Airdropping Aid to Gaza Is an Expensive Gimmick
The airlift avoids the real problems causing starvation.

President Joe Biden announced Friday that the U.S. military will work with Jordan to begin airdropping aid to starving Palestinians in the Gaza Strip. Ever since it was proposed, this idea has attracted criticisms from experienced humanitarian workers, who say the airdrops are an expensive, wasteful gimmick to avoid addressing the political problems causing the starvation.
The charity Oxfam America, for example, issued a statement Thursday arguing that airdrops "would mostly serve to relieve the guilty consciences of senior U.S. officials whose policies are contributing to the ongoing atrocities and risk of famine in Gaza." Instead, it said, Biden should "cut the flow" of American weapons to Israel.
Jeremy Konyndyk, the president of Refugees International and a former disaster relief official in the Obama and Biden administrations, outlined the problems with airdrops in a PBS interview a day before Biden's announcement.
"We only used them when we had absolutely no other option, because they're the worst way to get aid in. They cost a lot of money, they're difficult to mount logistically, and they get very little volume," Konyndyk said. "We're only resorting to airdrops because of the blockages by the Israeli government."
Airdropping food costs about $16,000 per ton, as opposed to $180 per ton on average to move food aid by truck, according to a U.S. Air Force study from 2016.
Under pressure from the Biden administration, the Israeli government has opened a land crossing into the Gaza Strip—but Israeli nationalist protesters have physically blocked the crossing several times. Meanwhile, goods entering Gaza from Egypt must still go through the arduous Israeli border inspection process.
Sen. Chris van Hollen (D–Md.), who visited the Egyptian side of the Rafah crossing in January, told The New Yorker that some shipments were being held at the border for 20 days, and that he saw entire shipments turned back because they contained just one banned item, such as a tent with a metal pole.
The U.S. government itself has admitted that the starvation is a political problem, although it blames Hamas rather than Israel.
"It is not a question of aid going in," U.S. State Department spokesman Matt Miller told reporters on Thursday. "There is a distribution problem inside Gaza right now because there are police officers—some of whom are members of Hamas—who have been providing the security for that distribution inside Gaza. And what Israel says is that they have a legitimate right to go after Hamas. We would obviously prefer to see members of a security force inside Gaza who are not Hamas members."
Inside the Gaza Strip, distribution has been chaotic. Riots have broken out around aid convoys, and Hamas-affiliated police shot a teenager in a December incident. Israeli forces have also bombed the police officers guarding aid convoys. U.S. official David Satterfield said last month that the attacks on police in Gaza have made it "virtually impossible" to protect aid from "criminal gangs."
The deadliest aid-related incident of the war, known as "flour massacre," took place Wednesday, when Israeli forces opened fire on a crowd of Palestinians seeking aid. According to the Palestinian health ministry, 112 people were killed. The Israeli military claims that its troops opened fire when Palestinians approached them in an unsafe way, that their gunfire caused only 10 casualties, and that most of the deaths were produced by a stampede.
That day, the war's Palestinian death toll reportedly crossed 30,000 deaths. Half a million Palestinians in the Gaza Strip, a quarter of the population, are facing imminent starvation, according to U.N. officials.
In addition to announcing the airdrops, Biden said that he was seeking an "immediate" six-week ceasefire and a "surge" of aid on the ground. He has so far resisted calling for a permanent end to the war. When the war resumes, the aid that cost Americans so much to fly in may soon be bombed by American weapons.
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Hamas can end the situation at any time by laying down their weapons and surrendering, and releasing any surviving hostages.
The airlift avoids the real problems causing starvation.
"Hamas?" was my first thought on reading the subheader.
How about just stopping the genocide?
Palestine was every Zionists wet dream since the late 1800s.
When WW1 was close to completion in 1916 rich global Zionists, who had been more accepted in Germany than anywhere else, made a deal with Britain to bring the antiwar US into the war in exchange for the promise of Palestine via the Balfour Declaration.
That stab in the back and the resulting suffering in German from the treaty of Versailles gave rise to anti Jewish sentiment and with it Nazism.
Once again global Zionists boycotted all German trade, promising to bring another world war to Germany successfully resulting in WW2.
Meanwhile Zionists had claimed that Jews were the victims of genocide holocausts in various nations no less than 166 times between 1900 and 1945. To raise money like liars on go fund me websites do today.
In 1948 with allied weapons and support Jews declared the apartheid state of Israel beginning the Middle East conflict. They have occupied and terrorized Palestinians for the last 76 years with more US weaponry and aid than any other nation.
Now Jews are on trial in the international court of justice for committing genocide in Gaza. They promised to and have actually slaughtered over 20,000 non combatant Palestinian women and children.
That is the story of Palestine and Israel.
Israel is stopping the genocide.
>made a deal with Britain to bring the antiwar US into the war in exchange for the promise of Palestine via the Balfour Declaration.
What brought the US into the war was unrestricted submarine warfare on American civilians conducted by Germany, combined with an utterly boneheaded plot by the Germans to turn the US-Mexico border into a second front., which the Mexican government wisely rejected. Even if Zionists wanted to, they did not have enough pull with the US government to bring it into the war.
>That stab in the back and the resulting suffering in German from the treaty of Versailles
The British and French would have beaten the Germans eventually even without American help. Also, the Treaty of Versailles was ridiculously lenient. Compared to the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk and the Treaty of Sevres it was nothing. The Germans were just being babies.
Also, even if it what you were saying was true (which it isn't), I don't see how American and British Jews lobbying their own governments to affect the outcome of WWI is a "stab in the back," just because there were also Jews living in Germany. People are not responsible for the actions of their coethnics in other countries.
>Meanwhile Zionists had claimed that Jews were the victims of genocide holocausts in various nations no less than 166 times between 1900 and 1945.
It's an easy claim to make since it's true. Jews have historically been persecuted in many countries for the crime of doing useful and beneficial work. It all started in the Middle Ages, when Jews were forced to work in the financial industry because Christians didn't want to dirty their hands by doing so. (this is because, for some insane reason, a lot of people turn into frothing psycho rage monsters when they hear about the concept of charging interest on a loan)
Since the financial industry is a really good and important key to economic prosperity, this meant a lot of Jews ended up creating more wealth than their Christian neighbors, which inspired envy and hatred. Jews are basically the equivalent of those superheroes who are hated and feared by the general populace, even though all they do is help people. Fortunately this hatred has subsided as modern people are starting to see that the financial industry is a good thing, and are no longer as likely to turn into bile-spewing madmen when someone tries to charge interest on a loan.
>In 1948 with allied weapons and support Jews declared the apartheid state of Israel beginning the Middle East conflict.
A bunch of Jews peacefully emigrated to Palestine and were repeatedly attacked by Arab anti-immigrant fanatics. For this reason the British and the UN wisely decided to partition the area into a Jewish state and an Arab state. Fanatical Arab nationalists refused to accept this, and attacked. The fighting forced a large number of Palestinian Arabs to flee their homes, and they were not allowed back into Israel when it was over, which was a genuine dick move on the Israeli government's part.
However, the fact remains that if the Arab nationalists had accepted the partition plan, none of this would be happening now. Israel would be a smaller country, Gaza would be part of Egypt, and the West Bank would be part of Jordan. The descendants of the Palestinian refugees would be living peacefully in Israel, the same way Israeli Arabs do today.
Every single subsequent attempt by Arab nationalists to use violence to fix this problem has made it worse. Each attempt to invade Israel has led to Israel seizing more territory. The October 7th attack has led to an invasion of Gaza to destroy its perpetrators.
Jews declared Israel a state in 1948 after the UN had already declared it a state in 1947 with a majority vote of the General Assembly.
It was immediately attacked by five surrounding nations who attempted an invasion, and were beaten back.
You can see why they'd make a dick move
Samuel landman was solicitor to the UK Zionist federation from 1917 - 1922. In his paper published in 1936 entitled Great Britain the Jews and Palestine he said that the Balfour Declaration was definitely a contract to bring the US into the war in exchange for the promise of Palestine.
The Lusitania passenger liner sinking in 1915 was used as propaganda. In 2008 diving teams proved that it was carrying millions of rounds of ammunition and a legal combatant. Neither the Americans who loaded the ammunition or the British who ordered it told any of the civilians aboard, and deny it in the face of irrefutable evidence to this day. Restricted submarine warfare my ass!
For all these reasons the Germans knew of the plans to bring the us into the war and there only alternative was to solicit help from Mexico.
Nothing could beat German uboats. In 1916 France wanted out and Russia was negotiating peace with Germany who had offered to all the reasonable return to pre-war conditions. Only the sheer numbers of American dead on the front lines won the war.
The antiwar president Wilson controversially appointed the Jew and leader of the American Zionist organization Louis Brandeis to the Supreme Court and as his special counsel to WW1.
Claiming holocausts of 6,000,000 Jews in various nations on 166 different occasions between 1900 and 1945 was nothing less than bald faced lying from Jews whose religion advocates lying. This is the reason Jews have been persecuted and are hated. Stop lying Jew.
This is the Kol Nidre text
“All vows, obligations, oaths, and anathemas [curses]which we may vow, or swear, or pledge, or whereby we may be bound, from this Day of Atonement until the next we do repent. May they be deemed absolved, forgiven, annulled, and void, and made of no effect: they shall not bind us nor have any power over us. The vows shall not be reckoned vows; the obligations shall not be obligations; nor the oaths be oaths.”
You may not have me around to warn you, so I'll tell you now. You're dealing with a Holocaust-Denying, Anti-Jewish Nazi! Don't engage this bastard unless it's to tell him what I always tell him:
Fuck Off, Nazi!
That trial is over. The recommendation was that Israel take precautions to not put civilians lives in danger.
AND that Hamas release all hostages immediately.
Has Israel complied? Some say no, some say yes.
But those hostages remain hostages. It's undeniable that Hamas has NOT.
Idiot. The ICJ has ruled that the trial is moving forward because there is reason to believe Israel is committing genocide.
They ruled on interim and immediate provisions which Israel and its henchmen are ignoring.
“Israel defying ICJ ruling to prevent genocide by failing to allow adequate humanitarian aid to reach Gaza”
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/02/israel-defying-icj-ruling-to-prevent-genocide-by-failing-to-allow-adequate-humanitarian-aid-to-reach-gaza/
This.
The US shouldn't be sending any aid to Gaza at all. They are literally rapist terrorists playing War Crime Bingo. Imagine if the US sent aid to the Nazis in WW2, and the Nazis didn't even hide terrorist bunkers underneath hospitals. It's ridiculous.
There is a very substantial proportion of Israel that agrees with you. They want everything cut off except for legally mandated items based in i'ntl law (i.e. humanitarian aid - food, medicine, water only). I agree with them.
The problems in Palestine started before Hamas existed, and if higher level change doesn't occur, we'll just get Hamas part two, like we got ISIS as Al Qaeda became less powerful. There is no excuse for killing innocents by Hamas or the Israeli government, but at the same time, I think we need to recognize that the Israeli government made Hamas, or an organization like it, all but inevitable through their policies in the Palestinian territories.
I like your post, except I don't see "that the Israeli government made Hamas ... through their policies". Instead, I see it made by Islamist fanatics who hate Jews and used their hate to obtain political power in Gaza, so they could oppress the Palestinians far worse than Israel ever did.
Blaming Israel for Palestinian problems, is just like Democrats claiming xenophobic Americans are oppressing foreigners by not allowing them across the border (while they have an open border). Most Palestinians would rather be living in Israel, just like most foreigners would rather live in the USA.
It's strange since I seldom believe what the Biden administration says, but I believe the US government's statement that follows is correct:
The U.S. government itself has admitted that the starvation is a political problem, although it blames Hamas rather than Israel.
Your comment is ahistorical. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel strongly encouraged the Qatari government to send millions of dollars a month into the Gaza Strip to prop up the Hamas government. In addition, Netanyahu at a Likud party conference in 2019 said, "Anyone who wants to prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state needs to support strengthening Hamas."
You are full of shit.
I for one am totally shocked that EdG is a Palestinian simp.
Cool story bro. Got any other bullshit yarns you want to spin?
Hamas murders people for fun. Israel has to contend with collateral damage because Hamas uses ‘Palestinians’ as human shields.
But you’re too stupid and credulous to understand the difference.
Hamas is the continuation of the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO). The PLO was a construct of the Soviets to promote destabilization in the Middle East. The Soviets objective was to get the US dependent on oil from the Middle East. It used it's "useful idiots" (Greenpeace, The Sierra Club and others) to make that happen. Their objective was to use the PLO to be able to threaten the Suez Canal, while at the same time destabilizing Iran to threaten the Straights of Hormuz.
Psychopath
I'm suuuuuure that would be enough for the Israeli fascist politicians like Ben-Gvir who have made it clear that their goal is the physical elimination of Gaza.
Folks, we are witnessing here the propaganda war. Reason generally takes the rational side when push comes to shove and admits that Hamas atrocities triggered the current war, but they constantly seem to forget that in a rush to condemn the collateral damage and civilian casualties that occur in ANY war. Imagine an American alternative news source during World War Two condemning the starvation and collateral damage done to the German people after Hitler invaded the entire European continent and summarily executed millions of people. Disgusting!
"Imagine an American alternative news source during World War Two"
There's no need to go back that far. There's plenty of other wars America has been involved in. Take Afghanistan for example. American leaders never spoke of exterminating Afghans, there were no attempts to starve the population, no indiscriminate bombings of civilians. Apologists for genocide always seem to hearken back to WWII to justify and minimize Israel's war crimes.
If you have real evidence that Israel is intentionally starving and killing civilians then prove it. That’s what I meant about a “propaganda” war here: all we have is highly questionable propaganda from the terrorist side and an occasional denial or apology from the Israeli government. Almost every allegation by the terrorists has subsequently been debunked (take the hospital bombing early on for example – it was a Hamas misfired rocket that killed refugees in the parking lot and did almost zero damage to the hospital building itself, medical personnel or patients inside, not an Israeli bomb on the hospital) so repeating their propaganda as fact just makes you a propagandist.
You should read the South African charges of Israeli genocide against the people of Gaza. Israel had a chance to rebut the charges but I think all but one of the 15 judges found that there was a plausible case against Israel, and the process was set to proceed on to the next stage. It was in the news, I believe, but never covered here at Reason.
"That’s what I meant about a “propaganda” war here: all we have is highly questionable propaganda from the terrorist side and an occasional denial or apology from the Israeli government."
We have a lot more than highly questionable propaganda. We have tens of thousands of dead bodies and horrendous devastation. But of course they don't fit in with your depraved narrative so they are conveniently brushed aside. You said it best, disgusting.
The asshole trueman lies. It’s what trueman does. If what trueman posts isn’t a lie, it’s nonsense:
mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
“Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”
Why would I give a shit what the South Africans have to say? You are seriously idiotic.
"Why would I give a shit what the South Africans have to say? "
Because you care about Jews and are concerned about the gravity of the charges laid against Israel. Because Israel has been dining out for decades on the strength of their being victims of genocide. Once it's accepted that they are now perpetrators, all that emotional capital will disappear, Israel will be recognized as a pariah state and destined for the dustbin of history. Giving a shit yet? There's always more if you want.
They aren’t perpetrators. Israel is willing to live in peace with their neighbors. The reverse is not true. Especially with the ‘Palestinians’. If they didn’t want to be attacked, maybe they shouldn’t hav elected and supported Hamas, and their actions on 10/7.
Israel are the good guys. Case closed. Only a totalitarian Marxist scumbag like you would think otherwise. You are a bigot and a fool.
" Israel is willing to live in peace with their neighbors. "
It's not their neighbors they should be worried about. It's the people they've been in conflict with since their founding. ie the Palestinians.
"Israel are the good guys. "
No, they're Nazi scum. And you're not much better for supporting them and their murderous actions. Enjoy it while you can.
I hear they're doing wonderful things in mental health lately....
"We have tens of thousands of dead bodies and horrendous devastation."
That's pretty weak, even for you. We can discuss the actual body count versus the claimed body count all day long, but it's irrelevant to the point: pointing to a dead body tells us nothing about how or why he was killed. No one seriously disputes the likelihood that some innocent bystanders have been killed during a war in which one side is burrowed into the infrastructure and intentionally hiding behind the people they claim to be fighting for.
And pointing to a pile of rubble says nothing about why it was destroyed. Taking a picture of a destroyed building with a hand-painted sign that says "Baby Milk Factory" doesn't prove it wasn't a Hamas headquarters destroyed during a firefight. So not buying it, but by all means keep shaking your tiny fists in impotent rage.
“We can discuss the actual body count versus the claimed body count all day long, but it’s irrelevant to the point”
Dead bodies aren’t irrelevant. You can’t have genocide without dead bodies. And the numbers are more than sufficient. There were some 8,000 victims in the Srebinica, and we had no problem calling it an act of genocide. What’s happening in Gaza is far more horrible. As far as intention is concerned, that’s more than clear from multiple statements of politicians and military leaders. As I said, you can read about this in the South African charges and Israeli response.
“So not buying it, but by all means keep shaking your tiny fists in impotent rage.”
Whether you buy it or not is immaterial. It’s a matter before the courts and they bought it. Israel doesn’t have to worry about my tiny fists. They are surrounded by enemies who have the ability to wipe Israel off the map.
“And pointing to a pile of rubble says nothing about why it was destroyed. Taking a picture of a destroyed building with a hand-painted sign that says “Baby Milk Factory” doesn’t prove it wasn’t a Hamas headquarters destroyed during a firefight”
Israel could have presented evidence to justify their choice of targets in the Hague. They didn't. The court assumed the worst.
Fuck off Nazi scum. Go ahead, keep calling Israelis "Nazis" as if anyone will accept the lunatic ravings of a piece of shit, Nazi shit-eater like you. Please submit yourself to the nearest woodchipper, feet first.
What's wrong with calling the Israelis Nazis? There are lots of other people who have perpetrated genocide, but Nazis are probably the most recognized. And there's a delicious irony, too. Jews being the principle victims of the Nazi's genocide. It seems they learned all the wrong lessons. I still think that zyklon b would be an improvement of today's techniques. In for a penny, in for a pound.
Since I may get pay walled any moment, I just wanted to say keep up the good fight!
Did you also read the ICJ recommendation that Hamas relwase all the hostages immediately?
The issue is Israeli's genocide in Gaza. It's not about hostages held by Hamas, or hostages held by Israel.
Fuck off Nazi scum. Do the world a favor and self-immolate.
The world doesn't care.
"Under pressure from the Biden administration, the Israeli government has opened a land crossing into the Gaza Strip—but Israeli nationalist protesters have physically blocked the crossing several times."
Are they throwing soup on the Mona Lisa, too?
Who cares about the cost? We have lots of money!
And we can make more!
Oh, come on. That's money that we could send to Ukraine or hand out at the border to welcome new migrants!
"Newcomers" is the new preferred term, if you please.
(and by next week, even if you don't please)
Ow they’re allocating VA resources to care for illegals.
Those food pallets are taking up valuable space and GVW allowances that could be used for ordnance.
>The airlift avoids the real problems causing starvation.
You mean the Palestinians constant attempts to kill Israelis?
^This!
Dropping hundreds of 2K bombs in an urban area is hardly trying to avoid civilian deaths. Or are all folks living in Gaza complicit and deserve to be starved and bombed? You know Christians live there or are they just useful idiots for the AIPAC?
Or are all folks living in Gaza complicit and deserve to be starved and bombed?
They're the one's who elected Hamas, and left them in power for 20 years, so... yes?
Most of them weren't even born when Hamas was elected. And about half of them are under 18---you know, children.
We melted cities full of people in WWII. War kinda sucks. Hamas is kind of insisting on war. The people there are culpable as any others in history. The actual ancient rules of war are that they’d be starved until they surrendered. And possibly pillaged and massacred for not surrendering when the had the option.
Any cease fire or half measure by Israel is totally counterproductive and makes all the death pointless.
To the extent that we should have anything to do with it? That’s obviously up for a debate.
Murum Aries Attigit.
After the atrocities committed in WWII, sane nations gathered together and created laws of war to prevent those atrocities in future conflicts. Your reliance on WWII and "ancient rules of war" is flat out wrong.
The rules of war are indeed ancient, starting with "the winner makes the rules" before the Roman Empire, but "sane nations gathered together" long before the atrocities of World War Two. The First Geneva Convention was signed in 1864. The Second Geneva Convention replaced the first one in 1906, which was replaced by the 1929 Geneva Convention. World War Two was a "total war" in the sense that the people and the nations involved were literally fighting for their lives and their existence. The Allies very nearly lost to Hitler and Tojo, and my comparison of World War Two to the Israeli-Hamas War was quite intentionally based on the desperate plight of the Israelis and the Jewish State of Israel. There are no rules when you are fighting for your life, as the more than a thousand men, women and children who were wiped out suddenly without warning by the cowardly Hamas terrorists on October 7th, 2023 could tell you if they were still alive. Nevertheless, the good guys do not intentionally kill innocent civilians or torture prisoners of war. The American wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria and the Balkans are not even remotely comparable to a desperate fight for survival, because they were political, deliberate police actions. So go peddle that mush brain crap somewhere else.
Bill, seems your beef is with Hamas who has decided to hide amongst them.
And build their command tunnels under hospitals.
Note “and left them in power”. And as for the children, well, they can blame their parents.
Look, I’d be delighted if Israel stopped bombing Gaza. There’s an easy way to get that to happen. I bet it would stop within 12 hours, possibly even less, if Hamas released all of the hostages they took, and surrendered.
But I note that you only talk about the need for Israel to stop fighting, and only mention Hamas when someone else brings them up. Why is that?
They support Hamas. So they get what they get. If they want to be left alone, they need to leave the Israelis alone.
But we all know they won’t.
I if they do team to be bombed then they shouldn’t attack Israel. He aside that’s what happens when they do.
Or are all folks living in Gaza complicit and deserve to be starved and bombed?
I suppose it's possible there's a few who aren't.
Or are all folks living in Gaza complicit and deserve to be starved and bombed?
Pretty much, yes.
" starved and bombed"
Come on, don't be so harsh. Nazis would never neglect gassing, a more humane way to commit genocide. And they were thoughtful enough to feed, clothe, and give productive work for their inmates to do. Modern Israelis seem determined to give genocide a bad name.
trueman lies. It’s what trueman does. If what trueman posts isn’t a lie, it’s nonsense:
mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
“Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”
Ya know, you're being awfully idiotic. Do you moan and wail about the millions of Japanese and German civilians who died in wars started by their leaders, and blame it on the UK and US?
Bet not. Politicians start wars, people fight them and die whether they like it or not. The Palestinians tolerate and encourage Hamas. They've made their bed, they get to lie in it.
1. They're not dropping 2000 lb bombs *at all*. Keep up with military technology mate. You sound like an idiot when you talk about tech you know nothing about.
2. If the Palestinians didn't want to be on the receiving end of bombs then maybe they shouldn't have tagged along and murdered, raped, and kidnapped people?
3. Or, you know, not built all that military infrastructure inside their own homes?
4. Fuck 'em. They brought it upon themselves.
5. It is interesting however to see people like you aren't screeching about Russian shelling of Ukrainian neighborhoods or what China has been doing for several decades to the Uyghurs. Or even what our own government has done during the WoT. But when Israel conducts what is probably the most careful military campaign of the last 120 years you're all screeching about 'them ebul joos!'
It's weird how I've "screeched" about every fucking one of those atrocities. Why are you making this one the only exception?
So, are you admitting to also being "Bill Falcon" or are you just replying to things that weren't addressed to you as if they were?
Pretty funny that they're not dropping 2000 lb bombs but the IAF has released more than a few photos of aircraft preparing to take off with 2000 lb bombs under their wings. Maybe they were just flying out to drop them in the sea...
>Or are all folks living in Gaza complicit and deserve to be starved and bombed? You know Christians live there or are they just useful idiots for the AIPAC?
Yes. The Palestinians consider all of us complicit in the things our government has done in the Middle East. So . . . sauce for the goose as the saying goes.
Or 'make your enemy live by their own rules'.
Fuck off you dishonest POS. You know Hamas has embedded itself in these areas precisely to increase civilian casualties so Leftists like you can let your anti-semitic feelings out under the guise of stopping the killing of a complicit (both in political and material support) population.
The only thing we should be airdropping over them are MOABs.
We're going to need those for Yemen.
"The only thing we should be airdropping over them are MOABs."
Nazis did extensive research on this. They found gas to be the ideal weapon for genocide. It works well on men, women and children, is cheap, humane and I'm sure the US would be more than willing to supply it.
Remember that trueman lies. It’s what trueman does. If what trueman posts isn’t a lie, it’s nonsense:
mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
“Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”
The only genocide being perpetrated in the Middle East is by Muslim countries.
Oh look, a Nazi
how the entire US foreign policy establishment, congress, media and the mob has become a propaganda arm of the Israeli State and their dual citizens in the US is pathetic. Israel is not the 51st state. The IDF is dropping more 2K pound bombs in Gaza in a few weeks than the US did against ISIS in years in a mostly rural area. This is sending a message. Perhaps Israel should vacate occupied lands and actually try for a two-state solution. Or perhaps another route is to give all Palestinians asylum and US citizenship. After all they are well education, have a traditional view of marriage and family, hard working. And they won't be leading sexual mutilation of mentally ill kids and abortion up to birth along with the DIE manta and other cultural bolshie crap.
How is this different from the firebombing of Dresden?
Why should I care?
Also: Or perhaps another route is to give all Palestinians asylum and US citizenship.
No.
All of Israel is "occupied lands". There will never be a "two state solution".
Nor should there be. It would lead to the extermination of the Jews, and euphoric celebrations by people like Mtrueman and Bill falcon.
There's no Israeli propaganda, only anti-Israel propaganda. Israel doesn't occupy any land that doesn't legitimately belong to the Jewish State. The too-meme solution will never be a thing, wasn't ever realistic in the first place, and alas, why would the victor give anything to the genocidal losers anyway? They deserve nothing, and that's exactly what they'll get in the end.
Two-State solution is impossible. One state with a large Jewish minority is the inevitable outcome.
You keep talking about '2000 lb' bombs - you don't know what you're talking about.
250 and 500 lb bombs, maybe - but no one's using 1 tonners mate. To even suggest it makes you sound like an idiot.
Lol, (Bomb shaming).
"...To even suggest it makes you sound like an idiot."
I think you're on to something.
https://theaviationist.com/2023/11/07/israeli-f-35i-cas-gaza/
Perhaps Israel should vacate occupied lands and actually try for a two-state solution.
Why? Why should they give up the lands they conquered in wars other people started?
Do you "live on Indian Land", Bill? Are you going to give it back?
"Or perhaps another route is to give all Palestinians asylum and US citizenship."
Yes, we need more ass-backwards and violent sociopaths here. That sounds like the best idea ever.
You do not bring non-housebroken dogs into your house.
No more Muslims.
Great argument against allowing Trump supporters to live here but the commenter was talking about Palestinians
Did your mom drink heavily while pregnant with you?
"Perhaps Israel should vacate occupied lands and actually try for a two-state solution."
Israel existed before Islam.
If you're going to say "This was their land historically", you cannot pick a starting point. Israel is dramatically older than Islam.
Muslims conquered the land. Israel has taken some back. C'est la vie.
"...After all they are well education..." Sic
The pot smoke hasn't risen in the air yet to signal the new paywalled Reason Magazine, so I'll say this while I can:
Fuck Off, Father Coughlin Pope Boy!
One can imagine the uproar in 1945 if Allied leaders had stopped attacking Berlin and Tokyo just because the German and Japanese war criminals were hiding in the midst of hundreds of thousands of civilians.
There should have been a uproar because the Allies did not continue to Moscow.
I dunno. I've had the thought before, but I can understand how the people at the time might have been tired of fighting. Also, invading Russia does not really seem to have ever gone well for anyone except possibly the Mongols.
Though if we could have broken through the lines and raced the Red Army back to Moscow, it might have been possible to win, and a rather different century.
We should have backed some Mongols in a proxy war against the USSR. Genghis Khan certainly had enough descendants to find some willing to take up that cause.
We didn't need to continue on to Moscow. We only had to proceed to the Russian border, thank them for their help in eradicating the Nazis, and then proceed to help the Overrun Nations by extending the Marshall Plan. The world would be a very different place now, of course, but no one now alive can tell us how it would be different.
It is like for many people, history began in 2010.
That recently?
"Sen. Chris van Hollen (D–Md.), who visited the Egyptian side of the Rafah crossing in January, told The New Yorker that some shipments were being held at the border for 20 days, and that he saw entire shipments turned back because they contained just one banned item, such as a tent with a metal pole."
Wait, what?
Fences DO work??
Also, we should be upset that a shipment with any contraband is turned back?
I fail to see why it is anything but a positive that the shipment was turned back.
"The U.S. government itself has admitted that the starvation is a political problem, although it blames Hamas rather than Israel."
And still wants to provide aid to Hamas.
This conflict is the ultimate litmus test. It is 100% guaranteed that any and all anti-Israel, Jew-hating, Pali-loving retards are... well, above all, they're retards. They're invariably leftists, wokesters, progressives, Team Blue gangsters and their (occasionally existing) voters, faux-humanitarians, European socialists, Marxists, Greens...
The worst of the worst people are all siding against the singular Jewish State in existence, against the most persecuted people in history, in order to aid the most terroristic group of people in history, to help them genocide the Jews once again.
So if it hadn't already been obvious to all actual libertarians that the above mentioned loonies are bad people, it should be blatantly obvious since 10/7.
God chose poorly
I still remember Golda Meir remarking "Let me tell you something that we Israelis have against Moses. He took us 40 years through the desert in order to bring us to the one spot in the Middle East that has no oil."
It has good beachfront property though. As does Gaza. Israel is a wonderful place, ad Gaza is a blighted shithole.
Islam is a curse upon the earth. Just like Marxism.
Sounds a lot like evangelical Christianity. All of those small towns in beautiful, bucolic, pastoral scenery but the area is nothing but trailers filled with drop-outs, criminals, meth freaks, etc.
Ackshuyally, that's not true anymore. Even little Israel has oil and had natural gas before that.
And it's not strictly fossil fuels. Petroleum derives from plankton. Conceivably, every Square Inch of this Planet could have the bubblin' crude underneath it if you dig or shoot for it deep enough.
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This episode has been illuminating. People actually have to take a side and say why. And as a Jew, it is always good to know who your enemies are (even if you do nothing more than steer clear of them).
I am shocked at the level of antisemitism in American academia.
I am shocked at the level of antisemitism in American media.
I am shocked at the level of antisemitism in Corporate America, using DEI.
And now, the world has seen what Hamas is about. If we do not help Israel stamp out Hamas there (gaza), their (Hamas') tactics will come here to America. And our American Experiment will have ended.
I’m surprised at your surprise.
Since the Reason Magazine paywall could come up anytime, let me just say that I have always intently read and enjoyed your comments and, even though SJWs have tainted the word, you have an Ally in me.
Though I am a Howling Atheist who will never share your religion, I don't share anyone else's either, so I play no favorites. I certainly don't share the other two Abrahamic religions that condemn Unbelievers to a so-called "afterlife" of eternal Hell and make this only life a Hell-On Earth.
My only concern is with the one life all humans have on Earth and in the Natural Universe and I want it better for myself and for all humans, including you and your fellow Jews.
While U.S. taxdollars and troops can't eternally defend whole the world or even just allies, me and my little Bachelor's Mite supports Israel and every other civilized and potentially full-bore Libertarian society! And I stand aware and ready against all threats coming our way from Hamas and all other enemies of Life and Liberty!
Wherever you are after Reason morphs, keep up the good fight and I send you my heartiest L'Chaim!. "To Life!"
They’re invariably leftists, wokesters, progressives, Team Blue gangsters and their (occasionally existing) voters, faux-humanitarians, European socialists, Marxists, Greens…
Sadly not accurate. There are quite a few people who are still more traditional "right-wing", "conservative" antisemites. I've encountered them. It's made for some baffling interactions with people I would normally otherwise agree with on many topics. Things which can in no way be considered lefty or proggy positions.
Kinda sad, really.
Yes, but... you cannot really compare leftist Jew-hatred and their anti-Israel crusade to the occasional right-wing antisemitism. Maybe you can, but it only shows how utterly different the two sides really are. Right-wingers of that type don't hold any power, yet leftists absolutely do. You can't find right-wing anti-Israel NGOs because literally every single one of them are controlled by the international left. Same goes for academia, media, etc...
Plus there's another important facet, which is the diversity of opinion. As we all know, leftists are collectivists so they pretty much all think alike about Israel. Whether they're upfront about their desire to destroy Jews and their one and only state or simply are pushing for policies that would result in the destruction of Israel... are the same thing, as the end result would always be the same. Meanwhile, you can find different Jew-hating right-winger types who promote different concepts e.g.:
1. "Let the Jews and Arabs kill each other, it's for the best!"
2. "I don't care about Israel as long as all Jews fuck off back to Israel!"
3. "We shouldn't give a dime to the Jews, they're rich enough, let them solve their own problems!"
4. "Israel is a based ethnostate we should all try to emulate... but they're Jews so fuck them... but still!"
As eerie as it may sound, these are all much much better stances than the one promoted by the left, pushed by virtually every single leftist. Leftist want the destruction of Israel (because they say it is White, colonialist, apartheid, oppressor, genocidal, etc...) and they want Jews in the diaspora to die as well (because they say they are White, rich, privileged, Zionist, etc...) But once again, as deplorable as right-wing Jew-haters can be (and they certainly are), they are absolutely powerless compared the left... I believe Israel would pay anything to only have an opposition to their very existence on 4chan and nowhere else!
Carrying water for fascist Jew haters. Well, Nazis gotta Nazi. Thanks Anne for your Frankness.
Case in point: misconstrueman, the infamous Jew-hater of this board self-admittedly identifies with those leftists. He is one of the most committed (far-)leftist Jew-hater on this board.
Jew lovers for genocide. I think you are being too hard on leftists. Look at Filipp Goloshchyokin, the Jew Stalin put in charge of 'collectivization' of Kazakhstan, the overwhelmingly Muslim republic. Something like half the population perished thanks to his efforts. If that's not murderous enough to change your mind, the same guy was on the scene for the murder of the Romanovs. Granted, Filipp was no Heinrich Himmler, but just think about it. Half the population of Kazakhstan, almost entirely Muslim, died at his hand.
As a democrat YOU are a fascist anti semite. It is the way of your kind.
"As a democrat YOU are a fascist anti semite. "
We can teach you a thing or two about genocide. Forget this jets and tanks bullshit. Zyklon B, straight from our labs at Auschwitz. Cheap, effective and humane. That's the way to go.
misconstrueman, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. misconstrueman is a nasty-ass anti-semite, a pathological liar, and is also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a pathetic anti-semite.
misconstrueman lies; it’s what he does. misconstrueman is a lying antisemitic piece of shit.
misconstrueman, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. misconstrueman is a nasty-ass anti-semite, a pathological liar, and is also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a pathetic anti-semite.
misconstrueman lies; it’s what he does. misconstrueman is a lying antisemitic piece of shit.
I'd also add that the left seems to LOVE Palestinians and defends them irrationally.
The right wing antisemites hate Jews and Arabs pretty much equally.
If it's any assurance, on the Forum for Atheists that I participate in most, the overwhelming majority of us condemn the Islamofascist Hamas terrorist attack on October 7th and wish Israeli citizens well in their fight against this evil.
The one member who buys into the "Genocidal Apartheid Israel" shit is also a Putineer who wants Ukraine to surrender and he gets roundly and intellectually trounced on both topics like a punching bag by the rest of us!
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As I told Commenter_XY, you and Israel have an Ally in me! Wherever you stand when Reason shakes things up with the Commentariat, keep up the good fight for Life and Liberty!
Where did all the Israel-First boomercons come from?
Hey, chicken fucker is back just before the great comments shutdown! Woo! Bringing back the old faces!
Total opposition to the side that literally raped civilian women to death as a battle tactic is 'Israel-First', now?
I'm a Gen-Xer and I'm Pro-Istael! And judging from all the YouTube Gen-X videos, the Pro-Hamas crowd would be up against some serious Rednecks if they Fucked Around and Found Out with Gen-Xers!
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At least they’re not giving the ragheads pallets of $100 dollar billls.
Who says the Democrats can’t learn?
In Near East Asia all the US taxpayer-funded foreign aid goes to the guys in tiny hats.
What's this about $16,000 a ton by air versus 180 overland?
The total cost per ton of the 1948-1948 short haul Berlin airlift started at four bucks a ton and finished under two using puny two engined DC-3's.
Food is cheaper to drop than bombs, thousands of tons of which have been landing on Gaza monthly
The Berlin lift did not drop supplies; the planes landed and were unloaded on the ground.
(Some pilots did drop candy out the cockpit window for the kids)
You are missing the point: here's today's front page :
"Biden Says U.S. Will Begin Aid Airdrops in Gaza
The president said that the United States would work with Jordan and other allies to deliver aid by air and that supplies could eventually be delivered by sea.
In the last half of 2023 the U.S. economy seemed to be entering rehabilitation. The increase in quantity of number of transactions and the value was not due to private investment or spending, it was due to a 25% increase in federal spending as all federal agencies were advised to spend or lose it. This is just more of the same, but on a smaller scale for now.
“ The charity Oxfam America…”. Hey Matthew, have you visited their website? I see quite the DEI/leftist/marxist slant in their articles. So this is the single source you quote outside the State Department? Wow, Libertarian Reason. This isn’t about someone writing their opinion. This trash doesn’t belong here. I think my money and readership need to move on. Good luck to you.
In addition to announcing the airdrops, Biden said that he was seeking an "immediate" six-week ceasefire and a "surge" of aid on the ground.
No. And I'm glad the IDF is going to completely ignore this.
Do not give them time to regroup. Do not give them time to plan. Do not give them time to breathe. Kill them all.
Anyone not with Hamas had ample time to flee. Those who didn't are enemy combatants. No quarter given.
And announce to the entire world that the first person who complains about this effectively signs Iran's death warrant. Israel will crush Palestine unopposed, or America nukes Iran.
And then nuke Iran anyway.
Back during The War of Northern Aggression, we called this "keeping up the skeer".
Airdropping is a poor method of delivery but it will send a message to the Israelis that aid is going to delivered whether they like it or not. The Americans are going to need to start giving the Israelis some tough loving. Americans are not going to allow the death of all the Palestinians just to get all the Hamas members.
Yeah. We will.
The Jordanians in Gaza need to make drastic changes. Israel has been exceptionally kind to them.
If Canada did to the US what the Jordanians do to Israel, there would not BE a Canada.
More to the point, if the Navajo Nation started lobbing Katyushas at Albuquerque and Phoenix, it would go very poorly for them.
Meanwhile, goods entering Gaza from Egypt must still go through the arduous Israeli border inspection process.
How and why is that the case? What if Egypt decided that it no longer would be?
I ran into similar logic when I tried researching whether or not Palestinians could leave Gaza pre-oct 7th. Everything centers on Israel’s rules with no mention of Egypt. Let alone Hamas’ rules.
"Everything centers on Israel’s rules with no mention of Egypt. "
Israel is the occupying power. They are treaty bound to take responsibility for the refugees. Not Egypt, America, Germany or any other country.
"...They are treaty bound to take responsibility for the refugees..."
trueman lies. It's what trueman does. If what trueman posts isn't a lie, it's nonsense:
mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
"Spouting nonsense is an end in itself."
BTW, this ‘treaty’ of which the lying trueman refers was the pre-Israel UN-brokered treaty, broken immediately upon the departure of the UN forces by the Arabs attacking the (then newly-minted) citizens of Israel, thereby abrogating any and all parts of the agreement. (Morris, “1948”)
The lying trueman is either ignorant of that fact (which would be no surprise – his posts are often from ignorance of the issue) or is hoping everyone else is ignorant of the facts.
Regardless, trueman lies. It’s what trueman does.
misconstrueman, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. misconstrueman is a nasty-ass anti-semite, a pathological liar, and is also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a pathetic anti-semite.
misconstrueman lies; it’s what he does. misconstrueman is a lying antisemitic piece of shit.
Egypt doesn't have a border with Gaza. They have a border with Israel. That's why only Israel and Egypt were at Camp David in 1979. What 'appears' to be an Egypt-Gaza border is merely an agreement between Egypt and Israel re what is called the 'Philadelphi corridor'
Are you saying Gaza doesn’t exist? Or that it is rightfully part of Israel?
The Democrats have a huge problem: the economy. The perception of the state of the economy decides elections. The price of a barrel of oil determines the state of the economy. Regardless of perception, OPEC sets the price of a barrel of oil. On the face of it, this gimmick is a ploy to win the heartstrings of liberal and independent voters. If you fall for it, so be it. It really is an attempt to gain access to Middle Eastern oil. With Obama and Co. already relieving sanctions on Maduro and Venezuela to allow sales of oil to the U.S., the cost of everything may slow on its rise. In the Islamic world of the Middle East, where the State of Israel is an affront to Islamic hegemony and where the U.S. is seen as the Great Satan for its support of Israel the likelihood of favorable oil deals is non-existent. So what to do? The Democrats will win or lose based on the price of oil. And there is some irony in this.
A pox on both their houses.
Why both? Israel has done nothing but exist.
Keep practicing the NAP/NIFF and one day you'll get it right.
Meanwhile, when I get kicked off the Reason comments, I won't be plagued with your victim-blaming of Holocaust victims and your tut-tutting of innocent Israeli civilians!
You live up to your handle...You are an Ice man! Fuck Off!
Sam Kinison explains the cure for world hunger,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0q4o58pKwA&t=138s
I wonder if that set was taped in LA for maximum irony. "We have deserts in America! We just don't live in them! Unless they're named Los Angeles!" 😀
Aww, I miss Sam Kinison.
"...The U.S. government itself has admitted that the starvation is a political problem, although it blames Hamas rather than Israel..."
Stopped clock?
Remember that, in a militarized country, either temporarily (like Japan and Germany WWII) or 'permanently' (Russia/USSR/Russia), the military always eats first.
The civilians get the dregs.
Always.
Looks like Bibi is on the way to becoming the next Imran Khan, the ex PM ousted in December by the US, now enjoying a stay in a Pakistani prison.
"Israeli war cabinet minister Benny Gantz is set to visit Washington and London in an uncoordinated trip that has reportedly angered Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu."
I heard a story that Reagan was so horrified by Israel's bombing of Beirut back in the day, that he felt compelled to phone Israeli PM Begin. He characterized the bombings as a holocaust and within 20 minutes, Israel cancelled the assault on Beirut, and after a couple of days stripped Ariel Sharon of his powers.
Remember, the asshole trueman lies. It’s what trueman does. If what trueman posts isn’t a lie, it’s nonsense:
mtrueman|8.30.17 @ 1:42PM|#
“Spouting nonsense is an end in itself.”
misconstrueman, the ass-wipe of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. misconstrueman is a nasty-ass anti-semite, a pathological liar, and is also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a pathetic anti-semite.
misconstrueman lies; it’s what he does. misconstrueman is a lying antisemitic piece of shit.
an Expensive Gimmick
Well I guess that's better than a cheap gimmick.
Hamas knew what they were doing from the start-- engage in atrocities guaranteed to elicit harsh blowback, which provides more proof to their jihadi brethren and western lefty midwit fanboys that Palestinians are the real victims, which justifies all past and future atrocities, ad infinitum.
"Under pressure from the Biden administration, the Israeli government has opened a land crossing into the Gaza Strip—but Israeli nationalist protesters have physically blocked the crossing several times."
Are they throwing soup on the Mona Lisa, too?
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Mebbe the Glibertarians weren't so wrong after all ...
A near supermajority of Americans support Israel. Most people realize that Hamas is the Third Reich of our time - a government whose only purpose is ethnic cleansing and fomenting hatred against a certain group of people. It represents an existential threat to Jews and world security in general. It can no more exist than the confederate states of America when its constitution allowed slavery.
So fighting will continue. There are two practical ways the suffering of Palestinians can end - Hamas surrender, or the middle east accepting them as refugees. But none of them hate the Jews enough to do that. Egypt especially is wary of Palestinians.
"Palestine" should be placed under coalition rule much like postwar Japan and Korea. Right now these people are not capable of self governance. Reconstruction has to be headed by civilized nations until such time these people can function as modern nation.
Japan was very much not under coalition rule. It was US rule.
It also why that ended in only 7 years, as opposed to the, what, 45 years it took to let all of Germany govern itself?
It took the Berlin Wall coming down. If the USSR hadn't fallen, Germany may have continued to be divided.
Wall or no Wall, a flood of East Germans rushed out through Hungary, a country the Soviets had invaded with tanks to bring into communism. Maybe invading and shooting people doesn't inspire grateful forgiveness? American MAGAts could benefit from this lesson in ethics in dealings with Central and South America. Suppose Argentina or Brazil were to send men with guns to tell Americans birth control or gasoline vehicles must be banned immediately or they'll take over our banks?
Killing the Jews wasn't the Nazis' only purpose. They also wanted world domination.
-jcr
All of a single piece. And it's equally true with Hamas, since they are motivated by a larger movement that seeks world domination a.k.a. Islam.
By the way, I'll miss your comments when Reason makes it's last call for alcohol.
ALL aid going into Gaza is immediately plundered by the Hamassholes, and that's been the case since they took power. It shows up in stores after the shopkeepers buy it from the thugs.
-jcr
Whack-job mystical fanatics attacked Pearl Harbor. Airdrops from B-29s over Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki sorted them out nicely. Yet whiners who never lifted a finger to this day act like the Nipponese never mussed anyone's hair before August 1945. Today they pretend the mindless in Gaza didn't assist, abet and cheer the murdering arsonists and kidnappers who invaded Israel.
Biden really knows how to piss our money away.
The record shows the Trumpanzee pissed just like the Mummy. Or was that all Fake Nyooz?
What the Hell happened to the "Reply" button? It doesn't direct the reply to the right person!
Am Chai Yisrael.
Long after your pathetic life ends, we Jews will endure.
The ICJ didn't stop Israel from advancing further into Gaza. South Africa is not any sort of neutral party whatsoever and is KINDA close to where actual apartheid occurred.
Genocide is a specific charge. Civilian casualties is not genocide per se. Turkey denied the Armenian Genocide because they insist the mass murder wasn't systemic. They're lying, but given that the west bought it for political reasons, Israel should be given some benefit of the doubt as well. They're not a genocidal state, unlike some Muslim nations.
The Kyle Rittenhouse case went forward despite a video proving his innocence on the spot. If a prosecutor in America could indict a ham sandwich, what do you think the world would do to the Jewish state engaged in warfare of survival?
The nation of South Africa, which is the site of The International Court of Justice, has itself long since been accused of “genocide and discrimination” against the KhoiSan people (previously called Hottentot or Bushmen.)
South Africa’s forgotten bushmen fight for recognition
This article is more than 13 years old
Khoisan, southern Africa’s first inhabitants, seek legal redress for ‘injustices’ and demand land rights as well as cultural protection
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/sep/06/south-africa-khoisan-legal-action
And the KhoiSan suffered this treatment both under the present Bantu-dominated regime and under the previous (and actual) Apartheid regime, you know, the regime that got it’s inspitation in part from your buddies in Twentieth Century Germany.
In fact, your buddies from Germany engaged in genocide against KhoiSan peoples in 1907 to 1909, even before their more well-known Holocaust.
KhoiSan–Wikipedia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khoisan
*Click!-Click!-Click!* *Tsk!-Tsk!-Tsk!*
Both here and everywhere, now and always, with or without me saying it…
Fuck Off, Nazi!
I want the Jews to endure. I also want them to stop killing innocents, just like Hamas is doing. Guess that's too much to ask.
Sad how much mtrue and Misek sound, ain't it?
"we Jews will endure"
Jews, probably, although it may be unlikely they avoid the fading relevance of all religion in the modern world, especially among educated, smart, successful people.
Israel - in its current form -- not likely.
In the middle of a war of existence, it probably is.
So you see defending yourself against a genocidal group as a bad th thing, very telling.
Then Hamas should unconditionally surrender. Period. If not, then Israel should slaughter them as aggressively as possible. And the ‘Palestinians’ hav only themselves to blame. They support the 10/7 attacks and they support Hamas.
Also, if you believe any of the casualty data coming from Gaza authorities, then you’re a credulous fool.
Hamas hasn't stopped victimizing civilians, both Jewish and Arabic, and Israel is trying to avoid civilians. So no comparison.
Planting your flag in an area that hates you is not a war of existence, it's an act of stupidity.
EdG posting anything at all is an act of stupidity. By definition. Fuck off and die, EdG
Being a democrat is an act of stupidity in a country that despises you.
Tell that to the guys who raised the flag at Iwo Jima.
Jews are the most educated, smartest, and successful group of people in the world.
And Israel isn't going anywhere, fool.
Israel is a largely Secular nation founded by a Secular Zionist movement and is the least religiously observant of any nation in the Middle East.
And with man-made genetcally -modified coral island and man-made "Seasteads", dozens more Miini-Zions could pop up alongside any land mass or anywhere in the Seven Seas!
Try to keep up from your rat cage, Klinger! And I'll "Carry on" with or without your leave, whether on or off the Comments!
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