Second World: Globalize Us, Please!
Tyler Cowen points out this Pew Center study showing that the developing world is far more enthusiastic about globalization and international companies than the rich West. Which is logical for two good reasons: Free trade makes poor countries richer faster, and developing countries haven't had the luxury and time to become aesthetically turned off by "cookie-cutter" chains and rapacious "multinationals." Reminds me of when the first McDonald's opened in Prague -- it was met by protests, led mostly by young Americans and Western Europeans, and then it was packed from day one with Czechs.
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I guess its selfish to say, "who wants to live in a homogenous world?" That is probably the worst side effect to globalization. But, who am I to stop progress and commercial evolution?
Well, I think that a world that is "homogenous" in that everyone has food, clothing and housing that wouldn't make a cockroach gag, and in which the liberalizing influence of modern communications has swept aside quaint tribal customs like stoning gays and clitorectomies, is probably preferable to one characterized by a wide variety of ways to suffer and die from poverty and primitive superstition.
But that's just me.
Maybe this is just nitpickery, but I always thought the second world was associated with communist bloc countries and the third world were the "developing nations?"
Well said R.C., well said.
It definitely seems to me that the world has grown more homogenous as I've lived. However, that's partially in the sense that while before, everywhere was different in that only the local types of food were available, now almost everywhere has Indian food, Italian food, Mexican, Chinese food, not to mention things like Thai, Korean, Japanese, and NC-style barbecque.
One of the earliest Chinese restaurants in Durham, NC (a fairly large town) was established in 1980. The Ram's Head Rathskeller (Chapel Hill) believes that it was the first restaurant to serve pizza in the state of North Carolina-- in the mid 1950s.
Sure, the world was a lot less homogenous back when the only food you could get in North Carolina was the local Southern food, and, conversely, nothing approaching North Carolina barbecue was found anywhere else. However, I prefer the modern situation.
The same wide variety everywhere is better than a different type of uniformity everywhere.
John Thacker, well said. The problem here is one of distrust and conceit, as usual. People don't trust "developing" countries to be as smart as we are. It's so disgusting. Once the world is "homogenous," people will simply find other ways and means of expression and distinction.
Once the food problems are solved, and everybody has a local McDonald's, people will have the strength and creativity to do other things. It's as though McDonald's was the last American restaurant, as though when the first McDonald's opened in America, no new restaurants were ever opened again, as if the Subway or the local barbecue shop down the street don't exist.
As if when the first McD's was opened in the USA, we all did nothing but eat there, like we never drank coffee or wrote mystery novels or went to the movies or went to a national park any more. It's so frustratingly preposterous.
If it's a choice between hundreds of different types of cuisine, or clothing or whatever, but only one type available in a given locale, or a dozen types available everywhere, the choice is easy. The only people who could object are those with the time and money to travel when they want to experience "diversity." But for anybody else, having the same dozen options available everywhere is a lot better than having only one option where ever you might be stuck.
Time has an interesting article about India's growing young middle class:
http://www.time.com/time/globalbusiness/article/0,9171,1101030825-476405,00.html
The interesting part is that the multinationals moving in have altered their products, advertising, etc to fit in with local culture.
Also interesting are the local entrepenuers who are copying western businesses like coffee shops.
Heh. Being from a small town, I recall when our first McDonalds (we now have three, if you count the one inside the Wal-Mart Supercenter) opened. It was like we'd finally made it. Just a few years ago, another (smaller) town in my area got a Dairy Queen. It was like a Papal visit.
Excellent point, James. Who *are* you? And why are you such a homophobe?
Lemme tell ya', the wierdest thing about my last trip to Egypt (in 2000) was the TGI Friday's on the Nile (not to mention the Hardees, Baskin Robbins, Chili's and other American chains that are all over Cairo). I'll second Don's comment, when relatives and family friends visit from Egypt, they shop, shop, shop and are amazed at the low prices. My mom told me that on occasion she would have to lie about what she paid for something that she bought for someone from here because they were astounded at the low prices and assumed it meant low quality, as opposed to the reality, high productivity.
Globalization rocks. Heck, we're not gonna win this war on terror and Islamo-fascists with guns and tanks, but with Burger Kings and Walmarts. If we improve their lives with economic power, they will reject those that would take them to the bad old days. It's time to reread Asimov's Foundation.
How come everywhere in Europe, people began dressing like the Italians, emulating the merchants of Venice, and becoming so "homogenized" during the reign of the de Medicis?
How come during the Golden Age of the Dutch during the 17th century, everyone's pants were falling down -- not only in Holland, England, Germany, France, but in the Americas as well? (Because they wore their belt buckles on their hats and their shoes -- emulating the successful Dutch.)
How come everywhere, the world over, tea time and Queensware table settings became all the rage during the reign of the British Empire -- emulating not only the ways of the English, but their very language as well?
Apparently, "globalization" is nothing new. The so-called world "homogenization" (which is really a form of communication) has been going on for a very long time.
Brilliant, Cosmo - it seems "globalization" and "multiculturalism" both are things seemingly claimed as some new thing when they have existed for ages and ages.
Similar, consider how one of the biggest single inventions is mathematics, the Hindu-Arabic number system, spread all over the world and pretty much seems to have universally displaced all other number systems. Originally it was from India, after all, then various philosophies and advances were imported into Islamic countries, which then spread to Italy, and then to the entire world.
Further consider the spread and proliferation of Greek philosophies, which possibly would have been entirely lost if not for Islamic countries scholarship and trade, which spread to western european countries and majorly influenced Christian theology for all time.
If it works for one country, there is nothing to say it somehow shouldn't work for any other country. It must be understood that all cultures are constantly changing, even when isolated from "outside" influences - isolationism from trade can only slow the changes, never bring them to a halt.
Err...I meant "the biggest single inventions IN mathematics", not "is".
Globalization causes "homogenization" only in the sense that you get the same brands everywhere. What you actually get often tends to be completely localized.
For eg. in India, the Pizza Huts and McDonalds', as well as MTV and Fox News affiliates etc are very different from what you see in the West. If it weren't for the familiar brand name you would probably not recognize the product at all. MTV in its original indian incarnation, with all-american content, was a failure & it was only when they recruited local talent and shows that it became popular.
Madog beat me to linking to the time mag article on this subject.
I just can't understand the gripe. Why is it so wrong to give someone the option of exchanging money for an Original Recipe chicken leg? On the scale of global threats, I'd have to believe that would be pretty low on the list.
The notion of homogenization just doesn't stand up to the evidence, either. As a number of Reason contributors have pointed out, people modify cultural imports to suit local tastes. You can even see it occur between states of the union.
On a related note, I remember hearing an interview with a fine fellow on NPR a few weeks back. He was promoting the notion that we are destroying cultural diversity just as we are destroying ecological diversity. By way of example, the listener was subjected to a eulogy for salt mining Bedouins, most of whom are sending their children to schools because there is not much need to mine salt by hand and haul it by camel these days. I'm not kidding.
Some times I get the feeling that a lot of people against cultural globablization are just upset because their favorite "quaint" vacation spots won't be the same.
"Why is it so wrong to give someone the option of exchanging money for an Original Recipe chicken leg?" If that's all that were happening, there would be little if any opposition.
How are you giving those people that choice? Chances are Pepsico (owner of KFC) is getting subsidies to enter that market. This is bad enough for US taxpayers. But when the rise of KFC leads to local dislocation and unemployment, and when that rise is not a natural occurance, but is being pushed and supported by the US government, there is a legitimate gripe.
Well, yeah, that's true, Madog. But we can always thank Disney for giving us a glimpse of what it used to be like -- even though it's "canned quaintness."
"Madog beat me to linking to the time mag article on this subject.
That's because Madog spends 24/7 on H&R instead of having to earn a living like the rest of us.
GET BACK TO WORK, MADOG!
:}
(Just kidding, guy. You're OK.)
"consider how one of the biggest single inventions in mathematics (the Hindu-Arabic number system) spread all over the world"
You got that right, Plutarck!
They especially gave us that most important of all digits: The zero, without which the world would be up a creek without a paddle, and Reason Online and H&R -- hell, the entire Internet and all of computerdom, would be non-existent!
Have a look:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0140296476/reasonmagazinea-20/
(Zero: The Biography of a Dangerous Idea -- by Charles Seife)
Joe,
OK, I'll bite.
"Chances are Pepsico (owner of KFC) is getting subsidies to enter that market. ... But when the rise of KFC leads to local dislocation and unemployment, and when that rise is not a natural occurance, but is being pushed and supported by the US government, there is a legitimate gripe."
There's about 20 unsubstantiated claims in the above paragraph. "Chances are?" How does the rise of KFC lead to dislocation and unemployment? By chasing out all of the other purveyors of Southern-style food in, say, Egypt?
Conspiracy theories, Joe.
multiculturalists still cling to the racist vision that the only natural food for Egyptions is pitas, just as their skin-color/national-orgin obligates them to wear robes and quote the Koran. To see an Egyption that likes KFC, wears a tie and happens to like American culture horrifies them.
(maybe they are afraid that their lily white lives are contaminated by brown people who happen to like some of the same stuff they do, a la how the Germans viewed Jews who adopted German culture).
You wrote -
"How are you giving those people that choice? Chances are Pepsico (owner of KFC) is getting subsidies to enter that market. This is bad enough for US taxpayers." Etc
I suggest you read the article Madog linked to. If you dont give "those people" a choice then they won't buy you product, period. Also, the article claims that there has been an increase in high-paid employment, not unemployment etc as you suggest. The only people who have been displaced are those cultural theorists who think that any product, tangible or otherwise, with an american or "western" sounding name is automatically a form of cultural imperialism.
Joe,
A minor point; but lay the blame where it is due: Pepsi spun the restaurant business out on it's own about a decade ago to Tricon group. I see just now that that org has renamed itself Yum! Brands.
(I can't decide which is worse - cultural hegemony via a faceless conglomerate with an 80's style made-up name; or cultural hegemony via a faceless conglomerate with a 90's style cutesy name)
Pepsi does continue to kick the world's ass with Frito-Lay, however.
Matt,
You should put the words "free trade" in quotes when referring to the mercantilist regime enforced by the IMF, World Bank, and the Uruguay Round of GATT. What in the name of all that's holy do those "rapacious multinationals" have to do with genuine free trade?
Didn't you make a wrong turn somewhere, Kevin?
Sounds like a non sequitur to me. (Your post doesn't pertain to this article.)
Try This Post Brought to You by the the Vast Right Wing Propaganda Machine -- about two dozen articles further south.
No wrong turn, HW. You oughta stop reading just the Comments, and take some time reading the parent articles for a change.
I was addressing Matt Welch, the author of THIS article, Second World: Globalize Us, Please! when he wrote,
Which is logical for two good reasons: Free trade makes poor countries richer faster, and developing countries haven't had the luxury and time to become aesthetically turned off by "cookie-cutter" chains and rapacious "multinationals."
I wasn't born yesterday. Been doing H&R for a while now. Probably much longer than you have. So please get off my back.
Keith, try as we might, we ain't gonna dominate no culture via mere products. We might influence a people's shopping habits, maybe, but not their culture, per se.
YOU SAID: "(I can't decide which is worse - cultural hegemony via a faceless conglomerate with an 80's style made-up name; or cultural hegemony via a faceless conglomerate with a 90's style cutesy name)"
Perhaps "commercial hegemony" would've been a more appropriate term.
I went to, I think, Cocos in Korea, looking for a good old fashioned American menu--alas, the food was Korean.
I very much like Korean food, although the Kimchi wasn't somthing I really care for. But damn, after a week you really want something familiar.
Joe-
To the extent that international trade is distorted by subsidies and whatnot, I think it's safe to say that all of us here oppose those subsidies and decry whatever cultural damage may be wrought as the result of regulations and subsidies and other distortions of the market.
But overall, allowing for all exceptions and cases of painful adjustment, I just can't get upset if Iranian teenagers decide they like American music better than indigeneous Iranian music. Considering that rock'n'roll was invented by blacks, popularized for whites by Elvis and the Beetles, and now even receives some Latino influences, I'd say our culture is a product of globalization, not a purveyor of it.
"How are you giving those people that choice? Chances are Pepsico (owner of KFC) is getting subsidies to enter that market. This is bad enough for US taxpayers. But when the rise of KFC leads to local dislocation and unemployment, and when that rise is not a natural occurance, but is being pushed and supported by the US government, there is a legitimate gripe."
Huh? The only way KFC can displace local food sources is if all the locals overwhelmingly prefer KFC over the local food sources. I.e., the locals have a choice--and they choose KFC.
If you are saying that American taxpayers are subsidizing KFC to the point that KFC can sell well below the local food joints' cost--isn't this just saying that American taxpayers are feeding the locals? Shouldn't leftists & locals love us for this? Yet, even if this is the case, the locals still have a choice to go to "their" normal food sources.
In any case, in places like Ecuador, most locals don't eat in resturaunts--they are for Americans and Europeans and other travelers. Well, this IS changing . . .
"Considering that rock'n'roll was invented by blacks, . . ."
I believe Reason ran a good article on how the history of music was much more involved than that. I.e., rock'n'roll isn't simply a black invention.
thoreau, I can't get upset about that, either. My beef is with genuinely imperialist attempts to alter other countries economies to the advantage of multinationals, not with the effects of more intercultural experience on the part of people from poor countries. The whole Free Trade infrastructure is built around some fairly illiberal pillars, but even the "classic liberals" seem willing to pretend the WTO represents a libertarian shift away from government distortion of the commercial sphere.
Jade Monk asks "How does the rise of KFC lead to dislocation and unemployment?" Dislocation, by interrupting existing economic relationships among buyers and sellars as the retail and wholesale level. Unemployment, by reducing demand for local products through the substitution of imported ones, and thus rendering "redundant" the former suppliers. Again, this is especially troublesome when our tax dollars, and the economic power of our corporations, are used to muscle our way in. When it happens through genuine free choices, I don't have an issue; but then, the cultural and economic impacts of that type of commerce are qualitatively different than what you see when the biggest corporations take advantage of the laws of American, European, and International governments to make the governments and markets of developing countries more compliant. But what I see here is one dimensional cheerleading for corporatist Free Trade, and namecalling when someone acknowledges the problems.
It's funny - I come to a libertarian web site - the freaking Reason Foundation's magazine's web site - and now matter how hard I try to stick to empirical discussions, someone will accuse me of racism if my opinion is too far from party line.
Rock & Roll grew out of the Jitterbugs and the Charleston Flapper dances of the Benny Goodman, Tommy Dorsey, and Glenn Miller variety. (They all looked Caucasian to me.)
Forensic II -
Touche!
(Maybe I should've also said that Pepsi fattens the world's ass with Frito-Lay, instead of "kicks")
Joe is right! KFC in Egypt or Jordan has all its chicken flown over from farms in Kansas.
Either that, or the chickens make those flights all by themselves, arriving in Egypt, Jordan, or elsewhere, dead tired, but ready for slaughter and box lunches.
And by doing so, KFC has put Middle-eastern chicken farmers out of business.
That, or there never were any chickens in the middle east to begin with, you see.
(Excuse me while I remove tongue from cheek.)
WHY DID THE CHICKEN CROSS THE ROAD?
Charles Darwin's answer:
Depends on what came first;
the chicken or the road.
Clint Eastwood's answer:
To make my day.
Colonel Sanders' answer:
What!? I missed one?
joe:
can you provide any evidence that Yum! foods is being subsidized?
b/c i certainly wasn't aware that subsidies of high enough levels to actually lower market prices were going on, i would think that'd cost a LOT.
Vik is absolutely right to point to the tremendous improvement first GATT and the the WTO has brought to international trade -- not compared to a hypothetical libertarian model, but compared to the genuine mercantilism and protectionism we had before. My concern, frankly, is that for various reasons we may have reached the high water mark for free trade while being only dimly aware of it.
The story of the current episode of globalization has its roots in a prior, failed episode that occurred a century ago. In the decades prior to World War I, the Industrial Revolution made possible a level of international economic integration that rivaled, and in some respects exceeded, our present situation. In that first world economy, unlike in our own, technology was indeed the driving force. Although political conditions grew progressively more hostile, plummeting transportation costs and radically improved communications unleashed worldwide movements of goods, services, capital, and people on an historically unprecedented scale. ?The Weight of the Past (.pdf) (HTML): Chapter I, Against the Dead Hand: The Uncertain Struggle for Global Capitalism by Brink Lindsey
Makes good sense to me.
When my inlaws from the developing world (Ecuador, specifically) visit, they want to shop, shop, shop, buying as much stuff in American stores as they can stuff in their bags, and then some. They love Walmart, K-Mart, Target, and the now-defunct Pick & Save (Big! Lots now).
Excellent points, Steve!
My gosh, isn't that exactly how numerous Asian countries acquired CARS, BLUE JEANS, WASHING MACHINES, REFRIGERATORS, AIRPLANES, TELEPHONES (the round-dial kind) etc., over the past 100 years or so?
Those things were not invented in the East.
And isn't that exactly how the West acquired ASTRONOMY, MATHEMATICS (ALGEBRA), LOGIC, OPTICS, SOPHISTICATED MEDICINE, and a host of other marvels over the past 1000 years or so?
Those things were not invented in the West.
Cultural, scientific, and practical interchange is a wonderful two-way street, the world over. No one nation has a monopoly over this transactional phenomenon. And in the end, the whole globe is but the better for it.
(Some imperialism!)
"Omnipresent amid all the frenzy of Shanghai is that famous portrait, that modern icon. The faintly smiling, bland yet somehow threatening visage appears in brilliant red hues on placards and posters and is painted huge on the sides of buildings. Some call him a genius. Others blame him for the deaths of millions. There are those who say his military reputation was inflated, yet he conquered the mainland in short order. Yes, it's Colonel Sanders." Eat the Rich by P. J. O'Rourke
"Makes me wonder how much longer I'll continue posting here." -- thoreau.
No, no, please, thoreau! Don't go! Those purist idiots who occasionally post here are few and far between.
We know you are a sensitive man, but please don't get your nose all out of joint just because some morons shitbag the rest of us, the minute we don't toe their line of "ultimate ideological perfection."
Just ignore them.
This is definitely one of those cases where "if you ignore it, it'll go away." Simply don't respond to their vitriol. They'll then feel like they don't exist, and they'll evaporate like so much digital GIGO in cyber space.
I've noticed that most, if not all, of those posters are obvious trollers -- writing primarily to see if they can get your goat. Please don't let them get yours, thoreau! Your contributions to this site have been all too valuable over the years, to now suddenly disappear.
You make a lot of sense. You get us to thinking. We've learned so much from you lately. And it surely has added to our intellectual growth. If you should go away, you'd be sorely missed, and H & R definitely won't be the same.
Won't you stay? Please?
Thanks,
On behalf of your many reason readers ...
Yep, don't go thoreau. Admittingly, I am a lefty disenchanted with some of the liberal mantra. At the suggestion of libertarian friends, I have been reading many of the posts on Reason and it has helped change some of my points of view. I think I started this whole series of posts based off my perception of a future of world homogenization via globalization. Many posts helped me recognize some of my one dimensional thinking and have given me insight to expand on. Even some of the more "purists" responses are beneficial to a degree, if name calling comes into play, well, it goes to show even the most purists maintain a certain level of ignorance that no amount of wordsmithing can hide.
Right now I am not pretending to be a libertarian or a free market purist, so there is no need to invoke the LINO rule (Lib in name only) and have me removed from Reason. So if anyone wants to give a constructive point of view, I am all ears (or eyes) and open minded 🙂
And yes, Madog, its a bit disheartening to go to a fav vacation spot only to see main street USA, it has a way of defeating the purpose of the vacation. However, if some of my fav vacation spots can come to main street USA, then I have something more to work with. In the meantime, I still don't plan on being in the way of a developing nation.
James-
Welcome to the club of recovering leftists who have headed down the libertarian road. We might not make it all the way to the 12th step where we embrace Ayn Rand as our higher power, but we've admitted that we have a problem, and we are seeking market-based solutions. Steps 1 and 2!
As for cultural homogeneity, I think it's great to learn that even the Iranians and Afghans just love that old kind of rock and roll (let's face it, that kind of music just soothes the soul!).
Sure, there's a handful of mullahs shouting "Hey, you darn kids, get off my lawn!" But based on recent protests it appears that most young Iranians would rather march into the 21st century, sample the best of what each culture has to offer, and use the power of the market to enrich themselves and spread to the rest of the world the best of their culture's contributions. As somebody who believes that personal freedom, free trade, and voluntary cultural exchange (as in both parties contributing some of their culture to the other) are the world's best hopes for peace, I believe in the diversity of a melting pot, not the diversity of isolated, untainted cultural time capsules.
Whoever the "Kevin Carson" was that posted at 0720, it wasn't me. Oddly enough, though, I agreed with the comment, except for the snippy part at the end.
I was shopping there with K?s sister and his 18 year old nephew and 22 year old niece. Just outside the stores, we were approached by a whispering man who I automatically ignored. It was a bit like being approached on the streets of New York by men whispering ?Pot, pot, pot?? K?s niece and nephew, however, did not ignore the whispering. They responded to the man who then produced a list of CDs and video CDs that he had for sale. They bought two Metallica video CDs, I bought Madonna?s American Life. I just could not resist the opportunity.
Later that evening we all sang along to American Life: K?s nieces and nephews know every word of the song. View from Iran: American Life
CharlesWT: is your use of the name K there a reference to Kafka?
Jacob, I don't know the name "K" represents. My impression is that the author of the blog, View from Iran, believes that her husband's name is distinctive enough that she would risk losing their anonymity if she used it. Not an idle concern in Iran. Especially so since he is a Persian language blogger.
James,
You wrote -
"And yes, Madog, its a bit disheartening to go to a fav vacation spot only to see main street USA," etc.
No offense, but i am really looking forward to the day my hometown in India looks like main street USA. I suspect that a lot of people over there feel the same way too. Once you stop waxing romantic over the quaintness of things, you realize that a good deal of it is poverty and not some incredibly alien & wonderful cultural trait.
"all too valuable over the years,"
Um, I hope you mean over the months. Maybe somebody else had been posting under that pseudonym before me, but I've only posted under that pseudonym for a few months now.
And I guess I will try the "ignore purist idiot" tactic from now on. Thanks.
The 'globalization: pro or con" question is about much more than cultural imperialism, but that's the part I've spent some time thinking about.
Much of the liberal rhetoric about cultural homogenization is patronizing in the extreme. Simply put, the developing world can take care of itself.
- In the Philippines, local fast food chain Jollibee beats KFC by making better chicken (you can get it in California now, too).
- In Taiwan, there's a 7-11 on every block, but the local delicacies in the night market seem to be selling just fine.
- Taiwan also has plenty of Starbucks. Are the pearl tea shops going anywhere? Only to America, where they're catching on big time.
I suspect that, like much of what Westerners have had to say about the non-Western world over the centuries, the perception that cultures are being steamrollered by the West has more to do with Westerners' own expectations than anything else.
For many of us, the essence of a foreign culture is that it bears no resemblance to our own. So the sight of one McDonald's in, say, China spoils the whole thing: The culture is gone.
In reality, those cultures are evolving, just as liberals demand that our own culture evolves. The West absorbs immigrants and pearl tea and the developing world absorbs foreign investment and KFC. Anti-globalization folks should respect them enough to acknowledge they can find their own way.
"The US gov't using its clout to bring about arrangements that give US corporations an advantage (an advantage relative to what the situation would be if individuals were making truly free choices) can produce a lot of bad things."
Frankly, the worst aspect would be wasting US taxpayer dollers in the interest of one or more companies.
What's a "truely free choice", anyway? More choices are better than less, IMO.
If KFC is US gov subsidized in Jordan (or where ever), that favors KFC and that favors the Jordanian people (or whom ever), but it wastes my tax dollars. Sure, some people in Jordan will be hurt by the additional access to cheap, good food. But on balance, most Jordans will be better off. And in any case, they still have a choice: the nefarious plans of KFC & the US gov will fall through if Jordanians don't choose to buy KFC.
Duh, Don! What was your first clue?
". . . its a bit disheartening to go to a fav vacation spot only to see main street USA, . . ."
What if the locals feel differently? Shouldn't they have the chance to choose what they like, as well?
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