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Palin Didn't Know Africa Was a Continent Source a Hoaxster
Turns out the most ridiculous and generic "dumb polack
joke"-style accusation about the dimness of Sarah Palin's
bulb--that she thought Africa was a country, not a continent--was
probably from an interesting and amusing hoax advisor to the McCain
campaign--from the nonexistent "Harding Institute for Freedom and
Democracy"--going by the phony name (which is also the
real name of another minor D.C. policy dude, unrelated to the
hoax nope, there is a minor policy dude named "Michael
Eisenstadt") of "Martin Eisenstadt."
The New York Times has the details, including some earlier lies he had told (and been caught up on).
The front "Harding Institute" site, with the brilliantly conceived line: "Welcome to the homepage of The Harding Institute for Freedom and Democracy. A Washington-area think-tank in the truest sense of the words...."
"Eisenstadt" on YouTube.
UPDATE: As I said, "probably." The New York Times story certainly reads as if Eisenstadt both was the original source of the Africa story, and recently admitted publicly being so. This AP story states--without any details backing it up, though one presumes he got the Fox reporter to say, no, his source was someone other than "Eisenstadt," and the only hoax was Eisenstadt claiming credit for it. Without a named source, I'm inclined to wonder about that as well. But if so, the mere claiming credit for the leak, as opposed to being the leak, is a pretty weak and lame finale to an otherwise interesting fake career.
anon|11.13.08 @ 11:30AM|#
maybe I didn't read it carefully enough but:
was the leak about the africa story real, but the attribution was
phony?
or was the leak itself phony from the start?
Naga Sadow|11.13.08 @ 11:33AM|#
Hmmmm . . . I wasn't aware you could pull a verbal rickroll. Important info to keep in mind.
Mike M.|11.13.08 @ 11:38AM|#
The "leak" itself was phony from the start. Palin may not be any kind of genius, but honestly, even many of the liberals I know who don't like her didn't believe that she was really that stupid.
|11.13.08 @ 11:39AM|#
Ditto what anon said. It wasn't clear to me whether the hoax was the leak itself, or the claimed credit for the leak.
|11.13.08 @ 11:41AM|#
You are all fucked up.
The story was leaked to Fox (Carl Cameron)--not a hoax,
AFAWK.
THEN, this bozo came to MSNBC and said he had leaked the story.
THAT was the hoax.
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 11:42AM|#
The funniest part is that many people couldn't tell it was fake
until the curtain was lifted.
She's that stupid.
Not that I didn't think it was fake. It was just too good to be
true.
|11.13.08 @ 11:43AM|#
So, we have yet another Palin 'fact', breathlessly reported by
the mainstream media, which turns out to be complete bullshit. So
far, a good 90% of the smears leveled against her have turned out
to be wrong or gross exaggerations. Way to go, media.
Next up, the whole "$150,000 wardrobe" fiasco. Palin gave her
version of it yesterday - she had no say in the matter, it was all
planned by the RNC with image consultants and stylists, who were
already hired and ordering wardrobe for her before she even got to
the convention. She asked for none of it, never felt it was her
property in the first place, and doesn't have any of it now.
That's her version, anyway. But I'm willing to bet that when the
smoke clears on this one, she'll once again be proved right.
|11.13.08 @ 11:44AM|#
If you had followed the link from Drudge(!!) you'd have gotten
it right.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081113/ap_en_tv/palin_hoax_1
"The hoax was limited to the identity of the source in the story
about Palin - not the Fox News story itself. While Palin has denied
that she mistook Africa for a country, the veracity of that report
was not put in question by the revelation that Eisenstadt is a
phony."
So, Brian, lose your boner for Sarah--she IS an idiot. Or do you
like dumb chicks?
|11.13.08 @ 11:45AM|#
You guys are so hot for this moron that simple English seems
beyond your grasp.
She must be contagious.
|11.13.08 @ 11:49AM|#
No, motherfucker, it is me--the guy who can't stand people
falling over themselves, erroneously, to apologize for this
mediocrity.
Let's see how long it take Brian to correct himself.
Martin Eisenstadt|11.13.08 @ 11:49AM|#
You all misinterpreted the story. I am real (obviously), but the attribution of the Africa story to me was a hoax perpetrated by the FAKE Harding Institute pranksters. The real Harding Institute has no affiliation with them AT ALL, and we are weighing our legal options against them.
|11.13.08 @ 11:55AM|#
henry - kill yourself. Who's the one who looks like a rude
jackass and burning misanthrope from so small of an issue?
You lost your dignity over nothing.
|11.13.08 @ 11:55AM|#
Dude, I was here long before you--quit trying to change the subject, which is inability of a supposed editor of Reason to understand the story he is purporting to blog about (the same inability of some of the posters here is not as surprising).
|11.13.08 @ 11:55AM|#
While Palin has denied that she mistook Africa for a
country, the veracity of that report was not put in question by the
revelation that Eisenstadt is a phony.
So let me get this straight:
Palin has denied the story (for that's worth, which isn't
much).
The source of the story is a known hoaxster.
Exactly what basis do we have for believing the story is true,
again? How on earth can you say with a straight face that a story
that comes from somebody running a hoax website, that has no other
apparent attribution whatsoever, is still legit?
Hell, even MSNBC is admitting that it shouldn't have gone with
it.
An MSNBC spokesman, Jeremy Gaines, explained the network's
misstep by saying someone in the newsroom received the Palin item
in an e-mail message from a colleague and assumed it had been
checked out. "It had not been vetted," he said. "It should not have
made air."
|11.13.08 @ 11:56AM|#
"The funniest part is that many people couldn't tell it was fake
until the curtain was lifted.
She's that stupid."
No the funny part is that people like you are such ignorant, faux
sophisticate provincial morons that you will believe anything about
anyone you have decided is not university enough for you. Palin has
been a wonderful litmus test to bring out the semi-literate
wannabes and give them a reason to feel better about themselves. If
it wasn't for the myth of Palin, who would you, MO and BDB have to
feel superior to?
stuartl|11.13.08 @ 11:56AM|#
It is amazing to me that people still fall for the 'all dems are
smart and all repubs are dumb' story. It is as real as the 'all
repubs are hawks and all dems are doves.'
Look at Joe Biden, he is a counterexample to both.
thoreau|11.13.08 @ 11:59AM|#
I figured it was probably fake before I knew anything about the source. Aside from the fact that it seemed too dumb even for Palin, I assumed that any nasty post-defeat revelations about Palin would have to be taken with a grain of salt: When a team loses, and the political attack dogs are out of work and looking for a culprit, why should we expect them to tell the truth about anything?
|11.13.08 @ 12:01PM|#
Oh, a half-assed update--let's see how many here can make heads or tails of it.
economist|11.13.08 @ 12:02PM|#
Oh, shit, henry's back. The quality of trolling here has consistently declined these past few months. Can we please get some respectable trolls back? Joe needs to get back from his vacation soon, and TallDave needs to get off his ass. Hell, at this point, I would even let Dondero back in.
|11.13.08 @ 12:02PM|#
If Carl Cameron (Fox) is not to be believed by you right-wing apologists for mediocrity, who is? Joseph Goebbels?
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 12:03PM|#
No the funny part is that people like you are such ignorant,
faux sophisticate provincial morons that you will believe anything
about anyone you have decided is not university enough for you.
Palin has been a wonderful litmus test to bring out the
semi-literate wannabes and give them a reason to feel better about
themselves. If it wasn't for the myth of Palin, who would you, MO
and BDB have to feel superior to?
John is saucy today.
He had Grape-Nuts on his Wheaties. Keeps him regular.
Henry, it turns out, is also right on the merits, but such a
complete douche that nobody, including me, actually cares.
|11.13.08 @ 12:03PM|#
Yeah, I know--YOU guys were hoax by Brian, so I'M the bad guy. Whatever, fools.
economist|11.13.08 @ 12:03PM|#
Is henry c.o.'s alter ego? I just ask because their posts tend to have the same style. They want to sound like pure venom, but it comes off with them sounding like morons.
economist|11.13.08 @ 12:05PM|#
Seriously, henry, what happened to you to make you such a complete douche?
the innominate one|11.13.08 @ 12:06PM|#
If it wasn't for the myth of Palin, who would you, MO and
BDB have to feel superior to?
well, there is always you, John.
economist|11.13.08 @ 12:08PM|#
cretinous jackanapes make me miss joe, so now I hate them twice as much.
|11.13.08 @ 12:08PM|#
Cool, now I have people using my nym for fake posts ("Why won't
people agree with me?")--the highest form of flattery, they
say.
Palin apologists, unite--you have nothing to lose but your
intellects.
|11.13.08 @ 12:10PM|#
I am continuously astonished that people can hate/love/care about politicians so much. Especially Palin. What the fuck is wrong with some of you?
|11.13.08 @ 12:10PM|#
I guess other folks are slow as well:
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2008/11/palin_deserves_an_apology.html
You're all so EAGER to embrace this dimbulb--amazing.
|11.13.08 @ 12:11PM|#
I actually know a girl who went to UPenn and is now a medical doctor who referred to Africa as a country to me before. I don't see how it is that much more of a gaffe than 57 states. The whole Palin smear think has stunk of establishment bias from the start. I watched Palin's Alaskan Governor debate when she got picked. There was nothing particularly impressive or embarrassing about her performance. Her IQ seemed on par with Obama, McCain, and Biden, none of whom would be classified by any objective observer as some kind of mental titan. Her problem was being a woman, not being from the Beltway, and talking with an accent.
|11.13.08 @ 12:14PM|#
It's kind of cute, sort of like having a rabid hamster. He wails and gnashes his teeth, but in the end he's just a widdle hamster.
economist|11.13.08 @ 12:14PM|#
I'm no Palin defender. You're just a giant douche, henry. Sorry to be the one to tell you.
|11.13.08 @ 12:15PM|#
Ditto economist. henry, look around whatever sad little hovel you occupy, get up from your no doubt ass-imprinted and dingy chair, find some rope and a chair and do the world a favor.
|11.13.08 @ 12:16PM|#
joez Law at work...and it couldn't have happened to a better
person!
Henry said:
My God, you people are illiterate.
Followed by:
Yeah, I know--YOU guys were hoax by Brian, so I'M the bad guy. Whatever, fools.
Proper use of verb tense tends to show the level of literacy of
writer. ;-)
|11.13.08 @ 12:18PM|#
But, I can understand written English, which seems beyond a lot
of you (at least on this subject), so I'll take it.
You know, if I hadn't interjected here, it would have been
interesting so see how long you clowns carried on completely
clueless.
|11.13.08 @ 12:19PM|#
Ban the troll, please.
I am coming to realization that caustic hijacking
"pay-attention-to-me-isms!" really drag down the level of
discourse.
|11.13.08 @ 12:19PM|#
Epi,
The venomous hatred of Palin is fairly plain to me. They are
horrified that the GOP might actually have another folksy charmer
like Reagan or W. They've seen folksy trump technocrat and career
politician four times so far. And of course the anger that people
actually like Palin where they couldn't stand Hilary.
|11.13.08 @ 12:21PM|#
Yes, Yerbaff, but grade C typing skills (literally) are an
answer to all the idiocy so willingly swallowed in this thread
previously.
I know you are all embarrassed by your gullibility, but repeated
posts shooting the messenger only highlight it.
Face it--you fucked up, guys. The early posts in this thread (I
KNEW IT!) are a joke.
|11.13.08 @ 12:22PM|#
Yeah, ban the guy who actually bothered to read before
posting--makes sense.
So much for "Reason".
|11.13.08 @ 12:25PM|#
DRINK!
I'd rather have the Anarchrist around here than you, henry. Hell,
give me Dan T...give me Jersey McJones! At least he was
entertaining.
|11.13.08 @ 12:26PM|#
Just as soon as he boasts that he's better read on libertarianism than anyone else here, I will totally have my troll bingo card finished.
Citizen Nothing|11.13.08 @ 12:26PM|#
I still think we should ignore all trolls who don't post in
limerick form.
But, hey. That's just me.
|11.13.08 @ 12:26PM|#
They are horrified that the GOP might actually have another
folksy charmer like Reagan or W
I guess, but (and I don't want to go Feministing you here, but you
can take it), I smell misogyny in the form of "dumb bimbo".
She can't be that dumb and be where she is in life.
Sorry.
|11.13.08 @ 12:26PM|#
Just as soon as he boasts that he's better read on
libertarianism than anyone else here, I will totally have my troll
bingo card finished.
A-3
the innominate one|11.13.08 @ 12:28PM|#
She can't be that dumb and be where she is in
life.
does that apply to Bush also?
Abdul|11.13.08 @ 12:28PM|#
The joke's on Max Eisenstadt because Africa is not really a continent or a country, it's a song by Toto.
|11.13.08 @ 12:30PM|#
Episiarch--
Have you ever been to Alaska?
henry, have you ever been to a Turkish Prison?
|11.13.08 @ 12:32PM|#
I have a better Palin game. Supply the caption to this photo
which the NYT is currently running:
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/11/13/world/13palin-600a.jpg
Will|11.13.08 @ 12:32PM|#
henry,
The question everyone is dying for the answer to: Are you "teh
concerned observer"?
Naga Sadow|11.13.08 @ 12:33PM|#
Damn you Edward! How many times do I have to say it? Take a Zanax and relax. Christ! You're gonna have a coronary just from typing.
|11.13.08 @ 12:34PM|#
Whew, otherwise they would have had to cancel her guest appearance on "Are you Smarter than a 5th Grader?"
|11.13.08 @ 12:34PM|#
The fascinating thing is not whether she's actually dumb or not*
but rather the desperate need for leftists to prove she's dumb in
order to neutralize her. They wouldn't spend this much energy on
someone who wasn't perceived as a threat.
Which is stupider? Being Sarah Palin or being petrified of Sarah
Palin?
*I personally think she's probably not all that bright, and she
certainly doesn't have the guile required for big time
politics.
|11.13.08 @ 12:35PM|#
Damn you Edward! How many times do I have to say it? Take a
Zanax and relax
Xanax, Naga. Xanax. It's important to get your
drugs right.
And Valium is better.
Cable News|11.13.08 @ 12:36PM|#
Without a named source, I'm inclined to wonder
We're not. More, please, and the stupider the better.
24 is a lot of hours to fill. Please don't make us focus on the new
president.
|11.13.08 @ 12:38PM|#
There once was henry the troll
who made everybody lol
and when we're wailin
on sarah palin
he's such a stupid ass hole
|11.13.08 @ 12:39PM|#
I smell misogyny in the form of "dumb bimbo".
But can it compare to the horrific sexism
of movie trailers?
the innominate one|11.13.08 @ 12:39PM|#
other than getting overly worked up, it's hard to see henry's sin that called for such a dogpile
|11.13.08 @ 12:40PM|#
This AP story states--without any details backing it up,
though one presumes he got the Fox reporter to say, no, his source
was someone other than "Eisenstadt," and the only hoax was
Eisenstadt claiming credit for it.
So, on the one hand, we have "Eisenstadt" apparently claiming to be
the source, and on the other we have a Fox reporter covering his
ass by saying somebody else was the source, but giving no
indication as to who the real source was, and giving no
corroboration for the story.
Why would anybody believe the Fox reporter here?
And why do I find it so funny that people who ordinarily dismiss
Fox out of hand are now citing an (at best) anonymous,
uncorroborated Fox report as gospel truth?
|11.13.08 @ 12:41PM|#
And we're safe ladies and gentlemen! henry won't be bothering us anymore. I chased him off... with my nudity. Does that arouse anyone here?
|11.13.08 @ 12:43PM|#
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/11/13/world/13palin-600a.jpg
"...and then I realized that henry had stretched his anus out to
this width. I sat back in amazement and terror as he inserted his
entire head into his anus. I had no idea he was that flexible. Sure
proved me wrong, dontchaknow."
henry\'s mom|11.13.08 @ 12:43PM|#
I'm so worried about my son. He won't go to school, he just locks himself in his room screaming obscenities at his computer.
|11.13.08 @ 12:44PM|#
I peed on their goddess--that has gotten people slaughtered for
eons.
Hey, for all I know the story WAS false--but people are LOOKING for
reasons to label it false, which is pathetic for a site of this
type.
"Reason" indeed.
There\'s no story here|11.13.08 @ 12:45PM|#
Look, here's what happened:
1. Carl Cameron claims, based on unnamed sources, that Palin didn't
know Africa was a continent.
2. "Martin Eisenstadt" claims that he is the source of the rumor,
and that the story was a fabrication.
3. Eisenstadt himself is revealed as a hoax.
4. Cameron claims that Eisenstadt was not his source.
There are at least two different ways you could interpret these
events:
A. Eisenstadt had nothing to do with the initial rumor.
Cameron heard the story from some other, still unnamed, source and
reported it. Eisenstadt opportunistically claimed credit for his
own reasons (maybe to try to discredit Cameron, maybe just to sow
confusion, who knows).
B. Cameron is lying to cover up his being hoaxed.
Cameron heard the story from Eisenstadt and then reported it. After
Eisenstadt's deception was revealed, Cameron lied that Eisenstadt
wasn't his source.
Both stories seem plausible to me, but I don't understand why
anyone would put much weight on either of them. The only reason to
put any credit in story B is the claim by "Eisenstadt," an
anonymous hoaxster who is a known and admitted liar.
And even if story A is completely true, it doesn't provide any good
reason to believe the underlying rumor. An angry, bitter, unnamed
source from inside the sharply divided McCain-Palin campaign
related a fairly extreme story about Palin's ignorance. Even if you
believe Cameron accurately relayed his source's story, what good
reason is there to believe that this unnamed source is telling the
truth?
|11.13.08 @ 12:46PM|#
the innominate one,
I think he just was the last in a critical mass of half-literate
spew trolling that has been building up since the election. He
stood up in front of the dart board; I don't care how many he gets
in the eye.
Cable News|11.13.08 @ 12:46PM|#
"Sources?"
We don't have no sources.
We don't need no stinking sources!
Will|11.13.08 @ 12:48PM|#
henry,
You obviously don't read here much. Sarah Palin isn't a "goddess"
to anyone here.
|11.13.08 @ 12:48PM|#
"Even if you believe Cameron accurately relayed his source's
story, what good reason is there to believe that this unnamed
source is telling the truth?"
That is always an issue--you have to judge by the previous
credibility and thoroughness of a reporter in vetting their
sources.
So what is new about this?
Naga Sadow|11.13.08 @ 12:51PM|#
Sorry Epi. As you know, prescription pills don't seem to work on me that well. Not an excuse for my ignorance . . . just a good reason.
|11.13.08 @ 12:51PM|#
Actually, if this story was shown to be false, that would be
great, wouldn't it? After all of Fox's yammering about Rather, it
would be highly enjoyable.
I can't lose here!
Carl Cameron|11.13.08 @ 12:52PM|#
By the way, people believe what they want to believe, but you
all know that.
That's the secret to our success. Just ask Bill O'Reilly. Keith
Olbermann. Chris Matthews...
Truth? You're being old-fashioned. Truth is for pussies.
|11.13.08 @ 12:53PM|#
Will,
Since we aren't blathering about what kind of dog Obama's going to
get, we have to be a cabal of secret Republicans. Sorry,
"Rethuglicans."
Anyway, I'm done providing him stroke material.
|11.13.08 @ 12:55PM|#
SugarFree--
When Drudge didn't have it under a flashing light, you should have
known--admit it.
Let's chip in and get Brian a flashing light of his own.
|11.13.08 @ 1:09PM|#
Anyway, I'm done providing him stroke material.
Hey, you haven't shown any of us your ass yet. Take it off! Take it
off!
There\'s no story here|11.13.08 @ 1:12PM|#
"That is always an issue--you have to judge by the previous
credibility and thoroughness of a reporter in vetting their
sources.
So what is new about this?"
Nothing new about it at all. But the journalist's credibility needs
to be weighed against other relevant factors. More extreme claims
and sources with known biases demand a greater degree of
credibility from the journalist.
In this case, the rumor claims a fairly extreme level of ignorance,
and its anonymous source was allegedly a disgruntled member of the
McCain campaign.
Does Carl Cameron have an long and unblemished history of
anonymously sourced stories that are later shown to be accurate? If
so, then maybe the rumor deserves some weight. But I haven't heard
anyone suggesting such a thing.
|11.13.08 @ 1:14PM|#
If it wasn't for the myth of Palin, who would you, MO and
BDB have to feel superior to?
There's always you. I didn't need the Africa story for me to feel
that Palin wasn't ready for the VP slot. She's a fine local
politician, but there's a huge difference between local issues and
national issues. When you throw in the way she mismanaged Wasilla's
budget, the shady ethics and the fact that she worked in a state
with a huge financial safety net, all signs point to not ready for
prime time.
Jindal was smart enough to see that, Palin wasn't.
Just because people disagree with you, John, doesn't mean that I'm
a troll. At least I provide links and sources for my statements,
and not just ones that are ideologically amenable to me.
There\'s no story here|11.13.08 @ 1:18PM|#
R C Dean pretty much nailed it, above.
Palin-haters are willing to accept a Fox news reporters unsourced
claims as gospel truth.
Palin-lovers are willing to accept the word of an anonymous
hoaxster that he is the source.
There's no good reason to believe the original rumor spread by
Cameron. But there's no reason to believe "Eisenstadt" either.
Citizen Nothing|11.13.08 @ 1:24PM|#
"It would blind you with its German-Irish glory."
SF, is your real name Lance Holdger, by any chance?
www.theonion.com/content/node/29886
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 1:26PM|#
Palin-haters are willing to accept a Fox news reporters
unsourced claims as gospel truth.
Palin-lovers are willing to accept the word of an anonymous
hoaxster that he is the source.
And so, Palin-haters like me who thought that the story was
bullshit to begin with, source or otherwise...where do we sit?
|11.13.08 @ 1:31PM|#
Ele,
Where do you sit? In the STFU corner with the rest of the
wiseacres. And Palin-lovers who still believe the story have to
spend the night in Stop-hitting-yourself-stop-hitting-yourself
Alley.
|11.13.08 @ 1:35PM|#
No. My ass is better than that.
You're still competing with me and still failing, I see. You should
really try to control your obsession.
j sizzle|11.13.08 @ 1:43PM|#
the henry says, "I can't lose
here!"
Really? The grand prize for "winning" this discussion is that
Rathergate is somehow avenged? Oh, you can lose,
henry. For instance, you could still be whining
about some event that happened during the 2004 election. Everyone
would look at you and say, "henry's a weirdo."
That would be losing.
|11.13.08 @ 1:48PM|#
I know all. I even know about your dacryphilia.
But at least you are better off than this guy:
Under the terms of the order, Arobieke was banned from touching, feeling or measuring muscles, asking people to do squat exercises in public, entering the towns of St Helens, Warrington or Widnes without police permission and loitering near schools, gyms or sports clubs.
zoltan|11.13.08 @ 1:51PM|#
She certainly doesn't have enough guile for national office. When asked about the whole Bridge to Nowhere fiasco she had no slick answers for it. Of course, there was no taking of responsibility for it either. She's more like your annoyingly earnest, do-nothing aunt than anything else.
|11.13.08 @ 1:51PM|#
I rather think that Palin is neither stupid nor brilliant. I
think she's got more common sense than Biden, but that's a low
bar.
On the flip side, I think something fundamentally screwed up has
happened when people think politicians are geniuses. That's so rare
as to be presumptively false. Clinton, for instance, is bright, but
he's no genius. I think the same can be said of Obama, who I'd say
is less intelligent than Clinton.
The GOP has had its share of smart candidates and politicians, but
Democrats almost universally insist that everyone the GOP runs is
stupid. Don't get that logic--why can't they be, say, smart yet
evil? Or why can't the Democratic candidates be not-so-smart but
good? Even Wile E. Coyote would appoint and rely on smart staffers,
so intelligence is perhaps not so important as common sense and the
ability to make good decisions.
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 1:59PM|#
In the STFU corner with the rest of the
wiseacres.
Wiseacre...I learned a new word today. Etymologically, shares the
same root with "wizard". Interesting.
Nobody|11.13.08 @ 2:01PM|#
"No. My ass is better than that."
"You're still competing with me and still failing."
Just because your ass is bleeding doesn't mean you're the front
dog.
economist|11.13.08 @ 2:12PM|#
This is quite impressive. Almost 100 comments inspired by the exchange with "henry".
|11.13.08 @ 2:15PM|#
Ele,
Cool. I love passing words onto people. I was one of those weird
kids who would look up a word in the dictionary and then spend ten
minutes reading the next three pages and looking up words I didn't
know.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 2:16PM|#
I'm still trying to figure out how I got dragged into this. I don't recall saying anything about the Africa story.
|11.13.08 @ 2:22PM|#
I was one of those weird kids who would look up a word in
the dictionary and then spend ten minutes reading the next three
pages and looking up words I didn't know.
Total. Fucking. Nerd. What else, playing Star Frontiers
with your imaginary friends?
economist|11.13.08 @ 2:22PM|#
BDB,
Don't worry too much over it. Most of the annoyance was directed at
henry.
|11.13.08 @ 2:23PM|#
My take on Palin is that she is a fairly bright person but a
person who is remarkably uncurious.
A trait incidentally that I think she shares with W.
|11.13.08 @ 2:32PM|#
My take on Palin is that she is a fairly bright person but a
person who is remarkably uncurious.
A trait incidentally that I think she shares with W.
I see no reason to agree or disagree. I'm just curious, myself, how
you can tell that someone is "uncurious" or not.
Is Obama or Biden curious or uncurious? How can you tell?
BDB|11.13.08 @ 2:33PM|#
R C Dean, can you defend Palin without shifting to "BUT BIDEN IS
THE STUPID TOO!!"?
Just wondering.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 2:34PM|#
Idiot's Guide to Defending Sarah Palin:
1) Call your opponent sexist
2) Call your opponent an elitist
3) Evade the relevant issue, and talk about Biden
|11.13.08 @ 2:46PM|#
R C Dean
Both Obama or Biden display a wide ranging knowledge about the
world. Essentially they know the things that well-informed people
know. I think Hit and Run commenters fall into that category. Like
what an "Achilles Heel" is.
Palin's version of smarts may have served her well in Alaska local
and state politics but it's not enough for the national game.
Though I'm sure that the "Afica is a country" thing is totally a
myth. After all, the preacher who gave her the blessing to protect
her from witches told her he was from Kenya, a country in Africa.
She has a good memory so she probably retained that one.
|11.13.08 @ 2:46PM|#
"I rather think that Palin is neither stupid nor brilliant. I
think she's got more common sense than Biden, but that's a low
bar."
I think you are exactly right pro. She clearly has something going
for her or she wouldn't have managed to become governor. There are
truly dumb people who reach important positions, but those people
are almost always from rich or well known families and got where
they are because of their connections and name. You can be a
Kennedy and be stupid and get elected to an important position. You
can't be a nobody and get elected governor without having something
going for you.
But Palin is an easy target. She is a Republican. They are always
stupid and racist as you point out. She is from some small town.
All small town people are stupid, even the ones who fly planes,
operate on people, fix cars or do any number of other things that
the clowns who are convinced Palin is a moron couldn't do if their
lives depended on it. She speaks with a funny accent. She doesn't
read the right newspapers and magazines. I think you really have to
go back to the Eisenhower 50s to find in the words of Camille
Paglia the "lock-step parade of bourgeois provincialism, shallow
groupthink and blind prejudice..." that we have seen with Palin.
When someone who actually knows something or impresses me tells me
Palin is stupid or if and when I ever meet the woman and she gives
me reason to think she is stupid, I will change my mind. Until then
I think Paglia, someone who while a bit batty really is smart and
impressive, has it about right.
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 2:46PM|#
Cool. I love passing words onto people. I was one of those
weird kids who would look up a word in the dictionary and then
spend ten minutes reading the next three pages and looking up words
I didn't know.
Me too. I got to pass on 'supererogatory' a month or so ago. I love
words, and am always glad to hear a new one.
LGF Fan|11.13.08 @ 2:49PM|#
"Both Obama or Biden display a wide ranging knowledge about the
world. Essentially they know the things that well-informed people
know. I think Hit and Run commenters fall into that category. Like
what an "Achilles Heel" is.
"
You just hate people from small towns and women!
Obama once said there were 57 states, what about that!?
Just Plain Brian|11.13.08 @ 2:49PM|#
She doesn't read the right newspapers and magazines.
Impossible, she reads them all.
|11.13.08 @ 2:50PM|#
"After all, the preacher who gave her the blessing to protect
her from witches told her he was from Kenya, a country in Africa.
She has a good memory so she probably retained that one."
Now someone is developing evidence. Of course maybe she thought
Kenya was to Africa as say Alaska is to the US. Surely she doesn't
think Alaska a country (although her husband apparently feels it
should be).
What a mind to fathom, eh? Her 4 question news conference today
(the first since hitting the national scene) was really
impressive.
|11.13.08 @ 2:51PM|#
I see no reason to agree or disagree. I'm just curious,
myself, how you can tell that someone is "uncurious" or
not.
Their response to what newspapers or magazines do you read is, "All
of them". Then when pressed for specifics, getting defensive and
saying, "Alaska isn't a foreign country, where it's kind of
suggested, 'Wow, how could you keep in touch with what the rest of
Washington, D.C., may be thinking when you live up there in
Alaska?'"
Sidenote to Governor Palin: you can subscribe to American
newspapers and magazines in foreign countries too, not to mention
reading them on the internet.
|11.13.08 @ 2:52PM|#
LMNOP -- Someone got to be governor of Alaska while being so
stupid and ignorant that they didn't know Africa is a continent.
Riiiiiight.
I'd say anyone who believed such an obvious hit piece is likely a
wee bit ignorant, or at least painfully gullible about
politics.
|11.13.08 @ 2:52PM|#
John, if you wanted to prove your point, why waste your time
using this Palin blivet?
Here's a much better starting place:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/politics/elections/sfl-chi1113tolerance-test,0,6396541.story
Teach,
your children well....
|11.13.08 @ 2:53PM|#
Ele,
Oh, that is a nice one. And apt in our current paroxysm of welfare
state flagellation.
Look at me, talkin' all fancy.
|11.13.08 @ 2:53PM|#
"Both Obama or Biden display a wide ranging knowledge about the
world. Essentially they know the things that well-informed people
know."
Really? That is an interesting question. I would imagine that both
Biden and Obama could tell you what an "Achilles' heel" is. But I
fail to see how that means they know anything. Neither one of them
have ever shown any real knowledge of classical culture. Yeah, they
could tell you what "Achilles heel means" but could they have an
intelligent conversation about the Iliad and its meaning for modern
politics?
I doubt it. Further, what real experience has either one of them
had? Could Obama or Joe Biden tell you anything about what it takes
to run a business? What do they know about tax law or accounting
practices? What do they know about managing people getting people
to work together as a team. Yeah, they have both run campaigns and
bloviated in the Senate but that they never been in charge of
anything.
Lastly, give me five really inciteful things each of them has said.
Not rhetoric, not insulting the other side, but real meaningful
things that made you go "wow I never thought of that". I haven't
heard anything like that at all from either of them. Certainly not
from Biden. Maybe there are some nuggets in Obama's books but there
certainly weren't any in his campaign speeches. Further, since
becoming President elect he hasn't said one thing of note or wisdom
that I have heard.
|11.13.08 @ 2:54PM|#
She clearly has something going for her or she wouldn't have
managed to become governor.
She was elected by a population, half of whom want to be
represented in the senate by a convicted felon.
What's not a myth is that she, to this day, seems incapable of
speaking intelligently about the issues that face the nation.
Whether that's a lack of intelligence or a lack of education is
ultimately moot.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 2:57PM|#
"She clearly has something going for her or she wouldn't have
managed to become governor."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiro_Agnew
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvin_Mandel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Ryan
|11.13.08 @ 2:59PM|#
One other thing Isaac Bartrum. I think you make an interesting point about "things informed people know". We seem to have a low bar for education these days. Knowing what is expected of an informed person seems to entail knowing a few bits about a variety of subjects and being able to bullshit on them. I don't find knowing what an "Achilles heel" is particularly impressive. But you are right about the need to know certain things that all informed people know. The problem is that most of those things are either insignificant trivia or outright bullshit. None of the "informed people" seem to know much about anything beyond looking smart and bullshiting about this or that subject. That fact has a lot to do with many of the troubles we face I think.
Elemenope|11.13.08 @ 2:59PM|#
I'd say anyone who believed such an obvious hit piece is
likely a wee bit ignorant, or at least painfully gullible about
politics.
I agree.
What does that say about FOX News?
Look at me, talkin' all fancy.
Careful, or John might call you some terrible names. He fears the
words, you see.
|11.13.08 @ 3:00PM|#
The woman never even had a fucking passport until last year,
when she was forced to get one to visit the ANG in Kuwait.
I am not going to presume shit about her grasp of geography. She is
demonstrably uncurious about such things.
|11.13.08 @ 3:01PM|#
BDB,
If it so easy to go from nowhere to governor, I expect you will be
going right out and doing it in the next couple of years. Afterall,
if idiot like Palin can do it and you can't, what does that say
about a real big city sophisticate like you?
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:01PM|#
"The woman never even had a fucking passport until last year,
when she was forced to get one to visit the ANG in Kuwait."
Now I'm in the weird position of defending Sarah Palin. World
traveling is fucking expensive, and those of us who are not from
wealthy backgrounds don't do a lot of it.
Just Plain Brian|11.13.08 @ 3:03PM|#
I don't find knowing what an "Achilles heel" is particularly impressive.
Me, either, but I do find not knowing it to be
very telling.
BDB |11.13.08 @ 3:03PM|#
"Afterall, if idiot like Palin can do it and you can't, what
does that say about a real big city sophisticate like you?"
It says you can b e a complete dumbass and be a great politician.
Which is unsettling, but true. Look at 3/4 of the people in
Congress for God's sake.
|11.13.08 @ 3:04PM|#
"Careful, or John might call you some terrible names. He fears
the words, you see."
Yes I fear words. I never went to college or learned much and never
read. Again, when someone who really is impressive and knows
something and doesn't have an axe to grind tells me how dumb Palin
is, I might believe them. Up to now that hasn't happened. Instead
Palin hating is the great indoor outdoor sport of pseudo
intellectual posers everywhere. No wonder the media is so good at
it.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:04PM|#
I guess Biden isn't a dumbass since he is Vice President Elect and you're not then, John?
Boston|11.13.08 @ 3:04PM|#
I certainly don't hate Palin. Though it seemed to me whenever she was speaking extemporaneously she really had trouble trying to voice a coherent thought in a straightforward manner.
jimmydageek|11.13.08 @ 3:08PM|#
John | November 13, 2008, 3:01pm | #
BDB,
If it so easy to go from nowhere to governor, I expect you will be going right out and doing it in the next couple of years. Afterall, if idiot like Palin can do it and you can't, what does that say about a real big city sophisticate like you?
I think it says that he's not inclined to spend his time doing lots
of ass kissing. In the end, it's (politics) just a big popularity
contest and the best ass kisser wins.
I'm not saying Palin is dumb, just positing that intelligence alone
does not win or lose elections. So your "well she's governor, how
dumb can she be" theory doesn't convince me.
Urkobold™|11.13.08 @ 3:09PM|#
THE URKOBOLD WOULD ALLOW GOVERNOR PALIN TO PLEASURE HIM. AND PLEASURE HIM AGAIN.
|11.13.08 @ 3:09PM|#
I wouldn't say Biden is dumb. Just a fool and not very thoughtful woefully dishonest. That whole plagiarizing thing, which goes all the way back to law school for him.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:09PM|#
"I'm not saying Palin is dumb, just positing that intelligence
alone does not win or lose elections. So your "well she's governor,
how dumb can she be" theory doesn't convince me."
It is an especially odd argument coming from a guy who has spent a
lot of time telling us what a dumbass the future Vice President is
(I agree with this, BTW).
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:11PM|#
I guess the bottom line is John a lot of horrible and stupid people get elected to public office. You can be a crooked bastard or a complete dumbass and get elected to statewide office. I gave you three examples of the former above.
|11.13.08 @ 3:11PM|#
"I'm not saying Palin is dumb, just positing that intelligence
alone does not win or lose elections. So your "well she's governor,
how dumb can she be" theory doesn't convince me."
If only it were just a matter of ass kissing. It takes more than
that, especially if you don't come with family connections. You
have to know how to talk to and connect with people. That is a real
skill and not to be taken lightly.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:12PM|#
So, does Joe Biden, the guy you say is such a fool, "really
connect with people" more than Palin John?
He must, since he is at an even higher office, right?
|11.13.08 @ 3:13PM|#
Both Obama or Biden display a wide ranging knowledge about
the world.
I haven't noticed it, to tell you the truth. Most of what they say
that registers on me is either blindingly wrong, or political
blah-blah put in their mouths by their staff.
Their public personas are either controlled (Obama) or notably
unimpressive (Biden).
Really, I think "uncurious" is just a way to say "stupid" without
being rude, and I think it is an accusation generally levelled
without any good basis.
I think Obama, for example, is "book smart" because of his law
school grades, but he has spent his adult life in a very narrow
circle and really has very limited life experience as an adult. He
may be curious as in "reads a lot of stuff" (I don't know, and
neither does anyone else here) but he sure doesn't get out
much.
|11.13.08 @ 3:15PM|#
"I guess the bottom line is John a lot of horrible and stupid
people get elected to public office. You can be a crooked bastard
or a complete dumbass and get elected to statewide office. I gave
you three examples of the former above."
All true. But Palin gets selected out for special treatment for
gaffes that other politicians routinely commit when other
politicians, Biden being the most obvious the most obvious example
these days, are let off the hook. She is treated like no other
politician. That is what infuriates me so much. Everything people
say about Palin could be said about 90% of the politicians out
there but isn't. I have no special affinity for Palin beyond my
loathing of the attitudes and prejudices that drive the criticism
of her. If the people who make those criticisms actually meant
them, they would make them about other politicians.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:16PM|#
The bottom line is in politics 98% of the time the politician is either smart but crooked as hell, or just dumb as a bag of hammers.
jimmydageek|11.13.08 @ 3:16PM|#
You have to know how to talk to and connect with people.
Yes, as I said, ass kissing.
That is a real skill and not to be taken lightly.
Yes, great ass kissing is quite the challenge.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:17PM|#
John--
That is because her roll out by the McCain campaign was just
downright horribly incompetent and the media loves a good train
wreck.
|11.13.08 @ 3:19PM|#
RC,
I can't think of one thing Obama has done as an adult that
indicates he is intellectually curious. If he were intellectually
curious, he would be reading economics books or military history or
some other subject that he doesn't know much about but would be of
value in government. He has never done any of that. Everyone is so
obsessed with what Palin reads and doesn't read, I don't recall
anyone ever asking what Obama reads. He is supposed to be such a
philosopher king; I would expect his reading list to be impressive.
I doubt it is because he is really not a particularly curious
person and not a very deep thinker.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:19PM|#
Also theres an unkown/known quantity thing. Biden got chased out of the 1988 Presidential race by the media when he was still relatively new. Re-hashing that wouldn't get the media good ratings. Going after someone new, does.
|11.13.08 @ 3:23PM|#
"John--
That is because her roll out by the McCain campaign was just
downright horribly incompetent and the media loves a good train
wreck."
No it is because she connected with the Republican base and they
knew they had to destroy her. They also are sexist and parochial as
hell. Another thing that drives me nuts about the media's treatment
of her is that most journalists really are stupid and know just
enough about what they cover to be dangerous. They honestly think
spending a summer backpacking across Europe in college makes them
knowledgeable about foreign affairs. Most journalists are
everything they accuse Palin of being (parochial, intellectually
uncurious and unserious, and functionally ignorant of most
matters). There dislike of her was sheer projection.
|11.13.08 @ 3:23PM|#
Now I'm in the weird position of defending Sarah Palin.
World traveling is fucking expensive, and those of us who are not
from wealthy backgrounds don't do a lot of it.
There's a world of difference between a lot and none. My straight
out of undergrad broke-ass managed to squeeze some international
travel in.
I doubt it. Further, what real experience has either one of
them had? Could Obama or Joe Biden tell you anything about what it
takes to run a business? What do they know about tax law or
accounting practices? What do they know about managing people
getting people to work together as a team. Yeah, they have both run
campaigns and bloviated in the Senate but that they never been in
charge of anything.
The person you're defending has spent her entire career in the two
areas you've been deriding most. She was a sports journalist and
then was a politician. Both Biden and Obama practiced law before
they became politicians. The former actually had his own firm for a
couple of years, so he probably knows a thing or two about running
a business.
He may be curious as in "reads a lot of stuff" (I don't know,
and neither does anyone else here) but he sure doesn't get out
much.
Besides pulling it out of your ass, where did you find that?
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:24PM|#
I agree criticizing her for not traveling abroad in college was
dumb. I didn't do it, not because I'm stupid but because I had to
work in the summer to pay for college.
I still say they went after her for ratings, not because of some
deep prejudice.
Just Plain Brian|11.13.08 @ 3:24PM|#
I don't recall anyone ever asking what Obama reads
And yet you say this:
He has never done any of that.
Are you stalking him, or just pulling all of this out of your
ass?
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:25PM|#
"There's a world of difference between a lot and none. My
straight out of undergrad broke-ass managed to squeeze some
international travel in."
I didn't feel like getting into debt even more, thanks.
The fact that George W. Bush, who was from a rich family, didn't do
it is more revealing.
|11.13.08 @ 3:25PM|#
"Also theres an unkown/known quantity thing. Biden got chased
out of the 1988 Presidential race by the media when he was still
relatively new. Re-hashing that wouldn't get the media good
ratings. Going after someone new, does."
yeah but Biden had about 30 new gaffes for them to talk about and
they ignored it. What worries me now is that he is VP and when he
says something stupid it can have consequences and hurt the
country. What happens when he says something like "of course we
wouldn't go to war over the straights of Formosa that is all just a
bluff"? Biden is a real lose cannon.
|11.13.08 @ 3:27PM|#
I didn't feel like getting into debt even more,
thanks.
I saved up for it with my first post-collegiate job. I figured, 4
years of Ramen wasn't too bad, so why not cut back on my living
expenses for a few months so I could treat myself.
Granted, that was a personal priority of mine.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:27PM|#
"yeah but Biden had about 30 new gaffes for them to talk about
and they ignored it."
From what I remember, everytime Biden made a gaffe they covered it,
but like two days later Palin makes an even bigger gaffe and it
sucked the oxygen out of the room. Like she was trying to one-up
him or something.
|11.13.08 @ 3:29PM|#
"Both Biden and Obama practiced law before they became
politicians. The former actually had his own firm for a couple of
years, so he probably knows a thing or two about running a
business."
Obama never practiced law. He was an adjunct at U of C Law school
and then worked in the public interest things like the Annenberg
Challenge but he never worked for a law firm or had his own
practice. He also never tried a case. I would feel better about him
if he had been a PD or something. Had some experience in the real
world beyond just politics. Also, Palin and her husband ran a
commercial fishing business.
|11.13.08 @ 3:30PM|#
BDB,
Palin never had a gaffe as big as "spread the wealth around" or
"clinging to their guns and religion". If Palin had ever said
anything that thoughtless she would have been ran out of public
life.
|11.13.08 @ 3:32PM|#
yeah but Biden had about 30 new gaffes for them to talk
about and they ignored it. What worries me now is that he is VP and
when he says something stupid it can have consequences and hurt the
country. What happens when he says something like "of course we
wouldn't go to war over the straights of Formosa that is all just a
bluff"? Biden is a real lose cannon.
Name one. Seems to me that I heard about most of his gaffes from
the media. Not to mention he was the Chairman of the Senate
Committee on Foreign Relations for 4 years, which is a pretty
important position and one where saying, "of course we wouldn't go
to war over the straights of Formosa that is all just a bluff" is a
major league fuck-up.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:32PM|#
"Bitterage" was covered non-stop for two weeks.
"Spread the wealth" was something that resonated mostly with
partisan Republicans.
The first one would have destroyed Dukakis, Gore, or Kerry, but
Obama was a better politician.
|11.13.08 @ 3:34PM|#
Obama never practiced law.
He was an associate at Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland for 3
years. People can have multiple jobs, you know.
|11.13.08 @ 3:39PM|#
That is true, he did work at a small public interest firm. That being said, it is not like he ever accomplished anything. He was never involved in any significant cases I have heard of or achieved any significant successes. The Annenburg Challange was a disaster and a complete waste of money. Show me where Obama has done anything beyond go to school, work on failed social programs and get elected. In a lot of ways I don't blame Jesse Jackson for hating him so much. Jackson for all of his faults really did accomplish things when he was young.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 3:40PM|#
"Show me where Obama has done anything beyond go to school, work
on failed social programs and get elected. "
John, you were telling us all upthread what a big deal it was to
get elected to office, and how Sarah Palin is smart and
accomplished because she got elected Governor.
Chicago|11.13.08 @ 3:53PM|#
I am a man who will fight for your honor
I'll be the hero that you're dreaming of
Gonna live forever knowing together
That we did it all for the glory of love
You keep me standing tall
You'll help me through it all
I'm always strong when you're beside me
I have always needed you
I could never make it alone
the innominate one|11.13.08 @ 3:56PM|#
awesome:
Lastly, give me five really inciteful [sic] things each of them
has said.
Biden is a real lose [sic] cannon.
I've been trying not to be the spelling nazi, but in a thread about
the intelligence of various politicians, I just couldn't help
myself.
Peter Cetera|11.13.08 @ 4:05PM|#
Hey, Chicago, stop trying to take all the credit! "Glory of Love" was my solo work, dammit!
|11.13.08 @ 4:08PM|#
"I can't think of one thing Obama has done as an adult that
indicates he is intellectually curious. If he were intellectually
curious, he would be reading economics books or military history or
some other subject that he doesn't know much about but would be of
value in government. He has never done any of that. Everyone is so
obsessed with what Palin reads and doesn't read, I don't recall
anyone ever asking what Obama reads. He is supposed to be such a
philosopher king; I would expect his reading list to be impressive.
I doubt it is because he is really not a particularly curious
person and not a very deep thinker."
You got the impression after reading the two books he wrote,
right?
(For the record, I've read neither, although the first is actually
supposed to be pretty good for the genre; the second was a
pre-campaign book).
|11.13.08 @ 4:19PM|#
John is grasping. For what? I don't know.
John is doing interpretive web art. The title of the piece is
"Moving Goalposts".
|11.13.08 @ 4:22PM|#
John, you were telling us all upthread what a big deal it
was to get elected to office, and how Sarah Palin is smart and
accomplished because she got elected Governor.
Not only that, but he's a mixed race dude, with the middle name
Hussein, a senator and raised from a no name family. I would say
the difficulty rating of accomplishing that is an order of
magnitude more than being the governor of a state of 600K.
|11.13.08 @ 4:24PM|#
I confess I walked right into the "compared to Obama/Biden"
thing. And I shouldn't have. Because I don't want either of them
either.
But everything I've seen indicates to me that both of them can
answer just about any question about where and when just about any
noteworthy historical event happened and can tell you where just
about any country is located and something about its culture.
Now as flawed as I find their politics these are the kinds of
things I would expect someone who aspires to this kind of high
office to know. And everything I've seen of Palin makes me fairly
sure that she would not know many of these things. Not because
she's stupid but because it has never occured to her to wonder
about any of them.
See, it doesn't so much matter how she stacks up against BO or JB,
the fact is that she doesn't even know things that any
well informed American should know.
You can draw whatever conclusions you want to about how well
informed the average American is.
economist|11.13.08 @ 4:25PM|#
I have to congratulate henry on proving me wrong on one very important and controversial point, in which I strongly persisted in my point of view until today: It is in fact physically possible for a human being to insert his head into his own rectum. On previous threads I had claimed that this was physically impossible for a human being. I posted links to websites where they tested the theory and said it couldn't be done. I have been proven wrong today by henry, and I feel that it is only proper that I give credit where credit is due.
|11.13.08 @ 4:27PM|#
That's a brave admission, economist. We'll all be here for you in the coming days and weeks.
|11.13.08 @ 4:35PM|#
Yes BDB and up thread you were telling me how that doesn't mean
anything. I would say Obama and Palin have a lot in common in that
they both came from nowhere and managed to get elected to high
posts. But of course, the party line at Reason is that Obama is a
genius and Palin is lucky to be able to feed herself.
Since I am not a member of the Obama cult, I don't find his
accomplishments that overwelming. I don't find Palin's that
overwelming either. I just don't think the criticism of her is
fair.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 4:36PM|#
"Yes BDB and up thread you were telling me how that doesn't mean
anything."
Yeah, and I stand by that. I'm not an O-bot.
|11.13.08 @ 4:36PM|#
You got me Mo and BDB. i have to admit, Obama and Palin are about equally impressive. Fair enough.
economist|11.13.08 @ 4:38PM|#
John, don't go trollish on us. Name one person (besides Weigel and Chapman) who consider Obama a genius.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 4:40PM|#
Do you think Palin is more impressive than Bobby Jindal who is a
Rhodes Scholar, John?
Take off the partisan hat and compare Palin to her likely
competition in 2012 (Crist, Jindal, Sanford, Flake,
Huckabee).
The last guy is a dumbass. Jindal is smart. The others, don't
know.
economist|11.13.08 @ 4:40PM|#
Of course, Chapman considers Obama a specially enlightened being
with the ability to crap ice cream and sneeze money.
He also thinks Obama is a libertarian.
economist|11.13.08 @ 4:41PM|#
BDB,
I don't think John was comparing Sarah Palin to any of those
people, or saying there was anything particularly impressive about
her.
BDB|11.13.08 @ 4:42PM|#
"economist | November 13, 2008, 4:41pm | #
BDB,
I don't think John was comparing Sarah Palin to any of those
people, or saying there was anything particularly impressive about
her."
Yeah but I hear other Republicans screaming that she should be the
2012 nominee, because the media hates her. Or something. Despite
the fact they have more impressive people.
economist|11.13.08 @ 4:46PM|#
BDB,
"Yeah but I hear other Republicans screaming that she should be the
2012 nominee, because the media hates her. Or something. Despite
the fact they have more impressive people."
Yeah, but they're not here. So don't argue with them. Actually, I'm
not going to argue about it either, anymore. It was utterly
pointless before and utterly pointless it remains. And I'm still
pissed off that I was wrong about it being possible for people to
shove their heads up their asses.
|11.13.08 @ 5:05PM|#
"Do you think Palin is more impressive than Bobby Jindal who is
a Rhodes Scholar, John?"
No. Jindal is a really smart guy. Rhoades scholarships are nothing
to sneeze at. I frankly have no idea if he would be a good
candidate or not. He is apparently a good governor of Lousiana. I
can tell you from first hand experience that the State government
in Louisiana was about 100 times better prepared for Gustav than
they were for Katrina. How much of that is Jindal's doing I don't
know. Also, it doesn't take much beyond staying out of jail to be
considered one of the "good governors" of Louisiana.
|11.13.08 @ 5:06PM|#
Economist,
True about Obama and being a genius. Weigel and Chapman are really
the only ones who are a member of the cult.
economist|11.13.08 @ 5:11PM|#
I will take the opportunity to say this:
OUST STEVE CHAPMAN ALREADY!
Seriously. Chapman's articles are always either A.statist
apologetics B. Statements of his own delusions (see 'A Liberal Like
No Other' for an example), or C. so general as to be
irrelevant.
economist|11.13.08 @ 5:17PM|#
the innominate one,
I just have one question: How did Edward become so batshit insane?
Seriously, did you guys actually do something to him, like shit in
his birdbath, or has he just failed to take his meds for the last
decade?
Geotpf|11.13.08 @ 5:21PM|#
R C Dean | November 13, 2008, 11:55am | #
The source of the story is a known hoaxster.
False. An unnamed source told Fox News about the Africa thing. Then
the hoaxster told MSNBC that he was the source that talked to Fox,
when he was not. The person who talked to Fox is a different person
than the person who talked to MSNBC. The original leak was
real.
Urkobold™|11.13.08 @ 5:23PM|#
EDWARD THINKS HE IS THE URKOBOLD'S ILLEGITIMATE SON AND CAN'T HANDLE THE STARK TRUTHS PRESENTED BY DNA EVIDENCE.
economist|11.13.08 @ 5:23PM|#
Geotpf,
You really should have read the update. And the record should state
that no one actually knows who the unnamed source is, which
therefore makes it impossible to determine whether the original
leak was real.
economist|11.13.08 @ 5:25PM|#
Urkobold,
No, really. I mean, things like the "When you fuck with bull, you
get horns" comment. Was this all because he went to your blog and
got pissed off at you? Because if that's true then he's an even
bigger twat than I formerly considered him to be.
BlueBook|11.13.08 @ 8:24PM|#
This happened to Drew Carey a few years back on Who's Line
Is It Anyway? Maybe that's where the hoaxer got the
inspiration.
Video pops.
VM|11.14.08 @ 8:17AM|#
Kus - probably. "Edweirdooo" could also be "Lefiti". Maybe a
regular who impersonates a troll to get a rise. Or it's "Dan T"
coming back to haunt us.
Or he is a one time Croesus, Jean Bart, gay french reporter marine
who's married to a Jewish lady and living in NYC but then is from
the south with Jason Bourne, the Frankish Kings, and now the
purchaser of Alaska.
Glenn|11.16.08 @ 12:33PM|#
Ha ha! Martin Eisenstadt pwned the news media! Everyone knows that the dinosaur news media will never change. They are just going to keep getting pwned by people like Martin until no one can trust their reporting anymore and they go extinct.
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