Debate: Democracy Is the Worst Form of Government Except for All the Others
What is the relationship between liberty and democracy?

When We Are Governed, Ballots Are Best
Affirmative: Jesse Walker

There are countless drawbacks to democratic government, but most of these are problems with the government part, not the democratic part. It is true, as the old joke goes, that unconstrained majority rule is two wolves and a sheep debating what to have for dinner. But unconstrained minority rule is just the same debate with more sheep. The lesson should be that we need constraints on any state, democratic or not.
Constitutional constraints on power are often described as countermajoritarian measures, but the best of them are counterminoritarian too. (The same First Amendment that is there to protect us if Congress passes a law criminalizing speech is also supposed to protect us if an unelected police chief starts harassing his critics.) Democratic input itself can be a constraint on power—not the most effective constraint, but one we're better off with than without. I prefer it when government does not claim powers over people's lives; but when it does claim those powers, we should at least get some say in when and how they are wielded.
One possible objection to this is that democracy doesn't really give us much power: Outside the most local level, it is virtually impossible for one voter's ballot to change an election's outcome. This is undeniably true, and I would never try to hector a citizen into the voting booth. But when a large number of citizens get upset at once, that actually can have an impact. Keeping one person from voting is not likely to have a long-term impact on public policy, but systematically barring a population from the polls—as in the Jim Crow South, to give the most obvious example—can allow all sorts of oppressions to thrive.
Another objection is that voters can back bad policies as easily as they can back good ones, as when majorities embrace financially irresponsible measures because they send more money to their pocketbooks. Again, this is undeniably true. But are less democratic systems any better? In his 2004 book For the Many or the Few, the University of Southern California economist John Matsusaka found that ballot initiatives—those direct-democracy routes around the legislature—tend to be associated with reductions, not increases, in spending. The European economists Lars Feld and Gebhard Kirchgässner have found that the cantons of Switzerland, another hotbed of direct democracy, are similarly prone to spending less. And there is no strong evidence that town-meeting governments are more profligate than less democratic municipal structures.
Matsusaka also noted that ballot initiatives tend to be associated with reductions in taxes and with shifts from funding services via taxation to funding them via user fees. And of course, initiatives and referendums have allowed citizens to adopt all sorts of anti-statist measures that legislators were too scared to touch, such as the legalization of recreational marijuana. Within the legislature, meanwhile, libertarian-friendly reform bills have tended to fare better in the more democratic House than in the Senate.
The most intrusive segment of the federal government—the executive branch—contains just two elected officials. Vast swaths of it are shielded from any genuine democratic oversight. In the domestic administrative state, a permanent bureaucracy has been given wide latitude to issue its own rules and to operate its own courts. In the national security agencies, the situation is even worse: A culture of secrecy sometimes conceals even budgets from the public eye, let alone the behavior (and misbehavior) that those budgets are funding. Greater democratic control would not fix the underlying problem here, but it would at least be a potential tool for reining in the abuses. Surely it would be preferable to the status quo.
It may be easy to imagine some idealized elite that would make decisions more wisely than the mass of ill-informed voters, but it's harder to come up with a foolproof system to establish who is intellectually qualified to join it. (What tool would you use? A literacy test?) And no matter who makes it into that ruling class, it would be just as prone to self-dealing and to interest-group capture as any other system. Undemocratic processes will periodically produce relatively liberty-friendly leaders—a John Cowperthwaite in colonial Hong Kong, a Hans-Adam II in Liechtenstein—but Cowperthwaite is not the typical appointee, and Hans-Adam is not the typical prince. And even those two came to power in tiny polities where it was easier than usual to vote with your feet.
So I'll muster a cheer for democracy. It is best not to be governed. But when we are, we're better off with ballots.
Democracy Doesn't Protect the Individual From the Majority
Negative: Jason Brennan
Compared to dictatorship, one-party states, and oligarchy, democracy is pretty good for freedom. But that's a bit like saying Karen is the nicest of the Plastics in Mean Girls.
People often describe democracies as free countries and other forms of government as unfree. There are two different, though compatible, reasons why.
As a matter of fact, democracies tend to be more liberal than nondemocracies. Despite being a critic of democracy, I've published papers making this point myself. Various think tanks and research centers (such as the Fraser Institute, Economist Intelligence Unit, or Freedom House) produce annual indexes which rate how democratic countries are, how much they respect the rule of law, how much they respect economic liberty, and how much they respect civil liberties (such as freedom of speech). As a matter of fact, there is a very strong and persistent positive correlation between how democratic a country is and how much it respects civil liberty. The effect size is large. There is also a strong and persistent positive correlation between how democratic a country is and how much it respects economic liberty, though here the effect size is much smaller. As countries become less democratic, they tend to become less free.
Still, we should be cautious: Extreme democracy does not predict extreme liberalism. Highly democratic countries tend to be freer than nondemocracies, but that does not mean they are liberal utopias. Democratic countries regularly suppress citizens' civil rights. They restrict foreign immigration and freedom of movement. Most imposed draconian lockdowns during the pandemic on the basis of flimsy evidence. None respect economic freedom the way libertarians desire.
There seems to be an intimate connection between democracy and freedom, but among researchers the connection is disputed. Some argue that the background conditions which tend to cause liberal politics also tend to produce democratic political structures. Some argue there is causation: Perhaps liberalism causes democracy, democracy causes liberalism, or they are mutually reinforcing. As of now, we don't really know.
A second reason people claim that democracies are free is that they hold that democratic politics itself is an important kind of freedom, that democracy is essential to freedom, or that the rights to vote, run for office, and participate are themselves constitutive of what it means to be free. These common views do not survive scrutiny.
Back in October 2020, the fast casual restaurant chain Nando's did a public relations stunt encouraging people to vote. Customers could choose their own meal or instead select an "unDemocratic Meal." If they selected the unDemocratic Meal, managers would feed them a comical and disgusting mishmash, such as brownies on rice.
Funnily enough, Nando's other option was a meal where each customer chose for themselves. That's not democracy; that's a market. Imagine Nando's offered a real democratic meal instead: You tell the manager what you want, but then you get whatever the majority wants, regardless of whether you want it. Since you have some input, that's perhaps better and freer than the UnDemocratic Meal, but it's not much to celebrate.
When working as intended, democracies give each citizen an equal fundamental share of decision-making power. This is less like equal slices of cake and more like equal crumbs. On the most optimistic estimates in the economics literature, the probability an individual voter will affect the outcome of a major election is, in special cases, somewhere on the order of one in 3 million.
Imagine you were deciding what to eat, whether and with whom to have sex, how to dress, whether and what to worship, where to work, or what rules would govern your life. Imagine we gave you a one in 3 million chance of making these decisions for yourself, along with a 2,999,999 chance that others will decide for you. We wouldn't call this a situation in which you consent to the outcome, exercise autonomy, live only by rules you set for yourself, or govern yourself. We wouldn't call it freedom.
Indeed, that's the very point of democracy. Democracy is not supposed to be a system in which we as individuals decide for ourselves. It's a system which disempowers individuals in favor of the majority—or the biggest minority. Even members of that very majority are powerless. It's better to have a vote than not, but an individual vote protects you from the caprice of the majority no more than a bucket protects you from a tsunami.
Subscribers have access to Reason's whole May 2023 issue now. These debates and the rest of the issue will be released throughout the month for everyone else. Consider subscribing today!
- Debate: It's Time for a National Divorce
- Debate: Artificial Intelligence Should Be Regulated
- Debate: Democracy Is the Worst Form of Government Except for All the Others
- Debate: To Preserve Individual Liberty, Government Must Affirmatively Intervene in the Culture War
- Debate: The E.U. Was a Mistake
- Debate: The U.S. Should Increase Funding for the Defense of Ukraine
- Debate: Mentally Ill Homeless People Must Be Locked Up for Public Safety
- Debate: Despite the Welfare State, the U.S. Should Open Its Borders
- Debate: Cats Are More Libertarian Than Dogs
- Debate: Make Housing Affordable by Abolishing Growth Boundaries, Not Ending Density Restrictions
- Debate: Bitcoin Is the Future of Free Exchange
- Debate: Be Optimistic About the World
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I'm not sure I understand the differences in position between these two. They seem to agree with each other with a slightly different point of emphasis.
Because it is a one-sided argument. The negative (Jason) allocated the first part of his response praising democracy and never offered up a legitimate alternative.
Similarly, Open Society is better than closed society, secularism is superior to theocracy, and capitalism is better than collectivism.
turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.
Yes, regular readers already KNOW that Sevo prefers a closed society, theocracy, and collectivism.
Butt thanks for confirming it, evil power pig!
Anything regulated by truth is good.
Criminalize lying.
I hardly consider having one vote every four years, to pick one from a small group of liars as choices, democracy.
We have the technical capability to maximize our democratic choices with voting for specific issues online. Technological Democracy.
Regulating the outcome with inalienable rights and the truth demonstrated by correctly applied logic and science.
We don’t have to suffer with the corrupt shit we have now.
If lying were ever criminalized you would be put to death. Nazi Holocaust deniers would not fare well under your system.
Now go commit suicide.
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The only thing you'd want done by technology would be One Man, One Vote, One Time for "Eine Volk! Ein Reich! Ein Führer!".
And the technology you'd want is not Intel Inside, but 9mm Parabellum Inside and Zyklon-B Inside!
Fuck Off, Nazi!
I would suggest that first the claim that a holocaust ever occurred would need to be irrefutably proven. Paid and coerced testimony is inadmissible.
Failing the ability to do that the entire holocaust industry would need to be dismantled, all criminals purporting it punished and all victims of it compensated.
To prosecute me you would simply have to demonstrate that my statements aren’t supported by correctly applied logic and science. So, refute them.
None of you ever have or ever will be up to that task.
The following points refute key elements of the holocaust with logic and science. This is because all stories creating the holocaust narrative defy logic and science.
There has been no objective forensic analysis at any supposed site. That means that there is no physical evidence. Any activity that demonstrates and shares evidence to refute the holocaust is a crime in every nation where it allegedly occurred.
The fact that all evidence that refutes the holocaust is criminal in every nation where it allegedly occurred is relevant if you are accepting any evidence at all from those nations.
Refusing to consider evidence is the definition of bias and any conclusion that bias is irrelevant only demonstrates bigotry and a disregard for justice.
The crucial event of the story is the cyanide gassing of millions of Jews. That couldn’t have happened as claimed. The story is bullshit.
Jews have published books illustrated with pictures of themselves shirtless dragging piles of gassed bodies from the chambers to cremation ovens.
But cyanide is absorbed through the skin and NOBODY could have survived a single day of such activity much less collecting reparations into their old age reminiscing about it years later.
And so it goes with every bullshit story told by paid and coerced lying fuckwitnesses. The facts prove otherwise.
Let’s not forget another old timey favourite.The story of Babi Yar is a popular lesson in Jewish schools described as the single largest event of the holocaust.
The lesson is that between 30,000 and 100,000 Jews were taken to a ravine in Ukraine where they were killed.
The story is told by one Jewish survivor, Dina Pronicheva, an actress who testified that she was forced to strip naked and marched to the edge of the ravine. When the firing squad shot, she jumped into the ravine and played dead. After being covered by thousands of bodies and tons of earth she dug herself out, unscathed, when the coast was clear and escaped to tell the story.
She is apparently the only person in history to successfully perform a matrix bullet dodge at a firing squad. The soldier aiming point blank at her never noticed her escape. Never walked a few steps to the edge of the ravine to finish her off.
They were stripped naked to leave no evidence. Naked she had no tools to dig herself out from under 30,000 bodies and tons of dirt.
Only after the deed was done, the nazis realized that so many bullet ridden bodies were evidence. Oops, rookie move. So they brought more Jews and millions of cubic feet of firewood to dig them up, cremate them on gravestones and scatter their ashes in surrounding fields.
There has been no forensic investigation at the site. None of the bullets allegedly burned with the bodies have been recovered. Not one shred of physical evidence of this has ever been found.
There are military aerial photographs of the area at the time but they don’t show any evidence of the narrative, no people, no equipment, no firewood, no moved earth, no tracks of any kind.
Simply stating these facts is a crime in Ukraine where the Babi Yar narrative is taught in school.
Have you ever heard of the Bletchley park decrypts of the famous German enigma machines? It was credited for turning the tide of the war as allies knew what military actions the Germans were planning.
Only released in the 1980s those translated messages included prison camp information, deaths, transfers and requests for medicines to treat illnesses. The numbers of dead don’t support the holocaust narrative of which there was also no mention of.
Here are some actual enigma decrypts from Bletchley park in 1942 when deaths were at their highest.
Firstly the number of dead for the month are nowhere near what is necessary to support the holocaust narrative.
Secondly, notable is the concern over typhus deaths and the requests for medical supplies to treat.
GPDD No’s.:- 194/199, 201/203, 205, 218, 219, 222/3, 226, 233, 236, 239, 240/2, 247.
Covering the period 3rd Aug. 1942 – 25th Sept. 1942
A further examination is made of Concentration Camp figures; deaths from typhus have reached a very high figure in AUSCHWITZ.
A suspected case of typhus is reported from AUSCHWITZ (223b/42). It is probable that on the 6th August Nachschubkdtr. Russland Mitte requests typhus vaccine for 50 men and spottenfever serum for 20
For the first time returns are given for deaths of prisoners (223b/14,24,43,50): the figures for August are: NIEDERHAGEN 21, AUSCHWITZ 6829 (or 6889) men, 1525 women;.
Are you willing and eager to perform the feeble mental gymnastics required to believe, as the story goes, that Germans were communicating in code about prison camps while talking plainly about their military actions with their top secret enigma machines?
That would require you to really believe that Germany INTENTIONALLY lost the war to cover up the holocaust while ostensibly leaving lying fuckwitnesses alive in the prison camps as the Germans retreated.
The numbers of dead from German enigma decrypts does align with Red Cross numbers.
The Red Cross regularly visited all prison camps. It was their job to report the cause of all deaths. They recorded a grand total of 271,000 among all camps for the entire war. It is a matter of record.
The Red Cross was founded in 1863 with the purpose of protecting the interests of victims of conflicts.
The holocaust fairytale requires us to believe that they were so unaware of what might be happening that they completely missed 95% of the victims in prison camps.
AND that they had not so much as an inkling that a holocaust was going on right under their noses even though allied media propaganda was reporting it. Because there is no evidence of any Red Cross document suggesting they did.
Are you performing those feeble mental gymnastics? How gullible are you?
The story of gassing Jews began as British propaganda to turn popular opinion against Germany. It was inspired to draw attention away from Jewish Bolshevik war crimes in Russia because that would work against allied propaganda. It also served global Jewish interests to create undeserved sympathy for Jews who had publicly organized boycotts of Germany to drive Germany to war.
There is a documented letter from the head of British propaganda to the head of the war office recommending that they cease the “gassing Jews“ propaganda because there was no evidence for it and if found out would work against their propaganda efforts.
Head of British Psychological Warfare Executive (Propaganda), Victor Cavendish-Bentick in a handwritten note, wrote on Aug 27th, 1943,
“We have had a good run for our money with this gas chamber story we have been putting about, but don’t we run the risk eventually we are going to be found out and when we are found out the collapse of that lie is going to bring the whole of our psychological warfare down with it? So isn’t it rather time now to let it drift off by itself and concentrate on other lines that we are running.”
Public Record Office Document F0371/34551 revealed by Stephen Mitford Goodson, ‘Inside the South African Reserve Bank’.
Zyklon B is an off the shelf insecticide used among other places in Prison camps to delouse clothing and bedding to save lives by preventing deadly typhus. The system used for years before and during the war throughout Europe employed heating to release cyanide gas, fans to circulate the gas and more to exhaust the chambers to make the de loused articles safe to handle.
Pictures of this equipment and the small de lousing buildings with clothing racks still exist in Prison camps. But no evidence of any gas delivery system has ever been found in the shower houses where the bullshit holocaust allegedly occurred. In fact, the story has changed to that they just threw the heat activated pellets onto the cold drainless floors in rooms full of people.
Such an inefficient method would have taken too long to kill the required number of Jews. The pellets couldn’t be spread evenly in rooms full of people. The cold drainless floors would have delayed the release of cyanide from the pellets that people would have swept away from themselves. Any dead would have released all their bodily fluids and their bodies covering the pellets. Vomit would have been added to the floor prior to entering such a room.
According to the testimony of the so called survivor, the timing entering the chambers immediately, the details shirtless survivor, piles of bodies with unvented cyanide gas pockets in every space, death from repeated exposure as per testimony would have been necessary, not just possible.
According to Martin Gilbert in his book, Holocaust Journey, the gas chambers at Treblinka utilized carbon monoxide from diesel engines. At the Nuremberg trial of the Nazi war criminals, the American government charged that the Jews were murdered at Treblinka in “steam chambers,” not gas chambers.
Gasoline engine exhaust contains about ten times the carbon monoxide than diesel. Diesel exhaust is relatively safe. Even if the Diesel engines were running at their maximum of 500 ppm, death would take several hours. Far too long to support the narrative.
If Germans had used gasoline engines, death would have been in a few minutes. But in the holocaust narrative for treblinka diesel was used even though Germany had plenty of gasoline for their tanks. Nuremberg still recorded that they were “steam chambers”.
Somebody is lying. They weren’t both steam chambers and diesel gas chambers.Which stupid lie is more believable? Does it even matter to you?
Jews had been publicly claiming a holocaust of 6 million Jews in various nations no less than 166 times between 1900 and 1945. Only to coerce sympathy to raise money. Like the wastes of skin who fake cancer on go fund me pages.
What’s the probability after being proven lying about 6 million Jewish deaths by holocaust over 166 times that the 167th claim is true? Better to buy a lottery ticket. Though the bullshiit narrative has been like a lottery bonanza for Jews.
The only thing the bullshit holocaust narrative has in common with WW2 is that they were both the creation of Jews.
These Jewish leaders are admitting it. Are they lying?
They are properly referenced quotes from Jewish leaders demonstrating that they had intended to create and force Germany into WW2.
That kind of evil is absolutely relevant when considering the character required to lie to the world about a holocaust for the 167 th time.
“We Jews are going to bring a war on Germany”. David A Brown, national chairman, united Jewish campaign, 1934.
“The Israeli people around the world declare economic and financial war against Germany …holy war against Hitlers people”
Chaim Weismann, the Zionist leader, 8 September 1939, Jewish chronicle.
The Toronto evening telegram of 26 February 1940 quoted rabbi Maurice l. Perlzweig of the world Jewish Congress as telling a Canadian audience that” The world Jewish Congress has been at war with Germany for seven years”.
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Maybe the coercion of lying means nothing to libertarians, but the cost in cold hard cash!!!
Why?
The Costs to American Taxpayers of the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict: $3 Trillion
https://ifamericansknew.org/stat/cost.html
Misek’s “irrefutable” evidence shown to be largely lacking in evidence and refuted where we find some few scraps:
1) “There has been no objective forensic analysis at any supposed site. That means that there is no physical evidence.”
That’s a lie.
Contemporarily, there was ample evidence in carcasses, skeletons, other human remains, mounds of possessions, gold dentures, etc.
Even in 1994, comparisons cyanide ions remaining on the walls of buildings where Zyklon-B was used sparing as a fumigant and the walls of the cellars at Auschwitz shows drastic deltas: Institute for Forensic Research, Cracow: Post-Leuchter Report (archive.org)
2) “Any activity that demonstrates and shares evidence to refute the holocaust is a crime in every nation where it allegedly occurred”
Irrelevance
3) “The crucial event of the story is the cyanide gassing of millions of Jews. That never happened.”
Lie or possible attempt at sophistry; cyanide is the active ingredient in Zyklon-B.
4) “Jews have published books illustrated with pictures of themselves shirtless dragging piles of gassed bodies from the chambers to cremation ovens.
But cyanide is absorbed through the skin and NOBODY could have survived a single day of such activity much less collecting reparations into their old age reminiscing about it years later.”
Bullshit. It is possible to die from contact, but the primary cause of death from Zyklon-B is ingestion of the gas containing the cyanide.
5) “And so it goes with every bullshit story. The facts prove otherwise.”
Irrelevant attempt to poison the well; not evidence.
6) “Let’s not forget another old timey favourite.The story of Babi Yar is a popular lesson in Jewish schools described as the single largest event of the holocaust.
The lesson is that between 30,000 and 100,000 Jews were taken to a ravine in Ukraine where they were killed.
The story is told by one Jewish survivor, Dina Pronicheva, an actress who testified that she was forced to strip naked and marched to the edge of the ravine. When the firing squad shot, she jumped into the ravine and played dead. After being covered by thousands of bodies and tons of earth she dug herself out, unscathed, when the coast was clear and escaped to tell the story.
She is apparently the only person in history to successfully perform a matrix bullet dodge at a firing squad. The soldier aiming point blank at her never noticed her escape. Never walked a few steps to the edge of the ravine to finish her off.
They were stripped naked to leave no evidence. Naked she had no tools to dig herself out from under 30,000 bodies and tons of dirt.
Only after the deed was done, the nazis realized that so many bullet ridden bodies were evidence. Oops, rookie move. So they brought more Jews and millions of cubic feet of firewood to dig them up, cremate them on gravestones and scatter their ashes in surrounding fields.
There has been no forensic investigation at the site. None of the bullets allegedly burned with the bodies have been recovered. Not one shred of physical evidence of this has ever been found.
There are military aerial photographs of the area at the time but they don’t show any evidence of the narrative, no people, no equipment, no firewood, no moved earth, no tracks of any kind.
Simply stating these facts is a crime in Ukraine where the Babi Yar narrative is taught in school”
To be honest, I haven’t heard of this but as regards any of evidence with reference to the Holocaust, it says nothing at all. It is totally irrelevant.
7) “Have you ever heard of the Bletchley park decrypts of the famous German enigma machines? It was credited for turning the tide of the war as allies knew what military actions the Germans were planning.
Only released in the 1980s those translated messages included prison camp information, deaths, transfers and requests for medicines to treat illnesses. The numbers of dead don’t support the holocaust narrative of which there was also no mention of”
Cite missing for YOUR claim, but:
“Allied forces knew about Holocaust two years before discovery of concentration camps, secret documents reveal”
[…]
“The Allied Powers were aware of the scale of the Jewish Holocaust two-and-a-half years earlier than is generally assumed, and had even prepared war crimes indictments against Adolf Hitler and his top Nazi commanders…”
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/world-history/holocaust-allied-forces-knew-before-concentration-camp-discovery-us-uk-soviets-secret-documents-a7688036.html
8) “Are you willingly performing the feeble mental gymnastics required to believe, as the story goes, that Germans were communicating in code about prison camps while talking plainly about their military actions with their top secret enigma machines?”
OK, this goes beyond parody, and this represents the Nazi shit’s level of gullibility.
Simply, yes, the Nazis did NOT want to broadcast to the world that they were engaged in mass-murder, as the post-war interrogations proved. If there’s ‘mental gymnastics’ here, Nazi shit just got a unanimous “1”.
9) “The numbers of dead from German enigma decrypts does align with Red Cross numbers”
Cite missing.
“The Red Cross regularly visited all prison camps. It was their job to report the cause of all deaths. They recorded a grand total of 271,000 among all camps for the entire war. It is a matter of record.
Are you performing the feeble mental gymnastics required to believe that the Red Cross were so incompetent that they were completely unaware of 95% or 5,629,000 deaths?”
Is Nazi shit so gullible as to believe the Nazis would welcome the Red Cross to the death camps? Seems so. Value as “evidence” = zero
10) “Zyklon B is an off the shelf insecticide used among other places in Prison camps to delouse clothing and bedding to save lives by preventing deadly typhus. The system used for years before the war employed heating to release cyanide gas, fans to circulate the gas and more to exhaust the chambers to make the de loused articles safe to handle.
Pictures of this equipment and the small de lousing buildings with clothing racks still exist in Prison camps. But no evidence of any gas delivery system has ever been found in the shower houses where the bullshit holocaust allegedly occurred. In fact, the story has changed to that they just threw the heat activated pellets onto the cold drainless floors in rooms full of people.
Such an inefficient method would have taken too long to kill the required number of Jews. The pellets couldn’t be spread evenly in rooms full of people. The cold drainless floors would have delayed the release of cyanide from the pellets that people would have swept away from themselves. Any dead would have released all their bodily fluids and their bodies covering the pellets. Vomit would have been added to the floor prior to entering such a room.”
Arm-waving; see about for Zyklon-B concentrations. Value as “evidence” = zero
11) “According to Martin Gilbert in his book, Holocaust Journey, the gas chambers at Treblinka utilized carbon monoxide from diesel engines. At the Nuremberg trial of the Nazi war criminals, the American government charged that the Jews were murdered at Treblinka in “steam chambers,” not gas chambers.”
Arm-waving, Value as “evidence” = zero
12) “Gasoline engine exhaust contains about ten times the carbon monoxide than diesel. Diesel exhaust is relatively safe. Even if the Diesel engines were running at their maximum of 500 ppm, death would take several hours. Far too long to support the narrative.”
One approximation, one number many assumptions, no support. Value as “evidence” = zero.
13) “If Germans had used gas engines, death would have been in a few minutes. But in the holocaust narrative for treblinka diesel was used even though they had plenty of gas for their tanks. Nuremberg still recorded that they were “steam chambers”.
Which stupid lie is more believable? You have to perform some feeble mental gymnastics to buy that.”
More arm-waving, weak attempt at well poisoning, zero evidence.
14) “Jews had been publicly claiming a holocaust of 6 million Jews in various nations no less than 166 times between 1900 and 1945. Only to coerce sympathy to raise money. Like the wastes of skin who fake cancer on go fund me pages.
The story of gassing Jews began as British propaganda to turn popular opinion against Germany. It was inspired to draw attention away from Jewish Bolshevik war crimes in Russia because that would work against allied propaganda. It also served global Jewish interests to create undeserved sympathy for Jews who had publicly organized boycotts of Germany to drive Germany to war.”
Anti-sematic rant, followed by idiotic conspiracy theory; not anywhere close to “evidence”.
15) “There is a documented letter from the head of British propaganda to the head of the war office recommending that they cease the “gassing Jews“ propaganda because there was no evidence for it and if found out would work against their propaganda efforts.”
I’ll bet there were all sorts of letters which were embarrassing during WWII. Try finding some evidence
16) “The only thing the bullshit holocaust narrative has in common with WW2 is that they were both the creation of Jews.
These Jewish leaders are admitting it. Are they lying?
“We Jews are going to bring a war on Germany”.
David A Brown, national chairman, united Jewish campaign, 1934.
“The Israeli people around the world declare economic and financial war against Germany …holy war against Hitlers people”
Chaim Weismann, the Zionist leader, 8 September 1939, Jewish chronicle.
The Toronto evening telegram of 26 February 1940 quoted rabbi Maurice l. Perlzweig of the world Jewish Congress as telling a Canadian audience that” The world Jewish Congress has been at war with Germany for seven years”.
Smells strongly of “DID YOU HEAR WHAT TRUMP SAID!!!!!”, but regardless, even if true, it is irrelevant to the question
Shitbag, you have had your ass handed to you many times; you are simply too stupid to understand that.
Fuck off and die.
You are DESPERATE to refute what I said because you recognize that truth can’t be refuted. Hahaha
Your cherished bogeyman narrative necessary to your perpetual victim mentality has been refuted.
I immediately refuted this exact feeble attempt 3 weeks ago. You haven’t even tried to address your errors. So, with no effort required, your most feeble attempt is refuted, again.
Through your lazy ineptitude you managed to fail just as miserably as the last time but I still appreciate the opportunity to clearly demonstrate it, just the same.
1) Being a crime to conclude that the holocaust is refuted, no government approved study could have been objective when the conclusion is predetermined.
The polish government approved “post lecter” report simply concluded that trace amounts of cyanide were found throughout the camp and did not even address the lectern reports analysis of the extreme concentration of cyanide in the admittedly non homicidal clothing fumigation chambers that were designed to use zyklon b.
The government would have committed a crime if they had actually been objective.
Your point 1) has been refuted.
2) typical for a biased feeble minded fuckwit you didn’t even try to refute how I demonstrated that criminalizing the evidence that refutes the holocaust is relevant.
I’ll repeat it, just for you.
The fact that all evidence that refutes the holocaust is criminal in every nation where it allegedly occurred is relevant if you are accepting any evidence at all from those nations.
Refusing to consider evidence is the definition of bias and YOUR conclusion that bias is irrelevant only demonstrates your bigotry and disregard for justice.
Your feeble point 2) was already refuted
3) typical for a biased feeble minded fuckwit you didn’t even try to refute how I demonstrated that zyklon b was a pesticide used to save lives throughout Europe. Its use absolutely no evidence of a holocaust, instead to save lives.
Your feeble point 3) was already refuted.
4) Typical for a biased feeble minded fuckwit you didn’t even try to refute how I demonstrated that the described method of using zyklon b doesn’t support the narrative and that death from the detailed fuckwitness testimony and picture would have been scientifically necessary NOT merely possible.
Here I’ll repeat it for you,
Such an inefficient method would have taken too long to kill the required number of Jews. The pellets couldn’t be spread evenly in rooms full of people. The cold drainless floors would have delayed the release of cyanide from the pellets that people would have swept away from themselves. Any dead would have released all their bodily fluids and their bodies covering the pellets. Vomit would have been added to the floor prior to entering such a room.
According to the testimony of the so called survivor, the timing entering the chambers immediately, the details shirtless survivor, piles of bodies with unvented cyanide gas pockets in every space, death from repeated exposure as per testimony would have been necessary, not just possible.
Your feeble point 4) was already refuted.
5) Your desperation to refute what I’ve said demonstrates that you believe that facts will prove a story is bullshit.
Your problem is that my facts are proving that your story is bullshit.
That’s what we’re doing here. I hope that’s not irrelevant. Hahaha
Your feeble point 5) has been refuted
6) the fact that you admit that you haven’t heard of what Jews herald as the single greatest event of the holocaust and therefore consider it irrelevant demonstrates the low bar you set for “irrelevance” and just how ignorant you are.
Your ignorant point 6) has been refuted.
7) The fact that the allies admitted to using media propaganda to spread the holocaust lie for years doesn’t prove that there was a holocaust, in fact the opposite.
I provided my reference dates and identification.
Your feeble point 7) was refuted.
8) you admit that the Bletchley park decrypts demonstrate that to believe the holocaust story about them you must believe that the Germans intentionally lost the war to cover up the holocaust and at the same time left lying fuckwitnesses alive to tell the story after the Germans.
This is what you believe. Hey folks you didn’t win the war, the Germans intentionally lost it to protect a secret that they left witnesses alive to tell it.
Sevo the retarded has performed his most famous feat of feeble minded gymnastics.
Hmmmm should be in a history book somewhere Dontcha think. No you don’t.
Your feeble point 8) was hahaha refuted.
9) You are claiming that the Red Cross didn’t visit German prison camps. That’s an absurd lie disproven by the numerous Red Cross records.
Did you just make that up general because it’s time for your medication.
You need to provide a cite. Hahaha, I won’t hold my breath.
Your feeble point 9) has been refuted.
10) in your feeble fuckmindedness you forgot that that information soundly refuted your points 3) and 4). It is neither irrelevant or “arm waving”
Your point 10) has been refuted
11) the contradiction between the Nuremberg conclusion and the official holocaust story demonstrates that one or both are lying and therefore not credible.
I’d call that relevant to refuting the holocaust.
Point 11) has been refuted
12) they are the numbers and you haven’t refuted them. Diesel exhaust is relatively safe and definitely doesn’t support the mass murder narrative of the holocaust. If diesel exhaust was used in gas chambers , the holocaust couldn’t have happened.
I’d call that relevant to refuting the holocaust.
Your point 12) has been refuted.
13) simply the summary of what was contained in points 11) and 12) and refuted with them.
Your point 13) has been refuted.
14) you haven’t refuted the fact that Jews did publicly falsely claim to have suffered from holocaust’s of 6 million no less than 166 time between the years 1900 and 1945.
You didn’t refute the probability of the 167th claim being true. Better to buy a lottery ticket. Or the fact that the bullshiit narrative has been like a lottery bonanza for Jews.
The fact that the truth is antisemitic is irrelevant to refuting the holocaust.
Your point 14) has been refuted
15) the fact that the documented letter from the head of the British propaganda office Victor Cavendish-Bentick admits in august of 1943 that they have NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT THE HOLOCAUST PROPAGANDA is evidence relevant to refuting the holocaust.
Your point 15) has been refuted
16) it demonstrates the inherent evil of a people whose religion advocates lying and that these claims which aren’t required curriculum in school demonstrate that the majority of people don’t yet know the truth.
This is entirely relevant to the holocaust purported by the usual suspects.
Your point 16) has been refuted.
All your feeble points have been refuted demonstrating that you haven’t refuted a word I’ve said.
I like feeding trolls evidence of truth that they can’t refute and laughing at you as you choke trying. Hahaha
It was proven over 75 years ago. Conclusively.
Case closed.
The end.
There is zero irrefutable physical evidence. There never was any proof.
I’ve refuted that lie and it remains refuted.
I have repeatedly posted links to the photos of the Red Army diggging up the trenches in Ukraine you cowardly lying shitbag
What trenches, where, provide any irrefutable evidence of a holocaust.
Are you referring to Babi Yar? In that bullshit story all the bullet riddled bodies were later dug up and cremated on gravestones and all the ashes scattered in surrounding fields. What exactly are YOU claiming the “red army” dug up?
Photos of trenches? Hahaha
How many people do you think die in war?
How difficult do you think it would be to fill a hole with bodies and call it a holocaust?
Let’s all see what irrefutable evidence of a holocaust that you or ANYONE ELSE has.
The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. When there is a gap between one’s real and one’s declared aims, one turns as it were instinctively to long words and exhausted idioms, like a cuttlefish spurting out ink.“ George Orwell
Well, in this case he (if that’s the right pronoun) seems to have simply made some true (although fairly obvious) observations. How about we dispense with the ad hominem attacks on certain people whenever they post anything. Maybe SPB2 or Rob Misek will have something useful to say on some topics unrelated to the ones about which their comments have been found so objectionable.
No. That isn’t going to happen. I have no interest in polite conversation with either an unrepentant, proven pedophile Soros worshipper, or a deranged anti semite, Nazi, Holocaust denying shitbag.
If I figure out a way to be even nastier to them, I’ll take it.
Have you ever noticed how Buttplug calls everyone fascist and antisemitic except Misek?
Is a Shreek a secret Nazi? I would entertain the idea that Shreek is Misek, but Shreek has never displayed enough intellect for subtlety to pull that off.
capitalism is better than collectivism.
What about collective capitalism?
Aka social democracy, or cronyism.
Edit: I guess fascism could also work.
And if we're distinguishing capitalism from free market, as I like to do, then socialism or communism-as-real would also work for collective capitalism.
I 'm not a Doctor and don't play one on TV, but I think your hip just swiveled out of place and the resulting fall has given you a concussion.
🙂
Right…… ‘open society’……
Basically global Marxism. You, Soros, and every other Marxist belongs in a landfill.
Yeah, I know. Soros, Buffett, Gates, Bezos, etc are all "global Marxists" because they aren't all in with you MAGA rednecks?
You're nuts.
No, they're global Marxists because they're anti-democratic authoritarians and powermongers, who've bought out thousands of politicians, prosecutors, judges and bureaucrats.
Citations? From OTHER that Sidney Powell, the Lizard People, or Alex Jones?
Soros and Gates themselves? They haven't been exactly quiet about what they're doing.
ML covered the buts and bolt already, so I’ll just close by calling you a proven unrepentant pedophile, global Marxist shitbag.
You should kill yourself. That would be just the best.
Sqrlsy too.
Yes, SQRLSY should definitely kill himself. A horrific thing like that has no right to exist.
I see it replied. Yet again not taking our advice.
Conservaturds making friends, gathering votes, and influencing people by... PEDDLING KOOL-AID AND SUICIDE!!! How's it workin' for ya, servant of the Evil One?
EvilBahnFuhrer, drinking EvilBahnFuhrer Kool-Aid in a spiraling vortex of darkness, cannot or will not see the Light… It’s a VERY sad song! Kinda like this…
He’s a real Kool-Aid Man,
Sitting in his Kool-Aid Land,
Playing with his Kool-Aid Gland,
His Hero is Jimmy Jones,
https://www.britannica.com/biography/Jim-Jones
Loves death and the dying moans,
Then he likes to munch their bones!
Has no thoughts that help the people,
He wants to turn them all to sheeple!
On the sheeple, his Master would feast,
Master? A disaster! Just the nastiest Beast!
Kool-Aid man, please listen,
You don’t know, what you’re missin’,
Kool-Aid man, better thoughts are at hand,
The Beast, to LEAVE, you must COMMAND!
A helpful book is to be found here: M. Scott Peck, Glimpses of the Devil
https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1439167265/reasonmagazinea-20/
Hey EvilBahnFuhrer …
If EVERYONE who makes you look bad, by being smarter and better-looking than you, killed themselves, per your wishes, then there would be NO ONE left!
Who would feed you? Who’s tits would you suck at, to make a living? WHO would change your perpetually-smelly DIAPERS?!!?
You’d better come up with a better plan, Stan!
An uncapitalized open society, yes. The Open Society, no. The Open Society is Collectivist, but we know you're a liar.
Well, it’s subtle. One point of emphasis in opposition is that it’s not enough to say that democracy is bad but not as bad as the alternatives, you have to also distinguish what kind of democracy you’re using. If you are referring to the original meaning of the word – the people rule – then, as an OUTCOME, i.e. no one else rules over the people – it’s clearly better than any other alternative outcome. But if you are referring to “Our Democracy (TM)” then it’s not a democracy at all because it’s a method for ruling over the people who have no power to resist. If you mean democracy in the sense of, “the people elect their representatives and officials” or every decision is made by a vote of the people and a simple majority or plurality wins, then it’s intentionally misleading – someone ends up ruling over the people, however those rulers get their power.
A wise man once said "democracy is counting noses so you don't have to count fists". But it still reeks if you're outnumbered.
Google is by and by paying $27485 to $29658 consistently for taking a shot at the web from home. I have joined this action 2 months back and I have earned $31547 in my first month from this action. I can say my life is improved completely! Take a gander at it what I do.....
For more detail visit the given link..........>>> http://Www.jobsrevenue.com
Because they both do agree with what could be called 'liberal democracy'. Where one is lucky to argue the affirmative and the other must argue the negative re the debate so ends up having to emphasize the constraints that classical liberals put on democracy and pretends that that is not an adjective modified form of democracy.
Google is by and by paying $27485 to $29658 consistently for taking a shot at the web from home. I have joined this action 2 months back and I have earned $31547 in my first month from this action. I can say my life is improved completely! Take a gander at it what I do.....
For more detail visit the given link..........>>> http://Www.jobsrevenue.com
https://apnews.com/article/leaked-documents-pentagon-justice-department-russia-war-5c2aca4dd971d8bc83d1260f1574f99f
So they catch this dumb fuck in a few days, but the Supreme Court memo leaker is still out there sipping lattes somewhere never to be found.
Guess they escaped in that murderous red SUV.
Good guys and bad guys I guess.
It has to be some kind of conspiracy. It can't simply be that the Supreme Court leaker successfully covered their tracks.
No, it can't. The list of suspects would be tiny. They must know who it was.
It couldn't be more than ten suspects versus potentially thousands for the leaked documents, but look at Mike go.
Do you think he just never thought about it or was he being deliberately obtuse?
I suspect they know who it was, but it would be embarrassing to the institution, so they're keeping quiet.
That's because it was either Alito or one of Alito's favorite minions.
What is John Roberts gonna do? Fire him? Embarrass him?
Radical undemocratic policy overhaul needs decorum to succeed without people noticing too much. That's the John Roberts way.
The bad ones, slavers and nazis then and now on the Supreme court, are basically the same. Reason readers note that GOP nationalsocialists are ashamed of what they had to stoop to to make "conservatism" mean what it did in the 1856 Democratic platform: enslavement of women into forced labor via personhood forfeiture. The 19th Amendment can still correct this situation. (https://bit.ly/40cBYDW)
The contrarian libertarian will note that the Rothbardian Necessaries will never align with God's Own Barbers in trimming the fornication freedoms given to us by the man downstairs. If Comstock's Corn Laws were the harbinger, then the Asses and Elephants are the missionary warning us of MAGAt imitations.
Very good.
This makes more sense. Thanks!
Well, one big difference is that this guy is/was a dumb fuck, and the supreme court leaker wasn't.
Man gets prison time after feds discover $3.4 billion in stolen Bitcoin hidden inside a Cheetos popcorn tin and underground safe
...
According to federal prosecutors, James Zhong, 32, stole more than 50,000 Bitcoin from Silk Road, a marketplace on the so-called "dark web" where users can buy anything from pornography to illicit drugs. Its founder, Ross Ulbricht, was sentenced in 2015 to life in prison without the possibility of parole after he was convicted of drug trafficking, money laundering, and hacking, among other charges.
.
Zhong was able to steal from the marketplace by creating multiple accounts and tricking Silk Road into releasing the Bitcoin to his accounts; per the Department of Justice. He never actually purchased or sold anything on the website, according to a DOJ statement.
https://www.businessinsider.com/man-gets-prison-time-after-caught-stolen-bitcoin-2023-4
Is this some kind of weird Cheetos viral marketing?
It's worth more than the jet fighter Pepsi bottle top.
Observe the cant and slant of the God's Own Prohibitionist editorial style. Ross helped men and women to pay each other for goods they were willing and able to buy. Christian National Socialism defines uncoercive buying and selling as "vice=victimless crime" and arrested Ross to supply the nonexistent victim its dupes demanded to legitimize the initiation of deadly force. Superstitious initiation of force caused all this. See Lysander Spooner
Misek's minions here will maintain the minimization that the GeeOhhPee are doing to the freedom of many minors to copulate with whomever they may choose. And these nationalistic socializers oppose the right to corporatism and freedom from speech near and dear to the contrarian libertarian ideal.
RELEASE: Gottheimer Introduces “Freedom to Decide Act” to Combat Abortion Pill Ban
Supporting Telemedicine for Abortion Pill Access. Supporting Access to Mifepristone Via Mail and Across State Lines. Endorsed by Planned Parenthood, NARAL, National Women’s Law Center, & Center for Reproductive Rights.
https://gottheimer.house.gov/posts/release-gottheimer-introduces-freedom-to-decide-act-to-combat-abortion-pill-ban
Freedom = good, Peanuts.
Jane Roe's baby is alive. Does he or she have the right to continue living?
Assuming that Jane Roe’s baby is now competent to defend his or herself, or some other person or persons FREELY chose to defend Jane Roe’s baby, and PAY for the costs of such defense, w/o violating the rights of others, than yes, Jane Roe’s baby has the right to continue living (also so long as Jane Roe’s baby isn't, and doesn't become, a mass murderer).
"We" (whoever the "we" are in any given case) have the "rights" that we have earned and defended for ourselves. If fertilized egg cells (of ANY species!) want some "rights", they need to...
'A) Go out and get themselves a JOB (and also a haircut, but that one's just a nice-to-have side option), selling goods and services to willing customers!
...and...
'B) Buy themselves some up-to-date and tastefully-designed weapons with the proceeds of said job! It is NOT all that hard to do!!! (Unless you're a slacker).
Beyond that, “rights” is just fancy talk for “y’all should be obeying MEEE and MY Opinions on what YOU should and should not be doing!”
Go to North Korea and tell all of the oppressed over there, ALL about their "rights", and see how much good comes out of it! But be sure to pay ALL of your own expenses, for this utterly futile effort!
"“We” (whoever the “we” are in any given case) have the “rights” that we have earned and defended for ourselves. If fertilized egg cells (of ANY species!) want some “rights”, they need to…"
Sqrlsy can't into basic biology, but he can into elementary sophistry.
200-line rage out incoming in 3... 2... 1...
Basic biology means that ALL living things (and I mean ALL of them other than ones that are falling over dead right now) fight for resources! Eat or die, find and keep space (soil, water, sunlight, yada-yada) or die!
"Advanced" biology means we fight needlessly over tribal symbols, self-righteousness, angels dancing on Perfect Pinheads (like Mammary-Fuhrer), and idiotic ideology. Now I will grant you that Mammary-Fuhrer ***IS*** a practicing "expert" when it comes to THAT kind of shit! And believe you me, it IS utterly worthless shit!
Basic biology means that ALL living things fight for resources!
By “biology” here I was obviously referring to the field of scientific study, particularly regarding human development.
But never mind, we’ll run with your sophistry for a moment:
“means that ALL living things fight for resources”
So in the fight for resources does that mean it’s okay to kill you? Because that seems to be the logical takeaway from your argument.
“So in the fight for resources does that mean it’s okay to kill you?”
Evil people think that it’s a good thing to kill (“administer capital punishment” to) people who kill Sacred fartilized HUMAN egg smells, yes! And to peddle other forms of suffering, disease, and death, by taking away peoples’ property rights (such as privately owned web sites), discouraging people from getting vaccines, and, last butt not least (Ye Perfect BEAST!), peddling SUICIDE!
Fighting over resources is biology. Fighting, You udderstand, Mammary-Fuhrer! NOT killing (or otherwise abusing) intelligent, sentient beings is ETHICS! And ethics? You have NONE! You don’t even have enough sense to know that a newly fartilized egg smell has NO intelligence and NO sentience!
“Evil people think that it’s a good thing to kill (“administer capital punishment” to) people who kill Sacred fartilized HUMAN egg smells, yes!”
Back to ignoring biological realities I see. You’re like a fucking cartoon.
"peddling SUICIDE!"
You literally just said it was okay to kill people because "ALL living things fight for resources". Make up your mind.
As with just about everything, "it depends". Killing humans is OK when we are "murdering" a duly convicted mass murderer to make DAMNED sure that he or she NEVER does it again! It is also OK in wartime, as a last resort. Live free or die!
Now, goading people into suicide? NEVER EVER OK, Perfectly Evil Servant and Serpent of the Evil One!!!
Mammary-Necrophilia-Fuhrer, Supreme Demonic Director of Decay, Destruction, and Death, will now SPEAK! HARKKK silently and RESPECTFULLY, all ye lowly heathens, as She Directs Death, and announces WHICH few of us MIGHT deserve to live, and WHO all deserves to DIE-DIE-DIE!!!
https://reason.com/2022/01/25/did-these-three-officers-willfully-deprive-george-floyd-of-his-constitutional-rights/?comments=true#comment-9323626
“You should really join ᛋᛋqrlsy, ᛋᛋhrike. You two goosestepping fascists offing yourselves would definitely be a mitzvah.”
-Quote MammaryBahnFuhrer the "Expert Christian Theologian", AKA Mother’s Lament, with a head full of cement
So Mammary-Necrophilia-Fuhrer, Supreme Demonic Director of Decay, Destruction, and Death... WHEN are You going to STOP stealing the IDs of Your victims, and then posting kiddie porn in THEIR names, and then blaming THEM?
Killing humans is OK when we are “murdering” a duly convicted mass murderer... It is also OK in wartime, as a last resort... Now, goading people into suicide? NEVER EVER OK"
But you're as shitty a person as any mass murderer or warpig, so shouldn't you judge yourself by the same criteria?
And there you have it, Ladies and Germs!!!
"But you’re as shitty a person as any mass murderer or warpig" is ALL that you need to say to someone (according to Mammary-Necrophiliac), and then Perfect You are TOTES justified and calling for their DEATH!
(Butt don't forget, Mammary-Necrophiliac is an Expert Christian Theologian, so that, and MUCH more, are all justified!)
https://www.denisonforum.org/biblical-living/the-heartbreaking-story-of-jane-roe-and-the-roe-baby-who-was-born/
Let’s see what Jane Roe’s baby herself has said on the controversial issue:
https://www.denisonforum.org/biblical-living/the-heartbreaking-story-of-jane-roe-and-the-roe-baby-who-was-born/
“McCorvey was never able to make peace with Thornton. So, what about Thornton’s views on abortion?
“She’d held that opinion ‘close to her chest.’ However, after Roe was overturned, she said, ‘I believe that the decision to have an abortion is a private, medical choice that should be between a woman, her family, and her doctor’ and called it a ‘fundamental right.’ But, she did this through a ‘spokesperson,’ so it may be hard to know her true opinions.
“In the past, Thornton has said she couldn’t see herself getting an abortion but believed it shouldn’t be up to the government. In fact, early in her life, Shelly became pregnant out of wedlock with her future husband but refused to get an abortion.”
So, Jane Roe's baby spoke out for a woman's choice despite personally not choosing abortion.
I wonder if she'd still speak out if they'd killed her fifty years ago? Oh wait, she'd be dead.
THIS is why every sperm is Sacred, and needs to be brought to term!
(WHERE will we find that many womb-women/bots to enslave? Ah, details, details!!! All that matters is that I SHOUT IT OUT self-righteously, and gain more followers, by hook or by crook, for WHATEVER I have decided to BLEEVE!!!!)
Sperm can't be brought to term, and neither can an egg, but a embryo or fetus certainly can. If you'd graduated from middle school you'd have known that basic biological fact.
The genes (DNA, chromosomes) in sperm can be combined with those in eggs and brought to term, Oh Brilliant Biologist! Do sperms have souls or half-souls, do egg cells have souls or half-souls? NO ONE knows yet, or most certainly, can NOT show their work, and PROVE this kind of shit!!! What IS a soul, does it even exist? Many Nobel Prizes await Perfect You, Oh Brilliant Biologist! Now go do the work, and SHOW Your Perfect Work, besides being a trouble-maker!
"The genes (DNA, chromosomes) in sperm can be combined with those in eggs and brought to term"
And then when it's combined it's not a sperm and an egg but a human being.
Just like a bag of flour and a bag of sugar aren't a cake, but when combined and popped in the oven they are.
You really are incapable of thinking critically, huh?
QUESTIONS THAT THE FANATICS WON’T EVER ANSWER: What do YOU think that the punishment should be for deliberately killing a fertilized human egg cell? Ditto the punishments for likewise killing a fertilized egg of an ape... A monkey... A rat... An insect... If your Righteous Punishments From on High are DIFFERENT in these cases, then WHY? WHERE do the differences come from? And what gives YOU (or the 51% of the voters) the right to punish the rest of us?
Never, ever, have I gotten any serious answers, when I pose these questions, about what the PUNISHMENTS should be! (Could it be that the fanatics don’t want us to focus on THEIR obsession, which is their smug and self-righteous “punishment boners”?). Also, the unwillingness to answer questions is strongly indicative of authoritarianism. At the root here is the unmistakable attitude of “Because I said so, peons! Do NOT question your Rulers!”
More (MUCH more) at http://www.churchofsqrls.com/Jesus_Validated/#_Toc117957741 ... For intelligent and benevolent people! For evil people and those who lust after disease, death, and SUICIDE (like Mammary-Fuhrer), this will all be as pearls cast before swine!
"What do YOU think that the punishment should be for deliberately killing a fertilized human egg cell?"
At what age, Shillsy? 6 minutes? 40 hours? 3 months? 4 years? 2 decades? 85 years?
The penalty for murder should by applicable no matter how old a person was when you killed them.
So You REALLY think that the punishment for killing an adult human (for no good reason) should be the same as for killing a Sacred Fartilized Egg Smell, fartilized 3 minutes ago? I steal an acorn from Your Perfect Property should be punished the same as me stealing a mature oak tree, for thousands of dollars worth of valuable hardwood lumber?
YOU are Perfectly INSANE when it comes to "proportional justice", Perfectly Evil Bitch!
Me? Not having a HUGE and obscene "punishment boner" or "punishment clit", like SOME evil people that I know of... I think that the punishment (when the offender is caught) for killing a fartilized egg smell should be... A FINE of $0.33!!! Now THERE is "proportional justice" for YOU, Perfect One!
There's no such thing as a "Sacred Fartilized Egg Smell" but a second trimester human is just as human as an 80 year old human.
You just can't form an argument without resorting to sophistry and specious reasoning, can you.
Didn’t SQRLSY spend his formative years as a carnival geek locked in a cage?
The US Constitution provides borders within which it asserts jurisdiction and enforces rights of persons. Like baby seals, unborn creatures are not constitutional persons. There are constitutional persons in other jursdictions--Jews in 1930s Germany, Ukrainians today--OUTSIDE the US jurisdiction just as tissue inside of a woman is outside its jurisdiction. "We" could illegally invade Ukraine with conscripts, but it is suicidal. Using mystical personhood forfeiture to enslave women is even more suicidal. It follows that THAT is what mystical altruists demand be attempted using deadly force.
The burden of proof rests on those who demand the extension of jurisdiction, forfeiture of personhood, and initiation of deadly coercion under color of law. Furthermore, pronatalist usurpations coerce only women--as clear an exercise of arbitrary discrimination as can be imagined for the 9th to strike down. Indeed the 15th amendment under Comstockist enslavement of women literally made the 19th redundant, absent willful blindness. Forcing black women to labor at reproduction is slavery forbidden by the 13th Amendment even if Slaughterhouse and ku-klux Cruikshank are held up as tenable precedent. Any takers? https://bit.ly/3A2K6wi
The Constitution says that no one can be deprived of life, liberty, or property without their day in court. It also outlawed cruel and unusual punishment. By their DNA, unborn are individuals, with one chance at life. Just like you, me, and everyone else.
Wasting your time. Hank will just nonsensically rave about ‘mystical girl bulliers’ Comstock, stolen 1972 party planks, etc.. he really should be locked away in some assisted living facility for seniors with severe dementia.
No skin off her nose, she'd already been born by the time the Supreme Court said Roe could kill her in the womb.
Perhaps so, but maybe Jane Roe’s baby shouldn’t be used as a political football, as Philly Collins tried to do above.
Oh lol. What were you just doing with your links, Mike?
Dunno. Are they black?
turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, a TDS-addled asshole and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.
RELEASE: Gottheimer Introduces “Freedom to Decide Act” to Combat Abortion Pill Ban
It's amazing how quickly we pivoted from "choice is sacrosanct" to "you get no choice" back to "choice is sacrosanct" in the period of just a few months.
Where was the “you get no choice”?
"I'm going to pretend I wasn't arguing over mandatory vaccinations yesterday"
“I’m going to pretend that people getting fired from their jobs for persistently NOT performing their work duties... Are being turned into work-SLAVES by FORCE AND COERCION!!!"
Because this is a TOTALLY straight-forward and accurate drop-in analogy to health care workers (etc.) being fired for NOT consenting to being vaccinated!!! You pro-disease EVIL twits and twats NEVER document examples of people being ACTUALLY FORCIBLY VACCINATED!!! Gee, I wonder why? Also, WHY do You never demonstrate the existence of unicorns, and erections STOLEN from Der TrumpfenFuhrer?
That’s not even remotely relevant to what anyone here was saying, Shillsy.
Go be dishonest and crazy at Salon. I know you love it there. ===>
Well, evil lying Perfect Bitch, I am still waiting for Perfect You (or anyone else here) to document ONE single case of a person in the USA recently HELD DOWN AND FORCIBLY VACCINATED against their will!
Notice how Shillsy had to add “HELD DOWN” because he’s already been given tons of examples of people forced to get the mRNA injection by being threatened with firing.
What a fucking Nazi.
By Stupid-and-Evil Perfect Bitch logic... people getting fired from their jobs for persistently NOT performing their work duties… Are being turned into work-SLAVES by FORCE AND COERCION!!!
Non vaccinated harm others more than killing another human through abortion, or something.
JesseBahnFuhrer is incoherent, or something. JesseBahnFuhrer is in favor of stuff-and-stuff... Except when it is NOT!
Also, wasting even a SINGLE sperm that does NOT fartilize an egg smell... STOPS A WIGGLING TAIL!!!! Up with THAT, we can NOT put!!!
Arrest, indict, and imprison the perjurious criminal "Doctor" Anthony Fauci..
Impeach Garland
Impeach Mayorkas.
And last but not least, impeach the scumbag-in-chief Joe Biden. Yep, I said it yet again!
And I’m just going to keep on saying it over and over and over and over and over again here every single week until we the American people get what we voted for: some justice and accountability for the three years (and counting) of absolute hell these bastards have put this country through because of their lies and crimes.
And last but not least, impeach the scumbag-in-chief Joe Biden.
Just wait til they find that e-mail from China!
I guess today is not going to be a day off for all current and former Reason staff sockpuppets given tge start you're already off to!
It’s adorable you believe we actually care what you white trash peasants post on here.
Faggot.
Good one! You sure showed me!
Do you kiss your cousin with that potty mouth?
If the dick fits, go ahead and stick it in another dude's filthy asshole. We know no woman would ever spread 'em for a pansy like you in a million years.
Just stay away from the kids you freak.
Why should I stay away from kids? You’re the one who keeps bringing up dicks and assholes. Your username is about a journalist’s penis. You seem to be fascinated with the male anatomy.
If anything you’re the one who should stay away from kids.
Homo.
You’re the one obsessed with male genitalia.
Remember that turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.
Uh, sure, democracy. Would you rather have that or free speech and association, property rights, and rule of law?
Stay at home mom Kelly Richards from New York after resigning from her full time job managed to average from $6000-$8000 a month from freelancing at home...
This is how she done it...................>>> http://www.jobsrevenue.com
Democracy is worse than a constitutional republic. The founders knew this. So do most actual libertarians.
Pure democracy in Greece removed many asserted rights. There is no protection from the state in a pure democracy. Especially if government controls the means to an election. Or can bribe the people with their own money.
Reason pushing a democracy narrative here sounds like a standard leftist demanding democracy in order to increase state powers.
A recognition of rights is the prime concern of a libertarian. A democracy does not guarantee any human rights and can easily remove them. That is why a grant of limited powers in a republic is necessary.
What a sophomoric headline and assertion.
I can usually get the standard lefties (especially if they're girls) to agree that they do, in fact, believe in limits in what can be voted on, by invoking the same thing the second author did: sex.
Not that they even then apply this realization to stop being standard lefties, but oh well.
"Democracy is worse than a constitutional republic"
Maybe if the constitution was still followed and wasn't treated like used toilet paper.
What is sophomoric is your ilks absence of understanding as to what a constititutional republic is or to what it is meant to be the alternative form of governance.
You continue to remain more ignorant than even Tony. Amazing to see really.
Democracy is worse than a constitutional republic.
But uf we’re talking about representative democracy rather than direct democracy – and that’s generally the case – there is no contradiction between a country being a constitutional republic and being a democracy. The US is one, Germany another, France another, etc. In fact, it’s a commonplace amongst Western-style democracies for them to be constitutional republics as well, the alternative usually being, not undemocratic constitutional republics, but democratic constitutional monarchies, like the UK, Netherland, etc.
Meanwhile,
A recognition of rights is the prime concern of a libertarian.
For some - the more dogmatic - libertarian, perhaps, but rights are a convenient fiction. There are no natural rights out there that can be determined by objective discovery or analysis, only rights that experience tells us make certain societies and ways of living better than those which deny them, and more pragmatic libertarians will recognise this, while preferring a more expansive and wider range of rights than people who adhere to other political systems.
In practice, rights are what you can claim exist with the consent - active or passive - of enough of the people, and how many "enough" is is a matter of debate. If the number if 1, it's a dictatorship...But people do feel uncomfortable with the idea that rights are an agreed-upon fiction, hence appeals to natural rights, and the like.
But this is all, of course, obvious.
Jesus fuck. Shrike can’t read a full comment just like he can’t read the articles he posts.
You pull the standard rhetorical trick of thinking government grants rights instead of the people deciding to grant government powers. Youre the exact type of retard the founders recognized as harmful to the people.
Are you even aware the US system was a 2 formed style republic of the house representing the people and the senate representing the states appointed by state legislature?
One of the biggest fires starting federal expansion was direct voting of senators. But of course you don't know this.
Still not shrike, you lying cracker.
Nowhere do I say - and nor do I think - that the government grants rights, you liar. You complain that I don't read my own links - another lie - and yet you apparently either don't read what I did write, or read something I didn't write. As I am well aware, the Constitution only recognises pre-existing rights, for example, because the US - being a republic - has power flowing from the people, and the government has only such powers as are delegated to them.
And I am well aware that originally senators were appointed by state legislatures not the people, until passage of 17A. Anyone studying for their citizenship exam who bothers to read the Constitution will know this. BTW you do realise that the passage of a constitutional amendment is also legitimate in a constitutional republic, right?
But where do those rights come from? It's still by agreement - or by acceptance of a fiction, whether some nebulous idea of natural rights, or the even more nebulous one of their being given by God.
And of course all of this deflects from the point that the US is an (indirect) democracy and a constitutional republic, about which you are flatly wrong. FWIW only in the US do right-wingers make this ignorant observation. Nowhere else do right-wingers come out with rubbish like this - almost as though at some point some American conservative unthinkingly said this for whatever reason, and it's been repeated unthinkingly ever since, while the comment never got any traction outside the US.
I do note that often enough the comment is made as something of a boast about the superiority of the US system, the boaster being unaware, as so many Americans are, of how political systems operate in other countries.
Not shrike... just the same soros defending, government defending, low info poster with all the same arguments and invective epitaphs.
Lol.
And the lying continues, fuckwit.
I am simply describing political systems and terms, without either criticism or approval, and you then spew irrelevant bullshit - again, to hide your ignorance of why a democracy and a democratic republic are not contradictory. I know that you're stupider than you think you are, I didn't realise until now that you're stupider than I thought you were,
Of course, you can always rely on your clown claque to defend your idiocy and ignorance.
8 never said a republic and a democracy weren't related shrike. If you read what I wrote I stated how a democracy doesn't recognize rights and was open to abuse which is why a 2 tiered constitutional republic is better.
But you're so simple minded you don't understand the issue.
Globalist, socking, soros worshipping shrike.
Brit’s use a parliamentary system, so does much of Europe. We’re not ignorant at all, we just recognize that those systems are inferior. As are you and your kind.
They're not inferior, merely different. There are advantages and disadvantages to both systems, though I note that Britain is not a republic, and France - which is a constitutional republic as well as a democracy - is a hybrid of a presidential and a parliamentary system.
Parliamentary systems do seem to make it more difficult for the executive to gain greater control, while presidential systems seem to provide for greater political stability. You pays your money and you takes your choice.
I believe the upshot is that the US, since it's both not a democracy and also the bestest country in the history of the universe, should be perfectly fine with the Republican party in charge forever without regard to the will of the people. See, it's right there in the word "republic."
I must say, if I had so much power to convince the stupid to believe anything, I'd do a lot more freaky shit with it.
You democrats are literally doing that now. So fuck you pinko.
Big surprise a ahitbag like him fucks children.
Shrike doesn't believe in federalist ideals that try to push power closer to an individual. Big government pro new world order type. See soros adoration.
It’s like Soros is Dracula, and Shreek is Renfield, or more specifically a puss infested boil on Renfield’s rectum. Promising y lives. For sex, instead of blood.
Obvious arm-waving evasion, and copied at that. Moore sold altruism saying trust your feelings. Rights are whatever you feel like they are. Less ignorant is Tara Smith's version: "A right is a moral claim to freedom of action." Here free entails freedom from coercion coming and going, and the statement is a lot like pi. Civilization has increased as pi was calculated to more and more decimal places. Rights strengthen as libertarian spoiler votes help voters make looter politicians unemployed.
Jeff's people make some demands.
https://www.foxnews.com/lifestyle/plus-size-airline-passenger-demands-free-seats-bigger-bathrooms-more-online-petition-faa
The petition also asks for free extra seats for plus-size individuals.
.
"All plus-size passengers should be provided with an extra free seat, or even two or three seats depending on their size, to accommodate their needs and ensure their comfort during the flight," Chaney wrote.
.
In addition, airlines should "offer a refund for plus-size passengers" who "purchase additional seats independently," her petition notes.
.
Other demands include creating airline standards on booking, refunds, check-in, boarding and flight procedures for plus-size people.
Offering a potential solution, she said, "Many airlines also oversell a percentage of seats on flights, resulting in available seats that could be used to accommodate passengers who need additional room."
So, she doesn't understand what that means either. Has it precisely backwards, in fact.
So she's fat and retarded. Wonderful.
Most are.
It would be interesting to study the correlation between hyperobesity and low intelligence. My observation would be that it seems close. Actual mentally retarded people are almost uniformly obese.
Dear Sweet Mother Eris. I hate myself so I clicked the link to watch the video of her whining about this problem, and goddamn.
I am "plus sized" at 6'5" and 245 lbs. I get it, airplane seats are small. My shoulders are flat out wider than the seat. As a result, I sit on the aisle and just accept that my knee is gonna get repeatedly smashed by the drinks cart.
That woman is... plus plus plus plus plus plus sized. Botticelli would have suggested she slow her rolls. I was reminded of Grimace, from Ronald McDonald-land. I now understand why she mentioned not just one, but several free seats from the airline.
But now I'm left wondering how he even gets to the airport? Cattle trailer?
Yeah, I'd have more sympathy if I wasn't also 6'4 and straight up don't fit in modern aircraft. I'm not fat by a long stretch, but lengthwise I simply do not fit in cattle seats.
Unlike tremendously fat people, buying extra seats isn't going to fix that either.
I've heard good things about ships--before Senator Wesley Livsey "5 & 10" Jones did everything possible to make them as illegal as beer, wine and dope.
I don't think she's going far enough. She should demand that grocery stores give her more food for the same price as everyone else.
I mean, the "logic" she's using would apply...
The question is whether a ticket buys a place on a plane for a person or the specific real estate of a seat. Take the corporate interest position to its logical extreme, and we might end up with virtually no legroom on planes or something.
Then nobody would buy a ticket
I'm sure the discomfort of flying in tiny seats is already depressing ticket sales.
Deregulating the airlines, an industry that for all anyone knows is physically incapable of turning a profit, was a move just asking the entire country to call uncle.
Flying is shitty in America because squeezing profits requires minimizing passenger comfort. But you can't compete on amenities since there's no way to make money in this industry except by sheer volume. It's one of the major pitfalls of free-market capitalism, the race to the bottom. How much choice do you actually feel you have? You just pick the cheapest fare and suffer, right? Or else pay out the ass for an extra three inches of legroom.
But deregulation in this instance wasn't just some evil capitalist scheme, it was spearheaded by Democrats in response to high costs and inefficiencies associated with regulations.
But we've learned about all these unforeseen other problems now. My thinking is that the pre-deregulation problems are addressable as policy, but the post-deregulation problems are endemic to the industry as it interacts with the market mechanism. So like all other transport we should return it to being a public utility and subsidize the extra costs publicly on the grounds that comfort in air travel is a public good worth paying for.
On both a GAAP basis and excluding the impact of net special items, American Airlines produced an operating margin of 10.5% in the quarter. American also produced record revenues of $49 billion for the full year, resulting in full-year 2022 profitability.
Fantastic. Perhaps some day its stock price can gain 100% to be back up to 2013 prices.
How old are you? The old CAA gave airlines monopoly rights to routes and it resulted in only the wealthy and govt classes affording air travel. We had relatives in the Bay Area and as late as 1970, they would visit Western NY via train. I flew out there after dereg and my flight was about $150 in today's dollars. Before that it was more like $1K in today's dollars. Dereg works in every industry. Now can we apply it to public education?
No. Don't expect the public to essentially upgrade your coach ticket to first class because you don't feel like paying it yourself. There's no reason we should be subsidizing luxuries. You want to get from Chicago to New Orleans, you can already take Amtrak or Greyhound and take a day.
Luxury is in the eye of the beholder, and as long as economic productivity proceeds apace, we can keep taking them for ourselves if we want to, since it's our shit.
Stupidity, OTOH, is quite obvious here.
You are free to never fly basement dweller. Greyhound is more your purchase range anyways.
Deregulation only affected airlines. Nothing was attempted to deregulate airports.
You’re buying a seat. It’s explicit.
You are assigned 1 ticket for 1 seat on purchase retard. It is literally paying for 1 seat. Fag asses can pay for 2 or 3 if they need.
Or lose weight.
But personal responsibility is anathema to you.
Giving in to demands from estrogen filled beta male progtards never made sense to me. Beatings do though.
Eat a dick, Jesse Walker
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1647220760518197248?t=Jekf_SgmLeksIQLQKMU7og&s=19
Look what's going on here:
First the NYT (jointly with CIA-front Bellingcat) and WPost hunted down, exposed and ensured the arrest of the 21-year-old leaker.
Now they're having a party with the docs, publishing one "EXCLUSIVE" after the next as if they bravely "obtained" them:
Each time these news outlets publish reporting on these docs -- as we did -- it's an implicit admission that they are newsworthy, that the public should know about them.
That's what makes it so repellent that media corporations are the ones who hunted him down on behalf of FBI.
And, don't forget that a week ago:
@Reuters published an article claiming Russia was behind this leak, based on what "three officials" told them.
These media outlets print whatever the US Security State tells them to, because that's their alliegience:
There were many docs incriminating of the Biden WH and CIA, including ones showing they lied about the extent of their involvement in the war in Ukraine.
Those have been swept aside in favor of narratives the intel agencies like: about Chinese balloons and Russian infighting.
Under basic journalistic ethics, the only time it's justifiable (indeed required) to out a source is when they purposely cause you to disseminate lies.
Does this mean @Reuters will reveal which official anonymous sources caused them to falsely claim Russia did this leak?
Literally every day, major media corporations (NYT, WPost, NBC, CNN) publish leaks of classified information from anonymous officials.
What's the difference between them and Jack Teixeira?
The media outlets are publishing what the Govt orders them say.
[Links]
America needs a free and independent media. Too bad it obviously doesn't have one.
Sure it exists on the fringes of the internet like at Substack, but that should be the rule, not the exception.
Has it ever actually had one, though?
Kind of. Maybe not on a national scale and certainly not with the big three networks, but there used to be tens of thousands of independent state and local newspapers and radio stations that generally adhered to those principles.
Has the white house admitted these documents are legitimate, or are they still just a random collection of words and syllables which, while not legitimate, should not be in the public domain?
The corporate media is just a prop arm of the State.
These are not legitimate media organizations. They ar e propaganda networks that are de facto election boosters for the democrat party, they should be prosecuted for endless election law violations.
Once control is retaken, that needs to happen.
For those who missed this the other day:
ederal deficit tops $1 trillion in first six months of FY ’23 despite near-record tax revenues. Park Slope Welchie Boy, Goth Fonzie Woppo, Mingo-Mango-Mongo, and Dipshit Dave Weigel hardest hit:
https://www.cnsnews.com/article/washington/terence-p-jeffrey/deficit-tops-1-trillion-first-six-months-fy2023
Yes, some of this is because interest on the debt is now rising rapidly, but that’s mostly your boy Sleepy Joe Biden’s fault, you Soros dick-riding fugazi libertarian scumbags!
Don't forget shrike.
Poor Buttplug. It's going to be hard to find the silver lining in that dung pit.
I’d like to.
Chump change.
WASHINGTON (AP) — The federal budget deficit hit an all-time high of $3.1 trillion in the 2020 budget year, more than double the previous record, as the coronavirus pandemic shrank revenues and sent spending soaring.
.
The Trump administration reported Friday that the deficit for the budget year that ended on Sept. 30 was three times the size of last year’s deficit of $984 billion. It was also $2 trillion higher than the administration had estimated in February, before the pandemic hit.
... 2020? I think 2020 can just have a giant asterisk next to it. Of course you're going to have a huge deficit when states shut down businesses.
turd, the ass-clown of the commentariat, lies; it’s all he ever does. turd is a kiddie diddler, and a pathological liar, entirely too stupid to remember which lies he posted even minutes ago, and also too stupid to understand we all know he’s a liar.
If anything he posts isn’t a lie, it’s totally accidental.
turd lies; it’s what he does. turd is a lying pile of lefty shit.
It's going to get worse. A lot of rich people lost a lot of money last year in the stock market.
Personally, it seems a constitutional republic which had some generally elected officials would be preferable, but that an alternative which doesn't seem to last too long.
Democracy!
https://twitter.com/kylenabecker/status/1647252498632114176?t=7VFzfbQ7PBugvqj0DPYvVA&s=19
JUST IN: Washington Passes Bill Allowing Children to Legally Be Taken From Parents if Parents Don't Consent to Gender Transition
[Link]
I wonder if Chemjeff will stick with his "It's solely up to the parents" on this one.
As long as the parents get conjugal visits with the kids, he'll probably be OK with it.
Need to turn Idaho into a sanctuary state.
I cannot avoid being pedantic in this debate – it’s highly abstruse theory to start with. But even experts continue to confuse “democracy” with the concept of “a democracy.” Democracy (rule by the people) is a negative principle. Democracy is what you have in the absence of any other government system (i.e. dictatorship, oligarchy, monarchy, etc.) Even then there are several modes for decision-making from electing representatives who then rule over the people with an iron fist directly or by legislating and appointing the people who appoint the officials; to direct democracy in which every citizen casts one vote on every decision to be made (who, then, carries out the result of the vote?); to democratic socialism in which the decisions to be made by the people are limited by the lack of private property and ownership and operation of the major means of production. So how the decisions are made are not nearly as important as which system works best to achieve the outcome desired in the real world. If the vast majority of the people treasure liberty and seek to achieve it through mutual cooperation pledging their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor, then the outcome will be liberty. There will be no power centers taking root in such a society and the actual mechanism of government will be much less important. Once a small group is allowed to use whatever authority there is to achieve their personal goals, then the reactionary principle will come into play – either the budding power center will be wiped out by an angry vote, or another group will seek to use the same or another new power center to achieve THEIR own personal goals, and liberty is doomed. The fact that a society is "a democracy" tells you almost nothing about liberty in that society.
Not trying to be snarky, but can you please add more paragraph breaks. You seem to have interesting observations, but it is physically hard to read your comment.
What was fucking hard to read? Make a mental pause dumbass. You need to be pressed to do anything don't you? Just like you refuse to watch videos as you need someone to tell you what the video is about.
Jesse, give him a break. He’s just a democrat. If he were smarter, he wouldn’t be.
Mike, if anyone ever expresses an interest in compiling my observations into a book I will make the effort to edit them into a more readable structure. As it is I find myself putting the words onto the screen and then trying to make the corrections quickly before the five minute time limit is up.
Inverse Jim Cramer Curse Strikes Again
Cramer is as good at picking sticks as Biden is at foreign policy.
God damn comments system ate my comment
PRAISE BE GIVEN UNTO THE SQUIRRELS!
...and nothing of value was lost.
Finally the squirrels do something useful.
GIGO...
What is your one vote worth?
In the political district I live in? Literally nothing.
As a 3rd grade teacher, I often talk about Jesus with my students, they are so excited to hear about my faith. They point to the cross on wall and ask me about the resurrection.
Some have gotten baptized in the sink, as long as they don’t tell their parents. It’s our secret.
I hope this doesn’t get me fired, please don’t share this to libs.
Apr 14 I want you guys to understand something, I am NOT grooming these young apostles, THEY COME TO ME and I follow their questions back to it’s source
These kids feel something is not right inside them and I help them to understand that Jesus is what they are missing in their life
20h Guys, it is important that we keep these tweets away from people who would get me fired. PLEASE be very cautious who you share these with.
DO NOT post links like this to prominent liberals. It puts my whole class in danger.
The best part is the progs in the comments who don't realize it was parody of them and are genuinely outraged.
Beautiful.
Jeff made the same arguments here. Saying region shouldn't ever be taught but sexual grooming is fine.
https://twitter.com/CarpeDonktum/status/1647279056210067459?t=gwL2fy6UEPPzsWsQf5F-Cg&s=19
What right do parents have to interfere in the development of a childs spiritual identity? These kids know who they are inside, and a parents only job is to support them in their journey.
If they can't do that, then maybe they aren't fit to be parents.
https://www.foxnews.com/us/woman-demanding-reparations-target-punched-face-security-guard-rosa-parks-moment
“This is my Rosa Parks moment,” 37-year-old Karen Ivery told police officers after a confrontation inside a Blue Ash Target last year, according to a report from the New York Post.
Ivery’s explanation to police came after a dramatic scene played out in the store, where she attempted to pay for her $1,000 grocery bill by demanding reparations from the store’s manager.
Entitlement. It’s a Karen thing.
Zach Cotter, a 28-year-old loss prevention officer, then approached Ivery to try to defuse the situation, asking the irate customer to calm down and leave the store. But the loss prevention officer’s intervention only led to Ivery becoming more angry, with the screaming customer allegedly following Cotter to his office.
When Cotter tried to shut the door to his office behind him, Ivery followed and forced her way in, resulting in the loss prevention officer throwing a punch that landed squarely on the customer’s face, according to a report and video of the incident.
And this is how entitlement should be dealt with.
The problem is not the voting system, the problem is that the rulers have too much power. Both sides (both sides!) demand that their winners should have moar power. But it doesn't matter if it's the majority who wins, the minority, the purples or the oranges, the first-past-posters, or the ranked-choice-instant-runoffers, the winners need to be restrained and limited in their power.
Those restrictions can only occur outside/beyond the enumerations of the power those representatives/rulers have. They are meta decisions. Those restraints ARE protected in a democracy because the person whose rights would be infringed is present to make a big stink about them. It is only in a 'representative' democracy that the disconnect between a minority that isn't being represented and a majority that is can/will result in a minority whose rights are infringed/ignored by the representative legislature itself.
A constitutional form sounds like it would protect those rights but in practice a judiciary confirmed by a legislature and chosen by an executive doesn't protect shit. And countries that don't occasionally redo their constitution find that there are never any new individual/minority rights that will ever be protected.
Elections clearly don't protect shit and indeed make that sort of infringement a viable political strategy for election.
It's one reason I think sortition can work - as long as the minority is a statistical minority and not exclusively an individual-of-one minority.
Rights like access to Healthcare. Which you advocated be removed for those who were unvaccinated?
You argue that people are responsible for their actions. Except apparently that unvax people are not responsible if they got a case of covid serious enough to force someone else out of hospital.
You anti-vaxxers were so intent on your conspiratorial narratives that you didn’t give a shit that your own political allies are the ones that you killed.
Nobody gets forced out of hospitals.
25 states implemented their crisis standards of care protocols at some point during the covid waves. That means they EXPLICITLY decided who would not enter hospital during those waves. None were as explicit as say Italy, remember them?, which at its peak said no one over age 60 will be admitted to hospital. Nor would it have been as bad as the early pre-vax waves precisely because the vax worked in keeping people out of the fucking hospital/morgue no matter how much or how long you asswipes lied and lied and still lie and lie FOREVER about that.
Most of the remaining states simply used first-come-first-served. Which meant the hospitals just filled up with covid treatment that could take up to three weeks – while new patients – eg David Wilkinson – a 40 year old who lived one block from an ER and 60 miles from the Texas Medical Center (the largest hospital district/campus/center/pillhill in the world) – died of acute gallstone pancreatitis because HE was de facto forced out of hospitals.
Most of the people your anti-vax ilk killed were those who believed your bullshit and lies and fraud about the vaccine/covid. And yes that is proven..
You paleos are NOT libertarian. You are lying nihilists. Whatever you advocate results in the deaths of those who believe that shit. Which is why you people are toxic and will succeed at nothing.
The vax didn't stop transmission. Retarded shit.
Wait, JFree. You seem to be blaming people who refused vaccinations for the bad consequences of the state's bad emergency protocols after the state destroyed their own hospital system? Talk about blaming the victims! In the US Medicare destroyed the US health care system, then governors dictated bad lock-downs hoping to avoid overwhelming the hospitals damaged by Medicare and reduce deaths, further damaging the hospitals, and you're blaming vax resisters for all of that? Amazing!
The purpose of what I advocated was to clear the shortages more quickly so that people could be treated under normal standards of care not under crisis standards. Specifically to do so by posing a simple question to those contemplating vax/no -- Are you willing to put up with the consequences of a poor covid outcome FOR YOU (one that results in hospitalization or death) by refusing to take the vax for political signaling reasons?
The context of those vax/no decisions then was - You can posture all you want about the vax. If the shit hits and you get a bad case of covid that requires hospitalization, then you (vax or not) get to clog up the hospitals and force someone else who needs hospitalization to not get it. But the vax didn't get those bad cases. The unvax did and they are the ones who filled the hospitals for covid treatment.
That is exactly the sort of context that has no consequences at all and that incentivized the sort of lies that paleos, antivaxxers, and conspiracists flocked to in order to pollute everything. My proposal - modest as it was - was little more than a splash of cold water with the effect of waking people up as to the real-world consequences of vax/no. The reason the commenters here got so upset is precisely because that dose of cold water spoiled their lie-fest.
Your nonsense about Medicare destroying whatever is -- totally irrelevant. If that needs fixing then you've had decades to fix it before covid - and you now can fix it post-covid. Using covid as an excuse to 'fix' Medicare and ignore the existing reality is beyond sociopathic.
Further - the lockdowns were also near irrelevant. The ones that may have worked in 2020 were only in the northeast where covid hit hard and early and affected capacity. Everywhere else, covid didn't even hit until that summer or winter. The capacity problems in 2021 were PRECISELY those areas that did not have lockdowns in 2021 and also had very low vax uptake. And it was the vax uptake that made a difference in 2021.
Funny how we turned out to be right, and you turned out to be horribly wrong. And now you double down on your horrible mistakes.
Please argue the same for tuberculosis, hepatitis. Etc. Fuck sick people. Why are they at a hospital. The vaccines did not stop transmission you statist retard.
You've been wrong on every aspect to covid and the vaccines for them.
And now you are back on mute.
Angry crybaby! Jesse slapped you down hard, so there goes the mute button. Go ahead and mute me while you’re at it.
Or do you want me to wipe your tears away little girl?
Lol. Just like Mike. Mutes people who expose their idiocy with reality.
All leftists are alike.
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There is no right to health care. A decision to go into hospital for care is, or should be, made by a patient in consultation with a doctor based on the risks, potential benefits and costs for that patient with that medical condition. Availability of beds in hospitals used to be market-based until Medicare came along and informed us that medical care in the US was costing too much. This resulted in a decline in the number of hospital beds, a worsening shortage of doctors, INCREASING costs of medical care and, ultimately, a reduced capacity for responding to temporary health emergencies. Hospital administrators and medical staffs used to be very good at allocating resources and shifting in response to changing conditions until the central planners took over. If you want to declare a RIGHT to health care, the burden of implementing that right is on YOU, along with the disastrous results of your failure.
"...Except apparently that unvax people are not responsible if they got a case of covid serious enough to force someone else out of hospital..."
Perhaps one day, the asshole known as JFree will argue without pointing to a strawman.
Perhaps one day, he'll make the world a better place by fucking off and dying.
"the winners need to be restrained and limited in their power."
You used the passive voice. Liberty can only result from action, just as freedom is taken away by the actions of the majority, a powerful minority or the power-hungry who gravitate towards government positions. The winners don't need to be restrained; the people who value liberty for themselves must restrain them. They realize that they can only keep their own liberty by preserving it for all the people through mutual cooperation despite less important disagreements amongst them. It even says that explicitly in the Second Amendment: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State ..."
https://twitter.com/amuse/status/1647219363999629312?t=YijPTSjvZ5p_Gngv7NUM6g&s=19
The United Nations issued this report calling on member nations to decriminalize sex between adults and minors. Should adults be allowed to convince kids to perform sex acts with them? The UN says yes.
[Link]
Woo! Tween whores! Dystopia abounds...
Edit- oops
Is this the language you mean?
“Moreover, sexual conduct involving persons below the domestically prescribed minimum age of consent to sex may be consensual in fact, if not in law. In this context, the enforcement of criminal law should reflect the rights and capacity of persons under 18 years of age to make decisions about engaging in consensual sexual conduct and their right to be heard in matters concerning them. Pursuant to their evolving capacities and progressive autonomy, persons under 18 years of age should participate in decisions affecting them, with due regard to their age, maturity and best interests, and with specific attention to non discrimination guarantees.”
International Commission of Jurists [et. al.?], “The 8 March [2023] Principles for a Human Rights-Based Approach to Criminal Law Proscribing Conduct Associated with Sex, Reproduction, Drug Use, HIV, Homelessness and Poverty,” pp. 22-23.
https://icj2.wpenginepowered.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/8-MARCH-Principles-FINAL-printer-version-1-MARCH-2023.pdf
"the enforcement of criminal law should reflect the rights and capacity of persons under 18 years of age to make decisions about engaging in consensual sexual conduct and their right to be heard in matters concerning them. Pursuant to their evolving capacities and progressive autonomy"
Wow. Maybe it's time for another Chicxulub event.
Here are the two American jurists who belong to the organization:
"Mr Reed Brody – United States
Mr Reed Brody, from the United States, is currently serving his first term as an ICJ Commissioner having been elected in December 2016. Mr Brody is counsel for the victims of the former dictator of Chad, Hissène Habré, who was convicted of crimes against humanity in a special court in Senegal. Previously, he worked on the cases of Augusto Pinochet and Jean-Claude “Baby Doc” Duvalier. From 1998 to 2016, he was Counsel and Spokesperson for Human Rights Watch, where he was author of four HRW reports on U.S. treatment of prisoners in the “war on terror” and the book “Faut-il Juger George Bush?” He has also served as Deputy Chief of the UN Secretary-General’s Investigative Team in the Democratic Republic of Congo (SGIT), Director of the Human Rights Division of the United Nations Observer Mission in El Salvador (ONUSAL), advisor to the government of Haiti for the prosecution of serious crimes, and Executive Director of the International Human Rights Law Group, He coordinated the ICJ 1997 report “Tibet: Human Rights and the Rule of Law.” From 1987 to 1992 he was director of the ICJ’s Centre for the Independence of Judges and Lawyers and then ICJ Executive Secretary. His 1984 investigation uncovered atrocities by the U.S.-backed “contras” against Nicaraguan civilians. He has taught courses on accountability for international crimes at Columbia Law School and the American University Washington College of Law. Mr Brody is on the advisory board of the European Center for Constitutional and Human Rights. His work has been featured in five films, including “The Dictator Hunter.”...
"Professor Sarah Cleveland – United States
A first term commissioner, Professor Sarah Cleveland (USA) is the Louis Henkin Professor of Human and Constitutional Rights and faculty director of the Human Rights Institute at Columbia Law School. She is currently a member of the UN Human Rights Committee, the US member of the Venice Commission, and former counsel to the US State Department legal adviser. She also serves as coordinating reporter of the American Law Institute’s project on the Restatement (Fourth) of the Foreign Relations Law of the United States."
https://www.icj.org/commission/commissioners-from-the-americas/
Why would we want to give due regard to the circumstances of minors? It's much more libertarian to make them all wards of the state.
Tony wants the right to groom children to sleep with him.
Sometimes I wonder Tony is the former mayor of Seattle.
Hey man, it was the 70s man.
I think there's an interesting tension in age-of-consent and other sex-based law that excites at the most relevant intersections of our politics in the liberty-based community. But I suppose that's probably why you can't talk about it without taboo police from both left and right calling you names.
Age-of-consent laws obviously aim to protect minors from sexual abuse (by way of deterrence). They're liberal-minded in that they respond to the interests of a vulnerable population.
But that's not where the liberty conversation ends, since the business of throwing people into cages is also a concern for liberals. I happen to be highly skeptical of the criminal justice system in this country, empirically the most punitive in the world.
But the fact that this subject is taboo makes potential victims all the more vulnerable. Who wants to stick up for registered sex offenders?
Alas, as liberals and libertarians, the state affixing a scarlet letter to someone after throwing them in a cage for who cares how long is not our conception of justice. We must interrogate the fairnesses and lacks thereof at every step. Otherwise, just go jerk off into a collection plate with the other moral simpletons.
Because I don't believe you only started being horny on your 18th birthday, and I don't believe you'd think it fair if you were locked up forever for having consensual sex with a 17 year-old when you were 18.
Jesus, you guys used to be counted on to be the pervs. Now it's all this hypocritical moral shaming business. I guess libertarianism really is dead. Who would have guess that it would die at the hands of a coalition of Christian conservatives and Donald Trump. You can't write this shit.
you guys used to be counted on to be the pervs
No, that’s just you, Jeffy, Buttplug, and Anastasia. You’re projecting.
Libertarians who feel guilty after masturbating. What is the world coming to.
Maybe a therapist could help you with that.
Libertarians despising pedophiles*
You're not a libertarian and I doubt you actually feel guilty.
I find most feelings more or less useless, don't you?
Only psychopaths see it that way.
I’ve said for years that Tony is a sociopath. Most progs are at least borderline. A truly empathetic person could never be a prog. Not unless they’re so stupid that they never se east the delusions involved.
Then clearly you can explain what use feelings serve.
If you can’t control your predatory impulses, there is chemical castration.
Why not use the Constitutional phrase "republican form of government"?
Stay at home mom Kelly Richards from New York after resigning from her full time job managed to average from $6000-$8000 a month from freelancing at home...
This is how she done it...................>>> http://www.jobsrevenue.com
Russia almost finished.
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/wagner-group-chief-calls-putin-declare-end-war-gain-firm-foothold-held-territories
Wagner Chief Calls On Putin To Declare End Of War, "Gain Firm Foothold" On Held Territories
"The ideal option is to announce the end of the special military operation, to inform everyone that Russia has achieved the results that it planned, and in a sense, we have really achieved them. We have ground a huge number of soldiers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and can report to ourselves that our task has been completed."
"Theoretically, Russia has already received this full stop by destroying a large part of the active male population of Ukraine, by intimidating another part of it that has fled to Europe."
Prigozhin went on: "Russia has cut off the Azov Sea and a large chunk of the Black Sea, seized a fat chunk of Ukraine's territory, and created a land corridor to Crimea," and stressed that Russia can "gain a firm foothold, cling to the territories that already exist".
But he noted that "If earlier Ukraine was part of former Russia, now it is an absolutely national-oriented state".
This comes as Wagner is spearheading the largely successful offensive to capture Bakhmut and surrounding areas of Donetsk region. At least 80% of the largely destroyed city is currently in Russian hands.
The Reason-style guide to parenting:
https://twitter.com/bhennrich/status/1646752765207810048?t=UY_xS4yP92YwJR3ssGQFOg&s=19
Amber & I have compiled a true emergency kit for Briana & her friends. Plan-B, condoms, pregnancy tests. Just found out that I can add Narcan for free to that kit. I hope we never need to use it. But it will be there. You can see if you are eligible
The best way to parent is to band together with other good,parents and expunge the democrat party from existence,
You're not wrong
Sadly, I’m not. The things that are coming are not really how I want to spend the next ten or twenty years. And all because of subhuman trash like Tony, Mike Liarson, Shreek, Groomer Jeffy, etc.. All because the leftist subversives in government and media stopped McCarthyism. Then the hippies filth spent the next several decades embedding themselves in government, eventually taking over the democrats.
Now we have a Marxist regime that absolutely has to be destroyed. Yay. With luck, they will be eradicated before it’s too late.
Read the replies.
Apparently his daughter is 12…
But even if she were 16, 18, hell early 20s it’s still awful parenting.
https://thefederalist.com/2023/04/12/u-s-corporations-cut-dividends-and-employees-while-dumping-billions-into-race-hustling-groups/
In tracking BLM contributions, we found many companies prioritizing ‘racial justice’ to the detriment of shareholders and employees.
Not that that article shows any connection between the two. It's not like AT&T was going to lavish dividends on everyone but for BLM donations. The Federalist did manage to use the term "race hustling," though, to prove its journalistic integrity.
Anyway, what do you think the government should do about corporations that exercise free expression in a way you disapprove of?
Tony...
What causes corporations to increase dividends? Is it profit?
How do political donations show up on a ledger? As a cost?
Is profit revenue - costs?
Work it out slowly buddy.
Maybe it was their judgment that public virtue signaling would increase their revenue. A sort of marketing campaign. They're allowed to fail at marketing, aren't they? Not that the article even shows that this campaign did such a thing. You're just bitching that they spent money on a cause you irrationally hate. Welcome to being a progressive in a world where corporations buy politicians in the name of free speech. Something you presumably are just fine with on any other day.
Progs bitch about this stuff as much as you do. There are terms like greenwashing and pinkwashing. Attempting to buy interest-group credibility with a little marketing.
But we could make this less of a free country and see how that works.
Or they could act in the best interest of the shareholders, like they are supposed to.
Contrary to motivated assertions by rightwingers, going woke does not equal going broke. Most corporations don't want to be associated with the hysterical bigotry of the modern conservative movement. There's so much more actual market money in appealing to young sophisticates. That's no accounting for Bud Light, of course.
So conspicuously not donating to BLM in 2020 might have very plausibly been the poorer pro-shareholder choice. I don't know, because the linked article doesn't provide any evidence on the matter whatsoever. Just some cherry-picked companies that both donated to BLM and were losing money for entirely unrelated market reasons.
Doesn’t matter what they wasted money on, they need be be held accountable for wasting money.
And which fascist pig would you put in charge of that?
So you’re suggesting someone from your party be in charge of this?
Nobody from any party should be in charge of forcing private companies to take certain political positions.
Shareholders
Diversity= someone who agrees with my left wing views but doesn't look like me
Equity=standards are based on tribe not tribe "blind" objective measures
Inclusion=economic rewards based on said tribe's numbers at each level of an organization with a healthy dose of sunk costs applied. Over representation of "victim" groups do not impact economic rewards if sunk costs are applied.
All we're talking about are what free corporations are doing with their free expression.
It comes with a cost if it’s not in the best interest of the shareholders
Tony, hating the things you support is the only way to be rational. You’re an evil piece of shit that supports evil shitty things.
Name something I support.
Lice.
Gun control, grooming of young children in government school, the Biden Crime Family. Just to name a few things.
I see where the confusion is. You're a barely functioning imbecile.
Jesse Jackson successfully extorted millions from corporations decades ago by threatening them with frivolous lawsuits. He and his family are all millionaires. The IRS under both Ds and Rs declined to investigate his Rainbow Coalition's tax exempt status. These days corporations piss away shareholder wealth just for virtue signaling ass pats.
Libertarianism doesn't work anymore.
https://brownstone.org/articles/what-bud-light-fiasco-reveals-about-ruling-class/
"The Bud Light case is especially startling because the advent of commercial society in the high Middle Ages and through the Industrial Revolution was supposed to mitigate against this sort of myopic stratification. And this has always been the most compelling critique of Marx: he was raging against a system that was gradually winnowing away the very demarcations in classes that he decried.
Joseph Schumpeter in 1919 wrote an essay on this topic in his book Imperialism and Social Classes. He highlighted how the commercial ethos dramatically changed the class system.
“The warlord was automatically the leader of his people in virtually every respect,” he wrote. “The modern industrialist is anything but such a leader. And this explains a great deal about the stability of the former’s position and the instability of the latter’s.”
But what happens when the corporate elites, working together with government, themselves become the warlords? The foundations of market capitalism begin to erode. The workers become ever more alienated from final consumption of the product they have made possible.
It’s been typical of people like me – pro-market libertarians – to ignore the issue of class and its impact on social and political structures. We inherited the view of Frederic Bastiat that the good society is about cooperation between everyone and not class conflict, much less class war. We’ve been suspicious of people who rage against wealth inequality and social stratification.
And yet we do not live in such market conditions. The social and economic systems of the West are increasingly bureaucratized, hobbled by credentialism, and regulated, and this has severely impacted class mobility. Indeed, for many of these structures, exclusion of the unwashed is the whole point.
And the ruling class themselves have ever more the mindset as described by Thorstein Veblen: only the ignorable do actual work while the truly successful indulge in leisure and conspicuous consumption as much as their means allow. One supposes that this doesn’t hurt anyone…until it does.
And this certainly happened in very recent history as the conspicuous consumers harnessed the power of states all over the world to serve their interests exclusively. The result was calamity for rights and liberties won over a thousand years of struggle. "
Much more here. Good read if you have the time.
Bud Light, like ESPN, and Sports Illustrated, and many other companies, made the cardinal mistake of forgetting who their customer is.
It's never a good idea to make things political when you don't have to. Alienating half your customers is stupid for any reason. Backtracking to alienate the other half just makes it worse.
I defend democracy with what I think is a fairly rigorous logic. I dearly wish that libertarians would, finally, come out and say what alternative they prefer so I could make counterpoints based on some actual points. I gather it's something like a constitutional system with a constitution that can't ever be amended in order to preserve their specific ideological economic framework? Wait, are we already in libertopia?
Anyway, my rigorous point is that democracy is good because people are stupid. Hence, dictators are stupid. Even if you have a supergenius moral paragon as a philosopher king, the next guy will inevitably be his coked-out failson. The same logic extends to oligarchies, even putting aside the concretely inevitable problem that oligarchies will tend to be ignorant of the needs of the many if not be outright hostile to them.
The most basic logic of fairness says that everyone gets an equal say and majority rules. Then you have to go beyond basic once you realize that the real world has factions beyond the political, and that majorities can perpetrate intolerable abuses on minorities. We can't escape the need for enlightened supermajoritarian barriers for some specific policies, though that concept obviously can be abused, such as with the filibuster. And I don't think there's a pathway to such protections without buy-in from majorities anyway. Perhaps we could due a purer democracy if not for Mason-Dixon divides that pit enlightened majorities against regressive minorities who are geographically separated.
You defend tyranny of the majority and disregard individual choice.
Do you have any self inspection towards your claim people are stupid?
I shouldn't be put in charge of the country either.
You're going to have to be more clear about what you're talking about. Individual choice with respect to government is most respected in democracy. Everyone gets an equal say. What could more respect the individual than that? For some people to get more of a say than others? I'm an individual, and my individual preference is that I should get my way and you shouldn't?
Majority rules ≠ tyranny of the majority. Actual tyranny implies oppression. So yeah when majorities pursue their own interests in a way that oppresses minorities, that's the very problem I so carefully addressed.
You shouldn’t be in charge of anything at all. You and your fellow travelers should be put down like the rabid animals you are. I’m generous though. I am willing to accept permanent exile for you scum to some awful shithole far away. Maybe Somalis.
They’ll love you entitled dim witted douchebags there.
All the freedom in here is giving me a whole-body cum explosion.
Your freedom ends where your oppression of Americans begins. You democrats are ultimately totalitarians. It’s now time for you to go. If you leave quietly, that will be the end of it.
In a democracy the majority will always choose market capitalism because it is in the best interest of most of the people.
Look at Europe for proof.
The worst governments are imposed by socialist or anti-democratic tyrants – see Asia, the Middle East, and Russia.
Market capitalism combined with a robust social welfare state.
Isn't it interesting that we struggle to label the very social structure that everyone wants and that succeeds the most with respect to human well-being?
This is why I'm allergic to -isms. If it has an -ism, it's probably bad and stupid.
Far less welfare. You need to get off your lazy ass.
Tony advocates for slavery so he can be a lazy fat fuck.
I hate to deprive you of a mindless, absurd talking point, or to note the irony of you calling anyone else lazy, but any old government program isn't necessarily slavery, especially when it's not slavery.
It’s a form of slavery to those saddled with paying for it.
Nope, it's just taxes.
Peoples wars are a hellva lot worse for the human race than "King's" wars.
A decentralized constitutional republic with competing currencies and a bill of rights is better than a "democracy" as democracy is pretty fluid based on who is running the show. Today America has a dictatorship of democracy just like the bolshies had a dictatorship of the proto.
"I defend democracy with what I think is a fairly rigorous logic..."
Example:
Tony|9.7.17 @ 4:43PM|#
"I don't consider taxing and redistribution to be either forced or charity."
Massive fail. Saying that democracy is the least bad way to arrange government doesn't mean that democracy is good, especially when you then claim that "majority rules" is a form of democracy, which is a dangerous lie! If democracy means that no one rules over the people, then a majority choosing the officials who rule over us, or the majority makes every decision for someone else to enforce on all of us, it's NOT DEMOCRACY!
Sure it is.
You don't always get your way 100% of the time when you live among hundreds of millions of other people.
Sorry?
An interesting article by Jean Hatchet
Kid Rock is a woman?
Men can’t be mad about the same things women are mad about
/tony
Yes, I'm so sure that all these sweaty conservative shitkickers have always been feminists and have always had a deep abiding interest in fairness in collegiate women's sports.
This is definitely not some absurd, desperate feminist-washing of plain old anti-trans bigotry.
So what do you want the government to do to trans women whose free, private behavior makes hetero Karens feel momentarily uncomfortable?
We have more respect for women than a vapid Marxist faggot, such as yourself.
By respect, of course, you mean you pick out their clothes for them so they have more time to put their feet up in the birthing bed.
I’m not even sure where you’re going with that lame retort. But then, you only have an 85 IQ.
Although I will say that as a straight man, I know what looks good on women better than a poof like you who hasn’t been in a vagina since he was popped out of one.
No one cares if a famous gay man or woman was on the can. The issue is this is a grown man pretending to be an adolescent woman and being very upfront about it. Sorry but a society has to draw the line between morality and degeneracy. Bud needs to fire all these elitist Ivy League wealthy assholes and understand not just their customers but human decency.
The CEO is *former* CIA...
He was probably an interrogator.
"Will you answer my questions, or shall I force you to drink another Bud?"
Whatever, TERFascist
/sarc
What should the government do to this person and/or Anheuser-Busch?
You people complain about things free individuals do with their freedom all the goddamn day, but you never say what should be done about it.
“What should the government do to this person and/or Anheuser-Busch?”
Nothing, unless they starting castrating and maiming kids. Why do you always assume that everyone else is like you, running to the government every time someone is being gross?
It's possible to be disgusted with somebody and mock and ridicule their stupidity, without running to daddy.
Yet you're conspicuously not bitching about all the things Daddy is actually doing with actual laws, even to the extent of banning books about queer people. For the children. This is a libertarian political forum, no? Why the fuck do I care about your psychosexual hangups and random daily annoyances? Tell me what you want the government to do or not do. That's why we're here.
What books have been banned?
I'm curious. Clearly this stuff doesn't make it to air, but does FOX News tell you straight up that you shouldn't use Google?
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/arts/book-ban-attempts-reach-record-high-in-2022-american-library-association-report-says
Name the title of one book that has been banned.
Contrary to the shrill tone of the article, none of the books have actually been banned. Maybe read your links before you post them.
You guys however, have been busily burning books. Would you like some citations?
Now trans activists burn Harry Potter books
and
School board 'regrets' burning books in the name of reconciliation
How many examples would you like, Tony? There's hundreds, you guys have been busy little beavers.
You people don't even have a lower mammal's understanding of the difference between private and state actions or the liberty implications thereof.
Tony|9.7.17 @ 4:43PM|#
"I don't consider taxing and redistribution to be either forced or charity."
The shitbag who posted this is accusing whom of what?
And desecrating popular books by editing them for political correctness. And stopping authors from writing the books they intended to by subjecting them to the approval of "sensitivity readers".
Is the state doing this or is it private actors acting privately in the way they want to act?
It's rather alarming how you guys don't understand the first thing about freedom, specifically the sort of freedom libertarians are meant to be most acutely focused on.
Name the title of one book that has been banned.
https://pen.org/banned-in-the-usa/#stories
Knock yourself out. Keep hold of that goalpost so you can be sure to defend fascists for not gouging children's eyeballs out.
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=all+boys+aren%27t+blue&i=stripbooks&crid=2GXKVQ441S729&sprefix=all+boys+%2Cstripbooks%2C115&ref=nb_sb_ss_ts-doa-p_1_9&tag=reasonmagazinea-20
"even to the extent of banning books about queer people. For the children."
Nobody's banned books about your favorite perversions and kinks, Tony. They have however stopped your creepy ass from sexualizing children, so I get your hostility.
You should sue FOX News for what it has done to your brain.
But they know you won't ever do that.
You’re the one always bringing up Fox News. It’s a sign you’ve lost your argument.
to the man pretending to be a "girl", nothing, to AB....don't buy their beer or seltzer.
National divorce is coming along nicely.
Nothing at all. But the marketing industry should blacklist this stupid cunt. Along with any other identifiable wokies.
The market is handling it fine dummy.
This person has 11 million Tiktok followers and, suddenly, orders of magnitude more fame.
You people are so fucking dumb.
There are 360 million people. Democrats and their SEL in schools have pushed the percentage of Americans with mental issues to around 20 to 30%. Your 11 million is in this subset. AB already lost 10 million in sales from one weekend and lost 4.5B in market cap.
But pretend tik tok followers is an economic indicator.
You have never been the brightest.
Just so everyone understands, the complaint here is that a transgender person exists, correct?
Yeah, I’m sure all those TikTok people are big domestic beer drinkers. You’re a moronic fool. If you’re going to do something like this, here’s how it’s done….
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8ocRGLvOKI
“Last one in is not a sissy!”
Sometimes stereotypes reflect reality, at least statistically/averages.
Astutely observed, but I think the important point is that we should resist the temptation to condemn entire classifications of humans collectively at all, or to condemn individuals for the actions of other members of that classification or stereotypes thereof.
You mean like when you call people "sweaty conservative shitkickers"?
Oh no, he doesn’t mean that. Leftist double standards and all.
Oh I've never been able to resist anything I like doing.
Then let's hope that someday soon you'll be in prison.
Just hit the bad thing you don't understand with a stick.
Force is the only way to deal with predatory psychopaths.
Oh we understand you. You’re a sociopathic deviant with a number of antisocial personality disorders.
Says the most persistent voice for genocide on these pages, and that's saying something.
How does recognizing common female behaviors amount to "condemning women"?
On how many occasions is it necessary for you to "recognize common female behaviors"?
Honestly, what kind of freakshow life are you people leading?
Former drug dealer on San Francisco: This place be fucking dangerous.
I'd pay $500 to watch this former drug dealer debate Mike Riggs.
Yes, to be precise, San Francisco is the 37th most dangerous city in America.
What an honor!
To think that their are 36 other democrat run cities even worse than the shithole SF has become. Well at least Tony can still get gangfucked at any of a number of bathhouses there. A practice even AIDS didn’t stop.
But you can’t shop at Whole Foods anymore………
https://sfstandard.com/business/downtown-san-francisco-whole-foods-market-closing/
What kind of "democracy" are we talking about? The USSR, Cuba, and China were/are all "democracies". The US was a democracy pre-Bernays, and then progressives came to power and followed the mantra that The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society.
So, which "democracy" are we talking about here? Majoritarian democracy? Dictatorship of the proletariat? Representative democracy? Constitutional democracy? Parliamentary democracy? Spartan democracy? Early 19th century American democracy? Direct democracy?
If by "democracy", you mean the progressive arrangement we have in the US today, where propagandists like Bernays manipulate mass opinion so that people vote in accordance what experts think is right, you don't have to worry about whether it is "good" or "bad" because it is simply not stable.
So, if you want to have a sensible discussion, first define what kind of "democracy" you are talking about, and then address whether it is stable or not. The question of whether it is better or worse is irrelevant until you have done both of those things.
I find it humorous both arguments cannot come out and actually say it but just kick rocks around the corner.
"Constitutional LIMITS on Gov-Gun dictation is what ensures Liberty. NOT democracy." --- Now was that so hard?
Stay at home mom Kelly Richards from New York after resigning from her full time job managed to average from $6000-$8000 a month from freelancing at home...
This is how she done it...................>>> http://www.jobsrevenue.com
https://twitter.com/Amphianda/status/1647334315062329345?t=2KpEDSqtDdDDNBLNBZqwgg&s=19
They don’t call it all Marxism/communism because back in the 40s the communist party was literally told by higher ups in the party (the puppet masters) to stop calling themselves communists, and call themselves progressive democrats instead.
Why?-
Because communists aren’t popular. Normal sane people don’t want communism and don’t like communists. Not to mention the body count “gives it a bad rap”
Instead of rethinking their ideology they just started masking over it, disguising it, and lying to people. They are creeps.
[Link]
Better dead than red. Kill a commie for mommy!
What's one vote worth? How about ten thousand dollars?
First, only let net taxpayers vote. (If you work from the government, or live on government checks, or your company lives on government money, let the real taxpayers vote on how the money should be spent.)
Second, for every net 10K you pay in taxes, you get one vote. Most people would get one or two votes, I suppose. People who are really funding the government would get a lot more. And why shouldn't they? Whatever happened to proportional representation?
Third, if you want more votes, you're free to donate more to the government, maybe even pay down some of the debt.
The wealthy famously evade taxes in this country to a monumental degree, so we'd have to do some careful accounting to see who really contributes what.
Also, here's a little secret. The government can function without taking taxes. It gives value to the money in the first place. That's not how any of this works.
So you're going to have to come up with some other excuse to give a handful of rich people control over everyone else, as if one can't have an interest in their own society unless they have lots of money.
The government can function without taking taxes.
Bring it on.
lol... As someone else said, "Don't threaten me with a good time."
Course this comes from Tony who thinks value can be printed.
"The wealthy famously evade taxes in this country to a monumental degree..."
Why is it that Tony makes a career of posting unsupported lefty bullshit?
BTW, here's a dose of what passes for 'knowledge' from the shitbag:
Tony|9.7.17 @ 4:43PM|#
"I don't consider taxing and redistribution to be either forced or charity."
To the contrary: the wealthy have very high rates of tax compliance.
No careful accounting needed. You get votes on what you actually pay. That's easy enough to determine. Those few wealthy people who cheat on their taxes and pay too little, well, they get less voting power. Clean. Simple.
Your fellow travelers wrote the tax code. So you voted for it.
It is true, as the old joke goes, that unconstrained majority rule is two wolves and a sheep debating what to have for dinner.
That is not true at all. Before you even get to the idea of majority rule, you have to share enough common interests to want a shared government. Wolves and sheep have nothing but opposing interests.
Citizens of the same country have a common interest in defending the nation from outside forces, a common interest in maintaining safety from violent acts within the nation, a common interest in maintaining economic conditions likely to benefit the majority of the population, and so on.
This joke overstates the idea it is trying to express to a degree that undercuts the point. A majority can vote to take unfair advantages of a minority, but the greater the advantages it tries to extract, the more likely that the minority will simply no longer consent to shared government. That is how a nation governed by majority rule could end up in civil war. I've only ever seen that joke used by people that really just don't like it when they aren't in the majority on a particular issue, not that they have a case that their fundamental rights are being threatened by a majority.
That’s partly because it’s a misquote. The old joke goes, “Democracy is two wolves and sheep voting on what to have for dinner.” That’s why it’s a joke, not a statement of policy. But if one insists on taking the premise of the concept seriously, the “unconstrained” part is absolutely true beyond all possibility of denial. There are two necessary and sufficient conditions for preserving the liberty of the people and the democracy that everyone seems to be paying lip-service to these days: Constitutional constraints on what one person or group can legally decide for and impose upon society; and an armed, trained and informed citizenry that, while perhaps disagreeing with their fellows on many more minor issues, nevertheless is committed to mutually defending the equal rights of each other under the law, preserving liberty for all. “If you can keep it” turned out to be sadly prescient.
What got me the most about it was when the authors refer to it as being true. If it is a joke, then it is only something to laugh about and maybe make you think. But what I still say that what I think about when I see or hear that joke is how it really misunderstands the point of democracy. The point of democracy is for people to vote over the relatively small differences on how to meet their shared interests. It is not for a majority to vote itself the minority's resources. Even now, with our differences seeming to be so large, our shared interests are still greatly outweighing them.
There are two necessary and sufficient conditions for preserving the liberty of the people and the democracy that everyone seems to be paying lip-service to these days: Constitutional constraints on what one person or group can legally decide for and impose upon society
The Constitution is still a decision made by a majority (even if it was a supermajority rather than just 50%+1), and it is only ever going to be as effective at constraining government as the people want it to be. That "one person of group" seems to determine how government in our country works far too often, and it is certainly not a problem of just one party or the other. Both have their cults of personality and political dynasties in office or seeking it, and and both have special interests and megadonors getting what they want instead of what the people want. It isn't that the Constitution only gets lip service that allows this, it is the voters themselves allowing themselves to be distracted from what is really going on.
and an armed, trained and informed citizenry
It is funny that the U.S. is basically the only liberal democracy that needs its citizens to be armed to secure liberty. The "informed" part of your statement is what is really important. That, and being "committed to mutually defending the equal rights of each other under the law," as you said. If a large supermajority of the population is truly committed to respecting each other's equal rights, then the minority has little to fear from a majority of the moment on any particular issue.
What gets us to that large supermajority willing to defend everyone's equal rights is for people to live by what I see libertarians often saying that they live by: a "non-agression principle". That is, don't try and use the government to control people when it just isn't your business what they are doing with their lives.
This is the evil piece of lefty shit who condones murder of the innocent as a preventative measure:
JasonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?…”
Imagine! Those proles might have gotten in there and put their feet on desks if someone wasn’t murdered!
Eat shit and die, Jason.
This is the evil piece of lefty shit who condones murder of the innocent as a preventative measure:
JasonT20
February.6.2022 at 6:02 pm
“How many officers were there to stop Ashlee Babbitt and the dozens of people behind her from getting into the legislative chamber to do who knows what?...”
Imagine! Those proles might have gotten in there and put their feet on desks if someone wasn't murdered!
Est shit and die, Jason.
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Democracy is absolutely NOT the worst from of governance. It's still a bad form of governance but not teh worst. It is possible in a Democracy depending on the citizens, for it to succeed where all citizens rights are respected and the majority don't pores the minority. The American based Amish movement is a perfect example of Democracy working but it's only because all involved share a common set of morale's.
With humans being humans there is NO PERFECT form of governance but there are those that are far better like a Representative Republic as we had in America. It took the crooks and criminals among the worlds wealthy elite a long time to corrupt the system and they only succeeded because they were willing to let it take generations instead of trying to rush it like you get with a revolution or a coup. Today America is nearly %100 infiltrated Representative Republic at least at teh Federal level. Thankfully because of hos the system was setup teh Feds have to contend with teh states and teh elite haven't fully infiltrated all state governments yet. It's expensive to infiltrate and co-opt a nations government let alone then do the same at every state level so we still have time to push back at teh State level.
If a libertarian agrees with Jason Brennan's position on democracy, then can he or she really support open borders? Needless to say, unchecked immigration ensure that the left has all kinds of numerical superiority to enact their Marxist agenda.
And keep in mind the unique nature of American society. It has enough foreigners who form their own nations, and thanks to any number of constitutional freedoms, they can form their own meta societies in many big cities. There they tribal arms of the democrat party and attempt to pass a number of ruinous policy in the name of their circle. "We need this guaranteed income for POCs only" You get the idea.
Remember Kevin Deleon and his Latino posse discussing how to break up black districts for the benefit of Latino councilmen? Fellow (non Latino) party members like Bonin became stumbling blocks for them. Oh, and the recall effort Deleon failed.
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The biggest problem with Democracy is idiots can vote themselves right out of it and into dictatorship. We see that happening with the left right now, they elected people that will bring us dictatorship.
The left wants to re-write the Constitution, end the First and Second Advancement and to arrest and imprison political rivals, or at the least keep them from running. The Democrat's tried to federalize elections while they controlled the Presidency, the Senate and the House so they would have total control over elections from the states so never to lose another election, thank god that failed. They also tried to make a liberal city a state and a liberal territory a state with no corresponding conservative territory (like when Alaska and Hawaii were made states). The border crisis is also another attempt to illegally change the demographics of the US, by letting in people that want government handouts, but sending home people that come from failed socialist states that would never vote for socialism again. The Democrats also want to pack the courts so every judge is a die hard liberal.
Remember we are have a two party system, so are always one party from dictatorship. If you think a socialist dictatorship of the left will be good, check history, every dictatorship has been an authoritarian and repressive regime. Eventually their supporters suffer as much as their political opponents, Check out the Bolshevik's "Terror" and CCP's "Great Leap Forward" and "Cultural Revolution" to see how you will fare. Also the Khmer Rouge, where if you supported the Khmer Rouge, but wore glasses you were put to death for being an intellectual. Think it can't happen here? You are very wrong.
Those weren't leftists violently storming the capitol building to overturn an election.
They were disgusting morons.
Next weeks debate: Libertarian government will eventually become the worst form of government and you should consider an alternative.
Jason really reallly missed the boat, even the ocean
It is NOT rule by majority. Much of the Federalist is meant to show this. And even the Anti-Federalists agreed. There is rule by law, not by men. Even 99% of voters cannot make a God-given right not be a God-given right. Madison was tireless and tiring !! in his talk about TYRANNY OF THE MAJORITY.
Read Harry Jaffa or Abraham Lincoln.
When Judge Douglas says that whoever, or whatever community, wants slaves, they have a right to have them, he is perfectly logical if there is nothing wrong in the institution; but if you admit that it is wrong, he cannot logically say that anybody has a right to do wrong.
--October 13, 1858 Debate at Quincy, Illinois
Is boiling whale blubber still a thing?
He probably likes the really young. Not based on physical attraction. Probably more because anything over age 11 can likely beat the shit out of him.
What do you care? You got what you wanted, the government forcing women to be slaves of the state. Libertopia is just around the corner.
How are they slaves?
It's Tony:
Tony|9.7.17 @ 4:43PM|#
"I don't consider taxing and redistribution to be either forced or charity."
You want "stupid"? Look no further.
If a woman gets pregnant, the state will force her to carry it to term.
You think paying taxes is slavery.
Two completely unrelated things. Shows just how sloppy your thinking is. And I use the term thinking loosely.
So paying taxes is slavery but being forced by the state to shove an unwanted rape baby through your vagina is freedom in action?