A.M. Links: CDC Says More Ebola in the U.S. Possible, NSA Could've Infiltrated Telecom Companies, Kim Jung Un Seen in Public


  • Kim Jong Un public appearance

    The head of the Centers for Disease Control says other hospital workers in the U.S. could have Ebola and that the agency will "double down" on training for healthcare workers. A man in Los Angeles, meanwhile, tried to take a bus hostage by claiming to the driver he had Ebola.

  • Leaked Edward Snowden documents about the National Security Agency program SENTRY EAGLE suggest the agency could've placed undercover agents at communications firm at home and/or abroad.
  • Republican Sen. Mitch McConnell and his challenger, Democrat Alison Lundergan Grimes, appeared in their only scheduled debate this season. It's the 30-year Kentucky senator's most difficult re-election bid.
  • The French telecom company Iliad is no longer seeking a majority stake in T-Mobile after its offer was rejected by the German telecom company Deutsche Telekom, which still owns a majority of T-Mobile.
  • Police tried again to remove protester camps in Hong Kong, after hoping public pressure would force the pro-democracy demonstrators to clear the city's major streets.
  • After 40 days, North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un was seen in public, giving "field guidance."

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  1. …suggest the agency could’ve placed undercover agents at communications firm at home and/or abroad.

    Internships, that’s all they were.

    1. Hola.

      America needs a new national anthem. A certain song by the Police comes to mind.

      1. Don’t stand so close to me?

        1. Obama’s car is warm and dry.

      2. Sting wrote a lot of creepy lyrics, didn’t he?

        1. Definite dark side there.

        2. What might save us, me and you
          Is that the Russians love their children too.

      3. There is no political solution / to our troubled evolution / Have no faith in constitution / there is no bloody revolution / We are spirits in the material world?

        1. “I’m Hungry For You (J’Aurais Toujours Faim de Toi)”

      4. Cheap Trick. The Dream Police.

    2. Hello.

      After much time thinking about our problems I came to a solution.


      1. One Czar to rule them all?

        1. And in the darkness, bind them?

          If we can throw ’em in a volcano at the end, then sure!

          1. It’s the best traditions that should be preserved.

      2. One Czar for them, Another Czar for us?

  2. Truck containing 36,000 pounds of Crisco stolen

    St. Petersburg Police say that a tractor-trailer containing the 36,000 pounds of vegetable shortening was snatched Sunday morning.

    The truck was destined for a Publix distribution center in Lakeland. Authorities said the stolen tractor was a 2005 red Volvo, with a Florida tag and had the business name of “NS Express LLC on both sides of the cab. The trailer was a white Hyundai.

    Crisco can be used for frying or making delicious baked goods.

    1. I’ll be in my slippery bunk.

    2. I said COCAINE not CRISCO you idiot! It doesn’t even rhyme!

    3. Fat stash

      1. booooooo!

        /flakier but less flavorful comment

    4. I blame Warty.

      1. Like Warty would use lube. Ha!

      2. I was thinking the same thing.

    5. I assume this will turn up on the black market somewhere where trans fats have been banned?

  3. A man in Los Angeles, meanwhile, tried to take a bus hostage by claiming to the driver he had Ebola.

    He didn’t have exact change.

    1. Hey why shouldn’t a man with Ebola be allowed to take a bus anywhere he wants? Freedom of movement right?

    2. How about vague hope?

  4. Hillary Clinton touts affordable higher education in $225G Las Vegas speech

    “Higher education shouldn’t be a privilege for those able to afford it,” Clinton told a crowd of approximately 900 people. “It should be an opportunity widely available for anybody with the talent, determination and ambition.”

    The former secretary of State said that many students are affected by student loan debt “that can feel like an anchor dragging them down,” and praised President Obama for increasing federal Pell grants by $1,000.

    1. Then get the government out of inflating the bubble.

    2. It should be an opportunity widely available for anybody with the talent, determination and ambition.

      As determined by whether they vote for her.

    3. What could possibly go wrong?

    4. Comrades, MORE MONEY will drive down tuition inflation. Obviously.

      1. That’s the plan. It’s not about “making college affordable”, it’s about shoveling more money into a system that subsidizes progressive academics.

    5. Why haven’t they explored price controls?
      They love them for everything else – from avocados to heart pills to fast food worker’s pay.

    6. “It should be an opportunity widely available for anybody with the talent, determination and ambition.”

      Clearly, what this job market needs is MOAR DEGREEZ.

    7. “Higher education shouldn’t be a privilege for those able to afford it,” Clinton told a crowd of approximately 900 people. “It should be an opportunity widely available for anybody with the talent, determination and ambition.”

      So she’s pushing a move away from the university model to an internet based one, right?

    8. “with the talent, determination and ambition”

      If we limited it to those people, we wouldn’t have these problems.

      1. I occasionally chauffeured my kids over three years to a community college that they attended instead of high school. It was a good deal for us because they got two years’ of college credit and an Associates Degree while completing high school.

        At the beginning of each semester the campus was bustling, the traffic heavy, and the parking lots full. Activity diminished throughout each semester such that, by the end of the semester, the parking lots were only half-full.

  5. That’s some cheesy alt text!

  6. No Happy Ending for Investors in Central Bank Fairy Tale

    Their message for investors: Even after the MSCI World Index’s lurch to its lowest since February, sentiment risks souring for a while longer. The reason is that just as global growth is weakening again, central bankers who sustained much of the expansion are running out of ammunition.

    “Investors around the world are shocked, shocked that the monetary wizards may have run out of magic tricks to revive global economic growth,” said Yardeni, president and chief investment strategist at Yardeni Research Inc. in New York. “Even the wizards are admitting that their powers to do so are limited.”

    1. The happy ending is for the people in government.

    2. Oh please, they only just begun to inflate.

  7. You can stand under my AIR-brella: Hi-tech umbrella creates an invisible ‘force field’ above you to blow rain away

    A Chinese inventor is seeking funding for his Air Umbrella gadget
    It is a replacement for regular umbrellas, using air instead of fabric
    The sceptre-like device blows out air at the top to make a ‘force field’
    This protects the person or people underneath from rain
    Air is drawn in by the top of the device and fired out again at the sides
    Prices start at ?55 ($88) but it won’t be available until December 2015


    1. But is it bad luck to activate the field inside?

      1. Just don’t cross the streams.

    2. Seems like that would use a lot of power. I wonder how long it will run for? Kind of a cool idea if it works.

      1. Except it sounds like it might just blast water sideways onto people around
        you. Could cause a few problems.

        1. There is that. I wonder what happens if you do cross the streams?

  8. The French telecom company Iliad is no longer seeking a majority stake in T-Mobile after its offer was rejected by the German

    They didn’t like the suggestion that the logo be more rectangular and white.

    1. Square? White? RACIST!

    1. It does not matter, the death threat could have happened so that is the same as actually happening.

      1. Would that make it a fake but accurate news story?

        1. Exactly

          Its following the narrative and the narrative is what matters.

      2. The next question is are any death threats on the internet worth taking seriously?

      3. Since people believed the death threats were real, that just proves that something something.

    2. Every SJW knows it’s ok to lie if it serves the greater good social justice.

      No different then Jihadists believing that any tactic is justified if it furthers the will of allah.

      I think the term Social Justice Jihadists is a more accurate term for these people. It captures their fanatical nature better.

      1. You know who else compared internet activists to Muslim jihadists?

        1. The head of cloud computing at Dell? At least he didn’t speak ill of gay marriage.

      2. Socialist Jihadi Womyn

        1. Though Sojuhadeen works, I guess.

    3. So a vague story from a red-piller website which says in their “about” section that “Women and homosexuals are discouraged from commenting here.” is what you consider an objective source?

      1. Ad hominem much? The guy knows he’ll be challenged on the matter, backs it up with an improbably structured timeline by a supposedly deranged stalker who is making public threats, coherently, with perfect grammar, at around 2 minutes per tweet. You ignore this.

        There’s also an FOIA request by some other folks online to see if the police really were contacted by Sarkeesian.

        But I actually thought it was the newest (almost-certainly) fake assault charge leveled by Brianna Wu. That one is slowly falling apart as well.

  9. Stand-up comedian lost for words when NYPD arrests homeless man ‘masturbating in the audience’… and the cops start heckling him

    Adam Newman, 31, was half-way through set at UCB Theatre, New York City
    Four officers entered with flashlights to arrest homeless man ‘masturbating’
    Newman tried to talk through the incident but they yelled: ‘Shut the f*** up!’

    Classy cops. Very professional.

    1. They’ll be here all week. Be sure to try the unlimited state power, and tip your heroes in blue.

    2. Newman tried to talk through the incident but they yelled: ‘Shut the f*** up!’

      Technically, you cops are shutting the fucker up.

    3. And that professionalism was put into plan view for an entire audience to witness.

      The stupidity of police is probably the greatest weapon against their growing militarization.

    4. Seems like even a moderate to good comic would love for this scenario at one of their shows…this is like a gift all wrapped up and delivered on a silver platter.

    5. Long Island’s Finest.

  10. The creepiest man in New York: A gross portrait of a subway molester

    I’m honestly not sure what’s queasier, Robinson’s pointers re: how to pick up women on the subway? “No matter what place she says, say, ‘Wow, I’ve always wanted to visit your country/city, etc. .?.?. do you have ?e-mail?”?or the Post’s writer, Gary Buiso’s insistence on humorizing the story by deeming Robinson’s creepy pick-up handbook with euphemisms like “railway Romeo” and “subterranean seducer.”

    I know, I know. “It’s just a joke.” Or, wait, what’s the other one. “What’s wrong with a little attention?” Oh, hold up, don’t tell me. “Come on, a smile won’t kill you.” A man who prides himself on having a history of womanizers in his family is not the person you want to take date tips from. In its own weird way, this story is pretty much promoting sexual harassment.

    “Harassers walk around with a sense of entitlement, believing they are owed something. This sense of entitlement recently led to the murder of Mary “Unique” Spears in Detroit and the violent attack of a woman in Queens because they rejected verbal harassment,” Debjani Roy, Executive Director of Hollaback! an end street harassment non-profit told me via email. “There are many stories like this and it is nothing to make light of.”

    1. Creepier than De Blasio?

      1. No, DeBlasio is the Platonic Ideal of creepy.

    2. Reading the comments, which rightly blasted the article as idiotic, just further proves that Salon is about nothing but generating click bait.

    3. Bah! He’s only the creepiest because Epi took Horace Greeley’s advice and went west looking for a young man.

    4. I am not clicking on that but let me take a guess: how dare guys notice gals who are obviously looking to attract the attention of guys.

  11. After 40 days, North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un was seen in public, giving “field guidance.”

    After all, it takes a “community organizer” to provide “field guidance”.

    1. “field guidance”.

      We will plant potatoes in this field. Canola in that one. And we will harvest sorrow in the rest.

      1. And dissidents in that field over there.

        1. I was hoping that ratfucker had Ebola

      2. Sounds like a great five-year plan to me, dude.

      3. Canola in that one.

        Rapeseed. Canola is a Canadian trade-mark. Even Kim knows not to piss of Canada.


  12. NRSC Feeling More Confident About Tillis in North Carolina

    It’s worth noting that the Libertarian candidate, Sean Haugh, continues to draw a significant percentage of voters. In the latest Survey USA poll, Tillis actually leads head-to-head with Hagan, 46 percent to 45 percent. But when the Libertarian candidate is an option, Hagan leads, 44 percent to 41 percent.

    Haugh ? “Libertarian” ? not only supports term limits, but (tongue-in-cheek?) calls for term limits for “aides, bureaucrats, journalists, and anyone in the political class.” That may be a good idea or a bad idea, but it’s hardly a limited-government idea to impose new rules on who can participate in the political process.

    He also wants to “stop all war” and this is his response to military action vs ISIS:

    1. Jim Geraghty in 1791: “Someone wants a Bill of Rights, but it’s hardly a limited-government idea to impose new rules on what our elected officials can do.”

      1. Limiting who people can choose is hardly libertarian

        1. Democratic ? libertarian. There are all sorts of limits on our choices in government.

        2. That’s Bullshit Bo.

          How do term limits violate the NAP?

          Democracy is a means to and end. It isn’t the end itself. Setting up a system that curbs raw democracy isn’t, in and of itself, incompatible with liberty.

    2. The TEAM RED!!!111!!! shills busting a nut if Hagan wins by fewer votes than Haugh gets is going to be so much fun.

      1. Coulter gonna cut you down

        1. Hopefully, even that dumb cunt and her masters, at some point, will learn that you’ve got to appeal to people if you want them to vote for you.

    3. Placing limits on government operations is pretty inconsistent with limited government.

  13. The French telecom company Iliad is no longer seeking a majority stake in T-Mobile

    It will now go on an Odyssey

  14. Immigration Activists Call Out Kentucky Dem’s “Morally Reprehensible” Tactics

    Latino advocates were shocked to learn Monday that Democratic Senate candidate Alison Lundergan Grimes is running an under-the-radar campaign to paint herself as less interested in a pathway to legal status for undocumented immigrants than her opponent, Senator Mitch McConnell.

    “I approve this message because I’ve never supported amnesty or benefits for illegal immigrants and I never will,” Grimes says in a TV ad first uncovered by Vox. The ad attacks McConnell for voting in favor of a bipartisan immigration bill in 1986 that was the last time Washington provided a path to legality for undocumented workers.

    1. How is a TV ad “underground?” I saw that ad like 5 times last weekend in my hotel room in Louisville, in about 45 min of total viewing time. She is pushing hard to lie, lie, lie about her.intentions.

      1. It’s only on CBS where they think old white people will see it?

  15. Republican Sen. Mitch McConnell and his challenger, Democrat Alison Lundergan Grimes

    Too bad it’s not this Grimes.

    1. Too bad it’s not this Oblivion.

  16. Iran’s Message to World: You Need Us to Fight Islamists

    Iranian television published last week a picture of Quds Force Major General Qassem Suleimani on an Iraqi battlefield surrounded by Kurdish Peshmerga fighters. That photograph, widely shared on Twitter and other social media, is the latest of Suleimani to appear since the fall of the city of Mosul to Islamic State. Even in the constrained Iranian media, Suleimani sightings, which once were rare, are now common.

    The transformation of a man in the shadows as chief of covert foreign operations for the Revolutionary Guards into a public hero is central to Iran’s message to the world: If you want to beat Sunni militants, you need the help of the Shiite nation and its top military commander.

    1. What I need Iran to keep doing is make their delicious cookies.

  17. After 40 days, North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un was seen in public, giving “field guidance.”

    Turns out the only guidance the field received was to use water, not Brawndo.

    1. Pfft, shows what he knows, Brawndo’s got electrolytes.

      1. It’s what plants crave.

  18. 5 stupid, sexist things expected of men

    AlterNet If you have a scrap of progressive politics in your bones, it’s no surprise to you that sexism hurts women. Like, duh. That’s kind of the definition of the word.

    But we don’t talk as much about how sexism hurts men. Understandably. When you look at the grotesque ways women are damaged by sexism?from economic inequality to political disenfranchisement to literal, physical abuse?it makes perfect sense that we’d care more about how sexism, patriarchy and rigid gender roles affect women than we do about how they affect men.

    But men undoubtedly get screwed up by this stuff, too. Not screwed up as badly as women, to be sure? but not trivially, either. I care about it. And I think other feminists?and other women and men who may not see themselves as feminists?ought to care about it, too.

    1. Here is a list of five:

      1. Fight, fight, fight!

      2. Be a good husband/partner/lover ? but don’t care too much what women think.

      3. Be hot to trot. Always. With anybody.

      4. Stiff upper lip.

      5. Fear of being perceived as gay.

      this whole article is sexist.

    2. It’s Salon, so I didn’t read the article, but I presume it didn’t discusss the anti-male disparity in family court as one of the ways sexism hurts men?

    3. ” Like, duh. ”

      I stopped reading right there. Anyone who is over 14 and writes that for publication is not worth reading.

  19. So the wife had me tag along w/ her and her coworker and husband to see Gone Girl. My take: pretty boring first half hour, then it gets interesting, then it gets fucking crazy and then the ending is just sad, really. Best part of the film? Anytime Emily Ratajkowski is in a scene, especially when topless, because damn, those are some fantastic jugs.

    1. It always comes down to tits with us men.

      1. I’m more of an ass/leg man… but yeah…

      2. In the end, yes, it does.

    2. Truth. The movie was good while watching, but the plot quickly falls apart when you think about it at all.

      1. I didn’t care for the movie at all. There were redeeming scenes (cited above), but I hated the characters and couldn’t buy the plot. “Amazing Amy” was smart enough to perfectly frame her husband, but couldn’t outsmart a couple of druggies? Really?

        1. Thats pretty much where it lost me as well, it comes down to Ben Affleck’s character being literally the dumbest fuck ever and Amy just that much smarter(her plan was retarded). The only redeemable characters are the sleaze ball attorney and the female detective

          1. I liked the sister, too. But that was about it.

        2. I thought the movie was okay. There have been a complete dearth of good movies this year.

    3. thank God, my lady is making me take her to this and all I’ve heard about it Ben Affleck’s cock

    4. Next time I’m in a theater and there’s a tits scene or any nudity whatever really, I think I will let loose with a whistle. What have I got to lose, it’s not like I will see any of the other moviegoers ever again.

  20. Tourist calls police about angry iguana

    Sellers wrote in her report that Russell, upon showing her toe with “bright red toenail polish,” “was squeezing her toe like she was trying to make it look red.” But the officer wrote “no injury was visible.”

    Two other women at the resort told Sellers that Russell was “pushing her foot toward the iguana, antagonizing it.” Sure enough, a video taken of the alleged poolside attack shows her “repeatedly shoving her foot towards” the animal to the point where the iguana wrapped its mouth around her toe.

    The iguana wasn’t charged.

    1. “Touron” is now a word for a reason.

    2. Angry iguana’s, giant pythons, huge spiders, Florida is just land of the lost these days.

      1. Angry iguana’s

        Great band name

        1. Angry iguana’s what?

          1. Well played.

    3. He probably mistook her toe for a rasberry. It happens… Stooooopid mamal

  21. Not sure if this is true or not but it wouldn’t surprise me. I was listening to the radio on my drive home yesterday and heard someone talking about ebola, the CDC, and government in general. He made a few interesting claims.

    1. The CDC spent about 6% of their budget last year on studying,treating, and controlling disease.(They spent more than that studying gun control, and also investigated things like why lesbians are fat and gay men are thin)

    2. The private company who developed the ebola treatment extracted some of the chemicals in it from tobacco leaves.(which would probably be illegal if the progs had their way)

    1. GMO tobacco plants from Kentucky. A perfect storm of prog triggers.

    2. “1. The CDC spent about 6% of their budget last year on studying,treating, and controlling disease.”


      1. CDC FY2012 Budget

        Core Infectious Disease: 2.0% of its budget for FY2012

        Global Disease Detection and Emergency Response: 0.4% of its budget for FY2012

        1. Those two things are not the universe of actions controlling detecting or studying disease.

          1. Correct. However, you could argue that these two should be a more significant part of the CDC’s budget. Maybe go give the budget a quick scan yourself and tell us what you think?

            1. Of course if I had my way government funded agencies studying disease would have a narrower focus. My point is that if you have an organization ostensibly dedicated to studying ‘disease’ there’s no medical reason to exclude major killers like heart disease just because they’re not contagious.

              1. Sure, no medical reason at all. However, it is an excellent example of bureaucratic mission creep including the loss of focus on the original purpose of its creation.

          2. Warning for Bo: Do not try to polish a turd.

        2. Priorities. How do they work?

    3. How much time and money did the CDC spend on studying/scolding on salt?

      1. Heart disease

        1. No correlation

          1. And heart disease is not an infectious disease anyway, which is what the CDC is supposed to be focused on.

            1. Just curious, how’s that what they’re supposed to be focused on? They’re not the CIDC.

              1. The original purpose was to control infectious disease outbreaks. From a libertarian perspective, it should focus on infectious diseases rather than lifestyle diseases because you can’t catch heart disease and government’s only proper role is in preventing people from harming others. And from a practical point of view, they shouldn’t be involved with things like heart disease because the government doesn’t have a very good record of getting the causes right.

                1. Sure, from a libertarian perspective, but the CDC makes no pretense of being libertarian. There’s no obvious scientific or medical reason for the study of diseases to focus only on contagious ones.

                  1. The CDC may not make a pretense of being libertarian, or accountable, but as Zeb pointed out the original mission was to control infectious disease outbreaks.

                    Heart disease isn’t infectious and as such cannot pose a sudden and potentially dire threat to anyone.

                    1. Restoras want to try to put together a NYC reasonoid gig this week? I’m on vacation and Jesse is in town.

                    2. Slammer, yes I am down for that. Could do Thursday or Friday?

                    3. I’m open

                    4. Thursday. Somewhere mid-townish?

                    5. Parkside Lounge is decent dive bar with a serious NOLA vibe if the LES appeals to y’all.


                    6. Fine. GILMORE and Rhywun need an invite too, and Freedom Frog if he’s still around.

                    7. Let’s try to post at the beginning of the threads we get today to get the word out.

                    8. I’m in The Rockaways but might be convinced to brave a schlepp into DeBlasio’s wasteland.

                    9. Let’s meet here at 6pm?

                      14 East 33rd Street

                      Caveat, I have no idea what it will be like on Thursday night after work.

                    10. Slammer and l0b0t:
                      Are we meeting at Rattle and Hum or Parkside Lounge? Rattle and Hum has a great selection of beer and get’s my vote…

                    11. Rattle and Hum looks great. I don’t drink much anymore but I was perusing their menu and the food looks yummy.

                    12. Alright, Rattle and Hum it is!

                    13. Rattle and Hum sounds good. And R&H is H&R in reverse…kinda cool

                    14. See my earlier post with Pournelle’s Law. Their original mission is only important to their current leadership as a way to get more funding.

                  2. There’s no obvious scientific or medical reason for the study of diseases to focus only on contagious ones.

                    I think most people think of the CDC as an emergency response agency, like FEMA but for infectious diseases. Now we’re all learning that’s not true.

              2. Heart disease isn’t the same as something like Spanish Flu. Heart disease is a problem of affluence. Spanish Flu, et al can hit everyone regardless of ethnicity, socio-economic strata, etc.

            2. It was originally established as the Communicable Disease Center, but of course underwent mission creep and bureaucratic bloat to go far beyond it’s intended purpose in being established.

              1. That’s an interesting and fair point, conceded.

          2. No correlation?

              1. So there are no studies finding a correlation between salt intake and heart disease? I mean, if you’re saying there are some that don’t find that, or there’s reason to think it might be a spurious relationship, or that correlation doesn’t mean causation, then ok, but there’s quite a few studies reporting a correlation iirc.

                1. Here’s a link for you.

                2. Salt increases blood pressure in some people who have high blood pressure problems. Most people can eat all of the salt they want without any problems. And studies have found that low salt diets don’t improve death rates among the general population.
                  This goes back to my practical objection to the CDC being involved in non-infectious disorders. They get it wrong a lot and big bureaucracies aren’t good at changing their positions on anything. So people are still told to eat low fat and high starch diets even though it’s been pretty clear for a long time that that is not really the best thing.

                3. Bo, here is the skinny:

                  1) When one consumes salt, it enters the blood stream. In order to maintain salt conentrations in the proper band, your body reacts in two ways:
                  a) it immediately increases the amount of fluid put into your circulatory system
                  b) it starts filtering out the salt via kidneys.

                  1a) means that more fluid is getting stored in the same container (your vascular system) this means that the baseline fluid pressure goes up. That is your diastolic pressure.

                  To control the blood pressure, your thyroid gland gland pumps out a hormone that affects your heart beat and the constriction of your blood vessels, which acts to reduce the blood pressure.

                  If your blood pressure control is fucked up, then eating salt is very bad, because your blood pressure will spike. If your heart is struggling to pump blood through your vessels, the increased blood pressure will force it to work even harder.

                  If your vascular system is in tip top shape, eating salt will just make you thirsty and make your kidneys work a little harder.

            1. I see my advice came too late.

              The CDC is all about the CDC first, and secondly about controlling people’s behavior. They don’t really give a fuck about infectious disease unless it gives them a pretense for increasing the CDC.

              They spent fuck-all on infectious disease control and are currently headed by the same guy that helped bloomturd spearhead the 16+ oz soda ban, salt shaker ban, trans-fat ban…etc.

              Again, don’t try to polish a turd. Most of the time things really are just what they appear to be.

          1. 10 bonus points if you catch the reference.

            1. Epi’s mom?

              1. Strutter?

              2. And a flat head to set your beer on.

    4. If this makes you feel any better, the CDC got head slammed.


  22. What caused Rome’s fall? Immigration or centralization?


    1. It wasn’t immigration. It was the deterioration of the central government in Rome. This caused the legions to be called home to constantly fight civil wars over who was going to be emperor, which then left the frontiers open to attack and caused Western Europe to shrug off Roman rule. Roman for a long time represented stability and protection from invasion. When it stopped meaning that and meant only civil war and ruinous taxation, it fell apart.

      1. But it soldiered on during the worst of imperial civil wars for more than a century. from 220 – 320. It ‘fell’ a hundred+years later during as centralization advanced to the point that the western system became unable to deal with external shocks. There’s a lot of evidence that the cause of this was local elites losing all allegiance to the imperial system and embracing the barbarian invaders.

        The decline in the east is even more instructive of the dangers of centralization. Specifically it’s rigidity being unable to deal with Arab invasions in the 7th century.

        1. The East stopped being Rome and became a feudal empire after Justinian. And yes, that made it totally unable to handle the Arab invaders. Even then it was doing okay until the Venetians showed up to help and sacked Constantinople during the 4th Crusade. That and the resulting Latin state is really what killed eastern Rome.

          In the west, the modern thinking is that local rulers shrugged off Roman rule as you say. It wasn’t so much a fall as a disintegration and return to local rule similar to the fall of the Eastern block in 1989.

          The locals were willing and able to shrug off Roman rule because Roman rule had gotten so bad. The Dark Ages really were not as dark as people believe. For most of Western Europe they were an improvement over Roman rule, which had gotten that bad.

          1. Venice was fighting the Arabs on behalf of the Byzantine Empire.

            1. Except that they never got around to doing that and instead looted Byzantium and set up a rump Latin state.

    2. The JOOOOOOZZZ???

    3. If you consider the Byzantine Empire an extension of the Roman Empire immigration, international commerce, and advanced military technology kept it alive despite a dysfunctional government.

      1. Yeah, especially the Arab and Turkish periods of immigration.

    4. Taxes.

      The Republic was built as a middle-class empire. The soldier / farmer was the backbone of the city and drove it’s early expansion.

      During the Late Empire period, the Middle Class was simply taxed out of existence. Artisans and small farmers sold themselves into slavery to avoid the crushing taxes. There was nobody left with any skin in the game.

      1. Yes they were. This is especially true in Egypt and North Africa. Rome crushed North Africa in taxes to pay for bread, circuses and civil wars at home.

  23. This Secret Service Hooker scandal is a good example of why the GOP is the stupid party and always loses to the Left. Apparently some idiot son of an Obama donor got a job as a “White House Volunteer” that included being on the President’s advance team to Columbia. He is some douche bag Yale Law Student who had no business whatsoever being on an advance team. Of course he goes out and bangs a hooker. When they did the investigation, they ended the careers of all sorts of underlings who banged hookers but let him walk. The White House made sure the investigation never got to him. He is now a highly paid contractor at DOS doing, you can’t make this shit up, women’s issues.

    The left has done a great job of creating a culture where the most hated person in America is the rich white son who gets over. This guy is a perfect target for public hatred and ridicule. Going after him personally would both get an idiot son out of a job he doesn’t deserve and serve to embarrass the shit out of Democrats as they face the choice to either turning on one of their own or defending the one kind of person in America who is indefensible in today’s culture; the rich white boy who got over because of his dad’s connections.

    But will they do that? Will they tell this beautiful story that personalizes the opposition and embarrasses the shit out of them? Hell no. That just wouldn’t be cricket I guess.

    1. You know why no one cares about this story? Because Conservative Justice Warriors such as yourself have been pushing so many Worst Scandal Since Nixon!?! stories that there’s fatigue about it. Thanks a lot for enabling the lout.

      1. Conservative Justice Warriors? Sorry dude, stealing the other side’s rhetoric only works if its clever.

        And who says that the Secret Service Scandal such as it is is “worse than Nixon” other than the voices in your head?

        And people do care about this scandal and the problems at Secret Service because it shows that even an agency that were thought to be among the best is apparently completely broken. It is a real problem for Democrats to sell government as the solution to every problem when they prove to be completely incompetent at administering government.

        Moreover, this is a real injustice. This guy did exactly the same thing that other people saw their careers end over. Instead, he will end up being the under secretary of something in the next Democratic Administration. It is a great story to tell because it shows how government really works. Democrats like you always portray government as composed of selfless public servants out fighting for good. In reality is is politicals who are not qualified to get an entry level job at an agency out ruling over the country without any kind of accountability or competence.

        That story needs to be told again and again.

        1. Amen and/or Testify

        2. The shoe fits. Conservatives have been long and loudly having a conniption over the silliest things regarding Obama that his very real and obvious failings get drowned out by now. The Democrats love that and count on it.

          1. So the White House ending the careers of agents with decades of service to placate the media while protecting the idiot son of a donor who did the same thing is just a “silly issue”? I am pretty sure everyone not on the Democratic Party payroll would disagree with you.

            As everyone on this thread agrees, this story is both a personal injustice and a great example of a larger issue. Moreover, according to the Washington Post, the handling of the case has done untold damage to the moral at the agency charged with protecting the President. There is nothing silly about it and you know it, which is of course why you are pretending otherwise.

            Your concern troll act would be more effective if you were more selective in employing it.

            1. Wow, your impervious to my point John.

              Sure, this scandal had legs, there’s no way it’s going to get dismissed as yet another Worst Scandal Evah!!!
              There’s no way that will happen, just like there was no way the American people would reelect that blown in 2012, right?

              1. Sure, this scandal had legs, there’s no way it’s going to get dismissed as yet another Worst Scandal Evah!!!

                So admit I am right and are just shitting on the thread to obscure the larger point. I said upfront it was an outrage and the Republicans were idiots not to properly destroy it. And you now admit I was right.

                So you were not concern trolling. You were just shitting all over the thread hoping to obscure a topic that hurts Democrats.

                1. Actually, I think Republicans would be stupid to focus on it, for reasons I’ve detailed and won’t bore people by repeating just on the rare chance you’ll finally get them

              2. would reelect that blown in 2012

                You two are starting to resemble an old married couple, gradually morphing into a caricature of each other…

                1. Restoras,

                  Where am I wrong here? If I am wrong, tell me where. If I am not, then why I am wrong to respond?

                  1. Holy spit, you’re determined not to get anything from anyone today. Slow down and re read what Restoras said.

                  2. Relax, John, just poking fun as Bo seems to be taking on your penchant for funny typos.

                  3. No John. You are right about this.

                    Bo’s leftwing fuctardism is really acting up today. Must be the cold front coming through.

          2. Conservatives have been long and loudly having a conniption over the silliest things regarding Obama…


            Fast and furious – just a silly little slip up that could have happened to anyone trying to subvert constitutional protections.

            Multiple administration officials blatantly lying to Congress – just a silly little thing and no one likes Congress anyway.

            Subvert federal law enforcement to punish political opponents – just a stupid silly little thing that every 3rd world dictator does.

            The entire cluster fuck of Benghazi, running arms to terrorists, botching the job, then withholding a military response for fear of a political backlash if it fails and finally blaming the whole thing on an American exercising his 1st amendment rights – totally silly and fake.

            Complete administrative incompetence – just a silly little detail.

            1. BTW, Bo thanx for completely outing yourself as an Obama shill.

              How much does that gig pay, anyway?

            2. Also, trying to ram through recess appointments while Congress is in session, siccing the IRS on political opponents, and I’m sure I’m not remembering a few.

              If this were all sending back the Churchill bust type stuff, I’d agree with Bo. However, it’s clear that it’s much deeper than that. Thank God Obama is an incompetent. If he was a Woodrow Wilson or FDR type, we’d be in lots of trouble.

          3. This is true. Crying wolf by the Party of Stupid (Or are they Evil this week?) is one reason this story is getting no traction.

      2. No one cares about it because the media is largely doing its level best to ignore it.

        1. In fairness, the Washington Post broke the story about the idiot son in the White House. So they really are not ignoring it or at least the Post isn’t.

          People know about it and they care. This is one time where the media’s worship of government and cops in particular has come back to bite them. Before this people generally held the Secret Service in really high regard. When all of this broke and there were the string of fuck ups, I think has really hurt Obama and the Democrats in general. The big low information mass of voters expect either party to make the government work. When it doesn’t, in cases like this or FEMA being so bad during Katrina, they hold the President and his party responsible fairly or unfairly.

          1. The chickens are coming home to roost for these assholes. They’ve been worshiping government for so long that they’ve come to believe that it is magic, with the corollary that government just works – and doesn’t require any effort on the part of the politician or bureaucrats to make it work.

          2. They love the Hooker story compared to actual cover-ups and illegal shit like Fast & Furious and Benghazi.

      3. Inability to articulate a principled argument against this kind of thing is one of the many reasons I can’t stand the stupid party. This is a great opportunity to teach people that don’t pay much attention to politics exactly *why* the culture of bigger government is so poisonously destructive. Yet the GOP, for the most part, fails again. Opportunity lost.

        I use stories like this in meatspace when talking to people about why I’m a Libertarian, and for the most part get a good response. The Lefty Team Blue people still don’t understand, but what can you expect from them?

        1. Exactly that. This is how government really works in practice. Any person who has ever worked in government knows that, no matter what their political leanings.

          When I first came to Washington I had a law professor, who was an old time liberal but very wise to the ways of Washington, who would tell his students that if they couldn’t get an entry level job at an agency they shouldn’t be discouraged. All they had to do was go into politics and they could some day run that agency.

          Most people don’t know basic civics must less how the government works in practice. Shame on the entire right for not doing more to show them.

          1. And the nepotism too. Except that the Stupid Party is on board with that too.

            1. Yes they are. And they won’t go after this idiot son because they think it would cause the Democrats to do the same to theirs. What they don’t understand is the Democrats would totally use this story if the parties were reversed. So playing nice does no good.

        2. They’re too busy arguing he’s a Secret Muslim born in Indonesia who gives latte salutes while wearing a grey suit and bowing to Saudi kings to articulate the real problems.

          1. They’re too busy arguing he’s a Secret Muslim born in Indonesia who gives latte salutes while wearing a grey suit and bowing to Saudi kings to articulate the real problems.

            But I thought they were too busy talking about this silly story? Which is it?

            1. John, when told the story of the boy who cried wolf I bet you said ‘but hey, there was a wolf here, what’s wrong with the liberal media for not reporting it!’

              1. John, when told the story of the boy who cried wolf I bet you said ‘but hey, there was a wolf here, what’s wrong with the liberal media for not reporting it!’

                So since the Republicans complained about other things you don’t like, it is totally okay that the White House fucked a bunch of people while protecting the big son of a donor. Yeah, that makes sense.

                Again, choose your targets of concern trolling better.

            2. No, John, they’re too busy talking about all the other FAKE SCANDALS – like the IRS, Benghazi, NSA spying, Obamacare, etc. etc.

              1. You prove my point. There’s nothing conspiratorial about Obamacare, it’s flat out in your face bad policy. And it’s THAT which is going to do in the Dems in less than a month, not ‘Hillary Lied, People Died#!!!’

    2. I’m going to say it, they are a bunch of pussies. Romney should have raked Obama and HC over the coals 2 years ago during the second debate, right after the Benghazi disaster but he did nothing. He stood there like the lifeless corporate hack he is. And now the GOP has another Obama tied in scandal that they could embarrass our deal leader with but they will do nothing. It’s just pathetic all they way around.

      1. They are totally bullied by the media and popular culture into not telling the truth. If you stand up and play to win, the media and popular culture makes you a pariah.

        That doesn’t excuse the Republicans in any way. They should have the courage not to care. Instead, they are more interested in living a comfortable life of moderate to outrageous theft and keeping their heads down.

      2. The problem us that the real ‘Bengazi scandal’ is what were we doing meddling in Libya’s affairs, but Conservative Justice Warriors inevitably spun it in a government affirming way (if not for Obama’s incompetence we totally could have launched an awesome Rambo-esque rescue mission in the heart of a major foreign city in the midst of civil war and strife!)

        1. The problem us that the real ‘Bengazi scandal’ is what were we doing meddling in Libya’s affairs,

          That is certainly a legitimate issue for debate. It is however a completely separate issue from the Department of State’s competence in protecting its people and US Ambassadors. Even if we shouldn’t have been in Libya, that in no way would excuse the State Department for failing to protect the ambassador there.

          So no that is not the “real scandal”. Even if nothing had happened at Bengazi, the debate on our role in Libya would go on. Bengazi is about Hillary Clinton’s and the DOS incompetence. A US Ambassador was left in a unsecured compound in a war zone and was murdered. That is a big fucking deal that has nothing to do with the larger issue of intervention. We could never intervene anywhere and would still have ambassador’s and still need a State Department competent enough to protect them.

          1. See, here’s your problem: for all it’s obvious incompetence, it is exactly not a big f*#%ing deal. We lost thousands of lives in a folly in Iraq, losing four spooks in Libya is exactly not a big deal in comparison. When CJWs carry on and on about it ( because they transparently fear HRC) it plays exactly into Democrat hands.

            Have you not noticed that the GOP is on the verge of taking back the Senate in campaigns where things like Bengazi are getting nary a mention?

            1. it is exactly not a big f*#%ing deal

              Not being able to protect our diplomats abroad is a huge deal, at least within the context of the state department. If the State Department can’t protect our diplomats abroad, it has failed in one of its most basic functions.

              All you can say in response is “but what about Iraq”. What about it? Just because there are other issues in the world doesn’t make this issue any less important.

              You could say the same thing about any issue. What does the IRS being made into a political weapon matter in comparison to Iraq? I don’t know because one has nothing to do with the other.

        2. The Benghazi scandal has multiple components, anyone of which should have ended Obama and Hillary’s political careers.

          1) Why did we overthrow Qaddaffi in the first place.

          2) Who was Stevens arms trafficking with and what was he sending them.

          3) The botched security surrounding issue #2

          4) The lack of a rescue mission, most likely because of a fear of political backlash if it failed.

          5) Blatantly lying about ‘the disgusting video’ being the cause of the attack.

    3. That’s pretty shameful.

      I still don’t know why I should care about the hookers, though.

      1. We should care that they be free to ply their trade?

        1. We shouldn’t. There are two things going on here. First, is the claim that if people connected to the President frequent hookers, they create a security risk because people wishing to harm the President could use the hookers to get information. That is a pretty thin concern if you ask me. But some people think it is a big deal. And the rule was “no hookers on the road”. I don’t have a lot of sympathy for the Agents in this case. They knew the rules and broke them. What, they can’t wait until they go on vacation to hire a hooker?

          The second issue is that the Obama administration and the Democratic Party as a whole has made hiring a hooker into “supporting human trafficking”. I think that is a crazy position but it is their position. It is pretty rich for them to make so much noise about how horrible hiring a hooker is, end people’s careers over it, and then make sure the favored son of a donor hires a hooker and goes merely on and up in his career.

        2. Why we should care about the Colombian hooker incident, I mean. John explains well why people do care, I think.

          If the agents got fired or disciplined for breaking the rules, I’m OK with that. But it’s a silly thing to make into a big scandal.

  24. The one good thing about Adrian Peterson’s trial is watching the the media whore prosecutor go apeshit at being called a media whore

    In his motion, Montgomery County District Attorney Brett Ligon cited what he called an ongoing campaign of disparagement of his office by Judge Kelly Case, including Case’s calling Ligon, and Peterson’s defense attorney, media “whores.” Ligon detailed several incidents stretching back to Case’s election in 2012, including the judge’s threat to jail the prosecutor.

    To back up their motion, prosecutors submitted sworn statements by court personnel who heard Case make the “whore” comment on Oct. 2 as they casually discussed how the judge would handle media for the case. Legal assistant Vanessa Atkinson said Case turned to a prosecutor and said, “I’m sorry, Frank, but you have Brett Ligon, who is a camera whore,” adding that Hardin [AP’s defense lawyer] is one, as well.

    Assistant District Attorney Frank Barnett signed a similar statement. Hardin doesn’t plan to argue against the judge’s removal. About the “whore” comment, Hardin said in court, “I’ve been called worse.” Case declined to comment on Ligon’s motion.


    1. It seems like Peterson really is guilty of child abuse. Maybe I am misunderstanding the facts but the things I have seen are pretty bad. Given that, I don’t see how I can be angry at the DA for prosecuting a case that should have been brought.

      1. My take is that if AP was just some normal guy, he would have been charged, put in a diversion program and given some probation. Probably had to do some supervised visits with the kids too.

        Since he is AP, though, the DA is throwing the book at him to get his picture in the paper and on TV. And AP has his own high priced whore.

        End of the day, AP is a terrible father. The reports (if they can be believed and I think they can) really do paint some ugly physical abuse of the kid.

        What I don’t get is why AP’s agent didn’t get way out in front of this. AP should have done the old fake apology: “This is the way I was raised, I didn’t realize how bad it was, now I do and I’m getting treatment”. Then donate a bunch of money to some local shelter for domestic abuse, etc. Instead the knucklehead still seems to think he hasn’t done anything wrong.

        1. That is a fair point. Of course maybe Peterson isn’t willing to plead and that is what is driving this. I am not sure.

          It is a interesting contrast between this and the Ray Rice thing. There Rice plead guilty and was given diversion just like any other first time offender who played knock out with his wife. Here, you would think Peterson is being charged with murder. And that probably is the DA being a publicity whore.

          1. And nobody’s criticizing the New Jersey DA in the Ray Rice case for the light punishment, instead going after Goodell because it’s easier to make him a target of Hate Week.

            1. It is almost as if the journolist decided that America needs to stop liking football or something. You are absolutely right. If you are angry about Ray Rice not being punished enough for beating up his wife, your beef is with the DA and judge in New Jersey not with the NFL. It is not he NFL’s job to do justice, it is the state of New Jersey’s job. Instead of going after the right target, they went after the NFL because the narrative this fall is that football is evil.

              1. It is almost as if the journolist decided that America needs to stop liking football or something

                I think the NFL is doing a good job of that on it’s own.

              2. John it’s hard to feel sorry for the NFL though. They brought this on themselves, they have been trying for years to placate a group of people that will never be placated.

                1. I agree Idle Hands. I find the NFL loathsome. I just think the people who are attacking them are more loathsome. I also hate lies. And the stories about football being too unsafe for America’s snowflakes are either outright lies or facts taken completely out of context and made to look significant when in fact they are not. Football at the youth level is no more unsafe than other sports and in fact safer than some. The same people who won’t let their kids play football will take them skiing or let them do gymnastics or any number of other sports that are more dangerous in the aggregate.

                  1. Youth soccer has more injuries that pee-wee football.

                2. What I can’t understand is, they were bending over backwards to placate people who never put any money in their pocket, and were never going to. I understand kissing your customers ass, but the league has been giving them the finger for years now.

                  1. @anitsocial-ist-
                    I figure most of it is completely due to market saturation. They figure they won’t lose the people who have been watching for years because they have to much invested and they want to appeal more to women and pussies.

                  2. I don’t get it either anti-socialist. It is more than that even. They are bending over backwards to placate people their fan base loathes. I don’t know a single football fan male or female, R or D, who doesn’t think all of this stuff is idiotic and are not tired of hearing about it.

                    They should take a lesson from the video game companies’ response to gamer gate. They all sided with their customers and told the SJWs to go fuck themselves.

                  3. The NFL’s customers are the NFL owners, not the fans, at least that’s how it looks to me.

        2. Yes, his agent failed him miserably.

  25. Nurse Allegedly Killed 38 Annoying Patients, Took Selfies With Bodies

    A nurse working in a northeastern Italian hospital has been arrested as part of an investigation into the deaths of 38 patients who, cops said, she may have injected with potassium chloride because they or their family members were “annoying,”

    Coworkers suspected Daniela Poggiali, 42, because patients would suddenly worsen and die during her shift. They described her as a “cold, polished” person who sometimes sedated patients who bothered her during her shift. They also suspected she gave patients laxatives to embarrass the colleagues who worked after her.

    1. I wonder if they’ll release the selfies to the public.

    2. But never forget, the horror stories about government run healthcare are just rightwing lies.

    3. If only those anarchist Italians had government regulations against medical providers poisoning their patients this could have been averted.

    4. The Obama Administration needs her.

      1. That would certainly cut down on granny’s expensive end-of-life care.

  26. New Hampshire Republican: Rep. Ann McLane Kuster “is as ugly as sin”

    New Hampshire State Rep. Steve Vaillancourt wrote a long blog post predicting the outcome of the race in the state’s 2nd Congressional District on one factor: incumbent Democratic Rep. Ann McLane Kuster’s looks.

    “Let’s be honest. Does anyone not believe that Congressman Annie Kuster is as ugly as sin? And I hope I haven’t offended sin,” Vaillancourt wrote on NH Insider, a New Hampshire politics blog.

    By contrast, he wrote, Kuster’s Republican challenger, State Rep. Marilinda Garcia, is “one of the most attractive women on the political scene anywhere, not so attractive as to be intimindating [sic], but truly attractive.”

    1. What a fucking moron. I guess he would be okay with anyone, no matter how awful they were, as long as they were good looking.

      1. In his defense, that’s what a lot of elections come down to. When the low information voter sees two candidates that they don’t know from Adam(or Eve in this case) and don’t understand the issues, they pick the pretty one.

        1. I am not so sure about that. If that is true, then why are so many politicians male and female so ugly? If looks really got you somewhere in politics, it would seem like the list of attractive politicians would be a lot longer than the five or ten at most it is.

          1. I agree, looks don’t have a lot to do with it. Other stupid factors like whether the candidate seems like a nice person or means well certainly do.
            Since most politicians at the national level anyway are over 50, you aren’t going to get a lot of hotties.

            1. The “I want to feel like they care about me” and “I just want them to be a nice person” factor that really matters and helps to ensure why so many politicians are so awful.

            2. Those are sadly factors for many people who somewhat follow politics. I’m talking about people who don’t know jack shit,but may have seen the candidates faces on a billboard or something.


              1. anti-socialist,

                As bad factors go, I think voting on looks is the lesser of the two evils.

            3. Name a presidential race in the last 50 years where the uglier of the two won.

              1. One could make the case that Romney was the better looking in 2012, I think.

                It’s hard to decide if Dukakis or GHW Bush was uglier.

                Ford/Carter is a tough one too.

              2. Nixon over McGovern.

      2. And surely he should know TEAM BLUE!!!111!!! is going to trumpet this in every race across the country for the rest of the election season as “proof” of how sexist every Republican in the country is. (Never mind that Kuster is running against a woman.)

        1. Republican women aren’t women. They are gender traitors.

    2. Tee-hee! Imagine if a Rep. said Michelle is ‘ugly as sin’!

    3. I wouldn’t say she is ugly just old and very homely.

    4. Garcia is pretty easy on the eyes. I’m considering changing my voting policy to just voting for the candidate I most want to have sex with.

      Kuster just looks like any unremarkable middle aged woman.

      1. I think you should just write in “Kunster” on the ballot and hope you have an impossibly close election. Then you can watch both of them fight for your vote.

        “Obviously I am the Kuntster!”

        “No way, you are Kuster, I am a giant Kunster. Ask anyone!”

      2. I am liking Miss Garcia a lot. How much damage could she do in the House anyway? I would sure rather watch her on the House Floor and at SOTU addresses than Henry Waxman.

        If the Congress has to suck anyway, why can’t they at least be easy on the eyes?

        1. I’d certainly take her over Kuster. Could do a lot worse.

  27. CBO Projections Indicate Obamacare Will Raise Deficits by $131 Billion

    In all, therefore, CBO projections indicate that Obamacare will increase deficit spending by $131 billion from 2015-24. That’s a $311 billion swing from the extrapolated 2012 numbers, a $240 billion swing from the actual 2012 numbers, and a $255 billion swing from what we were told when Obamacare was passed.

    Polling has consistently shown that Americans do not believe that Obamacare, with its roughly $2 trillion in new federal spending, would somehow reduce deficit spending. To the contrary, they believe it would send deficits soaring. Still, it’s good to know that even the CBO, which has been one of Obamacare’s few friends in this regard, now seems to think Obamacare would increase deficits by over $100 billion.

    1. Remember it was only passed via reconciliation because it was “deficit neutral”.

    2. Whatever the CBO says, you take that number and multiply it by a magical Keynesian multiplier of, say 10. Then you will get the real deficit number.

  28. Preview first, then submit. Preview first, then submit.

    The Republicans’ 404 Error Page Is a Hillary Clinton Joke

    1. I punched it up for you below.

    1. I his defense he put down his partisan blinders and admitted it was a good idea.

      1. Surprisingly the comments actually aren’t retarded either.


        Draugr 1 hour ago
        Pic of Sarah Palin + “Sorry, there’s nothing here.”
        Lord North
        Lord North 1 hour ago
        Or Tina Fey in Palin clothes. I can see Russia from my deck but I can’t find your website.

        Their obsession with Palin borders on unhealthy.

        1. I take exception to your definition of the word ‘borders’.

  29. Just out of curiosity I went to find out if Lysol would be effective against Ebola virus. What I found was Lysol’s singularly unhelpful and authoritarian Ebola FAQ

    1. I don’t think Lysol is much of a disinfectant. If I am worried about Ebola, I am going for the bleach.

      1. The problem is that bleach wrecks lots of things other than microorganisms. It is a hell of an oxidizer, and the chlorine attacks stainless steel and can turn it to black mush.

        1. How about hot water and lemon juice? The acid from the lemon will kill a lot of germs. Then make sure the counter is dry afterwards and any remaining germs will die from the light and lack of water. Germs of any kind don’t do well on a dry, clean, sunny surface.

          1. But Ebola is not a germ, it is a virus. Many disinfectants that are effective against germs, i.e., bacteria, function by lysing the cell wall. A virus does not have a cell wall, and can only be destroyed by chemically cleaving its protein structure or damaging it with high energy photons.

            1. This is what I was thinking–viruses aren’t all that easy to get rid of. So, of course, what we need is cleansing, pure, and natural radiation.

              1. It is the only way to be sure.

            2. Correct.

              Use Bleach.

            3. That varies a lot among viruses, doesn’t it? As I understand it, some viruses really can’t survive long outside of a host (I think HIV is like this) and others can crystallize and be viable for a long time.

              1. Yes, that seems to be true. I don’t know what is the mechanism for the inactivation or destruction of viruses upon dehydration.

      2. For me, the goto cleaner is H2O2. At least 12%. They sell it at my grocery store but you have to ask for it. They only keep the 3% on the shelf.

        1. I read an article on HN about how a chemist refuses to touch HO above 30 and never touches HOOH. He then goes on to describe how HOOOOOH has been made and how insane and reckless it is to even think about. Pretty funny.

          1. That’s Derek Lowe, writing at pipeline.corante.com

            1. don’t lurk the same sites I do db…it is creepy.

      3. Besides, the point is that Lysol’s official “Ebola FAQ” lists no questions at all and consists entirely (at this point) of an infographic from the CDC stating flat out that “Ebola is not a risk in the United States.”

        Maybe an update woukd be in order, guys.

      4. It claims to kill/destroy some viruses, at least.

    2. My guess is not, because if it did, Lysol would have that plastered all over their advertising. KILLS EBOLA!

      1. Actually, they do say that Lysol “is expected” to work against Ebola virus, but that seems to mean that it hasn’t been thoroughly tested and they aren’t willing to makea claim regarding its efficacy.

        1. And, for the record, not every public health organization in the U.S. agrees with CDC on the modes of transmission on Ebola and the appropriate PPE that health care workers should be wearing when working with Ebola patients.

          1. But… how can science operate without CONSENSUS?

          2. But…but…but…Tom Frieden assured us that the CDC has protocols in place and that the only way you can get infected is if you break protocols.

            Pure Lysenkoism.

          3. Yeah, my ex works in an ER and she said that there were differing protocols on how to deal with it.

            Everything from “you just need a facemask” to “you gotta suit up”

        2. Actually, they do say that Lysol “is expected” to work against Ebola virus, but that seems to mean that it hasn’t been thoroughly tested and they aren’t willing to makea claim regarding its efficacy.

          You’ll notice that products like Lysol say stuff like, “Kills 99% of Viruses”.

          To be fair to Lysol, they probably haven’t had an Ebola virus in their lab to do a test. But they’ve probably done enough research to know its profile to make a reasonable guess that Lysol would in fact kill Ebola.

          My understanding is the stuff Lysol, alcohol, bleach etc. won’t kill are those rare viruses that exist in a protein shell– like Norovirus.

          I’ve never heard anything about that with Ebola.

    3. Lysol works by making the room stink like an old person’s shoe and running everyone out of the room and away from the ebola.

    4. Besides, everyone knows you’re supposed to powerwash it into the nearest storm drain.

      1. Fools! How are we to deal with those sewer-bred Ebolas climbing up out of toilets and attacking our junk?!?

        1. Phantasm VII: The Ebolizer?

          1. Made me think of this classic trailer…

  30. the agency will “double down” on training for healthcare workers

    Lovely. The CDC is using blackjack metaphors to describe their strategy for handling Ebola.

    1. Ebola is the “11” of infectious disease.

      1. And the government response is the 18″ Stonehenge.

  31. The head of the Centers for Disease Control says other hospital workers in the U.S. could have Ebola.

    Wait a minute, I thought they were telling us just a few days ago that it’s basically impossible for Ebola to spread in the United States. So I guess either they were lying, or they don’t know what the hell they’re talking about. Knock me over with a feather.

    1. Inconceivable!

    2. Please see above the link to Lysol’s handy CDC-provided Ebola FAQ. Ebola is NOT A SIGNIFICANT RISK. End of story.

    3. they were telling us just a few days ago that it’s basically impossible for Ebola to spread in the United States

      Anyone who believed that is a dope. I’m not worried about it too much, but of course it can be transmitted anywhere.

      But if it were more easily transmitted than is commonly suggested, I’d expect a lot more cases in Africa since it has gotten into cities. Unless they are significantly underestimating the numbers.

      1. I think it is unlikely to gain a real foothold in the U.S., but they should be treating people like adults, not uttering misleading reassurances out of the sides of their mouths. Be honest about the potential risks so that people can take reasonable protective measures. They are so terrified of a panic that they slow walk the news and pretend there is no chance of an outbreak. Well, there is a much better chance of containing it if the people have all the facts.

        1. Yes, I agree. Just give the straight story and admit where we are ignorant or unsure about anything.

          People are a lot less prone to panic, especially about things like diseases and natural disasters, than governments tend to believe.

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