Obama's Union Speech a 'Load of You-Know-What'

Obama seems to believe that pumping money into failure is an economic starter kit.

False choices. Populist bromides. A lecture on values. President Barack Obama treated us to some of his greatest hits this week.

Speaking before the United Auto Workers union in Washington, Obama, champion of the working man, challenged auto bailout "naysayers" to "come around" and admit that "standing by American workers was the right thing to do," as bailouts "saved" the auto industry. (You have to wonder whether downtrodden citizens appreciate just how close they came to having to roller-skate to work.)

"They're out there talking about you like you're some special interest that needs to be beaten down," Obama told cheering union members. And those who claim that bailouts were just a labor payback are simply peddling a "load of you-know-what."

I do know what, Mr. President.

Because actually, the United Auto Workers union is a special interest. Like other unions, the UAW regularly lobbies Congress, funds Democratic candidates across the country with millions, and advocates public policy that undercuts competition and free trade. And, as The New York Times recently reported, the UAW and other unions will "put their vast political organizations into motion behind Mr. Obama." (Nothing like a few strategic taxpayer "investments" to get labor inspired.)

And if by "be beaten down" the president means "compete in the marketplace like every other sucker in America," well, he's right. If by "be beaten down" he means "go to bankruptcy court -- even if you've 'played by the rules' -- and honor contracts you've signed rather than have a friendly administration rip them up and rewrite them in favorable terms for others, then heck yeah.

Yet Obama claims, "I"—"I"—"placed my bet on American workers."

Now, it's your bet, technically, of course, Mr. President. And let's be honest; all my favorite bets are made with other people's money. But you didn't bet on the American people. That would mean betting that the marketplace and those in it have the capacity and the smarts to find increasingly productive and innovative ways to produce the things that consumers demand. You bet on a politically convenient corporation that believes it's entitled to eternal state-sponsored protection. Too bad Woolworth's and Pan Am couldn't hold out until you came along.

Then again, it's not just an economic duty but also a moral obligation. "You want to talk about values?" Obama went on to explain. "Hard work—that's a value. Looking out for one another—that's a value. The idea that we're all in it together and I'm my brother's keeper and sister's keeper—that's a value."

Thank the secular spirits we don't have one of those Bible thumpers in the White House. They tend to get preachy, you know.

But ponder this: The same week our greed-averse president sends a fundraising letter demonizing the Koch brothers—dubious self-starters and risk takers who employ about 70,000 people without bailouts and hand out billions in noncoerced charity—he is busy celebrating policy that forces taxpayers to be their brother's keeper, even though their brother continues to make terrible decisions free of consequence.

Now, the auto bailouts began under President George W. Bush—abandoning free market principles to save the free market since 2001—but Obama seems to believe that pumping money into failure is an economic starter kit. Some unpatriotic rube might even ask: If bailouts can really save jobs, grow the economy and cost taxpayers absolutely nothing, why not bail out more industries—or every industry? Why not bail out every corporation that's headed in the wrong direction?

What, you don't care about your brothers and sisters?

David Harsanyi is a columnist at The Blaze. Follow him on Twitter @davidharsanyi

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  • ||

    OT: Ron Paul berates conman.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?f.....uL6CSiGrU#!

  • The Right To Take||

    Dr. Paul has said he is a great admirer of Ayn Rand.

    I wonder how any white person with The Right To Take integrates into Ron Paul's self-styled "free-market" "principles?"

    "[The Native Americans] didn't have any rights to the land ... Any white person who brought the element of civilization had the right to take over this continent."

    ~Ayn Rand, US Military Academy at West Point, March 6, 1974

  • The "market" is about a free..||

    ...as a 5-year plan is glorious.

  • Mike M.||

    What are you eating right now, fat boy?

  • My Brother's Keeper||

    Do political prisoners absolve their city-Statist captors of all wrong if they eat prison chow?


    “The world of the Takers is one vast prison, and except for a handful of Leavers scattered across the world, the entire human race is now inside that prison.”

    “Naturally a prison must have a prison industry. It helps to keep the inmates busy. It takes their minds off the boredom and futility of their lives. Our prison industry? Consuming the world.”

    A Condensation of Daniel Quinn Thought
    Part 1: The Problem is Civilization
    Prison
    www.lejournalmural.be/english-.....lla-1.html

  • Juice||

    You could go on hunger strike. Hmm, but I'll bet you're hungry right now. Quick, to the Twinkie stash!

  • Voice of Thy Brother's Blood||

    And they went into [Reason]; and straightway on the [Woden's] day he entered into the [chatroom], and taught. And they were astonished at his teaching: for he taught them as one that had authority, and not as the [Fibertarians].

    verses 47 and 48, chapter 1, The Jefferson Bible [adapted]

  • Jake Westbrook||

    Primitard told you so? Primitard told you so.

  • romulus augustus||

    Where in her speech does this alleged line occur? I've been unable to find it in any printed or internet copy.

  • Voice of Thy Brother's Blood||

    ~Ayn Rand, US Military Academy at West Point, March 6, 1974

    Question and Answer session, after her speech to the graduating class.

    There are recordings of it. You can find them if you want.

  • ||

    Ron Paul is not an objectivist. Admiring a Russian immigrant who made a permanent place in history for herself is not the same as agreeing with all of her policy.

    Glaring examples of differences is Rand was a hawk, and believed in a central bank. Rand's insights were philosophical. They were not economic, and her economic understanding was only better than the likes of Krugman or DeLong by degree.

    By Ron Paul's lights, Rand was a big government conservative. And, she was.

  • Economics Kill||

    People do not fight simply for religion’s sake; they fight for basic, economic reasons, and then dress it up with religion after the fact.

    No One Dies for Religion
    by Jason Godesky | 25 October 2005
    http://rewild.info/anthropik/2.....-religion/

  • ||

    Correct, so far as it goes, as Rothbard noted decades before.

    Most wars are economic, but not to benefit the people, instead to socialize the cost (in life, liberty, and property) of conquest onto the people to benefit the state and the court.

    Just wars are those which oppose those wars of conquest or reject existing conquest. Or, ultimately just wars are those which assert right of freedom association/disassociation, or put another way assert government by consent in withdrawing consent.

    The functional purpose of the state is to shift costs and protect existing capital from the market.

  • There is a free lunch ||

    The functional purpose of the state is to shift costs and protect existing capital and city-statist markets from becoming obsolete, as they would be if Non-State hunting and gathering a free lunch weren't violently suppressed.

    “You’ll know you’re among the people of your culture if the food is all owned, if it’s all under lock and key. But food was once no more owned than the air or the sunshine are owned. No other culture in history has ever put food under lock and key—and putting it there is the cornerstone of your economy, because if the food wasn’t under lock and key, who would work?" ~Daniel Quinn

  • There is a free lunch ||

    ...the Bushmen, who respond to the neolithic question with another: "Why should we plant, when there are so many mongomongo nuts the world?"

    ~Marshall Sahlins (University of Chicago)
    The Original Affluent Society
    www.primitivism.com/original-affluent.htm

  • moop||

    if food wasn't under lock and key we'd spend all our time hunting and gathering, and have 30 year life spans

  • ||

    The people who wanted something more than food. Which is apparently not you, but most people do. In fact most people desire leisure as well. Which division of labor allows for. If you can make nets better than you can fish, then you will have to work less if you make nets and let the fisher's fish.

    This requires your nets, and their fish, being safe from predation.

    If not, you will both be reduced to less leisure because you will both have to work more for the same result.

    Property rights. Which pre-exist the state, and which the state does a less than poor job protecting. In fact, as previously asserted, the primary function of the state is in fact, to violate property rights.

  • ||

    The idyl you fantasize about never existed. The comparative idyls we have in fact enjoyed, you ignore.

    The fact is people worked in factories because their lot as peasants working the land was far worse. The fact is that rural Chinese farmers making iphones do so, because their lot on farms is worse.

    The fact is your whole collectivist fantasy dogma was invented by landholders who squealed like a pig at industrial capitalists luring way their cheap peasant labor by paying them more.

    You have a tragically simplistic understanding of economics.

  • Toolbag||

    Indians suck

  • Racialist Science?||

    In short; RACIALIST SCIENCE is properly not an act of aggression or a cover for oppression of one group over another, but, on the contrary, an operation in defense of private property against assaults by aggressors. ~Murray Rothbard

  • kinnath||

    Ben just sits there waiting for the "crazy guy" to finish talking.

  • My Brother's Keeper||

    I wonder if Ron Paul realizes that Cain was the following:

    • Agriculturalist
    • First Murderer (Cain slaughtered his hunter-gatherer brother Abel)
    • Father of the First City-State builder
    • First Fibertarian (Genesis 4:9, And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?)

  • White Imbecile is an animal||

    who cannot even claim intellectual bankruptcy, as such would be impossible.

  • All humans are animals.||

    Are you going to continue blanking-out empirical evidence?

    Kingdom: Animalia
    Phylum: Chordata
    Class: Mammalia
    Order: Primates
    Family: Hominidae
    Tribe: Hominini
    Genus: Homo
    Species: H. sapiens
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human

    What are you, Fibertarian, a mushroom fresh off the horseshit pile?

  • White Imbecile claims to have||

    enough evidence to demonstrate his status as animal, yet he cannot even lick his own balls, leaving him in a deep depression.

  • White Imbecile does show||

    continuous and repetitive behaviors which can only be explained by animal instinct, or severe brain damage. The experts are still debating which.

  • Experts? Cite?||

    Their [i.e., Old Mexican's] magic tool is the blank-out, the pretense that nothing can come into existence past the voodoo of their refusal to identify it.

    Evasion
    Ayn Rand Lexicon
    http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/evasion.html

    Humans are indeed animals.

    I suggest you check your premises.

  • Alack||

    • First Fibertarian (Genesis 4:9, And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?)

    I can't be the only one bother by the "fibertarian" term. I mean, WI's clearly trying to call us all liars; I got that. But shouldn't that be "fibber-tarian"?

    Right now it looks like he's asserting we advocate high-fiber diets on a political level.

  • I wonder if Ron Paul's Bible..||

    ...has the following passage:

    Ye blind guides, which strain out a gnat, and swallow a camel. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

    ~Jesus
    verses 24 and 25, chapter 13, The Jefferson Bible

  • Mike M.||

    This pretentious, ponderous collection of retarded posts is enough to prompt the question, "On what day did the Lord create the disgusting diabetes-ridden slob Jason Godesky, and couldn't he have rested on that day too?"

  • Voice of Thy Brother's Blood||

    Taken in a literary (not literally as fundamentalists do) sense, with a mythicist exegesis, the genesis mythology is an accurate story of the aggression of agricultural city-Statism.

  • Gus||

    You. Are. One. Dumb Fucker.

    Genesis 2:

    4 These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,

    5 And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.

    6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.

    7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

    8 And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed.

    Ignorant. Fuck.

  • GardenOfEden=Non-State Society||

    Fall of Man = Agricultural "revolution."

    See:

    “Anarcho-Primitivism and the Bible.” In Encyclopedia of Religion and Nature, 56–58. London: Continuum, 2005.

    “The Fall.” In Encyclopedia of Religion and Nature, 634–36. London: Continuum, 2005.

    www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Re.....847062733/

    Or here:

    www.jesusradicals.com/theology/ched-myers/

  • cynical||

    I'm more annoyed by the abuse of the term "brother's keeper" by lefties. The passage has fuck all to do with welfare or charity or whatever bullshit they're peddling, it's about murder.

  • Abel, the murder victim.||

    Correct, it's about murder.

    Murder of hunter-gatherers by agricultural city-Statist Cain.

    And he said, What have you done? the voice of your brother's blood cries unto me from the ground. ~Genesis 4:10

    (Taken in a literary sense, with a mythicist exegesis, the genesis mythology is an accurate story of the aggression of agricultural city-Statism.)

  • ||

    If only RP could confine his sentences to one thought each, and insert a period from time to time. But I like him.

  • Tman||

    I am really farking sick of these people bragging about how great the auto bailout was. The WSJ talked today about the $18 billion in forgone tax payments that GM got away with-

    "GM had accumulated about $45 billion in such profit-shielding chits by 2008, with a book value of about $18 billion....In a 2011 working paper, J. Mark Ramseyer of Harvard and Eric Rasmusen of Indiana University argue that by manipulating corporate tax rules by fiat, "Treasury gave the firm (and its owners, including the UAW) $18 billion more in assets." Thus a Democratic Administration gave "a massive tax benefit to one of the party's biggest supporters."

    http://online.wsj.com/article/.....oveLEFTTop

  • ||

    What also irks me is that the nice thing about free(er) markets--without lots of government interference and favoritism, that is--is that they tend to reward those who perform better. While that doesn't always mean a better product (better marketing can often defeat superior product performance), it does usually mean, over time, a better-run business.

  • Mattrue||

    Not a shred of evidence, but methinks the Fortune 500 would look a whole lot different in a FREE market system.

  • ||

    Agreed. And a lot of money spent on peddling influence in DC would be spent on more useful and productive things.

  • sarcasmic||

    What is more useful and productive than purchasing government force for the purpose of shutting down existing competition, creating barriers to new entries into the market, and even subsidizing or requiring the purchase your products?

    Sounds like an effective way to stay in business to me.

    Completely dishonest and immoral, but effective.

  • Is the "Right To Take"...||

    ...Completely dishonest and immoral, but effective?

  • Tman||

    While that doesn't always mean a better product (better marketing can often defeat superior product performance), it does usually mean, over time, a better-run business.

    Which is the primary difference between Ford and GM/Chrysler right now. Ford has done more to fix the root of the problem -making cars people actually want to buy- whereas the other two have simply continued in their shitty car making ways.

  • sarcasmic||

    The other two are making politically correct vehicles. The ones that politicians want people to buy. As long as they keep it up the politicians will reward them.

  • shrike||

    So what? NOL's are not transferable to another company when said company is purchased. In this case GM was "purchased" by the Treasury which has no use for the NOL's. Letting GM retain the NOL's kept it on equal footing with its competitors who get to do the same.

  • ||

    The nonsense begins with the idea that a company should get bailed out in the first place. Let it fail. Let the banks fail. Let all failures fail. GM will continue to turn out inferior products and will continue to have ridiculous costs.

    It's such an openly political move without any benefit to the population at large--who gets to fund this business--that I don't understand why anyone outside of the party (or the union) would defend it.

    Even from the economic engineering perspective, we don't need GM. Other companies would have filled a vacuum, if one had been created, and the suppliers and even many of the employees would've found other manufacturers.

  • Gambol Lockdown = Ag Bailout||

    There was such a thing as a free lunch before agricultural-Statism.

    But free lunches aren't much profitable to agricultural capitalists.

    Why should government bail them out with Land enTitlement programs to restrict and regulate the free movement of people to hunt and gather?

    "Agriculture creates government."
    ~Richard Manning
    Against the Grain p. 73

  • Old Mexican||

    In other news: White Imbecile's claim that he's an animal and the empirical evidence he possesses to back this up.

  • marketplace of ideas failure? ||

    Why are Fibertarians quick to referencing the Lording-over of people? Is it the only relationship with people they can imagine?

  • Do angels defecate over||

    White Imbecile?

  • All humans are animals.||

    Are you going to continue blanking-out empirical evidence?

    Kingdom: Animalia
    Phylum: Chordata
    Class: Mammalia
    Order: Primates
    Family: Hominidae
    Tribe: Hominini
    Genus: Homo
    Species: H. sapiens
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human

    What are you, Old Mex, a mushroom fresh off the horseshit pile?

  • White Imbecile has a traumatic||

    psychotic breakdown after learning he's just an animal.

  • Don't angels eat animals like||

    White Imbecile and spit out the untasty parts?

  • Do animals like White Imbecile||

    eat their own shit? Empirical evidence says: They do.

  • After learning that he cannot ||

    lick his own balls, White Imbecile sinks into depression.

  • White Imbecile is an animal||

    but not all animals are like White Imbecile, who cannot lick his own balls, leaving him sunken in depression.

  • White Imbecile may be an||

    animal as he shows non-rational, repetitive behaviors which can only be explained by either instinct or severe brain damage.

  • Jesus, the anarcho-primitivist||

    When they hurled their insults at him, he did not retaliate; when he suffered, he made no threats. Instead, he entrusted himself to him who judges justly. ~1 Peter 2:23

  • Sevo||

    "~Richard Manning"

    This guy is an "award-winning" writer! He'd gotten awards from outfits so obscure, no one has bothered to list them on wiki, for pete's sake!
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J.....Fellowship
    And the reviews on Amazon are at best the sort written by someone who might need a review in the future.
    Suffice to say, Manning's a crackpot and any comment from him is probably served best with a pound of salt, or ingored entirely.

  • Da, Comrade Political Officer||

    Nyet on any ENEMIES OF THE CITY-STATE.

    Hooligans, all!

  • Studebaker||

    WE never got bailed out.

  • Packard Motor Company||

    Us, either.

  • Auburn-Cord-Duesenberg||

    HELLoooo! Where were OUR bailouts?

  • American Motors||

    Neither did - oh, wait, we got bought out by Chrysler... which DID get bailed out, so it's kind of a wash.

    But we still didn't get a bailout BEFORE Chrysler bought us, so...

  • Tman||

    NOL's are not transferable to another company when said company is purchased

    Nor should they be.

    In this case GM was "purchased" by the Treasury which has no use for the NOL's

    The treasury has no use for $18 billion? That would be news to them.

    Letting GM retain the NOL's kept it on equal footing with its competitors who get to do the same.

    No stupid, read the article again. "Treasury gave the firm (and its owners, including the UAW) $18 billion more in assets."

    Spin away shriek.

  • shrike||

    Book value =/= cash.

    Accounting 101.

  • Tman||

    The government erased GM's $18 billion in taxes owed.

    Arithmetic 101.

  • Colonel_Angus||

    Kindergarten arithmetic.

  • Tman||

    It is shriek I'm talking to, I have to start SOMEwhere.

  • ||

    NOL's are not transferable to another company when said company is purchased.

    Irrelevant. GM went through bankruptcy, and found a new investor in bankruptcy, the Treasury.

    And, in bankruptcy, NOLs are typically wiped out.

    Here's how it works. In a Chapter 7 bankruptcy, debts are wiped out. The company has to reduce certain of its "paper" assets to match the debts that were wiped out. The very first asset that gets written down is NOLs.

    Unless, of course, you get a special deal from the President, to plump up your post-bankruptcy books. If, say, this had been a normal bankruptcy and GM's new investor had been, say, the Koch brothers, GM would not have any NOLs post-bankruptcy because they wrote off more debt than the NOLs are worth.

  • Almanian||

    Exactly as RC Dean notes. See WSJ article to the same effect below.

  • shrike||

    So Treasury acted in our financial interest? Fine.

    Ideally there would be no bailouts. I just don't pretend the GOP is anti-bailout like some here do. I lived through 2008.

    http://abcnews.go.com/WN/Econo.....05mLPXN2KQ

    Speaking on ABC's "Nightline," Obama himself dismissed the idea of a government takeover of the banks just last week.

    "We want to retain a strong sense of private capital fulfilling the core investment needs of this country," Obama said.

    It was Obama that reversed the 2008 bailout mentality.

  • Sevo||

    shrike|2.29.12 @ 12:56PM|#
    ..."I just don't pretend the GOP is anti-bailout like some here do."

    How hard was it to put wheels on those goal posts?

  • shrike||

    Are you kidding? 'John' and Ken Schulz' blame Obama for TARP.

  • Sevo||

    No, I'm not kidding, you bozo.

  • Sudden||

    Did he or did he note vote for it as a sitting US Senator?

  • ||

    So Treasury acted in our financial interest?

    How did Treasury act in our financial interest?

    Your calculation should demonstrate that the value to the nation of allowing GM to retain its NOLs exceeded $18 billion.

    Show your work.

  • shrike||

    The present value of the NOL's should be partially reflected in the GM market cap.

    Treasury earned $4.5 billion on Bank of America and $12 billion on Citi. Those positions are closed.

    Yes, TARP was the biggest socialist move in US history. The Bush legacy will only get worse over time from its dismal last place rank today.

  • shrike||

    Hello!?!?!

    Can someone else please help me move these goal posts? They're really heavy.

  • Colonel_Angus||

    I've moved some goal posts in my day. In to the living room next to the flags that say "college" and "go team".

  • ||

    Properly TARP and the Auto bailouts were fascist, not socialist. MOP were not nationalized, rather government and politically connected corporations acted in their own interests at the expense of consumers, taxpayers, and competitors.

    In this regard Bush was awful, and Obama has been far worse.

    In any case GM is not profitable. It is made to appear profitable by inflow of taxpayer capital.

    Give me $50 billion and force my bond holders to take an illegal haircut I will show a 'profit' too. In fact more than GM. Give me $50b and I will show a profit of $50b.

    Not $8b.

  • ||

    The present value of the NOL's should be partially reflected in the GM market cap.

    In what way does that count as a benefit to the country offsetting $18BB in lost taxes?

  • Gilbert Martin||

    If GM was left on "equal footing" with its' competitors, the government would not have bailed it out to begin with.

  • Mr Whippple||

    I am really farking sick of these people bragging about how great the auto bailout was.

    Bailout? What bailout? The shareholders got fucked. They didn't even get a shitty 10 cents on the dollar. There was no bailout. There was a (forcible) transfer of ownership, instead of the "creative destruction" that should have occurred. I bet Roger Penske is still scratching his head.

  • nono||

    +1

  • Live Free or Diet||

    I'd be happy to be my brother's keeper, so long as he's kept in a pen in the yard and fed dog food like the other things that need to be kept.

  • Untermensch||

    The irony in people quoting this is that the Hebrew text roughly means “How should I know? I’m not my brother’s babysitter.” But somehow getting all inspirational and dewy eyed while admitting that you want to babysit your brother doesn't quite work.

  • cynical||

    Yep. The relationship between keeper and kept is not one of equals (at any rate, someone willing to indefinitely and unlawfully detain people without trial has no grounds to justify himself through comparison to Cain's rejection of divine habeas corpus.)

    In the case of the UAW, though, I imagine Obama's "keeper" relationship applies more in the sense of the union being like unto a kept woman.

  • GENOCIDE of NON-STATE brothers||

    Taken in a literary (not literally as fundamentalists do) sense, with a mythicist exegesis, the Cain and Abel story found in the genesis mythology is an accurate portayal of the aggression of agricultural city-Statism.

    Trail of Tears.

    And he said, What hast thou done? the VOICE OF THY BROTHER'S BLOOD crieth unto me from the ground. ~Genesis 4:10

  • ||

    Where's Shreeeek to tell us only the Venture-Capitalist-in-Chief was smart enough to recognise the "value" of GM?

  • Jeffersonian||

    If you mean political value, GM was an absolute steal for Zero.

  • Sevo||

    Bingo! We have exactly the right verb!

  • The Right to Take = Steal?||

    Bingo!

    "[The Native Americans] didn't have any rights to the land ... Any white person who brought the element of civilization had THE RIGHT TO TAKE over this continent."

    ~Ayn Rand, US Military Academy at West Point, March 6, 1974

  • kilroy||

    Very well said, Mr. Harsanyi.

  • Obama's Destitute Brother||

    "I'm my brother's keeper and sister's keeper" News to me.

  • Brother's Keeper=Not Murdering||

    It's not that hard to understand. Cain murdered Abel.

    And he said, What hast thou done? the VOICE OF THY BROTHER'S BLOOD crieth unto me from the ground. ~Genesis 4:10

  • ||

    Of course, the Bigger is Better fetishists could never accept the sight of GM being broken up.

  • ||

    Letting GM retain the NOL's kept it on equal footing with its competitors who get to do the same.

    You're going to go with that? What about wiping out the debt, which is what has magically returned GM to "profitability"? Ford is still making interest payments on their debt, but the playing field won't be level without allowing GM to skip paying taxes?

    You're pathetic.

  • shrike||

    Ford's shareholders kept ownership of the company. GM's were wiped out completely.

    You're an idiot who could not address the valid accounting issue I brought up so you clumsily change the subject.

    Some airlines got to wipe out their debt in the 80s while legacy airlines were saddled with it. Its not a new problem.

  • Almanian||

    Lemme grab you another shovel - that one you're using is pretty well used up

  • ||

    Some airlines got to wipe out their debt in the 80s while legacy airlines were saddled with it.

    Did the bankrupt airlines get to keep their NOLs?

    The write-down of assets to match the write-down of debts after bankruptcy is both a fairness issue (otherwise, bankrupt companies get a huge benefit that their competitors don't have) and a moral hazard issue (it assures that you can't turn a profit on declaring bankruptcy per se).

  • ||

    What "valid accounting issue"?

    That they intentionally allowed GM to retain those operating losses in order to improve their "profitability" and prop up the stock price? How's that working out?

  • ||

    The treasury did not come in and put their thumb on the scale for Braniff, did they?

    And yet, those who wish to still seem to be able to fly on commercial airlines.

  • Old Mexican||

    Now, the auto bailouts began under President George W. Bush—abandoning free market principles to save the free market since 2001—but Obama seems to believe that pumping money into failure is an economic starter kit.


    David, you and me know that Obama doesn't really believe that or that he cares about the economy. He is simply paying for favors granted by his cadre of clients. He acts not differently than Latin American politicians who also use other people's money to dole out favors, what we call in Mexico clientelismo (literally, "clientism"; loosely, cronyism).

  • ||

    Of course, this net operating loss carryforward bullshit would not be an issue in my Gross Receipts Tax paradise.

  • Realist||

    "Obama seems to believe that pumping money into failure is an economic starter kit."
    Stupid is as stupid does.

  • ||

    We're all crazy. Steve Ratner, the Architect of the Bailout, says not only was it necessary, it was a rampaging SUCCESS.

    How can you possibly argue with that?

  • Almanian||

    Duh. #WINNING

  • Almanian||

    Timely. Here ya go, shriek. Whatever your juvenile arguments, the bottom line (where business is concerned) is that the GM deal was a good fucking of the American taxpayer. Enjoy.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/.....oveLEFTTop

  • shrike||

    I admitted it was a "raw deal" for taxpayers yesterday (my exact words).

    But by mid-2009 it was done. Its like fucking your neighbors wife - once its in you may as well finish.

  • wareagle||

    well, of course, the perceived ends justify the means. Whatever.

  • ||

    Nice pivot. But it's not just taxpayers. It's British Leyland GovMo workers who are making plans based on the lie that their company, and thus their job, is profitable, thus sustainable.

  • Tman||

    He ignored it when I posted it above.

    He can't see the truth because his head is stuck so far up Obama's ass.

  • Sevo||

    From the article:
    "Mr. Obama crowed yesterday about GM's "highest profits in its 100-year history." We'd be interested to hear how its effective tax rate compares with Warren Buffett's secretary's."

    Snark, snark, snark....

  • ||

    By the way, Almanian:

    How 'bout that Biaggi kid?

    Holy fuck- goes off in turn one and races his way back to P2 in race two, after running away from the field in race one.

  • ||

    Treasury acted in our financial interest?

    Ummm, whuut?

  • ||

    Let my people fail.

  • Jeffersonian||

    Shriek is UAW??

  • Chupacabra||

    I always thought shriek was Ben Bernanke.

  • Anonymous Coward||

    standing by American workers was the right thing to do," as bailouts "saved" the auto industry.

    How nice of Barack to save the labor cartels (union). Especially when, given the price of gas, no one will be able to afford to drive a car in the near future.

  • Sevo||

    "standing by American workers"

    Yeah, both of them:
    "Union membership in the private sector has fallen under 7%[2] — levels not seen since 1932."
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L.....ted_States

  • toyota, nissan, et al ||

    bailouts "saved" the auto industry.
    ---------------------
    did we need saving?

  • ||

    lol, Obamas answer to everything, thow a speech at it.

    www.Gone-Anon.tk

  • Alack||

    Is it weird that I find Anon-bot to be one of the best commenters here?

  • Gus||

    He's very good with words.

  • rectal||

    Not at all. Far better than all of rectals personalities.

  • ||

    This is true.

  • Max||

    Does Harsanyi support Ron Paul?

    “It turns out that the brilliant [Bobby Fischer], who has all the makings of an American hero, is very politically incorrect on Jewish questions, for which he will never be forgiven, even though he is a Jew. Thus we are not supposed to herald him as the world’s greatest chess player.” Ron Paul -November 1992, background on Fischer’s “politically incorrect” views (which include Holocaust denial) here.
    http://2012.talkingpointsmemo......etters.php

  • Concerned Citizen||

    I only saw one or two points on there that might not be true. Fuck you and your political correctness.

  • Concerned Citizen||

    I just finished a biogrophy on Eddie Rickenbacker. He also started a car company named after himself. It and 1,600 car manufacturers have failed in the U.S. of A. Must be a mirage I was driving today.

  •  ||

    Cool bromide bro

  • onnta||

    Wow, now that is a rant. From the magazine that said there was no crisis, you bunch of whiners, now says the auto bailout was a failure in as pouty a manner as possible. Does the auto bailout keep you up at night? I know it isn't the bank bailout, or their bonuses paid for by the taxpayer that bugs you. The topic post count should back me up on this.

    I don't think the average person is bothered by employees working together to increase their bargaining power. Businesses do it all the time to get better terms with vendors and suppliers.

  • Sevo||

    onnta|2.29.12 @ 6:54PM|#
    ..."I know it isn't the bank bailout, or their bonuses paid for by the taxpayer that bugs you. The topic post count should back me up on this."

    No, nothing 'backs you up' on that; it's a lie.
    ------------
    "I don't think the average person is bothered by employees working together to increase their bargaining power. Businesses do it all the time to get better terms with vendors and suppliers."

    Uh, did you read the article? It has nothing to do with 'bargaining' and everything to do with rent seeking.

  • Tommie||

    I love my brother, but he's a worthless fuck as a worker. He's lazy, stupid, unreliable, and incompetent unless closely supervised.

    He has asked me for money and I have not given it to him. I offered his a job, and he wouldn't take it. He's happy on his 80th week of unemployment and sponging off our mother and his dipshit girlfriend.

    I am not my brother's keeper, unless he were to get truly disabled. I love him, but it's tough love, he's gotta learn to stand on his own fuckin legs.

    Obama and his gang are so tenderhearted that they rob me and other creators with excessive taxation to subsizize the lazy lifestyles of our many able-bodied but American brothers. All due respect to the office, he can suck my productive toolkit.

  • ||

    This should be categorized an opinion piece. There aren't any fact based arguments or substantive reporting, just one guy's conversation with (at) the president.

    He's right (mostly), but still. This is not news.

  • seo expert in india||

    I read this blog, thanks for sharing this nice blog.

    www.seopromotionwork.com

  • ||

    classmate's mother brought home $18499 a month ago. she makes money on the laptop and got a $524600 home. All she did was get fortunate and put to work the clues made clear on this site Nuttyrich DOTcom

  • OBD2 Scanner||

    What, you don't care about your brothers and sisters?

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