Camille Paglia: 'Universities Are an Absolute Wreck Right Now'

She talks feminism, Beyonce's Lemonade, Prince's career, and more.

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Camille Paglia: 'Universities Are an Absolute Wreck Right Now'

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"The universities are an absolute wreck right now," said Camille Paglia. "For decades any graduate student in the humanities who had independent thinking was driven out."

Paglia, the noted cultural critic, university professor, and Salon columnist, sat down with Reason's Nick Gillespie to discuss whether we should still look to universities for cultural production and knowledge. She noted a shift in attitude toward authority on campus: Students used to look for ways to get administrators out of their private lives; today's college kids are calling for more control over their lives.

"It's a nightmare, an outrage, and none of the faculty have fought back. […] They pretend to be leftists, they're pygmys; they are passive worms; not to fight back against the bureaucrats," says Paglia.

Paglia—who also offered her take on Beyonce's new album, Lemonade, Prince's career, and why she prefers early Madonna—sat down with Gillespie at Reason Weekend 2016, the annual donor event for the nonprofit that publishes Reason.com and Reason magazine. The event took place April 28 through May 1, 2016 in Phliadelphia.

About 33 minutes.

Shot by Paul Detrick and Todd Krainin. Edited by Detrick.

Scroll down for downloadable versions and subscribe to ReasonTV's YouTube Channel to receive notification when new material goes live.

Comments

[sarcasmic]

"culutral"? Does that have something to do with Cthulhu? I sure hope so.

[Gozer the Gozarian]

Cthulhu and I are running for president on the libertarian gods ticket.

[NYC2AZ]

So the transdimensional travel was deemed worthy in these trying times?

[Irish is a Millennial, Poll Me]

More importantly, Camille Paglia just buttfucked the New York Times' ridiculous "Donald Trump likes hot women" story

The drums had been beating for weeks about a major New York Times expose in the works that would demolish Trump once and for all by revealing his sordid lifetime of misogyny. When it finally appeared as a splashy front-page story this past Sunday (originally titled "Crossing the Line: Trump's Private Conduct with Women"), I was off in the woods pursuing my Native American research. On Monday, after seeing countless exultant references to this virtuoso takedown, I finally read the article?and laughed out loud throughout. Can there be any finer demonstration of the insularity and mediocrity of today's Manhattan prestige media? Wow, millionaire workaholic Donald Trump chased young, beautiful, willing women and liked to boast about it. Jail him now! Meanwhile, the New York Times remains mute about Bill Clinton's long record of crude groping and grosser assaults?not one example of which could be found to taint Trump.

[Irish is a Millennial, Poll Me]

"Blame for this fiasco falls squarely upon the New York Times editors who delegated to two far too young journalists, Michael Barbaro and Megan Twohey, the complex task of probing the glitzy, exhibitionistic world of late-twentieth-century beauty pageants, gambling casinos, strip clubs, and luxury resorts. Neither Barbaro, a 2002 graduate of Yale, nor Twohey, a 1998 graduate of Georgetown University, had any frame of reference for sexual analysis aside from the rote political correctness that has saturated elite American campuses for nearly 40 years. Their prim, priggish formulations in this awkwardly disconnected article demonstrate the embarrassing lack of sophistication that passes for theoretical expertise among their over-paid and under-educated professors.

When I saw the reporters' defensive interview on Monday with CNN anchors Kate Bolduan and John Berman, I felt sorry for the earnest, owlish Barbaro, who seems like a nice fellow who has simply wandered out of his depth. But Twohey, with her snippy, bright and shiny careerism, took a page from the slippery Hillary playbook in the way she blatheringly evaded any direct answer to a pointed question about how Rowanne Brewer Lane's pleasantly flirtatious first meeting with Trump at a crowded 1990 pool party at Mar-a-Lago ended up being called "a debasing face-to-face encounter" in the Times. The hidden agenda of advocacy journalism has rarely been caught so red-handed."

[Playa Manhattan.]

She's really making a name for herself being right all the time.

[Crusty Juggler]

I was off in the woods pursuing my Native American research

That is a fine euphemism, ma'am.

[Renegade Jew]

+1 John Redcorn.

[RBS]

- 1 headache

[Demoted Comment (Slammer)]

She's a wonderful writer.

[Gozer the Gozarian]

...of fiction.

[mad.casual]

delegated to two far too young journalists...a 1998 graduate of Georgetown University

That puts her at or above 40 by my math. Either way, well past the age and time when, on a personal level, PC brainwashing has gone the way of Santa Claus. I think either Camille's being naive, ageist/nostalgic, or both.

[Irish is a Millennial, Poll Me]

"Either way, well past the age and time when, on a personal level, PC brainwashing has gone the way of Santa Claus"

Not in Manhattan media it hasn't.

[mad.casual]

Not in Manhattan media it hasn't.

Still I say 'not possible'. Like telling me the Ministry Of Information has NYC or Manhattan on lockdown for anyone < 40 while plenty of anti-PC propaganda exists and several of its progenitors live in Manhattan/NYC.

40 yrs. old means she was alive and approximately 'of age' when movies like 'Desparately Seeking Susan' and 'When Harry Met Sally', and 'Coming To America' were made.

Maybe Camille's being polite, but I can't jive living entirely through the 80s and buying into the PC narrative in the way she describes without a hefty dose of 'willful ignorance'.

[GILMORE?]

Irish is right.

How old they are has nothing to do with it. Its the consensus of the environment one lives in.

[mad.casual]

How old they are has nothing to do with it.

Then how is 'far too young' relevant? How old and well-travelled/educated would they have to be to cease being 'far too young'. The only sense it makes is as politeness/pleasantry, misplaced nostalgia, or scapegoating.

You can't possibly, as an honest and functioning adult, simultaneously believe Trump (or any other rich, powerful magnate) to be a vile womanizer, an abnoxiously overbearing and powerful blowhard, and chaste/upstanding/faithful/chivalrous gentleman for all of his life (including the decade of decadence). It's like discovering an adult who believes that the Pope doesn't shit and ascribing their ignorance to their youth. Ignorance is certain and, IMO, willfulness is very strongly indicated.

You're right that youth has nothing to do with it. These people aren't naive victims of a PC war that they were brought up in anywhere near as much as knowing perpetrators and accomplices. They saw the sexism/chauvinism of the 80s first-hand, lived through the Clinton and Bush Eras, probably even enjoy it in their Mad Men episodes, and then act aloof to generate a false expectation about Trump that no sane adult would have in the first place.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

The culture of academia was already pushing hard in establishing PC as the de facto intellectual framework for the country during the 90s. Twohey's about my age, and I remember very well classes with professors telling us to not use stereotypical words like "Indians" in our essays and the requirement, even in the mid-90s, that we had to have a "multicultural" (read: non-white European) class credit as part of our graduation requirements (not to mention having student fees to the commie shits at CoPIRG being automatically added to our tuition bill). Towards the end of the decade is when the idea of "whiteness" came into fashion, which later morphed into the "white privilege" meme with SJWs--all of which first took root in academia.

Plus, Twohey's a Georgetown grad, and god knows what kind of hyper-progressive social circle she restricted herself to while living in DC during the height of the Clinton/Lewinsky drama. It's not out of bounds to criticize her for never leaving her hugbox and seeing how ridiculous a piece like Trump's Hoochies would look to someone outside the NYC-DC Megacity 1 media complex.

[mad.casual]

Their age is irrelevant and/or culturing/education/upbringing is irrelevant, IMO. If they were 20 and couldn't remember the 80s at all or 30, went to a Baptist or Nazarene University and were reporting for the Christian Science Monitor, I might buy that they're too young/naive/sheltered. A 30-yr.-old Yale grad. working for The NYT should have a pretty damned good bead on what NYC was like in the 70s and 80s and what the NYTs reputation is. And if he doesn't, he shouldn't have his fundamental misalignment with reality waved away by his 'youth'. At some point they have to stop being dumb kids and are either plain dumb or playing dumb. Otherwise, it makes it sound like these two reporters are Clark Kent and they just happened blow into Metropolis from Smallville only to get picked to write a slam piece for the NYT.

[Red Rocks Rockin]

I think you underestimate just how sheltered these people make themselves. One of my childhood buddies is a PhD in English from Notre Dame and has lived on both coasts. He's a partisan Democrat and it shows in every one of his arguments, because he can't do anything except spout boilerplate from OFA email blasters and parrot the same talking points he and his fellow academics discuss at their cocktail parties. It's like talking with a walking Salon article, and its all because he's deliberately chosen to not associate with anyone who doesn't share his biases and opinions. I don't think it's out of the realm of probability that Twohey's done the same thing.

[mad.casual]

I think you underestimate just how sheltered these people make themselves.

If true, then these people are more despicably idiotic than the most fundamentalist conservative religious idiots. I don't doubt that these people surround themselves selectively but, most all of the adults I've been around who do so are acutely aware of that fact.

I understand living and being raised in an echo chamber, but even the Amish have a Rumspringa and the Westboro Baptists recognize that homosexuality exists and that there are people out there, some of them wealthy politicians and business magnates, who indulge in it.

Even then, and I've come to realize that this is the central disconnect that rubs me the wrong way; ascribing the poor portrayal to youthful inexperience, at 30 or 40, is no better than the University Admins who've coddled them thus far. They're 30-40 and writing for the NYT, youthful ignorance isn't a valid excuse anymore. Just call them disingenuous hacks writing a hit piece for a crooked paper.

[Squinja]

From what you are saying I'm not sure people other than hard-core lefties are going to want to hang out with him.

The modern leftist is amazingly secure inside their bubble of ignorance and it's been rare to have any engage past the point their talking points run out. (Well, that's usually when the allegations of isms starts).

[Ted S.]

Four years younger than I. I turn 44 in June.

[Intraveneous Woodchipper]

Congrats! Reason party!

[Crusty Juggler]

That was great. This photo from the NYT story illicited this paragraph from her:

Small and blurry in the print edition, the Brewer-Trump photo in online digital format positively pops with you-are-there luminosity. Her midnight-blue evening dress opulently cradling her bare shoulders, Rowanne is all flowing, glossy hair, ample, cascading bosom, and radiant, lushly crimson Rita Hayworth smile. The hovering Trump, bedecked with the phallic tongue of a violet Celtic floral tie, is in Viking mode, looking like a triumphant dragon on the thrusting prow of a long boat. "To the victor belong the spoils!" I said to myself in admiration, as seductive images from Babylon to Paris flashed through my mind. Yes, here is all the sizzling glory of hormonal sex differentiation, which the grim commissars of campus gender studies will never wipe out!

I need a cigarette!

[Citizen X]

Whoa, why are my pants off?

[Renegade Jew]

illicited

Intentional?

[Crusty Juggler]

Uhhh....yes...I did that purposely...sure...I am just that good...

[SugarFree]

Pro Tip: Don't be married to the leader singer of Warrant for 9 years.

[Citizen X]

She looks a little bit like Neil deGrasse Tyson in a wig.

[SugarFree]

Is that the Jello Pudding Pop guy?

[Derp-o-Matic 5000]

Way too old and conscious for that guy's taste

[If-by-whiskey]

Uhh.. I'll be right back

[Brutus]

Word is Trump is openly heterosexual. Is there any truth to this charge?

[Derp-o-Matic 5000]

I was off in the woods pursuing my Native American research.

Oh, shit! She's going after Chief Senator Warren next!

[commodious spittoon]

If momentum were a surge of electromagnetic energy, Donald Trump against all odds has it now.

What?

smash-the-cucumber-frames

What?

her frugal, unmaterialistic opponent, Bernie Sanders (my candidate)

What?

[Raven Nation]

Partially offthread, and probably not surprising, the AAUP is not convinced "that Professor [Melissa] Click's actions, even when viewed in the most unfavorable light, were adequate grounds for her dismissal".

[Playa Manhattan.]

The smart thing to do:
Say nothing at all. They're just embarrassing themselves, if that's even possible.

"The AAUP maintains that adequate grounds for dismissal must be related, directly and substantially, to the fitness of faculty members in their professional capacities as teachers or researchers."

So, calling for violence against students is not directly and substantially related to her professional capacity as a teacher? Uh huh.

[Renegade Jew]

Academic freedom. Jesus, you really don't get it.

[Raven Nation]

Calling for violence was pretty close to being a criminal act and, for that alone, she could have been in trouble even if it didn't directly relate to her assigned academic duties.

If the AAUP is correct in some of its other charges, Missouri may have a problem because it seems they violated their own rules in how they went about dismissing her. If so, it's stupid on the part of the administration.

[commodious spittoon]

it's stupid on the part of the administration

Unless it was intentional.

Fire the woman to placate those calling for it (quite rightly, in my opinion), but do it in such a way that it violates her union contract. A few months later when it's fallen off the front page, reinstate her with back-pay. I'm willing to bet police departments do this all the time.

[LarryA]

The AAUP maintains that adequate grounds for dismissal must be related, directly and substantially, to the fitness of faculty members in their professional capacities as teachers or researchers.

The whole point of holding a demonstration is to get publicity for your cause. To that end you NEVER EVER want to piss-off journalists. Particularly journalists sympathetic to your cause, as a student journalist would likely be to fellow students.

What she should have done when the student journalist showed up, is hand him a press release, show him to a front-row vantage point, and offer to answer any questions he had in quotable sound-bites. Or, even better, have one of her students primed to go on camera and answer the questions.

Click was a "communications" prof who showed she had no comprehension of the basics of her field of study. That makes her obviously incompetent and unfit to be teaching communications.

[mtrueman]

I'm surprised by her blanket dismissal of those French post structuralists. One of the distinguishing characteristics of the movement is its rejection of Marxism, something a Reason editor would normally be celebrating. What little I know of Derrida can be summed in one sentence: there is no final reading to text. There is always the possibility for an alternate reading. To me that's liberating. I'm surprised nobody agrees with me.

[Square = Circle]

One of the distinguishing characteristics of the movement is its rejection of Marxism

No it isn't. The distinguishing characteristic par excellence is a refusal to reject Marxism despite having blown apart its philosophical foundations.

That's how you get completely schizophrenic books like Jameson's Cultural Logic of Late Capitalism, and why it took Derrida until 1992 to do a deconstruction of The Communist Manifesto and soft-balled it when he did, declaring Marx to still have fundamental value despite the constant and fundamental logical contradictions.

And while Derrida is certainly an underappreciated thinker in most quarters (and way over-appreciated in others) I think you could revise

Derrida can be summed in one sentence: there is no final reading to text

to

Derrida can be summed in one sentence: there is no final reading to text except his

[mtrueman]

"Derrida can be summed in one sentence: there is no final reading to text except his"

Nobody, not even Derrida, can stop you from disagreeing with him.

[mtrueman]

"No it isn't. The distinguishing characteristic par excellence is a refusal to reject Marxism despite having blown apart its philosophical foundations."

My apologies. Instead of saying the post structuralists rejected Marxism, I should have said they merely destroyed its philosophical foundations.

[Brandybuck]

There is no final reading of a text, because thereis always more leftist twaddle that can be pulled from it.

[mtrueman]

Something tells me you disapprove.

[Tak Kak]

"there is no final reading to text. There is always the possibility for an alternate reading. To me that's liberating. I'm surprised nobody agrees with me."

At first I did agree but then I read it again.

[mtrueman]

but then I read it again.

There is always the possibility for an alternate reading

[Gozer the Gozarian]

It all depends on how you "identified" with the reading.

[mtrueman]

"how you "identified" with the reading"

It's nothing so exotic as to require scare quotes. It's about the potential to interpret and find new meaning. As I say, not something to be dismissed so airily on the way to more important topics like pop stars.

[BearOdinson]

Of course, anyone can take anything and put their own meaning into it. And of course the author can't dictate how the reader interprets the writing. So you don't have to stop with the author's intention. But if you don't at least start there, then you are just making shit up as you go.

And at some point, reinterpreting shit just becomes an excuse for lazy university PhD candidates to come up with something NEW, without having to come up with something of SUBSTANCE.

[mtrueman]

"But if you don't at least start there, then you are just making shit up as you go."

That's never as easy as it sounds, knowing an author's intention, and there will inevitablly be disagreement among any two scholars what it was.

"And at some point, reinterpreting shit just becomes an excuse for lazy university PhD candidates to come up with something NEW, without having to come up with something of SUBSTANCE."

That's probably true of an uncomfortable amount scholarship in every faculty, even in fields like software engineering. Can hardly blame Derrida for that.

[Gozer the Gozarian]

Sounds similar to most of the "material" coming out of Hollywood nowadays.

Scare quotes intentional to annoy the shit out of people.

[mtrueman]

"Sounds similar to most of the "material" coming out of Hollywood nowadays."

That shouldn't be a surprise. Hollywood is one place where a degree in the Humanities specializing in these French post structuralists is a benefit. Didn't hurt The Matrix, for example.

If you are trying to annoy me, you gotta come up with something better than quotation marks.

[lap83]

who also offered her take on Beyonce's new album, Lemonade, Prince's career, and why she prefers early Madonna

I didn't watch the video, but I'm going to take a wild guess that she wasn't the one initiating those conversations

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[Gozer the Gozarian]

Where suspicion fills the air and holds scholars in line for fear of their jobs, there can be no exercise of the free intellect. Supineness and dogmatism take the place of inquiry. A problem can no longer be pursued to its edges. Fear stalks the classroom. The teacher is no longer a stimulant to adventurous thinking; she becomes instead a pipe line for safe and sound information. A deadening dogma takes the place of free inquiry. Instruction tends to become sterile; pursuit of knowledge is discouraged; discussion often leaves off where it should begin.

-- Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas

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[Claude]

Twenty years ago I had been very impressed by Camille Paglia but now she just sounds like these old sixty-eighters that are so nostalgic of the time of their youth that they cannot see anything positive in the new generations. The golden past never existed. Each generation wants to believe that after them nothing good can ever happen but there are wonderful new creative trends emerging all the time. Perhaps it is time for Ms. Paglia to consider retiring from the academic world...

[Sevo]

So, other than some existential disagreement with her, did you have any specific comments?

[Mrs. Renard]

Only her entire spiel on how today's generation, etc. etc. Music today is not erotic, because anything goes.... really sounds like a good-old-days-romatic sometimes.

[Intraveneous Woodchipper]

That's exactly what Gillespie said and she offered an explanation/excuse for it.

[Sevo]

Terrible, terrible!
"Former Miss Universe: Donald Trump called me 'Miss Piggy' and 'Miss Housekeeping'"
http://www.sfgate.com/technolo.....755087.php

TERRIBLE, I tell you! Can you imagine any human horrible enough to call a woman "Miss Piggy"? I can't! Nope! Not possible!
But then I don't get to beauty pageants very often.

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[Mrs. Renard]

She credits capitalism for liberating women and she supports Sanders?
WTF

[nrob]

I hope it's due to her picking the underdog, or the august process of "eenie, meenie, miny, Democrat B"

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