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West Virginia is Romney Country (Almost) Huckabee Country
Mitt Romney is close to a win in West Virginia's complicated GOP convention. On the first ballot:
Mitt Romney has 464 votes (41%)
Mike Huckabee has 375 votes (33%)
John McCain has 176 votes (16%)
Ron Paul has 118 votes (10%)
Paul has been knocked out of the race, and I honestly don't know where his votes go. Whoever wins the convention gets 18 delegates: Paul and presumably McCain will get nothing. The Ron Paul Forums people want the conventioneers to vote Huck—how do you like that monkey wrench, gears?—or split.
UPDATE 2:20: I'm hearing the gambit by McCain and Paul backers to go for Huckabee worked. Huckabee's going to win.
UPDATE 2:24: Yes, most of the McCain and Paul voters went for Huckabee on the second ballot. Huckabee wins, 52-47 percent.
UPDATE 3:00: Via Michael Wooten of WSAZ, Paul backers expect to score 3 of Huckabee's 18 delegates today in return for giving him the election.
The Wine Commonsewer|2.5.08 @ 1:54PM|#
I'm off to vote RP here in the Golden State. I predict 3% (which is better than most LP candidates do).
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 1:59PM|#
Can they make you vote?
I would rather fight my way past the sergeant at arms of the
convention than vote for any of those other bums. ESPECIALLY Huck,
even if that causes the most mischief.
|2.5.08 @ 2:00PM|#
If Hucklebee is gonna stick around, the least he can do is deny delegates to those candidates that might win the nomination pre-convention.
|2.5.08 @ 2:00PM|#
You people need to listen...and understand. Romeny is out there. He can't be bargained with. He can't be reasoned with. He doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And he absolutely will not stop, EVER! Until you are Mormon.
Rhywun|2.5.08 @ 2:03PM|#
I had to read the thread to figure out why anyone in their right mind would throw a vote at Huck - apparently the idea is to prevent anyone from reaching 50%. But wouldn't a vote for McCain, or, I dunno, Ron Paul, accomplish the same thing?
The Wine Commonsewer|2.5.08 @ 2:05PM|#
Rick, I posted a plea yesterday at TWC and emailed it to a few others. Hope it has some effect. not sure it will.
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 2:06PM|#
The 600 series had rubber skin. We spotted them easy, but these are new. They look human - sweat, bad breath, everything. Very hard to spot. I had to wait till he moved on you before I could zero him.
John Denver|2.5.08 @ 2:13PM|#
Life is old there, older than the trees
Younger than the mountains, votin' for Huckabee. . .
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 2:15PM|#
Rhywun -
They boot the low candidate off after each round. You aren't
allowed to vote for Paul any more.
Voting for Huckabee gives Huckabee the state, probably, and denies
it to Romney. For spite, and to keep Huck off the canvas.
|2.5.08 @ 2:16PM|#
The 600 series had rubber skin.
You take that back, or Hillary might shed another tear.
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 2:18PM|#
You still don't get it, do you? He'll find her. That's what he does. That's all he does! You can't stop him. He'll wade through you, reach down her throat, and pull her fucking heart out!
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 2:18PM|#
The Corner is reporting that the Paul people did in fact go over to Huckabee [stronger men than I were apparently in attendance, to be able to keep the vomit down long enough to vote] thus apparently fucking Romney.
|2.5.08 @ 2:20PM|#
They are reporting on NRO that the second ballot is going;
Through 30 of 55 counties on the second ballot:
316 Huckabee
275 Romney
I don't know where the other counties will go, but I'm told that
most of the Paul people are going with Huckabee.
Perhaps the Paulites will give Huckabe a win.
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 2:21PM|#
Maybe I'm dense, but what good does fucking Romney do? What's the upside--that McCain wins? How is that any better or worse?
|2.5.08 @ 2:21PM|#
Hmmmm....Paul-bearers hate Romney so much they'll throw the nomination to McCain? This will help the libertarian movement because...?
|2.5.08 @ 2:22PM|#
TWC is Cali an open or closed primary?
Closed, but decline-to-state's can vote Democratic.
|2.5.08 @ 2:25PM|#
I am not really sure how screwing Romney to get McCain nominated furthers the Paulite agenda much. Romney and McCain are about the same on the war. Romney seems to be more dedicated to limited government than McCain. Other than immigration, I can't see how any Paulite would prefer Romney to McCain. If they hate both of them, just don't vote. I don't see how throwing your vote behind the most loathsome of all of the candidates proves much of a point.
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 2:27PM|#
It helps libertarianism by prolonging the period during which
the Republicans cannot coalesce around a frontrunner who has locked
up the nomination.
Tomorrow morning Huckabee won't be the presumptive nominee. McCain
might be and Romney might be. We're better off hurting both of
those guys wherever we can.
Frankly, I'd love to see a brokered convention where the
Republicans tear each other apart. Handing Huckabee a state helps
keep that hope alive.
|2.5.08 @ 2:29PM|#
Fluffy,
From what I can tell the only way to prolong the Republican
nomination process is for Romney to get a boost out of Super
Tuesday, especially given all the WTA states up for grabs (for
Republican candidates that is).
Taktix®|2.5.08 @ 2:31PM|#
I agree with John.
It really look like we're down to "lesser of several evils" time,
and as far as I'm concerned, Romney is far better than McCain or
Huckabee.
But it is much in the same way that Francisco Franco is better than
Hitler or Mussolini.
|2.5.08 @ 2:32PM|#
"Frankly, I'd love to see a brokered convention where the
Republicans tear each other apart. Handing Huckabee a state helps
keep that hope alive."
Okay, then that just gets Obama or Clinton elected, which helps
their cause how? If your whole point is to destroy they party, why
not just form a third party? Further, if you are honest about your
goal being to destroy the party, can you really complain when the
rest of the party loathes you and won't take you seriously?
Wouldn't it be better to throw your support behind a candidate who
can actually win and use your leverage with that candidate in a
close election? Vote for Romney this time, but in the next state
threaten to support McCain if Romney is not willing to give you
some concessions. That sounds like a better plan than just being an
asshole.
If the Paulites only concern is ending the war and screwing the
pro-war candidate, why don't they just be honest and support Obama,
the only reliably anti-war guy still with a chance to win the
election.
|2.5.08 @ 2:32PM|#
Do you think that's why Romney strapped the dog to the luggage
rack? Maybe it just kept barking at him.
"Phase plasma rifle with a 40 watt range"
"Hey, just what you see, Pal..."
|2.5.08 @ 2:32PM|#
Mitt Romney has 464 votes (41%)
Mike Huckabee has 375 votes (33%)
John McCain has 176 votes (16%)
Ron Paul has 118 votes (10%)
Interstestingly, the ignorant, hillbill, whack-job preacher is
pulling similar numbers to what he got in Iowa (34.4% there). If I
were an Iowan, I'd be embarrased.
|2.5.08 @ 2:33PM|#
haha, I love it. My only hopes for today are a Paul win in Alaska and a Romney defeat everywhere else.
Taktix®|2.5.08 @ 2:34PM|#
If I were an Iowan, I'd be embarrased.
Well, J sub D, this is West Virginia...
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 2:34PM|#
The Republicans tearing each other apart has good entertainment
value for sure, but is it a smart strategy? Maybe it is; if Ron
Paul supporters can cause this, they will have a lot of clout and
maybe they will be pandered to a bit.
Or maybe the GOP is so fucking pissed that the Paulites did this
that they refuse to give them anything.
We'll see!
The Wine Commonsewer|2.5.08 @ 2:34PM|#
TWC is Cali an open or closed primary?
Was open and then the Dems sued. Now its modified open so if you
are undeclared you can vote in whoever's primary you want. I
re-registered R in order to be able to vote for RP. However, had my
bro in Az not alerted me, I would have not re-registered assuming
that Ca still had an open primary. Then again, maybe all the RP
emails might have clued me in. :-)
some dude|2.5.08 @ 2:36PM|#
Okay, then that [brokered convention] just gets Obama or
Clinton elected, which helps their cause how?
Maybe it doesn't, but it is more fun.
Further, if you are honest about your goal being to destroy the
party, can you really complain when the rest of the party loathes
you and won't take you seriously?
They made their loathing clear first.
|2.5.08 @ 2:38PM|#
Now its modified open so if you are undeclared you can vote
in whoever's primary you want.
Nope. Undeclareds can vote only in the primaries of parties that
explicitly allow it. This year those parties are Democratic, Peace
and Freedom, and American Independent.
|2.5.08 @ 2:39PM|#
Caliodre,
If its just Romney vs McCain then one of them will probably get
enough votes to win. It might be close, but without Paul and
Huckabee winning states and getting delegates, a brokered
convention probably won't happen. Also, if Huckster drops out you
know the mainstream media is going to make the debates two men
affairs. Huckster sticking around keeps Paul at the debate table,
which is the more important thing from a movement perspective.
Bingo|2.5.08 @ 2:39PM|#
Libertarians as kingmakers! Now we get to anoint giand douche or turd sandwich instead of just watching other people do it for us.
|2.5.08 @ 2:39PM|#
It helps libertarianism by prolonging the period during
which the Republicans cannot coalesce around a frontrunner who has
locked up the nomination.
Still trying to figure out how this helps The Cause.
Its a zero sum game, as far as I can tell, at this point.
If you hurt Romney, you help McCain. Is Dondero actually winning
converts to his "McCain is the Libertarian Saviour" meme? I don't
get it.
If you hurt the Repubs (with a prolonged primary fight), you help
the Dems, no? Is Hillary or Obama better for The Cause than McCain
or Romney? I can't see how.
|2.5.08 @ 2:40PM|#
I would like to see Weigel or somebody else confirm this, but
from (two comments) in the linked RP forum the idea is that a vote
for Huck is a vote for unaligned electors, since Huck's going to
lose. This would allow the possibility of some sort of gambit
(rebellion? revolt?) at the convention. I have no idea whether this
argument makes sense or not. Maybe an RPer will show up to
clarify.
Anon
|2.5.08 @ 2:40PM|#
Well, J sub D, this is West Virginia...
That was kinda my point. WV has a surfeit of ignorant, hillbilly
whack-job voters supporting Huckabee. The Iowa electorate looks
embarrassingly similar.
All offended WV and IA residents, please send hate mail directly to
me. No need to clutter up the thread.
|2.5.08 @ 2:41PM|#
"Further, if you are honest about your goal being to destroy the
party, can you really complain when the rest of the party loathes
you and won't take you seriously?
They made their loathing clear first."
Then don't be one. I can't stand the Democrats and disagree with
them on nearly everything. Could I really complain if they kicked
me out after I showed up at one of their meetings telling them how
wrong they were about everything and how much I can't stand them? I
don't think I could. Again, if the war is that important to you,
vote for Obama. It is a perfectly reasonable thing to do; leave one
party after one party does something to make you angry.
|2.5.08 @ 2:41PM|#
Doesn't having Ayatollah Huckabee stick around hurt Paul simply
because, he too, is a "second tier" candidate? It simply justifies
the narrative that, of the two remaining "long-shots", the
Huck-a-buck is the more viable because he can pull the conservative
evolution-deniers. Giving him yet-another victory marginalizes Paul
further as a second place finish in Maine or (and) Alaska or (and)
Montana can be responded to with "Well, so what? Huckabee WON Iowa
AND WV."
Furthermore, the Huckster has been the candidate most aggresively
pursuing the Paul-leaning conservatives (however superficially)
with his new ads proclaiming him as the anti-IRS vote. He doesn't
have to reconcile this with his record as a tax-and-expand governor
because, as a Baptist, he's used to drastic conflict between
reality as it is and "reality" as he would like it to be. And so
are his supporters. Whether or not they somehow "know" that their
vote is helping Ron Paul.
|2.5.08 @ 2:42PM|#
"Is Hillary or Obama better for The Cause than McCain or Romney?
I can't see how."
If you see gridlock as preferable to compassionate conservativism,
Hillary is the obvious Libertarian choice.
She gets in the White House and the Republicans go Ape$#!+.
Dodsworth|2.5.08 @ 2:42PM|#
A brokered convention will only happen if Huck is able to stay
in...thus, from that standpoint, the strategy makes sense.
My own view is that Paul (or someone like Gary Johnson) should run
third party beginning tomorrow rather than waste time at a pro-war
convention. Then again, if true chaos reigns, and if Paul makes a
respectable showing in a couple of states,he might be able to get
some publicity in the remaining primaries.
|2.5.08 @ 2:43PM|#
How the hell does anyone "know" Romney would be more federalist than McCain. Romney hasn't taken a hard stand on anything. He's as amorphous as an amoeba with his past and present and present present stances. Atleast McCain, as loathsome as he is, is believable in his stances. As for me, I'll be taking a hard look at Obama if he in fact beats out Hillary or is close to beating out Hillary and needs votes in the Texas primary.
R. House|2.5.08 @ 2:47PM|#
I now have quite a photograph collection of Snorg Tees Girls. Maybe a leather-bound edition is in order.
|2.5.08 @ 2:47PM|#
"Is Hillary or Obama better for The Cause than McCain or Romney?
I can't see how."
Hillary no, Obama maybe
dodsworth|2.5.08 @ 2:47PM|#
Lost In Translation
On your point, it is worth noting that Romney's campaign was making
robo-calls to scare seniors in Florida. These argued that McCain
should be defeated because he voted against the prescription drugs
boondogle (one of McCain's few good stands!) Romney is hopeless. He
doesn't have a clue, not a clue, about what limited government
really means....and or he is simply amoral.
|2.5.08 @ 2:49PM|#
Anyone here ever witnessed a brokered convention? What's
that like?
looks alot like a slaughterhouse. Alot of red meat, but at the end
of the day, no one can enjoy the product anymore.
|2.5.08 @ 2:49PM|#
"I'll be taking a hard look at Obama if he in fact beats out
Hillary or is close to beating out Hillary and needs votes in the
Texas primary."
I plan to vote for Obama in the Texas primary.
some dude|2.5.08 @ 2:50PM|#
Could I really complain if they kicked me out after I showed
up at one of their meetings telling them how wrong they were about
everything and how much I can't stand them? I don't think I
could.
If this was just some club, I'd say you were right. But there is a
two-party establishment. People like Michael Medved ridicule third
parties and say "work within the two-party system instead." That is
being tried. The GOP is an established institution. If "they" are
insulted at "their" meetings, the problem is the mindset that the
meetings are "theirs."
If there was any kind of free association between political parties
and no institutionalized barriers to the formation of new parties,
I would agree with you 100%. That not being the case, I'm not too
broken up about their boat being rocked.
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 2:51PM|#
Tough luck, John.
On the basis of the Republican party platform of 1980, YOU
leave.
I'll stop shitting on the carpet at Republican events when they
stop lying and employing the rhetoric of small government and civil
liberties.
It's obvious they don't believe in either one, but they continue to
trot out motheaten assertions that they do at every election
cycle.
As long as they are willing to lie to me, I'll stick around and be
a dick. When they come clean and admit that they are the party of
big government and authoritarianism, I'll leave.
If that means that Hillary wins the general election - que sera,
sera.
|2.5.08 @ 2:52PM|#
bookworm,
i still have a problem with a guy who talks about vague notions of
"bringing America together", but doesn't want to outline anything
specific as to what he'd do. I just don't have enough
information.
Oh, and the way things are going, I predict a landslide democratic
presidency win.
|2.5.08 @ 2:52PM|#
"Romney is hopeless. He doesn't have a clue, not a clue, about
what limited government really means....and or he is simply
amoral."
He has Sean Hannity fooled or is Sean Hannity so desperate for a
conservative candidate that he has duped himself into believing
that Romney is one?
|2.5.08 @ 2:54PM|#
He has Sean Hannity fooled
PT Barnum once said "There's a Sean Hannity born every day"
True story.
|2.5.08 @ 2:54PM|#
gaijin--
I've seen it on a smaller scale in Connecticut. The '82 state
convention, and the '88 5th district US Rep conventions. Both were
WILD, with all kinds of interesting bedfellows.
|2.5.08 @ 2:55PM|#
"Oh, and the way things are going, I predict a landslide
democratic presidency win."
If Hillary is the nominee, I don't see how that's possible. She
will unify the Republican Party. They'll all come out to vote
against her and also retake Congress while they're at it.
|2.5.08 @ 2:57PM|#
West Virginia is Romney Country (Almost) Huckabee
Country
LOL! I knew I could count on the Hatfields, McCoys. and
these folks.
Iowans, I apologize.
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 2:57PM|#
i still have a problem with a guy who talks about vague
notions of "bringing America together", but doesn't want to outline
anything specific as to what he'd do
Yes. I find Obama's seeming harmlessness and charm to be dangerous.
Hillary would have to deal with an iron wall of GOP opposition,
even if they don't control Congress. But Obama might be able to
sweet-talk the Republicans into doing things that Hillary never
could.
I think gridlock based on hate is much safer than comity.
|2.5.08 @ 2:59PM|#
bookworm,
doesn't matter. the republican party is collapsing into oblivian.
The independents that remember the Clinton days and hate the
republicans will dwarf any effort to rekindle Hillaritis that the
republicans attempt.
This is the democrats race to lose.
|2.5.08 @ 2:59PM|#
Why did the Paul supporters participate in the gambit? Why help McCain? He will promote more war! And he plans to force us to sacrifice our liberty and prosperity to fight false anthropogenic global warming!
|2.5.08 @ 3:01PM|#
rick
looks like Huckabee promised 3 delegates to Paul in exchange for
the help. In winner take all WV, that probably enticed Paul
supporters who want some call in the final tally to support
Huckabee.
dodsworth|2.5.08 @ 3:01PM|#
Does it promote McCain? More like;y, it promotes a brokered convention. Under such a scenario, there is an excellent chance the convention would unite behind a less objectionable candidate like Thompson.....or it could be worse. Who knows?
Jon|2.5.08 @ 3:04PM|#
The best part of this is that Dondero jumped the gun at the first ballot and posted "Shocker. Mitt Romney Wins West Virginia Caucuses" on his blog.
|2.5.08 @ 3:04PM|#
This year those parties are Democratic, Peace and Freedom,
and American Independent.
Upon further review, it seems that the P&F primary is
not open to those who declined to state.
Apologies to all Californian undeclareds who went to the polls to
vote for Cynthia McKinney or any of the other wonderful socialists
on that ballot.
|2.5.08 @ 3:04PM|#
"If Hillary is the nominee, I don't see how that's possible. She
will unify the Republican Party. They'll all come out to vote
against her and also retake Congress while they're at it."
No way will they retake Congress. If the Clinton is the nominee,
people will vote Republican for President on the premise that the
Democrats will hold Congress. The only way the Democrats win the
Presidency is with Obama charming his way in. If that happened, the
Republicans in Congress would get religion and go back to their
principles and you would see a 1994 like swing back to a Republican
Congress in 2010. In 2008 at least though, if you are looking for
divided government, I don't see how you vote Democratic for
President since the chances of the Republicans taking back Congress
is near zero.
Colin|2.5.08 @ 3:05PM|#
"Looks like the RP people may have cut a deal for 3 WV
delegates."
If that's true, that's really funny. You can really do type of
horse trading?
Dodsworth|2.5.08 @ 3:05PM|#
Getting three RP delegates? The normally blundering RP campaign played this gambit well.
|2.5.08 @ 3:06PM|#
Yeah, dodsworth. There will be a "draft Petraeus" movement (or someone else who is well known but not divisive) at the convention that may or may not succeed.
|2.5.08 @ 3:09PM|#
Recently my father asked me what it would take to get the
republicans in congress to actually act like "conservatives". I
replied, a democrat in the whitehouse.
Face it, if mccain or romney win, it will be a third bush term with
congressional republicans voting en bloc to expand the state. If
hillary wins, the same proposals will be met with righteous
indignation.
|2.5.08 @ 3:11PM|#
"Does it promote McCain? More like;y, it promotes a brokered
convention. Under such a scenario, there is an excellent chance the
convention would unite behind a less objectionable candidate like
Thompson.....or it could be worse. Who knows?"
Or maybe you get a McCain Romney ticket. I have never seen a
brokered convention so I don't know. There is a good chance the
Democrats could do the same. I have to admit two brokered
conventions would certainly make for good TV.
|2.5.08 @ 3:12PM|#
Getting 3 delegates was a well played manuever (if thats
actually what occured)
The republican establishment will continue to try and hamstring
McCain while Paul and Huckabee hang on for a while collecting
delegates to deny the top two contenders enough to win the
nomination outright. This could lead to all sorts of joyous havoc
wreaking.
RP might only have 5-10% of the republican vote, but if
strategically implemented, that could help further the cause of
liberty significantly. The game just needs to be played right.
Roger Maltz|2.5.08 @ 3:13PM|#
My main beef with Romney, like many others, is that he's a lying sack of shit. The only thing that gives me the warm fuzzies about Huckabee is his open support for the Second Amendment, which tends to be a telling character of an American. Romney has talked out of both sides of his mouth on that issue and couldn't give two shits about the issue even symbolically, and even openly lies about endorsements from the "gun lobby" that he doesn't have. Fuck that elitist suit.
|2.5.08 @ 3:13PM|#
"Face it, if mccain or romney win, it will be a third bush term
with congressional republicans voting en bloc to expand the state.
If hillary wins, the same proposals will be met with righteous
indignation."
There is a lot of truth to that. But the Democrats will do some of
the same thing to a Republican President. The problem is that the
Republicans won't control Congress so their religous indignation
won't do them much good. Further, if you get Obama in there, they
might want to work with him to produce non-partisian bullshit that
will cost the country billions and move the government even more
leftward.
|2.5.08 @ 3:13PM|#
John,
I think Edwards dropped out too early for a democratic brokered
convention. Plus the addition of superdelegates can quickly solve
any dispute about who will win.
Bingo|2.5.08 @ 3:13PM|#
bob: We tried that in 1994. It got us control of the House and
the Presidency in 2000, which subsequently got us to where we are
today.
The Republican party pays lip service to small government, but when
push comes to shove they don't do shit.
Sam Grove|2.5.08 @ 3:14PM|#
McCain will lose to the Democrat. The media will make sure everyone is familiar with his (we'll stay there 100 years if necessary) position on Iraq.
|2.5.08 @ 3:19PM|#
"I think Edwards dropped out too early for a democratic brokered
convention. Plus the addition of superdelegates can quickly solve
any dispute about who will win."
They do but I have read that the Super Delegates deciding is
basically a brokered convention. Clinton and Obama are dead even. I
am not familiar enough with the system, but people who are tell me
that it could get very ugly if niether Clinton nor Obama win a
majority of delegates without the Super Delegates. Also there is
the issue of the Florida delegates and whether they should count if
the nomination is in doubt. No way does Clinton roll over and not
let those delegates get counted if she needs them to win.
|2.5.08 @ 3:21PM|#
Hey Fluffy,
I and people who agree with me are in the vast majority on the
Republican side. No one voted for Paul. It is tough luck for you
dumb ass. Have fun with the socialists. No one really is going to
miss you.
|2.5.08 @ 3:23PM|#
The republican establishment will continue to try and
hamstring McCain while Paul and Huckabee hang on for a while
collecting delegates to deny the top two contenders enough to win
the nomination outright. This could lead to all sorts of joyous
havoc wreaking.
I don't think so. McCain is going to win all the big states and
will run away with the nomination. He'll have plenty of delegates
to win it outright. The party establishment will realize this is
inevitable and will have no choice but to pretend they've always
wanted McCain and get behind him.
stephen the goldberger|2.5.08 @ 3:26PM|#
is
http://twitter.com/scottsaxton/statuses/680965072
really the reliable source for Ron Paul getting 3 WV delegates?
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 3:29PM|#
John -
Every voter Paul has gotten in the contests to date is denied to
the eventual Republican nominee in the general. They just aren't
going to shrug their shoulders and say, "Good game, guys. We'll
vote for McCain now." [Or whoever.] They'll stay home, or they'll
write in Paul, or vote for him outright if he goes third
party.
Without those voters, you lose.
There are enough of them. Subtract those voters from W's total in
either 2000 or 2004 and you don't win the elections. Period.
I'll be equally annoyed by either a McCain or a Hillary Presidency,
so it's no skin off my ass if Hillary wins. OTOH, I think you will
notice the difference quite a bit.
When watching Hillary press conferences for the next four years,
remember that you told me that no one would miss us.
|2.5.08 @ 3:29PM|#
Does it promote McCain? More like;y, it promotes a brokered
convention.
The alternative to helping Huckabee win it was to let Romney win it
- how would that have helped McCain? Romney is McCain's
only competition (not much, but still) so it makes sense that if
McCain realizes he couldn't win the state that he'd rather not let
Romney win it either. If the only choice is between helping a
non-factor (or two non-factors) get delegates or allowing your only
rival to get them, it is not a difficult decision and it is not
going to make the chances of a brokered convention any worse.
Anyway, there isn't going to be any brokered convention, at least
for the GOP, it isn't even going to be close on the GOP side.
Besides, letting the Huckster win a state and pick up a few more
delegates is a nice bone to throw to your future running-mate.
Fluffy|2.5.08 @ 3:35PM|#
Also, John, I note with interest that you didn't dispute my
characterization of the GOP - you just told me that if I didn't
like it, I could leave.
At least you have the sense not to try to pretend that the
candidates representing the party mainstream are lying every time
they open their mouths and claim to be in favor of small government
and fiscal responsibility.
|2.5.08 @ 3:37PM|#
Does it promote McCain? More like;y, it promotes a brokered
convention.
Oh, looking back I see you were responding to a question of why
would Paul supporters would help McCain... so never mind my reply.
I had just read a different comment and misunderstood what your
response was referring to. Of course it makes it easier for us who
are a little slow if you quote who you're answering. :)
Colin|2.5.08 @ 3:39PM|#
Romney just sent out a pr crying about this "Washington backroom
deal." And I've heard Rush is making the acusation of
"collusion."
We have all the beginnings of an amusing day.
Bingo|2.5.08 @ 3:42PM|#
stephen the goldberer:
Yep. The is Scott Saxton's twitter account and he is a political
blogger/correspondent for WSAZ (which appears to be a TV station in
WV)
evidence here:
http://www.wsaz.com/blogs/political/15288091.html
some dude|2.5.08 @ 3:42PM|#
Huck will see this as something other than what it is. Just
watch.
sixstring
You be the judge:
"I wish I could say that this win reflected strength for Huckabee. But more than anything else, is reveals the strong division between the Romney and McCain supporters. While the blogosphere and talk radio has focused on the 'anybody-but-McCain' theme, there is a strong 'Anybody-but-Romney' sentiment among the voters. I suspect we may see more of this as the day goes on."
economist|2.5.08 @ 3:48PM|#
Screw Huck and McCain. However, we at least know what asshole will be McCain's running mate. McCain/Huckabee '08. I think I'll just stay home and get drunk on election day.
|2.5.08 @ 4:00PM|#
God, it's not even three yet and already this has me
depressed.
I'm so pissed at the Republicans, a Hillary win is exactly what
they deserve.
Kolohe|2.5.08 @ 4:04PM|#
OK, make fun of Iowans and Mountaineers, but at least those yokels knew when their elections were, unlike over 1000 people in the San Antonio area.
economist|2.5.08 @ 4:10PM|#
Seriously, this election is shaping up to be like the "Douche and Turd" episode in South Park.
|2.5.08 @ 4:18PM|#
CNN's article on the WV contest doesn't even mention Ron Paul's
name. They do credit McCain's backers for helping Huckster
out.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/05/super.main/index.html
PC|2.5.08 @ 4:18PM|#
This will prolong nothing. Huckabee has already shown himself to be McCain's catch can. Whatever delegates McCain misses will just go to Huckabee only to be returned at a later date. This was a stupid move, a Romney win would have prolonged the campaign because he is flying solo. This also doesn't help Libertarianism because the brainwashed fiscal conservatives who still buy the Neocons' talking points for the time being are going to be more belligerent because we swayed it against their candidate, at least the candidate they have been told to vote for. Huckabee and especially McCain seem like Teddy Roosevelt Republicans and we have no business rolling in the mud with them making deals.
Roger Maltz|2.5.08 @ 4:22PM|#
I'm relishing the lament of Romney's loss by Boston-based Romney fuck toy Jay Severin, a talk radio host, concerning the Huckabee upset in West Virginia. He's all crabby today, poor baby.
|2.5.08 @ 4:24PM|#
If you see gridlock as preferable to compassionate
conservativism, Hillary is the obvious Libertarian
choice.
That would be true if the Republicans had a hope in hell of gaining
any seats, even if they couldn't take back control.
But whoever wins in November will have a Congress even more Dem
than it is now. With a Dem in the White House, that ain't gridlock.
That's a blank check.
However, we at least know what asshole will be McCain's running
mate.
Yeah, we do. The Governor of Florida.
Right-wing gun nut hunter|2.5.08 @ 4:28PM|#
Screw all this, I'll give up voting rights in exchange for a few thousand dollars and supplies to start a colony in Antarctica. Then if anyone from the outside tries to invade, I'll shoot 'em.
|2.5.08 @ 4:31PM|#
The Republicans tearing each other apart has good entertainment value for sure, but is it a smart strategy? Maybe it is; if Ron Paul supporters can cause this, they will have a lot of clout and maybe they will be pandered to a bit.
Or maybe the GOP is so fucking pissed that the Paulites did this that they refuse to give them anything.
We'll see!
That's the reason the Religious Right has power in the GOP - they
are willing to take their ball and go home. That the RLC is
unwilling to do so has been their fundamental failure.
Instead I am told "we don't want to lose our voice at the table"
which is why they don't use their voice at the
table. If the RLC had stood up more over its lifespan, perhaps Paul
wouldn't have such a hard road today.
|2.5.08 @ 4:32PM|#
Yeah, we do. The Governor of Florida.
R C Dean,
Are you talking Crist or the previous Governor?
What was his name again?
economist|2.5.08 @ 4:33PM|#
RC Dean,
Uh, I actually meant Huckabee. Those two aren't quite as thick as
thieves, but they've apparently hatched a political alliance in
order to take the Republican nomination. McCain picks up the
liberal/moderate and perversely, also the raging warmonger
Republicans, and Huck gains the ignorant populist Pat Buchanan-type
vote. Why, the only people left out are-Hey!!!
Roger Maltz|2.5.08 @ 4:38PM|#
Screw all this, I'll give up voting rights in exchange for a
few thousand dollars and supplies to start a colony in Antarctica.
Then if anyone from the outside tries to invade, I'll shoot
'em.
Right-wing gun nut hunter
Hey man, where will you get your vegetables? You'll be constipated
like the Inuit. You don't want to know why I know this about Inuit
butthole.
|2.5.08 @ 4:44PM|#
Romney can't be having a very good day.
It seems like the only primaries Romeny ever wins are the ones 1)
where he has personal connections (Michigan, Utah, Massachusetts)
and ones nobody else seriously contends (Wyoming, Nevada).
Sam Grove|2.5.08 @ 4:50PM|#
The media prefer McCain because of Romney's $$$.
After the selection, the media will go Hillary/Obama.
Episiarch|2.5.08 @ 4:56PM|#
gun nut: Mmmmm, scurvyyy.
Beluga skin is loaded with vitamin C. Seriously. The Inuit chew it
to prevent scurvy.
|2.5.08 @ 5:07PM|#
UPDATE 2:24: Yes, most of the McCain and Paul voters went
for Huckabee on the second ballot. Huckabee wins, 52-47
percent.
Ummm I am pretty sure denaroooooo said something about Ron Paul
supporters being idiots...
From looking at this I have to start agreeing with him.
economist|2.5.08 @ 5:20PM|#
I am very disillusioned right now. I'm going to go home and eat pie and hope things look better tomorrow.
BakedPenguin|2.5.08 @ 5:21PM|#
The only way I'm not voting LP is if Huck is on the R ticket in
any way, shape, or form. If he is, and Florida is a close state, I
would vote for Obama - even friggin' Hillary.
I don't want that sanctimonious douche one heartbeat away from the
presidency, especially when the heart belongs to a 108 year old guy
with anger management problems.
|2.5.08 @ 6:22PM|#
gun nut: Mmmmm, scurvyyy.
Beluga skin is loaded with vitamin C. Seriously. The Inuit chew it
to prevent scurvy.
Most raw meat has decent levels of vitamin C, and organ meats are
loaded with it. If you see someone healthy who never eats
vegetables, just meat, bet they eat their steak rare, or eat liver
frequently.
|2.5.08 @ 10:32PM|#
Most raw meat has decent levels of vitamin C, and organ
meats are loaded with it.
Not according to a nutrition chart I just looked at. It doesn't
list anything except fruits and vegetables as a source of vitamin
C. It does, however, say that meats and organ meats are a good
source of vitamin D and the various B vitamins.
I had to study nutrition years ago to become a cook in the Navy and
this is the first time I have ever heard of meat as being a source
of vitamin C. If it is a source, then why weren't sailors able to
get it from the salt pork that was one of their traditional
provisions? Why the insistence on fresh fruit and vegetables to the
point of British sailors being referred to as Limeys?
economist|2.6.08 @ 8:05AM|#
BakedPenguin
Actually, I think the truest form of democratic protest is not
voting. It basically says, "Screw you guys, I'm staying at
home/work/school/hotel where I'm living 'cause the exterminators
are busy gassing the house."
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