Financial Crisis Quotation of the Day

In the Washington Post today, former director of the Congressional Budget Office Douglas Holtz-Eakin pretty much says it all about the AIG dust-up and much else: 

The … lesson is that no matter how bad you think market capitalism is, the federal government has proved it is worse. Congress originally banned these very bonuses, then stripped the ban out of the stimulus bill and is now threatening confiscatory taxes on the lawful recipients. The Treasury knew about the bonuses and vouched for their legality but now wants double the money back somehow. How, exactly, the Treasury expects any straight-thinking financial entity to enter into a voluntary public-private "partnership" to solve the financial crisis given this track record is a mystery to me. 

Yes, indeed.

Comments

[Lefiti]

I think this comes under the rubric of having your ears tickled. You fucking libertarians are shameless in your predilection for any fucking sop that shores up the faith. Keep those blinkers in place!

[sage]

One of the sad things is that no matter how bad things get screwed up, all our leaders have to do is mutter "something something the last eight years" and justify further incompetence.

[Other Matt]

Nailed it, that quote is golden.

[Blue]

Heck of a job Barry

[Art-P.O.G.]

Lefiti is a puzzling fellow, indeed. What are his secret motivations? Who are his paymasters? I hope they're getting a discount rate.

And what of Art-P.O.G.? Libertarian cosmotarian or apolitical eccentric?

[John C. Randolph]

Left Titty,

It's really funny to see someone like you, with your faith in demonstrably corrupt, masively incompetent government, trying to take a cheap shot at us for having "faith" in the free market.

It's not faith that shows us that freedom is the way to go, it's history and experience.

-jcr

[Episiarch]

How, exactly, the Treasury expects any straight-thinking financial entity to enter into a voluntary public-private "partnership" to solve the financial crisis given this track record is a mystery to me.

You'd think so, but a few hundred billion dollars can affect "straight thinking".

[instasilly]

Another reason why nobody should ever be bailed out for any reason. That goes for auto, banking, single mothers, sports teams, shopping centers and everyone else. How did we get here? Why do BOTH parties utterly fail to understand this?

[SugarFree]

Art-P.O.G.,

With your love of Synthpop, I just figured you DJed at gay disco.

[The Angry Optimist]

not to be a pain in the ass, but I do start to wonder why OLS and Lefiti are still prolific around here and I'm behind an anonymizer.

Meh. reason doesn't really have its priorities in order, but no matter.

If you guys want another real story on this AIG thing, notice how the White House, with the aid of the media in the commission thereof, pulled a hitjob on Chris Dodd.

[John C. Randolph]

all our leaders have to do is mutter "something something the last eight years" and justify further incompetence.

Hell, it worked for FDR. There are still people stupid enough to worship that SOB.

-jcr

[SugarFree]

TAO,

not to be a pain in the ass, but I do start to wonder why OLS and Lefiti are still prolific around here and I'm behind an anonymizer.

Also consider the Lefiti spoof wars. Didja notice is wasn't much a big deal until joe started getting spoofed? That's when the banhammer came out. Curious.

[John C. Randolph]

TAO,

I think that Dodd may have just realized that he might not be able to bluff his way out of the mortgage scandal, and decided to take one for the team. That way, he'll have a bunch of his fellow pols who owe him a favor, which will be worth a fortune when he becomes a lobbyist in a couple of months.

-jcr

[PC]

"How, exactly, the Treasury expects any straight-thinking financial entity to enter into a voluntary public-private "partnership" to solve the financial crisis given this track record is a mystery to me."

I thought this was the Fed.

[The Angry Optimist]

The other day, I think it was Jesse who was actually arguing with Lefiti; and so too Jacob Sullum was arguing with OLS.

I mean, why are these guys even allowed around here, anyway?

[R C Dean]

You'd think so, but a few hundred billion dollars can affect "straight thinking".

I would expect that execs will be notably cooler to any arrangement, no matter how much capital it makes available to "the system", that requires them to put the majority of their compensation at risk.

[Pro Libertate]

This is the state of the affairs today: Our leaders are so stupid, and we are collectively so stupid, that they think they can turn on a dime and take diametrically opposing positions over and over and over again. And they are usually right.

The AIG retention bonuses are disturbing, and I think AIG probably should've worked out something very deferred to avoid directly paying them with public money. That said, AIG's hubris is not even within an order of magnitude as bad as the hubris of the Obama administration and of Congress. In a rational world, all of the screechers in our government would be forced to resign over their dangerous, unethical, dishonest, and unconstitutional behavior.

[TofuSushi]

True Liberals are not for corrupt government. We are for good government.

Thank goodness for the November 08 revolution that got the right people in charge again.

[domoarrigato]

Nancy Pelosi is going to tax ALL Wall St. bonuses at 90%. (at least those who work for TARP recipients). My buddy and his wife (who both got bonuses from JPMorgan) are considering divorce to get under the 250k limit.

[TofuSushi]

TAO,

Why are you afraid of other persons ideas?

[The Angry Optimist]

The galling quote is from Grassley, though, given that he sat on the conference committee that finalized the bill.

For my money, JCR, it just looks like another bus-toss for Obama. He's done it to others; why not here?

[Solana]

Sorry, I only got as far as the picture of Barney Frank. Then I stopped and thought:

ZOMG! HOW ARE THESE PEOPLE IN CHARGE?!

[TofuSushi]

domo,

Are you proud of being friends ith tax cheats who are taking milk from the mouths of innocent little underprivileged babies?

[Other Matt]

Nancy Pelosi is going to tax ALL Wall St. bonuses at 90%. (at least those who work for TARP recipients). My buddy and his wife (who both got bonuses from JPMorgan) are considering divorce to get under the 250k limit.

If they didn't divorce prior, will it save them?

[The Angry Optimist]

I'm with PL. AIG bonuses = kind of bad.

Grandstanding about AIG bonuses when you signed and approved the bill knowing full-fucking-well that they were going to get paid = galling hypocrisy of the first order.

I want to pound my shoe on my desk and threaten the Government with nuclear annihilation.

[domoarrigato]

domo,

Are you proud of being friends ith tax cheats who are taking milk from the mouths of innocent little underprivileged babies?

I have never met Tim Geithner in person, but I'm sure he's a nice guy...

[The Angry Optimist]

Please do not feed the unfunny spoofs of trolls or their all-too-real brethren.

you see, Sugarfree? On what planet is TofuSushi a worthwhile addition to the debate? I don't get it.

[domoarrigato]

If they didn't divorce prior, will it save them?

Divorce is effective for tax purposes DEC 31 of the calendar year, so it should work. But it depends on how the law is written - whether the 250k applies to an individual, or a household.

[Solana]

I'm with PL. AIG bonuses = kind of bad.

Grandstanding about AIG bonuses when you signed and approved the bill knowing full-fucking-well that they were going to get paid = galling hypocrisy of the first order.

I want to pound my shoe on my desk and threaten the Government with nuclear annihilation.

Right. The bonuses are bad... but they were enabled by the bailout, which was/is also bad. More than bad. It's the goddamn problem. But, then, the government is also bad: maybe 95% of the people who make it up are stupid and the other 5% are actually evil.

Bad, bad, bad.

And it's only getting worse.

[JiggleTits]

"Are you proud of being friends ith tax cheats who are taking milk from the mouths of innocent little underprivileged babies?"

tiresome...

[Other Matt]

I have never met Tim Geithner in person, but I'm sure he's a nice guy...

+1

and another +1, and a beer if you catch me in the bar after cleaning up the juice I just sprayed all over my office laughing at that one.

[Reinmoose]

You'd think so, but a few hundred billion dollars can affect "straight thinking".

Funny, you only required $20.

[PR]

Does Barney Frank have any teeth?

[James Ard]

The days of a rational world are over now that the children have assumed control, with the help of their press enablers.

[Barney Frank\'s \"friend\"]

He does, but luckily, they are not too sharp.

[Pro Libertate]

It's so mindnumbingly crazy that they passed a bill that protected bonus payouts then act like they had nothing to do with it. My God, are we incapable of punishing these idiots? I'm not kidding and not even being a libertarian when I think every open mouth should be out of office--right now.

Them vocally regretting the "mistake" wouldn't bother me, nor would them suggesting that the next round would be tougher for AIG and others if they abuse the public funds they're getting. But brazen lies and unconstitutional behavior needs to be stopped--by removal from office. Without this, things are just going to get worse and worse.

[domoarrigato]

Thank Other Matt - making jokes is all I can do. Apart from move to Canada.

[ten-seven]

Thanks, Massachusetts, for sending this flaming a-hole to Congress over and over. Thanks a lot.

[mahesh17]

LONDON, March 14 (Reuters) - Investors may cautiously welcome finance chiefs' willingness to do whatever it takes to fix the global financial system and revive growth, marginally benefitting riskier assets like stocks at the expense of government bonds on Monday.

But the lack of a globally coordinated fiscal response to the economic crisis from finance ministers and central bankers of the world's 20 leading economies could yet dampen optimism and cap any followthrough from last week's stock market bounce.
----------------------
mahesh17
Drug Intervention Washington-Drug Intervention Washington

[Alan Vanneman]

I don't think AIG "volunteered" for a public/private partnership. I think they wrote a memo to the federal government saying "bail us out or we take the whole world economy down with us." AIG could have gone bankrupt, after all, in which case the guys now collecting bonuses would be penniless, not to mention facing endless lawsuits from angry creditors.

Yes, the "outrage" is hysterical--people are looking for scapegoats--but let's not forget that it was the Wall Street crowd who came to DC demanding a handout. Beggars can't be choosers. Under both the Bush and Obama Administrations, the Treasury Dept. has tried to reassure Wall Street that nothing has changed. But that isn't true.

[The Angry Optimist]

Fine and fair, Mr. Vanneman, but the Government didn't have to listen. It did listen, however, and is now retroactively trying to change the terms of the agreement even though it had full knowledge that the bonuses were going to get paid from the public coffers.

[domoarrigato]

The scary thing is that the govt knows it can't just tax AIG bonuses, because it would fall afoul of the equal protection clause - so they are going to hit everyone who works for a TARP recipient. In doing so, they are confiscating a majority of peoples comp - people who worked for JPM whose company didn't want/need the TARP in the first place! people who didn't do anything to collapse the economy.

question: do they want to target AIG bonuses and need this as an way to get around the law, or do they want to target all bonuses and are using AIG as an excuse...

[Gilbert Martin]

So why aren't the bonuses being paid to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac employees just as worthy of being yanked back as the one's at AIG.

The government took over 100% of those institutions.

If Congress wants to be all retroactive, it should go after Franklin Raines and grab back the multi-millions he made while at Fannie Mae.

[TofuSushi]

When we have an wage-free society we will all be free.

[domoarrigato]

Gil, they are. but only retroactive to Jan 1 2008.

[JiggleTits]

"When we have an wage-free society we will all be free."

zzzzzzzzzzzz...

[Gilbert Martin]

How about taking back 100% of Congress' pay?

Clowns like Frank and Dodd are every bit as complicit in causing the financial mess as anyone in the private sector they are screaming about.

[domoarrigato]

I suggest that government employees income be taxed at 90% until the government is running a surplus...

[jsh]

I suggest that government employees income be taxed at 90% until the government is running a surplus...

And that property taxes in the DC area be raised to 90%.

[Other Matt]

My God, are we incapable of punishing these idiots?

These idiots are the ones put in power to punish the last idiots. We needed "Hope" and "Change", now we have it. You sure you want to go down that spiral for another cycle?

[Other Matt]

And that property taxes in the DC area be raised to 90%.

Personal property too, don't forget.

[..]

I mean, why are these guys even allowed around here, anyway?

If y'all keep rising to their bait they'll never leave.
Narcissists require feedback. Don't give it to them.

[kinnath]

If y'all keep rising to their bait they'll never leave.

Not much different than the first time your five-year-old says "fuck". He or she has no idea what he or she just said, but it gets a lot of attention.

[TofuSushi]

..,

Yep, those people are tiresom.

[domoarrigato]

Whoever spoofs TofuSushi is far more entertaining than the real one. depending on who is doing it. YMMV.

[TofuSushi]

domoarrigato,

Just because I think your friends should be in jail is no reason to dislike me.

[R C Dean]

When we have an wage-free society we will all be free.

For certain values of "free", this is true.

[TofuSushi]

R C D,

We will all be equal too.

[JB]

Government is dumb, and Obama is really dumb.

When is he going to release those test scores of his?

[JB]

Yeah, I no longer read comments by Lefiti.

Tofusushi is purposefully trying to be ironic, but it gets old after awhile and he is only slightly funnier than Jon Stewart (which is a very low bar).

[JB]

I love Obama's recent tactic: I'm not supposed to know what's in the bills I sign!

Not reading the porkulus is really coming back to bite Obama and the demotards in Congress.

[alan]

SugarFree | March 19, 2009, 10:12am | #
TAO,

not to be a pain in the ass, but I do start to wonder why OLS and Lefiti are still prolific around here and I'm behind an anonymizer.

Also consider the Lefiti spoof wars. Didja notice is wasn't much a big deal until joe started getting spoofed? That's when the banhammer came out. Curious.

To be honest, the management here coddling the all too Precious One just added fuel to my fire to annoy him until he left.

But THO is under a ban? Jeez-Loueez . . .

[The Angry Optimist]

wherever this THO guy is, I stand in solidarity with him, alan! 😛

jkjklol. 😀

[SugarFree]

wherever this THO guy is, I stand in solidarity with him, alan!

Not me. I think The Hairy Optimizer is an asshole.

[alan]

LOL! Coffee really was mighty weak this morning.

[John C. Randolph]

How about taking back 100% of Congress' pay?

Good start. I'd also reduce the session to no more than thirty days in a year. Serving in the legislature needs to be like serving on a Jury. It should NEVER be a way to make a living.

-jcr

[Timothy Geithner]

Pssssst. I'm not wearin' any underpants.

[WeNeedAnAmendment!]

"Congress shall meet every year and hold its sessions..."

I've always thought this should read:

"Congress shall meet no more than once a year and hold its sessions..."

[R C Dean]

WeNeedAnAmendment!

We need a whole bunch of amendments. I'd like to see one requiring every Congress to hold its sessions in a different city, with no city eligible to repeat for 20 years.

[The Angry Optimist]

RC - NO! I'm in the 15th largest city in the nation, and I don't want those fools traipsing about my fair city for most of a year.

[Pro Libertate]

I say that we tell Congress that we've built them a Fortress of Solitude at an undisclosed location within the Arctic Circle to protect them from terrorists and other malcontents, then ship them off to. . .an undisclosed location in the Arctic Circle that, sadly, doesn't really include a Fortress of Solitude or, for that matter, any shelter at all.

Bon voyage!

[Hazel Meade]

The irrationality of investors may produce bubbles, but the rationality of politicians turns busts into ever-loving clusterfucks.

[Gilbert Martin]

"I love Obama's recent tactic: I'm not supposed to know what's in the bills I sign!"

Another good one is Obama proclaiming that he wasn't the one who wrote the bonus contracts.

But of course he was the one who signed the legislation that approved honoring them.

[Zeb]

If only Frank could have been chairman of the queers, pot and gambling committee instead.

[Hazel Meade]

I say that we tell Congress that we've built them a Fortress of Solitude at an undisclosed location within the Arctic Circle to protect them from terrorists and other malcontents, then ship them off to. . .an undisclosed location in the Arctic Circle that, sadly, doesn't really include a Fortress of Solitude or, for that matter, any shelter at all.

I vote for a Club Med type place on some unnamed Carribean island.

[Pro Libertate]

Well, okay, but only so long as we're lying about the island being in the Caribbean. And about the Club Med.