        Amateurs.

        1. Because #4 is classified!

  25. Huh? If you are referring to her post yesterday, you really missed the boat, Groovus Minimus Brainus! She was making fun of the barter society. How did you do on your SAT reading comprehension?

    The most shocking thing I saw at Zuccotti Park during my weekend visit was that it is teeming with very thing that protesters hate: markets and commerce. All around the tiny tent city, vendors have sprung up, like mushrooms in warm compost, selling all kinds of Occupy Wall Street paraphernalia? buttons, pins, souvenirs. (Incidentally, there were more tourists than protesters at the park.)

    (emphasis mine)

    What Shikha was lampooning was the dichotomy of the OWS’ers being a buncha Marxists evolving into free marketeers, and the post has a decidely celebratory and benign tone.

    I take it you’ll now be fucking yourself with a lovely and freshly sharpened chainsaw, bigbubba? Or fawning over your exceptional reading skills?

    1. Are you just being dumb or dishonest. I think its the latter, given that you obviously read this part since you brought up Bartertown:

      “As if this is not bad enough, all of this was going on right next to a stall inviting people to return to the golden age of bartering, because, you know, an economy where people live hand-to-mouth and die in their 40s is so much more sustainable than the alternatives. Converting your surplus product into money to buy what you want when you want to free yourself from death, disease and hunger is just so goddamned bourgeois and selfish.”

      Keep the chainsaw for yourself.

  26. Right-wing misdirection; the tanks will be rolling shortly, to crush our very own Tiananmin Square. Those poor, noble freedom fighters.

  27. She could also insert a straw or chopstick in his urethra. Or use the straw to blow air into his bladder. Or festoon his scrotum with dozens of safety pins soaked in kerosene. Or rubberband the scrotum until the testicles die. Or core his anus like an apple and pull out his colon

    These are all true, Saccharin Man. However, I was trying to be slightly more discreet. The last option I have done, but in the environs of a surgical theater. Advanced stage cancer of the rectum is absolutely awful.

    Colonic surgery generally entails an abdominal approach.

    1. Colonic surgery generally entails an abdominal approach.

      Is that abdominal or abominable?

  28. I think Bobby Lee should reprise his greatest recurring character from MadTV: The Blind Master goes to OWS.

    “It is eyeeeyah, The Blind Master!”

    If it is a new direction you seek, behold the path of my tonfa stick!

    Hiya-hiya-hiya-hiya!!!

    Uh-oh. I just beat up the old lady who got raped in the tent, didn’t I?

    Why didn’t you tell me I was hitting the wrong person? Can’t you see that I am blind?

  29. Keep the chainsaw for yourself.

    No, please by all means, your maw of an ass is lonely without a Husqvarna handy.

    Did it occur to you that that the options I presented were both bad ones and the “bartertown” remark was not complimentary? Apparently both snark and nuance are lost upon thee, and ye should get your sarcasmometer checked. How fitting one with the handle “bigbubba” would appear on a thread involving sexual assault of the anal variety.

    Comtemporary of STEVE SMITH?

    1. You are disingenuous and an idiot.

  30. Hobbes and Rousseau are interesting, and all, but I think the more appropriate analogy to this situation is the classic “rat overpopulation” experiment, in which all sorts of psychosocial derangement manifest themselves in the face of far,far too many subjects being crammed into the cage.

    Coming soon: open warfare and cannibalism.

  31. far,far too many subjects being crammed into the cage

    Isn’t this the problem with places such as New York City to begin with?

    1. Goddammit, I hate when a comment is at the end of a thread and you type in the wrong reply box because it’s sitting right there.

      1. At least you quoted, which made it easier to know what the hell you were talking about.

    2. except NYC *now* actually has a very low crime rate. DESPITE its high density, it is a very safe place to live.

      crime rates, homicide, etc. have been dropping for decades. whether you credit guiliania, compstat, society in general, or whatever… the facts are the facts.

      NYC (and tokyo, granted the latter being in an entirely different social, legal, etc. context) are proof that people CAN live crammed together without resorting to “the jungle”.

      i read a stat somewhere the said the average manhattanite would , on average, go 10 yrs or more without even seeing a police officer with his gun out of the holster. think about that.

      i know many hipsters lament the “decline” of times square, etc. its “disneyfication” but the reality is that even times square is no longer ‘scary’. it’s actually quite safe.

      the idea that people can’t live in close proximity w.o resorting to mayhem/violence is as discredited as the idea that a decline in the economy is necessarily correlated with increase in crime

      note all the libs said crime would skyrocket and yet 2010 showed FURTHER drop in crime DESPITE the recession

      1. Point taken, but I’d say New Yorkers’ instinct for leftism/progressivism — their attraction to the cannibal pot, as Billy Beck would put it — is a rats-in-the-cage byproduct.

        1. Not really. Most progressive lefties are imported. The genuinely local variety are old tammany hall working-class politicos, union thugs, and just the generically-ignorant.

          My point is=NYC does not produce hippies. The vast majority of OWS interview candidates are transplants. Our variety leans more the way of Lotion Man…. just straight up *crazy*.

          1. You’re taking the micro view. My observation (speculation, really) was more macro: I just think places crammed with lots of human beings are more apt to take on a collectivist mentality.

            Leftists would probably be quick to respond: “Well, city dwellers are ‘better educated,’ become more sensitive to diversity,” etc. But (A) those things aren’t necessarily true, and (B) it’s basically begging the question. There has to be some other dynamic at work; I’m just not certain that I know what it is.

            I am pretty sure that humans are not built to have 10 million of us jammed onto a couple of little islands. Weird shit can only ensue from that, and it’s not likely to be kind to individualism and liberty.

          2. A couple of thoughts from Thomas Jefferson:

            “I view great cities as pestilential to the health, the morals and the liberty of mankind.”

            “I think our governments will remain virtuous for many centuries as long as they are chiefly agricultural; and this will be as long as there shall be vacant lands in any part of America. When they get plied upon one another in large cities, as in Europe, they will become corrupt as in Europe.”

      2. crime rates, homicide, etc. have been dropping for decades. whether you credit guiliania, compstat, society in general, or whatever

        Crime is all about demographics. Something like 75% of all violent crime is committed by men between the ages of ? 18 and 27. I forget the exact ages but there is about ten years or so. My personal experiences confirm this.

        1. you can also further break it down (besides gender) into race.

          but that’s tangential.

          our drop in crime is not correlated with corresponding age/racial changes that would equal the change

      3. NYC is weird because a lot of the densely populated areas are extremely wealthy, which artificially depresses the crime rate.

        Buffalo and Rochester having the highest murder rates in the state is a joke when you consider some of the hideous neighborhoods in NYC.

        1. those hideous neighborhoods aint NEARLY *as* hideous. even the bad old south bronx isn’t. NYC as a whole is just much much safer. literally thousands of people less per year are killed there.

          a lot of cities have densely populated areas of high wealth, too.

          again, a lot of factors are going to change the stats city to city. average age, racial makeup, etc. but the reality of the new york decrease is that the INCREDIBLE drop happened without any similar change in demographics whatsoever.

          buffalo *is* a much more dangerous city than NYC. it’s not even remotely arguable. plopped down at random in some location in buffalo or new york, you’d be safer in the latter

          buffalo recently had THREE TIMES the homicide rate of NYC.

          it’s a fucking shithole for pete’s sake

  32. While I enjoyed Lemonwheel, I could see how the hippie tent city could quickly dissolve into chaos and crime had it gone on for more than a couple of days.
    When you get that many people together who feel that everything is owed to them, it doesn’t take long before force and fraud become the currency of choice.

  33. It really says a lot when you are relieved to discover that the gamboler has not shitted up the thread and in her absence the regulars are discussing man-rape and coring anuses.

    1. What’s your point?

  34. Hey groove, my neighbor just to the south, how did YOU enjoy Quakenado?

    To quote Carol King, “I felt the earth, move, under my feet…”

    Wasn’t a big deal where I was, but I understand the epicenter got smacked pretty good. All the people that laughed at me for buying separate earthquake insurance at less than $50 dollars per year…

    I knew about the Missouri Fault line; I dated a geology major in undergrad and she gave me many a lesson in moving plate tectonics. Her advice to get earthquake insurance stuck with me; she’s a seismologist now.

    1. Ever try finding a particular brand in a grocery store (typically about 1/3 of an acre) if it is not one of the common ones?

    2. I dated a geology major in undergrad and she gave me many a lesson in moving plate tectonics.

      Oh, she did, did she?

      1. “Fissure? I hardly even know her…!”

        ::rimshot::

    3. Where are you, Doc? I live in OKC. You ever get around these parts?

  35. From the Post story: “The Zuccotti “cops” had just spent an hour and a half tracking Bezabeh through goat paths in the park armed with a description from the manager.”

    Just how big is this fucking place, anyway?

    Wikipedia says it’s 33,000 square feet. That’s all of 3/4 an acre. What the hell?

    1. The average two person tent is 25-35 square feet.

      According to the story the tents are packed so tight you can barely move through them.

      That is potentially a lot of tents. Like approaching a thousand lot of tents.

      1. I guess. But 3/4 of an acre is like a Best Buy parking lot. Even full of cars, would it really take an hour and a half to track somebody down there?

        1. Poor analogy. Even a tailgate party ain’t that great.

          Think refugee camp.

          1. Don’t get me wrong: I’m not knocking these cops’ tracking skills — I’m sure they’re far better trackers of human beings than I am.

            I’m just sorta confounded by it, is all. I can’t quite get my hands around the scope of this site.

            1. Its tiny. Half of Best Buy parking lot is just right. That line was confusing. But I think the article didn’t mean that they were tracking the guy in the Park…I thought “goat paths” meant nearby streets although the way it is written does suggest that the Park itself.

            2. It’s not so much a “PARK” as concrete with trees.

              Here’s the Google Sat view
              http://g.co/maps/ysj5z

              1. Is there an easy way to get the current view?

  36. IHNTA except that if you are a New Yorker, you already know to take anything the Post writes with a very generous handful of salt. Seriously, it’s a crappy sensationalist tabloid.

    1. And how, precisely, does this distinguish it from the NYT? (Other than the target audience, I mean.)

      1. Aresen, the NYT is a broadsheet, not a tabloid. Geez.

        1. Thanks for the clarification.

          The NYT is a crappy sensationalist broadsheet with a penchant for manufacturing stories aimed at a liberal elite target audience, while the Post is a crappy sensationalist tabloid with a penchant for manufacturing stories aimed a conservative middle class target audience.

      2. The most e-mailed NY Times article of all time
        http://www.theawl.com/2011/01/…..ticle-ever

        1. I wonder which occupy protest she is at now.

        2. OMG. that is so perfectly self-satisfied-i-just-wiped-my-own-ass-affected-liberal-elite-insane-awesome!

          it really is amazing that this is not parody

          1. it really is amazing that this is not parody

            That’s what I keep saying to myself whenever I hear the words “Vice-President Joe Biden.”

            1. One should consider that, ‘Email’ is also a French verb meaning, ‘to coat with enamel’

              The title may suggest that perhaps this is the equivalent of an elitist progressive-liberal Penthouse Forum entry.

  37. “Jean Jacques Rousseau thought that Hobbes was full of it because, in his view, SON was a lost Eden where noble savages full of natural goodness roamed the bountiful earth free and happy.”

    Now everybody gambol!

    Gambol now, gambol tomorrow, gambol forever.

    1. I think that going forward there should be a fine for using gambol or any form of gambol.

      1. Jesus and Joseph, that’s played out. Just stop.

        1. The only thing we have to fear is gambol itself.

    2. Watch out, if you say “gambol” three times in a row whilst twirling about you will conjure up the spirit of WI.

    3. The thee inch spear head embedded in my hip would describe it as romp.

      Me? I would describe it as slow motion train wreak of pain, fear blood and death….so yeah a gambol.

  38. I think a Hobbes problem calls for a Hobbes solution.

    1. CalvinBall…?

      1. I beat you to it.

        You were tagged out at 13th base at 2:12 PM.

  39. Why is Hobbes even remembered? His work was sentimentalist crap and nothing else.

    1. contrast.

    2. Why is Hobbes even remembered?

      One of the first political thinkers who identified due process and equality under the law and one of the handful of proto classical liberals who founded the enlightenment…

      Who says any does remember him. You sure don’t.

  40. So this is OWS’s Altamont Speedway after their groovy Summer of Love.
    You know what comes next. Yup. Disco.

    1. It’s all going to end in blood and fire. And Andy Gibb.

      1. Bloody Andy Gibb flambe?

  41. So this is OWS’s Altamont Speedway after their groovy Summer of Love.

    I had nothing to do with this.

    1. Hell’s Angels for security. What could happen?

  42. Wait, was White Indian really banned? Humans being evil in the state of nature should be a topic he’s all over. The first paragraph alone should have him foaming with primitivist fury.

    1. Wait, was White Indian really banned?

      I don’t think so. There are still occasional spewings of pixelated diarrhea, but he/she/it seems to have cut way back on the deranged volume.

      1. I think those may actually be spoof posts. It isn’t like White Idiot not to crap over everything.

  43. Common Tater|11.8.11 @ 3:55PM|#

    The most e-mailed NY Times article of all time
    http://www.theawl.com/2011/01/…..ticle-ever

    I’ve known thugs, went to school with a few rapist, and a good friend from college committed a murder suicide a month ago. I’ve read about mass murderers, Ivan the Terrible, Stalin, and Mao. Read about serial killers, the Manson Family, and Jim Jones. I read the grand jury report on Sandusky and it’s bone chilling description of child rape and the cowardice of officials who wanted to keep several incidents over several years where he was caught blowing little boys under wraps just yesterday evening.

    But Anna Williams and her parents Leslie Wilhelm and Walter Gilliam are by far the worst human beings of whom I am aware.

  44. They have that much money? Easy marks.

    I bet it would be real easy for people to disappear, and no one would realize they’re missing for a while.

    1. Tell me about it.

  45. write your own blog post dumb ass

  46. Joshua Corning|11.8.11 @ 6:09PM|#

    Why is Hobbes even remembered?

    One of the first political thinkers who identified due process and equality under the law and one of the handful of proto classical liberals who founded the enlightenment…

    Who says any does remember him. You sure don’t.

    Jesus fuck, you’re dumb, and you don’t seem to care who knows it. Check out the Magna Carta sometime, tard.

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=magna carta due process&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCQQFjAA&url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Due_process&ei=zMS5Toz7AcK78gPx4P2hBw&usg=AFQjCNExLywwvrOE59mZcKHBM9pN4osjAA&cad=rja

    1. The Cyrus Cylinder (539 B.C.)

      A clue that there was some inkling of equality before the law prior to 1651

      1. Not that people should make too much of it. Mainly text explaining that the king’s will can be wrongly imposed on his people. But the germ of the idea is there…the idea that the king’s power flows from the people’s consent is hinted at throughout.

      2. The ten commandments are older…the fact that the laws of god are above all implies that even kings must follow them.

  47. So today was election day, and I did my duty. Barack Obama now has a nonzero chance of being elected as a township supervisor in western Pennsylvania.

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  49. Didn’t Glen Healy play goal for the Edmonton Oilers?

  50. Or, to put it in Founding Father terms: Hamilton 1, Jefferson 0…

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