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Another Woman Accuses Moore of Underage Sexual Advances, Supreme Court Takes Up First Amendment Cases, Rand Paul Returns to Work: P.M. Links

  • Roy MooreTom Williams/CQ Roll Call/NewscomThe latest in response to the allegations that Alabama candidate for the U.S. Senate Roy Moore in the past made sexual advances toward underage girls: Republican Sens. Mitch McConnell and Susan Collins say they believe the women and that Moore should step aside; more than 50 pastors in Alabama have signed a letter in support of Moore; and attorney Gloria Allred has gotten involved, representing another woman who just came forward today accusing Moore of sexually assaulting her as a minor.
  • Brett J. Talley, a judicial nominee of President Donald Trump's administration, has been getting a lot of heat for his lack of history as a lawyer. He has never tried a case. It also turns out that he's married to a lawyer in the White House Counsel's Office, but he didn't disclose this information to the Senate as a potential conflict of interest.
  • In Manila today, Trump bragged about his great relationship with Philippines President Rodrigo Duterte, who … well, in diplomatic news media phrasing, "faces human rights allegations related to his crackdown on drugs." Here's a little bit less of a diplomatic term from Jacob Sullum: "murderous drug warrior."
  • The Supreme Court has agreed to take a couple of potentially significant First Amendment cases. One case will explore whether a state (California) can force pregnancy clinics to provide information about abortion to patients. The second case will explore whether a state (Minnesota) can ban political buttons and badges at polling locations.
  • Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) has returned to work after suffering broken ribs last week in an altercation with a neighbor. We still don't know the details of what exactly happened other than Paul getting allegedly tackled from behind while mowing his yard.
  • A brawl erupted when two sets of undercover Detroit Police officers encountered each other in a drug sting operation. The cops started fighting each other, and apparently it was all captured on body cameras.

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Photo Credit: Tom Williams/CQ Roll Call/Newscom

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  • Fist of Etiquette||

    Republican Sens. Mitch McConnell and Susan Collins say they believe the women and that Moore should step aside...

    Those two should show Moore how it's done.

  • ||

    Hello.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    What is "Ray Moore's most common opening line to teenage girls"?

  • Unicorn Abattoir||

    It's this, or 5 years without parole?

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "Touch it or your mom goes to prison."

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "Have you ever seen a grown man naked?"

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "Wanna help my baby Jesus rise from the dead?"

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "Do you have pubes yet?"

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    "I can prove I'm not a jew."

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    "Do you want to be more like Mother Mary?"

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "It's time to prove you're not some muff-diving freak."

  • Crusty Juggler||

    "Wanna be famous in forty years?"

  • Red Tony||

    "Sex is immoral when done wrong, and nasty, freaky, dirty, disgusting, and horribly immoral when done right.

    How's about we do it right, sweet thing?"

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    "I'll help you break ALL the commandments." 1 minute of silent eyebrow wiggling commences

  • EscherEnigma||

    1: Thou shalt haveno other gods before me
    So if you call out "oh my God" during the act...

    2: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image
    I got nothing for this one.

    3: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord they God in vain
    Back to "calling out".

    4: Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy
    I guess if you're doing it on a Saturday (Jewish) or Sunday (everyone else)

    5: Honour they father and they mother
    Do it in their parents' bed.

    6: Thou shalt not kill
    ... are we getting into snuff porn now?

    7: Thou shalt not commit adultery
    Well, this one is easy at least.

    8: Thou shalt not steal
    Well, since you're doing it in their parents' bed, go ahead and use their condoms or lube too.

    9: Thou shalt nob ear false witness against they neighbor
    Lie about it afterwards.

    10: Thou shalt not covet [lots of things]
    And finally, think about someone else while doing it.

    So I can see nine out of ten, though violating #7 is pretty hardcore. Not sure how you get to all ten though.

  • ||

    4: Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy
    I guess if you're doing it on a Saturday (Jewish) or Sunday (everyone else)

    What are Seventh Day Adventists, chopped liver?

  • EscherEnigma||

    Beyond my knowledge. They're the ones that say no to blood transfusions and organ donations, right?

  • ||

    They're the ones that say no to blood transfusions and organ donations, right?

    You got me there - I know one and only one thing about them, which is "the Sabbath is Saturday, and anyone who doesn't think so is damned to Hell."

    But I think you may be thinking of Christian "Scientists" - I know Ben Carson is 7th Day, and it would be tricky to do brain surgery without looking the other way on the whole blood-transfusion thing.

  • CE||

    2: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image
    I got nothing for this one.

    No pics on your phone, duh. I might run for the US Senate some day.

  • CE||

    Or, given that the alleged offenses allegedly occurred prior to the widespread adoption of cell phones, no Polaroids.

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    "You're too hot for those high school boys, pretty girl- you deserve something... *Moore*."

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    "This is what God wants, Margaret."

  • Telcontar the Wanderer||

    "Hey, would you mind coming and helping me move this huge slab? It's moving-in day."

  • Tony||

    "Don't tell anyone. I'm the DA. Nobody will believe you."

    Roy Moore's actual opening lines.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    Hey, that is what Bill Clinton said to his victims too.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    "I plan to steal all the virgins waiting for jihad warriors. You will be virgin number one"?

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    ...more than 50 pastors in Alabama have signed a letter in support of Moore...

    Have you read the Bible?

  • Unicorn Abattoir||

    That's like asking the commentariat "Have you read the articles?"

  • EscherEnigma||

    The bible is pretty okay with old dudes and young girls.

  • Nwallins||

    Outside a holy state of matrimony?

  • ||

    Not as long as you count polygamy.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    In a not too distant past, girls had sex immediately after they bled to up the chances for having as many babies as possible. The life expectancy was usually about 35, so you had to get busy early.

  • Bee Tagger||

    A brawl erupted when two sets of undercover Detroit Police officers encountered each other in a drug sting operation. The cops started fighting each other, and apparently it was all captured on body cameras.

    Winnipeg fans vs San Jose fans. This wouldn't happen if the red wings were any good.

  • Citizen X - #6||

    Damn, i need a cigarette after these links.

  • Unlabelable MJGreen||

    Scott'll never let us down.

  • Unlabelable MJGreen||

    Though I must say, I expected Scott to make space for the crazy Amazon LOTR deal.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I read that and thought there was gonna be some sweet daily sale on a life sized hobbit statue.

  • Citizen X - #6||

    You do NOT want to know what BUCS intends to do should he ever acquire a life sized hobbit statue.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Well, I know the first thing he will do is straighten all the hairs on its body.

  • Rhywun||

    I had to look that up.

    Why, oh why?

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    ...and attorney Gloria Allred has gotten involved, representing another woman who just came forward today accusing Moore of sexually assaulting her as a minor.

    Is it too late to side with Moore?

  • Bee Tagger||

    We still don't know the details of what exactly happened other than Paul getting allegedly tackled from behind while mowing his yard.

    And with the "allegedly," we don't even know that.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) has returned to work after suffering broken ribs last week in an altercation with a neighbor. We still don't know the details of what exactly happened other than Paul getting allegedly tackled from behind while mowing his yard.

    It's Paul's hair's fault regardless.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    Rand Paul's neighbor will bum rush him next time he's peacefully getting his hair cut because Paul just does not take care of his hair.

  • perlchpr||

    The cops started fighting each other, and apparently it was all captured on body cameras.

    This is why we need body camera footage released to the public.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I miss Cops too...

  • Rich||

    With this as the soundtrack.

  • Bearded Spock||

    That would be an AWESOME pay-per-view event.

  • Citizen X - #6||

    In Manila today, Trump bragged about his great relationship with Philippines President Rodrigo Duterte, who … well, in diplomatic news media phrasing, "faces human rights allegations related to his crackdown on drugs."

    If Trump starts carrying Duterte around in a little backpack, much will be forgiven.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    Shackford's alt-text is like a woman that enjoys watching fat gingers masturbate.

  • Entropy Drehmaschine Void||

    At least Stchakmumford has Alt Text.

    Britches' Alt Text Every Day: Fuck you, CMT.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I'd appreciate his zeal if he was hating Country Music Television every single day.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    The cops started fighting each other...

    When an irresistible force which fears for its life meets an immovable object that just wants to get home safe.

  • CE||

    As long as no weapons were discharged.

  • CE||

    And procedures were followed.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    A brawl erupted when two sets of undercover Detroit Police officers encountered each other in a drug sting operation. The cops started fighting each other, and apparently it was all captured on body cameras.

    The cops are just another victim of urban flight.

  • Bee Tagger||

    The second case will explore whether a state (Minnesota) can ban political buttons and badges at polling locations.

    Just as long as you don't pin them to your babushkas

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    How did these very clear violations of free speech start anyway?

  • Bee Tagger||

    They solved the problem of election tampering so i don't know what you're so upset about.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Election tampering is still rampant until my preferred candidate wins.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    These euphemisms are getting too political.

  • Stormy Dragon||

    It's annoying enough having to run through the gauntlet of campaign volunteers who won't leave you alone getting into the polling place. I can't imagine having them inside pestering you for 15 minutes while you're waiting in line.

  • EscherEnigma||

    Yeah. Though banning individual folks that are there to vote from wearing pins, stickers, or t-shirts is probably taking it a bit far.

  • Stormy Dragon||

    I agree this law goes to far, I was just answering the question of how it started.

  • CE||

    Can't we just ban voting to be on the safe side?

  • CE||

    If you want to elect someone to be your agent to rob me, I want a signed contract so I can include you when I press charges.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    We still don't know the details of what exactly happened other than Paul getting allegedly tackled from behind while mowing his yard.

    The investigation is being handled by the Las Vegas sheriff.

  • Chipper Morning Truthjammer||

    As I said earlier, if Paul was mowing naked, this never would have happened.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    God, if his head is any indication Paul's pubes are probably disgusting.

  • Red Tony||

    Maybe he waxes.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    That's disgusting in a different way.

  • Red Tony||

    Do you want his hair in your teeth?

    Neither does his wife.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Do you want his hair in your teeth?

    You're new I see. Chipper Morning can get you up to speed on my preferences.

  • EscherEnigma||

    He's a so-con. I think it's safe to assume that he either (A) doesn't commit sodomy (and yeah, that includes oral) or (B) only commits it with underage boys and congressional pages.

    Either way, his wife doesn't have to worry.

  • Crusty Juggler||

    He lasers. It's like a turtle shell down there.

  • Bee Tagger||

    He has never tried a case. It also turns out that he's married to a lawyer in the White House Counsel's Office, but he didn't disclose this information to the Senate as a potential conflict of interest.

    Is she Russian? Please say she's Russian. Or at least had a Russian nanny. Give me something, here.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    You need to be a little less desperate for more spank material.

  • Rich||

    Russian to judgment?

  • Entropy Drehmaschine Void||

    ***SPANK***

  • BYODB||

    So we're just going to, y'know, ignore that one of the members that was confirmed as a Supreme Court Justice had never been a judge before?

    Yet we're suddenly concerned about lower courts having actual lawyers?

    I suppose we might as well care; no one else gives a fuck.

  • Bubba Jones||

    This dude was a clerk for a federal judge.

    So he has more experience writing opinions than actual judges do.

  • BYODB||

    I just have to wonder that being a regular lawyer with political connections gets you onto the Supreme Court, and yet being a Judge has the exact same 'requirement'.

    It seems like if the only qualification for the Supreme Court is 'lawyer' than it would make sense for the burden to be lower for a lower office, but what do I know.

  • Red Tony||

    There's no qualification for the Supreme Court besides "Congress finds you acceptable."

    Speaking of which, y'all should totally try to get Agile Cyborg on the Supreme Court.

  • Tom Bombadil||

    I wish the Founding Fathers had written in one qualification: The Supreme Court must always contain one Justice who has never attended law school but who can recite the Constitution.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    The Supreme Court has agreed to take a couple of potentially significant First Amendment cases.

    And that represents a full caseload for the year.

  • Rich||

    One case will explore whether a state (California) can force pregnancy clinics to provide information about abortion to patients.

    Serious question: What "information" do pregnancy clinics provide, um, naturally? "We recommend *folic* acid, not *acid* acid"?

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    They provide a lot of advice to women about pregnancy. They perform various procedures related to pregnancy and becoming pregnant. They also are becoming a much more popular place to actually give birth as an alternative to the more intimidating venue of a hospital.

  • Rich||

    But somehow nothing about abortion?

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I don't know. My guess is that many probably don't do abortions, but I'm not pregnant or about to become pregnant so I don't know much about them and I drink a lot.

  • Red Tony||

    Well, a pregnancy clinic might be aimed at "here's how to have a healthy pregnancy" rather than "okay, let's get rid of your pregnancy."

    Believe it or not, there are a fair amount of women out there who want to be moms.

  • ||

    The law is in response to pregnancy clinics that are specifically run by anti-abortion people where abortion is intentionally never mentioned as a possible way of dealing with a pregnancy.

    The Team Blue response has been to view these as pied-pipers leading women who have never heard of abortion away from ever hearing about abortion. So the State of CA wanted to mandate signs saying basically "despite whatever they're telling you here, you can still have an abortion."

    Both sides are operating under the assumption that people don't already know about abortion.

  • EscherEnigma||

    Both sides are operating under the assumption that people don't already know about abortion.
    Well, that and "Crisis Pregnancy Centers" have a well documented habit of lying to women about abortions. And advertising/presenting as full-service clinics to lure in women looking for abortions. And basically being lying liars that lie a lot from Liarton, Ohio.

  • ||

    Well, that and "Crisis Pregnancy Centers" have a well documented habit of lying to women about abortions. And advertising/presenting as full-service clinics to lure in women looking for abortions.

    I don't disagree. I just think they're fooling themselves that there are any women, especially in CA, who aren't aware that there is such a thing as abortion. But I may be optimistic about the intelligence level of most people.

  • CE||

    Are health clubs required to provide information about murder?

  • Tom Bombadil||

    ^^This. Are funeral parlors required to provide information about how to bury Grandpa at sea? Is Sizzler required to provide flyers touting a vegan diet? Is PETA required to describe the best way to skin a chinchilla?

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    In Manila today, Trump bragged about his great relationship with Philippines President Rodrigo Duterte...

    It would have been impolite to call him an intellectually uncurious wannabe autocrat. Either of them.

  • Rhywun||

    I'm struggling to think of anything worse that Trump has done than praise that scumbag. OK, Sessions. Anything else?

  • Red Tony||

    Basically he's horrible on drugs (as is the Republican party. Also not too sure about his foreign policy, because his Twitter stuff is probably hurting the U.S. there. And his rhetoric on trade is abominable but he doesn't seem to be doing much to actively hurt trade.

  • Tom Bombadil||

    "I'm struggling to think of anything worse that Trump has done than praise that scumbag."

    Haven't you heard? It's all explained in "What Happened".

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    Brett J. Talley, a judicial nominee of President Donald Trump's administration, has been getting a lot of heat for his lack of history as a lawyer.

    I'm sold.

  • Domestic Dissident||

    Fake-ass libertarian girly man Steve Chapman wants football banned by elite decree.

    Why am I not the least bit surprised? What a freedom-hating little fruitcake.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    All I see is him saying that Yale and Harvard should discontinue playing football voluntarily.

  • Juice||

    They're too good for TBIs. Leave that to the state schools.

  • Domestic Dissident||

    Oh please. It's pretty easy to read between the lines of his bullshit. This is how leftist assholes like him always get started on one of their sanctimonious crusades.

  • Citizen X - #6||

    Where "read between the lines" = "make shit up"

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Do you believe there is an appropriate way to approach this then? Or is simply taking issue with the fact that he spoke against playing football?

  • Stormy Dragon||

    Just because you think the voice in your head is Steve Chapman does not make Steve Chapman actually responsible for what it's whispering to you.

  • John||

    Chapman is responsible for the logical implications of his position. If it is the right thing for Yale and Harvard to do, then why isn't it the right thing for every other college to do? Unless Chapman wants to explain why Yale and Harvard are different, he is advocating for everyone to do it. He is just too dishonest to say so in so many words.

  • Fairbanks||

    He said more than that. He said that there is a heavy burden of proof on those who support the game. Why do adults have a burden of proof to justify engaging voluntarily in activities that harm no one not engaged in those activities?

  • Domestic Dissident||

    This. Chapwoman is taking that non-scientific, self-selecting "study" that we've all heard about and is actually using it to imply that everyone who plays football at even the college level is going to get CTE! It's every bit as completely absurd bullshit as implying that every person who smokes pot is going to turn into a worthless, unproductive, drug-addled zombie.

    But the leftards like Chapwoman apparently desperately want their War on Football. He doesn't even make a halfway decent fake libertarian.

  • colorblindkid||

    Moore wound up marrying somebody he met while she was super young. I'm honestly still on the fence about the whole thing. It is only hilarious and serious because of his positions on such things. If it wasn't for hypocrisy, I wouldn't be too troubled at all. My grandpa was 26 when he started dating my 16 year old grandmother, and they were happily married for the rest of their lives.

  • Brendan||

    He's probably a creep, or at least was one back then.

    I'm getting a sense of old accusation fatigue with all the people being accused of things that allegedly happened before I was born and/or in early elementary school.
    The person can't be punished for it and has a very difficult time disproving it. What's the point?

    If the Moore story is correct, the person in question didn't go public, she was tracked down by the WaPo, which suggests someone tipped them off. How nice of them not to do it during the primary or at any time during his courtroom antics.

  • John||

    Absent a video or the guy admitting it, it is hard to see what you supposed to do with accusations this old. Basically, everyone just believes or doesn't believe it based on whether they like the person. The actual facts have nothing to do with it.

  • Memory Hole||

    The facts line up with the accusers. Moore stupidly denied things that are verifiable. His credibility is destroyed for that reason alone. These women don't even know one another. There are many different credible data points that lend support to the parts of the women's story that would only have beem experienced by Moore and the women accusing him. Time doesn't do anything to diminish the quality of the evidence either. The only motherfucker claiming foggy memory is the pervert who admitted to dating teenage girls. His own co workers remember that he dated teenage girls and hung around high schools.

  • John||

    Moore stupidly denied things that are verifiable Like what? say what they are and what Moore has lied about that has been shown to be a lie or shut up.

    And the fact that the women didn't know each other means nothing. You can pay a group of strangers to lie about something just as easily as a group of friends to lie about it.

    I get it. You hate Moore. So you believe the accusations. Thanks for providing confirmation of what I am talking about.

  • jcw||

    At least we know that he doesn't date girls without the permission of their mothers, which is the important thing here.

  • John||

    He admits to dating teenagers who were of legal age 40 years ago. And I should give a shit about that why? Legal age is of legal age. The rest is his business.

  • Memory Hole||

    Moore was asked if he ever dated teenagers when he was in his 30s and Moore said no, then not generally and then not without mother's permission. Which is it? Moore's answers cannot all be true.

  • John||

    No he didn't. Moore admitted up front he dated teenagers. His wife was 18 when she married him. He never denied dating teenagers when he was in his 30s. He married one for God's sake. He could hardly deny that.

    You are lying. Just stop it. Just admit you want it to be true so you will believe anything. At least that is being honest. Stop pretending you are being rational here.

  • Memory Hole||

    Wrong. Hannity tried to down Moore down on the question of whether he dated teenagers and Moore answered "No, not generally". That is a lie. The honest answer was "Yes. I dated teenagers".

  • John||

    You are making shit up. The guy's wife was 18 when they got married. Everyone knows that. There is no way he could deny he dated teenagers. It would be like him denying he was married. You are just fucking lying. The facts are what they are. Quite making them up.

  • Memory Hole||

    Go read the transcript of Roy Moore on the Sean Hannity radio show. You obviously haven't. You're just fucking wrong.

  • Memory Hole||

    HANNITY: At that time in your life, let me ask you this you do remember these girls would it be unusual for you as a 32-year-old guy to have dated a woman as young as 17? That would be a 15 year difference or a girl 18. Do you remember dating girls that young at that time?

    MOORE: Not generally, no. If did, you know, I'm not going to dispute anything but I don't remember anything like that.

    HANNITY: But you don't specifically remember having any girlfriend that was in her late teens even at that time?

    MOORE: I don't remember that and I don't remember ever dating any girl without the permission of her mother. And I think in her statement she said that her mother actually encouraged her to go out with me.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    He married an 18 years old. Hannity asked about age 17, not 18.

    Furthermore, dating and trying to fuck are too totally different things.

    Most people would fully disclose everything but Moore is an attorney and a politician. He did not lie but is also being a shady lawyer.

    Its up to Alabama Republicans to pick this guy or not. The left just is trying to hijack the GOP's majority in the Senate.

  • CE||

    I think the right answer is "don't pick this guy". You have to have some standards.

  • Brendan||

    "His own co workers remember that he dated teenage girls and hung around high schools."

    This gets me. Not once could they have mentioned this to a reporter anonymously during all the other times Moore was in the news?

    Fuck all these people who come out after the big reveal to say, "Yeah, we knew about this about the whole time."

  • EscherEnigma||

    Not once could they have mentioned this to a reporter anonymously during all the other times Moore was in the news?
    If you're not from Alabama or the South, and are not an Evangelical of the region, then this may surprise you, but he's actually gotten a lot of support from Alabama Evangelicals saying "we don't see a problem with a man in his thirties dating high school students".

    So yeah. Seeing as lots of folks in the area didn't consider it a problem at the time, why would his co-workers volunteer it unprompted?

  • Bubba Jones||

    The answer is that his own coworkers didn't care. They answered the question truthfully when asked.

  • JFree||

    The timing of the Moore story is not about the election. It is about the #MeToo stuff.

    She couldn't, back then, get legal recourse because he was the freaking district attorney. She told some people privately over the years so the story isn't new at all. But the reality is that it took this #MeToo meme for a LOT (like hundreds of thousands at least) of women to actually feel comfortable talking publicly about stuff they had repressed for a long time.

    I don't really understand why it took women so long - but it did. I am near 100% certain that women sharing these stories now are telling the truth - ESPECIALLY those who don't stand to benefit now because statutes of limitation have expired.

  • Brendan||

    It still would have been nice for whoever led the WaPo to the first girl to have done that during the primary election or courtroom drama.

    The New Yorker is now claiming that local cops said that he was banned from the mall for cruising for teenagers.

    Too bad that never got mentioned once during all his high profile media time. Just one anonymous comment from all the people who were apparently aware of this that 'Judge/Senate candidate Moore was such a creep in his 30s that he got banned from the mall for cruising for young girls.' Nothing. These people suck too.

  • Memory Hole||

    Dude he sexually assaulted two of the girls. Have you just not bothered to investigate the details? You can't accept the truth of this shit and sit on the fence in my opinion. Moore's credibility is the most suspect when you consider the totality of the evidence. Did you catch the Sean Hannity interview? Moore was obviously less than truthful.

  • John||

    Dude he sexually assaulted two of the girls.

    And you know that how? Oh yeah, you don't like him so you believe whatever anyone says about him.

  • Memory Hole||

    I know it as well I as know most things. If we were witnessws to the crimes we wouldn't be qualified to sit on a jury. We rely on the experiences of others to determine whether crimes occurred. I would convict this guy on the evidence that's been presented especially considering Moore destroyed his own credibility in that Hannity interview.

  • John||

    I know it as well I as know most things.

    Can't argue with you there.

  • Memory Hole||

    What kind of fucking lawyer are you to not understand that every jury verdict is determined by people who rely on other witnesses to form the opinion?

  • John||

    And you know nothing about these witnesses other than they are telling you what you want to hear. You don't know shit.

  • John||

    And you know nothing about these witnesses. You have no idea their background or reasons to lie or anything else. All you have is people telling you what you want to hear. That is it. If it turns out to be true, it will be by luck alone, because there is nothing they could say that you would not believe.

  • Memory Hole||

    I know the girl was at a custody hearing where Moore worked as a ADA. That's no lie. Most of the evidence is not in dispute. It's what occurred behind closed doors that we are necessarily dependent upon the credibility of the witnesses and I believe the girls for alot of reasons.

  • John||

    You know they once knew of him. So did a lot of people. There are thousands of people who have interacted and known Moore over the years. That says nothing about the truthfulness of their accusations.

  • TW||

    All things being equal, I'd rather someone other than Roy Moore was the Republican nominee and I find someone in their thirties dating a teenager to be pretty weird even if they were legally of age and he got their parent's permission. That being said - there's a pretty huge distance between "went out with a sixteen year old after asking and receiving her parent's permission" to "assaulted a fourteen year old."

  • Memory Hole||

    "assaulted a fourteen year old" and a 16 year old. Now you have to believe two women are lying.

  • Tom Bombadil||

    If this forum is no longer stipulating that all women lie, I don't want to play anymore.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    I though Democrat policy was to consider all woman accusers as liars?

    Hillary Clinton once called Monica Lewinsky, the White House intern Hillary's husband took advantage of during his time in the Oval Office, a 'narcissistic loony toon.' Kathleen Wiley, who accused Bill Clinton of sexual assault in 1993, said Hillary went out of her way to verbally beat her down in order to delegitimize the accusations.

    In 1975, the same year she married Bill, Hillary Clinton agreed to serve as the court-appointed attorney for Thomas Alfred Taylor, a 41-year-old accused of raping the child after luring her into a car.
    In a July 28, 1975, court affidavit, Clinton wrote that she had been informed the young girl was "emotionally unstable" and had a "tendency to seek out older men and engage in fantasizing."
    "I have also been told by an expert in child psychology that children in early adolescence tend to exaggerate or romanticize sexual experiences and that adolescents in disorganized families, such as the complainant's, are even more prone to exaggerate behavior," Clinton said.
    Clinton said the child had "in the past made false accusations about persons, claiming they had attacked her body" and that the girl "exhibits an unusual stubbornness and temper when she does not get her way."

  • Juice||

    The EU signed a "historic" deal to integrate 23 armies to shake off its US dependence

    It took 70 years, but the European Union finally signed a pact today (Nov. 13) agreeing to integrate military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defenses. In a way, creating a unified mega army.

    So...like Voltron?
  • Juice||

    fuck

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Good for them.

  • Red Tony||

    Can't tell if this is good news or bad news.

    On the one hand, giant army that doesn't belong to America.

    On the other hand, America probably won't need to spend as much money maintaining European bases.

    On the other other hand, fuck Europe.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I take it as good. They should be responsible for their own protection, and we should probably be less involved militarily with that part of the world.

  • Red Tony||

    Wild guess: 25 years from now, WWIII erupts, and it starts in Europe. This leads to everyone agreeing with me on one salient point:

    FUCK EUROPE.

    (Beyond that I take your point, and it would be nice if the U.S. would quit sticking its dick everywhere.)

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    And I stand by your "FUCK EUROPE" belief system.

  • BYODB||

    I must wonder if step #1 is 'return Britain into the EU' but we shall see since I can't be sure they're actually leaving at all.

  • KobolCoffeeLord||

    On the other hand, America probably won't need to spend as much money maintaining European bases.

    True. What luck for us, there will be another massive standing army in the area so our own massive standing army will be able to take a holiday from global protection. Think of the savings. With another army providing required services, we can afford to scale back some of our expensive operations.

    This would be rational. You seem rational. Traditionally, a military tends to not take market competition philosophically, and that gives me a moment's pause.

  • Kivlor||

    I have a negative view of it. I think it's pretty obvious that the EU will inevitably attempt to officially integrate, and dissolve the individual nation-states that comprise it. And that is bad for the peoples of those nations.

    In the era of the Pax Americana, where there are no other superpowers, having one forge itself out of our vassal states is also not a good thing. This will likely lead to conflict between us, which will also invite others to rise up and challenge us (ie China).

    Not that there aren't some positive aspects to it. I'm just thinking they're minuscule compared to the negatives.

  • Brendan||

    An EU military is an interesting development.

    We'll probably see WW3 in about 15 years when internal strife boils over up as all their lauded social programs get displaced to cover the costs of their new military doing all the things the US used to do in that region.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    So Europe now openly admits that it's been leaning on the U.S. whenever someone needs to go die?

  • Half-Virtue, Half-Vice||

    This is good, take some weight off our shoulders and we won't have to feel obligated to involve ourselves in everything.

  • Tom Bombadil||

    " the European Union finally signed a pact today (Nov. 13) agreeing to integrate military funding, weapons development, and deployment of European defenses. In a way, creating a unified mega army."

    This time Germany's doing it right.

  • loveconstitution1789||

    Remember the last time Europe was united under one army?

  • Red Tony||

    I don't believe that ever happened.

    Napoleon: didn't grab Britain, didn't grab northern Europe.

    Romans: didn't grab Scotland, Ireland, or much of Germany; didn't grab northern Europe.

    Hitler: didn't grab Britain, Italy, Sweden, Norway, or Finland.

    Unless the Huns did something, I don't think Europe has ever been united under one army.

  • Tom Bombadil||

    Benetton?

  • Unlabelable MJGreen||

    I kinda find the yearbook message creepier than the actual molestation accusations.

  • Rich||

    Nelson said she was waiting for her boyfriend to pick her up from work one night when Moore offered to give her a ride home.

    "I trusted Mr. Moore because he was a district attorney," Nelson said.

    Oops.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    Why do we keep trusting elected officials? We should know better at this point.

  • Rich||

    "I said 'huge *election*'!"

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    I actually remember a professor of mine telling me a story when they were in Japan. Is was back in the 90s and a friendly business man was talking to them about Bill Clinton and kept mentioning how excited he was for Clinton's *election*.

    It was a fun story.

  • Red Tony||

    Everybody's excited for Clinton's election.

    ...well, maybe not Hillary's election, but Bill's election sure enough.

  • BestUsedCarSales||

    They're just upset that Hillary's election was bigger.

  • Red Tony||

    Thus proving that bigger is not always better.

    Just remember, Bill feels your pain.

  • Nwallins||

    Donna Brazile will not hesitate to show us how she wins election contests

  • Red Tony||

    The Supreme Court has agreed to take a couple of potentially significant First Amendment cases. One case will explore whether a state (California) can force pregnancy clinics to provide information about abortion to patients. The second case will explore whether a state (Minnesota) can ban political buttons and badges at polling locations.

    No they cannot, and no they cannot.

    The rule of thumb should be that if the states have to ask "can I do this?" the answer is no.

  • John||

    Pretty much. The other rule is that if the question is "can a state force..." the answer is almost certainly no, at least with regards to speech.

  • John||

    If the Roy Moore accusor is telling the truth, who told her to hire Gloria Aldred? She is either lying or the recipient of the worst PR advice ever given. Why would anyone who was telling the truth want to be associated with Aldred?

    Beyond that, I love how it never occurs to anyone that the signature on the yearbook might not be legit. I don't know that it isn't. But without any evidence, why is there any reason to believe that signature is what they are claiming it is? Anyone can sign a yearbook "Roy Moore" at any time.

  • BYODB||


    Republican Sens. Mitch McConnell and Susan Collins say they believe the women and that Moore should step aside;


    If your goal was to make me dislike Moore even more...this is not the way to do so. This makes me almost reflexively defend him, in fact, because McConnell specifically endorsed and funded Strange and Collins is definitely, and without question, a RINO. There isn't really a way to get around those facts. In truth, I suspect that McConnell would prefer a Democrat over Moore and I know Collins would.


    Jesus H. Fucking Christ, how about something with substance before you link?

  • John||

    Lindsey Graham testified as a character witness for Menendez at his trial. But these guys care so much about underage sex. I have never liked Roy Moore and certainly don't give a shit about who is Senator from Alabama but my God these assholes are forcing me to hope the guy wins.

  • Stormy Dragon||

    And yet tomorrow you'll be whining about how Democrats choose principals over principles.

  • John||

    And saying that the Republicans are just as bad makes that claim untrue how? The Democrats are going to welcome Menendez back with open arms. No conviction no foul. They don't' give a shit if he was part of a sex slave ring, any more than they give a shit what Roy Moore did 40 years ago.

    Do you not understand that?

  • Stormy Dragon||

    None of which has anything to do with you wanting Roy Moore to win just because you dislike the people criticizing him.

  • John||

    No. I would like him to win because the guy he is running against is worse and because having a double standard is worse than having no standard. You can't see how that words because you are a partisan idiot who can't get past your hatred for Moore. I am not and can.

  • John||

    You don't give a fuck about Menendez either. He is a Democrat so the rules don't apply to him in your mind. All I am saying is, if you want the rules to apply to Moore, then you should have applied them to Democrats.

  • Red Tony||

    John, I say this as a...guy who can...comfortably offer comments on the internet...within the bounds of state and federal law...and I just want you to know...that you're kinda...going Buttplug here.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    And as everyone knows, you never go full Buttplug.

  • Unlabelable MJGreen||

    This makes me almost reflexively defend him

    Bet you feel like a partisan moron now, Scott.

  • John||

    AS opposed to the people like you who reflexively believe anything said about him? You are just as big of a partisan moron. Meanwhile, the fact that they are going to welcome Menendez back into the Senate, even though there is very credible evidence he had sex with underage sex slaves kept on Epstein's Island makes all this shit ring a bit hollow. It is not that one justifies the other. It is that the hypocrisy and double standards going on here ought to offend the sensibilities of anyone with any integrity and isnt' just a partisan moron happy to see someone they don't like go down for any reason.

  • BYODB||

    It puts me in an impossible position: agree with McConnell or support someone who may or may not have done something that may or may not have been legal before I was alive.

    The only reason I thought Moore might not be terrible was because McConnell didn't like him. Yes, I hate McConnell. A lot. And I admit that could indeed cloud my judgment when it comes to other things.

    I suspect I'm not alone there.

  • Tony||

    Roy Moore is one of the most terrible people on earth.

  • Tony||

    So terrible even Mitch McConnell doesn't want to work with him, if that helps.

  • Bubba Jones||

    he didn't disclose this information to the Senate as a potential conflict of interest.

    Probably because it isn't a conflict of interest. At least no more so than any nominee is grateful to the person who nominated him.

  • John||

    Most of the members of the Supreme Court, sans the Notorious RBG and the Magic Latina have never tried a case either.

  • Bubba Jones||

    Most of them were politicians in the executive branch.

  • Tony||

    With due sympathy to the victims, I find it pretty hilarious that the moment of introspection and putting principle over party for Republican politicians only comes when the issue is kid fucking.

    Republican voters, of course, forgive the kid fucking too.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    You know who else forgave kid fucking?

  • Tony||

    The all-powerful creator of the cosmos?

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    I was going to say the documentary Roman Polanski: Wanted and Desired, but yeah.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

    This now a fucking thing in America, and proof that there is no slippery slope.

    http://abcnews.go.com/US/proof.....d=27222136

    American Airlines, the parent company of US Airways, confirmed to ABC News that a passenger brought the pig aboard as an emotional support animal. After the pig became disruptive, she was asked to leave, a spokesperson said.
  • Tom Bombadil||

    There was on old lady who had a support fly
    I don't know why she wanted a fly, perhaps she'll die.

    There was an old lady who had a support spider
    She had the support spider to support the fly.
    I don't know why she wanted a fly, perhaps she'll die.

    etc.

  • Bra Ket||

    Fun fact: pig squealing is comparable in volume to jet engine noise.

  • Diane Reynolds (Paul.)||

  • Morbo||

  • XM||

    Moore says he doesn't even know the woman, and can't even recall the restaurant. But she has an yearbook with his signature. Since his denials are absolute, he'll be TONs of trouble if anyone can identify that he was a regular customer there.

    Either Moore is a creepy pedophile, or this is a blockbuster sequel to the UVA fiasco. And I just don't get it. The entire town either heard rumors or saw him trying to pick up young girls, and no one brought it up? In the 80's, a local politician getting banned at a mall didn't make the news?

    He was at a mall, picking up young girls, and no one said "Yo check it out, I heard that guy's Roy Moore the DA, he's here doing his thing again." The mall management didn't file a report? The local police can't confirm whether he was actually banned, apparently.

    Guilty or not, I suspect Moore understands these women probably don't have physical evidence that can be used against him. Not after 30,40 years.

  • Bra Ket||

    With all these allegations he is looking more and more guilty. But on the point you're making about "catching" him in a lie with the absolute denials, he could simply have forgotten or confused people. It was a really long time ago. Reality is not always so simple and memories are fallible for everyone involved.

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