Here's an unexpected nugget of news in Hillary Clinton's new memoir: At the outset of her last presidential campaign, she thought about calling for a universal basic income. But she rejected the idea when she realized the only ways to afford it involved either "a lot of new taxes" or "cannibalizing other important programs."
Here is the relevant passage from the book, viaVox:
Gage Skidmore/Flickr
Before I ran for President, I read a book called With Liberty and Dividends for All: How to Save Our Middle Class When Jobs Don't Pay Enough, by Peter Barnes, which explored the idea of creating a new fund that would use revenue from shared national resources to pay a dividend to every citizen, much like how the Alaska Permanent Fund distributes the state's oil royalties every year. Shared national resources include oil and gas extracted from public lands and the public airwaves used by broadcasters and mobile phone companies, but that gets you only so far. If you view the nation's financial system as a shared resource, then you can start raising real money from things like a financial transactions tax. Same with the air we breathe and carbon pricing.
Once you capitalize the fund, you can provide every American with a modest basic income every year. Besides cash in people's pockets, it would also be a way of making every American feel more connected to our country and to one another—part of something bigger than ourselves. I was fascinated by this idea, as was my husband, and we spent weeks working with our policy team to see if it could be viable enough to include in my campaign. We would call it "Alaska for America." Unfortunately, we couldn't make the numbers work. To provide a meaningful dividend each year to every citizen, you'd have to raise enormous sums of money, and that would either mean a lot of new taxes or cannibalizing other important programs. We decided it was exciting but not realistic, and left it on the shelf. That was the responsible decision. I wonder now whether we should have thrown caution to the wind and embraced "Alaska for America" as a long-term goal and figured out the details later.
The basic income has libertarian fans too, but in liberland "cannibalizing" other arms of the government is a feature, not a bug. You replace a bunch of separate bureaucracies with a single, simpler, less intrusive, and (if the numbers work out right) cheaper program. That's the big draw. I don't suppose it's news that Hillary Clinton isn't Milton Friedman, but it's telling that she saw this as a dealbreaker.
It's possible that another Democrat will embrace some version of the basic income in the 2020 race. But not Joe Biden: Today the former vice president published a blog post attacking the idea. Instead of cutting checks with no strings attached, Biden wrote, the government should be "recognizing that 12 years of school is [sic] no longer enough" and putting more money into job retraining.
Bonus link: For a deep dive into the history and prospects of the basic income, in all its mutually exclusive incarnations, see my story on the subject in the July Reason.
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I wonder now whether we should have thrown caution to the wind and embraced "Alaska for America" as a long-term goal and figured out the details later.
When buying the presidency, it's important to guess correctly what price point the voting public will settle on.
In this case, unlike say climate change, that's because it's not actually a problem, but the fixation of some kooks who don't understand that the economy has moved on since the days of little purses with gold coins you wear on your belt.
You are so fucking stupid it beggars the imagination. Which explains why you have not drank your Drano yet. Probably getting confused on your way to the kitchen. Maybe you should just walk into a busy street until a car hits you at high speed.
Someone else's assets. Like granny's social security.
Well, in the sense that "granny's social security" is a commitment by government to screw over future generations in a pyramid scheme. Assets, however, those are not.
Tony -- what are your thoughts on paying the debt interest? As the debt grows and/or interest rates rise, so do the debt payments. Don't you think that is a problem? If not, why not?
a new fund that would use revenue from shared national resources to pay a dividend to every citizen
Yeah, I've got a pretty good idea what these "you didn't build that" folks consider to be "shared national resources". "The air we breathe" ought to give you an idea where they're coming from. It's been said before.
Libertarian thinkers do not seem to quite get that complex, intrudive bureaucracies are a feature, not a bug, to the current system. They have no incentive to replace entitlements with a simpler UI system, that would contract their power.
If you view the nation's financial system as a shared resource, then you can start raising real money from things like a financial transactions tax.
Financial transactions, they're pretty much like the air we breath, right? Not like anybody owns that stuff. Private property is just an obstacle to egalitarian utopia. And when we start confiscating it, nobody will change their behavior or anything like that. People aren't that attached to their life's savings!
The more we know about Hillary Clinton, the better Donald Trump looks, and making him look better is no small accomplishment. She's one of the crookedest, least principled politicians we've seen in modern times; she makes Bill look like a piker. Look in the encyclopedia under "hyena" and you'll find a picture of her. Hillary the Hyena! That's it, and she laughs like one too.
Literally the old good thing about a UBI is that it will replace inefficient government crap. Most libertarians support it as the lesser of two evils.
But to this person, that's the PROBLEM of the UBI! Is that it will make all of those government programs and democrat voters smart hard-working bureaucrats unemployed.
well, he did say 'lesser of two evils' and if you put a gun to my head and make me choose, I'm going with a no-strings-attached UBI as opposed to what is going on now....
Total spending on anti-poverty spending at the local, state, and federal level is about $1 trillion dollars annually, not including Social Security, Medicare, or unemployment benefits. Divide that by the poorest 33.3% of Americans, and that comes out to be a little over $8,800 annually on average per individual, or $26,400 on average for a family of three in the bottom third. Again, this is excluding Social Security, Medicare, and unemployment benefits.
There is more than enough money spent on anti-poverty programs. There clearly does not need to be an increase in anti-poverty spending.
Universal Basic Income is just that, universal. Everyone gets it, regardless of income. Your proposal is more along the lines of a negative income tax, which is more feasible/better IMO (depending on the design - in theory, a negative income tax could have relatively bad consequences compared to UBI if the effective marginal rates were high enough).
Also, I'm guessing that number includes Medicaid. I don't think anyone in the mainstream is going to go for replacing health care programs with cash benefits. Even compared to the already low probability of replacing other programs like TANF or food stamps.
Poor Jeb. How about that stupid smile whenever Trump would attack him on the debate stage? It was almost as if the poor boob doesn't know how to get mad or angry. I can't imagine any of them on that stage getting mad enough to appear as disgusted with Trump as he was with them. Jeb was the least among them, and that's a very, very small accomplishment.
Those who think a Universal Basic Income will replace multiple layers of welfare as as naive and silly as those who think the Fair Tax would replace the income tax. It's only going to last until the next congress seats itself.
Show me evidence that government at any level can manage to cut anything, and then I might pay some attention to your fantasy plan. Until then it's just another layer of pancake makeup on the pig of government.
p.s. You can fix both problems (high taxes and low income) with one simple idea: Combine the flat tax with a large standard deduction. Zero taxes on anything less than 50,000, flat percentage on anything above that. Any remaining problems can get dealt with at the state and county level.
I prefer the Alternative Maximum Tax. Once your federal tax bill hits $10,000, you don't owe any more. And if you're paying the max, you don't have to provide any details of your income or deductions. Just send in the check and indicate which year it's for.
"Those who think a Universal Basic Income will replace multiple layers of welfare as as naive and silly as those who think the Fair Tax would replace the income tax. It's only going to last until the next congress seats itself."
This is 100% correct. But, when discussing *theoretically*, a UBI is clearly superior to the bureaucracy of social programs we have today.
Those who think a Universal Basic Income will replace multiple layers of welfare as as naive and silly as those who think the Fair Tax would replace the income tax. It's only going to last until the next congress seats itself.
We could simply do what European countries like Germany do, countries that Democrats like to point to as examples of good, progressive government: Germany replaced multiple layers of welfare with a single monthly benefit of a maximum of $490 plus rent assistance. But you only get that when you are out of work, and unless you are disabled, you need to show up at "job centers", take job training, and take jobs that are offered to you.
Proponents think the UBI is the path to Star Trek TNG. In reality, the UBI is a great idea if you want to create a permanent underclass and continue the drift towards Idiocracy. See what happens when you extend unemployment benefits indefinitely, offer generous welfare or disability programs. It starts as a safety net and a hand up and quickly becomes a lifestyle.
And if you think income inequality is a problem now, wait until you have 3rd generation UBI families.
"And if you think income inequality is a problem now, wait until you have 3rd generation UBI families."
If you thin TLAH is joking"
"Protesters shut down Pelosi news conference on DACA"
[...]
"Chanting pro-immigrant slogans ? "All of us or none of us," "Democrats deport" and "We are not a bargaining chip" ? more than 60 young people overwhelmed a news conference that House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi had organized Monday..." http://www.sfchronicle.com/new.....206788.php
First, the thing is called "Delayed Action..", so even if it was kept as-is, the action is going to happen (assuming the law is followed)
Secondly, Obo 'decreed' it in violation of the constitution, and Trump is simply handing it back to congress where it belongs.
Thirdly, pro-tip: "All of us or none of us" is a VERY bad slogan to use while you're trashing the presser of one of your allies. That "none" will begin to look very attractive to more and more people; Trump didn't win for no reason.
Robespierre Josef Stalin|9.18.17 @ 9:11PM|#
"How many troops should we station at the Mexican border to keep out immigrants looking to work in mutually beneficial economic relationships, slaver?"
You are an ignoramus, commie kid.
I'm one of the 'open boarders' guys here, you fucking idiot. I was pointing out that the other idiots in the 'protest' are not helping their cause.
Oh, and fuck off, slaver.
to keep out immigrants looking to work in mutually beneficial economic relationships
Mutually beneficial to big, well-connected businesses and their Mexican indentured servants, subsidized by tax payers who need to put up the money for the education, infrastructure, and medical care that keep the labor costs down for those Mexican indentured servants.
slaver
Your signature is correct: a f*cking slaver is what you are.
How many troops should we station at the Mexican border
As many as it takes to keep our borders secure. After we abolish the welfare state, we can remove them.
I won't lie. I can't help but smile every time I think of her with nothing to do but think about her failure. The depths of her soul searching with the all knowing answer constantly nagging her at the back of her conscious.
I once met an unfortunate woman who had messed up her life with bad decisions and spoke to at-risk kids to scare them straight - "don't end up like me!"
Maybe Hillary could do something like that - except instead of "don't end up like me" it could be "this is what you'd have ended up with if you'd voted for me - stay away from Democrats, kids!"
I'm with you, Cy. I've never grinned so broadly nor laughed so hard inside, as I do every single time I think of her losing the election to Donald Trump. Part of the humor is simply knowing how she'll never comprehend it for the rest of her (hopefully) very, very long life.
I wouldn't wish for her to have much life at all; she's out and about now making some noises about how the election is not valid; never mind that there is absolutely no constitutional provision for invalidating a presidential election that has been certified by the electors, it just needs a little lawyering and some discussions of what the meaning of is is, and stuff like that. She and her followers would have no problem with that whatsoever.
I worry that just like a corpse in a horror movie, Hillary's foul, unclean, decaying political corpse come back to life and haunt us for years to come.
I wish she had run with this as one of her promises. Then the name of her book would have been WHAT THE MOTHERFUCK HAPPENED! as she would have lost by double digits.
My tarantula is named Jobo. I play with the bristly fellow often mostly at night when I get fucked up on cocaine, dreams, or buckets of ipppa. I let Jobo run up and down my body mostly because I imagine his or her legs to be deep sea tentacles tenderly going about the surging orifice that is my entire heaving cell storm. He or she chews and nibbles on my nipples and its shed skins always pile up near my toes but I still can't figure out what the fuck sex this bitch is. I noticed after playing with Jobo my cum is super strong and sinewy. I think I get infected with spider genes momentarily. I blew a huge load recently that splashed above the lamp and Jobo climbed upon this celestial strands and danced a tarantula fiddle and the dim lights gleamed in all its eyes and I went outside, climbed into a spaceship, held the door open for Jobo, and flew off under monopoles and megadreams.
It would take at least a constitutional amendment to prevent UBI from being abused as just another welfare program, and even a constitutional amendment might not work, given the propensity to find workarounds.
"We decided it was exciting but not realistic, and left it on the shelf. That was the responsible decision. I wonder now whether we should have thrown caution to the wind and embraced "Alaska for America" as a long-term goal and figured out the details later."
If only she'd demagogued harder instead of being so darned responsible!
Don't worry, your demagoguery was first-rate as it was.
12 years of school is too much. At least two years of that is just young adult babysitting. Anyway, like Rick Sanchez says, school isn't for really smart people anyway.
It occurs to me that if the Dems do push through some UBI, they will be most helping the rural and flyover people they despise so much and most hurting the rich leftists they love so much. They're too class-sensitive and afraid of inequality to differentiate the base income by region or localized median income, so it will probably be the same everywhere. Their left coast and Northeast friends will get a paltry $15K a year, which is meaningless when rents push $3K a month, while rural folk will get enough for house payments.
Hmmm...OK, require recipients to perform "national service" projects assigned by local politicians. In Blue cities, this will mean registering Democrats at election time. In Red areas, it might involve some actual work, thus deterring more people from signing up.
See how easy that is? Screw the rural bitter clingers and avoid the blame.
they will be most helping the rural and flyover people they despise so much and most hurting the rich leftists they love so much
The rich leftists they love so much have so much money and so many opportunities for tax avoidance that it doesn't matter to them. And rich as they are, they don't have enough money for this.
The people paying for this will be the middle class, because that's where the money is. That's how Europe finances its welfare state: the middle class pays for the welfare of both the lower and the middle classes. "The rich" actually often end up being taxed less in much of Europe.
She's a serial killer along with Bill
but sweet elite Harvard neighborscapes
across all the gentle fences where
socialists and communists gather
somehow discover a scrappy picnic
on an Irish vacation whereupon they
determine tons of people die...
Like ALL world wars start in an Irish
bar but no one tells you this.. because
very few people in real world America
are Catholics... actually, if you talk
to Marks while getting your fucking
Avalon serviced in middle America
even HE, the country Catholic sez he
is Catholic like he has fucking
cold sores on his toes
Hillary kills People Along with Bill
like Catfish bakes
and no one understands where all
the bodies are and why
these fuckers have brains that
don't work and retire in Tijuana
where ashes and vodka runs
like forever hooves and tits bobbing
under red moons
If you want to become the best
chopper up of humans and the
ultimate fucker of dead bodies
study the Clintons ...and maybe the
Bushes... and, perhaps, Reagan
and also... Congress
This world you think is so goddamn
sweet if the lid was lifted off
would result in tons of snipers
shooting through street numbers
impossible to remember
North Korea has shit
North Korea kills scarecrows
North Korea has nothing to worry about
The establishment is creating a fucking
theater of worry
Create a span of worry over public
consumption and they
get loose goosey with money or....
they actually... DO NOT... because
the FUCKING military in this country is fucked and corrupt
and disgusting and goddamn TRUMP should check their shit
World War 3 is a big world code game
created by fucking super establishment
grove fucks in the Owl brigades
I GET that this fake shit about North Korea and crap
plays well for some crap bulldog balls
but not for me....
TRUMP, why are you fucking loading your team up with
the most fucking planetary killers ever called AMERICAN
BEAST GENERALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOTHING ON EARTH compares to a dick wiggling Patton
which infuse all these things...
Incorporate poets and artists and thoughtful physicists
PLEASE do not rely on Military Supermans
Everyone understands Bill Gates that shit billionaire got super rich employing millions of morons who can't make crap work... Bill Gates got rich gathering shit fuckers making shit fucker software for shit fuckers..
Bill Gates got rich being so fucking loco capitalism didn't expect his socialist ass showing up... but peace out on his shit and getting all embedded in Modern Murican dick blow all over the fucking plates and old Japaneses kneel downs because get ready our shit is tight and when the bombs fall I promise you fucking deep earth politicians ME and a bunch of intense dudes aren't going to be as peaceful when we find you under and behind the melted hives you planned on Cambridge chalkboards, bro.
Make society work, McCain you shitty brain cancer fuck or McConnel will act just like you and Baked Alaska.. shitty as ever... and weepy as ever...
Antifa is Pelosi sadness
Antifa is horribly unaware its queen is brain dead
Antifa also doesn't understand that no one watches
their captive crap channel now called CNN and CBS and shit
tears and butt spew
but underneath it all none of these people care about
freedom, love, peace, and rising above the forces that crush humanity
because they are all about war, violence, and dragons
Freedom is the end of government chains
Freedom is not condoned by most world gangs called governments
Freedom IS the wings of humans
Freedom does require the use of self defense
and fences
Freedom is generally hated by oppressive
shitty hellacious governments- Germany comes to mind
There is no Freedom under Merkel
There is no Freedom under May
There is no Freedom under Europe
There is no Freedom under Jinping
There is no Freedom under Putin
There is no Freedom under Enrique Pe?a Nieto
Freedom is dying on planet earth and no one seems to give a goddamn fuck
It's possible that another Democrat will embrace some version of the basic income in the 2020 race. But not Joe Biden: Today the former vice president published a blog post attacking the idea. Instead of cutting checks with no strings attached, Biden wrote, the government should be "recognizing that 12 years of school is [sic] no longer enough" and putting more money into job retraining.
Well fuck. That's almost a bad idea I could live with. No wonder this old-timer had no chance of getting the nomination.
I am against this, but I think it would be illustrative to people who believe in welfare. It could demonstrate how peoples financial situation is mostly a result of their decision making.
I wonder now whether we should have thrown caution to the wind and embraced "Alaska for America" as a long-term goal and figured out the details later.
When buying the presidency, it's important to guess correctly what price point the voting public will settle on.
Yeah turns out having numbers to back up your campaign promises wasn't so hot this time around.
Yeah, numbers like the 20 Trillion dollar debt that nobody wants to hear about, and nobody not named Paul was even interested in discussing.
In this case, unlike say climate change, that's because it's not actually a problem, but the fixation of some kooks who don't understand that the economy has moved on since the days of little purses with gold coins you wear on your belt.
Unlike climate change, the debt is real though.
You know what another word for debt is? Someone else's assets. Like granny's social security.
You are so fucking stupid it beggars the imagination. Which explains why you have not drank your Drano yet. Probably getting confused on your way to the kitchen. Maybe you should just walk into a busy street until a car hits you at high speed.
Yes, a hidden tax obligation.
Well, in the sense that "granny's social security" is a commitment by government to screw over future generations in a pyramid scheme. Assets, however, those are not.
Cash in someone's pocket isn't an asset?
Never thought of it that way. I do consider the cash in someone else's pocket my asset now. Thanks, Tony.
Google searching, how do I mug people 101.
If the dead if "not actually a problem", why not just go to eleventy trillion then?
ha! Great typo. dead == debt
Because debt hawks won't let us, bless their hearts.
Tony -- what are your thoughts on paying the debt interest? As the debt grows and/or interest rates rise, so do the debt payments. Don't you think that is a problem? If not, why not?
It's all about the FEEEELZ!
a new fund that would use revenue from shared national resources to pay a dividend to every citizen
Yeah, I've got a pretty good idea what these "you didn't build that" folks consider to be "shared national resources". "The air we breathe" ought to give you an idea where they're coming from. It's been said before.
I'm assuming she means nationalizing the oil wells, like Venezuela did. That worked out fine.
Libertarian thinkers do not seem to quite get that complex, intrudive bureaucracies are a feature, not a bug, to the current system. They have no incentive to replace entitlements with a simpler UI system, that would contract their power.
Progressives have no incentive to simplify the system, that is.
It's this kind of conspiratorial horseshit that keeps the status quo in place, you know.
That wsd Clinton's reason for rejecting the idea.
She said she couldn't make the math work without eliminating (presumably) social health insurance programs.
I'm sure Tony never attributes unsavory motives to his political opponents.
The entire purpose of all the myriad "programs" is to CONTROL the poor, not to help them.
Financial Transactions Tax
Because everything you do anywhere is subject to theft by the government
You are a resource owned by the government, the only question is how fast they want ro extract it.
Note also:
"Same with the air we breathe and carbon pricing."
She was going to start taxing the air we breathe!
Smoke 'em if you got 'em; cuts down on the air you breathe.
Financial transactions, they're pretty much like the air we breath, right? Not like anybody owns that stuff. Private property is just an obstacle to egalitarian utopia. And when we start confiscating it, nobody will change their behavior or anything like that. People aren't that attached to their life's savings!
The more we know about Hillary Clinton, the better Donald Trump looks, and making him look better is no small accomplishment. She's one of the crookedest, least principled politicians we've seen in modern times; she makes Bill look like a piker. Look in the encyclopedia under "hyena" and you'll find a picture of her. Hillary the Hyena! That's it, and she laughs like one too.
That is an uncalled for slur on hyenas. Not acceptable. Try Komodo Dragons.
Literally the old good thing about a UBI is that it will replace inefficient government crap. Most libertarians support it as the lesser of two evils.
But to this person, that's the PROBLEM of the UBI! Is that it will make all of those government programs and democrat voters smart hard-working bureaucrats unemployed.
ANd by "most libertarians" you mean no one who is really a libertarian at all.
well, he did say 'lesser of two evils' and if you put a gun to my head and make me choose, I'm going with a no-strings-attached UBI as opposed to what is going on now....
it will replace inefficient government crap
No, it won't. It will provide the pretext for yet another round of bureaucratic hiring.
-jcr
Total spending on anti-poverty spending at the local, state, and federal level is about $1 trillion dollars annually, not including Social Security, Medicare, or unemployment benefits. Divide that by the poorest 33.3% of Americans, and that comes out to be a little over $8,800 annually on average per individual, or $26,400 on average for a family of three in the bottom third. Again, this is excluding Social Security, Medicare, and unemployment benefits.
There is more than enough money spent on anti-poverty programs. There clearly does not need to be an increase in anti-poverty spending.
Universal Basic Income is just that, universal. Everyone gets it, regardless of income. Your proposal is more along the lines of a negative income tax, which is more feasible/better IMO (depending on the design - in theory, a negative income tax could have relatively bad consequences compared to UBI if the effective marginal rates were high enough).
Also, I'm guessing that number includes Medicaid. I don't think anyone in the mainstream is going to go for replacing health care programs with cash benefits. Even compared to the already low probability of replacing other programs like TANF or food stamps.
If we had a universal basic income of $8k per capita, I think I would expect my taxes to go up enough to offset it.
We can't afford any program that gives even the "rich" an extra $32k per year.
Who cares. She lost and will never be president.
Which is staggeringly unfair: it was her turn.
Jeb's too.
Jeb!
Poor Jeb. How about that stupid smile whenever Trump would attack him on the debate stage? It was almost as if the poor boob doesn't know how to get mad or angry. I can't imagine any of them on that stage getting mad enough to appear as disgusted with Trump as he was with them. Jeb was the least among them, and that's a very, very small accomplishment.
I know right? Just think of all of those bodies she had to bury! She earned that shit.
"her turn"
She could have been the first 4 year-old president! My turn! No fair! *holds breath*
It's long past time for this old cunt to shrivel up and die.
That happened years ago. She's a revenant who didn't have what it takes to become a lich.
Or president for that matter.
That thing shriveled up a long long time ago. Dried up and went to seed, they say.
Those who think a Universal Basic Income will replace multiple layers of welfare as as naive and silly as those who think the Fair Tax would replace the income tax. It's only going to last until the next congress seats itself.
Show me evidence that government at any level can manage to cut anything, and then I might pay some attention to your fantasy plan. Until then it's just another layer of pancake makeup on the pig of government.
p.s. You can fix both problems (high taxes and low income) with one simple idea: Combine the flat tax with a large standard deduction. Zero taxes on anything less than 50,000, flat percentage on anything above that. Any remaining problems can get dealt with at the state and county level.
I'm sure tax cuts are exactly what they're talking about.
I prefer the Alternative Maximum Tax. Once your federal tax bill hits $10,000, you don't owe any more. And if you're paying the max, you don't have to provide any details of your income or deductions. Just send in the check and indicate which year it's for.
"Those who think a Universal Basic Income will replace multiple layers of welfare as as naive and silly as those who think the Fair Tax would replace the income tax. It's only going to last until the next congress seats itself."
This is 100% correct. But, when discussing *theoretically*, a UBI is clearly superior to the bureaucracy of social programs we have today.
We could simply do what European countries like Germany do, countries that Democrats like to point to as examples of good, progressive government: Germany replaced multiple layers of welfare with a single monthly benefit of a maximum of $490 plus rent assistance. But you only get that when you are out of work, and unless you are disabled, you need to show up at "job centers", take job training, and take jobs that are offered to you.
So she wanted to tax the air we breath also?
There is no limit to evil.
Apparently not. And it appears she may have gotten Jedidiah Bila canned from 'The View' from daring to ask the hag a real question.
http://www.foxnews.com/enterta.....inton.html
That's the takeaway I got from the article! 😉
"She thought about making it a campaign plank but backed down for fear of "cannibalizing" other programs."
And this woman claims to have been beat in the 'free-shit' contest?
The basic income has libertarian fans
Not after we throw a representative sample of them out of helicopters. The rest will quickly re-remember that taxation is theft.
Pinochet helicopter memes, how mature (and libertarian!).
And for the record, I'm not a UBI advocate.
See you in the gulag, friend!
WHO'S JOKING?
We will be free men... or else.
*Cocks gun*
Proponents think the UBI is the path to Star Trek TNG. In reality, the UBI is a great idea if you want to create a permanent underclass and continue the drift towards Idiocracy. See what happens when you extend unemployment benefits indefinitely, offer generous welfare or disability programs. It starts as a safety net and a hand up and quickly becomes a lifestyle.
And if you think income inequality is a problem now, wait until you have 3rd generation UBI families.
I wonder what UBI would do to our rate of immigration by illiterate peasants.
"And if you think income inequality is a problem now, wait until you have 3rd generation UBI families."
It'd be like a nation wide Chicago. If it's not given to them, it's stolen.
"And if you think income inequality is a problem now, wait until you have 3rd generation UBI families."
If you thin TLAH is joking"
"Protesters shut down Pelosi news conference on DACA"
[...]
"Chanting pro-immigrant slogans ? "All of us or none of us," "Democrats deport" and "We are not a bargaining chip" ? more than 60 young people overwhelmed a news conference that House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi had organized Monday..."
http://www.sfchronicle.com/new.....206788.php
First, the thing is called "Delayed Action..", so even if it was kept as-is, the action is going to happen (assuming the law is followed)
Secondly, Obo 'decreed' it in violation of the constitution, and Trump is simply handing it back to congress where it belongs.
Thirdly, pro-tip: "All of us or none of us" is a VERY bad slogan to use while you're trashing the presser of one of your allies. That "none" will begin to look very attractive to more and more people; Trump didn't win for no reason.
That "none" will begin to look very attractive to more and more people; Trump didn't win for no reason.
How many troops should we station at the Mexican border to keep out immigrants looking to work in mutually beneficial economic relationships, slaver?
Robespierre Josef Stalin|9.18.17 @ 9:11PM|#
"How many troops should we station at the Mexican border to keep out immigrants looking to work in mutually beneficial economic relationships, slaver?"
You are an ignoramus, commie kid.
I'm one of the 'open boarders' guys here, you fucking idiot. I was pointing out that the other idiots in the 'protest' are not helping their cause.
Oh, and fuck off, slaver.
Mutually beneficial to big, well-connected businesses and their Mexican indentured servants, subsidized by tax payers who need to put up the money for the education, infrastructure, and medical care that keep the labor costs down for those Mexican indentured servants.
Your signature is correct: a f*cking slaver is what you are.
As many as it takes to keep our borders secure. After we abolish the welfare state, we can remove them.
The current system was designed to create a permanent dependent underclass. And it succeeded.
The UBI removes the perverse, anti work incentives of the current system. It's the cure for the permanent dependent underclass.
By applying them to everyone? Huh?
The path to ST:TNG isn't UBI. It's cold fusion powered replicator technology.
You know, just like Sarah Palin, we can ignore her.
Sarah Palin isn't shedding salty ham tears about how she should have been elected - "how could these stupid voters have rejected wonderful ME?"
Why is Reason wasting their time and energy with this loser?
Who gives a shit? Like, for real.
Continued salty ham tears.
I won't lie. I can't help but smile every time I think of her with nothing to do but think about her failure. The depths of her soul searching with the all knowing answer constantly nagging her at the back of her conscious.
She deserves far worse.
I once met an unfortunate woman who had messed up her life with bad decisions and spoke to at-risk kids to scare them straight - "don't end up like me!"
Maybe Hillary could do something like that - except instead of "don't end up like me" it could be "this is what you'd have ended up with if you'd voted for me - stay away from Democrats, kids!"
I'm with you, Cy. I've never grinned so broadly nor laughed so hard inside, as I do every single time I think of her losing the election to Donald Trump. Part of the humor is simply knowing how she'll never comprehend it for the rest of her (hopefully) very, very long life.
I wouldn't wish for her to have much life at all; she's out and about now making some noises about how the election is not valid; never mind that there is absolutely no constitutional provision for invalidating a presidential election that has been certified by the electors, it just needs a little lawyering and some discussions of what the meaning of is is, and stuff like that. She and her followers would have no problem with that whatsoever.
I worry that just like a corpse in a horror movie, Hillary's foul, unclean, decaying political corpse come back to life and haunt us for years to come.
See preceding comment; she's like Beetlejuice and ain't going no where.
I wish she had run with this as one of her promises. Then the name of her book would have been WHAT THE MOTHERFUCK HAPPENED! as she would have lost by double digits.
My tarantula is named Jobo. I play with the bristly fellow often mostly at night when I get fucked up on cocaine, dreams, or buckets of ipppa. I let Jobo run up and down my body mostly because I imagine his or her legs to be deep sea tentacles tenderly going about the surging orifice that is my entire heaving cell storm. He or she chews and nibbles on my nipples and its shed skins always pile up near my toes but I still can't figure out what the fuck sex this bitch is. I noticed after playing with Jobo my cum is super strong and sinewy. I think I get infected with spider genes momentarily. I blew a huge load recently that splashed above the lamp and Jobo climbed upon this celestial strands and danced a tarantula fiddle and the dim lights gleamed in all its eyes and I went outside, climbed into a spaceship, held the door open for Jobo, and flew off under monopoles and megadreams.
It's like Hunter Thompson's unquiet ghost has access to the Internet.
(Seriously, I'm no doctor, but mixing drugs and tarantulas doesn't seem like a pathway to wellness)
It's a pathway down the well.
You truly just never know what you will encounter in these threads, do you? I don't even know what class of porn that falls into.
The other big draws:
Justice - see Lockean Proviso for details
Ending the welfare dependence trap and perverse incentives generally against work
It would take at least a constitutional amendment to prevent UBI from being abused as just another welfare program, and even a constitutional amendment might not work, given the propensity to find workarounds.
A gender and racially-adjusted UBI could pay out all those reparations the white man owes.
"We decided it was exciting but not realistic, and left it on the shelf. That was the responsible decision. I wonder now whether we should have thrown caution to the wind and embraced "Alaska for America" as a long-term goal and figured out the details later."
If only she'd demagogued harder instead of being so darned responsible!
Don't worry, your demagoguery was first-rate as it was.
"Expand tenured Democratic voting base living off the public teat, and years of government mandated progressive indoctrination. Think win-win!"
12 years of school is too much. At least two years of that is just young adult babysitting. Anyway, like Rick Sanchez says, school isn't for really smart people anyway.
It occurs to me that if the Dems do push through some UBI, they will be most helping the rural and flyover people they despise so much and most hurting the rich leftists they love so much. They're too class-sensitive and afraid of inequality to differentiate the base income by region or localized median income, so it will probably be the same everywhere. Their left coast and Northeast friends will get a paltry $15K a year, which is meaningless when rents push $3K a month, while rural folk will get enough for house payments.
Hmmm...OK, require recipients to perform "national service" projects assigned by local politicians. In Blue cities, this will mean registering Democrats at election time. In Red areas, it might involve some actual work, thus deterring more people from signing up.
See how easy that is? Screw the rural bitter clingers and avoid the blame.
What does Machiavelli call it when he gets an orgasm? I got one of those.
Why? Your hypothetical was stupid.
Nuh-uh, *you're* stupid!
Ha, that shut him up.
What's the matter, "Reality," can't handle your namesake?
Go crawl away and lick your wounds from the epic pwnage I delivered unto you.
The rich leftists they love so much have so much money and so many opportunities for tax avoidance that it doesn't matter to them. And rich as they are, they don't have enough money for this.
The people paying for this will be the middle class, because that's where the money is. That's how Europe finances its welfare state: the middle class pays for the welfare of both the lower and the middle classes. "The rich" actually often end up being taxed less in much of Europe.
Why only offer everyone a free pony, when you can offer them a weekly paycheck for doing nothing?
OMG Missouri is temporarily allowed to enforce its abortion laws!
Whee! It's fun to decide what to do with money you didn't earn, isn't it, Hillary?
-jcr
She took all those 3 AM phone calls which protected the country from being blown up...plus it's her turn...of course she earned the money!
She's a serial killer along with Bill
but sweet elite Harvard neighborscapes
across all the gentle fences where
socialists and communists gather
somehow discover a scrappy picnic
on an Irish vacation whereupon they
determine tons of people die...
Like ALL world wars start in an Irish
bar but no one tells you this.. because
very few people in real world America
are Catholics... actually, if you talk
to Marks while getting your fucking
Avalon serviced in middle America
even HE, the country Catholic sez he
is Catholic like he has fucking
cold sores on his toes
GIVE ME FREE SHIT BITCH!!!
Hillary kills People Along with Bill
like Catfish bakes
and no one understands where all
the bodies are and why
these fuckers have brains that
don't work and retire in Tijuana
where ashes and vodka runs
like forever hooves and tits bobbing
under red moons
If you want to become the best
chopper up of humans and the
ultimate fucker of dead bodies
study the Clintons ...and maybe the
Bushes... and, perhaps, Reagan
and also... Congress
This world you think is so goddamn
sweet if the lid was lifted off
would result in tons of snipers
shooting through street numbers
impossible to remember
holocaust is the
plate of spaghetti
on all fucking senator
plates the
only thing
stopping it is...
nothing
North Korea has shit
North Korea kills scarecrows
North Korea has nothing to worry about
The establishment is creating a fucking
theater of worry
Create a span of worry over public
consumption and they
get loose goosey with money or....
they actually... DO NOT... because
the FUCKING military in this country is fucked and corrupt
and disgusting and goddamn TRUMP should check their shit
World War 3 is a big world code game
created by fucking super establishment
grove fucks in the Owl brigades
I GET that this fake shit about North Korea and crap
plays well for some crap bulldog balls
but not for me....
TRUMP, why are you fucking loading your team up with
the most fucking planetary killers ever called AMERICAN
BEAST GENERALS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOTHING ON EARTH compares to a dick wiggling Patton
which infuse all these things...
Incorporate poets and artists and thoughtful physicists
PLEASE do not rely on Military Supermans
President Trump please read across the
plates of notes and tones and magazines
and open your door to poets and artists of
your choosing...
NEVER fully trust the military mind
because these fucks would bind all
humanity
NEVER fully trust the military mind
because these fucks would
bind America
BE FUCKING CAREFUL WITH
YOUR LOVE OF GODDAMN
MILITARY- it is designed to hate
freedom
Everyone understands Bill Gates that shit billionaire got super rich employing millions of morons who can't make crap work... Bill Gates got rich gathering shit fuckers making shit fucker software for shit fuckers..
Bill Gates got rich being so fucking loco capitalism didn't expect his socialist ass showing up... but peace out on his shit and getting all embedded in Modern Murican dick blow all over the fucking plates and old Japaneses kneel downs because get ready our shit is tight and when the bombs fall I promise you fucking deep earth politicians ME and a bunch of intense dudes aren't going to be as peaceful when we find you under and behind the melted hives you planned on Cambridge chalkboards, bro.
Make society work, McCain you shitty brain cancer fuck or McConnel will act just like you and Baked Alaska.. shitty as ever... and weepy as ever...
Antifa is Pelosi sadness
Antifa is horribly unaware its queen is brain dead
Antifa also doesn't understand that no one watches
their captive crap channel now called CNN and CBS and shit
tears and butt spew
but underneath it all none of these people care about
freedom, love, peace, and rising above the forces that crush humanity
because they are all about war, violence, and dragons
Freedom is the end of government chains
Freedom is not condoned by most world gangs called governments
Freedom IS the wings of humans
Freedom does require the use of self defense
and fences
Freedom is generally hated by oppressive
shitty hellacious governments- Germany comes to mind
There is no Freedom under Merkel
There is no Freedom under May
There is no Freedom under Europe
There is no Freedom under Jinping
There is no Freedom under Putin
There is no Freedom under Enrique Pe?a Nieto
Freedom is dying on planet earth and no one seems to give a goddamn fuck
The Agile abides. I take comfort in that.
Mescaline?
Cocaine is bad, mkay.
Well fuck. That's almost a bad idea I could live with. No wonder this old-timer had no chance of getting the nomination.
The indignity and tedium of government-run job training is enough of a disincentive to receiving welfare that it might actually work.
cutting checks with no strings
I am against this, but I think it would be illustrative to people who believe in welfare. It could demonstrate how peoples financial situation is mostly a result of their decision making.