FBI Failed to Act on 2018 Tip About 2018 Shooter, Mitt Romney Runs for Senate, and Inflation Is on the Rise: P.M. Links

• 

  Laura Cavanaugh/Sipa USA/Newscom

  The FBI failed to act on a January 2018 tip about Nikolas Cruz, the alleged perpetrator of Wednesday's Parkland, Florida school shooting.

• Florida Governor Rick Scott calls on FBI director to resign.

• Mitt Romney announces Utah senate run.

• Senate immigration deal falls apart.

• Safety review of Baltimore subway finds 17 of 19 track segments unsafe.

• Inflation is on the rise, but stock markets seem not to care.

Comments

[Fist of Etiquette]

Mitt Romney announces Utah senate run.

Binders full of runs for office.

[Citizen X - #6]

His campaign bus has a dog tied to the roof.

[Rufus The Monocled]

Hello.

Apparently, everyone has 'blood on their hands'. The new pop phrase.

Reason go out and do what you do best....bring reason to the irrational.

[MarkLastname]

Having metaphorical blood on your hands means the angry mob can get your actual blood on their hands while keeping their metaphorical hands clean.

[Eidde]

So the bloodiness of the real hands is inversely proportional to the bloodiness of the metaphorical hands?

[Fist of Etiquette]

The FBI failed to act on a January 2018 tip about Nikolas Cruz...

But they'll totally get on confiscating his gun when it's banned.

[Domestic Dissident]

"Protocols were not followed."

[Don't look at me.]

Moar money needed for training.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Florida Governor Rick Scott calls on FBI director to resign.

Finally, someone taking Trump's side.

[This Machine Chips Fascists]

Trump hates him though because, you know, cueball. Disgusting and weak.

[colorblindkid]

Mitt Romney is about to go back to being an evil Nazi religious fundamentalist who wants to literally murder your grandma.

[colorblindkid]

Also has there have been a politician to be Governor and Senator of two different states? Kinda funny that one is often the most Democrat state and one is often the most Republican state.

[SIV]

Sam Houston

[colorblindkid]

You're right. I never knew he was governor of Tennessee.

[loveconstitution1789]

You assume residents of Utah are Republican.

Jesus was a socialist minus the violence and who knows what dum dee dum Joseph Smith was.

Its part of the reason the GOP are not fiscally conservative. They spend too much time on using the Nanny state to enforce social conservatism on people. War on Drugs for example.

[Eidde]

Socialism lacks a certain oomph without the violence. I would in fact say that it's not really socialism at all.

[DRM]

You assume residents of Utah are Republican.

No, he said, with absolute truth, that it "is often the most Republican state."

Utah, compared to all other states, had the highest percentage of the vote for the Republican presidential ticket in 2012, 2004, 1996, 1988, 1984, 1980, and 1976. That's 7 of the last 11 elections, "often" by any reasonable definition.

Similarly it would be accurate to say that it is often the least Democratic state, since it had the lowest percentage of the vote for the Democratic presidential ticket in 2016, 2012, 2004, 1996, 1992, 1988, 1984, 1980, and 1976, or 9 of the last 11 elections.

[Bubba Jones]

Bill Clinton was the first female senator from NY?

[Palin's Buttplug]

Mitt Romney announces Utah senate run.

He can tell everyone how great Romneycare is.

[John]

He can pick up the pieces after Trump is indicted for being a Russian agent. Come on Shreek, do not deprive us of the pleasure of your delusions.

[Fist of Etiquette]

Safety review of Baltimore subway finds 17 of 19 track segments unsafe.

Straphangers are getting nickel rides without law enforcement even needing to be involved?

[cgr2727]

Baltimore has a subway? Are the track segments unsafe because of some maintenance or engineering problem, or just because they're in Baltimore?

[Don't look at me.]

Someone screwed up and fixed two of them. Heads will roll.

[Conchfritters]

That's because 17 of the 19 tracks also have STDs.

[John]

Inflation is on the rise and stocks are getting more expensive. Amazing.

[Ecoli]

Smart aleck!

[AlmightyJB]

I know right

[Conchfritters]

I'm going to stab myself in the eye with a pencil if the 55 year old lady who sits in front of me at work says that again. All day: "I know, RIGHT?!?!???"

[Robespierre Josef Stalin Pot]

Isn't it your job John to tell us about how socialism in the form of unchecked federal spending is why we should run for the hills, stockpile weapons, and bury gold bars and MRA rations in a cave somewhere?

DUH DULLAH IS GOING TO BE WURTHLEZ BECAUSE DUMOCRATS ARE DUH TAX AND SPENDZ

Something isn't right with the above narrative.

[ThomasD]

What is not amazing is the Grauniad rushing to declare a rise in the PPI to be inflation.

The PPI is an indicator of potential inflation, but in and of itself is not a measure of inflation. A rise in PPI may be due to simple market conditions like reduced supplies or increased demand for given commodities.

[Juice]

When there is a general rise in prices for everything, it's safe to assume that it's because of monetary inflation.

[Drave Robber]

In other words, money is getting cheaper.

[steve walsh]

Jeebus, first we have broad based increases in wealth and now we're hit with inflation? If only someone could have seen that coming...

[Citizen X - #6]

The FBI failed to act on a January 2018 tip about Nikolas Cruz, the alleged perpetrator of Wednesday's Parkland, Florida school shooting.

Well, the FBI has been busy lately. Come on.

[BestUsedCarSales]

In the two days you were gone DD successfully convinced me that you and Crusty are the same person and also "Fruit of the poisonous tree", just wanted to let you know.

[Citizen X - #6]

Thanks for the heads up, man. I thought that's how it was going to go down.

[Ecoli]

What could the FBI have done?

No crime was committed, certainly no federal crime.

[John]

I am pretty sure plotting to commit mass murder or threatening to do so constitutes conspiracy to commit terrorism or terrorist threats.

[Ecoli]

You could be correct, but I see no plotting. There was bloviating about being a "professional school shooter". That sort of anti-social blather is all over the internet. Here at Reason there is often talk of chipping wood, for example.

[John]

That is true. It really should have been the locals who did something. The guy was nuts and should have been committed. At the very least there should have been a restraining order against him going to the school. That way if he had turned up there before the shooting, they could have thrown him in jail for violating the order.

[Ecoli]

Yes! Exactly. The local cops knew about this guy. The school district knew about him as well. There was a de facto restraining order against him at the high school, (remember the "no back pack" edict?) but it obviously did not work. It is hard to thwart crazy people.

[John]

They should have thrown him in jail the first time he was near the place. I bet anything he was there a few times after they knew he was crazy but before he did this. And we need to have involuntary commitment. When you have voices in your head telling you things like "go shoot up a school" you need to be committed.

[Ecoli]

I agree. There should be involuntary commitment, but even with involuntary commitment some crazies will slip through the cracks.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

*thinks of responding, taps sarcometer instead.

[ThomasD]

You 'bloviate' at the wrong person at the wrong time in sufficient manner and they just might be legally justified for giving you a double tap to center mass.

Not saying what this asshole said qualifies as a credible threat, but it is obvious the FBI didn't even bother to find out if it did.

[Sigivald]

"He said a bunch of juvenile aggro crap on various social media" ain't "conspiracy to commit terrorism" under Federal law, though.

Shall we invent some new precrime just for this purpose?

(None of it rose to the level of a particularized threat, as I understand it. It's not illegal - yet - to spout off about generally wanting to maybe kill people someday.

And it probably shouldn't be, considering how easy it is to fakepost as someone, eh?)

[ATXChappy]

As much as these guys like databases. You would think that all tips that come in are stored in one. Between this tip, and the YouTube comment where he used his actual name, they should have been able to at least question the guy. I've seen where they have charged people with terrorist threats for far less. I'm not saying that's what they should have done. But, if they looked into the tips that came in to them, it might have set off enough red flags that they could have done something. Like maybe charging him with bringing ammo onto school grounds so they could confiscating his weapons.

[Domestic Dissident]

There was a time not very long ago when obvious psychos like this guy were locked away in secure mental institutions where they belong. Today, we let them roam free until they kill a bunch of people and then we go "Whoopsy-daisy!"

Yes, the conditions in those places were often deplorable. But on the plus side, at least they couldn't kill any innocent people. I guess it's a trade off.

[55]

Dude, you'd be like the first one lobotomized if you keep pushing that envelope. Have you not seen One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest? Half you motherfuckers, myself included, would be at risk.

[Don't look at me.]

NOT ME!!! HAHAHAHA!

[Conchfritters]

The conditions were deplorable, but then most had a "chief" who could chuck a sink through a window, and then all of them leave en masse.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Trump's Deregulation Has Had Little Economic Impact, Goldman Says

February 12, 2018, 12:54 PM EST

https://goo.gl/K8mrRN

No shit, Goldman. But his idiots still believe it!

[Citizen X - #6]

Didn't get enough attention when you posted this on Tuesday, huh.

[John]

That is totally what a Russian sock puppet would say. Shreek is onto you.

[Palin's Buttplug]

I had to go to work, asshole. So I didn't see the replies.

It is just that good a link anyway. It deserves a daily posting.

[John]

Begging from people going in and out of the 7-11 in front of the dumpster where you live is not going to work.

[55]

Hey that seems like a hard way of making money. I see these fuckers standing in blazing sun inhaling car fumes all day and think to myself god damn dude just get a job because you're basically already working.

[Citizen X - #6]

A financial giant that benefits from regulations that keep its competitors down comes out against deregulation? No potential conflict of interest there!

[BestUsedCarSales]

It bothers me sometimes how much PB shills for large corporations.

[Palin's Buttplug]

A study by the bank found little evidence that "non-financial deregulation has had meaningful macroeconomic impact to date,"

[BestUsedCarSales]

So, does that mean financial deregulation has? Though it's also really suspicious of them to specifically not discredit the deregulation that affects their industry.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Didn't get enough attention when you posted this on Tuesday, huh.

Which KGB agent assigned you to sniff my ass every day anyway?

[loveconstitution1789]

Vladimir Poopin.

[Scarecrow Repair & Chippering]

That'd be just like the Russians, assigning a job which can't be done, cuz your ass is plugged up.

[John]

The economy took off when Obama left because God is a racist and wanted to make sure the black man didn't get any credit. It is just a damn shame.

And shouldn't you be out hunting Russians?

[55]

You may regret the economy heating up too much.

[loveconstitution1789]

Because the economy will correct and then heat up again?

[John]

Actually, I am glad you believe this. Just think Shreek, Trump is getting credit for you idol Obama's good work. He is taking all of the credit and Obama is just getting the blame. It is terrible. How do you live knowing that?

[Palin's Buttplug]

Trump is lucky to inherit a sound economy, with solid job growth, low inflation, a strong dollar, record high equity prices, and a deficit of only half a trillion.

He is fucking that all up though. The US Dollar is down over 10% in a year and inflation is coming.

[John]

He is so lucky. He is getting all of this credit and just pissing on Obama and people like you. He is going to spend 8 years in the White House thanks to people like you. Just think shreek, Obama is going to help get Trump re-elected. LOLOLOL

[Ecoli]

It is deeelishus, isn't it!

[Tony]

You people are insane children.

You know, not once during the 8 years of Obama did I ever wish for conservatives to feel bad about it. I never said "yum Republican tears."

Do you even care about policy anymore? You don't, right? It's all about the (R). Trump could raise taxes on billionaires and make abortion mandatory and you'd still be having orgasms to sociopathic thoughts that at least somewhere there's a liberal who's sad.

It's not normal, people.

[Ecoli]

Interesting point, Tony.

Not once during the 8 year agony did I suggest impeachment, try to destroy the presidency, or cover my face with a mask while punching socialists either. I think I am way ahead of you on the goodness scale.

[Tony]

Piker.

[55]

Trump has pretty shitty poll numbers, barely won the election last time and Hilary is old news so it doesn't seem rational for y'all to be so damn sure of a re-election.

[Ecoli]

Trump has higher approval rating than Obama at the same time in their respective tenure.

[Tony]

That's an outright lie. You're going by Rasmussen alone, aren't you? Just like Fox & Friends.

[loveconstitution1789]

Troll has shitty poll numbers according tot he pollsters who fucked up election 2016 and the media that hates Trump.

Many Trump supporters never take polls nor go to events. They just vote.

[Tony]

The polls were pretty good. The Electoral College is what fucked up.

[loveconstitution1789]

Electoral college worked as designed.

Commifornia and New York did not get to decide who would be president over 31 states that voted for Trump.

[Square = Circle]

You know, not once during the 8 years of Obama did I ever wish for conservatives to feel bad about it. I never said "yum Republican tears."

Umm . . . that's just completely untrue, what you said right there.

[Tony]

Not really my style. In fact I believe I encouraged you all to go enjoy yourselves with your cousins.

[Ecoli]

Something seems to be goosing the economy. Maybe deregulation is just a coincidence. More likely, it is just a reaction to the end of the long 8 year nightmare that the US just endured.

Agreed?

[John]

I am telling you. It is because God is a racist and didn't want to see a black man get any credit.

[EscherEnigma]

You may be joking, but American Christianity has a long history of literally believing that, using God's racism as justification for everything from slavery, miscegenation laws, segregation, and so-on. And while such racist religious rhetoric has fallen into disuse in modern times, I don't think it's unfair to suggest that the belief persists in many folk, even if they don't talk about it as openly as they used to.

That is to say... you may be joking. But there are literally folks out there that would no-nonsense agree.

[John]

Yes. And below Tony claims without any irony that "the markets are racist". So that tradition lives.

[Tony]

With irony John. It was a joke. Much like your attempts to pretend Trump is responsible for low black employment rates somehow when he couldn't even keep a casino open.

[mad.casual]

American Christianity

As delineated by the American Christian Church and drawing on the material from the American Christian Bible.

I mean, the Southerners quoted scripture and sang the Battle Hymn of The Republic while whipping slaves and the Northerners killed white Southerners and refused to hire slaves, leaving Black Southerners in the streets to die, but they did it entirely without quoting scripture. So, the association between America as a unified whole, Christianity as a unified whole, and Racism should be crystal clear to anyone who understands those topics.

Wait, I mean anyone with even a passing understanding of any of those topics should be able to recognize that you're full of horseshit.

Sure, there are fringe groups who use their religion to justify and espouse racism. They hardly represent anything uniquely American or broadly Christian.

[Tony]

You'd have to be monumentally uninformed not to know about how intertwined the institutions of Christianity and slavery were. In Christianity's defense, it's always trotted out to justify mass horrors.

[loveconstitution1789]

Tony, please tell us again how Democrats justified slavery?

[mad.casual]

You'd have to be monumentally uninformed not to know about how intertwined the institutions of Christianity and slavery were.

Even before the birth of Christ no less!

In Christianity's defense, it's always trotted out to justify mass horrors.

In proxy and post hoc too!

[BestUsedCarSales]

And it was also a major driving force and justifier for abolition. All you're really observing is that people used the most socially important document at the time to justify their preheld beliefs. It's like people arguing from the constitution here.

[Tony]

So it's the market that is racist.

[Ecoli]

Only indirectly. God's invisible hand, etc.

[John]

My God Tony, you are beyond parody.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

The market generally looks forward, not backward. Since Hillary wasn't elected, that means it's sexist. And possibly speciesist.

[Palin's Buttplug]

There is no evidence that the economy has been "goosed". The same trendlines are all in place.

I know the Dotard took credit for record low AA UE but it was 16% when Obama took the presidency and 6.8% when he left.

So 6% now is all credit for the Con Man?

[Ecoli]

Actually, it's around 4%.

Trump said he would make America great again, and he has.

Painful, huh?

[Palin's Buttplug]

AA (black) UE is 6%.

[John]

It is the lowest it has been in decades. Trump took office and a bunch of black people got jobs. What a racist.

[cgr2727]

Tangential, but funny nonetheless: a Swiss holding company finally got fed up with the labor shenanigans in Chicago and washed its hands of a bakery it owns there. Hundreds of Mexican laborers got rounded up in an immigration raid that everyone wants to blame on Trump, but it turns out the black labor groups ratted them out so they could take their places. More a comment on the rot of organized labor than the whole "build a wall" yammering, but still some good schadenfreude:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/.....story.html

Please excuse the fact I'm too lazy to google how to mark up a hyperlink instead of just pasting the whole thing.

[Ecoli]

And now it's the lowest it has ever been since records were kept. That fact did not seem to loosen the stick planted in Nancy's ass at the SOTU.

[Ecoli]

My apologies for not recognizing "AA" as African American. I thought you meant Affirmative Action.

[loveconstitution1789]

Or Assholes Acapella?

Or Amos and Andy?

[Bubba Jones]

There are a lot of people surprised to see that their take home pay jumped a few bucks last month. They are probably spending 110% of the windfall.

[Definitely Not Tulpa]

Yep. Big corporate banks are the most trustworthy sources of news.

[loveconstitution1789]

Goldmand only support TARP bailouts or other crony economic impact.

Otherwise he has TDS and crosses his arms in a little tantrum.

[Tony]

Can Mitt Romney run for senate in every state he has a house in, just to hedge his bets?

[Ecoli]

Worked for Hillary!

[Citizen X - #6]

Mexico's not a state, Tony.

[EscherEnigma]

But think of how many problems could be avoided if we annexed it.

We don't even have to turn it into a state, just let is remain in a weird limbo between statehood and territory, like Puerto Rico.

Heck, just go ahead and annex everything down to the Panama canal. Then we don't need a wall.

[Ecoli]

Also, don't forget the wall. It would be much shorter if we built it in southern Mexico, and cheaper too with Mexican labor.

[EscherEnigma]

Well at that point saying "Mexican labor" would be like saying "Texan labor", so it'd kind of lose it's sting.

[BestUsedCarSales]

I consider "Texan Labor" to be way more obnoxious than Mexican Labor.

[loveconstitution1789]

Its bigger too.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

If it's in southern Mexico, you should be using cheap Guatemalan labor. We're running a deficit, you know.

[Ecoli]

You must be an economist!

[Unicorn Abattoir]

Engineer. Way cheaper than economists.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Make Carlos Slim compete with Comcast.

[Conchfritters]

annex everything down to the Panama canal.

Then Tegucigalpa can overtake Chicago as the murder capital of the US.

[Stormy Dragon]

Florida Governor Rick Scott calls on FBI director to resign.

If this is bad enough to warrant the FBI director resigning, shouldn't the President resign too?

[BestUsedCarSales]

The only choice is to get rid of everyone and start fresh.

[loveconstitution1789]

Ten bucks says Tony would want Hillary to take the spot when they start fresh.

[Tony]

That bald homosexual is one of the slimiest Republicans ever to crawl out of the Florida swamps, and that's saying a lot.

[Palin's Buttplug]

I figured out your problem, Tony. You expect the taxes you pay to go for good causes and not to be squandered or stolen by assholes like Rick Scott and Cheetoh Dick.

That is very naive.

[Tony]

Well I'm just not a total cynic. You have to pay attention and elect decent people instead of insane, corrupt people. It's not like we're gonna ever be without politicians, and I don't think we'd want to be.

[loveconstitution1789]

Its always fun watching these two go at it.

Its like young Bernie and old Bernie.

[Tony]

Young Bernie is exactly the same as old Bernie, and that was a large part of his problem.

[MarkLastname]

Inasmuch as politicians have a purpose, it's to stand between people who earn their living and want to be left alone, and parasites and busybodies (such as yourself). They get a little graft, sing some pieties to assuage the morons, and the world slowly progresses.

When politicians do the bidding of busybodies, they've ceased to serve their limited purpose.

[Tony]

That purpose being to do the things you personally want for yourself and fuck everyone else's needs? Do I have libertarianism down about right?

[loveconstitution1789]

As a Libertarian, I say say fuck me and everyone else too?

Welcome to the Reason website, Tony. Let us know if you need help understanding what Libertarianism is.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

The FBI failed to act on a January 2018 tip about Nikolas Cruz

Is there any shooting conspiracy the Cruz family can't get away with?

[John]

That was awesome. Well played.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

I don't always post comments on Reason, but when I do... they're, like, funny, and stuff.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Nah man. If you ask me quantity over quality.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

I didn't need to ask.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Another benefit of my philosophy!

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

Another???

[BestUsedCarSales]

I give and give.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

As you must, since I ain't buyin'.

[GILMORE?]

Politico examines how ABC, AP, et al basically abandoned all reporting standards in effort to hype Nazi-connection

In posts to Gab, an alt-right social networking site, early Friday morning one user said that the Discord group "spent around 18 hours orchestrating, contacting ABC, being interviewed by reporters, etc."

Members swapped links to articles that identified Cruz as a member of ROF, celebrating each story and keeping a tally of media interview attempts.

"ABC messaged me. Asked to use my name in this article," wrote one user.

"This is spreading like wildfire," wrote another user, Renegade, after someone in the chat shared a link to the ADL blog post.

"All it takes is a single article," the first user wrote back. "And everyone else picks up the story."

ABC News reported that its reporters spoke with three "former schoolmates" of Cruz, but did not indicate whether these communications were over social media. A spokesperson for ABC News declined to comment on how its reporters vetted the identities of these purported acquaintances.

For clarity: ABC news "validated" a sketchy rumor found on unreliable social media site #1... by taking word of people from unreliable social media site #2 (who it turns out were coordinating efforts)

They printed story as tho they had interviewed "Former Schoolmates".

[Ecoli]

It will probably headlined at WaPo next.

[GILMORE?]

And the original story is still running, uncorrected, unmodified

""Three former schoolmates of Cruz told ABC News that Cruz was part of the group. They claimed he marched with the group frequently and was often seen with Jereb, who also confirmed to ABC News that Cruz was, at least at one point, part of that group.""

Professional Journalism: 'giving appearance of authority to some shit we heard on the internet'

[Don't look at me.]

Cutting and pasting tweets.

[GILMORE?]

*now they've completely deleted any record of the original story.

no correction, no retraction. it just didn't happen.

[Definitely Not Tulpa]

Well at least it's not that fake news stuff.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Who gives a fuck if Cruz was ROF, he wears a MAGA hat for crying out loud. He is a Trump-tard.

[Ecoli]

He also posed with an AntiFa mask. He is a Ellsion-tard!

[GILMORE?]

this isn't about cruz. its about ABC

[Crusty Juggler]

Useful information

[BestUsedCarSales]

Samoas/Caramel deLites & Angel's Envy Rye

I will definitely give this a try this year.

[Palin's Buttplug]

Jimmy Kimmel is getting to the GOP. They assigned Grand Poofter Mufti "Fat Rush" Limbaugh to spend precious AM radio time into assassinating his character.

Kimmel is not important enough, I would think.

[Ecoli]

Kimmel is an ass, and not a very good comedian to boot. Limbaugh is a much better comedian, and he has 15 hours of radio time every week, so "precious" seems inapt.

[BestUsedCarSales]

I like him as a comedian. He has a very dry, very sleepy delivery. Even way back on Win Ben Stein's Money he was a pretty good wit. Honestly, the only late night comedian I dislike as a comedian is Seth Meyer's who I think has just been consistently awful. I do not understand his rising star at all.

[Juice]

What's Jimmy Fallon? Chopped liver? No, chopped liver has more talent.

[Tony]

You'd think he'd be assigned to a lower-rent flapping jaw like Tucker Carlson or John.

[Palin's Buttplug]

John went after Kimmel in the AM Links.

[Tony]

That is valuable info. I'll stop accusing him of being a FOX News junkie since he keeps denying that he's ever heard of such a channel. I guess he's into the hard stuff!

[BestUsedCarSales]

Can't wait to see more of this Endless Waltz.

[Definitely Not Tulpa]

About as important as Limbaugh is.

[loveconstitution1789]

Who's Kimmel?

[MarkLastname]

You have an obsession, pal. You need help. I bet you never miss his radio show. Probably own all of his books too.

[Crusty Juggler]

I bet he drinks his tea.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Pussy shit compared to Alex Jones' Coffee

[Crusty Juggler]

TW: You may overdose on beefcake

[Crusty Juggler]

The Single Men of Ashley Madison

My take: never get married.

[Crusty Juggler]

Feminists are like libertarians with vaginas.

[BestUsedCarSales]

We're all feminists here, but none of has a vagina. How does that work then?

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

Cross-referenced with New Oxford and Merriam-Webster:

Libertarian
(lib-er-tar-ee-uhn)
(noun)
"a feminist without a vagina".

I hope this clears up any confusion.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

Slightly O/T

This AM on Morning Joe (yes, I watch), they were discussing the Florida Shooting with noted firearms expert Montel Williams. He stated that the .223 and .30-06 are actually the same bullet. Discuss.

[Crusty Juggler]

He was in the Navy and the Marines, so I think he knows his rifle calibers.

[loveconstitution1789]

The Marines are part of the Department of the Navy.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

Go up to a Marine and tell him that.

[loveconstitution1789]

As a sailor, I do all the time. They know its true.

Since 1834.

[Unicorn Abattoir]

You should consider retirement if you've been doing it since 1834.

[loveconstitution1789]

I was trying to be cool and post an answer to two posts in one.

Should have known better with this contingent.

[Crusty Juggler]

The Marines are part of the Department of the Navy.

WHAT! When did that start?

[Ecoli]

Yeah, it's the Men's Department!

[loveconstitution1789]

Men's that runs on beaches under fire.

I will get my 3 squares a day in air conditioning lobbing shells at the enemy, thank you.

[GILMORE?]

Here is the segment

a 30-06 is a 5.52mm bullet! that bullet will go through doors! nomenclature! hunting weapons!

[GILMORE?]

sigh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqT4YT53SLA#t=03m00s

[Unicorn Abattoir]

While I'm no gun expert, I'm pretty sure the 30-06 is more comparable to a 7.62, not 5.54.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

It is a 7.62. (7.62x60, I think, or something).

7.62x51/.308 Win, 7.62x54R, 7.62x39S, 7.62x25T, .300 AAC/BLK, and 30-06 are all .3 inches/7.62mm.

[Stormy Dragon]

Nitpick here:

7.62x51/.308 Win

Contrary to popular myth, 7.62x51 NATO and .308 Win are not the same round. It is possible to create a round that is within spec on both standards and could thus be used in rifles chambered for either, but that doesn't mean all rounds that meet one spec necessarily meet the other. In particular, .308 Win has a much higher maximum pressure spec than 7.62x51, which means using .308 Win ammo in a 7.62x51 rifle could cause catastrophic failure.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

I know that. But using 7.62x51 in a .308 gun works fine (at least in manual loaders that don't have to worry about cycling), so I'm also half right.

Is an Eastern Coyote a coyote, or a wolf? Answer: you don't have to choose.

#Schr?dinger'sCanid/Cartridge

[Mock-star]

Further nitpicking: The Russian .30 rounds - 7.62x54r, 7.62x39, and 7.62x25Tokarev (plus 7.62x38r Nagant) use a slightly different bullet diameter. IIRC, theyre bullet diameters read .311 on a caliper while NATO .30 calibers read as .308

[Mock-star]

*their* sigh

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

I'm pretty sure they're close enough that you can still fire them out of a .308" barrel. The bullets will swage, without blowing up the gun. I'm almost certain I've heard of someone accidentally shooting a .303 (actual width .312", according to Wikipedia) through a .30-06 without damage.

[Mock-star]

Oh, yeah, probably. I wouldnt count on any sort of match grade accuracy though.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

Only cowards attempt to engage targets from more than 15 feet away, anyway.

[loveconstitution1789]

What was that thing Montel did when waving his hand in a fist? Wuff, Wuff, Wuff

[BestUsedCarSales]

Ugh.

[loveconstitution1789]

Its no more ridiculous than him saying those were the same bullet.

[BestUsedCarSales]

I was saying Ugh cause that was Arsenio Hall.

[loveconstitution1789]

I know.

[BestUsedCarSales]

That's not a funny thing to joke about then. Nobody should ever laugh at Arsenio Hall.

[loveconstitution1789]

But he put the "O" in Arsenio.

[Unlabelable MJGreen]

The Persistence of Tyranny

Tyranny is not an abstraction. Tyranny is not faceless government. Tyranny is not some anonymous end boss to be defeated once and then confidently forgotten. Tyranny is us. Tyranny is our inclination to punish and oppress the other. Tyranny is our willingness to abuse our neighbor for not being on "our team." Tyranny is mouthing platitudes about liberty while cheering its suppression. Tyranny is our capacity to rationalize exceptions to rights for our enemies. Tyranny is our willingness to dismiss violation of rights as unimportant or minimal. Tyranny sold you your morning coffee, greeted you warmly as you walked into the office, made lunch plans with you, and will wave goodbye to you at the end of the day. Tyranny can be you.

Especially you.

[Crusty Juggler]

Shut up, cosmo faggot.

[Unlabelable MJGreen]

You're the end boss in my life, Juggs.

[Crusty Juggler]

This is no place for your cosmo lib thoughts.

[BestUsedCarSales]

It's a fair summary of why I believe we should depower the government. Man will not fundamentally change, I believe. The best we can do is mitigate the evils they do be deconcentrating the power they have to commit atrocity.

I sometimes look at the evil government does and the thing that scares me the most is that people look at it and think it's okay, because the government is doing it.

[Don't look at me.]

Building hideous weapons and declarations of war come to mind.

[Ecoli]

Building hideous weapons has been the well-spring of most technology.

[BestUsedCarSales]

It's fun to go over the Volokh articles and read the comments. They are way more on target and all around better than us here.

[loveconstitution1789]

The lefties that visit us also drop in over there. Its amusing because they are way out of their depth with the Constitution and legal rationale that is discussed over there.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Though we gained one of their trolls as well, so good for us. If you're here Reverend, make a post.

[Unlabelable MJGreen]

They'll feel stupid when we crack FISAgate over here.

[BestUsedCarSales]

I'm just glad that DD will not be shamed from slowing his righteous fury.

[Crusty Juggler]

Shut up, lib cuck loser.

[BestUsedCarSales]

Great, now I'm crying so much it's hard to eat all my soy for lunch. Thanks a lot, meanie.

[Sevo]

"It's fun to go over the Volokh articles and read the comments. They are way more on target and all around better than us here."
Agreed, but they are far more legally technical; 'way beyond my pay grade in that subject.

[XM]

The few really great things about having Trump as prez is that the hapless suits in the FBI know they can't just run to Trump for cover. Trump hates the FBI and he fired Comey, who was GREATLY admired by his peers. This man, who couldn't stop the Chinese was planting an agent in their building and did nothing to stop every single mass shooters he was tipped on.

"FBI admits it failed to meet protocol" That's the toothless headlines you see. Now I'm sure the MSM will jump into action and demand to review how the FBI investigated these would be mass shooters. Surely no porn watching desk worker improperly filed documents or fail to interview subjects? They took like 20 years to finally report on Weinstein, so eventually they'll expose how the government, not lax gun laws, failed the victims?

[Robespierre Josef Stalin Pot]

Today in ethnic cleansing:

Immigration officers took Nu?ez to York County Prison, where ICE holds immigrants it arrests and places in deportation proceedings. Nu?ez has requested asylum, based on the fear that gangs will threaten or harm him based on his sexuality if the U.S. deports him to rural Mexico. His sister, who is also queer, has gone into hiding in Mexico to avoid threats of violence.

[loveconstitution1789]

Sexual preference is ethnic now?

You lefties really will make up anything these days, won't you?

[Robespierre Josef Stalin Pot]

Nope, he's Mexican. Thus the reference to ethnicity. Good God, you guys have turned into some of the biggest sad sack defenders of the police state.

Duh, hez illegalz so illegalz are illegal. Perfect, libertarian.

[Tony]

So is this how it's gonna be? We're gonna do Trump's dirty work by getting rid of Wray because... guns don't kill people, FBI directors do.

What were they supposed to have done with the shooter once they got to him? Send him to prison for futurecrime?

Indeed, I wonder how much of a police state you guys would tolerate before you're OK with banning AK-47s.

[Don'tTreadOnMeChipper]

"Indeed, I wonder how much of a police state you guys would tolerate before you're OK with banning AK-47s." This is English, right?

[Don't look at me.]

Kinda, I guess.

[Robespierre Josef Stalin Pot]

It's time to talk about Juanita Broaderick and Obama's body count, Tony. Jesus Christ, don't you know better?

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

Whataboutism is only a logical fallacy when you don't hate both sides. Throwing out the 4A right to privacy is just as anti-libertarian as throwing out the 2A.

[Don'tTreadOnMeChipper]

"What were they supposed to have done with the shooter once they got to him? Send him to prison for future crime?" I dunno, maybe talk to him and his parents? Maybe encourage counseling?

[Tony]

And surely take away the mass death machine in his possession?

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

And while they're taking the laundry bleach and quicklime, kerosene cans and lighters, and minivan, they should probably take the gun too.

[Tony]

Defend your shit with a minivan how about.

[Brendan]

Dumb ass.

Mass murder and self-defense are two very different things.

[Tony]

I know. Apparently one can be only achieved with guns while the other can be equally achieved with any household object.

Guns literally magically become efficiently killing machines only when used for self-defense. Otherwise they're just like any other blunt object.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

They only become "magically efficient killing machines" in unplanned situations.

An attacker can choose the circumstances of his attack: when, where, how soft a target, how far away the target is, etc. That means he doesn't have to choose a specific weapon- because he can adapt his circumstances to his weapon, in line with said weapon's capabilities.

Whereas a self-defender has to adapt their weapon to their circumstances, because they DON'T get the luxury of deciding when the attack happens, how well-prepared the attacker is, and whether or not reinforcements (eg cops) are close by. Meaning they A, need a weapon that is portable for 24/7 availability (eg a pistol), B, need a weapon with range (so that they don't have to close the distance with a physically larger attacker- less relevant for men, life-or-death for many women), and C, can immediately engage multiple opponents (because real-life muggers and home invaders routinely attack in groups of 2 to 4).

Not that I even need to explain this- did the Nice attack not happen in the world you inhabit? Effective means of method displacement are not theoretical.

[Telcontar the Wanderer]

And once again Tony reinforces my argument without, evidently, realizing that he is doing so.

[IceTrey]

I don't think he had a car.

[IceTrey]

If you see something, say something so we can ignore you.