Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump: Who Will Be *Worse*? Is Gary Johnson a "Buffoon"? New Reason Podcast

Podcast: Election 2016, Americans should be proud of the free speech laws that gave rise to Donald Trump and how Tom Wolfe is "America's greatest living essayist."

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Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump: Who Will Be *Worse*? Is Gary Johnson a "Buffoon"? New Reason Podcast

South Park Studios, screen capture

On the latest Reason podcast, Nick Gillespie and Reason magazine editor in chief Katherine Mangu-Ward are joined by Andrew Ferguson, a staffer at The Weekly Standard and author of a series of best-selling books ranging from Land of Lincoln to Crazy U.

The choice between leading presidential candidates Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton has been likened to having to decide between being shot and being poisoned, contracting different sorts of STDs, or electing a giant douche versus a turd sandwich. So which is it? And how do we feel about Gary Johnson, the Libertarian candidate who is polling at historically high numbers yet still manages to disappoint somehow? (Here's a clue: One of us calls him a "buffoon," another is unimpressed but less caustic, and a third says nice things). While Donald Trump has been rising slightly in the poll, does his likely defeat portend a conservative and Republican crackup that will force the right to rethink a process and set of positions that has kept them out of the White House since George W. Bush left with historically high disapproval numbers?

Mangu-Ward discusses her lead piece in the new issue of Reason (currently available only to subscribers), in which she praises American free-speech laws and traditions even as they permit all sorts of crazy talk to flourish:

There's something heartening, however, to be found in the deep awfulness of [Donald Trump's] public statements over the years: the fact that he remains a free man despite uttering them. Because in quite a few otherwise civilized countries, a good deal of what leaves the GOP presidential nominee's mouth on the topic of Muslims, women, and Mexicans could land him in jail.

And Ferguson explains his description of Tom Wolfe as "America's greatest living essayist" and his new book, The Kingdom of Speech, as doing to uncritical evolutionary scientists what previous tomes did to artists and architects.

It's a lively, fast-paced, and intermittently nasty conversation. Listen by clicking below. Produced by Ian Keyser.

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Comments

[AlmightyJB]

Well it's going to be Hillary even though she is the worst. Need to make sure Dems don't get elected to Congress. Gridlock is best case scenerio at this point

[loveconstitution1789]

She's being investigated again by the FBI.

Will two investigations by the FBI be a campaign killer?

[ElizabethCole]

I'm making over $12k a month working part time. I kept hearing other people tell me how much money they can make online so I decided to look into it. Well, it was all true and has totally changed my life. This is what I do... http://www.Trends88.Com

[Sanjuro Tsubaki]

Give it up already. People who post and read here aren't suckers.

[tarran]

OK guys. I have to share a hi-larious article making the rounds amongst my Hilary supporting facederp circle:

Admit It. The Clinton Email Controversy Bothers You, Yet You Don't Actually Know What the Clinton Email Controversy Is: How a poorly explained mistake continues to threaten the political career of the former Secretary of State.

Here's a not very hard challenge. Find all the lies! 😀

[straffinrun]

She was deleting thousands of emails to avoid being caught doing something.

AFTER the subpoena. Neat how he left that out.

[Suthenboy]

Every day more and more shit comes out about Clinton. The level of corruption is just breathtaking and her supporters are just oblivious.

I saw this with Obama. True story: An Obama supporter had become disappointed and made some complaining noises. I couldn't help myself, I had to pile on with "I told you so. There was never a time when it wasn't obvious". He asked how he could have known. I pointed out, using these very words, "He looked right in the camera and told you he was going to fuck you to death. He never tried to hide it."

"He never said that!"

"Yes, he did. Here is the video" *I pull up the video of Obama explicitly saying that his energy plan would cause energy prices to skyrocket. "There it is. Do you have any idea what skyrocketing energy prices will do? The majority of the cost of everything you buy is the cost of the energy it takes to produce that thing and transport it to you. It isnt just gasoline and electricity. It's paint. It's bread. It's shoes. Every goddamned thing you consume. He told you he wants to destroy your lifestyle."

[Suthenboy]

"Well, I never heard that before."

"It was all over the news when that video came to light. Thats just the tip of the iceberg."

**skip forward two weeks. The subject comes up again. This time he is bitching because his insurance premiums are rising along with his deductible.

"I showed you the video of him saying he planned to fuck us all to death. Why are you still acting surprised?"

"What? You never showed me that. I don't remember that. He didn't say that."

I show him again. He professes ignorance of the first viewing. As an experiment I waited a month or so, brought it up again, made the same claim. He professes ignorance a second time.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

The mind has several fairly effective ways of dealing with traumatic events.

[Suthenboy]

How many people get to see the self driving car ads where the young woman is driving down the street singing along to the radio? She drifts off into dreamland where she is singing on some idiot game show in front of judges and nearly rear-ends the car in front of her. The car's safety feature kicks in and prevents the collision. For a moment she has a dazed, blank look on her face while she tries to figure out what the fuck just happened.

These are the kind of brain-dead idiots the country seems over-run with. They walk around in a half daze, a dreamland oblivious to the real world around them always half a step from disaster.

Lady, you are flying down the street with a ton of steel. That is far more dangerous and destructive than shooting a gun. People's lives depend on you paying attention to what you are doing. Pull your fucking head out of your ass.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

Why do you think the world has to be padded with Nerf these days? Some jerk decided that morons need to be saved from the consequences of their idiocy. Unfortunately, too often some moron doing something moronic does actual harm to non-morons.

[Suthenboy]

Me? I didn't think I said that. I was saying that people should get their head out of dreamland and pay attention to the world around them before they do harm to non-morons. Or trying to.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

No shit, and I was agreeing with you...

[Free Society]

Did you even read his comment? He said nothing of the sort.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

*sigh*

Speaking of morons and dreamland.

[Cynical Asshole]

That might be the funniest damn sub-thread I've ever seen. Seriously.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

This level of irony would make a hipster blush.

[Free Society]

There's a winning argument. It's everyone else's fault that you can't string together a coherent statement that says what you claim it says.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

Dude, for your own sake stop showing how much of a retard you can be.

[Free Society]

I get that you like to call names, you have little else going for you in terms of ability to make an argument. But it's not making your point, whatever the hell that might be.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

Ok, fine. If you want to take the retard bit in your retard teeth and run with it I'm not gonna stop you.

[Free Society]

If that's your intellectual crutch then at least have some variety in your name calling.

[Cynical Asshole]

stop showing how much of a retard you can be.

Go easy on him. The concept of the rhetorical question can be a difficult one to grasp for some.

[Free Society]

The obviousness of a rhetorical question is not a guarantee, especially in written form. Suthenboy himself certainly didn't take it that way. I saw no reason to take it that way, the question was asked directly and without any qualifiers.

[PurityDiluting]

"Why do you think the world has to be padded with Nerf these days?"
My Driver's Ed. teacher in high school wanted cars to be padded with rubber bumpers.
That way he could ram all the a*hole drivers off the road without damaging his car.

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

I remember once upon a time a comedian doing a bit about the world being made of Nerf. He had some lines about a plane going down with the pilot coming on and telling the passengers to enjoy the crash.

I can't find it anywhere though and I don't remember who it was.

[PurityDiluting]

Sounds like something George Carlin would say

[robc]

What bothers me most about it, is that as an IT professional, the lies arent even a real attempt to cover up the story.

Like with the IRS controversy, the attempts to blame things on hardware failures and backup issues arent believable to anyone even passingly familiar with the technology.

[grrizzly]

Remember Timmy Geithner? The one who didn't pay income taxes when he worked for the IMF and was later appointed Treasury Secretary. I happen to be rather familiar with the way how taxes are withdrawn from foreign nationals and US citizens working at the IMF and the World Bank. Foreign nationals working for those institutions (and there are many foreigners there) don't pay income tax but the US citizens are supposed to pay it. That's why the US citizens are paid more for the same work at the IMF than foreigners to compensate for the tax disparity. This is common knowledge among anyone who ever worked for the IMF or the World Bank, like I did. I always knew 100% that every excuse offered by Geithner (Turbotax made him do it) was complete bullshit.

[Cynical Asshole]

Find all the lies!

Every declarative statement in the entire article?

[Azathoth!!]

They always use that scenario--

Turd Sandwich vs Giant Douche

But a douche is just vinegar and water. Not really pleasant, but not coprophagic either.

I use vinegar and water in my cooking all the time.

[PurityDiluting]

"coprophagic"
Rarely a day goes by that my vocabulary doesn't expand by reading the comments in H&R

[straffinrun]

"I couldn't vote for Donald Trump on aesthetics alone."

*Sigh*

[$park? is totally a Swifty]

Is Gary Johnson a Buffoon?

No, he's a dolt. Huge difference.

[Crusty Juggler]

I didn't know Joan Didion and David Sedaris were dead.

[Citizen X]

Don't blame me, i voted for Boo Berry.

[straffinrun]

But words are violence. Just ask this guy.

[straffinrun]

Liver and onion dinner if you make it to the end. Any takers?

[Jerryskids]

I made it as far as seeing the guy's haircut and I had to tap out.

[straffinrun]

Onions only then.

[Cynical Asshole]

I couldn't make it past "reverse heckling activism." Or the dumbfuck's douchey hipster beard, glasses, and idiotic looking haircut.

Perhaps if you'd offered something other than liver and onions as a reward I could have made it further, but I doubt it.

[straffinrun]

Can of Chef Boyardee ravioli and a glass of tap water?

[Cynical Asshole]

Chef Boyardee ravioli and a glass of tap water

*flashes back to college days, curls up in fetal position on floor*

I didn't think it could much worse than liver and onions, but low and behold, you pulled it off.

[Suthenboy]

This shit is straight out of the fascist movements from 20th century Europe and the Soviets in Russia. It is pure cultural marxism.

Looking at this guy's rationale, if you can call it that, the source of his irritation, the seriousness which he takes his cause and himself, is it any wonder these types always resort to violence? I bet money I could get the guy to admit wanting to line people up against a wall.

[Cynical Asshole]

I bet money I could get the guy to admit wanting to line people up against a wall.

Probably wouldn't even take much to get it out of him either.

[Zero Sum Game]

I find it amusing that he goes from "insults are violence" to feigning upset at the host suspecting potential violent actions from him. According to your own credo, you just did violence to everyone who heard your screed, buddy.

Internally consistent philosophy is never a strong point of this kind of person. This guy seems to have conditioned himself as a Manchurian Candidate, compartmentalizing a bunch of philosophical nonsense that isn't allowed to touch the other compartments of nonsense and using trigger words on himself to open each compartment separately.

Had I seen this person in the midst of his verbal assault, I'd have assumed that he was schizophrenic (I don't mean MPD, but actual schizophrenia, complete with paranoia about conspiracies focused specifically on him), but he seems to have figured out a way to self-induce schizophrenic tendencies.

[Gadianton]

I've figured out who the real Hillary and Trump are. One is Pennywise, and the other is Krusty. Which is which I leave as an exercise for the reader.

[Free Society]

Clinton. Yes.

[WhatAboutBob]

Trump will be the next president. You are now seeing Trump getting closer to Hillary in the polls as they adjust their models to match reality. Professor Helmut Norpoth is predicting a 5% Trump win based on his research. This betting sites are setting up like Brexit where the big money is predicting one outcome while the majority of the small bets are predicting a different outcome. It's going to be fun watching the liberals go into meltdown on election night.

[Ayn Random Variation]

I ,

[Craig@USA]

Trump has no chance. The best thing about either of them being elected though is that the next president will be a lame duck with impeachment concerns.

[Jerryskids]

For all the talk about "focusing on the issues", the only issue I'm concerned with is this: When you look at all the troubles in the world is your first instinct to ask "What should the government be doing to address this problem?" If so, you're part of the problem. Because there's a good chance if you look closer at any given problem, the government's already trying to fix the problem and they're making it worse. A better question would be "What should the government stop doing to address this problem?" (And even government "success stories" have to be qualified with the question of whether or not the government program was worth the price, yet few people even bother thinking about any sort of cost/benefit analysis, let alone a complete one that takes into consideration things like opportunity costs and moral hazards.)

So, no, I don't need to waste my time analyzing Trump's plan for healthcare or Hillary's plan for income inequality - the fact that they have a plan at all tells me all I need to know. They both think government is the answer to all problems.

[Cynical Asshole]

So... reason has 2 podcasts now? Or is The Fifth Column a side project of Welch?

[GILMORE?]

B.

I wish they'd expand on the 5th column, and let Matt organize different round-tables with Reason personae... and keep KMW and Nick in the print/video sphere, respectively.

Its not just that they can't stop using the platform to moan boringly about Trump *(as though the magazine needs a new forum for that?)... its that they're just a very poor contrast to Matt/Mike/Kmele's dynamic and free-wheeling conversation. They have the tempo and energy of NPR on lithium

[Cynical Asshole]

They have the tempo and energy of NPR on lithium

Glad it's blocked at work then so I won't be tempted to listen to it.

[Robert]

Johnson's not a buffoon, but "wet noodle" or "dishrag" come to mind. Good enougto be elected twice governor of NM, but couldn't people tell on the national stage in 2011 in Republican prez debates that he was unimpressive? So bad that the m.c. of one of them asked him a joke Q not asked of other candidates?& no, it wasn't because he's a libertarian, because Ron Paul didn't get that kind of approach.

[Zero Sum Game]

He has one attractive quality that is all to rare in politicians: he's genuine. I suspect that quality would have shored up any weaknesses and gotten politicians elected back before radio and later television dragged all our Presidential candidates out in front of absolutely everyone in the country. The Internet turned it into a true 24/7 activity.

Reputation is nothing anymore. It's something that can be easily manipulated, controlled, distorted. I feel that it was something you had in spite of the press, and the big change is that it is now something you have because of the press.

Being a genuine person is a liability now. You have to be a master of deception or you're not fit enough, and the jackals will devour you. You can do as Ron Paul did and demonstrate the kind of person you are continually, leaving no room for an honest person to dispute your motives. So they simply find some dishonest people. Operatives lie their asses off in every sphere, given free rein to do so by the ubiquity of media. How many people were out there pushing the lie that Ron Paul was going to overturn Roe v. Wade, despite the fact that he had no designs on doing anything like that and a track record of honesty wasn't enough to overturn carefully sown suspicion?

Gary can't be the perfect candidate because nobody can. He is the best candidate we currently have, both as a person and a politician, but that isn't what works anymore.

[Hank Phillips]

It works. The key is in the definition of winning. If I tell you I want my son shot and jailed, my home confiscated, unemployment up, the markets crashed and my daughter to bleed to death because of accidental pregnancy, you will recommend I vote Republican. To them that's winning.
But I tell you I want less initiation of force, the personal income tax abolished, to eat, drink and smoke what I please and be master of my financial decisions (winning). The recommendation can only be to vote for the LP platform Gary is standing on, secure in the knowledge that, as in 1892 or 1909, libertarian spoiler votes have way more law changing power than votes wasted on mindless shape-shifting con artists fronting for soft machines. I know that even if Gary received 60% of the votes, a way would be found to defraud the election, but the fright would cause the looters to abolish a mess of bad laws--which is what I really want. THAT's winning.

[Hank Phillips]

Herbert Clark Hoover and George Waffen Bush left office despised for the same reason. Hoover was the Great Dry Hope destined by God to keep light beer a federal felony. George Bush, ditto, only for all the enjoyable nonaddictive and non-toxic drugs that might cut onto the alcohol and big pharma markets. Both presidents packed the federal bureaucracy with religious fanatics for prohibitionism, and both cooperated with Congress to enforce asset-forfeiture, libel and income tax laws specifically targeting prohibition cases. These identical policies caused money to flee banks and brokerages, hence the Crashes with liquidity crises as harbingers of collapse and depression. Brokers and Treasury officials understand these things, but naturally deny all knowledge of their actions. The mechanism is simple, explained in Free to Choose, and was understood in the 1930s. If history rhymes, those looters will not return to the White House before 2028--longer if replaced by the LP.

[Uncle Jay]

RE: Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump: Who Will Be *Worse*? Is Gary Johnson a "Buffoon"? New Reason Podcast

Who will be worse?
Cyanide or Arsenic?

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[Sanjuro Tsubaki]

They're all killer clowns.

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[believe]

If our economy and national security means anything to Hillary or to Donald, they'd open dialog and layout their plans to balance the budget for starters. We're $19 Trillion in debt. Our government and infrastructure is antiquated and grossly inefficient. Both H & D have big plans to expand gov with new programs we can't possibly pay for.

Hillary is a liar, stands for crony capitalism and war. Middle Eastern Tribes have been infighting since the 7th century, that's 1,300 years! She doesn't have the common sense to realize that our operations won't change this and meddling has destabilized more than it's helped. She has no regard for life!

Trump is also a liar, and a con, a bigot, a fascist, a sexual predator, and now a whiner! He's a loose cannon who incites violence, and threaten our security and freedoms. Trump focuses on Trump. He's not a person, he's a brand.

Gary Johnson may not have names on the tip of his tongue but understands the real cost of unnecessary and ineffective military interventions is. He supports military supremacy but has a foreign policy based on defense. Johnson / Weld are experienced governors with practical experience in working across party lines as reelected Republican Governors in Democratic majority states to affect reforms without tax increases. What's happened to honesty and integrity? I hope that one or more states vote's are able to tilt the electorate for real change. Don't vote for the lesser of two evils...Vote Johnson/Weld!