Under the Lip vs. Into the Lungs

Today Brad Rodu, a University of Alabama oral pathologist, is scheduled to testify before a House subcommittee about his efforts to promote oral snuff as a much safer alternative to cigarette smoking. Rodu's work is interesting because it reveals a split within the anti-smoking movement between pragmatists open to "harm reduction" and moralists who insist on complete abstinence from tobacco products. Early on he was condemned by the anti-smoking establishment, but his point of view is beginning to gain support in some surprising places.

Comments

[Robert Nabors]

Remember, immediate effect can be a good thing.

Case in point - higher tar in cannabis.

You don't see anywhere near the number of pot heads with lung disease in hospitals. Reason why? Marijuana is specifically grown for very high potency. No one really wants to inhale burning plants that make you cough and gag, be it mary jane or tobacco, but it's tolerated 'till you can get what you want, be it the high, or the nico buzz.

Consider - what if a ciggarette or cigar was created that had 2 packs woth of niccotine? Well, not accounting for health effects of niccotine in and of itself, the medical damage would go down, from lesser exposure to extranious effects.

-Robert

[Charlie]

Of course I am not a researcher, but I find it hard to believe that snuff does not have any deleterious effect on the heart or that its health risks are significantly less than smoked tobacco. I have only my personal experience to offer support for this.

I have consumed tobacco products for almost 20 years (cigars, cigarettes, pipe AND dip) and I would have to say that dipping skoal (which I have been doing for the past 2 years) seems to have the most profound immediate cardiovascular effect of all. I can feel its effect on my pulse and blood pressure almost as soon as I dip and with far more intensity. How can this not be affecting my heart or contributing to hypertension?

But this is all beside the point. The issue we're discussing is that the anti-smoking lobby is really an anti-tobacco moralistic crusade that uses the health risk reduction argument to promote its cause.

I am only cautiously suggesting that while this posting exposes the rhetoric of the anti tobacco camp for what it is, smokeless tobacco has not received the medical scrutiny that cigarettes have. It may be premature to say that the risks are reduced. Obviously the risks are different, and one could say that tooth loss is less severe than emphysema, but what is the full range of snuff's side effects?

I guess what I'm saying is, to call dip "much safer" than smoking when what we really mean is that it's "potentially less harmful" is to engage in the same rhetorical shenanigans that anti-tobacco activists employ.

[Jacob]

Charlie, if you follow the link on the word "support," you'll find links to several discussions of oral snuff's health effects, including Rodu's 1995 book on the subject. You're right that snuff has not been investigated as extensively as cigarette smoking. But it's quite clear from the epidemiological data that snuff users face much lower risks than cigarette smokers do.

[Mike Barry]

Hi my name is Mike Barry and I dipped Skoal smokeless tobacco for 3 years and then quit. I quit because I noticed gingival recession from my lower and upper teeth. After quitting, a couple of months later I decided to have another dip. I left it in for about 45 minutes and when I took it out I realized that my lip felt different. Not for the better. That dip either caused a neurological reaction or damaged the mucosa and or frenum tissue. But what occured was that I had lost control to my lower lip. This makes it very hard to articulate. I think I have lost some suction strength because straws are harder to use and holding things between my lips is difficult. It has been 2 years since this has occured and it hasn't gotten better. I've seen a periodontist, an oral surgeon, a plastic surgeon, a neurologist, and an oral pathologist. What has been done so far is I've had 4 free gingival grafts. This didn't really help because the problem still persists. I'm right now determining the benefits of alloderm. My periodontist thinks that it will make it worse. Because it drops the whole musculature inlying in the mucosa and the frenum. I'm also going to a speech pathologist and I'm currently doing a button pull exercise and lip exercises. If there is some sort of doctor who knows what I'm talking about or is willing to help that would be great. It seems very complicated. If you have any information on this that would be nice. My email is [e-mail] and my phone # is 401-297-9296 and I live in Portsmouth RI 11 Holman st. 02871

[tyler fox]

am i the first person to be in this website

[Concerned Wife]

I just found out today that my husband has been lying to me for over a year about stopping dipping.. We both quit smoking a year ago and today my son let the cat out of the bag that dad never did stop dipping.. The kids brought in 29 empty cans of skoal from the woods... I am crushed !! We have been married for 16 years and I can't believe that our marriage is based on lies..

[Henry A. Raines DDS]

I am a general dentist in a small country town in Georgia and many of my good old boys dip.

If you dip, don't keep in in the same place all the time. Move it around, _especially_ if you feel any burning in the tissue. Remember there is sugar in dip and it will give you cavities everywhere, especially at the gum line, so if you are dipper you have to be a good brusher and go to the dentist before these small cavities become big ones - think of it as part of the price of the addiction.

And for Heaven's sake, quit gobbing it in. It's powerful stuff and you only need a little bit. Give it a rest between dips. Keeping it in your mouth all day long is overkill, is not necessary, and ultimately, if you are a "morning till night" user you have no chance in heck of backing off and quitting.

We all do the best we can.

[Ty]

Ty dips.

[Lucy]

I packed a lip for the first time. It was pretty cool. We used Skoal - which I think is pretty popular. I deffinately felt a buzz after dipping... kind of dizzy, relaxed, and loose. Is that what everyone feels?