Selective Rights
From his vantage point in New Orleans, Michael Barnett (who's packin') has this comment about gun-confiscation:
So there you go, go ahead and grab your pocket-sized copy of the constitution and tear out Amendment II. It should be the first one on the page, because if you've been keeping track, Amendment I should have been torn out years ago. I don't mean to make this a debate about guns, but what I want is for the law to be the law, and that means if the we don't like Amendment II anymore, we need to just go ahead and repeal it, not ignore it. If we just start ignoring the Amendments, we never know what rights we're entitled to and when. That complicates things. Just go ahead and repeal them if we're not gonna use them.
Whole thing here.
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Even as a crazy, wild-eyed gun-nut extremist*, I can’t say that I fault him.
*Well, I’m not really wild-eyed. And hopefully not crazy, either.
I just don’t see the logic in this. Confiscating the guns from people in this way is only going put people in harm’s way. Unless this is a coercive technique to get people who don’t want to evacuate to come around.
I suppose I would think twice about protecting my property no matter what condition if my guns were confiscated.
the whole thing really is unbelievable. it says to me that people really have no idea why the second amendment exists. apparently, when law and order breaks down, and you need to protect yourself the most, it will still assert itself enough to take that ability away from you.
I suspect two things at work behind this idiotic, door-to-door confiscation policy:
1) The stumblefuck policia of New Orleans need to project the image that they’re “DOING SOMETHING!*”
2)Gun Control isn’t about guns. It’s about control.
*I wouldn’t be surprised to see, by Wednesday of next week, NOPD putting on a dog-and-pony show for the media to display all of the guns they’ve confiscated.
Ug. Stupid song about Hurricane Katrina! It seems like people are more insensitive to the event, the further they live away from it.
Lyrics like:
people drown and they get hurt
and they don’t feel so good because they are poor and they can’t get out of the place
then, and,they, the government’s really slow
and they break the levees
and they blow it up with dynamite
and they flood the land
it’s a distraction
it’s a distraction
it is really, oh
it’s really about oil
I mean, what the hell… oil?
Well, it is myspace, for whatever worth that is.
http://www.myspace.com/itn
Its total classism. If you are rich and can afford to hire a private security guard, you are good to go. If you are not and rely on your own gun, the police come and take your only means of self-defense. You are right mediageek its about control and “doing something”
The New Orleans police? Didn’t most of them quit, and the rest are taking orders from the Army?
I’m thoroughly nauseated. I tore out the first, then the fourth, then the tenth, now the second. What’s next?
John-
Possibly to some extent. But according to a report aired on ABC World News Tonight, they’re confiscating guns from rich people defending their homes, too.
The only people who don’t seem to be losing them are police, feds, military, and privately contracted security.
I saw a T-shirt with a reproduction of the Bill of Rights silk-screened on it and a big red stamp over it that read: VOID WHERE PROHIBITED BY LAW
I thought “Damn, ain?t that the truth”.
I don’t really know what the intent behind this is, but the outcome is exactly as John describes.
Are these pigs merely asking people to turn over their weapons, or are they actually tearing houses apart to look?
If the former, I would just say “Gun? What gun? All I got is this bottom half of a cue stick!”
Pigs.
Having the law actually say what it means instead of having to coerce meaning out of hundreds of years of jurispredence would be nice.
Hopefully when this is all over, these police will be held responsible for theft.
You know, after all the posturing by gun owners, is anybody else disappointed we haven’t yet seen a “from my cold dead hands” incident? What happened to the macho gun owners of ‘Merka?
Hopefully when this is all over, these police will be held responsible for theft.
Har!
If by “will be held responsible” you mean “will be given medals” then you’re no doubt correct…
Yes, and perhaps Santa will bring me a pony this year.
I asked this on another thread: will people at least be compensated for the expensive weaponry the cops confiscate?
And I’m willing to bet that, in addition to actual weapons, the cops will also confiscate valuable antiques like the gold-handled single-shot revolver that great-great-great-great grandpa carried when he fought in the Civil War.
Indeed a single-shot revolver would be an unusual antique.
Mike–
Uh-oh. Did I expose my gun ignorance again? Make that “single-shot pistol.”
Let’s see them try this shit with the Coonasses out in the parrishes. Anyone seen Southern Comfort?
I asked this on another thread: will people at least be compensated for the expensive weaponry the cops confiscate?
So far in this disaster, if given two choices to make in any given incident where choice A is The Correct Thing to Do and choice B is Fuck this up even worse which do you think the authorities would choose?
Well, at least there’s a certain consistency here. Elections are when free speech is most necessary — McCain-Feingold that sucker! Civil disorder? Confiscate the non-looters’ guns! (Unless they’re better-armed and better-connected than the cops.)
Anyone seen Southern Comfort?
Long time ago.
Mediageek–
Point taken. Not only will they NOT offer compensation, they’ll probably charge the former owners a “Weapons Removal Fee.”
“Anyone seen Southern Comfort?”
That was a real cult classic for me and my sister growing up. No lie. We’d quote that movie all the time.
“It real simple… we live back in here… dis is our home, and nobody don’t fuck with us “
I don’t understand how they can force anyone out of their home or take their gun. Can anyone tell me the legal precedent that makes this possible? Does it have something to do with martial law? Has martial law even been declared?
Ralphus-
I am seriously wondering if this isn’t the beginning of the end of Rule of Law in this country, to be replaced by Rule of the Guys in Power.
Did you see the new thread, just posted, about the restrictions the military is placing on journalists in New Orleans? No law allows that, either.
“It real simple… we live back in here… dis is our home, and nobody don’t fuck with us ”
I propose this should be the LP’s next campaign slogan.
Jennifer,
What’s fucking frightening is how many people don’t seem to give a shit. I’ve discussed this with people at work and the usual response is “We’ll they should leave.” Maybe they should, but that doesn’t mean they have to. I don’t know if it’s 9/11 or the result of most of us sleeping through high school civics or both. The average citizen just seems much more content to roll over and do what ever the government tells them to.
Jennifer:
I am seriously wondering if this isn’t the beginning of the end of Rule of Law in this country, to be replaced by Rule of the Guys in Power.
Not to sound snarky, Jen, but when have things ever been anything but that way?
WARNING: NAZI ALLUSION ALERT
Ralphus–
I can’t understand this either.
I remember reading a history of World War Two–when Hitler first came to power, some journalist went to Germany and interviewed various (non-Jewish) people, all of whom seemed to really like their new chancellor. And the journalist said, “But aren’t you bothered by the fact that your civil liberties are being taken away?” And this one guy laughed, and pointed out that before, he had no job and no money and no way to feed his family, but now he had all three. And he said, “Who wants to be free to starve?”
I found that hard enough to grasp, but hell–at least that man DID get some concrete benefits for the loss of his liberty–job, money and self-respect. Compare that to most Americans nowadays–what the hell are WE getting in exchange for our lost liberties? A false sense of security propped up by a bullshit personality cult? A permanent pro-USA pep rally?
Jesus.
This Forcing Folks Out And Stealing Weapons Policy makes me shake with fear and anger. I live in Los Angeles and have provided for my family’s needs following the Big Quake should it come. Now I have to consider a gun battle with the inept West Valley Division of the LAPD on top of that? What is a citizen to do when faced with this situation that local law enforcement is forcing you from your self-owned, taxes paid, home and stealing your paid for, registered weapons?
The sad reality of human nature is that we are programmed to want to survive. Somewhere along the line of human history we got it into our heads that we need some form of governing authority to facilitate that survival. Now, for all of our bravado and “land-of-the-free” posturing, we Americans are reall no different than the rest of our wretched species. We want to survive, and we’re willing to do anything we can do do it, especially when we are starving, homless, and staring the Reaper in the eye-socket.
Why, aren’t these survivors standing up for the constitutional rights? Why bite the hand that feeds you? If you’re in the disaster zone and you raise a ruckus in the name of second amendement, chances are you’re either going to end up in a jail cell or a bullet-ridden corpse. Why bother when there a food, shelter, dry clothes, medicine and other basics waiting. All you need to do is obey the man in the olive drab uniform carrying the M-16 and everything will be all right.
I hate to say it, but freedom may be a luxery item. Do I like it? No. However, I understand it.
Is this being done by the city, the state, or the feds?
If it’s being done by the city or the state – it’s still outrageous and depressing, but not surprising…this is a very fucked up state, and nothing that happens in Louisiana can or should be extrapolated for other states. I want to see someone have to FORCE a gunowner to turn over his weapon. If it came down to a fight, my money says the NOPD would back down.
The sad reality of human nature is that we are programmed to want to survive. Somewhere along the line of human history we got it into our heads that we need some form of governing authority to facilitate that survival.
i don’t think that wanting to survive is sad, and i don’t think that it’s wrong to think that a governing authority does, in fact, facilitate that survival. let’s not forget, if government had done its job better in this case, we wouldn’t be seeing the anarchy that we are now (or at least as much of it). government is a great tool when it does its job and doesn’t get out of hand. it’s our job as citizens to hold it accountable when those conditions aren’t met, and it’s our own fault that all too often, we don’t.
if i were in NO right now, i would also give my guns away to the cops if i thought they would kill me otherwise (and if i owned any guns, of course). it doesn’t make much sense to me to hold onto a tool for your own survival, at the expense of your survival. but as citizens under the same government, but removed from the chaos, it’s our job to hold our government accountable for creating that dilemma in the first place.
zach,
I hear you. I don’t think I would get into a gun battle over my gun. Quite frankly my balls aren’t that big. Hell, I probably would have evacuated in the first place. But, the right I cherish most is the right to do stupid shit as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone else. If I want to be stupid and stay in a festering hellhole of looting and disease I should be allowed to. You can try to talk me out of it, but you can’t force me out. And you damn sure can’t force me to turn over the gun that the founding document of this nation says I can have.
“If it came down to a fight, my money says the NOPD would back down.”
You have obviously never dealt with the NOPD. Shit, any Louisiana law enforcement for that matter. They make the cops on The Shield look like mall security guards. They have the “resisting arrest” defense down to a science. NOPD is the most dangerous gang in the city.
Where’s the ACLU stand on this crap?
I don’t know if I would’ve left or not. I have a propensity for thinking things aren’t as bad as they really are that gets me into trouble all the time.
If I was still in NO at this point, however, and the cops came to my door to confiscate my weapon and send me out of town, it’s not like I would “skin that smoke wagon” and “throw down”, but I would for damn sure let them know that I owned the gun and would not relinquish it on 2nd Amemdment grouds. Course, I’d probably be beaten and arrested for my trouble, but I would feel obligated to assert myself thusly.
Having seen what Andrew did to Homestead and knowing that I was under sea level I would have hauled it. But If I didn’t I sure as hell would have gone to the Pooper Dome. I’d hold up in a dry place and protect what was left of my shit.
Lowdog,
I said I wouldn’t get in a gun battle, but I would take an ass beating and an arrest. Then I would take it to the Supreme Court.
The problem is that NOPD is lazy, so they would probably just save themselves the trouble and shoot me.
To clarify, I sure as hell WOULDN’T have gone to the Pooper Dome.
“But aren’t you bothered by the fact that your civil liberties are being taken away?” And this one guy laughed, and pointed out that before, he had no job and no money and no way to feed his family, but now he had all three. And he said, “Who wants to be free to starve?”
Jennifer,
I have been saying this for about 20 years. People say it can’t happen here, but it is happening. The Germans were and are not a bunch of third world peasants. They were a very desperate bunch of very smart and industrious people who believed Hitler would make them safe, if they would just give up some liberties. We know how it all ended up.
How many people are just going along with the program, because they have “nothing to hide”? There is something to be said for being able to afford food and a home to live in, but we’re subjected to more and more searches and invasions of privacy as the price.
Drug test? OK, I have nothing to hide.
Background checks for weapons? OK, I have nothing to hide.
Can we come into your house and look for your guns? …..
Just remember, your status in hell is determined by the size of your “honor guard.”
ralphus,
Louisiana law has no concept called “martial law”. The governor has declared a state of emergency, which grants state and local executives extraordinary powers including mandatory evacuation. The ACLU contends that the Second Amendment protects the right of the several states to form militia for protection against the federal government. (Actually, the ACLU’s position also disregards the Tenth Amendment, but the Tenth isn’t relevant to this situation.)
Here in Baton Rouge they removed all the guns and bullets/shells from the shelves in WalMart and Academy Outdoors. Nice to know I am only allowed to defend myself when they see fit to allow me. never the less another lesson learned from this disaster, keep a large ammo supply on hand at all times and perhaps start reloading your own. needless to say the pawn shops still sold guns and business was brisk at the local gun dealers shops they will never decide when you can have your rights they let you decide, and they throw in a box of shells with each purchase 🙂 Walmart can kiss my ass, if they can’t sell the same things they do every other day of the year when the shit hits the fan and people want to protect themselves they can choke on the rest of their crap as well it can all be purchased else where!! Hunting season opens soon and since there is no meat in the stores with the population doubling here overnight we all might need some bullets just to eat dinner nightly!
Here in Baton Rouge they removed all the guns and bullets/shells from the shelves in WalMart and Academy Outdoors. Nice to know I am only allowed to defend myself when they see fit to allow me. never the less another lesson learned from this disaster, keep a large ammo supply on hand at all times and perhaps start reloading your own. needless to say the pawn shops still sold guns and business was brisk at the local gun dealers shops they will never decide when you can have your rights they let you decide, and they throw in a box of shells with each purchase 🙂 Walmart can kiss my ass, if they can’t sell the same things they do every other day of the year when the shit hits the fan and people want to protect themselves they can choke on the rest of their crap as well it can all be purchased else where!! Hunting season opens soon and since there is no meat in the stores with the population doubling here overnight we all might need some bullets just to eat dinner nightly!