Kicking 'em While They're Down

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UPDATES! There have been many fairly important updates to this post—chief among them that the person identified in the second photo has denied being the person depicted in the first. That account is now here. We've closed comments on this post because people were posting personal info that could be used to contact and harass the guy. That would be clearly non-Kosher even this weren't an investigation still in progress; since it is still in progress, it's super bacon cheeseburger with a clam on top non-Kosher. END UPDATE

So I see that TalkLeft and other liberal blogs have been wondering about the identity of this guy:

…who purportedly kicked a female protester (video here) at the Republican convention. Of course, if you're trying to identify a hardcore right-winger, left-wing blogs are probably the wrong place to post your query. Because someone on the right might've recognized a former National Taxpayers Union intern (left):

I didn't know the guy, but a few people who were in town this summer and did seem fairly certain it's him. Assuming it is, I guess "the angry and debilitating, empty-rhetoric of mob-style street politics" he denounces here are less debilitating when you're in the mob.

UPDATE I showed this video, in which the kicker is shown more clearly and speaks briefly with a reporter, to someone who spent the summer as part of the same internship program. That person says it's him…

UPDATE 2: Naughty, naughty NTU… someone there just cropped their 2004 intern photo, leaving this, with the guy I'm being told appears to be the kicker cropped out. Of course, I expected as much, so the full photo is still above.

UPDATE 3: Allow me to clarify that I'm not posting this just because of the resemblance in the photos (which would be grossly irresponsible), but because of numerous people who spent the entire summer with him using language like "absolutely sure" and "no doubt" about the guy in the RNC photo and video being the same person. Another blogger has just passed along the following email, which I'm told was sent some time ago but held back for want of multiple confirmations, which I've had at this point:

The young republican who kicked a girl in ABC video is a junior at Wharton (University of Pennsylvania) named Scott Robinson. Although I have been an acquantaince of Scott's for 2 years and know of his radical republican ideals, this video was over the line and heinous enough for me to speak up. [AUTHOR-IDENTIFYING COMMENTS REMOVED] I hope this helps in doign whatever it takes to ensure that something like this does not happen again and Scott is held responsible for his actions. Thanks

UPDATE 4: Yet another D.C. intern this summer who knew Robinson is JD Henchman. He's absolutely postive that the person in the video is Scott, and adds: "I'm not surprised that Scott would do something like that."

NEXT: Drug Policy Alliance on Election 2004

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  1. Nice work, Julian – did you recognize him yourself, or were you tipped?

    Based on what I’ve seen, by the way, the guy should be brought up on charges.

  2. There are plenty of rumors swirling that it’s Dr. Laura’s son. I have no evidence either way…

  3. Symbolic politics matters.

    You toss true believers enough red meat, they start acting like predators.

    We’d be better off if “whipping people into a frenzy” wasn’t an acceptable political tactic.

  4. “the angry and debilitating, empty-rhetoric of mob-style street politics”

    He must hate the American Revolution then. 🙂

  5. “I guess the ‘the angry and debilitating, empty-rhetoric of mob-style street politics’ he denounces here are less debilitating when you’re in the mob.”

    I could either say:

    Exactly wrong. While in jail, he’ll have plenty of time to consider how just debilitating they can be.

    or

    What mob? This is just some jackass kicking a girl on his own. That excuse isn’t even open to him.

  6. I had a funny experience with the NTU. I was selling art door to door on Capitol Hill in 1995, and knocked on their door. The office manager or director or whatever was late back from lunch, and everybody was pissed, so when she walked in, they made her buy them some framed prints.

    So I’m walking out to the car with her, and I say “Hey, National Taxpayer’s Union. I’ve heard of you guys!”

    She, suspicious, “Oh, yeah?”

    “Yeah! I read about you in Time.”

    Warming up, “Yeah?”

    “Yeah. You’re the people pushing the flat tax idea, right?”

    Smiling, “Yes, that’s right.”

    “You know, that idea has really taken off…”

    Big smile at me.

    “…since Jerry Brown started pushing it in his campaign.”

    Huffy, “WELL, it didn’t REALLY get going until Speaker Armey put it on the agenda!”

    “Ohhhh….”

    I only ended up selling about half a dozen pieces, but it was worth it.

  7. That experience is not funny. Neither “ha ha” nor “weird.”

    Judgement has been rendered.

  8. I suppose all those left wingers got a little worked up due to all the other instances of the Reps stepping on people and their constitutional rights.

  9. No tie & no haircut… but at least he’s got the girl.

  10. Does freedom of speech give folks a right to heckle? Is heckling considered blocking someone else’s speech?

  11. I’m not sure those two people are the same guy. The guy in the video has a longer face and less deep-set eyes, and the nose and eyebrows seem different too. It’s hard to say, though.

    It also seems a little strange that an NTUF intern would wear a “Monster.com” shirt to the convention. But maybe he was job-hunting. 🙂

  12. joe, you weren’t one of those door-to-door art-selling Israeli spies, were you?

  13. I’ve got some nice Matisse prints. Why don’t you leave your computer on and come look at them?

  14. curious,

    Well, its a private event, so they can boot anyone they want to. Plus, Bush doesn’t like potential protesters in a crowd, which is why his speeches only have Bush supporters in them.

  15. Meanwhile: Has Kerry Union Thug Been Identified? The answer is yes, but apparently no charges were filed.

  16. looks like this guy contributes to a blog:
    http://ksfp2004.blogspot.com/

  17. Gary,
    Thanks, but I was wondering if there was anything on the books about heckling either being protected speech or as interfering with someone’s protected speech.

    I can understand someone getting tossed from a private event, but what about a public one?

  18. Sorry, Wacko. No one was complaining that the heckler at the RNC got grabbed and tossed out, but that 1) she got kicked when she was down, and 2) she was a she, and he was a he.

    Some people fight so dirty, they don’t even know what clean is.

  19. out of curiosity of who reads this site — how viral is this post — is his pic on rncnotwelcome or related lefty blogs, etc.?

    Where is he from, where does he live?

  20. Hey, at least the union thug doesn’t hit girls. What kinda Wonderpuss kicks 1) a girl, 2) when she’s down?

  21. out of curiosity of who reads this site — how viral is this post — is his pic on rncnotwelcome or related lefty blogs, etc.?

    Where is he from, where does he live?

  22. out of curiosity of who reads this site — how viral is this post — is his pic on rncnotwelcome or related lefty blogs, etc.?

    Where is he from, where does he live?

  23. curious,

    In a “public forum” you can pretty much heckle all you want to I guess; at least within some limits. This gets one involved of course potentially in “fighting words” and “hostile audiences” and the case law concerned with those concepts. I recall two cases from memory concerning these sorts of things – Chaplinsky and Feiner.

  24. Whoa, the pictured has been chopped to remove the suspect.

  25. They look so young. Don’t they know where the recruiting office is?

  26. Just from the looks of him, I would suspect that he is the type that kicks people when they are down; is he by any chance kin to Tim McVeigh? Lokks a little like him.

  27. I’d like to add that not only did he kick the girl while she was down — but he kicked her while she was being restrained by THREE secret service agents. Republican family values at work. Kick girl while she is on the ground restrained by other men.

  28. Taxpayer’s Union just cropped the kid off their site.

  29. It looked to me like he was aiming for the girl’s crotch. Sicko.

  30. Looks like they’ve cropped the photo, cause the ones I see don’t look much like the kicker. Anyone have a screenshot? (I already checked Google’s cache of that page, and they’ve got a different intern photo.)

  31. Taxpayer’s Union just cropped the kid off their site.

  32. I hope you are really sure or you just libeled an innocent person. That can be expensive.

  33. The link made it to Atios. From there it will get around.

    Good job on ferreting out the brownshirts.

  34. I hope someone got a screencap or a copy of the original picture since it seems to have been cropped now.

  35. I’ve got six people who spent the whole summer with him claiming that’s the guy. They might all be wrong, but it’d be a hell of a coincidence.

  36. Julian Sanchez,

    Did they state whether it was “like him” to commit such an act?

  37. ‘I hope you are really sure or you just libeled an innocent person. That can be expensive.’

    Indeed. The kicker may be a world class douchebag but the appropriate avenue here is law enforcement not blog vigilantism, or jury by JPEG. Very irresponsible.

  38. Would it be libel or is it slander? I forget which is which.

  39. ‘I hope you are really sure or you just libeled an innocent person. That can be expensive.’

    Indeed. The kicker may be a world class douchebag but the appropriate avenue here is law enforcement not blog vigilantism, or jury by JPEG. Very irresponsible.

  40. Would it be libel or is it slander? I forget which is which.

  41. “Based on what I’ve seen, by the way, the guy should be brought up on charges.”

    Come on RCD, I would have thought anyone from Samizdata would be all for assulting people who oppose your war. They’re supporting Saddam, aren’t they?

  42. For the time being, Atrios has the original, uncropped, picture uo on his site.

  43. Hey, I was an NTU intern once, too! But the worst thing I was accused of was not doing much work. Someone should kick this douche bag’s ass.

  44. Atrios has the original, uncropped photo:

    http://mywebpages.comcast.net/atrios/2004interns.jpg

  45. Atrios has a screen shot of the page

  46. Libel: Basically defamation in writing and allied forms.

    Slander: This is basically oral defamation.

    For a more precise definition, look to the Restatement of Torts:

    “Libel” and “slander” are both methods of defamation; the former being expressed in print, writing, pictures, or signs; the latter by oral expressions or transitory gestures.

    Restament, Second, Torts, sec. 568

  47. atrios.blogspot.com has the un-cropped version of the photo. I think it’s the same guy.

  48. not only did they crop the picture, but this link is now dead. they work fast.

  49. not only did they crop the picture, but this link is now dead. they work fast.

  50. dbfactor,

    Not fast enough apparently.

  51. here’s the URL to the uncropped pic: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/atrios/2004interns.jpg

    looks like the guy to me.

  52. They cropped the pic but atrios has it up on his site
    atrios.blogspot.com

  53. not only did they crop the picture, but this link is now dead. they work fast.

  54. Come on RCD, I would have thought anyone from Samizdata would be all for assulting people who oppose your war.

    Scott, perhaps you can link to one single post of mine or of any Samizdatista that supports your little smear.

    No? Thought not.

  55. Can someone tell me if they cropped the pic, and if Atrios has it up on his site?

  56. What do be call this? What prefix should come before “gate?” 🙂

  57. Indeed. The kicker may be a world class douchebag but the appropriate avenue here is law enforcement not blog vigilantism, or jury by JPEG.

    That’s right — the resources of the blog world are only supposed to be unleashed on world-shaking issues like typography and Dan Rather, not on assault & battery cases!

  58. sorry for reposting so much. i couldn’t tell if my post went through. site just lagged for days.

  59. Atrios has the original picture here

  60. You can see the uncropped photo here

  61. Atrios has the original picture here.

  62. dbfactor,

    Post, then let your post hang for a few minutes, then hit refresh on your browser. That seems to work for me, and avoids the re-posts. 🙂

  63. You can see the uncropped photo here

  64. You can see the uncropped photo here

  65. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  66. Can someone tell me if they cropped the pic, and if Atrios has it up on his site?

    Big 10-4 to both, Redundency. But don’t worry! You can see the uncropped photo here.

  67. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  68. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  69. Okay, admittedly, he kicked a girl who was on the ground, and who was being restrained by three men.

    But, look, the guy’s such a wuss, that’s what it took to make it a fair fight.

    If she only had two guys holding her, she would have torn off his remaining half-testicle.

  70. This may set the all time record to links from Reason to atrios.

  71. Wacko:
    Here’s the difference democrats fight wars don’t send others to war, dems stand by the facts they don’t spin,lie, intimidate,etc, dems stand their ground they don’t cower under the federal government and finally dems go “mano a mano” with men they don’t hit women. So go whine and moan with your right-wing chicken-pussies.

  72. Atrios posted the original photo here; the alleged kicker is the guy with the kinky (kinky!) hair on the left:

    http://mywebpages.comcast.net/atrios/2004interns.jpg

    =P

  73. Like a couple of posters have noted, the site hosting the image has cropped the guy out of the photograph.
    While I’m sure that will be obvious to Julian or the webmaster of Reason.com once they check this page, it bears noting.

    Atrios has a screenshot of the photo including the kicking kid, which folks can see here:
    Full Picture, including the kicking kid

    Ohyeah. you’re welcome.

  74. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  75. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  76. Tim Cavanaugh,

    You reliving fantasies you had after seeing the movie Convoy? 🙂

    (Yeah, breaker one-nine, this here?s the Rubber Duck, you got a copy
    on me bigpen? C?mon.)

    (Ah yeah, ten-four bigpen, for sure, for sure. By golly it?s clean clear to
    Flagtown. C?mon.)

    (Yeah, that?s a big ten-four there bigpen. Yeah, we definitely got the
    front door good buddy. Mercy sakes live, looks like we got us a
    convoy)

  77. You can see the uncropped photo here

  78. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  79. Like a couple of posters have noted, the site hosting the image has cropped the guy out of the photograph.
    While I’m sure that will be obvious to Julian or the webmaster of Reason.com once they check this page, it bears noting.

    Atrios has a screenshot of the photo including the kicking kid, which folks can see here:
    Full Picture, including the kicking kid

    Ohyeah. you’re welcome.

  80. Like a couple of posters have noted, the site hosting the image has cropped the guy out of the photograph.
    While I’m sure that will be obvious to Julian or the webmaster of Reason.com once they check this page, it bears noting.

    Atrios has a screenshot of the photo including the kicking kid, which folks can see here:
    Full Picture, including the kicking kid

    Ohyeah. you’re welcome.

  81. Atrios has the picture before they cropped it.

  82. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  83. the image was last modified 16-Sep-2004 14:55

  84. the image was last modified 16-Sep-2004 14:55

  85. His name might be Scott Robinson.

    PS Here’s the uncropped photo in question.

    What a scumbag.

  86. My guess – they wouldn’t have cropped if he wasn’t the one.

  87. My guess – they wouldn’t have cropped if he wasn’t the one.

  88. >Looks like they’ve cropped the photo, cause the ones I see don’t look much like the kicker. Anyone have a screenshot? (I already checked Google’s cache of that page, and they’ve got a different intern photo.)

    Atrios has it here.

  89. >Looks like they’ve cropped the photo, cause the ones I see don’t look much like the kicker. Anyone have a screenshot? (I already checked Google’s cache of that page, and they’ve got a different intern photo.)

    Atrios has it here.

  90. Much apologies for the scatter-shot posts… the site was bogged down something fierce…

    🙂

  91. Wait, if this guy assaulted a girl who was being held by three Secret Service agents, why was he not arrested on the spot?

    Please, please tell me I don’t know the answer to that question… 🙁

  92. America Blog http://americablog.blogspot.com/archives/2004_09_12_americablog_archive.html#109537193326040282
    has both versions of this photo, including Before and After. Why would they crop it now?

    That kicker sure is a 17th Century style gentleman, eh? Kick a person when she’s down. Hit a GIRL!!! Then run away. A true prince.

  93. Wait, if this guy assaulted a girl who was being held by three Secret Service agents, why was he not arrested on the spot?

    Please, please tell me I don’t know the answer to that question… 🙁

  94. Looks like the NTU has restored the full picture now.

  95. > This may set the all time record to links from Reason to atrios.

    Wait till Eschaton Wet T-shirt week.

  96. I would say that the NTU would only crop that person from their photo if he were indeed the culprit of the aassault. That said, I haven’t read anything on this site that purports to insist that the person in the NTU photo is for certain the assaulter, hence no libel Mahatma.

  97. Atrios has a screen shot up with the little coward still in the shot. Looks like the whole group is populated with cowards.

  98. Note to new posters from Atrios:

    All of the readers here really do appreciate being informed that Atrios has the picture, but…

    1) A dozen or so of you guys already told us… about 3 times apiece 😉

    2) Just click the “post” button once. Yes, even if it takes forever for the software to respond. And if you get an error message, my advice is to click the “back” button on your browser, copy what you just wrote onto your clipboard, and then click “refresh” to see if it posted anyway despite the error message. If it didn’t, feel free to try posting again.

    Thank you, and enjoy our wacky forum, where we subject our hypotheses to at least as much scrutiny as Dan Rather! 😉

  99. Atrios has a screen shot up with the little coward still in the shot. Looks like the whole group is populated with cowards.

  100. Thanks Thoreau … I am really embarassed at the number of redundant posts I put up. I swear it didn’t show up the first two or three times I refreshed the page. I swear! 😀

    PS Is there going to be a 4th season of 24 this fall?

  101. So this is the great omnipotent free market’s excuse for a comment server?

  102. Steve-

    Being a long-running poster, you should know better. No soup for you! ;->

    The new season of 24 won’t start until January. They’re going to run it Monday nights, and they’re going to start late so they can do a full run without any interruptions. They’ll do a few 2 hour episodes, supposedly, so they can get through 24 hours by the end of May.

    http://24spoilers.tvheaven.com

  103. Atrios posted the uncropped picture, with a guy added on the left — http://tinyurl.com/5as8y

  104. Wait, if this guy assaulted a girl who was being held by three Secret Service agents, why was he not arrested on the spot?

    You make it sound like three agents had her in custody and he just walked up and kicked her. Watch the video — he kicks her while they’re still in the process of apprehending her, and none of them were looking in the right direction to see the kick. So it’s entirely possible that the guy escaped arrest because the Secret Service guys didn’t see the kick.

    It’s also possible that they refrained from arresting him because doing so would have conflicted with their duty to protect their charges — they are there to deal with threats to certain government officials, not threats to the general public. The regular police handle that. After all, if the Secret Service was obligated to deal with every crime it witnessed, an organized force could perform a “denial of service attack” on the President’s bodyguards simply by staging fights in their presence.

  105. NTU cropped the wuss out of the picture. You can see the original here.

    Picture url is:
    http://img71.exs.cx/img71/3070/2004interns.jpg

    Screenshot stolen from Atrios.

  106. Dan,

    Then why not tell the NYC cops about the incident?

  107. You can get the pre-cropped screen shot at
    http://www.atrios.blogspot.com/

  108. Dan,

    I’d have to argue with your interpretation of the video — two of the agents are standing right next to the guy.

    And as GG points out, the place was crawling with cops — could they not have flagged one of them down if concerned with leaving their post?

  109. Dan,

    After all, if the Secret Service was obligated to deal with every crime it witnessed, an organized force could perform a “denial of service attack” on the President’s bodyguards simply by staging fights in their presence.

    Please. Three of them grabbed a girl who committed the crime of holding up a sign and shouting. You’re telling me they couldn’t grab a guy and hold him for a few seconds till the police got there?

  110. Dan,

    After all, if the Secret Service was obligated to deal with every crime it witnessed, an organized force could perform a “denial of service attack” on the President’s bodyguards simply by staging fights in their presence.

    Please. Three of them grabbed a girl who committed the crime of holding up a sign and shouting. You’re telling me they couldn’t grab a guy and hold him for a few seconds till the police got there?

  111. Won’t you need a trial lawyer for a libel case?

  112. Slow news day in Sanchez land.

  113. I would think that in a situation of a disturbance the Secret Service should simply arrest anybody who gets violent, period. Whether it’s a protestor or somebody who seems to be on the opposite side, they’d simply arrest anybody who get violent. The goal isn’t just to get the protestors and leave everybody else alone, the goal is to restore order to the event where their protectee is speaking, period. Anybody who gets violent for any reason is a threat to law and order there.

    The notion that they simply lacked the manpower to handle this guy without abandoning their primary charge would imply that if the protestors would have just brough a few extra people with them they would have had free run of the place.

    The only excuse I can see is that maybe they didn’t realize what he was doing. However, as I recall he was kicking the woman that they were holding. Shouldn’t they have noticed his foot coming in there, even if they weren’t facing him directly? I mean, sure, it’s a chaotic situation and all, but they are supposed to be trained observers skilled at identifying and subduing anybody who engages in violence in an area they’re trying to secure. And it’s not like this is the most stressful situation the Secret Service would expect to encounter. A handful of shouting people with signs should pose far less stress for them than, say, a sniper taking shots at a protectee or some other situation that they (presumably) train for.

    We’re left with 2 possibilities:
    1) They aren’t as observant as one would hope. If a relatively minor disturbance can make them oblivious to some guy kicking the person that they’re holding on to, I want a refund on the taxes that I paid toward their salary. To quote the Donald, “You should have noticed that dipshit thug kicking the person that you were taking control of. It’s your job to notice violence even in stressful situation. You didn’t do that, so I have to say you’re fired.”

    2) They didn’t see a need to deal with the dipshit thug kicking the girl because he was one of the “good guys” and she was one of the “bad guys.” That’s the sort of thug mentality I’d expect from, say, the LAPD’s Rampart CRASH units, not nation’s most elite (supposedly) law enforcement agency.

  114. Original, uncropped photo showing the alleged kicker here.

  115. Clearly the guy should have been arrested, and should still be arrested, but let’s not go nuts. The Secret Service knows that to restore order they just need to get protestors out of there.

    Suppose this was more of a mob situation, or turning into a mob situation and not just one assclown. It would be best to grab the protestors and get them out, rather than pull in anyone else in the crowd who might be taking cheap shots on the way by, who might quickly be multiplying.

  116. JDM-

    When I was in high school, if there was a fight the teachers would pull the two fighting students apart. They wouldn’t just pull away the guy who started it, because once he’s gone the situation will calm down. They’d pull away anybody who was throwing punches.

    You’re basically suggesting that the Secret Service only needs to pull away the people who started it in order to restore order.

  117. I’d have to argue with your interpretation of the video — two of the agents are standing right next to the guy

    I know they’re standing right next to him, but look at when the kick occurs, about 80% of the way into the video — the balding agent is looking at something off to the kicker’s left, and the agent with the short red/brown hair has his back to the kicker. The third guy’s off camera, but when last seen was standing on the other side of the balding guy. It looks to me like the guy snuck in a kick when the agents weren’t looking.

    Three of them grabbed a girl who committed the crime of holding up a sign and shouting.

    The three of them grabbed a woman about whom they knew exactly two things: (a) she hated Bush, and (b) she had snuck into the convention. I’m sure they’re very sorry they didn’t have your magical psychic powers to look into the future and see that she’d turn out to be harmless, because having powers like that sure would make their jobs easier. As it is, five out of the last ten Presidents have been either killed, shot, or shot at by assassins, so the Secret Service natually has no sense of humor about people like this.

    You’re telling me they couldn’t grab a guy and hold him for a few seconds till the police got there

    If you think it takes “a few seconds” to grab a guy and hold him for the police, you don’t know shit about police work. But in any case the answer to your question is no, the Secret Service can not just decide to blow off their bodyguarding duties in order to arrest some guy for misdemeanor assault. What they would do, if they’d seen the assault, would be to notify security, via radio, to come grab the guy.

  118. can somebody link to any others photo of this fine young
    Republican? You know his name and school. How about a yearbook photo? For confirmation.

  119. Good job Julian. You’ve done so much to advance libertarian thought and discussion with this post.

  120. We’re left with 2 possibilities:

    We’re left with 3 possibilities; the third is that you haven’t actually watched the video very closely. 🙂

    If a relatively minor disturbance can make them oblivious to some guy kicking the person that they’re holding on to, I want a refund on the taxes that I paid toward their salary.

    He kicked her once, so far as I can tell, and they weren’t holding on to her yet. Also, calling it “a minor disturbance” isn’t fair, and you know it. It isn’t like there were three Secret Service guys alone in a park with a protester and the guy who kicked her. They were in a massive crowd of people, and the incident they missed took only a fraction of a second. It isn’t like the Rodney King beating was reenacted under their noses and they missed it.

  121. Uh, Dan, if you think law enforcement haven’t got a duty to protect those in their custody (wow, Dan, if they had the same magical fantasy, like you, to think this woman posed any significant threat to Bush whatsoever, it sure seemed they’d want to avoid her turning into another Lee Harvey Oswald at the gun and/or foot of Jack Ruby/Wimp Scotty, right?) — to include not magically (and incompetently) “looking the other way” as you describe above…. then YOU don’t know shit about police work.

    And unless…you know….certain law enforcement officers selectively enforce laws based on their own political beliefs. Not that that ever happens in America. No sir.

  122. The three of them grabbed a woman about whom they knew exactly two things: (a) she hated Bush, and (b) she had snuck into the convention. I’m sure they’re very sorry they didn’t have your magical psychic powers to look into the future and see that she’d turn out to be harmless, because having powers like that sure would make their jobs easier.

    Actually, if they knew either of those two things, they were endowed with more magical psychic powers than either you or I can possibly envision.

  123. Big entertainment going on in comments over on Little Scotty’s blog page at the Kock Foundation:

    http://ksfp2004.blogspot.com/2004/08/dems-disenfranshise-militarykerry.html

  124. Dan,

    I’ve watched the video and I don’t agree with your analysis; his actions were clearly visible to at least one of the agents (the balding fellow) and he appears to glance in their direction just as he ensues his kicking. Now, maybe he missed the action, but the case is hardly as open and shut as you appear to claim that it is.

    BTW, he appears to have kicked her twice or three times. There was an initial kick that occurred while he was helping put her to the ground, then there was one or two following kicks when gets to the ground.

    Finally, there is the possibility that the fellow who seems to push him away is also a SS agent as well; he appears to be dressed similarly as the other “agents” after all.

  125. “You’re basically suggesting that the Secret Service only needs to pull away the people who started it in order to restore order.”

    Yes. That’s it exactly. Can you refute that?

    “And unless…you know….certain law enforcement officers selectively enforce laws based on their own political beliefs.”

    So if the same thing happened at Democratic President’s convention, do you think they would haul off the entire crowd and leave the Republican protestors?

  126. , the Secret Service can not just decide to blow off their bodyguarding duties in order to arrest some guy

    Dan, your kneejerk fascist-apologizing naivete is hanging out of your shorts, you might want to tuck it back in.

    I suggest you run out and watch Fahrenheit 911 before spouting hilarious BS like this. It’s captured live on video for you there.

  127. Anyway, she has an excellent suit in the making for battery; and hopefully criminal charges will be filed against this man as well.

  128. here is an anti-kerry article mr. robinson posted on the daily pennsylvanian http://www.dailypennsylvanian.com/vnews/display.v/ART/40b575b016095?in_archive=1

  129. here is an anti-kerry article mr. robinson posted on the daily pennsylvanian http://www.dailypennsylvanian.com/vnews/display.v/ART/40b575b016095?in_archive=1

  130. here is an anti-kerry article mr. robinson posted on the daily pennsylvanian http://www.dailypennsylvanian.com/vnews/display.v/ART/40b575b016095?in_archive=1

  131. To the Editor:

    For the record, Mr. Robinson left NTU Foundation’s internship program well before the GOP convention. Whether or not Mr. Robinson is indeed the same person depicted in the convention video, my organization repudiates violence in all forms. Now to the burning question no doubt elicited from the editor’s “update 2”: why is there now a different photo on the NTU Foundation’s website? Because “Kicking ’em While They’re Down” didn’t adequately clarify the fact that Mr. Robinson was long gone from NTUF before this chain of blogged events unfairly implicated us in the incident. Sorry, but the words “spent the summer” didn’t cut it, since we’ve been put in the position of having to explain our total non-involvement in this controversy (or whatever it is) to a few seriously confused people who’ve emailed us directly. What’s that phrase from the top of page I read? Oh yes … naughty, naughty, Hit and Run.

    Pete Sepp
    Vice President for Communications
    National Taxpayers Union Foundation

  132. Scott Robinson blogs on how he feels about protesters.

    http://ksfp2004.blogspot.com/2004/06/sick-of-radical-protestors.html#comments

  133. Where is the Reason in most of these posts? Talk about a mob metality….I didn’t realize readers of this web/magazine were comprised of so many pugilistic vigilantes.

  134. Vice President Sepp (if that’s who you really are),

    So you thought that cropping him out of the picture would show that you’re not connected to him? Such an act has “cover-up” written all over it.

  135. It looks to me like the guy snuck in a kick when the agents weren’t looking.

    lol! You’re telling me that this guy could stand in the midst of three Secret Service agents, and probably more scattered around the place, and kick a girl they were touching “while they weren’t looking”. Good thing no one with a plan to harm the prez got in while they weren’t looking.

    What they would do, if they’d seen the assault, would be to notify security, via radio, to come grab the guy.

    Which is why it’s left to bloggers to find him, right?

  136. Dan, I fear you’re becoming the joe of the right.

  137. Steve in CO, the first 2 or 3 times…
    When the error message comes up go back and then refresh. Guess what! Your post will be there. You gotta be a Democrat. /R

  138. Police suggest entire population in the Elm Terrace area do as follows: Everyone in every house in every street open a front or rear door or look from the windows. The fugitive cannot escape if everyone in the next minute looks from his house. Ready!

  139. Step back…,

    Well, considering roughly 70% of the posts in this thread are plugs for Atrios’ displaying of the intern picture…

    And I will look up what “pugilistic vigilantes” means! :

  140. Pete Sepp,

    He was a summer intern, was he not? Did anyone claim that your organization was reponsible for his actions? Not that I can see. Did you try to distance yourself from this individual by cropping the picture? It appears so. Do you look foolish for doing so? Yep. 🙂

  141. To Pete Sepp:

    Your defense of the doctored photo is amusing but completely nonsensical.

    What possible difference does it make that young Mr. Peterson’s internship ended before the Republican convention? His assault on a defenseless protestor in no way changes the straightforward truth that he WAS one of NTUF’s 2004 “Associates.”

    While you may no longer wish to be associated with this pathetic thug, your attempt to doctor your own records only makes you look like a sneaky, lying bunch of weasels. And, frankly, that’s just what I’d expect from a group that tries to sell the snake oil of a flat tax.

  142. Mr. Sepp,

    Your letter made little sense to probably just about everyone reading it. You didn’t explain WHY you deleted his picture from the internship group photo. Is it really your assertation that the reason was this blog didn’t say he was “long gone”? That’s a non-answer, and a ridiculous argument. I hope your organization can make better points than your letter to this blog did!

    Are those other interns as “long gone” as he is? Why does their picture remain?

    One thing I don’t think you understand is that it was WRONG for your organization to doctor the photo after his assault on the woman. It doesn’t change the fact he was an intern there along with the others depicted in that photo! By doctoring it, you are covering up the fact he interned there, and sending a message that you’ll rewrite history if it is a mean to your ends.

    Some republicans just have no sense of morality, as is demonstrated by your post. Saving your ass isn’t always the RIGHT or CORRECT thing to do. Take it like a man. After all, you didn’t do anything – he did. To put things in perspective you can understand (saving your ass), put the original photo back up before your cover-up becomes a bigger story than what you were trying to prevent. Sheesh!

  143. Uh, Dan, if you think law enforcement haven’t got a duty to protect those in their custody

    Do I think that all law enforcement agents have an obligation, 1.2 seconds after they *begin* to grab a criminal, to immediately devote all their attention to protecting her from any form of harm? No.

    wow, Dan, if they had the same magical fantasy, like you, to think this woman posed any significant threat to Bush whatsoever

    I never claimed she was a threat to Bush; I claimed it was reasonable for the Secret Service to think she might be. Squeaky Fromme and Sara Jane Moore looked even more innocuous than this woman did, and they each came within a hair of successfully assassinating Gerald Ford. All the Secret Service knew about this woman was that she hated Bush and had snuck in to the convention. It is quite reasonable to assume that any such person is an assassin until further investigation clears them from suspicion.

    And unless…you know….certain law enforcement officers selectively enforce laws based on their own political beliefs. Not that that ever happens in America. No sir

    What political beliefs might those be? Are you suffering from the delusion that the Secret Service is a Republican organization? The only political belief widely held by the Secret Service is that crazy people shouldn’t try crazy shit in the presence of the people the Secret Service is protecting.

  144. Did you see the story about the Soldiers at Fort Carson, Colorado being told to re-enlist or get sent to Iraq? (Pick one.) Rocky Mountain News in Colorado at http://rockymountainnews.com/drmn/state/article/0,1299,DRMN_21_3185596,00.html

    – Chuck

  145. Dave Stanley
    CEO NTUF

    Pete,

    Well you really screwed it up this time. Why did you doctor that photo? By doing that you’ve dragged us right into the middle of this mess. And then to make things even worse, if that was possible, you posted a message in this snakepit. What are you going to do next, get Dan Rather to explain it?

    Be in my office at 7:15 AM

    Thank you.

    Dave Stanley.

  146. NTU sucks.

    But…

    What SHOULD they have done to the picture? Left him? Taken down the whole thing? Cropped him, and left a note?

  147. Leave no stone unturned.

    Leave no Republican unturned-in.

    Sue the bastard!

  148. “The three of them grabbed a woman about whom they knew exactly two things: (a) she hated Bush, and (b) she had snuck into the convention.”

    Actually, if they knew either of those two things, they were endowed with more magical psychic powers than either you or I can possibly envision.

    She was waving a sign that read “BUSH GLOBAL AIDS LIAR” and yelling anti-Bush slogans. It doesn’t take much clairvoyance to figure out (a) and (b) from that.

  149. Dave Stanley
    CEO NTUF

    To: “Joe”

    What Sepp should have done was… nothing. Absolutely nothing. Ignored the whole thing. Any enquiries should have been answered thus:

    1) We have no idea if the person in the video was Mr Robinson or not.

    2) Mr Robinson was an intern for a brief period of time which ended long before the convention.

    3) We have nothing further to say on the matter.

    Thank you.

  150. Dan, I fear you’re becoming the joe of the right

    I can’t be bothered with worrying about the opinions of anyone clueless enough to think I’m a member of “the right”.

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