SSDP to Drug Czar: Piss Off

Next week the Office of National Drug Control Policy will begin a four-city propaganda tour urging schools to take advantage of federal grants for student drug testing. Students for Sensible Drug Policy is organizing protests in Orlando on January 19, San Diego on February 26, Falls Church, Virginia, on March 15, and Milwaukee on April 25.

Comments

[kmw]

Let's see where we can go with this...

*Random student drug testing pisses me off

*This is one school test I'm no wiz at

*Aim high - say no to drug testing

[James Feldman]

Uh, what happens to the students who test positive for drugs? Since going to school is required by law, doesn't this just piss all over the 5th Amendment (yep, pun intended).

[David]

What's a 5th amendment?

[jeffiek]

An ammendment is a change or clarification to a document. The 5th ammendment would be the fifth occurence.

My question is: What document?

[James Feldman]

Uh, this document: No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Seems being forced to go to a place where they force you to piss in a cup is the textbook definition of being compelled to be a witness against yourself.

[Chuck]

James--

The drug testing programs currently in vogue get around 5th amendment issues by only requiring drug testing for students who participate in extracurricular activities, which are "optional" (unless you want to get into a decent college). Such activities include sports, band, student government, and any clubs a school might sponsor. Want to be in the chess club? Go pee in that cup, right over there.

Of course, these programs are always successful, too. If there are a lot of positive tests, this is proof that there is a drug problem in the schools and that the program is successfully keeping those little druggies from contaminating the normal kids. If there are few positive tests, this is proof that the program is deterring kids from trying drugs. It's a win-win situation!

See you later. I'm off to go buy lots of LabCorp stock.

[James Feldman]

Chuck: I understand that is how they have worked. I guess what I'm wondering is what these grants are supposed to pay for, since the article doesn't say that, and then what sort of discipline students who test positive are up for, which is also not mentioned.

[Jake Boone]

"...nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation."

Maybe students should just start charging for their urine. "Sure, you can test me, but I simply couldn't part with my precious fluids for less than, say, $30.00 per ounce."

[Ammonium]

I don't believe that the Supreme Court has incorporated the 5th amendment into the Constitution.

[Dar]

$30.00 per ounce! Piss on that. How about this. Oh you wish to collect my DNA hmmm well it is copyrighted material which is only available from me. How about 1 million and you can have you cup O`urine. Could they force us to give away copyrighted material for free? Not according to the RRIA and MPA or any other place that enforces copyrighted material from being distributed without them getting a cut. So all we need to do is have our DNA copywrited and then wait for the call to start the bidding.

Dick Morris wrote recently about how the GOP needs to get back on issues they are so strong IE Drug War and to offer more drug testing to schools.

What a great angle for the GOP they can act as if they care about "the children," just like the Dems do so well and they can step on people's rights who are not even able to vote. All I can hope is that those who are tested remember who wanted to test them in a few years when they can vote. Perhaps they won't feel the violation of their privacy and rights will stop with drug testing alone if they allow those same people to continue to lead. I mean who would believe someone that says they have no intention to trample your rights or freedom when in fact they already have.

If they had asked me for a urine test in high school I would have flat told them the only urine test your getting from me is a taste test!

I am even considering stumbling with my overfilled cup of urine and tossing it all over our HR lady and her office. OPPS I must have tripped, oh well it was your idea anyway HR lady so your directly to blame. Otherwise why else would I have been walking through the office with a cup full of piss? What makes it even more tempting is that HR lady doesn't have to piss ever go figure along with 9 others here. 75% of us are tested 25% of us are not. As of last year our total amount of compensation for yearly raises/bonuses is now tied to our safety record and amounts to 25% of the potential total compensation for our facility. Needless to say this pisses off the 75% that do get tested.

Its all coming to an end soon th emoney is running out. You have government spending $800 billion (sure to go up) on drugs for old people. While at the same time they spend billions to try and stop drugs and incarcerate drug offenders. While at the same time they want to finance urine testing of students. See the common bond here?

Medicare is for the old people and the drug war and drug testing is to protect the children. Mention old people or children no matter that the debate and all logic and facts are trumped then you appear to hate children and old people. Forget what actual facts and ideas you had you old people hater and child beater.

All those that are crying now about the NSA wiretaps now are likely the same people that said I have nothing to fear go ahead and drug test me over the years. Extend that same logic to wiretaps without warrant and see if you still feel the same way. Unfortunetly most people believe the more rights they give away the more the gov is doing to protect them, idiots. So all those who are shocked don't be it has been happening since the WoD started. But no body seemed to mind unless they accidently shot your husband when they kick in the wrong door or you have to prove your innocence to get your large pile of cash back from the cops. After all they are just doing all they can to get those evil monster drug users off the streets to keep us all safe. Haven't you heard them talk about how evil these drug users are we must yield our rights for something this important.

If we are lucky perhaps this check of who has power over what when it comes to peoples personal business will lead to the conclusion that should have been come to all along. Drug Testing is not constitutional and is against or basic freedoms as Americans.

As you doctor if its right for you!

[Warren]

John Walters, i.e the Drug Czar, has been spewing Refer-Madnessesque bilge-water every chance he can get since he took office. Few things get me as torqued as when reporters allow him to sow his bullshit unchallenged.

Here's to the SSDP! I hope the tar and feather the dirty SOB and run him out of town on a rail.

[Lowdog]

Warren - yeah, that McAffrey fuck used to do the same thing. How these people can give a press conference and straight-up lie about marijuana and other drugs without being run out of the room is simple amazing.

I'm with you, I get so mad I start yelling and screaming at the TV.

[DaveInBigD]

Um, is this really a 5th Amendment issue, or is it 4th, "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."

I can't think of anything that makes me feel less secure in my person than the thought of some government bureaucrat sniffing around in my urine.

[James Feldman]

Dave:

I've seen arguments against drug testing that used both the 4th and 5th amendments. I chose to bring up the 5th, since school in this country is compulsory, so any person being given a drug test as a requirement of attending school would be compelled to offer evidence against themselves.

IMHO, the 4th is also apt.

[Russ R]

James Feldman,

The 5th Amendment doesn't rightly apply here because the clause you cite only refers to "criminal cases".

Not that I support gov't drug testing, but it's not like people are being imprisoned for testing positive. All it "proves" is individual consumption, which (fortunately) has always been legal.

Where you really should be looking are the 9th and 10th Amendments.

[Dar]

Russ - Wouldn't the fact that we are having to prove our innocence due to a government issued order which it basically is because we have no recourse with employers should be refuse. Under what other circumstance besides lip stick stains on your shirt and your wife do you have to explain yourself or prove your innocence. If a murderer is caught on tape commiting a murder he is still innocent until a jury finds him guilty. In a case where he does not even have to defend himself personally due to incrimination of himself nor does he have to do anything to prove his innocence with evidence. The sole proof of guilt lays with the prosecution. This is completely contradictory to the drug war proof of innocence assumption of guilt, unless you can prove your innocent.

People may not be imprisoned but livelyhoods are still at risk. Is it worth a drug test to have a father fired from his job for no other reason than he could not prove his innocence via his urine? Does the government actually think it benefited from having someone take a drug test and than fail. If they lose their job over it that is income no longer around to tax. So they have effectively cut their tax base while continuing to alienate the citizens that work for a living and just want to be able to smoke a little ganja at night instead of drink a Budweiser. So they lose money and have done what to stop drug use in the country by doing so, not a fucking damn thing. But hey at least they feel good about it and it looks like they are doing something.

I often wonder if the craze of drug testing is simply to have statistics that say OMG look at how many people failed drug tests this year, WE MUST DO MORE!!! Knowing all along that the testing itself will not stop usage one bit it matters not because that is what they want, the constant appearance of a drug problem running wild in America. Thus the WoD is perpetuated by its very self.

Ask your doctor if its right for you!