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News Outlets Ignore Millennials' Skepticism of Gun Control

Youth opinion on firearms is far from monolithic.

Mike Stocker/TNS/NewscomMike Stocker/TNS/NewscomThe predominant narrative coming out of the Parkland, Florida, shooting is that young people are demanding gun control. The teenaged survivors-turned-activists of Parkland have pushed that angle hard, organizing "March for Our Lives" rallies and student walkouts across the country. But young people's opinions about gun control are much more diverse than that story implies.

Mainstream and left-leaning media outlets have been happy to present the post-Parkland clamor for more gun restrictions as a "youth-led" uprising against their pro-gun elders. "Pit a youth movement for firearms regulation against an aging gun lobby—the kids will ultimately win," declares a headline in today's Los Angeles Times. "Adults marvel at youth-led gun control movement," says The Boston Globe. "Boston teens say it's about time."

CNN ran an article detailing how student activists "led" the Washington, D.C., March for Our Lives rally on Saturday, downplaying the heavy organizational support they received from adult gun control advocates. Recent survey data show that only 10 percent of rally attendees were under 18 and the average age of the adults present was 49. And while most of the press coverage has implied that young people are overwhelmingly in favor of more gun control, comments from actual young people suggest their views are not quite so monolithic.

Consider a conversation that broke out on the r/news sub-Reddit last night. Below an article mentioning that donations to the National Rifle Association (NRA) had tripled following the Parkland massacre was an explosion of comments that were mostly skeptical of gun control.

"It's insane to me that the biggest push for gun reform is happening under this administration," reads one the most popular comments. "If ever we needed an example on why the Bill of Rights is so important, this is it."

That comment was followed by a bunch of self-declared left-leaners saying they were more than fine with gun rights. "I'm a liberal and I think it's a natural right to be able to defend oneself," said one commenter. Said another, "I identify as a social democrat and even I enjoy gun sports and believe people should have access to them."

I don't know the ages of these people. But given that 58 percent of Reddit users are in the 18-to-29 bracket, it's fair to assume the commenters in this thread skew young.

That impression is supported by public opinion surveys finding that millennials are the age group least in favor of gun control. A 2015 Pew poll* found that only 49 percent of 18-to-29-year-olds favored an "assault weapons" ban, compared to 55 percent of those aged 30 to 49 and 63 percent of those 65 or older. A March 6 Quinnipiac poll, taken several weeks after the Parkland shooting, found that only 46 percent of 18-to-34 year olds support an assault weapons ban, rising to 51 percent for those aged 35 to 49, 68 percent for those aged 50-to-64, and 80 percent for those over 65.

Pro-gun youngsters are not limited to Reddit. Sixteen-year-old sport shooting champion Cheyenne Dalton—a self-described "shooter, musician, good kid"—has a Twitter feed with 630 followers that mixes trick shot videos, gun safety tips, and retweets of NRA spokeswoman Dana Loesch.

Millennials who support the Second Amendment are themselves surprised at the pro-gun leanings of their peers. When an NPR reporter cited polling data indicating that young people tend to be skeptical of gun control, 19-year-old gun rights activist Abigail Kaye responded, "That's surprising, because I feel like we're a more progressive generation…We've grown up more, I think, with this kind of gun violence, so you'd think maybe we'd push for more regulations."

No wonder she's surprised. Contrary to the impression left by most of the press coverage, the gun control battle is being fought within generational cohorts, not just between them.

This post has been updated to include the more recent Quinnipiac poll numbers.

CORRECTION: The original version of this post said the referenced Pew poll was conducted in 2017, when it was actually conducted in 2015.

Photo Credit: Mike Stocker/TNS/Newscom

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  • Libertymike||

    Gun grabbing twinks and fags and lezzies are so UGLY.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    You can't disagree with a group without descending into slurs, huh?

  • JesseAz||

    Hogg and his merry band of morons can't either. They are literally saying anyone who dosagrees with them are child murderers.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    And they shouldn't be our role models.

  • ThomasD||

    Response in kind does not make them role models.

    Or is irony truly dead?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    It does, in fact, make them role models.

    Have you ever heard the expression "don't mud wrestle with a pig"? You just get dirty, and the... hog likes it.

  • Longtobefree||

    Irony requires literacy.
    Refer to any college campus or high school curriculum to see where the problem is.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Irony is using your opponents' own logical fallacies against them, then wondering why people on your own side are criticizing you.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    These punk kids are great for NRA and related organization recruiting and fundraising. And the best part is that the only people they convince of anything are the ones already in the tank for gun confiscation.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    #RelevancyInCriticism

  • Flinch||

    Talk, brother.
    Since politics is a circle, I rewound to a song that just seems to fit Hogg's milieu [his head being planted firmly in a highly negative part of the ether] to discover a place he cannot stay...

    Human race was dyin out
    No one left to scream and shout
    People walkin on the moon
    Smog will get you pretty soon... ship of fools, ship of fools.

  • Libertymike||

    Once again, Emma Gonzales is the quintessence of UGLY.

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    Liar. You would, if you could get your Hogg to salute.

  • JesseAz||

    She should have realized her mistake in the fact that even Sinead O'Conner wasn't considered hot.

  • wingnutx||

    Oh yes she was :P

  • ThomasD||

    If we truly were playing by their rules then you'd have to explain why you are defending such a raving lunatic statist.

    But we are not quite there.

    Yet.

  • Jerryskids||

    C'mon, this isn't about gun control. It's about control, period. It's not enough that they can make you eat shit or even that they can make you eat shit and say you like it, you must eat shit, say you like it, and *mean* it.

    Besides which, let young Mr. Hogg have his 15 minutes, he'll never have a chance to be in the spotlight again. Except for the inevitable few days about five years from now when he announces that henceforth he'd like to be called Brandi and we'll have to be reminded who this lady even is.

  • Libertymike||

    Brandi will be even uglier.

  • Bearded Spock||

    When young Mister Hogg's fall from grace inevitably occurs, it will be one of the most cringe-worthy and wince-inducing of any public figure in recent memory.

    The guy has made a legion of enemies in a very short amount of time, they have very loooong memories, and the internet is forever.

    Like most high schoolers, he has no concept of what adult life is like. He's going to get a rude awakening pretty soon.

  • silver.||

    This is possible, but it's also possible that he becomes a very successful politician, professor, or professional activist. An awful lot of people will die with no concept of what adult life is like, and I think that trend is worsening.

  • Bearded Spock||

    The fly in the ointment of Mr. Hogg's future plans is that he appears to have little talent for being anything other than a professional Useful Idiot.

    Like Cindy Sheehan, once he stops being useful to the Left he will rapidly fade into obscurity. He has already demonstrated he has zero political skills outside of what his media-created fame has loaned him.

    In that regard he's more like Hillary Clinton, a supremely arrogant and profoundly unlikeable person who obtained her position and power purely by circumstance rather than merit.

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    The Left likes its useful idiots.

  • Hank Phillips||

    I'd never heard of Cindy Sheehan but now want to recruit her. Her description of George Waffen Bush is spot on. Wait'll she finds out there is a real peace and freedom party that isn't a looter sockpuppet...

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Silver, this is why we have to bring back McCartyism. Hogg should be on a blacklist for the rest of his life. Becoming largely unemployable.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    You know who else wanted to put their ideological enemies on government watchlists...?

  • This Machine Chips Fascists||

    John Adams?

  • Earth Skeptic||

    Every sitting president?

  • JesseAz||

    Hogg himself.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Theeere you go.

  • Kivlor||

    Richard Nixon?

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Crusty, but his is written in his own excrement.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Nobody likes a sore loser.

  • silver.||

    We can speculate that his failure to get into various colleges is related to his activism. I'd think most schools would be happy to have him ..

  • JesseAz||

    Schools made their decision prior to the shooting. The mailers just went out after. Average gpa at his school was inflated to above a 4. His SAT was marginal. He's not a smart person.

  • ThomasD||

    His usefulness will last as long as his boyish appearance. The only reason he has lasted as long as he has is the well funded machine behind him. When he no longer serves their purpose he will be quietly discarded, much like Cindy Sheehan was.

  • Red Tony||

    Oh, yeah, like they'll cover it.

    How the fuck did pigdude become a national figure, anyway? And who is he?

  • JesseAz||

    Democrats on average are ugly, so they found a dumb kid and who was above average for Democrats in looks and promoted him.

  • RoyMo||

    Or he might have "a come to jesus moment" and become a survivalist taking shots at DNR employees in the mountains of Idaho.

    Hillary was a Goldwater Girl, my Mom was a supporter of the IWW and thought Eugene McCarthy was a false flag operation, now she is a Ted Cruz fan.

    The kind of crazy stupid one is as a teenager is not the same crazy stupid one is as an adult.

  • BigChiefWahoo||

    I think many, most? of us start having a different view of government when we start filing income tax returns and having to pay IN, rather than getting a "refund" from kindly old Uncle Sam.

  • ThomasD||

    "Hillary was a Goldwater Girl"

    Hillary claimed to be a Goldwater girl. What she has always proven to be is a shallow opportunist.

  • FlameCCT||

    I expect Hogg will be dumped just after the mid-term elections and possibly accused of helping the GOP should they gain more seats just like Cindy what's-her-name during Bush43.

  • hardcorps||

    That is very accurate. When the Dems get hammered in November because of gun control, they will sacrifice Pigglett to appease the angry gods of public opinion.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    I said the same thing the other day. He'll get thrown away like rotten garbage, just like she did once Obama was directing the war machine.

  • Bubba Jones||

    I spend too much time on Reddit. They are all morons, even when they say something I happen to agree with.

  • silver.||

    I made an alternate account to argue for gun rights, and found myself butting up against an anti-spam rule. Because of the 10min timer, I couldn't defend my position or even debate at all, and because my perspective was unwelcome to that crowd, it was downvoted; eventually the negative karma caused my comment to be auto-hidden, and my viewpoint drops from the conversation entirely, so it was impossible to get back to net positive karma to overcome the spam timer.

    Completely ruined it as a viable debate platform for me. Look at the cat pictures and move along.

  • Bubba Jones||

    I was banned from an environmental community because I posted a reason link that was insufficiently global warming alarmist.

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    That's what you get for all of your hate speech.

  • silver.||

    Man, the in-built system insufficiencies are bad enough, but the culture actively promotes suppression of dissent. That so many mods are tyrannical and petty offers chilling insight into the normal human capacity for ideological intolerance, especially when wielding power.

  • Hank Phillips||

    I was led to my first Libertarian meeting by an econazi I was following and debunking on campus. The LP folks at that 1980 meeting completely declawed the wretch, and did it so deftly that I stayed to study their tactics.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Interesting. And when did your mental health issues begin?

  • Palin's Buttplug||

    I was banned from Bratfart.com for posting classic liberal/libertarian philosophy.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    No, probably for the same vile shit you say around here. Or worse. You are a disingenuous turd, after all.

  • marshaul||

    Whereas you are just a plain turd, right?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    An ingenuous turd. Very honest and forthright.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Green Cars threatened to ban me for citing evidence that did not support AGW. Which they claim is a terms of service violation.

    Nothing is more weak and cowardly than a progressive. With ideas so strong, even discussion of them is forbidden.

  • Hank Phillips||

    Why don't you run your own blog?

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    If you stay away from political subreddits, it's not that bad.

  • SIV||

    They are all morons. I can find active hobby Reddits with tons of posts and nobody knows what they are talking about. They're not even reading, much less participating in, the non-Reddit message boards/forums for the hobby they're seemingly interested in. They just prattle on with somebody saying something totally wrong followed by a bunch agreeing with him or "correcting" the poster with something just as wrong.

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    Dude, most people at r/BackYardChickens are not there to score or brag about their conquests.

  • Red Tony||

    I know we do the "SIV fucks chickens" jokes to the point of overuse, but dammit, this one made me laugh because it's just such a perfect response to SIV's post.

  • silver.||

    Should've known that Britches was a redditor.

    I've seen the tide waning on gun control on reddit recently, but it's still pretty strong. About every day there's an anti-2A headline on the front page, and many of them are kind of silly, "NRA quadrupled advertising budget since Parkland." I didn't read the article, and probably nobody else did, but I'm guessing their previous advertising budget was pretty paltry. I feel like they made a poor choice with the YouTube ads and such, but I don't know shit about marketing.

    Fear of Trump is invigorating gun rights for many in my generation. The seed of the realization that it is possible, though unlikely, that we may need to fight a government no longer in our control was planted on Nov. 8, 2016.

    Now if I can just get the same people to realize that it's why we should never cede our power to the government in the first place. Seems like they unconsciously understand that if a tyrant takes over the socialist utopia they desire, we're in trouble.

  • ||

    I've seen the tide waning on gun control on reddit recently, but it's still pretty strong. About every day there's an anti-2A headline on the front page, and many of them are kind of silly, "NRA quadrupled advertising budget since Parkland." I didn't read the article, and probably nobody else did, but I'm guessing their previous advertising budget was pretty paltry. I feel like they made a poor choice with the YouTube ads and such, but I don't know shit about marketing.

    Well, and I feel like it's a reverse-psychology disinformation campaign. The NRA's gun ads aren't going to kick these kids out of the spotlight and debase their arguments. The fact that Chicago has seen *almost double* the amount of firearm homicides as the Parkland shooting *each month* of 2018 so far and nobody's said a word is deafening silence. It was pretty apparent pretty early on that some of these inner city kids were less than thrilled that this shooting/issue is what took the national stage.

  • silver.||

    I suppose I should watch the ads, because there are some angles they could leverage safely, like clips about youth firearm safety training.

    I actually wondered what some communities thought about this movement by kids from an upper middle-class high school who have immensely safer and more privileged lives than many others. An average of 10 kids die per year in mass shootings compared to the 1,200+ that are killed in police shootings, predominantly in urban areas. And that's just the cops.

    Black teenagers are being killed literally daily, but a dozen rich white kids die and the media flips shit.

    Great point.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Absolutely. Remember, no one is more bigoted than the progressives.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Of course. No one is ever more bigoted than them.

  • ThomasD||

    Extremism in defense of liberty is problematic when it affects certain statists?

    The left is all about projection and the only standard they have is double standards.

    They are indeed an other deserving of othering.

    Or don't you discriminate?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Do you actually know any leftists? I do. Some of them are stupid. Some of them are smart. Some of them are arrogant. And some of them are humble, hard-working people who have never devoted much time to politics, much less been exposed to a libertarian or conservative way of thinking.

    Just like every other political, racial, national, ethnic, class, gender, religious, orientational, and whatever-categories-I'm-forgetting group ever.

    Generalization is a monolithic way of viewing the world that inclines the viewer to monolithic approaches to solving its problems. It is a mental tic of statists, not libertarians.

  • marshaul||

    Knee-jerk tribalism without a trace of nuance is the mental tic of idiots across the political spectrum.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    I like to at least pretend libertarians aren't among them.

  • silver.||

    I suppose I should watch the ads, because there are some angles they could leverage safely, like clips about youth firearm safety training.

    I actually wondered what some communities thought about this movement by kids from an upper middle-class high school who have immensely safer and more privileged lives than many others. An average of 10 kids die per year in mass shootings compared to the 1,200+ that are killed in police shootings, predominantly in urban areas. And that's just the cops.

    Black teenagers are being killed literally daily, but a dozen rich white kids die and the media flips shit.

    Great point.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    These movements are powered by the anxieties of middle class soccer moms.

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    BUCS, you better get on that. Go make some soccer mom's happy.

  • Paloma||

    Apparently, Black students at Parkland are complaining that their views are being ignored. Why am I not surprised?

  • hardcorps||

    Not surprised they are ignored or not surprised they are complaining?

  • Hank Phillips||

    The NRA could back LP candidates in races featuring two Kleptocracy Kristallnacht Kandidates.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    It still wouldn't beat the dems running someone who called a high ranking member of the KKK a mentor.

  • Azathoth!!||

    It was pretty apparent pretty early on that some of these inner city kids were less than thrilled that this shooting/issue is what took the national stage.

    No it wasn't.

    Anytime anyone mentions the sheer volume of the carnage that occurs in inner cities they get accused of racism--particularly if they dare to point it out after one of these school shootings happens.

  • Bubba Jones||

    The data shows that approximately 2% of redditors read a link before voting.

    Much like reading the am pm links.

    There was an awesome Orville (Fox) on this concept.

  • silver.||

    That we didn't have a Twitter president sooner is honestly a surprise.

    Dude, seriously, 2%? I mean I'm not that surprised, but I don't even see the point of voting if you haven't appraised the content.

  • Entropy Drehmaschine Void||

    WHAT PM LINKS?

    DAMN YOU, BRITCHES!

  • This Machine Chips Fascists||

    Don't give them the satisfaction. Act like you don't even notice the shit is gone.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    I don't know if I'd call that episode awesome. Interesting, maybe.

  • NotAnotherSkippy||

    Ah, reddit (and slashdot before it). Just another incarnation of that most useless of all things: USENET.

  • Adans smith||

    The MSM is almost all anti gun.Been that way for decades. They are only 'reporting' the 'correct' point of view.

  • Scarecrow Repair & Chippering||

    This is also the reason proggies are so deluded. Journalists who donate to politicians are something like 95% Democrats, so the MSM is in bed with Democrats. These kids grew up in their parents echo chamber and don't realize there are any other possible opinions. The Dem leaders don't give a shit. They think they've got the next election sewed up and are in for a rude surprise.

    Someone suggested a nation Gun Rights Buy-a-Gun day to counter this nonsense; I'd buy a new gun in a heartbeat of that came out. NICS would probably crash. The MSM would probably not report it.

  • silver.||

    I support the idea, but wonder if the retail infrastructure in general could handle it. I haven't been since Parkland, but my local outdoors stores get absolutely ransacked after shootings. Only really obscure ammo and non-functional antique firearms are still available. Of course stores could stock up early, but guns are thief magnets, so larger caches are a bigger liability.

    I mean, it's sorta cynical to say, but the Saturday/Sunday after our yearly mass shooting already is National Buy a Gun Day. Nothing gets people to stock up like the threat of a looming prohibition.

  • Scarecrow Repair & Chippering||

    If there's a gun you know you want even without trying it in the store, order it and wait. Put half down, whatever they want. The important part is getting a NICS event on the record. I'd get a Henry .357 for instance.

  • American Mongrel||

    The youngest millenials are all over 20. The oldest are approaching 40. The age cohorts you cite split the millenial generation in two.

    http://www.pewresearch.org/fac.....als-begin/

  • SIV||

    At 16 years (1981 to 1996), our working definition of Millennials will be equivalent in age span to their preceding generation, Generation X (born between 1965 and 1980). By this definition, both are shorter than the span of the Baby Boomers (19 years) – the only generation officially designated by the U.S. Census Bureau, based on the famous surge in post-WWII births in 1946 and a significant decline in birthrates after 1964.

    This is all so ridiculous.

  • VinniUSMC||

    And the "micro-generation in between Generation X and Millennials, so-called Xennials.

  • OpenBordersLiberal-tarian||

    Recent survey data show that only 10 percent of rally attendees were under 18 and the average age of the adults present was 49.

    As an advocate of common sense gun safety legislation, this information disappoints me. On the other hand, if 90% of attendees were 18 or over, that means they're old enough to vote (even though voting age should be lowered to 16) and will be motivated to kick NRA-owned politicians out of office this November.

  • BigT||

    "voting age should be lowered to 16"

    Don't you mean the age of consent?

  • Homple||

    Set the voting age wherever the nannies agree to put the legal age for buying and drinking hard liquor.

  • Inigo Montoya||

    The Voting age should be the same as the age of consent, because, after all, it is all about the people deciding whether it will be a D or an R who will be fucking them over.

  • Earth Skeptic||

    One age for:

    voting
    sex
    guns
    alcohol
    drugs
    and any other "serious" activity reserved for "adults"

    So if Junior is not to be trusted with any of these, then he is not worthy of the others.

  • ThomasD||

    I'm willing to accept that. I'm also willing to accept a stepped approach - where the transition from childhood to full adulthood is granted in stages. But in that case I firmly believe that voting and military enlistment should come latest.

  • Hank Phillips||

    Vote Kristallnacht looter? Instead of for libertarian legalization? Is such stupidity possible?

  • hardcorps||

    If a person can't be trusted at 18-20 with a firearm, I certainly am not going to trust them with a vote, nor am I going to take their rants about "common sense gun laws" seriously.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    At tha age they Igor still need some beatings.

  • EvilWayz||

    First of all, the main reason we don't deal with you "common sense gun control law" folks is you don't have the common sense God gave a grasshopper. In this case, common sense means your opinion, and anyone that thinks different hates children. Second stop drinking the Kool-aid. They've been saying for years that 90% of people in America want universal background checks. Bullshit says I. There is no way you could blithely ignore the wants of your constituents and stay in office. So keep thinking you are going to knock NRA backed politicians out of their comfy seats en masse. It ain't going to happen. Finally, like all shootings, unless there is one close to election time, nobody but the people directly affected by the Parkland shooting will remember it when they are in the voting booth.
    The reason for THAT is because most people in America understand that there are more guns than people here, and even though every shooting is trumpeted across mass media for several news cycles, shootings are actually pretty rare.

  • marshaul||

    This troll is so dumb it really boggles the mind.

    Reason has done more to defend the 2A than this clown ever will.

  • Hank Phillips||

    I just reblogged the Hitler speech overdub of Hogg (thanks, Commentariat!) to illustrate to Brazilians George Orwell's take on Americans. (The Managerial Revolution). Basically we can clearly see that communism and nationalsocialism are the same thing, except that the latter is popular with Protestants, Catholics and (of course) Lutherans. But unlike the Brits, Americans don't take either faction of looter altruism seriously. The Libertarian Party is American-Made and already has a foothold in some thirty countries. No such thing ever evolved in Altrurian Europe, but now that it flourishes LP laissez-faire is winning the Pepsi Challenge, attracting voters and changing the laws and political platforms of fossilized kleptocracies. (Thanks, Reason!)

  • Entropy Drehmaschine Void||

    Drink!

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    I just reblogged the Hitler speech overdub of Hogg

    And I'm sure that will be very persuasive to those not already deeply steeped in libertarian ideology. Very helpful.

  • Hank Phillips||

    Search this Raphael Lima guy "Idéias Radicais" Youtube... he has something like 400,000 subscribers, and he is mainstream libertarian. He gets the economic stuff all backward but still has a clearer image of reality than his most intelligent looter adversary or trolling critic. Last year Reason was pushing a YAF-style nationalsocialist impostor as Brazil's "libertarian revolution". The party is illegal, but the biggest cities all chose None of the Above as the lead vote-getter, averaging about 16% of the ballot.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Wow.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Somehow it's more strange to read than a SQRLY post.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    His powers of perception are truly impressing me today.

  • Red Tony||

    Hank, WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU?!?

    Too many drugs? Too few drugs? Psychological issues? A massive host of STDs?

  • Hank Phillips||

    Ed? Izzat you inside that sockpuppet? Ed Hominem was the guy everyone on the Asylum Debating Team hoped to draw as an opponent.

  • Red Tony||

    If I actually used an ad hominem, your post might have a point. Instead, I find myself wondering where you found an ad hominem, given that I questioned your first post, which mentioned:

    *Lutherians
    *George Orwell's take on Americans
    *looter altruism
    *the Pepsi Challenge

    And failed to make a cogent point about ANY of them.

    Every time I read one of your posts, I swear I get dumber.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    He rants and raves using obscure references he think make him clever, but fails to make any point whatsoever. He also likes to bring abortion into everything. Even things like the Iran deal. Really he's just a raving anti religious bigot.

  • ThomasD||

    I see some method to his madness, in a Beat poet, free associative sort of way. But, yeah, in effect it largely boils down to shibboleths.

  • Eric L||

    "...except that the latter is popular with Protestants, Catholics and (of course) Lutherans."

    Wait, what? - Lutherans are not Protestants? They were like the original Protestants.

  • Hank Phillips||

    You misspelled National Socialists. Where did you anonymous sockpuppets go to skool?

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Hank, you are definitely recruit repellent when it comes to the LP. A wacko bigot like you should keep his mouth shut if you want the LP to ever go anywhere.

  • Paloma||

    Aren't Lutherans Protestant?

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Yes. The Church founded by Luther is most certainly Protestant. Honestly, it's almost harder to name a non Protestant sect.

    You got Catholic, Greek Orthodox, maybe the coptics? Mormons I think don't count as Protestant. Also Unitarians? Are Unitarians even considerered mainline Christian?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Telcontarians are more of a Zoroastrian-Shinto fusionist kinda thing, FTR.

  • ThomasD||

    How do you fuse a universal monotheism with the animism of a sole nation?

    Good trick.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Well, when a ship of exiled pilgrims from the latter nation wrecks on the coast of the universal monotheists' homeland, and the shipwrecked pilgrims and the local tail love each other very much...

  • Paloma||

    Russian Orthodox, like Putin. They have quite a few in Russia, which has a large population. I don't know if Mormons would be Protestant, since they have a whole new gig with Jesus coming back and talking to Joseph Smith. Unitarians weren't counted as Christian in the colony of Maryland, which welcomed anyone who believed in the Trinity.

  • Hank Phillips||

    So ALL protestants want to exterminate jews? Have any of you READ Luther's faeces?

  • Janky Doodle||

    Greek Orthodoxy one piece of the Eastern Orthodox tradition of Christianity. People should refer to Eastern Orthodoxy when discussing the entire Orthodox communion, but it is very common to use Greek Orthodox as a catch-all term for those purposes. I'm saying all of this to let you know that Greek Orthodox and Coptic Orthodox are the same church. The descriptors of "Greek" and "Coptic" just refer to the regional heritages of specific individual churches, the Byzantine Empire and Northern Africa, respectively.

    Unitarians and Mormons would not be considered Protestants by anyone outside of their respective communities. Neither of these churches believe in the doctrine of the trinity, and Unitarians even choose to believe that Jesus has no divine origin. I'm not discussing whose right or wrong here. I'm just pointing out what makes a Christian and what makes a Protestant. In generally, church bodies that deny the trinity or divinity of Christ cannot be considered Christian churches. It's only of the oldest and most basic tenant of Christianity. Traditionally, Protestants are those members of Christianity that adhere to the "5 solaes." Scripture alone, faith alone, grace alone, Christ alone, and glory to God alone.

  • ThomasD||

    "Are Unitarians even considerered mainline Christian?"

    Given that many mainline Christian denominations do not even consider Unitarians actual Christians Id' say the answer is safely no.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    "That's surprising, because I feel like we're a more progressive generation"

    Which is exactly why it isn't surprising. Respect for private property is progress; expansion of government is the definition of regress.

  • Ken Shultz||

    There's a word for people who would sell our constitutional rights short out of fear. The word is "cowards".

    I'm glad to hear that all young people aren't cowards. I strongly urge those who aren't to start using the word "coward" to describe those who are cowards.

    They need to have their cowardice called out for what it is. Otherwise, people may start to think that cowardice is normal.

    Cowardice didn't win the war to end slavery. Cowardice didn't defeat the Nazis. Cowardice didn't bring the end of segregation. If cowards ever contributed anything good to American society, it wasn't because they were cowards. To whatever extent the government and other people respect our rights, it is only because of the people who championed them and refused to back down out of fear.

    If you want to sell our Second Amendment rights--or any other rights--short out of fear, then you are a coward. If you think there are excellent arguments for gun control, use them. Don't tell the American people to give up their rights because you're scared. That is both shameful and ineffective.

    people can be inspired to stand up for our rights against terrorists, violent criminals, or dictators--anyone who thinks they can intimidate us with fear. Nobody wants to stand up for cowards.

    Listening to cowards talk about how scared they are just makes people feel disgusted.

    Blech!

  • Earth Skeptic||

    But cowardice/helplessness/victimhood is the new (or not so new) progressive ideal.

    The fault lies with the rest of us, at least those who accept arguments that grant too many considerations to losers. Yes, a little pity might sometimes be the right thing, but stop being so pussy-whipped.

  • Ken Shultz||

    Animals in the wild are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves.

    The progressive ideal assumes people are more helpless than wildlife.

  • Paloma||

    Progressives have always believed in a superior educated class that tells everyone else what to do because they know what's best for them. It's the essence of Progressivism.

  • RoyMo||

    Cowards constantly contribute to society, a cowardly fascist is as useful as a cowardly bolshevik, the only trait more desirable than either is sloth.

  • BigChiefWahoo||

    Don't forget ignorance.

  • ThomasD||

    I'd say it is something worse than cowardice. Cowardice is refusal to act based upon fear. Locking your door at night is not the act of a coward. Demanding that others be restrained while you sleep is not cowardice, it is tyranny.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    You know what other youth organization impressed their elders?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Dumbledore's Army?

    (AKA the best bit of pro-gun propaganda ever accidentally written...)

  • silver.||

    The real reason millennials support gun rights..

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Accio boomstick!

  • Get lit||

    The 2A is a big deal for so-called single issue voters and these people are mostly stronger supportive of liberal gun rights, but I wonder if we're now seeing the emergence of an equally committed gun control faction and whether this new enthusiasm for control will increase voter participation among a demographic that tends to not vote.

  • SIV||

    so-called single issue voters

    Ahem

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    Yes, but you are the only for whom the single issue is chickens.

  • Sevo||

    Get lit|3.29.18 @ 8:24PM|#
    "The 2A is a big deal for so-called single issue voters and these people are mostly stronger supportive of liberal gun rights, but I wonder if we're now seeing the emergence of an equally committed gun control faction and whether this new enthusiasm for control will increase voter participation among a demographic that tends to not vote."

    You're a stupid shit; you wonder about all sorts of bullshit.
    Buzz off.

  • hardcorps||

    The gun grabbers are already deeply committed to the Dems.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    A problem the dems have is that there is actually a sizable oe centage of lefties who like their firearms. People like them may not vote republican, but they may very well stay home and not vote. Especially at the mid terms.

  • Brian||

    Someone needs to break it to Hogg that he's pure white bread.

  • Eidde||

    He'd make a great sheriff of Hazzard County.

  • This Machine Chips Fascists||

    I wonder if he plays the banjo.

  • Earth Skeptic||

    Can he scream like a pig?

  • Elias Fakaname||

    He could be Boss Hogg's retarded nephew.

  • Tony||

    I see you've waddled onto the Drudge bandwagon of criticizing the friends of mass murder victims by making fun of their names.

  • Brian||

    I made fun of his race.

    That's totally different.

    Especially because he's white, so that's Ok: no problem.

  • MarkLastname||

    Concern troll is concerned.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Baby Hogg was murdered? Hell, he wasn't even at the school when the shooting took place. He must be a victim through the transitive power of progtardedness. Like how Richard Blumenthal is somehow a Vietnam with never having set foot in Vietnam or the surrounding countries.

    Also Tony, when are you going to become a suicide victim?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Losing friends at a school to a rampaging twat with a gun is a legitimate form of victimization. It's not a "micro-aggression", it's not being offended at the words "freshman" or "history"; regardless of how well he knew them, it's real.

    People like you, empower people like him. Just as people like him, empower people like you.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    He isn't a victim. He may have lost friends, which if true, is sad. And I don't take it for granted, or him at his word, that he did. Keep in mind that the school had a student body of around 3,600 people. Which makes it entirely possible that he may not have even known or heard of the people who actually died. As I haven't investigated the issue, I'm not really sure. But this kid's word is already suspect.

    Even if he did, phrasing it like he was shot himself is total bulkshit. Words have meanings, and the left like to twist them. Do not allow that.

    It also isn't a subject I would be likely to address much outside Reason. I don't think discussing it here influences the subject much one way or the other.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    It certainly doesn't influence the subject of "gun control as an alleged panacea for violence" directly, but in political terms, saying that a student at a school that got shot up "isn't a victim" doesn't sound good and isn't really true. Like I said, even if he didn't know anyone who died, he certainly knows plenty of people who did know them. That isn't redefining the term "victim", it's a legitimate use of it. "Victim" just means "someone significantly harmed by something", and everyone at that school was. Even if you disagree with that specific definition of "victim", it's not a big stretch.

    I bring this up because questioning his "victim status" as you did plays right into his hands: he wants to provoke gun rights advocates into minimizing what happened, or making flippant remarks about him, so he can turn it into an emotional dichotomy of "sympathetic vs. callous". But the key to defeating his arguments is to take his claim of victim status "as read", and instead point out that it shouldn't matter- that even if he'd been shot himself, "being a victim" is not an argument, just an unempirical anecdote. Claiming he's not a victim implies that it would matter if he were. Better to just accept it at face value that he is one, and avoid making the debate about people instead of ideas: the ultimate rhetorical trick of all statists.

  • KevinP||

    He wasn't even in the same building where the shooting took place.

    By your token, everyone who lives in a apartment building is a survivor if a single person in that apartment is murdered.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    I would not call him a "survivor". But "victim" and "survivor" are not the same thing. And everyone in that theoretical apartment building who lost a loved one, or who had to comfort someone who had lost someone, can fairly be described as a "victim". Certainly, stating flatly that they are not a victim is not wise, as it implies that have not suffered at all, which is a genuinely unsupportable assertion. If you would prefer to describe them as "persons negatively affected" or something equally equivocal, that might be more technically correct, but that doesn't render use of the term "victim" by others inaccurate, much less worthy of scorn (or politically productive to criticize).

  • Tony||

    Gun regulation hasn't been on the table in our adult lives. It's a foreign concept met with skepticism. The NRA is not ineffectual in its propaganda.

  • Red Rocks White Privilege||

    Gun regulation hasn't been on the table in our adult lives.

    This isn't even close to accurate.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    He's only seventeen, he tricked you.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    Exactly,

    When did the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban expire?

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    Also, some states have enacted some measure of gun control in Tony's adult life. The NY State Safe Act for example.

  • Tony||

    By "our" I mean millennials. The last time gun control seemed like a serious thing before now was the movie The American President.

  • Red Rocks White Privilege||

    By "our" I mean millennials. The last time gun control seemed like a serious thing before now was the movie The American President.

    Gun control has been a serious thing for quite some time. You're just not happy that it's not resulting in the outcomes you want.

  • Palin's Buttplug||

    Reagan supported or signed lots of gun regulation.

    THAT SNOWFLAKE!

  • Tony||

    Reagan was president when I was in kindergarten.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    Wow, you've been in kindergarten a long time.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Will you finally ever graduate?

  • marshaul||

    Dammit Elias, don't "me too" next time. That was perfect until you chimed in.

  • Brian||

    Its the NRA's fault gun grabbers aren't persuasive.

  • Tony||

    No, I'm saying they won. We should be alarmed by how often evil wins in this country lately.

  • Brian||

    That's the refreshing flavor of democracy, doing its work for you.

  • Tony||

    Except not democracy. Electoral college, gerrymandering, plutocracy. Evil is winning because it has gained power over democracy. Even more alarming.

  • Brian||

    If it makes you feel better: Roe v. Wade.

  • Tony||

    We're gonna destroy the planet while idiots fight over whether fetuses go to heaven.

  • Brian||

    You really need to make your mind with this government business.

  • Tony||

    A whopping 18% of Americans think abortion should be illegal.

  • Brian||

    Yeah, as opposed to "regulated", which is more democratic, especially since about half he country is pro-life.

    But, that's how we know you're mendacious.

  • Red Tony||

  • Tony||

    All or most. Most means not all. Meaning some fetuses don't have souls.

    Even going by the numbers you linked, a democratic majority is pro-abortion. Only an extremely activist supreme court would significantly go against such a democratic majority will. Such as what the undemocratically powerful Republican party would install.

  • Brian||

    "Only an extremely activist supreme court would significantly go against such a democratic majority will."

    Because SCOTUS is a popularity-measuring contest.

    Which explains Heller.

    And why Roe v. Wade hasn't been overturned.

    Whatevs. Just bang your head against the desk until you vote yourself the government you deserve.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Is that the progtard plan? Destroying the world?

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    If only there were a way to stop the rampant gerrymandering in the Senate.

  • Emotional Opposition Animal||

    Evil wins every time someone dignifies your useless drivel with a response.

  • Sevo||

    Tony|3.29.18 @ 10:21PM|#
    "No, I'm saying they won. We should be alarmed by how often evil wins in this country lately."

    Well, fortunately, that miserable hag lost, so it doesn't look all that bad.

  • MarkLastname||

    That's not because of the NRA: that's becausr most people favor gun rights. Blaming that on the NRA is as moronic as blaming legal abortion primarily on lobbying by planned parenthood.

  • BigChiefWahoo||

    The confiscationists don't want to believe there would be any opposition to their well-intentioned gun laws if not for the machinations of the evil NRA. They don't want to admit gun control is not as popular as they want it to be.

  • hardcorps||

    If you live in Cali, NJ, NY, CT, MD, DC, or Chicago, gun regulation is real, ineffective at stopping crime, and punitive to otherwise law abiding citizens.

  • Rev. Arthur Ꮮ. Kirkland||

    It's going to happen anyway. When all states are majority-minority (like Texas), guns will simply be outlawed.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Weird how support for gun rights and concealed carry has been increasing across all demographic indices for the last 25 years, then.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Indeed. God bless the NRA, and God damn Bloomberg and his allies.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Artyif you morons really lull that crap, you will find progtardkind wild off the map in short order. Real Americans have staid our hand out of decency and mercy, but there is a limit. Your treason will come to an end.

    Really, you only exist because we tolerate your nonsense. Weak Marxist pussies don't do well when enough becomes enough.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Tony, the NRA is a force for liberty and freedom. Why do you hate liberty and freedom so much? They've done a lot of good. Like arming women who are at risk of being raped, and blacks people against your democrat friends in the Klan.

    This is the sort of reason I am good and you are evil. You represent helplessness, hopelessness, and domination. I represent freedom, rationality, and self determination. Honestly, if this is who you are, you really SHOULD commit suicide. You only have evil and ugliness to offer the world.

  • Palin's Buttplug||

    Sessions Says 'No' To Republican Requests For A Second Special Counsel

    NPR

    Wow, Sessions didn't cave to the kooks in the GOP. I am surprised.

    The Dotard may chop his head off.

  • silver.||

    I've been reasonably impressed with Sessions' refusal to capitulate on matters involving the investigation.

  • Emotional Opposition Animal||

    Mueller has either sat idly by for over a year while a traitor and Russian puppet rules the White House, or harassed and coerced associates of the constitutionally elected president, obstructing his ability to exercise the duties of his office, without any legal justification over the same time duration. Which one do you prefer?

  • OpenBordersLiberal-tarian||

    Let me fix that.

    "Mueller has either sat idly by for over a year continued his exemplary career in public service by carefully building an ironclad case against Drumpf while a traitor and Russian puppet rules the White House"

    I wish the process wasn't dragging on so long, but Mueller is a stand-up guy and I'm sure he's working 100-hour weeks getting to the bottom of #TrumpRussia.

  • Sevo||

    Emotional Opposition Animal|3.29.18 @ 10:54PM|#
    "[bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit, bullshit}
    Which one do you prefer?"

    I'll got for EOA is full of shit for the win.'
    Seek help asshole.

  • Sevo||

    My mistake, sincere apologies.Sarc meter was temporarily in-op.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Sessions is probably going to be fired soon. Trump should appoint Aldo Raine.

    New AG Raine (to his deputy AG's): Gentlemen, we will be doing one thing and nothing only. Prosecutin' Democrats!"!

    At the 2020 DNC convention, look for Aldo's men to lock all the democrats in and burn the oracle to the ground. Hillary survives, but Aldo carved a hammer and sickle into her forehead.

  • Gilbert Martin||

    "News Outlets Ignore Millennials' Skepticism of Gun Control"

    That's because they're not actually news outlets.

    They are outlets for predetermined narratives.

    They start with the conclusion they want and work backward from there

  • Curly4||

    The perception that these kids are for the elimination of guns is because all that is covered by most the mainline media new laws and other restrictions. No where have it been reported that the kids have called for the enforcement of the laws that are on the books.
    It would be a good idea that the news would give a more balanced report of what the kids think and what they want.

  • ||

    What's fascinating is lost in all this is the actual incompetence of law enforcement in all this which is far more problematic than gun control. Never mind that Gonzalez admitted to being part of a group that bullied Cruz. Her logic went something along the lines of 'you didn't know him ergo we had to!" Just awful stuff to the point I wonder if her parents are guiding her properly and doing their jobs.

    Seems to me these are pertinent angles to the story. If you're so into the truth this is where the conversation should begin. Not screaming off the top of your lungs, marching screaming the NRA are murderers like a bunch of ranting lunatics. How in the world by any reasonable standard could someone conclude gun control is the issue?

  • Chipper Morning Baculum||

    Question for Eddie: How do you feel about the Pope's recent declaration that there is no hell and that evil souls just sort of dissipate? I thought hell is the absence of God.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Also curious on this one.

  • Michael Ejercito||

    The Pope took a more extreme position than the Westboro Baptist Church.

  • Paloma||

    It's pretty obvious that Hell is having to watch and listen to Hillary over and over and over.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Now why would you force the devil t do that? That's a mean thing to do. Even to Satan.

  • Rich||

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    The problem is that some people disagree with Mr. Hogg about which guns are safe and responsible to own, and which ones are event horizons from which no toddler can escape.

    It's only the latter ones that are callous profit-worshipping monsters, you see.

  • DajjaI||

    If the kids really wanted to make themselves safe, they'd go around the neighborhood and round up the homeschool kids and drag them to school. Organize a book club or crime ring for the sobbing mothers, something to keep them out of trouble. These kids are on a witch hunt against their autistic peers and guess what you find when you go on a witch hunt.

  • VinniUSMC||

    Witches? Do they find witches?

    Don't leave us hanging like that.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    The only way for a kid to be truly safe is to be the one who calls 'force fields' first.

  • flyfishnevada||

    "...millennials are the age group least in favor of gun control."

    And you wonder why the anti-gun movement is trotting out these teenagers to scream for more gun control? The gun control lobby is losing the fight. Even mass murders like the one in Florida do little to sway public opinion and the most liberal and impressionable group among us seems to understand that taking away guns from the law-abiding won't stop criminals from misusing them.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    the most liberal and impressionable group among us seems to understand that taking away guns from the law-abiding won't stop criminals from misusing them using ramming, bombing, igniting, stabbing or hanging instead

    The only reason the controllers aren't winning is because their favorite rhetorical appeal has failed them. They used to love pointing to Europe; now they have to point to Europe, except for this and in spite of that...

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    ""And you wonder why the anti-gun movement is trotting out these teenagers to scream for more gun control? The gun control lobby is losing the fight"'

    Yep.

    I don't think the kids intended to be tools. They have a legitimate gripe about what happened at their school. But the anti-gun organizations saw an opportunity to use them as tools and started funding and organizing for them. I wonder if some point they will realize that they are being used as tools. Of course they may already know and don't care.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Unfortunately for them, once the novelty factor wears off, all you're left with were whiny know it all teenagers who reall don't know shit and aren't really prepared to carry on an adult discussion. They end up just being annoying. It might be different if the girl in their group had much bigger tits, but she doesn't. So they don't even have the milk jug factor going for them.

    Really, how long is anyone older than 20 going to put up with being lectured by a bunch of bitchy teenagers?

  • Mark22||

    "Pit a youth movement for firearms regulation against an aging gun lobby—the kids will ultimately win," declares a headline in today's Los Angeles Times.

    Yeah, just like the brownshirts won in Germany over the elderly defenders of Germany's fledgling democracy.

    Politics-by-youth-movement is the hallmark of fascist and communist totalitarian regimes.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

  • silver.||

    The Tiananmen Square massacre is concrete proof that citizens are still having to violently fight back against tyrannical regimes in modern nations. Tens of thousands dead and fifty thousand shot. Utterly brutal. Tyrants will order the guns to be turned on their own people to squash dissent, and the soldiers will be brainwashed to do it.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    They weren't trying to fight back with violence, though. Weapons are useless without the will to pull the trigger. What it really proved is that satyagraha only works when your oppressors are effete tea-drinkers. Against a real tyranny, only retaliation and rebellion by strength of arms can hope to achieve victory.

  • Paloma||

    See the huge protests in Venezuela. Chavez could not have cared less. Nor does Maduro. It's one of the ways you know that it's a real tyranny.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Oh, they care. But only because they know that if they don't play their cards close to the vest, those peaceful, toothless protests won't stay peaceful, or toothless, forever. Monsters tremble when good men go to war.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    The LA Times is going to be disappointed.

    The pro-gun crowd was able to ignore a crying President. These kids don't compare to that.

  • Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland||

    Quit whining.

    With all of their whining about how bad the mainstream is, and muttering bitterly and inconsequentially from the fringe, it's a wonder conservatives have time to chase any kids from lawns.

    I understand why right-wingers dislike kids -- young people are going to improve our electorate by replacing stale-thinking old conservatives in that electorate.

  • TrickyVic (old school)||

    As if conservative thinking and young people are mutually exclusive.

    This is why the left will be disappointed. You ignore what's out there. Just liking thinking the NRA is a single entity for defeat, trying to deny that it's actually an organization of millions of voters.

  • Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland||

    There are conservatives among our young people.

    Just as there are conservatives among our educated citizens; among residents of our modern, successful communities; among Americans who have not been on the wrong end of bright flight; among gays, blacks, Muslims, Hispanics, and educated women; among Americans who are not white, Christian, straight, older rural or southern males.

    Just not enough of them to amount to anything from a practical perspective, especially as America's electorate improves.

  • Paloma||

    Go burn witches someplace else, wannabe.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Hey Arty, I hate to break it to you, but the generation coming up is far more conservative than the dipshit millennial. I guess they look to that older generation and see watch a bunch of weak pussies progtards are, and are disgusted by it.

    On a related note, how do YOU deal with being such a worthless pussy?

  • Grifhunter||

    Before Trump threw his hat in the ring you were crowing about your "demographics are destiny" theory that the youth coming up (and immigrants) are all progressives who will be buying the Democrat platform whole hogg. You declared the Republican party dead. Then 2016 happened.

    What you fashion as an impending inevitable improvement in the electorate (with all the racist connotations that engenders) is no lock for the progressives. There are subtle forces for enlightenment at work in society, through the internet, video gaming and social media,. Ironically, the gun rights debate has educated and persuaded many under 30 year olds as to their constitutional inheritance, the historical case for not vesting all power in the sovereign, and a level headed risk/benefit analysis of private gun ownership.

    When the emotion after the shooting events gets evaporated off, the hearts and minds of your up and coming youth are at a minimum accepting of the individual right to arms, even martial arms, if not yet embracing same.

  • Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland||

    I believe the Constitution protects a general right to possess a reasonable firearm for self-defense in the home.

    I also believe that over time neither group of extremists -- those who propose to outlaw all guns, those who are absolutists in the other direction -- will prevail in America.

    Pres. Trump won because of our system's structural amplification of yahoo voices, and because our society's vestigial intolerance, ignorance, backwardness, and superstition surprised most Americans, especially those who reside in successful, modern communities. America's changing electorate -- less rural, less backward, less religious, less white, less bigoted just about every day -- suggests it will become increasingly difficult to maintain an electoral coalition for backwardness and intolerance.

    Unless right-wingers perfect a machine that mass-produces half-educated, gullible, economically inadequate, superstitious, easily frightened, selfish, rural white males, of course. If that occurs, modernity and progress will be in big trouble.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    reasonable

    A term always to be defined by you.

    I also believe that over time neither group of extremists -- those who propose to outlaw all guns, those who are absolutists in the other direction -- will prevail in America

    Golden Mean Fallacy.

    America's changing electorate -- less rural, less backward, less religious, less white, less bigoted just about every day -- suggests it will become increasingly difficult to maintain an electoral coalition for backwardness and intolerance

    The fewer people of the wrong race, wrong religion, and wrong educational background we have, the less intolerant and bigoted we'll be!

    a machine that mass-produces half-educated, gullible, economically inadequate, superstitious, easily frightened, selfish

    ...humans? Yeah, good luck finding a "machine" that doesn't produce those.

  • Red Rocks White Privilege||

    Unless right-wingers perfect a machine that mass-produces half-educated, gullible, economically inadequate, superstitious, easily frightened, selfish, rural white males, of course. If that occurs, modernity and progress will be in big trouble

    This, of course, ignores the fact that empires fall once the cotton-soft "enlightened" class becomes too decadent to maintain the nation their rougher forebears built.

  • Rockabilly||

    Fuck you Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland, gun grabbing communist fuck head.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    Arty is a poster child for why McCarhyism is needed again.

  • MSimon||

    Trump didn't waste any money buying votes hr didn't need.

  • MSimon||

    Trump didn't waste any money buying votes he didn't need.

  • BigChiefWahoo||

    But obviously not so "inconsequentially" that you didn't have to put in your two cents, eh Rev? Or does the "inconsequential" have some special attraction for you?

  • Paloma||

    Oh Lordz, THIS wannabe again.

  • Eric||

    There's something creepy to me about young conservatives. There, I said.

  • Eric||

    ...it.

  • Sanctimonica||

    Teen gun control activists are not millennials. The oldest millennial is not far from her 40th birthday, and the youngest is years old.

  • Sanctimonica||

    * 22 years old.

  • TxJack 112||

    Of course they downplay it because it destroys the narrative they are pushing. My daughter and her husband are millennials and neither supports gun control. The media has tried to make people think there is overwhelming support for gun control by using bogus polls and pushing disinformation and flat out lies to scare people into supporting more gun control. Gun Grabbers use phrases like "common sense gun legislation" to trick people into thinking their true aim is not an outright ban. Unfortunately for them, idiots like former Justice Stevens always let the cat out of the bag and make their true aims clear. The notion that all young adults think and act as a single group is not only wrong, but actually insulting because it implies they are incapable of thinking for themselves.

  • Rev. Arthur L. Kirkland||

    Some people want to prohibit all guns.

    Others are gun absolutists in the other direction.

    Neither of those groups is likely to have its wishes respected over time.

  • Michael Ejercito||

    The same could be written about abortion.

  • jester||

    Isn't he pajama boy? I swear there's a resemblance

  • mamabug||

    Pretty sure under 18 isn't considered Millenial anymore.

    Based purely on anecdotal evidence - at my son's high school only about 2 in a class of around 30 was willing to admit to being pro-2nd Amendment. Almost all of his friends favor gun control and are shocked that he doesn't. Admittedly, we live in 'San Francisco of the North' and teenagers are idiots and their positions on things have more to do with their parents and community at that age, but only 10% believing in the Bill of Rights is pretty poor odds.

  • Quo Usque Tandem||

    San Fran of the North: I'm guessing either Duluth or Ann Arbor. More familiar with the latter, and like the West and North East coastal areas they are pretty much an echo chamber unto themselves. And the rest of us backward looking and flyover bumpkins are either too stupid, crazy, or hateful to understand.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    Here in Texas, or in OK or Kansas, that'd be reversed.

  • Paloma||

    My six year old grandson announced in 2016 that he was going to "vote for Trump". No one in our household liked Trump, much less voted for him. He said he just liked his face and thought he was funny.

  • Elias Fakaname||

    What is it like when nearly all the kids are such total pussies? It must be terrible for a high school kid to show any amount of masculinity there.

  • BigChiefWahoo||

    Is anyone really surprised that the media ignore young people skeptical of restrictive gun laws? The metropolitan media have been 'in the tank' for gun control for decades now. Back in the mid 80s when a half dozen pro-abortion protesters in a state capital would be national news, five or six thousand pro-gun rights protesters in Columbus Ohio were resolutely ignored by the national media. Should any number of young pro-gun rights protesters show up in force anywhere, you can count on the Fourth Estate to do its best to minimize their numbers if not ignore them entirely.

  • Quo Usque Tandem||

    Our mainstream media is littler better than Pravda; they will tell us what they want us to know, how much, and what we should think and do about it. 0 credibility.

  • Curly4||

    The whole point of these new demonstrations should have been requiring the laws that we already have on the books be enforced then is there is any holes in the law to plug those holes rather than passing new laws that will not be enforced any more than the ones on the books now.
    Now some of the laws that has been proposed such as increasing the legal age to buy or own a weapon to 21 just how many children would that law have saved in any of the school shootings that we have had so far? The school shooter, Cruze, should not have been able to buy a weapon as it is but because his history with human services and police but non of that was entered into the system some say because of a program Obama had so Cruze was able to buy the weapons and so we had the shooting all because some one(s) failed to do their job. That failure of the persons responsible for caring out these laws is where the current attention should be directed and not in new laws.

  • Wokeboi69||

    Great article but these kids ARE NOT MILLENNIALS.They're Generation Z. They're a whole different generation just like Millenials, Gen X or the Baby Boomers.

  • Wokeboi69||

    Generation birth years (give or take a few years)

    Silent Generation: Mid-late 20s to mid 40s
    Baby Boomers: Mid 40s to early-mid 60s
    Gen X: Early-mid 60s to circa 1980
    Millenials: Circa 1980 to mid-late 90s
    Gen Z: Mid-late 90s to ?

  • Longtobefree||

    Ageist stereotyping.
    Judge people by their stupid web ramblings, not by their alleged chronological ages!

  • Curtisls701||

    Millennials who support the Second Amendment are themselves surprised at the pro-gun leanings of their peers. When an NPR reporter cited polling data indicating that young people tend to be skeptical of gun control, 19-year-old gun rights activist Abigail Kaye responded, "That's surprising, because I feel like we're a more progressive generation…We've grown up more, I think, with this kind of gun violence, so you'd think maybe we'd push for more regulations."


    Ah, the hubris of youth.

  • Adam Mill||

    Are countries with fewer privately-owned guns safer? No. Are countries with more privately-owned guns more dangerous? No. Read this: http://millstreetgazette.blogs.....-safe.html

  • Longtobefree||

    News outlets? What news outlets?

  • Alan@.4||

    Re all the screaming and yelling over and about Assault Weapons and the banning thereof, I seek one thing, and anyone is welcome to supply what I seek. A clean, clear cut, plain English definition for exactly what is this Assault Weapon that these people seek to ban. I await their output, however I do not intend to even try holding my breath while I wait.

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