Boll Weevils

New at Reason: Cotton subsidies make Jacob Sullum itchy.

Comments

[Anonymous]

the article states that some 170,000,000,000 dollars paid out over lst 8 years. average u.s production of raw cotton bales yearly ranges from 17 up to 18.5 or so million bales. over 8 years that would about 140,000,000 bales. this seems to equate to about 12 dollars or so per bale. percentage wise this is lsee than 4 percent of value of today' cotton bale.

this amount seems small when considering marketing chain vaules. if this 12 dollars gives the local ( country farm town)economy a its jump start to initiate local money supply and spending what can be wrong? these growers while we are talking fiber also supply us and the world with the finest food available. are we not subsidizing ourselves? yes from a politiacal stand point the program does seem difficult. make and assumption that those bales would not reach market and no monies returned to the local economy. where would those folks be?

those socalled step-2 dollars are ctually put in the pricing to buy down the commodity to wourld price and make salable. without the sale pruchase price isnot retruned to grower. these monies are and should be looked upon as promo or discounting monies to put goods to mkt place.
......all comers

[Jean Bart]

Anon.,

In other words, they can't compete on the world market, and therefore need to take money out of the pockets of their fellow citizens via the firm hand of the government in order to turn a profit?

[Hick American]

JB,

And you wonder why everybody things you're an A-hole? Comments like that just piss people off and then the flame wars start. You must be really lonely.

[The Merovingian]

Cretin, er, I mean Hick American,

*chuckle*

Somehow I think about 99% of the folks here agree with me. 🙂 If you are in favor of state subsidies for agriculture, then you aren't in favor of free markets.

BTW, we French aren't afraid of a little abrasive discourse. What is the American saying, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen?" 🙂

[The Merovingian]

Hick American,

BTW, Deanna Troi-like psychobabble such as yours is a sure sign that you are having your head handed to you.

Vous ?tes aussi utile qu'un frein ? main sur un canoe.

[Hick American]

Prime Minister Jean Riel Cretin:

I may have misunderstood your post. I'm sure it was a just a comment about subsidies in general. You would never make a jab at American farmers just to bait someone into another pedantic discussion.

[The Merovingian]

Hick American,

I think earlier today I said I was in favor of CAP reform in France; I am consistent on this issue.

[matt]

JB at 5:35,

Couldn't have said it better myself.....

[Agent Smith #23]

If American farmers can't compete, they should be replaced by machines that can.

[Jack]

Jean wrote: "Vous ?tes aussi utile qu'un frein ? main sur un canoe."

"You are as useful as a handbrake on a canoe"???

[Douglas Fletcher]

A rather wonkish weekend on the old Hit & Run. Back to the Boone's Farm, I guess.

[david f]

okay, Jean Bart, why this one, now???

ac.wwu.edu/~stephan/Rulers/merovingian.html

drf

[Jesse (Not Walker)]

Well hell, I was just shocked to read something by Jacob that didn't involve anyone getting high. 🙂

[MBW]

Any chance of a real discussion on this one?

Sure, everyone, myself included, is going to kneejerk subsidies=bad, get rid of them. And for the water subsidies per se maybe that's the right response; however, there's a big problem with using that same specific response for the general question of all ag subsidies. The real question here is why are American (and European, for that matter) farmers (cotton, tobacco, peanuts, or otherwise) unable to compete pricewise with third world farmers? To a certain extent, it's a result of a natural high cost of business in most developed countries, i.e. high land prices, high labor prices, and high taxes, as well as specific problems, such as unavailability of cheap water in this case. And inasmuch as that is the case, sure, cut the subsidies out and let 'em sink or swim in the global market.

However, how much of the uncompetitiveness of ag in developed countries is a result of measures, either voluntarily participated in or imposed from above, that inflate costs? How much of the cost of producing a crop in the US is a result of conservation practices to keep from burning the land out in a few years? Or buying worker's comp? Or following OSHA guidelines? Or following EPA guidelines on pesticide and herbicide use? All these millions of things that we have legislated to protect our soil, our workers, our environment, our water all have costs that, frankly, are borne by the producers and result in a higher cost of production. The merits of these rules can be argued all day, but the fact is, they and their costs exist, and in some cases probably rightly so.

I hate to continue this line of reasoning, because I'll sound like I'm in favor of subsidies, but even without arguing fairness to domestic producers, it's fairly simple to make the case that when we make these expensive rules, and then allow the production to simply transfer overseas where these rules are not in place by not somehow mitigating the costs that are associated with compliance, that all we're doing is exporting the problems associated with cheap production. So now it's too expensive to grow these crops here, and they'll be grown somewhere else where the producers don't have to spend money on safe working conditions, or providing a minimum wage, or preventing soil erosion, or worrying about impacts of excess nitrogen and pesticides.

Does that make the subsidies right? I don't know; and in cases such as the water subsidies, probably not. Even if the above argument is accepted, then doubtless the problem could be better handled in a way other than outright subsidies. And no matter what solution might be reached, it would still be a matter of attempting to further legislate our problems away. But I can't accept the argument that American and European farmers are somehow inherently less efficient per se than farmers in third world countries, and I can't accept the idea that simply increasing production in areas that are not subject to the rules that we (right or wrong) have decided are necessary to our society is morally right or even prudent.

[tomi]

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[kiki]

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[Saunders Patricia]

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DATE: 01/20/2004 12:12:40
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