German Homeschoolers Granted Asylum in U.S.

A family of German homeschoolers have been living in Tennessee for a couple of years now. They came seeking refuge from the government in their native land, where teaching your kids at home is effectively illegal. While most countries have some kind of education mandate, there are loopholes, exceptions, and limited enforcement. In Germany, the only exceptions are in cases of ill health—and a November 2007 ruling reinforced the state's right to take custody of kids who are not attending school.

The Romeike family was hit with fines "totaling over $11,000, threats that they would lose custody of their children and, one morning, a visit by the police, who took the children to school in a police van."

A judge found that the behavior of the German government amounted to persecution of this Christian family of seven, and granted them asylum at the end of January:

The family has been here for some time, having left Germany in 2008. But it was not until Jan. 26 that a federal immigration judge in Memphis granted them political asylum, ruling that they had a reasonable fear of persecution for their beliefs if they returned.

In a harshly worded decision, the judge, Lawrence O. Burman, denounced the German policy, calling it “utterly repellent to everything we believe as Americans,” and expressed shock at the heavy fines and other penalties the government has levied on home-schooling parents, including taking custody of their children.

As with many seemingly intolerant laws in Europe (like the Swiss ban on minarets), mandatory schooling rules—which date to the 19th century—remain in place partially due to fear of non-integrated (mostly Muslim) "parallel societies." For their part, Germans have reacted to the news of the asylum by being shocked that the U.S. is so loosey goosey with school attendance.

"No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers," says [Josef] Kraus, of the German Teachers' Association. "Kids also lose contact with their peers." Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect."

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  • Old Mexican||

    German Homeschoolers Granted Asylum in U.S.

    Take that, you German Nazi bastards!

  • ||

    "Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect."

    The development of a sect is clearly much more dangerous than having the central government indoctrinate everyone into one common ideology. Germans of all people know that nothing could go wrong with that.

  • ||

    +1.

    We should just stop the thread here.

  • wackyjack||

    But it's early. There couldn't have been a racist/homophobic/sexist/nazi reference yet.

    Oh wait.

  • MNG's Ass||

    But if the majority of Germans voted to force kids to be educated in the public schools, then who is this family (clearly a minority) to reject that?

  • Jim Crow||

    No way!

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    LULZ

  • Old Mexican||

    "No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers," says [Josef] Kraus, of the German Teachers' Association.

    The Roland Freisler of German educatiion has thus spoken ex cathedra.

    "Kids also lose contact with their peers." Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect."

    The concerns of the State is that people will stop worshipping the State, because the State does not like competition.

  • Sam Grove||

    "No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers," says [Josef] Kraus, of the German Teachers' Association. "Kids also lose contact with their peers."

    One problem of government schools is that kids lose contact with their families. Peer pressure can override parental guidance.

    Life offers a breadth of education that is often not found in schools, and now that we have the internet, the available resources are quite extensive.

  • Attorney||

    Just wondering ... what would be a freedom-friendly solution to the hypothetical problem (not necessarily the case in Germany) of having freedom-unfriendly people migrating into your country in such large numbers that they could vote away your freedoms?

  • Mad Elf||

    The simple solution would be not to give government so much power that a simple vote would be able to eliminate your natural rights.

  • ||

    Didn't the our founding fathers try that?

  • ||

    Didn't our founding fathers try that?

  • OMG||

    It bears repeating.

  • ||

    Death panels.

  • Death Panelist||

    Some of us think those should be part of the jobs bill.

  • ||

    Lots of sex. Lots and lots of sex.

  • Mad Max||

    If you want lots of sex, then government schools seem to have that covered.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    I see what you're driving at. Yes, this is probably the start of a sinister plan by the German government to get vast numbers of "persecuted" families into the U.S. so they can eventually show their true fascist colors and vote en masse to strip Americans of their freedoms.

    I always said never trust a Kraut!

  • Attorney||

    Always with the jokes!

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    The internets are terrible that way.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    Again, LULZ

  • Old Mexican||

    Just wondering ... what would be a freedom-friendly solution to the hypothetical problem (not necessarily the case in Germany) of having freedom-unfriendly people migrating into your country in such large numbers that they could vote away your freedoms?

    Knapping a few spare flints and casting lots of lead balls would be the first thing I would do . . .

  • ||

    There are certain rights that cannot be taken away. If a majority votes to do so anyway then sooner or later a point comes (and reasonable people can disagree on exactly what that point is) where the only options are fleeing the country, or armed resistance.

  • Old Mexican||

    Armed resistance - why would I leave my land?

    Now, I need to go knapping a few extra flints . . .

  • ||

    ""Now, I need to go knapping a few extra flints . . .""

    Cinco de Mayo was long ago. Your flints are useless against anything in the US arsenal. Besides, one of your facebook friends will give you up to the authorties. ;-)

  • Old Mexican||

    Re: TrickyVic,

    Cinco de Mayo was long ago.

    Mexicans do not celebrate Cinco de Mayo. They celebrate Independence Day (Sept 16) and Revolution day (Nov 20). Only Americans of Mexican ancestry celebrate May 5th in the US (I haven't the foggiest idea as to why). Just an FYI.

    Your flints are useless against anything in the US arsenal.

    Not if I use them to power my flintlocks! I would not be knapping spare flints jsut for the enjoyment.

  • ||

    Actually with the ammo shortage I've been thinking about adding a couple of Colt 1860 Armies or Walkers to the collection. Black powder and round balls and percussion caps shouldn't be that hard to fabricate.

  • T||

    Mmm. Making shock-sensitive explosives in the garage. That sounds like a fun time.

  • Colonel_Angus||

    Sure does. What are you getting at? My garage doesn't really belong to me?

  • Old Mexican||

    Pablo,

    Remember that in order to make the fine powder that the Colt 1860's require, you need a ball mill - because it takes too long using a mortar.

  • ||

    Migration need not require naturalization.

    If you make migration easier, make citizenship harder.

  • ||

    Maybe I'm missing your point. But migration without attempting to naturalize = deportation. Doesn't one's visa limit the length of migration to the point it's not migration but a short visit? No?

  • ||

    There don't have to be time limits on visas.

    Migrants/visitors can't vote away your rights if they don't have a vote. But, there's no reason they can't stay and work and educate their kids anyway. It's in interesting concept.

  • ||

    As matth notes, visas do not require time limits.

    In particular, an utterly unlimited visa class that allows people who have passed the requisite background checks to come and go and reside and work as they please can simply mean nothing with regard to citizenship.

    On the other hand, immigrants who desire citizenship can be routed through different classes of visa with whatever requirements and quotas the citizenry deems necessary to produce the desired naturalized citizens of the future.

  • ||

    Doesn't one's visa limit the length of migration to the point it's not migration but a short visit? No?

    No. One can stay one's entire life as a resident alien. ie; the holder of a Permanent Resident Visa, AKA Green Card. Many people choose to do just that.

  • bubba||

    Don't let them in?

  • Just my POV||

    Attorney, I like how you cased your words, but that is exactly the problem. Unfortunately, this family was caught in the policy of forced integration. My experience as an immigrant to this country has been immediate assimilation into the cultural melting pot of the US. In many European countries, immigrants refuse to adapt and insist on changing their new society to what they feel it should be. The Europeans have made many mistakes along the lines of employment and housing that we are not familiar with but perhaps this education initiative attempt to right a wrong. It may be, under the surface, an attempt to encourage freedom and not to negate it.

  • jester||

    Poor kids won't get to have anyone sign their yearbook. They'll be scarred for life.

  • HeadTater||

    And not having their lunch money stolen! How else will they build character if they are not bludgeoned on the playground by some big oaf for a few dollars?

  • jester||

    Immigration loophole. Get ready for a krautwelle.

  • Old Mexican||

    From the Times article:

    And then there are the social aspects of going to school.

    Like being bullied to literal death.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Health/MindMoodNews/story?id=7228335

    Homeschooling parents tend to want to shield their children from negative influences.

    . . . like the State's indoctrination efforts.

    But this quest often runs counter to the idea that schools represent society and help promote tolerance.

    Read: Impose Political Correctness and permissiveness, despite parents wishes.

  • ||

    ""Like being bullied to literal death.""

    Of all the social aspects of school, that's the one you pull out of the hat?

  • Old Mexican||

    Of all the social aspects of school, that's the one you pull out of the hat?

    Ok, ok - there's also:

    Group isolationism and banishment
    Excessive peer pressure
    Teenage Sex
    Teenage pregnancy
    Sexual harassment
    Social harassment
    Unsolicited groping
    Property destruction
    Property theft
    Intolerance towards opposing views

    Indeed, there is a lot to say about public "eeducation". Thank you for reminding me!

  • ||

    Just because your experience sucked doesn't mean everyone else's did.

  • T||

    Where the fuck did you go to school? OM nailed it. Even if it wasn't happening to you, you'd have to be deaf, dumb and blind to miss it happening to somebody else, frequently.

  • ||

    ""Even if it wasn't happening to you, you'd have to be deaf, dumb and blind to miss it happening to somebody else, frequently.""

    Those things did happen, I haven't said they didn't. But they were not the totallity of my school experience. I had far more positive experiences than negative ones.

    Your same critique could be applied to OM's lack of listing positive experiences. But to OM's credit, teenage sex was mentioned.

  • ||

    this thread now qualifies as child pornography.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    I take my hat off to yonemoto.

  • ||

    The basic problem is that from the school's point of view, the All-State linebacker is far more valuable to the school than any kid with a 1520 SAT.

    The school is in fact acting rationally when it takes the bread winner's side over the geek. Obviously the problem is the public being forced to fund and participate in an educational system with such warped incentives, but then try explaining that to people.

  • EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy||

    If yours didn't suck its even odds that you were doing the oppressing, and if you manage to duck that you were letting it happen and keeping you head down so it didn't start happening to you.

    Or maybe you were surrounded by wonderful human beings, but you'd have a hard time convincing me.

  • ||

    I thought all the vandalism, teenage sex and drugs were kind of fun.

    I'll probably feel differently in five years when my oldest is in middle school.

  • ||

    ""I'll probably feel differently in five years when my oldest is in middle school.""

    And that feeling will be the realization of how right your parents were when you were in middle school, lol.

  • Old Mexican||

    Re: TrickyVic,

    Just because your experience sucked doesn't mean everyone else's did.

    Right, as if I got pregnant at 16 (hard to achieve, being a male).

    Don't try to be a wiseguy - these things happen RIGHT NOW in many so-called public schools.

    The fact is it is a DAMNED LIE perpetuated by compulsive LIARS that schools provide a place where kids can become socially sophisticated, or some shit like that. Bollocks! Poppycock! Bullshit!

  • Colonel_Angus||

    "Read: Impose Political Correctness and permissiveness, despite parents wishes."

    Or the individual young person's wishes. Why is it always about the parents? My libertarianism started in school.

  • Old Mexican||

    "German schools use textbooks that force inappropriate subject matter onto young children and tell stories with characters that promote profanity and disrespect."

    No!

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=95773

  • ||

    Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect.

    I think we kinda like it when Germans don't form into a large and organized group with a singular purpose.

  • Jennifer||

    So we won't grant asylum to Iraqis in danger of getting themselves and their families murdered in retaliation for helping us, but we WILL grant asylum to Germans in danger of -- being fined and having their kids go to school?

    Priorities.

  • ||

    Why does one prevent the other? There is no cap on number of asylums granted. Just because the government is wrong in the case of the Iraqis, doesn't diminish these people's legitimate claim to asylum.

  • Jennifer||

    I'm not saying it does, and I surely think the Germans should be allowed to stay here. I just think it's fucked up that we can grant asylum to a family whose [relatively minor] problems aren't even our fault, yet can't get around to granting asylum to families whose severe danger is our fault.

  • Warty||

    There was an idiot here the other day yammering about FORSED MUSLIM CONVERSION and such. I wish he had stuck around.

  • Paul||

    I just think it's fucked up that we can grant asylum to a family whose [relatively minor] problems aren't even our fault

    I think you just unwittingly answered your own question as to why the germans get assylum, and the Iraqi's don't.

  • ||

    No one doesn't prevent the other. But I'm not certain running from madatory education rules is a legitimate claim for asylum.

  • ||

    The threat of government kidnapping your children isn't a legitimate claim for asylum?

  • ||

    Are the Germans in question christians? Memphis is in the bible belt.

  • K-Y||

    Does anybody else actually home school?

  • ||

    Yes. People of all faiths and non-faith home school their children. The Christians are more visible because they are, by definition, an organized group (or, rather, a set of organized groups, if you want to be denomination-specific).

    Atheists don't travel in packs, and are therefore less visible.

    But thanks for playing with your inaccurate stereotype.

  • TickleStick||

    but we WILL grant asylum to Germans in danger of -- being fined and having their kids go to school removed from the home by the state?

    You know for a published writer, you sure are a shitty reader.

    FTFA:

    In a harshly worded decision, the judge, Lawrence O. Burman, denounced the German policy, calling it “utterly repellent to everything we believe as Americans,” and expressed shock at the heavy fines and other penalties the government has levied on home-schooling parents, including taking custody of their children.

    (emphasis added)

  • Old Mexican||

    The family has been here for some time, having left Germany in 2008. But it was not until Jan. 26 that a federal immigration judge in Memphis granted them political asylum, ruling that they had a reasonable fear of persecution for their beliefs if they returned.

    Fortunately, the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement has submitted an appeal to this decision, in an effort to show persecuted people that they will not be allowed by the US government to run away from Political Correctness - no siree!!

  • Mad Max||

    Germany has Godwinned itself with its homeschooling law.

    As explained in this 2003 article by a German professor in the journal Evaluation and Research in Education:

    “Until 1919, Germany had compulsory education, which could be fulfilled by private tuition or home education (Avenarius, 2000: 450). The first obligatory compulsory school attendance arose in the Weimar Republic. But even the primary school law of the German Reich (Reichsgrundschulgesetz ) from 1920 included a special regulation which was used a lot to maintain the possibility of private tuition (Nave, 1980: 141). Only the law about compulsory school attendance from 1938 (Reichsschulpflichtgesetz) was the first general regulation in the German Reich without exceptions and with criminal consequences in case of contraventions (Habermalz, 2001:218). This law had considerable influence on the formation of the contemporary laws about compulsory school attendance in the German Lander [provinces/states].”

    Hmmm . . . the complete ban on homeschooling dates from *1938.*

    This law *deserves* to be Godwinned.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    Good find, Max.

  • HeadTater||

    Yet another case of how the Europeans are actually more intolerant that we are. They are the ones who act like the backwards rednecks, not us! However, it is a shame that we could very easily begin moving in that direction as well. All a politician needs to say is "for the good of the children" and people immediately stop thinking and do whatever they are told.

  • Bob #2||

    No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers

    I dunno... I certainly learned a lot more reading the backs of cereal boxes as a kid than I did in public school. I'd be willing to bet that a couple of halfway-educated adults with a vested interest in cultivating a well-rounded child could do quite a good job. If nothing else, they could just teach the kid how to learn and let the child loose to follow his own interests and proclivities.

  • Mad Max||

    This article is a reminder that German intellectuals, especially University professors and students, were among the most prominent cheerleaders for National Socialism.

    Yet what do we hear from Joseph Kraus of the German Teachers' Association? We hear this:

    'No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers. Kids also lose contact with their peers.'

    No, dummkopf, they do not have to lose contact with their peers in a country where homeschooling is legal. I know a drama teacher who teaches a class of homeschoolers, because the parents *choose* to provide that form of education and socialization to their children.

    What Professor Kraut really means is that children should be taught by state employees to accept the values of the government in lieu of the values of their parents.

    Und nozzink can possibly go wrong mit *zat!*

  • Mad Max||

    From the article I just cited:

    'As early as 1931 the [National Socialist] party, with 50 to 60 per cent of the votes, enjoyed almost twice as much support in the universities as in the country as a whole. The dominant influence of rightist tendencies was as evident in the teaching staff as in the self-governing student body, which was largely controlled by the Union of National Socialist German Students (NSDStB). It was no less noticeable on Langemarck Day, regularly celebrated from 1927 onward with nationalistic excesses and a lack of feeling for the tragic nature of the events, than in the style and speeches of the student congresses, the last of which, in summer 1932, was held significantly in a barracks. In May 1933 a collective declaration of support for the new regime was made by the professors. This was accompanied by a welter of individual expressions of approval, some of them linked with concrete demands, such as those advanced by the well-known cultural sociologist Hans Freyer, who wanted the universities to become more political in keeping with the new spirit. On the eve of the popular elections of 12th November well-known scholars and scientists like Pinder, Sauerbruch and Heidegger called for an understanding attitude towards Hitler's policies. An 'Oath of Loyalty by the German Poets to the People's Chancellor Adolf Hitler' was signed among others by Binding, Halbe, Molo, Ponten, Scholz and Stucken. Almost everyone invited to do so placed himself at the disposal of the regime, which was out to woo recognition and secure a list of decorative names, and which here and elsewhere concealed the aims of the National Socialist revolution behind a general screen of nationalism. The list included Richard Strauss, Wilhelm Furtwangler, Gustaf Grtindgens, Heinz Hilpert and Werner Krauss. This fatal willingness to serve was paralleled by the ease with which the new holders of power overran existing institutions, such as the Prussian Academy of Poets. Undoubtedly many of those who entered into the pact could claim honourable motives; but more courageous was the attitude of Ricarda Huch, who resigned from the new Academy of the Arts on the grounds that her Germanness was not that of the government. Faced with this mass conversion, Hitler issued in September 1933 a warning against those who 'suddenly change their flag and move into the new state as though nothing had happened, in order once again to have the main say in the realms of art and cultural policy, for this is our state and not theirs'.'

  • Horselips||

    This article is a reminder that German intellectuals, especially University professors and students, were among the most prominent cheerleaders for National Socialism.

    Interestingly enough, those seem to be the same people promoting stupid political ideas here. Some wit once remarked that if in 1932 an amendment had been passed requiring a Ph.D to vote, today the US would be digging itself out of the same mess the late Soviet Union is.

    Perhaps there ought to be a law prohibiting anyone with a post-grad degree from voting.

  • T||

    Can we exclude MBA's? It's barely a post-grad degree. And I like voting.

  • skr||

    Only if you renounce it in triplicate and have it notarized.

  • bmp1701||

    We wouldn't want religious sects forming in Germany, now would we? That would create a problem, and problems like that often involve expensive and embarrassing Solutions.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    The Godwin Contest? I never dared to dream!

  • Russ 2000||

    No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers

    That is sooooo fucking stupid. I was essentially homeschooled at ages 4 and 5, learned how to read an write and do math at a 4th grade level by age 5. When I went to public school for first grade, I noticed my teachers were rather stupid. This was consistent year after year - the only exception was one high school math teacher who was as competent at teaching as my home teacher. By the way, my home teachers were a 10 year old and an 11 year old. They just thought it was fun to subject me to the bullshit they had to go through at school earlier in the day and I was stupid enough to think it was play rather than work. Teaching is the #1 most overrated job, followed closely by policing and doctoring.

  • ||

    ""When I went to public school for first grade, I noticed my teachers were rather stupid.""

    They probably noticed how full of yourself you were.

  • ||

    But an important point is that learning doesn't start with school.

    I think parents fail their kids by adopting the school is responsible for my kids education philosophy.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    TrickyVic, your 5:22 post is spot on.

  • ||

    "Teaching is the #1 most overrated job, followed closely by policing and doctoring."

    Fine, diagnose your own appendicitis and take the damn thing out yourself. I give a shit. :-)

  • ||

    Beeeeeeeyaaaahhhh! :-)

  • ||

    Threadjack.

    The Left is realizing they are not getting a pony. And they are none to happy about it.

    We owe Ralph Nader and Cynthia McKinney an apology. They were right about Barack Obama. They were right about the corporate state. They had the courage of their convictions and they stood fast despite wholesale defections and ridicule by liberals and progressives.

    Obama lies as cravenly, if not as crudely, as George W. Bush. He promised us that the transfer of $12.8 trillion in taxpayer money to Wall Street would open up credit and lending to the average consumer. The Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. (FDIC), however, admitted last week that banks have reduced lending at the sharpest pace since 1942. As a senator, Obama promised he would filibuster amendments to the FISA Reform Act that retroactively made legal the wiretapping and monitoring of millions of American citizens without warrant; instead he supported passage of the loathsome legislation. He told us he would withdraw American troops from Iraq, close the detention facility at Guantánamo, end torture, restore civil liberties such as habeas corpus and create new jobs. None of this has happened.

    He is shoving a health care bill down our throats that would give hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars to the private health insurance industry in the form of subsidies, and force millions of uninsured Americans to buy insurers’ defective products. These policies would come with ever-rising co-pays, deductibles and premiums and see most of the seriously ill left bankrupt and unable to afford medical care. Obama did nothing to halt the collapse of the Copenhagen climate conference, after promising meaningful environmental reform, and has left us at the mercy of corporations such as ExxonMobil. He empowers Israel’s brutal apartheid state. He has expanded the war in Afghanistan and Pakistan, where hundreds of civilians, including entire families, have been slaughtered by sophisticated weapons systems such as the Hellfire missile, which sucks the air out of victims’ lungs. And he is delivering war and death to Yemen, Somalia and perhaps Iran.

    The illegal wars and occupations, the largest transference of wealth upward in American history and the egregious assault on civil liberties, all begun under George W. Bush, raise only a flicker of tepid protest from liberals when propagated by the Democrats. Liberals, unlike the right wing, are emotionally disabled. They appear not to feel. The tea-party protesters, the myopic supporters of Sarah Palin, the veterans signing up for Oath Keepers and the myriad of armed patriot groups have swept into their ranks legions of disenfranchised workers, angry libertarians, John Birchers and many who, until now, were never politically active. They articulate a legitimate rage. Yet liberals continue to speak in the bloodless language of issues and policies, and leave emotion and anger to the protofascists. Take a look at the 3,000-word suicide note left by Joe Stack, who flew his Piper Cherokee last month into an IRS office in Austin, Texas, murdering an IRS worker and injuring dozens. He was not alone in his rage.

    http://www.truthdig.com/report....._20100301/

  • Warty||

    Your tears are so yummy and sweet...

  • ||

    Schadenfreude is my favorite word.

  • Warty||

    Oh man, I had forgotten how great it is to read Chris Hedges. If sputtering leftist incoherence had an emperor, he'd be it.

  • TickleStick||

    Correction, it wasn't Stack's plane. He stole it.

  • Warty||

    “By any standard of government control of the economy, he is a socialist,” Gingrich said. If only the critique were true.

    AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

  • Attorney||

    Is Obama then a DINO? Or maybe a PINO?

  • OMG||

    SINO.

  • oncogenesis||

    Confidential to Chris Hedges: http://sadtrombone.com

  • TickleStick||

    Funny alt-text.

  • TickleStick||

    This is what PC schooling gets ya:

    Student apologizes for noose in UC San Diego library

    The campus paper publishes an anonymous letter by a minority student who calls the incident 'a mindless act and stupid mistake.'

    In a letter published Monday on the front page of the UC San Diego student newspaper, the Guardian, the student wrote that the incident was "a mindless act and stupid mistake" and was not meant to recall the lynching of blacks.

    "As a minority student who sympathizes with the students that have been affected by the recent issues on campus, I am distraught to know that I have unintentionally added to their pain," the student wrote. She was suspended Friday and remains under investigation for a possible hate crime.

    The letter is signed "Anonymous UCSD Student" and offers no clues about her identity or ethnicity.

    http://www.latimes.com/news/lo.....3265.story

  • Paul||

    "No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers," says [Josef] Kraus, of the German Teachers' Association. "Kids also lose contact with their peers." Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect."

    I might even agree with all of these things... but I'm not hearing a compelling reason for state force here.

  • C-Dog||

    The Germans are probably pissed that they're losing 4 future tax payers, because the socialists sure as hell aren't having kids. (1.39 births per woman via google).

  • EscapedWestOfTheBigMuddy||

    Obama lies as cravenly, if not as crudely, as George W. Bush.

    Well, he is a politician.

    And so eloquent. ::cues Harry Reid::

  • ||

    "No parental couple can offer a breadth of education [that can] replace experienced teachers," says [Josef] Kraus, of the German Teachers' Association. "Kids also lose contact with their peers." Concerns that homeschooling could lead to insularity—or worse, as Kraus puts it, "could help foster the development of a sect."

    I'm not sure why they felt the need to go all the way to Germany to find a quote like this. Our own red-white-and-blue NEA has the same position on homeschooling.

  • ||

    And some the homeschooling laws here may not be as restrictive as the ones in Germany some states set some pretty formidable obstacles.

  • skr||

    Which I have always found as an admission of failure on the education establishment's part. They are effectively saying, "We know you didn't learn what we taught you in school so we couldn't possibly let you teach your kids."

  • Forrest||

    One problem with homeschooling is that it keeps children from being protected by the sex predator exclusion zones that surround schools. So the people of the community have decided, through their elected representatives, that children need to be protected in this way, but homeschooling exposes them to danger by leaving them outside the zone where children are safe.

  • OMG||

    That's a great point. The logic is so rock solid that there is absolutely no reason to limit it to the school day and we ought to extend it 24/7 - we need 24 hour state protection of children. Since being at home potentially exposes children to danger, we should create "child safe zones" where all children must stay until the age of 18.

    Run Forrest … run.

  • ||

    YES! All the boy children can stay with lesbian couples and all the girl children can live with homosexual couples until they turn 18 at which time they swap.

    What a completely retarded country this has become.

  • The Art-P.O.G.||

    I like this. This is clever.

  • ||

    You're easily impressed. If you were a female when I was in high school I really could have used you.

  • ||

    Who is going to protect them from the people creating the zones?

  • Roy||

    who zones the zoners?

  • ||

    Doesn't one's visa limit the length of migration to the point it's not migration but a short visit? No?

    No. One can stay one's entire life as a resident alien. ie; the holder of a Permanent Resident Visa, AKA Green Card. Many people choose to do just that.

  • ||

    They really should not get too comfortable in the Oba Mao environment. Home schooling has a lot of obstacles here as well. Given we are pushing hard to emulate the western European socialist model, how long before this couple needs to escape to Guatemala or some such place?

  • Colonel_Angus||

    What now, you social engineering German pricks?

  • Beethoven||

    Colon**_An*us,

    Blow Me.

  • *||

    Roll Over Beethoven

  • oncogenesis||

    I wonder if this page is banned in Germany: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unschooling

  • CE||

    You would think the Germans would be wary of turning their children over to the government, you know, given their history.

  • A German||

    The German school system is free and offers a fundamentally higher level of education then the US system. Of course this also means that the requirements that students have to fulfill are much, much higher then anything US students have to go through.

    The reason why homeschooling is not allowed by German law is that parents can not, by any means, provide the level of knowledge and expertise that is require for German kids to get through the "Abitur", the final exam that allows students to continue their (free!) education in university.
    Just ask yourself - how many languages could _you_ teach your child(ren), while at the same time providing a high level education in Math, Physics, Chemistry, Biology, History, Art, Music, Literature, German and other subjects?
    People who finish German highschools usually learned 2 to 4 foreign languages.

    In America parents have the right to keep their kids ignorant and uneducated - and they exercise it with great success, which is why the US standard of education can be compared to third world countries.
    In Germany (and the rest of Europe btw.) that is not possible.
    So you can cry "Nazis" as much as you want - it only shows that you have no other means to argue than to throw out insults, which basically proves my point right there.

    Germans are very happy and proud of having such an excellent standard of education. We're also happy about the fact that we have not indebted ourselves for life by the time we finished University. So it is amusing, yet not surprising, to see the bible-thumping Sara Palin voters in the US complain about us not allowing our children to lose their ability to think.

    If you disagree with what I said feel free to write a retort in German - after all I'm writing this in your language - show me if you can say anything more eloquent than "Scheisse" in my language.

  • Bravo||

    A German, I'm glad to read your point of view and I agree with much you have written. The concept of leaving certificates is not a familiar subject in the US and nor is the competitive nature of education. Everyone can go university here and that may not be a erroneous approach. Americans do not have an understanding that the tax system provides for health care, education along with other social programs and that there are countries whose citizens appreciate that arrangement. Does the force schooling help with the assimilation of new immigrants? Are there discussions in Germany about privatization of healthcare? I was reading http://www.toytowngermany.com for information but do you have a recommendation of another online newspaper? I can read it in English or French but unfortunately not German.

  • Warty||

    Horst: [threatingly] We Germans aren't all smiles und sunshine.
    Burns: [recoils in mock horror] Oooh, the Germans are mad at me. I'm so scared! Oooh, the Germans!
    [hiding behind Smithers]
    Uh oh, the Germans are going to get me!
    Horst: Stop it!
    Man 2: Stop, sir.
    Burns: Don't let the Germans come after me. Oh no, the Germans are coming after me.
    Man 2: Please stop the `pretending you are scared' game, please.
    Horst: Stop it! Stop it!
    Burns: [brief pause, then resumes]
    No! They're so big and strong!
    Man 2: Stop it.
    Horst: Stop it, Mr. Burns.
    Man 2: Please stop pretending you are scared of us, please, now.
    Burns: Oh, protect me from the Germans! The Germans...
    Horst: Burns, STOP IT!

  • Punch list||

    Jim, don't you have to blow Don Marquis' corpse?

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