Right in Der Fuehrer's Face
Susy Buchanan and David Holthouse of the Phoenix New Times report from an Arizona Aryanfest:
Have you heard the one about the brown-skinned kid who showed up at the Nazi rally wearing a "WHITE POWER" tee shirt?
This was no joke at Aryanfest 2004, an "international" gathering of Nazi skinheads, Ku Klux Klan members and other white supremacists that took place inside McDowell Regional Mountain Park just north of Fountain Hills a couple of weekends ago.
Aryanfest's gates opened at noon, and about an hour later, the gathering assemblage gradually hushed as all eyes turned upon the young man who had just paid his entrance fee and was casually perusing the hate-rock compact discs, swastika flags and white power watch caps at Panzerfaust Records' merchandise booth.
He was in his late teens or early 20s, had a shaved head and sported Nazi and white power tattoos on both arms, in addition to wearing the white tee shirt with bold, black script.
He would have fit in just fine, except for one thing: He wasn't white. Not even close. There was at least half a cup of Kahl?a in his cream.
Seemingly oblivious to the increasingly hostile stares and menacing murmurs generated by his mere presence, this poor fellow, who seemed on the verge of getting lynched from the nearest sturdy saguaro cactus, was accompanied by three white kids who looked as if their primary aspiration in life was to load amplifiers for Marilyn Manson. They were outfitted in gothic black. Two had long, dirty blond hair, the other an unruly dark brown mop that danced wildly in the cold wind.
About five minutes after arriving, the group of four was approached by a cadre of skinhead security guards. These storm troopers were painfully polite as they informed the brown kid he wasn't welcome. "We're sorry, but we've been asked by the managers of this event to tell you that you have to leave. We're going to escort you out," said one.
"Why?" asked the kid.
The skinheads looked at him incredulously, and not without a degree of sympathy. It was obvious that he actually thought he belonged there, amongst white power kinfolk. "Well, you haven't broken any of the festival's rules," began another skinhead, employing the sort of "I hate to break it to you" tone of voice of a father explaining to his 5-year-old son why a bed sheet tied around his neck doesn't mean he can fly. "The thing is, you're not white."
Crestfallen, the kid stood silent for a few beats, then responded, "Okay, okay. I understand. I respect that. I just hope you know I didn't mean any disrespect by being here. I just wanted to come out and show my respect for the white race and support the cause."
"We respect that, and we appreciate your attitude, you not giving us any trouble," said a skinhead, gently guiding him toward the exit. "It's just we don't allow any non-whites here, and, you know, a judgment call was made and that call was that you're not white. We'll be happy to refund your money. Your friends can stay if they like, and if not, we'll give them their money back as well."
The four interlopers each retrieved their $30 cover charge, then made hastily for their car. Watching them go, celebrity racist Tom Metzger cackled and said, loudly but to no one in particular, "Well, what in the hell do you suppose that spic was thinking?"
Metzger later reveals that he's backing Al Sharpton for president. "Sharpton's the only one to mention race, the only one to recognize there is a white race," he explains.
Editor's Note: As of February 29, 2024, commenting privileges on reason.com posts are limited to Reason Plus subscribers. Past commenters are grandfathered in for a temporary period. Subscribe here to preserve your ability to comment. Your Reason Plus subscription also gives you an ad-free version of reason.com, along with full access to the digital edition and archives of Reason magazine. We request that comments be civil and on-topic. We do not moderate or assume any responsibility for comments, which are owned by the readers who post them. Comments do not represent the views of reason.com or Reason Foundation. We reserve the right to delete any comment and ban commenters for any reason at any time. Comments may only be edited within 5 minutes of posting. Report abuses.
Please
to post comments
Have to say this much for those skinhead security guards, they may be racist would-be mass murderers, but at least they are polite.
That was my exact thought too.
But didn't Chappelle's Show already do this bit?
Well, having been in the punk scene in New Mexico in the '80s I can't say I'm surprised by this at all. Some of the white power skins I came across just left me shaking my head. Some of them did try to insist that they were Spanish and therefore European. And the Germans and Spaniards fought together so the Spaniards were de facto Aryans. Another example of how amazingly people can justify anything to themselves.
Would a white kid trying to attend a Nation of Islam rally be treated so politely? Could a Jew wearing a Star of David walk into a crowd in the West Bank listening to Arafat spewing hate and survive? Metzger is irrational and stupid, but at least he appears to be able to control his more violent disciples.
When I asked if we could all get along, I didn't mean THIS.
True story:
Years ago I worked with an hispanic kid, 19 or so at the time, who got into whole skin head/racist look. We all ignored it until our boss, who was black, gave him a raise and the kid wrote, "Thanks n*gger" on his time card by way of thanks. He was genuinely surprised when his workmates wanted to thrash him and our boss wanted to fire him. After our boss talked to him about the boss said the kid really didn't understand how serious and hurtful the statement was.
I think a lot of low self-esteem kids get sucked into the whole racist thing more for the stylistic rebellious quality than because they're really racist. Race plays such a minor role in the day to day lives of most people, especially whites, that there is little real emotion to drive the skinhead appeal.
From here: http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/american/adl/tom-metzger/portland.html
On the night of November 12, 1988, a neo-Nazi skinhead gang in Portland called the East Side White Pride attacked three Ethiopian immigrants with a baseball bat and steel-toed boots; Seraw was killed. Investigation into the murder revealed links between the skinheads - three of whom were convicted of murder - and Metzger's White Aryan Resistance.
Crucial among these links was a letter to the skinheads signed by Metzger, which stated in part: "Soon you will meet Dave Mazzella, our national vice-president, who will be in Portland to teach you how we operate and to help you understand more about WAR...." Among the operations Mazella taught the Portland gang was attacking people of color. Mazzella later explained: "Tom Metzger said the only way to get respect from skinheads is to teach them how to commit violence against Blacks, against Jews, Hispanics, any minority. The word will spread and they'll know our group is one you can respect."
Mazzella, who was not charged in connection with the murder, later decideed to renounce his racist past and his ties to the Metzgers. He did so by contacting ADL; he later revealed that while a WAR member, he had cased the League's Los Angeles office several times, planning to blow it up. Mazella became a key witness in the civil lawsuit brought on behalf of Seraw's family by the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) and ADL.
The jury awarded the Seraw family $12.5 million, distributed as follows: WAR, $5 million; Tom Metzger, $3 million; his son John, $4 million; and two of the murderers, $500,000. Upheld on appeal on April 20, 1993, this judgment is one of the largest civil verdicts of its kind in U.S. history.
I once knew a guy from Pakistan who was into that sort of thing. There's nothing funnier than hearing white power rhetoric in an accent like Apu from the Simpsons.
Dave Chappelle did a similar bit, as Mo mentioned; the blind black man who's the head of his white-power organization. I'm assuming this black guy was playing a joke, but who knows? Does anyone else remember back in the late 80s or early 90s, when New York's outer boroughs were having all of those black-on-Jew race tensions? I distinctly remember reading about a bunch of black guys at an anti-Jewish rally who started chanting "Heil Hitler."
Of course, applying reason and logic to any racist ideal is a waste of time anyway.
"Upheld on appeal on April 20, 1993, this judgment is one of the largest civil verdicts of its kind in U.S. history."
Isn't that Hitler's birthday? How ironic, no?
PS As a teenager, I worked in an pizza shop, owned by immigrant Italians. I loved them like family, but my only bad memory was getting into once with the owner about him being a bit of a hypocrite for being racist toward blacks. He didn't want to get my point that there were plenty of people that hate him for his ethnicity and the fact he was born outside the US. No more logical than his dislike of blacks.
Gee, I wonder if anyone video taped the "incident?" That would be interesting to see. I am sure some skinhead started videoing in hopes of seeing a beatdown.
My only hope is that perhaps, perhaps, this may have opened a sliver in a few brains in which a little light of reason creeped in.
"a judgment call was made and that call was that you're not white. . ."
Hee hee hee. I wonder if they gave him the old 'paper-bag' test?
I ran across a similar character in Florida in the early 90s. He also used the line about "pure Spanish blood" and seemed genuinely surprised that nobody took him seriously. I've also met some black skins who, while not explicitly affiliated with any racist crews, might as well have been. Of course, racist skins primarily threaten and abuse other white kids, and most of their fights are against other racists/fascists. The skin scene is a lot like far left politics, "People's Front of Judea" and all that.
Root,
Libertarian politics? 🙂
JB, you'd better stfu before I come over there and beat your ass! 😉
Joe,
How about I shove this FAMAS down your throat? 🙂
If the brown kid was from India, he could have had a perfectly valid claim to being "Aryan" -- probably better than some of the whites there.
Hilarious.
If a white guy sporting an AK-47 bursts into a black church and hoses the congregation while shouting, "I love you guys!", is that a hate crime?
We should always be vigilant in protecting the 1st amendment which made this episode possible.
Also, a big benefit of this liberty is that examples of unreasonable behavior can be exposed and disseminated, and the general population then may discount those who are the source of the inequity.
I think part of the appeal to some white kids, fortunately not very many, of racist groups is
as a rebellion against affirmative action and it's unfairness to whites.
Iv'e got a hunch that some of these kids will be offended at the racist's actions in Arizona, which make clear what racism means in practice.
"Could a Jew wearing a Star of David walk into a crowd in the West Bank listening to Arafat spewing hate and survive?"
Actually, there are plenty of examples of Israeli Jews, clearly identifiable as Jews, attending Palestinian rallies in the West Bank and Gaza to help the Palestinians protest the occupation and the Israeli government's racist, apartheid policies. They not only survive, they are thanked enthusiastically and offered the microphone.
What's a FAMAS?
The "bullpup" automatic rifle in use by the French military.
St. Etienne,
Bonjour.
That is one excellent piece of journalism.
Bonjour, although it's more like "Bonsoir" to me.
That reads like a Mel Brooks script.
St. Etienne,
Bonne nuit. 🙂
Merci pour l'explication. 🙂
St. Etienne,
?tes-vous fran?ais?
Mr. Show beat Chappelle to it. Remember the skit commercial for the "new" KKK?
Non, je suis am?ricain, but I thought you might pick up on the FAMAS-St. Etienne connection. Sorry to mislead you.
St. Etienne,
Well, I did, which made me think that you are French. 🙂 Thinking too many steps ahead and not asking enough questions!
Most people know nothing about the "bugle," so I am impressed. 🙂
Ugly as sin, but a fine weapon by all accounts.
7 Jews were killed in a race riot started by Al Sharpton in Harlem & he's running for President.
hmmmm. So how was it that this conversation was able to be repeated so clearly? From mmory? And when the Jerk made his 'cackle' who was it that heard it and reported it? Hmmmmmm.... Sometimes things just seem so, well, incredible... ya know.
I just liked the Spike Jones reference.
I wonder how this would play at some of the black entertainment events when they talk about the oreos and the honkies, etc. The kid was lucky he ran into some fairly decent racists compared to what he could have run into.
As to Al Sharpton, he definitely does do the same thing as the Aryans do here and actually probably causes more problems than they do, yet (as masonn says above) he's running for president.
In any case a pox on all their houses. We should also just try like hell to get along and forgot all this race and creed and sex preferences stuff. Life is tough enough without all that baggage attached.
"to help the Palestinians protest the occupation and the Israeli government's racist, apartheid policies."
I guess "let's push Jews into the sea" doesn't count as a racist, apartheid policy. F*ck yourself.
I agree with Dick. As the leader of the Church of Fandel I believe racism is evil. But I also know in the South racism is everywhere. Both whites and blacks treat each other badly. When you go there you'll start playing along automaticly. I learned by default that if I want something done, I go to a white person. If I go to somebody black, it's almost like you're breaking some law. They make you feel like you're doing something wrong. Both races.
Regarding racism in the South. It's here, of course. But from that load of BS you wrote above, I strongly doubt that you have been.
We're sensitive, caring and, well, just darn nice. We're not your Dad's KKK.
We're the new KKK
Kind, karing and kompassionate?
"One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail."
Rabbi Yaacov Perrin, Feb. 27, 1994 [Source: N.Y. Times, Feb. 28, 1994, p. 1]
Rabbi Avraham Hecht, chief rabbi of the Congregation Sha'are Zion in Flatbush, New York and until recently the president of the Rabbinical Alliance of America, a national organization of 540 Orthodox rabbis, called for the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin and praised Baruch Goldstein, who slaughtered forty Palestinian civilians while they knelt in prayer at a mosque.
Evidence of this license to kill was on view when U.N. war crimes investigators were barred by the Israeli government from entering the Palestinian city of Jenin last April. The Palestinians are completely at the mercy of the Israeli military (IDF) and IDF' rabbis, who teach, as a theological dictum, that the Palestinian people are "Amalek" (pagans against whom genocide is divinely mandated. Cf. for example, Jerusalem-based Rabbi Dov Begon, "Canaanites and Amalekites: As Then, So Too Today," Jewish Press [Brooklyn, N.Y. newspaper], June 21, 2002, p. 47). The U.S. media almost never report this racist and genocidal theology of orthodox Judaism, even as the corporate media relentlessly characterize the religion of Islam as hateful and terrorist.
if thats not racist, i dont know what is! ps fcuk yourself jb
If you read the article, it seems like there were many security hoops people had to jump through to get to the event, so how would a black man get through them all? Smells like BS.
If i'm right, if I wandered into Iraq, felt like I was one of the crowd, perhaps made friends and swapped stories; I would currently be in Git-tom bay?
g,
You've quoted the statements of a rabbi who is the head of a non-governmnetal organization in America as evidence of the racist policy of Israel. Huh?
FUNNIEST. THREAD. EVER!!!!!
Rick B.,
I get it. You are welcome to visit but you can't live here. No apartheid in that is there?
Nope none at all.
Only Palestinians allowed in Palestine. Since Jews obviously can't be Palestinian having all arrived in 1948 from Poland why no Jews allowed is quite reasonable. Don't you think?
Personally I blame it all on Hitler.
I once knew a guy from Pakistan who was into that sort of thing. There's nothing funnier than hearing white power rhetoric in an accent like Apu from the Simpsons.
Hell, he's probably more Aryan than anyone at any any of these sorts of gatherings.
And I'd probably feel more out of place than him - me being a genuine (though not particularly practicing) Catholic, and a not-genuine (though the sort would probably lump me in) Russkie.
-Mark
They only got 350 people. More people would come to Arizona for a flat-Earth convention or Whitley Streiber speech.
To put this in perspective, consider these quotes:
[AFAIK, Art Torres is still the chairman of the California Democratic Party. You can hear his quote and others here]
Tom Metzger is a fan of the Nation of Aztlan.
The Nation of Aztlan is more extreme than MEChA, but let's not forget what the "A" in MEChA stands for. And, let's not forget that Tom Metzger is not the chairman of the California Democratic Party nor is he a Presidential Medal of Freedom recipient.
Rick Barton:
"Actually, there are plenty of examples of Israeli Jews, clearly identifiable as Jews, attending Palestinian rallies in the West Bank and Gaza to help the Palestinians protest the occupation and the Israeli government's racist, apartheid policies. They not only survive, they are thanked enthusiastically and offered the microphone."
Ummm...No. Palestinians don't thank Jews. The Jews might be shot on sight, without being given the chance to say that they hate their own people. Hate to break it to you, but Palestinians are about as evil as neo-Nazi skinheads, and even more dangerous.
Steve Metzger is an @$$hole.
No name:
"The U.S. media almost never report this racist and genocidal theology of orthodox Judaism, even as the corporate media relentlessly characterize the religion of Islam as hateful and terrorist."
How stupid are you? Do you know anything about Orthodox Judaism? Their theology is not "racist and genocidal," and Orthodox Jews don't go around killing people. Palestinians do.
I was recently in a taxi with a taxi driver from Egypt. Out of the blue he asked me if I was a racist. I told him that I wasn't. The taxi driver said loudly that he was and proceeded to lay out his reasoning. His main point seemed to be that white people treated him well and that black people spit on him. I found it all very odd. Maybe it has something to do with racism from his home country.
ah, yes... when i lived in AZ, i had a group of friends who were WP. Strange folk. I bet they were there.
But, y'know, the people i knew there were relatively "normal" people. Polite, too. They were just rascist pigs. Whole families of them. I babysat their kids.
If one could strip their rascism out of their characters, they would have been ok people. But part of the fun of hanging out with them was hearing what sort of weird crap was going to come out of their mouths. I spent a lot of time laughing at them. They didn't care, because they "knew" (!?) they were right and i was just some misinformed person.
See how that goes?
Sid in Flushing:
" Palestinians don't thank Jews. The Jews might be shot on sight, without being given the chance to say that they "hate their own people."
Oh, of course any Jews who oppose the occupation and the Israeli government's racist, apartheid policies must "hate their own people". I get to disabuse you of your ignorance. There have, in fact, been many times when Jews have attended Palestinian rallies to protest the Israeli government's murderous and thieving occupation and they continue to do so. Tikkun tikkun.org covers this front.
"Palestinians are about as evil as neo-Nazi skinheads"
What a racist, stupid thing to say! Shame on you Sid. You sound like a real jerk.
"Do you know anything about Orthodox Judaism? Their theology is not "racist and genocidal"
To the contrary, the Talmud contains lots of racist and genocidal sentiments, most Jews don't believe this BS but some nut balls, such as the ones that Sharon has made political league with take them seriously.
To understand racist, fundamentalist Jewish religious extremism and how Israeli polity is currently gripped by it, see the fascinating:Jewish History, Jewish Religion by Israel Shahak and also Jewish Fundamentalism in Israel by Shahak and Norton Mezvinsky
Note that, Sharon actually supported "Jews Only" housing laws on government land in open discrimination against Israel's 20% Arab population!:
http://www.eto.home.att.net/jewsonly.html
http://www.newsfrombabylon.com/article.php?sid=1779
And, there is the Israeli government's Nazi like, mixed marriage impediment law:
law:http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/01/international/middleeast/01MIDE.html?ex=1072933200&en=b3bdb3489e181def&ei=5070
"Steve Metzger is an @$$hole."
Good Sid, you finally said something right. It's to bad though that you seem to have something quite ugly in common with him.
I like the idea of someone who 'looks' like a skinhead going to a Nation of Islam rally. I fit the bill, and at 6'4", and about 250#, I think I could handle the stares. Any meetings in western N.Y. state?
This MUST be an Onion-planted story, right? Sounds like the script for a new Mel Brooks film.
St. Etienne,
Yes, every similar criticisms.
Is the FAMAS similar to the British IW? I rather like bull-pup designs. Not as aesthetically pleasing as the Steyr perhaps, but far more functional.
Manos>
ben:
"Israel Shahak was an ulta-Leftist anti-semite "
Nonsense! Shahak was a explicitly anti-Marxist Human rights activist who was a Jew and concentration camp survivor! The man was a meticulous scholar. In Jewish History, Jewish Religion, which you need to read so you won't make these ridiculous assertions, his non-Marxism is made clear. Also, Shahak has criticized both the Israeli government and the PA for suppressing free enterprise among the Palestinian people. Here is a review of Jewish History, Jewish Religion from Dr. Edna Homa Hunt, a member of a fourth generation Israeli family, btw :
http://www.middleeastbooks.com/html/books/shahak-jewish.html
Your attempt to portray the Palestinian people as monsters who only embrace civility when it is in their interest is absurd and racist, and citing a tragedy that befell two soldiers of the occupying army does not lend credence to your case against the occupied.
The rate of murdered innocent Palestinian civilians is about twice that of innocent Israeli civilians. Both are tragic. I realize that there is blinding hate on both sides. If you want this cruel insanity to end, urge your government to end the occupation. I just want mine to quit paying for it. Also, you should urge Sharon's ouster from government since having Israel led by a man who actually supported "Jews Only" housing laws on government land in open discrimination against your nation's 20% Arab population...
http://www.eto.home.att.net/jewsonly.html
http://www.newsfrombabylon.com/article.php?sid=1779
...is an affront to freedom loving people every where and not accommodating to the prospects for peace in your nation.
I wasn't surprised by the reaction of the skinhead security team. Hell, who wants a lawsuit? The fact of the matter is when people think about white racists, it is so comfortable to think about some illiterate, toothless redneck, with a John Deere cap on or some converted Muslim hellraiser decrying years of outrage. When in fact, hate doesn't have a monopoly on one kind of person. As much as Metzger has lost in recent years, I am sure he doesn't want to get under the gun again.
MALAK,
The FAMAS was the first bullpup automatic rifle design to go into production for a NATO country. I'm not sure what "IW" means, but the FAMAS is superior to the SA80-A2 now in use by British forces, despite help from Heckler & Koch. No one will ever accuse the FAMAS of being aesthetically pleasing, though - it DOES look like a committee-designed bugle, which is why French soldiers call it "le clarion". As far as I know, only a few are imported into the US - semi-auto, of course.
Just wondering if anyone has met a skinhead, ku kluc klan member or white supremist who plans on voting democratic this November?
Oh yeah, and I almost forgot to mention this in my previous posting. "Hello to all the KFFL guys who just miss me so much. Not to worry though, I will be back, or you will all be gone, whichever comes first."
MALAK,
St. Etienne is correct; it is not exported widely, so you are unlikely to see it (especially the F1). The original F1 (my original weapon) has stopped production, and the G1 and in 1994 the G2 followed it. They are similar weapons, though the G2 carries a thirty-round clip, as opposed to the F1's 25. The rate of fire and effective range have also been increased with the G2; and indeed the G2 was designed to be a weapon capable of being upgraded for France's the FELIN programme (similar to the American "Land Warrior" programme); and there are more variations on the design for the G2 (such as a sniper version and a commando version).
30-round magazines? So much for the "cent cartouches" test.
That a spanish kid would want to attend this sort of event shouldn't be very surprising. The whole rap music industry is driven by white teenagers, many of whom attempt to emulate the ghetto culture. In my neighborhood, I've been called 'whitey' (Im a dark skinned Italian) by obviously Irish descent 14 year-olds with red curly hair, pasty white skin and freckles. The kid seemed a little flustered when in reply I asked if he'd looked in the mirror lately.
St. Etienne,
The British divide the SA80 into two variants; the IW is a "Infantry Weapon" (the L85 as I recall) and LSW is a "Light Support Weapon" - or L86 (a light machine gun in other words). You are right, the 2001-2002 upgrade of the L85 (L85A1 and L85A2 respectively) has been proven unsatisfactory and the British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq have complained bitterly about them.
Not suprising at all, a friend of mine grew up in South Texas, where he encountered quite a few hispanic skinheads. As the story goes, in high school he actually came quite close to a beating from a group of them for some percieved slight, but managed to win them over by speaking fluent German to them.
Jean Bart,
Just what does the FELIN program consist of? It's the first I've heard of it, not spending all my free time on French small arms. 🙂
St. Etienne,
It is essentially a soldier modernization program; where the soldier will be "wired" and have an array of new "gadgets" attached to him (electronic devices that see around corners, infra-red displays attached to the ehlmet, etc.). All of this is supposed to be integrated with the air force, armored units (the LeClerc tanks for example), etc.
St. Etienne,
Here is a description from the government's (France) website:
FELIN : Integrated equipment and communications for the infantryman
Roles
The FELIN program meets a need expressed by the Army staffs for new integrated combat equipment for the infantryman, whose architecture would be modular and which would be interoperable in an multinational operational situation.
The challenge is to significantly increase the infantryman's combat effectiveness and his survivability in all operational situations.
Activity status
Work is currently being undertaken as part of the Combatant System federating project. This overall initiative aims to improve the coherence and ergonomics of the equipment and of the various system components.
The federating project includes firstly a feasibility study of a Deployed Combatant Equipment demonstrator ("ECAD") and secondly, advanced program studies.
The ECAD study aims to produce a demonstrator of a combat group with the group's individual and collective equipment, including those which are specific to the section leader and the marksman. This demonstrator is currently being assessed from both technical and operational aspects, as part of a joint test program.
The federating project brings together studies which can be structured along seven thematic aspects : system, attack, protection, vision, communications, support, assessment tools.
The aims are:
- To explore the possibilities of technologies that were not adopted under the ECAD study so as to assess their suitability for inclusion in the 2005 version of FELIN. Hence, among other things, studies are being or will be carried out on improving flexible and hard protection, a wireless link between the weapon and its mounting structure, a data transmission network internal to the combatant, identification friend or foe systems, improvements in ratios between energy supplied and weight transported and means of recharging batteries, etc.;
- To prepare for the future "Integrated Equipment and Protection for the Combatant in Action" feasibility study ("EPICEA"), which aims to open the way to version 2 of FELIN by around 2015. In this context, the future personal weapon PAPOP ("Polyarme-polyprojectile") is being studied in detail with the aim of providing the combatant with a weapon enabling him to engage moving targets, perhaps masked, using explosive or kinetic munitions.
Industrial aspects
The ECAD study was awarded in December 1996 to a temporary grouping of companies headed by Thomson CSF Services Industrie, which includes as joint-contractors GIAT Industries (protection of the respiratory tract and weapons), A?ro (software), Bertin (energy), Paul Boy? (combat clothing, ballistic and NBC protection), Gallet (helmet), Sextant Avionique (head mounted display), VTN (mount structure and carriage), and as sub-contractors, Thomson-CSF Communications, TAM TELESANTE (medical monitoring), GDI (simulation and identification) and the Laboratoire d'Anthropologie Appliqu?e (ergonomics).
While still schlepping the ancient sac ? dos, I guess. I have heard that some American soldiers would prefer better BDUs, packs and other basics before getting wired to high-tech and -maintainance weapons. Have there been similar critiques of FELIN?
I know this Arabic kid who is really into Nazi punk and its a little disturbing. I've overheard him talking with other would-be Nazi's about eugenics and white supremacy like it was a science waiting to be proven.
rick:
1. Israel Shahak was an ulta-Leftist anti-semite who is not taken seriously by any reputable scholar of Jewish history or theology. I advise you to stop citing him, you're only making a fool of yourself by doing so.
2. Pro-Palestinian Jews are obviously not attacked because the Palestinians are aware of their immense propaganda value. Two reserve soldiers in 2000 found out what happens when non-pro-Palestinian Jews happen into Palestinian territory: they had their internal organs ripped out and their bodies hurled out a window.
3. Your denial that genocidal anti-semitism is endemic in Palestinian politics and culture is absurd and obviously ideologically motivated. I live here. I've seen the imams on TV brandishing scimitars at the Al-Aqsa mosque screaming about death to the Jews. I've seen the graffitti in East Jerusalem calling for us to be thrown into the sea. Think what you want, but don't insult my intelligence please.
Today (I work for a law office in the south) I saw a fax laying on the boss's desk. It was an appraisal of a house a client had up for sale. The cover sheet said:
Dear ____,
See attached report. The house is in need of serious work. Several renters in the house -- one is black--
Sincerely, ____
Rick Barton:
I don't see why you need to resort to personal insults. Quite obviously, I know a LOT more about this subject than you.
"The rate of murdered innocent Palestinian civilians is about twice that of innocent Israeli civilians."
Where does this come from exactly? maybe palestinians murdered by other arabs. hate to brek it to you, but if you follow the news, innocent civilians are being killed daily by palestinian terrorists. when israel occasionally retaliates, the "people" killed are palestinian militants, who are often planners of previous terrorist attacks!
would you call those "innocent?"