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Another Isolated Incident
The headline says, "Two Officers Are Saved by Bullet-Proof Vests." It could just as easily have read, "Police Screw-Up Terrorizes, Nearly Kills Couple and Their Six Children."
The Police Department's SWAT team was attempting to search a house in the 1300 block of Logan Avenue N., at 12:46 a.m. as part of an investigation by the Violent Offender Task Force. But police said that they learned later that the wrong information led them to that house.
"It was found out that this particular address was not part of that long-term investigation," police spokesman Sgt. Jesse Garcia III told KSTP-TV on Sunday. He told KMSP-TV that it was a "bad situation. It could have been much worse."
Garcia said it was not so much a mistake by Minneapolis police but a mistake in the information that was given to them.
That last line translates to, "Admit nothing. Cover your ass in case of a lawsuit."
Come on. You nearly killed innocent people because you wrongly raided a home based on bad information. I don't care how or where that information went bad, it's pretty clearly a "mistake."
Here's another version of the same story:
Police believe they received some bad information and executed a search warrant on the wrong house early Sunday when two officers were shot at and hit, but were protected by bulletproof vests and helmets, a police spokesman said. ,p>"It was some bad information that was received on the front end and it's unfortunate because we have officers that were hit by gunfire and this truly, truly could have been a much worse situation," said Sgt. Jesse Garcia.
[...]
Family members living in the house said they were upstairs when they heard someone bust through their back door. They said Vang Khang grabbed his hunting gun to protect himself, his wife and his six children.
"He thought they were gang members and he was scared," Vang's brother, Dao Khang, told KARE-TV. Dao Khang said Vang fired a warning shot, and then two more shots through his closed bedroom door. The bullets hit two officers, but they weren't injured.
Several officers returned fire but no one in the house was injured, the department said. The man suspected of firing the shots was taken into custody, police said. He was later released.
Note where the police department spokesman's concern lies. No apology to the victims. No regret for nearly killing a man, or for spraying bullets all over the home where an innocent family lay sleeping. No, this incident is "unfortunate" because "we have officers that were hit by gunfire."
Note too that police claim they announced themselves, but no one in the house apparently heard them. Mr. Khang did nothing wrong, and isn't being charged. He isn't a criminal, and has no reason to lie.
So why is it that in so many of these cases, police claim they announced, but no one inside or outside seems to hear them? Retired cops have told me it's because the "announcement" often comes as the door is coming down, if it comes at all. Of course, even if there is an announcement, it doesn't do much good if it comes in the middle of the night, while the people inside are asleep in a backroom or on the second floor. Such scenarios effectively erase any real difference between a "knock-and-announce" and a "no-knock" raid.
When Mario Paz was killed in a SWAT raid in El Monte, California, the town's assistant police chief told the L.A. Times:
“We do bang on the door and make an announcement—‘It’s the police’—but it kind of runs together. If you’re sitting on the couch, it would be difficult to get to the door before they knock it down.”
Now imagine you're asleep when all of this is happening. The whole purpose of the middle-of-the-night raid is to catch the suspect off-guard. Why would police make a clear, full-throated announcement if the intent is surprise?
The catch-22 comes when the suspect, like Mr. Khang, or like Cory Maye, or like Cheryl Lynn Noel, justifiably feels threatened and acts in self-defense. Then "we need the element of surprise," dubiously morphs into, "They should have known we were the police."
It can't be both, as evidenced by the accumulating pile of bodies resulting from these unfortunate tactics.
|12.17.07 @ 1:12AM|#
I was just about to nod off. Now this. How am I supposed to sleep? Thanks, Radley.
bill|12.17.07 @ 1:21AM|#
What ever happened to DETECTIVES who are supposed to INVESTIGATE crimes? Really, how hard can it be to find out if there are children in the house before they pull this crap?
|12.17.07 @ 1:23AM|#
Every time Radley posts one of these stories, I start to wonder if there would be a market in affordable ways to harden a house. Reinforced doors, windows with shatter-proof film coatings, anything to delay the police long enough to get them to double check to make sure they have the right address.
Dave B.|12.17.07 @ 1:29AM|#
mediageek -
From what I understand about human nature, the harder it is for the
cops to get in, the meaner they'll be once they succeed.
Dello|12.17.07 @ 1:43AM|#
bill,
"What ever happened to DETECTIVES who are supposed to INVESTIGATE
crimes? Really, how hard can it be to find out if there are
children in the house before they pull this crap?"
Or even to find out, ya know, if it's the right HOUSE.
Peter Parker|12.17.07 @ 1:56AM|#
Are these newspaper accounts even consistent?
Dickinson Press: "Dao Khang said Vang fired a warning shot, and
then two more shots through his closed bedroom door. The bullets
hit two officers, but they weren't injured."
Star Tribune: "In a statement released shortly after 5 a.m. Sunday,
police said that officers found no one on the first floor of the
house. When they made their way up to the second floor, they were
confronted by an adult male. The officers identified themselves as
police, and the man fired several rounds at them."
Both could be consistent, if Vang "confronted" the police from
behind a closed door. If that is what happened, then the press
release from the police department would seem intentionally
misleading. The press release makes it sound like Vang stood in
front of the police, ignored their attempts to identify themselves,
and opened fire.
Since Vang wasn't shot or charged, it seems more likely he fired
blind through the door, in which case the press release is
misleading.
|12.17.07 @ 3:34AM|#
Peter Parker's comment above catches the police in an blatant
lie to cover their collective asses. There is simply no way to
believe the nonsense in that statement. Does anyone believe that it
is remotely possible for some guy with a gun to "confront" the
police who then identify themselves, then open fire at the police,
and yet somehow live to tell about it?!? It's just utter
unadulterated bullshit from the police statement. The only
believable, and consistent with common sense, scenario is the first
one where he's behind the door and therefore the return fire from
the police has a chance to miss him (and thankfully his family as
well).
So we have yet more evidence, as if any is necessary at this point,
that the police will simply, and collectively, lie to cover any
wrongdoing, including blaming the innocent victims of their
misguided policies. And yet again the silence of the "good" cops in
speaking out against these continued lies, slandering of innocent
victims and protecting their own at any cost, is once again
deafening.
Cactus|12.17.07 @ 3:56AM|#
Dammit Vang. If you shoot and they don't go down put a couple of
rounds between the running lights. Remember G. Gordon Liddy's
advice: "If they insist upon a firefight, give them a firefight.
Just remember, they're wearing flak jackets and you're better off
shooting for the head."
These raids terrorizing innocent people won't end until the
invaders start having to be hauled out in body bags.
|12.17.07 @ 5:09AM|#
I start to wonder if there would be a market in affordable
ways to harden a house.
I went right there with you, MG.
Anyone else kind of surprised that vests stopped rifle fire? Must
have either been a whimpy rifle, or the door slowed it down
considerably more than I would have expected. Normally rifle fire
laughs at vests on the way through.
|12.17.07 @ 6:48AM|#
"part of an investigation by the Violent Offender Task Force." It looks like the violent offenders were the task force.
|12.17.07 @ 7:04AM|#
Anyone else kind of surprised that vests stopped rifle fire?
Must have either been a whimpy rifle, or the door slowed it down
considerably more than I would have expected. Normally rifle fire
laughs at vests on the way through.
Not if the vests were enhanced with Small
Arms Protective Inserts (SAPI) or the Enhanced kind (ESAPI).
The manufacturer claims the plates are capable of stopping a round
the size of a .308 Winchester (7.62 for you NATO-nerds).
|12.17.07 @ 7:48AM|#
"Vang Khang grabbed his hunting gun" - Doesn't say rifle, so...
(nor what Vang hunts; insert obvious joke about hunting
neighborhood cats). The article (RTFA) actually says "He took out
his shotgun".
I may need to rethink my decision to keep birdshot in the 8 shot
Mossberg 500 Stainless because of birdshot's lower penetration
presenting less of a danger to innocents in other rooms. The
innocent is generally in the room with me (to provide cover fire)
and there is no one innocent on the other side of that door.
(BTW - difficult to defend the act of shooting through a door,
unless the Gestapo fired first.)
CB
|12.17.07 @ 8:03AM|#
The innocent is generally in the room with me (to provide
cover fire) and there is no one innocent on the other side of that
door.
You end up in this situation a lot, Cracker's Boy?
|12.17.07 @ 8:16AM|#
Rifle rounds zip through soft armor - shotgun and pistol rounds
do not.
The North Hollywood BOA shootout began a trend for many departments
to switch from shotguns and subguns to 5.56 carbines, due to their
ability to penetrate soft armor. As a homeowner, you might think to
do the same.
Here is a fun link for backyard ballistics experts.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/theboxotruth.htm
Rifle>shotgund>handgun
Birdshot is for birds.
(Disclaimer)
Advice is dependant on your own personal situation. If you live in
a trailer, apartment, or soft-sided house, you may decide
overpenetration is more of a liability than falling victem to
kevlar-clad thugs.
src|12.17.07 @ 8:24AM|#
The Star Tribune looks like a case of bad writing to me.
"When they made their way up to the second floor, they were
confronted by an adult male. The officers identified themselves as
police, and the man fired several rounds at them."
It looks like the reporter's clumsy way of saying that Khang was an
adult male who fired several rounds at them on the second
floor.
"Confronted" has aggressive overtones, but it doesn't tell you
anything about where he was standing; it seems like a vague word to
make him sound more dangerous without actually lying.
Also, is it just me, or does the national news under-report
incidents where people successfully defend themselves? I have
friends I've never been able to convince that guns can, in fact, be
used for self-defense.
|12.17.07 @ 8:31AM|#
switch from shotguns and subguns to 5.56 carbines
..or use shotgun slugs, although these don't always penetrate body
armor, and can overpenetrate through walls, etc. Anyhow, I'm very
surprised that Mr Khang isn't being charged with a slew of very
serious offenses and railroaded by the local DA (which seems to be
the normal procedure in these cases). He should count himself very
lucky, all things considered.
|12.17.07 @ 8:54AM|#
I start to wonder if there would be a market in affordable
ways to harden a house.
Oh, there is, and it's pretty simple -- be wealthy enough to live
in a city and neighborhood where police would be very unlikely to
think of using such paramilitary tactics.
|12.17.07 @ 8:56AM|#
So why is it that in so many of these cases, police claim they announced, but no one inside or outside seems to hear them?
And, furthermore, why should I believe that a gang of armed, masked
thugs breaking down my door in the middle of the the night are "the
good guys" even if the are yelling "POLICE"?
|12.17.07 @ 9:02AM|#
How did they get the wrong house number? Easy - he said
something in a phone call or email that the Bushy squad didn't
like. OOOPPPS. Get used to your future.
Ron Paul for President.
|12.17.07 @ 9:03AM|#
"..or use shotgun slugs, although these don't always penetrate
body armor"
Change "always" to "almost never." Slugs simply have too much
surface area for their low velocity to penetrate the tight weave of
modern ballistic fibers. Of course the blunt trauma can prove fatal
in itself.
"and can overpenetrate through walls, etc"
Everything that has sufficient power for self defence
overpenetrates through walls. Even 9mm ball will happily zip
through your entire house untill it hits a brick wall or cast iron
frying pan or something similar. It's a Catch 22: If it can't go
through multiple layers of sheetrock (birdshot), you probably don't
want to count on it to stop an attacker.
Again with the Box 'o Truth.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/theboxotruth.htm
|12.17.07 @ 9:03AM|#
Can I please ask what business the police have SPRAYING BULLETS
into a house? Any number of innocent people could have been inside.
You'd think the Murderapolis police would learn since a similar
incident just cost them millions. (In that case, they sprayed
machine gun fire on an undercover officer who was laying face down.
Why does any cop EVER need to spray ANYONE with a machine
gun?)
The fact that the victims were non-white and poor probably had
everything to do with it. The cops in Minneapolis neglect the
impoverished neighborhoods, allowing the criminals to take over.
Once in a while, they raid somebody and screw it up. Nice.
Episiarch|12.17.07 @ 9:21AM|#
Best solution, if you are not overly concerned with
overpenetration, is to get an SKS or AK variant. They will
penetrate body armor, are cheap and super-reliable, and the ammo is
(relatively) cheap and ubiquitous.
Otherwise, shotgun with buckshot or a .357 revolver.
The fact that Vang hasn't been charged with anything (thankfully)
is, to me, the most damning indicator of police inncompetence. They
are vindictive fuckholes, and if they could charge him for shooting
them they would. Since they haven't, that is an indicator that they
fucked up royally and don't dare make a stink.
|12.17.07 @ 9:24AM|#
To protect and serve.
We are here to keep the peace.
S & W .500 magnum 5 shot revolver. aim for the cup. They may
live, but they wont walk, procreate, defecate or strongarm an
innocent again.
May everyone derive maximum enjoyment from this holiday season.
|12.17.07 @ 10:03AM|#
The man suspected of firing the shots was taken into
custody, police said. He was later released.
Its a fuckin' miracle. The only thing I can think of is the cops
must know something they really, really didn't want to come out in
court.
|12.17.07 @ 10:38AM|#
So we have yet more evidence, as if any is necessary at this
point, that the police will simply, and collectively, lie to cover
any wrongdoing, including blaming the innocent victims of their
misguided policies.
That can't be. Most cops are good honest law enforcement officers.
Thet would never lie, cover up or perjure themselves to protect
their "brothers in blue".[/Annie off the pickle boat]
As Mr. Balko pointed out
recently, it's quite likely the boys in blue have already had their
LET'S get our story straight confab. Public servants, my ass.
REMEMBER KATHRYN JOHNSTON1
|12.17.07 @ 11:56AM|#
I'm relieved that Mr. Khang is not being charged.
However, I am amused that Mr. Khang hit his target twice, but when
"several officers returned fire" they all missed.
Bagger|12.17.07 @ 12:15PM|#
I'm surprised Mr. Khang wasn't found hanging in his jail cell, dead from an apparent suicide.
|12.17.07 @ 12:16PM|#
I cannot help but wonder what unflattering details might be revealed in open court which prevented the cops from charging Mr Khang.
dhex|12.17.07 @ 12:16PM|#
Since they haven't, that is an indicator that they fucked up
royally and don't dare make a stink.
it makes you think, don't it? maybe we're getting closer to a
critical mass - the one "get thee to the back of the bus" style
flashpoint incident that causes a change in public opinion.
sadly, that will probably take the form of a very young child being
fatally shot at point blank range, on video or home
surveillance.
aresen: they're probably not used to people shooting back at them
during their midnight adventures.
Marcvs|12.17.07 @ 2:33PM|#
Goddamit Radley, stop posting these things on Monday morning. It's like you sit home on the weekends thinking, "How can I ruin our readers' week?"
|12.17.07 @ 4:19PM|#
"""No, this incident is "unfortunate" because "we have officers
that were hit by gunfire."""
That pretty much sums it up. Many cops could care less about the
people in the community. The people are scum, and the cops are the
scum cleaner. And to think that many people want them to have more
power and more control.
|12.17.07 @ 6:34PM|#
Considering that the effective state of the law at this point is that when men with guns break down the door of your house and yell "POLICE!", you are legally required, under pain of death, to immediately drop to the ground and not interfere with them doing as they wish while in your house, I'm surprised armed robbers haven't changed their tactics to take advantage of this...
Paul|12.17.07 @ 7:54PM|#
"part of an investigation by the Violent Offender Task
Force." It looks like the violent offenders were the task
force.
Shyeah, it's like the "Substance Abuse Advocate".
Obbop|12.18.07 @ 11:22AM|#
The elite's government FEARS you!!!!!!
Their fear is manifested in the laws they pass. Here is a law
banning what MANY of the Founders wrote is a RIGHT of citizens when
a government no longer represents them:
Section 2385. Advocating overthrow of Government
Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or
teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of
overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States
or
the government of any State, Territory, District or
Possession
thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein,
by
force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of
any
such government; or
Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of
any
such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues,
circulates,
sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or
printed
matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity,
desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any
government in the United States by force or violence, or
attempts
to do so; or
Whoever organizes or helps or attempts to organize any
society,
group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage
the
overthrow or destruction of any such government by force or
violence; or becomes or is a member of, or affiliates with,
any
such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the
purposes
thereof -
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible for employment
by
the United States or any department or agency thereof, for the
five
years next following his conviction.
If two or more persons conspire to commit any offense named
in
this section, each shall be fined under this title or
imprisoned
not more than twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible
for
employment by the United States or any department or agency
thereof, for the five years next following his conviction.
As used in this section, the terms ''organizes'' and
''organize'', with respect to any society, group, or assembly
of
persons, include the recruiting of new members, the forming of
new
units, and the regrouping or expansion of existing clubs,
classes,
and other units of such society, group, or assembly of
persons.
The federal government is allowing MILLIONS of illegals to invade
our country. Corporate America is becoming increasingly more
powerful and influential. Yet, according to the government of for
and by the elites YOU, a citizen, have to accept whatever the
government does with NO recourse other than voting...... and there
is sufficient proof that shows to me voting is worthless since the
entrenched power structure ensures that the emplaced elite class
can not be removed.
Several Founders specifically wrote of the people's right to
abolish a government when it no longer represents them.
We are forced to live under an elite's TYRANNY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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