Education

The Death of the Baggie, Or Why Parents Must Now Decant Their Kids' Cheetos

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When baggies are outlawed, only outlaws will have baggies

Tiny signs in hotel bathrooms across the country now urge guests to voluntarily reuse towels in order to "save the environment." While this may (or may not) be sound environmental practice, the main reason hotels have almost universally implemented the policy is to save on laundry costs. 

Schools are finally catching on and using the same gambit when it comes to trash disposal—with the added bonus of peer pressure to increase uptake. 

This weekend's back-to-school edition of The New York Times tells the story of the death of the baggie, thanks to the no-waste school lunch policies popping up around the country. 

Enforcement is tricky…

"We don't send notes home to parents and say, 'Listen, this is the third time you've brought a Cheeto bag.' But we help them to understand" why the school has the lunch policy.

…so many schools rely on kids shaming each other to get the job done:

"Ziplocs are the biggest misstep," said Julie Corbett, a mother in Oakland, Calif., whose two girls attend a school with an eco-friendly lunch policy. In school years past, she said, many a morning came unhinged when the girls were sent to school with disposable sandwich bags.

"That's when the kids have meltdowns, because they don't want to be shamed at school," Ms. Corbett said. "It's a big deal."

Unlike hotels, kids and their parents have very little choice about schools. Quite a few parents stuck decanting their kids' Cheetos into hastily-washed, still-damp Tupperware in the bleary morning would likely prefer to pay a trash disposal fee, but that's not on offer. 

Schools are selling the program as a cost-saving measure for parents, but the cost in time and trouble may outweigh annual baggie expenditures—at least for some families—and taking away choices on a busy morning isn't exactly a boon. The schools, on the other hand, are saving big bucks on reduced trash collection fees.

At least kids are getting a handy object lesson is concentrated benefits and diffuse costs!

Anyway, all of this fancy packaging will be for naught, since (as Jesse Walker noted in today's Morning Links) 90 percent of the nation's children will soon be dead from lukewarm lunches.

NEXT: Krueger Time

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  1. It’s called “community”. The more everyone is up in everyone else’s business, the better. There should be a vote on everything we do and if our community doesn’t like that we chew gum, we should not be allowed to do it.

    I also believe (like Ted Kennedy) in mandatory, voluntary service.

    1. Officer, am I free to gambol across plain and forest like people did for 17,000 years? (I.e., until about 300 years ago, when this City-Statist community that doesn’t like that we hunt and fish and don’t have land titles committed genocide to stop it.)

      1. … committed genocide to stop it.

        Dammit, did we miss one? Someone get me some of those Smallpox blankies.

        1. No. Some of them are immune. Get the rifle.

          1. But then we’re going to generate a strain that is rifle resistant.

      2. Well at least until you ran into another tribe and then they would certainly try to kill you.

      3. When the new school year started the history teacher was so
        excited because there were three little Indian boys in her class.
        She was beside herself with excitement.
        So she asks the first little Indian boy to stand up and tell
        the class what tribe he was from and how he knows this.
        The little boy stands up and proudly throws out his chest and
        takes his fist and hits it on his chest.
        He says in a booming voice, “I am a Cherokee. My Father and I
        walked for many moons and one day my Father says son, you see all
        this land. This is Cherokee land. So, I know I am a Cherokee”.
        The teacher says very good and asks the next little Indian boy
        to stand. The little boy stands up and proudly throws out his
        chest, takes his fist and hits it on his chest.
        He says in a booming voice, “I am a Comanche. My Father and I
        walked for many moons and one day my Father says son, you see all
        this land. This is Comanche land. So, I know I am a Comanche”.
        The teacher is growing more excited by the moment and asks the
        last little Indian boy to stand up. The little boy stands up and
        proudly throws out his chest, takes his fist and hits it on his
        chest. He says in a booming voice, “I am a Fuckawee.”
        The teacher looks dumb founded. She says, “I don’t think there
        is any such tribe as the Fuckawee.”
        The little boy says, “My Father and I walked for many days and
        many nights. And many nights and many days. We ran out of water,
        but we kept walking. With no rest, we were getting weary. Finally,
        one day my Father stops and with his hand to shield the sun from
        his eyes, looks around. “He said hmm, where the Fuckawee.”

    2. Isn’t this precisely what Hillary Clinton meant when she famously declared: “It takes a village to raise a child.”?

      1. Linked article cites three schools in the nation with lunch-container recycling policies. Reason food-writer KMW portends the “death of the Baggie.” H&R puppets freak out, wonder why nobody takes libertarians seriously.

  2. I don’t know. I have a hard time getting upset about this. It really is smarter to use non-disposable containers…and I don’t just mean for the environment.

    1. The cheetos bag is still getting used, just being thrown away at home instead of at school.

      Plus, the tupperware has to be washed to get the cheetos cruft out, creating waste water.

      Net cost: bad for environment.

      1. You describe what is not seen.
        They (government dipshits) only care about what is seen.

      2. hmm… While I do enjoy that you are stating the obvious hidden impacts, I think there’s far too many unknowns there to say its worse than the original.

        Life cycle assessment strikes again

        1. In this case: no.

          The cheetos have already been purchased, the only variable is sending them as is or transferring to tupperware.

          1. Well, although there’s many more considerations, just quickly you’re assuming that the Cheetos can’t be bought in bulk, that the wash cycle for the tupperware is every time, and you haven’t established a number of uses.

            For a basic overview look at Hocking’s paper cup article.

        2. “there’s far too many unknowns”

          HOCKEY STICK!!!

  3. Home schools can decide their own zip bag policy.

    1. And they produce kids less prone to peer pressure.

      1. No wonder leftists despise them so much.

      2. Peer pressure to “be green”?? I’m having a hard time believing this. In my day kids told their annoying do-gooder peers to fuck off.

        1. That’s was one of my criticism of the infamous 10:10 video (the one with the exploding school children / employees)… I just wanted the smarmy teacher to shut the fuck up. It reminded me of the days at school when they (unsuccessfully) tried to shame us into not doing drugs, having sex, etc.

        2. Peer pressure as a tactic is neutral. It can be used to convince kids to “be green”, to get involved in extracurricular activities, or to tell annoying do-gooder peers to fuck off. My point is that home schooled kids are less likely to be manipulated by others.

  4. Hey, how about reusing the ziploc bags? I know that my family reused paper bags for lunches, and ziploc bags for individual portions. Use them for a week, and *then* pitch them. But I guess that’s too hard for the schools to police, cause someone might use a new one every day! Horrors!

    You’d get the benefit of reuse. The initial cost is much less in resources, and you’re not entrusting kids with things that are valuable to lose (unlike tupperware or other plastic containers). Plus, it fits better than a lot of big containers with open space.

    But hey, gotta have everyone with their sterilized little lunch experience, compartmentalized into little plastic boxes.

    1. That’s the same reason plasic bags, now outlawed in some progressive cities, are actually environmentally friendly.

      I reuse mine for stowing wet clothes, as trash can liners, for waterproofing. etc.

    2. Yeah, not to be a dork (too late, I know), but I reuse ziploc bags. Have forever.

      It’s because I’m the product of Depression Baby parents – my mom saves used aluminum foil, for fuck’s sake…I just recycle mine.

    3. I do this. Probably more because I’m cheap than a concern over environmental impact, but there’s a bit of the latter too.

    4. Glad to see I’m not the only one that does this. I reuse as long as 1) the seal is intact and 2) there isn’t any sort of science experiment growing in the bag. My high school son also does this. Mostly a small cost-cutting measure.

  5. For 30+ years I’ve been washing and reusing baggies until they wear out. Now these bozos are telling me I’m not eco-friendly? Bullshit.

  6. What the fuck is an “eco-friendly” lunch policy?

    This is a prime example of why the system is so completely fucked up. They’re worried about what parents send to school for their kids to eat and apparently what packaging that food is in rather than sticking to TEACHING THEM USEFUL THINGS.

    Anyone who sends their kids to public school is an idiot. There are alternatives. Use them.

    1. Anyone who sends their kids to public school is an idiot.

      Agreed.

      Both socially and individually, the culture of empire is devoted to the maximization of material wealth. Natural culture is devoted to the maximization of life. The culture of the empire is severed from its matrix in the life of the earth and becomes a reality solely of the intellect, furnished with symbols and meanings having little relationship to the earth. The child, having suffered rebuffs to the emotional body, having withdrawn emotionally because of birth trauma and the competitive psychic environment, is taught by the school system to seek rewards through the exercise of the intellect and restrict emotional empathy. The child begins to invest meaning in word-built realities. The child begins to live abstractly, alienated by filtering its perception of reality through these intellectual images.

      ~William H. K?tke
      The Final Empire: The Collapse of Civilization and the Seed of the Future
      http://www.rainbowbody.net/Finalempire/

      1. Move along. Nothing to see here.

          1. The child, having suffered rebuffs to the emotional body, having withdrawn emotionally because of birth trauma and the competitive psychic environment, is taught by the school system to seek rewards through the exercise of the intellect and restrict emotional empathy.

            Yeah…that’s pretty much the reason that I’m the way I am.

    2. They can’t teach kids anything. They can’t discipline them. So they have to do something don’t they? So they will make sure they are “eco friendly” little drones.

      1. Move along. Nothing to see here.

      2. their goal is not to teach but, rather, to produce kids who are only smart enough to be good little bureaucrats or private sector drones in need of govt “help”.


    3. Anyone who sends their kids to public school is an idiot. There are alternatives. Use them.

      In general, I agree. However, in my case, one of my sons has just started attending public school, after 5 years in private school. The _one_ advantage of a public school is that the school essentially cannot kick out a student (especially is he is covered by an IEP). Of course, this is also the biggest single disadvantage of a public school.

      My son has Asperger’s Syndrome–and is academically 3-5 grade levels ahead in most subjects. Last year he was kicked out of 2 private schools for behavior problems–this has gotten better, but he still needs to be able to leave the classroom to cool off when he is overly frustrated.

      Our local public school actually seemed happy to have him, even though his education will cost the district more than a typical student. The private schools would have nothing to do with him, regardless of what we offered to do.

  7. But remember kids environmentalism is science not a religion.

    1. But remember kids libertarianism is science not a religion.

      1. What did the hunting and gathering in your mom’s refrigerator not go well this morning?

        1. You think he lives in his mom’s basement?

          I always had him pegged as a crazy homeless drunk schizo posting from the local library.

          1. True. His mom probably kicked him out. I peg him for a douche college nerd who read a couple of books before flunking out.

          2. Is it wrong that I daydream about him being trampled by a bison?

            1. No. I would like to see him as a special guest on one of the reality survival shows. I would like to see Bear Grills kicking his whinny ass as he sobs uncontrollably because he doesn’t have TV or running water.

            2. Yes. You should daydream about him being trampled by a herd of bison.

              1. No, see… I don’t want him killed, I want him to experience the hunter and gatherer style of medicine he’s advocating.

                1. So when he falls and breaks his leg, Bear can reset it by hand with no anesthesia. I like that idea.

                2. I didn’t think of it that way.

                3. I don’t want him killed

                  Why don’t you just ignore it?

          3. No way. Digging in the ground deep enough for a basement is just the kind of endemic Gaia-rape that we don’t notice only because we are aquacultured fish dePRIVed of our natural glory by swimming in a unsustainable and doomed hatchery.

          4. I think this is kind of offensive, for reasons that ought to be obvious to any long term H&R reader.

            1. i did not wish to say anything as Sarc may not be aware.

    2. “But remember kids environmentalism is science not a religion.”

      Only a few environmentalists, and of course many of their detractors, make the mistake of conflating the findings of science related to environmental matters and the social-political movements which seek to change policy regarding the environment.

      1. Lie with dogs you get flees.

        1. Why do you hate me?

        2. Not if you use Frontline Plus:

          http://img413.imageshack.us/im…..rolupt.jpg

  8. But we help them to understand

    Thats what I’ve been sayin’. When I say, “gee, this is a really nice business, it would be terrible if it got burnt down while your family was tied up in a closet in the back”, I’m just tryin to get people to *use their imaginations*. Someone accused me of *threats*??! People are so insensitive.

    Also, like, the environment and shit. Yeah. Making sure the neighborhood stays clean.

  9. Screw that – they will get baggies with evil peanut butter sandwiches in them until they graduate.

    I won’t punish my kid for telling a green fascist to fuck-off.

    1. nope…the kid gets an extra sandwich. And a candy bar, too.

      1. I’m just going to pack extra baggies, screw the contents. The kid can find something to do with them.

  10. What a bunch of nonsense. It takes water to wash all that extra tupperware. for one thing. Also, the baggies can be re-used. The peer pressure angle is pretty ridiculous. I’m willing to bet that kind of thing isn’t as widespread down here in the Texas suburbs.

    1. I personally bring a insulated reusable bag for lunch to the office, and I do use tupperware mostly, although sometimes I have to use a plastic bag in order to get everything to fit. Mix and match, of course, is the best way to handle things. Some people insist they have the One Way though.

      1. I eat at restaurants. It’s great. One day Thai, the next day Cajun, Italian the next.

        I have no baggie issues.

        1. Yeah but that’s prohibitively expensive.

    2. Yes it does. And if the tupperwear isn’t washed regularly, it becomes a haven for germs. How many kids parents don’t wash them after every use? I bet a lot. But hey, what is a little food poisoning in the name of saving the earth? Not like eliminating the little brat’s carbon footprint wouldn’t be a good thing.

  11. If they reused the baggies, they might come to school with a few atoms of the most dangerous substance known to mankind, the demon legume known as THE PEANUT!

    1. I know. I have often wondered why people bothered with mustard gas and atomic bombs and manufacturing plutonium when they had the real ultimate weapon. Didn’t they talk to kindergarten teachers?

    2. “Son, eat your penaut butter sandwich, and then go breathe on Ms. Smith….”

      The New Drones

      1. A single peanut, glued to the end of a ruler, killed everyone in the whole school.

        1. And to think we wasted so much time with straw purchases for guns.

          1. I LOLed for a full 30 seconds at the mental image of the peanut-ruler being held aloft like some foul torch.

        2. That’s how we keep class sizes down and the species robust.

    3. Dude, food allergies are no joke. There are people who can die from being exposed to peanut dust from a sealed bag opened 10 feet away.

      Obviously the public schools are hamhanded as usual in addressing this problem, but it IS a problem.

      1. My wife had to stop eating a bagel with peanut butter at her desk in the morning; one of her co-workers is deathly allergic.

      2. Do they spend their lives in a bubble?

      3. COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE COASE

      4. “There are people who can die from being exposed to peanut dust from a sealed bag opened 10 feet away.”

        No, there are not. There are hypochondriacs with severe somatic disorders, but that has fuck all to do with peanuts.

  12. So what happens when -gasp!- someone brings a paper lunch bag to school these days? And even worse, how about a paper bag with the Cheetos original bag inside?

    Do they give out beatings for this now or do they just up the psychological torture?

    1. I just stuff my lunch directly into my pockets to be safe. Of course it kinda sucks on a day like today when I brought leftover broccoli cheese soup for lunch.

      1. Try wearing a windbreaker with pockets. Or a rain slick.

    2. Why not pass a bill that mandates the kids take their garbage (whatever it may be) back home with them? That would solve the school’s real problem — waste management.

  13. “Ziplocs are the biggest misstep,” said Julie Corbett, a mother in Oakland, Calif., whose two girls attend a school with an eco-friendly lunch policy. In school years past, she said, many a morning came unhinged when the girls were sent to school with disposable sandwich bags.

    “That’s when the kids have meltdowns, because they don’t want to be shamed at school,” Ms. Corbett said. “It’s a big deal.”

    We are doomed. We really are doomed. We are raising a generation of kids who scream and cry because they got the wrong sandwich bag? And worse still we have a society of adults who tolerates this?

    You are only as good as the people who make up your society. And you can only be as free as you deserve. We are DOOMED. Fifty years of liberals running education in this country has apparently ensured that.

    1. I raised my daughter to have a big mouth and an agressive attitude. She has long and harsh discussions on a regular basis with the dipshits running the school my grandsons go to.

      1. “I raised my daughter to have a big mouth and an agressive attitude.”

        Man, that is shocking coming from you…

        1. I fart in your general direction!

          1. Imagine that, childishness and classlessness also coming from you.

            1. A shocking level of cultural ingnorance on display here — you’re shouldn’t be allowed to post if you don’t recognize that one.

        2. BTW, I raised my kids to be goalpost movers and masters at argumentum ad hominem.

    2. It is indeed disturbing, John. I probably have more lefty friends than any normal individual should, but it hasn’t really bothered me until the past year or so. This kind of nonsense used to be the butt of jokes even among them; now they seem to be taking it all more and more seriously. I’m waiting for the moment when we’ll be out for drinks or something and one of them will point to me and scream like Donald Sutherland at the end of Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

    3. John, to be fair, if I opened my lunch bag and there was something inside it that was going to get every authority figure at my school to give me shit and send their fanatic acolytes after me to “apply peer pressure”, I might be a little pissed off, too.

      If on your first day of school your dad had handed you a “I Hate Kikes” tee shirt to wear, you might have objected based on the belief that wearing that shirt wouldn’t turn out so well.

      1. The upside of course is that rebelling against authority has gotten a lot less dangerous and destructive.

        When I was in high school, you had to start fights, bring drugs to school, or plant cherry bombs to rebel against authority. Now all you have to do is bring a ziploc bag to lunch.

        1. True dat. I would have festooned myself with ziploc baggies back in the day if it got a reaction like this. Every item in my school bag would have been individually wrapped in a seperate pristine baggie.

          At least until my dad figured out where all the baggies were going.

        2. To be fair, Tulpa, even back in our day bringing a ziploc to school could get you in serious trouble.

          Depending on what you had in it, of course.

          1. You can get even more trouble if you try to use it as a condom. Even the “green seal” isn’t foolproof.

          2. W/e in my day drug dealers didn’t use ziplocks but regular old fashioned cheapo sandwich bags that they licked to seal them. Unless it was coke in which case it was an origami pouch made from a ripped out page of a magazine.

            1. Coke dealers are so artistic.

              1. And environmentally conscious too

  14. My local school district brags about the award-winning environmental consciousness programs they have instilled in the students. Then they turn around and try to get approval to put lights on the football field so the kids can have “the experience of playing under the lights like kids in the surrounding school districts.”
    I guess nature’s free sunlight isn’t good enough for the little darlings who, nonetheless, hector their parents about recycling.

    1. I honestly don’t know which I hate more: the football teams and their boosters who think it’s OK to spend other people’s tax money to light up a field for their teams to play on, or the proto-nannies who whine and bitch about how irresponsible everyone else is for supporting football under the lights and we really should be spending other people’s tax money on music and art education. Then they ll get together and tax everyone quadruple so they can install solar powered lights at the field and fund a student art campaign to promote green lifestyles.

  15. In the course of hundreds of nights of hotel stays during the past fifteen years or so, I can think of maybe two or three times that the cleaning staff have NOT replaced all my dirty linens with clean ones when I have hung them up. I used to think the main motivation for hotels to have a “hang ’em up if you don’t need them washed” policy was cost savings rather than environmental “awareness,” but now I think they must get some kind of green tax break or something just for having the policy regardless of whether they follow it. I certainly haven’t seen any evidence that they actively follow thosse policies.

    1. Stop butchering the hookers in your room, and the housekeeping staff will stop laundering the linens every day.

  16. “The urge to save humanity the environment is almost always a false front for the urge to rule.” H. L. Mencken

  17. The schools, on the other hand, are saving big bucks on reduced trash collection fees.

    I’m inclined to call shenanigans on this claim.

  18. Unlike hotels, kids and their parents have very little choice about schools.

    Wait, so I don’t have a choice as to where I send my kids to school but hotels do? That’s bullshit.

    1. Most hotels are corporate owned, so according to Mitt Romney they are people too.

  19. I would have wanted to smash the public school system into oblivion even before it degenerated into the sorry spectacle it is today.

    But now that’s it’s a vehicle for whatever faddish lefty nonsense that’s popular this week, I would gladly drink the tears of every public school teacher and administrator in America as they joined the unemployment line.

    1. See, while I think there is certainly leftist faddy nonsense in schools today I think there is still plenty of rightist faddy nonsense as well. The schools near me have all kinds of drives and rallies for “the troops” and other militaristic nonsense all the time.

      1. “See, while I think there is certainly leftist faddy nonsense in schools today I think there is still plenty of rightist faddy nonsense as well. The schools near me have all kinds of drives and rallies for “the troops” and other militaristic nonsense all the time.”

        What it all has in common is that it is pro-government.

      2. Rallies for the troops aren’t militaristic.

        And in any case, it’s the left that’s gung-ho about war these days.

        1. “Rallies for the troops aren’t militaristic.”

          So … how would you describe them?

          1. You can oppose the war and still hope that soldiers in it don’t get killed or maimed in it.

            Rallies for the civilian command that gives the troops their orders would be another matter.

            1. Er, Tulpa, do you know what militaristic means? It’s exalting the military, not necessarily war. So yeah, rallies for the troops kind of fall in there…

              1. You don’t have to support a large and active military to hope that the people employed in it aren’t harmed.

            2. “You can oppose the war and still hope that soldiers in it don’t get killed or maimed in it.”

              Not wanting soldiers to get killed or maimed in a war is a very good reason to oppose the war. Are these peace rallies then?

              1. Not wanting soldiers to get killed or maimed in a war is a very good reason to oppose the war.

                Not if you think the war is necessary to accomplish some other goal. People who support the war can also hope that the troops don’t get killed.

                1. “Not if you think the war is necessary to accomplish some other goal. People who support the war can also hope that the troops don’t get killed.”

                  During the cold war anti-war types were sometimes smeared as “better Red the Dead Guys”. The theory at the time was that if we didn’t have enough nuclear weapons to destroy all life on Earth five times over that we would be taken over by the USSR and turned into Communist drones. Do you see an equivalent threat in today’s world?

                  1. What does that have to do with you being so glaringly fucking dumb that you can’t see the difference between supporting people and supporting the job they do?

                  2. PIRS,

                    I do not support any of the wars we’re currently engaged in, so no, I don’t see such a threat. What I’m saying is that people can join together to support the troops regardless of their opinion on the wars.

                    In short…you can be quite anti-militarist and still support our troops.

        2. The left is gung-ho about war?

          Look Tulpa, you’re going to have get your memes straight. It can’t be all “military loathing Democrats” one decade, “gung-ho about war” the next.

          1. “The left is gung-ho about war?”

            Obama is at least – as demonstrated by his actual policies (not what his tellepromper scripts say of course).

          2. The about face that occurred after 2008 on this topic is disgusting. Republicans may have cracked jokes about Libya. But they didn’t march in the streets chanting “war criminal” and “no blood for oil”. Democrats in contrast all of the sudden thought it was a great idea to use military force to throw out a tyrant. And the same people who were cheering on Michael Moore in 2003 while he was explaining how Iraq was a peaceful country and hoping for “a thousand Mogadishus on the way to Baghdad” and were calling insurgents in Iraq “freedom fighters” now embrace the Navy Seals and talk all macho on how great it was that we got Bin Ladin.

            If John McCain had won the election and done those things, there is no way they wouldn’t have acted differently. And you know it. The bottomline is there is no country Obama could bomb or no action he could take that Democrats and liberals wouldn’t support. It is cool to be militaristic again.

            1. “If John McCain had won the election and done those things, there is no way they wouldn’t have acted differently.”

              I agree with this statement. Many partisan Democrats cannot see socialism in Republicans when it is there. They assume all Republicans are Pro-Free Market and therefore oppose them. Lots of folks in Holywood and the entertainment industry are like that. The truth of the matter is that Obama and McCain are virtually interchangeable in terms of their actual policies. Only their party labels are different. I would say the same thing about Mitt Romney.

              1. McCain has one virtue, he would have never let the deficit get so out of control. He was always a reliable and principled spending cutter. No way would he have signed onto the 800 billion stimulus. And a Democratic Congress would have never let him get credit for a healthcare reform law even if he had wanted to. So, no Obamacare.

                And McCain is not the crony capitalist that Obama is. We wouldn’t be seeing government raids on companies that don’t play ball the way we are with Obama.

                But other than those things, they would have been reasonably similar.

                1. Even an average Democrat would have balked at the numbers.

                  Obama was like Custer riding into that mess.

                2. He was always a reliable and principled spending cutter

                  Right, that’s why he voted for NCLB, Medicare Part D, and suspended his campaign so he could fly back to DC and vote for TARP.

                  Leaving aside the war spending, of course.

          3. “It can’t be all “military loathing Democrats” one decade”

            Electing a President and Congress who continue two wars and starting another one will change perceptions a bit. Who would have thought such a thing?

            Yes, Democrats are every bit as militaristic as Republicans in power. When it comes down to it, no President no matter what party wants to be remembered as a guy who got bullied or lost a war. And thus, they will all be militaristic in power.

            And the Democrats who ran around staging marches under Bush only to shut up under Obama are just partisan hacks who never gave a shit about the war as anything but an avenue to political power.

          4. The search bar is right up there, find an example of me complaining about Dems loathing the military. Lying douchebag.

            1. “Lying douchebag.”

              Nice of you to sign your post.

              1. Just how many names are you posting under at this point, MNG?

            2. “The search bar is right up there”

              Don’t hold your breath waiting for him to use it. The useless little cunt claimed last week that I’m a shill for Palin.

              https://reason.com/blog/2011/08…..nt_2484439

              “Lying douchebag.”

              You got that right.

  20. “The schools, on the other hand, are saving big bucks on reduced trash collection fees.”

    This is of course the heart of it. I don’t see why governmental agencies can’t be motivated to cut costs just like the hotels. If they didn’t then people here would be yelling “Jesus look at them spending others money without a care!” but when they do take measures they get bitched at as well…

    1. Teachers in public schools should be paid less. Muhc, much less. No health coverage either. And let’s get rid of AC and heating as well. After all, the saved money can be used For The Children. That’s what school is about.

    2. Any school that sincerely wants to cut costs can do about a zillion other, more effective things before arriving at a “zero-waste lunch” policy to reduce how much it spends on trash collection. This is hairshirt environmentalism, not wise stewardship of public funds.

      1. Unfortunately the hairshirt always winds up being worn by someone else.

        I’d be willing to bet there are baggies and wrappers all over the place in the teacher’s lounge and the administrators’ office.

        1. Bullshit! Teachers are so underpaid they can’t afford disposable baggies. They have to eat their cat food right out of the can, and wrap the leftovers in the New York Times to keep the flies away.

    3. If the schools weren’t forcing the children to stay in a locked building 8 hours a day, 5 days a week, you’d have a point. When you imprison people it’s your responsibility to provide garbage disposal for their meals.

      If you want to save money, let the kids leave campus for lunch.

    4. “The schools, on the other hand, are saving big bucks on reduced trash collection fees.”

      bullshit

    5. I wanna see some real numbers on how much they will actually save, in real out-of-pocket dollars.

    6. I don’t see why governmental agencies can’t be motivated to cut costs …

      I find this quote amusing.

    7. SO, you gigantic asshole, you’re ok with them cutting costs by shaming children and bullying them into compliance?

      You’re that much of an asshole?

  21. and let’s not forget the evils of idling cars
    http://www.mlive.com/news/inde…..nts-2.html

    To my surprise, I was driving through a local private Catholic college and they already had the same rule. I mean this is Michigan where cold weather is common, and “they” don’t want us to idle our cars.

  22. I don’t know how you people with kids put up with this shit day in, day out.

    1. I like kids. They’re delicious.

  23. “Tiny signs in hotel bathrooms across the country now urge guests to voluntarily reuse towels in order to “save the environment.” While this may (or may not) be sound environmental practice, the main reason hotels have almost universally implemented the policy is to save on laundry costs.”

    And now many water bottles are so fucking thin they crush in your hands before you take the first step. This is supposed to “save the environment”. Of course this also saves the company money and guilts some of their customers into accepting an inferior product.

    1. Nearly empty flimsy water bottles are fun to twist up with the cap closed to build up the air and water pressure, then slowly unscrewing the cap with your thumb while aiming it at someone.

  24. We shouldn’t even be tolerating this anti-environmental blog post by Ms. Mangu-Ward. When people say things that question environmental policy, we have to just say, “Hey man, why do you talk that way? That’s wrong, I don’t go for that, so don’t talk that way around me. I just don’t believe that.”

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011…..hts-fight/(USE

  25. Edmonton schools ban junk food
    http://news.nationalpost.com/2…..junk-food/

  26. Edmonton schools ban junk food
    http://news.nationalpost.com/2…..junk-food/

    “Nothing is fried any more. In fact, my deep fryers, I took them out three years ago so there are no deep fryers at all in our buildings,” Jones said. “We’re not in the business of making money at cafeterias. We’re in the business of providing good, healthy choices.”

    Students are now less lethargic after lunch and better able to focus on schoolwork, he said.

    A junk-food-free environment better aligns schools with their commitment to children’s health, public school board chairman Dave Colburn said.

  27. Hotels tell you to hang them up so they can be re-used. In my many many travels, I have never had a hotel maid NOT take away my towels for laundry. The whole thing is a scam to make you believe they are doing something for the “environment”. I no longer even fake that I give a shit. I just throw the towel on the floor where it belongs.

    1. This^

      I usually don’t stay in a htel for more than a day or two, so I hang my towels, per hotel instructions, so i can reuse them. The maid has never – not one single time – failed to take away my hung towels and replace them with new ones. This is in many different hotel brands, too.

      1. Don’t get me wrong. I am not complaining. I do have to stay long periods of time in hotels. All over the country. It is true everywhere.

  28. Shouldn’t they be concerned about all the water used to wash tupperware, especially in California?

    1. Yes. It is the same people who go out of their way to recycle glass even though making new glass takes less resources than recycling it.

      Here is the bottomline with recycling. If it were worth doing, you wouldn’t have to try very hard to do it because someone would be at your door to pay you for your recyclables. Industry recycles all of the time. It is called efficiency.

      1. Collection can be expensive, though, so there are cases where recycling can bring about serious energy conservation etc, but it would be more expensive for industry to run recycling collection than to just build new stuff.

        1. Well that is just the question isn’t it? Collection and recyling can be more expensive and more resource intense than creating new. And where it is not, rest assured someone will be out there doing it without any help from the government.

          1. Damn joke names

          2. We all have an interest in energy conservation beyond the direct cost of it. If all it takes is putting a plastic bottle in a blue recycling bin instead of a garbage can, then we should do it.

            A program to go out and find all the recyclable plastic bottles from all the garbage in the world would be incredibly expensive, but we can do it for free if we just think about it.

            1. But if the cost of putting those recycled bottles into different trucks and then reusing them is greater than the cost of making new ones, then now we shouldn’t be putting those bottles in separate bins and in fact are harming the environment by doing so.

            2. I belive the program of which you speak is called homelessness, at least here in LA.

              1. Yeah, but to make that work you need a deposit system, which has its own costs. Also, homeless people tend to make a mess of the surrounding areas while looking for bottles and cans in dumpsters or garbage cans.

            3. “but we can do it for free if we just think about it.”

              Really idiot? So the garbage men pay themselves? The trucks are free? Gas to move them back and forth to the recycling center is free?

              How are you so stupid, and still so proud of it?

              1. Free was perhaps an overstatement, but the cost is vastly reduced when people separate their own recyclables.

                Oh, and if you want to get anywhere in life, there’s this thing called civility you might not have heard of.

            4. “A program to go out and find all the recyclable plastic bottles from all the garbage in the world would be incredibly expensive”

              GREEN JOBS!

  29. I’m sure someone has already said it, but if schools want to save space in their trash cans maybe they should try serving real food for lunch.

  30. “Quite a few parents stuck decanting their kids’ Cheetos into hastily-washed, still-damp Tupperware in the bleary morning would likely prefer to pay a trash disposal fee, but that’s not on offer.”

    It’s Tupperware. Do it the night before.

    1. No.

      What now asshole?

    2. So my cheetos can absorb a bunch of moisture and lose their crunch overnight? Fuck you, buddy.

  31. Someday local government will mandate returnable/reusable beverage containers.

    And when that happens I’ll teach the young uns how to re-return containers already returned for some extra cash.

  32. Cars are bad for the environment. We should walk or ride bicycles.

    Airconditioning is bad. Open the windows.

    Using too much water for bathing, and using detergent and water to wash our clothes is bad.

    Am I missing something, or are environmentalists a bunch of smelly motherfuckers?

    1. you missed the rationing of toilet paper.

    2. It’s a documented fact that Americans consume 15 times as much toilet paper per capita than Chinese.

      It’s a much bigger scandal than American consumption of oil, which is just 10 times greater on a per capita basis.

      Obviously, government needs to mandate some type of rationing or tax on toilet paper.

  33. Why haven’t any of you moved to New Hampshire yet? Is the New Utopia too inconvenient?

    1. Why are you here when you don’t espouse the principles?

      Is proving you’re a cunt to the entirety of the internet really the best thing you can think of to do with your time?

      1. I asked you first.

  34. The home lunch policy at my kids’ school is sufficiently complicated enough that my wife has decided to throw in the towel and pay for the school lunch. I think this was their plan all along.

    1. I can’t even imagine how complicated it must be for that to happen.

      1. “1076 – Form For Lunch Preparedness”, “240W – Form For Requisitioning Approved Paper Sacks”, and so on…

  35. Isn’t this part of the evil of busing and closed campuses?

    When I was in grade school, I walked home for lunch, no food container waste whatsoever and a nice 1-mile walk to stave off obesity.

    Look at the current food service items at any school lunch counter and there is arguably MORE waste (plastic cups, spoons, knives, foam plates, etc.) than the stuff a brown-bagger throws away. This is all labor-saving devices – cheaper to have one garbage collector show up and pay the disposal fees than have a cleaning crew washing dishes for 3 hours every day. Of course, government is in the labor-wasting business. Being “green” isn’t the same thing as being efficiently productive.

  36. When I was a pupil, retarded shit like this would have resulted in a small group of kids, including me, telling everyone else to fuck off if they had a problem. Do any kids still have self respect?

  37. Not only do our schools allow ziploc bags, they require each kid to supply a box of them for this classroom. I don’t know what they use them for, something with classroom supplies, I guess, but they must not reuse/recycle them- Since they must be bought every year.

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