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Joe Biden, Delaware Destroyer
The three best and the three worst things about Obama's VP pick
We few, we proud, we Delawareans have a particular view of Sen. Joe Biden, the six-term Democrat announced as Barack Obama's vice-presidential running mate. If you take the Acela Express to D.C. often enough, you'll see him in the back of one of the nice cars, resting his eyes behind Pablo Escobar sunglasses or talking to one of the voters who recognizes him. When you head to the polls, there's a two-in-five chance you'll vote instead for whatever scrub the GOP put on the ballot. It's always been a bit strange to have this guy—half-suburban dad, half-jetsetter with a Death Star ego—as our face to the nation.
The first three immediate minuses that Biden brings to the Obama-Biden ticket:
1. Drug warrior, at arms! In 1982, when John McCain was making his first run for political office, Joe Biden was building his credentials for a national bid. That was the year he proposed the office of "drug czar." Thus began a pattern: Whenever people were panicking about drug abuse, Biden would swoop in to assure them that their panic was justified. The crackdown on stuff that could be used as drug paraphernalia? The RAVE Act? Biden was there with a pen. Since 2002, he has softened only a little on the drug war, changing his mind about the crack/cocaine sentencing disparity two decades too late.
2. PATRIOT Actor. Don't use drugs? Never fear: Biden knows how to restrict your liberties, too. As The New Republic's Michael Crowley pointed out a month after the 9/11 attacks:
In the wake of the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing, Biden did, in fact, champion an anti-terrorism bill similar to the one now before Congress (though it was, as he complains, badly watered down by anti-government conservatives and leftist civil libertarians). And Biden doesn't let you forget it. "I introduced the terrorism bill in '94 that had a lot of these things in it," he bragged to NBC's Tim Russert on September 30. When I spent the day with him later that week, Biden mentioned the legislation to me, and to several other reporters he encountered, no fewer than seven times. "When I was chairman in '94 I introduced a major antiterrorism bill--back then," he says in the morning, flashing a knowing grin and pausing for effect. (Never mind that he's gotten the year wrong.) Back in his office later that afternoon, he brings it up yet again. "I drafted a terrorism bill after the Oklahoma City bombing. And the bill John Ashcroft sent up was my bill."
And get ready for the U.S. Public Service Academy!
3. The Red, White, and Blue Man's burden. Biden isn't a hawk in the way that John McCain is a hawk. He doesn't look to military intervention as the first solution to every foreign policy trip-up. But he still wants the United States to solve them all. Darfur? Check. The embargo on Cuba? Check. NATO expansion and aid to Georgia? Check. Biden amplifies Obama's long-held, and well-disguised, neo-liberal foreign policy. If you were leaning toward the Democrats because you're tired of leaders bellowing and demanding action from the actors in every foreign flare-up, forget it. That's going to be Biden's job description.
Politically, though, none of this is likely to wound Obama. Team McCain's immediate response to Biden, highlighting his criticism of Obama's experience (compare it to, say, Hillary Clinton saying she had experience while "Obama gave a speech"), is yawn-worthy stuff designed to slice into the news cycle. It won't stick.
Meanwhile, Biden helps Obama out in a few important ways.
1. Anti-Rudyism. There is an upside to Biden's aggressive
foreign-policy realism: He's a brutal, effective critic of even
stupider foreign policy. As Politico's Ben Smith first
noted, Biden was the most confident and aggressive opponent of
the "war on terror" concept. "Terror is a tactic," he
has said. "Terror is not a philosophy." That's not just
promising from a policy perspective. It presents the Democrats with
an opportunity to reframe the debate over terrorism.
2. Liberalism with a tough-guy face. Biden is exactly the kind of Democrat who would be winning easily this year if the party's voters hadn't gotten so distracted by that hopeful guy, that creepy lawyer guy, and that angry ex-president's wife. He is a doctrinaire liberal who has remained, nevertheless, completely relatable and C-movie tough. Apart from the 2005 Bankruptcy Bill (which sucked wind for reasons that should bother partisans of any side), there's nothing in his economic record, or interest-group voting record that should give liberals a second's pause. He helped throttle the nomination of Robert Bork, thereby saving Roe v. Wade for two decades. Between that and his authorship of the Violence Against Women Act, he'll lock up those Hillary voters who aren't just interested in throwing fits.
3. Don't call it a comeback. It shouldn't matter, but the manner in which Biden has survived gaffes, mockery, and a straight-up plagiarism scandal is pleasing, in a Hollywood kind of way. Biden recovered from his plagiarism scandal by burying all presidential ambitions for a generation and burrowing into his Senate work. He wasn't a foreign policy expert, so he became one. When he says something stupid, he bounces back. I never got why his comments about Indian-Americans staffing 7-Elevens and Dunkin' Donuts in Delaware were offensive, but in any case now Obama gets to look like an above-it-all pol who doesn't care about political correctness.
David Weigel is an associate editor of reason.
|8.23.08 @ 9:11PM|#
You have condemned him with faint praise, which sounds just
about right to me.
Jim Jones should have been Obama's pick.
Crect Splelng|8.23.08 @ 9:11PM|#
Mmm, Delware. Did I miss Dell buying out Tupperware? Because
I've always wanted computerized food storage devices.
COPYEDITING PLEESE?
Elemenope|8.23.08 @ 9:20PM|#
DEG --
From Wiki:
"Gen. Jones recently appeared with McCain, who he stated his
support for, effectively quashing rumors of an Obama-Jones
ticket."
That might have something to do with it.
|8.23.08 @ 9:29PM|#
Jim Jones is a fundie nut type - which would make him GOP, at least ostensibly (to everyone but the IRS).
|8.23.08 @ 9:31PM|#
Biden also has better-than-average judgment for a politician -- he said last year that Obama wasn't prepared to be president, and then stood by that statement again this year.
|8.23.08 @ 9:44PM|#
There is an upside to Biden's aggressive foreign-policy
realism: He's a brutal, effective critic of even stupider foreign
policy.
Well put, Dave.
You really think Obama is a neo-liberal more than a liberal on
foreign policy? More Madeleine Albright or Hillary Clinton than Ted
Kennedy or Jack Reed?
|8.23.08 @ 9:49PM|#
There is an upside to Biden's aggressive foreign-policy
realism: He's a brutal, effective critic of even stupider foreign
policy.
Heh. When it comes to foreign policy, this government goes to
eleven.
BDB|8.23.08 @ 9:51PM|#
PUMA-land is going apeshit.
HE CALLED HIS WIFE GORGEOUS IN HIS SPEECH!! HOW
DARE HE!
|8.23.08 @ 10:21PM|#
Predicting which candidate will win is as tricky as predicting
which horse will win the Triple Crown. And success in predicting as
well as whichever wins shall have nothing to do with the future of
horse racing.
Get my drift?
It's sort of the reason I'm a PEACEFUL anarchist. Elections nor
dynamite ever produce the hoped-for result.
Grow up!
Be a peaceful anarchist. Don't vote.
Not having any intention of voting makes following the races twice
as much fun.
(I voted once or twice before most of you were born, so I know of
what I speak.)
Better never than first|8.23.08 @ 10:29PM|#
I never understood why Delaware was a state. It's like giving two senators to the Cumberland Gap, but worse because at least the Cumberland Gap isn't sitting between NYC and DC soaking up my toll money.
Kolohe|8.23.08 @ 10:38PM|#
both in this article and the 2006 one, Weigel brings up the
opposition to Bork's nomination.
Bork's work, both recent and more distant, leads me to believe he
would even more in favor of plenary executive authority - and the
concomitant danger to civil liberties - than Scalia. I can hardly
imagine the current court with Bork instead of Kennedy, who wound
up with the seat.
Nick|8.23.08 @ 10:41PM|#
"Ladies and gentlemen, my wife Jill, who you'll meet soon, is
drop dead gorgeous. My wife Jill, who you'll meet soon, she also
has her doctorate degree, which is a problem. But all kidding aside
..."
Yeah, the feminists are going crazy, although not so much about the
"gorgeous" part.
I do think McCain should pick either Sarah Palin or Meg Whitman as
veep just as a tactical maneuver. Either would get sympathy from
women watching Biden trying to beat them up (and coming off as
condescending and sexist). This would be sure to win more
Hillarites to McCain's camp.
|8.23.08 @ 10:41PM|#
Elemenope,
Thanks for setting my mangy ass straight.
I heard from Jim Jones' mouth on May 16, to be exact, that he
"didn't do parties."
Oh, well. Another Santa Claus dead of a heart attack from being
over weight.
Better never than first,
Delaware is a state because that very straight line that is its
northern border was surveyed by Mason and Dixon.
I could be wrong (Elemenope), but I think you missed the Cumberland
Gap by a few states.
By the way, South Ossetia wil rise again! Keep saving your
Confederate money.
Orange Line Special|8.23.08 @ 10:44PM|#
I scaled the HighestPointinDelaware once. It's actually in the
middle of a trailer park, but since that's private property the
accepted point is in the middle of a road. No, really. In fact,
here's a picture of the
sign.
As for Biden, I don't really have much to attack him on so I'll
just stick with BHO.
|8.23.08 @ 11:42PM|#
The trouble is, Obama has already won on foreign policy, because
most people associate McCain with G. W. Bush, like it or not.
Economic issues are not important, because while Obama is
economically illiterate, so is McCain and most American voters.
Most likely, McCain will just be a watered down Obama on economic
issues.
However, Biden is super-pro-gun-control. Gun control is going to be
the issue that causes otherwise pro-Obama working class people to
vote for McCain. There are plenty of people who pretty much support
Obama 100%, but just hate Obama's and Biden's and the Democrat's
stance on gun control. And gun control seems to be the issue where
the Democrats are truly out of touch with the common people
on.
I think Biden is a huge liability.
|8.24.08 @ 12:03AM|#
Is it totally lost on everyone that this is 20 years after Pierre du Pont's run for the presidency? There are no coincidences, especially where Delaware is concerned.
|8.24.08 @ 12:16AM|#
"Jim Jones should have been Obama's pick."
It would be fitting, yes. Obama's supporters have certainly drunk
the Kool-Aid, and putting that cowardly
terrorist-aiding-and-abetting socialist in the White House would
doubtlessly be national suicide.
GEN James L Jones, USMC (Ret.)|8.24.08 @ 1:58AM|#
There was nothing wrong with the name 'Jim Jones' ... until I
was about 35 years old and that no-talent ass clown became famous
and started killing everyone.
Why don't I just go by James or Jimmy instead of Jim?
No way. Why should I change? He's the one who sucks.
Naga Sadow|8.24.08 @ 2:06AM|#
Delaware? Bah! (waves hand in dismissive gesture) The Mississippi of the North!
David Weigel|8.24.08 @ 2:21AM|#
I do think McCain should pick either Sarah Palin or Meg
Whitman as veep just as a tactical maneuver.
Terrible idea. Neither has been vetted, and both have served less
time in politics than Obama has. It would be the nakedest pander in
VP politics in living memory.
|8.24.08 @ 3:41AM|#
Gen James,
HA!
Should Weigel change his name because everytime I see it I think of
the cop on 'Reno911'?
The crazy racist chick that faked being suicidal to get the Lt to
spoon her.
|8.24.08 @ 3:45AM|#
OLS,
Of all the things in your post, "highest point in Delaware" gets no
spaces?
Is the no spaces thing, more to do with you being mad at your
computer or spell check or something, than any political
belief?
jk|8.24.08 @ 6:21AM|#
Even money that "Plagiarizing Joe" will lift something from someone in his speech at the Democratic Convention.
|8.24.08 @ 7:08AM|#
You bring up the VAWA (Violence Against Women Act) as an
accomplishment to attract the Clinton feministas.
But doesn't this threaten attachment to the males out there?
By focusing only on the female-as-victim, and completely ignoring
the other (fully) half of the domestic violence equation, the VAWA
alienates as much as it attracts.
Ultimately, Biden may prove as divisive as Hillary Clinton: you
either love or hate him.
ed|8.24.08 @ 8:04AM|#
Is the no spaces thing more to do with you being mad at your
computer...
I think the intent is to get rubes to notice him and then comment
that they noticed him.
VM|8.24.08 @ 9:28AM|#
jk:
at least Biden's 80s BS and McCain's 80s BS get evened out in the
wash.
(but McCain shouldn't talk about Rezko, cuz he leaves himself
open.)
actually. who cares what they harp on? All three choices have
terrible records.
sighs. ambles back into woods.
|8.24.08 @ 9:43AM|#
Weigel might appreciate these comments from
Ceila Cohen, the author of "Only in Delaware: Politics and
Politicians in the First State"
People are agog here in Delaware, the state that is 49th in size and peaked when it was the first to ratify the Constitution. Expectations are very low for national recognition. Delaware would happily take "home of a vice president."
...
All of Delaware is divided into Biden idolizers and Biden haters. The backers are more numerous, the detractors more intense. He will be on the ballot twice, because he also is running for reelection. This could put the Biden haters in therapy.
Abdullah|8.24.08 @ 10:41AM|#
"...and putting that cowardly terrorist-aiding-and-abetting
socialist in the White House would doubtlessly be national
suicide."
you've been watching too much hannity.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 11:16AM|#
People can make fun of Delaware, but its government has been very smart with its lax corporate laws and low taxes. If it wasn't so business friendly it would be a very poor state.
|8.24.08 @ 11:56AM|#
I understand the political logic in selecting a left leaning
authoritarian for the VP slot. Obama could have blown the election
with a selection from the farther left wing of the party. That
Biden is no friend of liberty must be said.
Anyone who allegedly cares for the poor and downtrodden while
suppporting the War on Drugs Minorities has a
serious problem connecting the dots. If you are too undiscerning to
recognize, or too stubborn to admit, the horrid effects present
drug policy has on the lower classes, I have to doubt your
intelligence or your honesty/courage.
BakedPenguin|8.24.08 @ 12:03PM|#
People can make fun of Delaware...
State motto contest: "Delaware! Gateway to New Jersey."
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 12:47PM|#
All the harsh criticism heaped on major party politicos here brings into sharp relief how weird the dorkish freaks like Ron Paul, Bob Barr and his porno-star boufonte running mate that you crazed libertarians actually support really are.
|8.24.08 @ 12:59PM|#
JK: I'm thinking there should be some sort of contest for the
best lines from Biden's acceptance speech.
"The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here,
but it will never forget what we did here."
"We will fight the Republicans on the beaches of Florida. We will
never surrender!"
"Senator Obama, let's tear down those walls!"
(OT: Ron Paul endorses Don Young!?)
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 1:13PM|#
"If we just go back to the gold standard, put all the references to God that the liberals have removed back into the constitution, and keep those wetbacks from crossing the border, all will be well." --Ron Paul
|8.24.08 @ 1:22PM|#
Biden is knowledgable about foreign policy if you think reading
The Economist makes a person knowledgable.
Did you know that Indonesia is at a crossroads? Well it is!
|8.24.08 @ 1:37PM|#
I think Biden was Obama's second best pick, behind Webb. Bayh is a pretty boy that offers little to the table. I think Biden's value is completely underestimated. When McCain responds to international conflict abroad by whipping out his swords and saying, "who wants some?!" (In a yosemite sam voice no less), then I see Biden as a very reasonable pick that will make McCain look like an immature 'know-it-all' adolescent in an adult world.
|8.24.08 @ 1:39PM|#
I was in the company of conservative Republicans yesterday, and
they were elated about Obama's choice of VP. Biden said a lot of
stuff on the campaign trail that will come back to haunt Obama in
hit piece after hit piece.
This was a remarkably stupid choice by Obama. This may cost him
some electoral college votes that he can't afford to lose in what
is shaping up to be as tight a race as in 2004, with pretty much
the same battleground states.
And, judging by the ad banner on the side of this post, McCain is
looking to pick a nominal Democrat -- Lieberman -- as his VP, thus
consolidating it as the Democratic lite ticket and seizing the
political center.
WTF was Obama thinking? There weren't any moderate to conservative
Southern Democrats -- you know, the kind of Democrats who actually
win presidential elections -- to choose from?
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 1:45PM|#
Prolefeed
The Republican smear machine needs a slightly subtler approach than
you offer, so stick your head back up your ass and don't quit your
day job, if you have one.
robc|8.24.08 @ 1:47PM|#
prole,
If McCain chooses Lieberman, Barr will poll high enough to be
included in the debates.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 1:52PM|#
McCain can't pick a pro-choice VP and keep the dimwitted religious right on side. Lieberman wouldn't even secure the Jewish vote. He'll hold his nose and pick Romney.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 1:53PM|#
Lieberman would seal the election for Obama.
It would turnoff McCain's own base while simultaneously energizing
the Democratic base.
Dagny T.|8.24.08 @ 1:56PM|#
Did you know that Indonesia is at a crossroads? Well it
is!
Haha, nice. Don't forget Africa in Turmoil, and some kooky
anecdotes from the annals of Canadian &/or British
politics.
Sadly, when the choices are someone who reads the Economist and
someone who apparently just reads Kristol/Brooks and the Bible, I'm
going with Bachelor Number 1.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 1:58PM|#
You should be happy, Lefiti.
Obama picked a running mate who was terrible in school!
|8.24.08 @ 1:58PM|#
The simple fact is that Joe Biden is a slack-jawed dolt whose
mouth consistently outpaces his meagre intellect, Delaware's very
own version of Teddy Kennedy.
The ticket's now nicely balanced, a high IQ Marxist intellectual
and a lip-bibbling nincompoop.
|8.24.08 @ 2:02PM|#
Lefiti -
Please regale us with more of your wisdom. A little comedy relief
from the intellectually bereft left helps to balance out the GOP
lickspittles.
Maybe you can tag team with the McCain backers defending the
Patriot Act that Biden proudly claims to have authored.
|8.24.08 @ 2:16PM|#
David E. Gallaher | August 23, 2008, 10:41pm | #
Delaware is a state because that very straight line that is its
northern border was surveyed by Mason and Dixon.
Actually, except for less than a mile that is the top of "the
Wedge", the northern border of Delaware is an arc of a circle. The
12-Mile Circle centered on New Castle, to be precise.
I have the theory that Delaware got the Wedge because it's so
puny.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 2:26PM|#
Ah, if only the masses would wake up and vote for the hairlip and the porno star!
BDB|8.24.08 @ 2:26PM|#
J Sub, as much as Joey Biden sucks on civil liberties issues,
you gotta admit it was a smart choice politically. The more I think
it about, its good strategy-wise on a lot of levels:
1) Biden is great at being the hatchet man
2) Hes Catholic, from a blue collar background, and wraps up PA (MI
and OH would probably like him, too)
3) People think (rightly or wrongly) hes a foreign policy
expert
4) He has the punditocracy in his back pocket, even more than John
McCain. Christ Matthews creaming his pants over the selection is
all you need to know.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 2:27PM|#
er, CHRIS Matthews. Wow, what a horrible horrible typo. Almost as horribly good joe's "brother in lay".
|8.24.08 @ 2:46PM|#
J Sub, as much as Joey Biden sucks on civil liberties
issues, you gotta admit it was a smart choice politically. The more
I think it about, its good strategy-wise on a lot of
levels:
I said as much upthread. Being an altruistic libertarian* does not
blind me to political realities.
*Kinda, sorta, ... y'know.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 2:52PM|#
"Being an altruistic libertarian* does not blind me to political
realities."
That you think you're an "altruistic libertarian" means your
connections with reality of any sort are tenuous and weak.
|8.24.08 @ 2:57PM|#
I see Lefiti is in the running for least substantive
poster...ever.
mommy not love you enough?
|8.24.08 @ 3:01PM|#
Lefiti -- I was pointing out how these conservative Republicans
were elated over Obama's pick. But let's try this on for size,
since you seem to be a little logic-impaired -- if you were to
mention in casual conversation what a conservative Republican said,
would that make you a conservative Republican?
If not, perhaps you could explain how you concluded that a radical
libertarian mentioning what some conservative Republicans said
makes said radical libertarian a conservative Republican?
Here's what I was getting at -- if a presidential candidate's pick
for a running mate makes their political opponents want to break
out the champagne, it might be an opportune time for said
presidential candidate to reflect on the possibility that he or she
fucked up royally.
Like, you know, when in one of the more colossal blunders in
political history, Quayle was tapped for VP. Oh wait, now are you
going to call me a liberal Democrat?
BDB|8.24.08 @ 3:05PM|#
Prolefeed-
MSNBC First Read said the GOP was "stunned silent" over the pick,
that Biden was the one they least wanted to see.
I'm not sure what universe you're in.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 3:12PM|#
"Like, you know, when in one of the more colossal blunders in
political history, Quayle was tapped for VP. Oh wait, now are you
going to call me a liberal Democrat?"
No, Prolefeed, I'll call you a moron. Bush/Quayle won, remember?
Some colossal blunder.
So I apologize for implying that you're a conservative Republican.
I see that you're a moronic libertarian.
|8.24.08 @ 3:23PM|#
Lefiti - just because the ticket won doesn't mean the choice of
Quayle was a wise one.
But I see nuance and substance aren't exactly your forte.
|8.24.08 @ 3:42PM|#
I've yet to see anybody who isn't a loud supporter of McCain say
Biden was a bad pick from the point of view of electoral
strategery.
You pretty much only see that argument made by people who just
can't help but work the words Marxist or Hussein into their
statements.
|8.24.08 @ 3:50PM|#
Lefiti - just because the ticket won doesn't mean the choice
of Quayle was a wise one.
But I see nuance and substance aren't exactly your
forte.
Nor is polite discourse. Lefiti is another example of an all too
commom trait. Sound and fury with a complete lack of content.
|8.24.08 @ 3:59PM|#
Hes Catholic, from a blue collar background, and wraps up PA
(MI and OH would probably like him, too)
I have to say that spending 30 years in the Senate doesn't exactly
make me feel like he's "one of the guys".
I personally think Biden's a liability (overall...one thing you can
say about him is that there isn't even a whiff of scandal
on the man, which is rare) in that he doesn't really deliver a
state (I'm skeptical about PA...and I figured that one was going
Obama because of Rendell), he shoots off at the mouth, he doesn't
appeal to the pie-in-the-sky young people who are the 2008 version
of Deaniacs. He's basically Joe Lieberman.
He's bragged about writing the USA PATRIOT Act, he's bragged about
calling for the "surge"...he's riffed on Obama and praised McCain!
I really do think this was a Grade-A dumb choice.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 4:03PM|#
"he doesn't appeal to the pie-in-the-sky young people who are
the 2008 version of Deaniacs."
He wasn't picked for that reason. He was picked to appeal to
AFL-CIO Democrats. Hes very well liked among older voters
(according to the polls) people Obama doesn't do well with.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 4:06PM|#
Yeah hes in Washington for 30 years, but hes one of the least
wealthy members of the Senate (that's probably why there is no
scandal), and he goes home every night. I think hes the only
Senator who doesn't live inside the beltway.
So hes of Washington, but not.
ed|8.24.08 @ 4:10PM|#
People can make fun of Delaware...
Well, you can't spell Delaware without "aware."
Aware of what I have no idea.
Neu Mejican|8.24.08 @ 4:19PM|#
Aware of what I have no idea.
Del = "of the"
So it is The Land of the Aware?
BDB|8.24.08 @ 4:21PM|#
Joe-
Your biggest problem with Biden is in Pumalandia and feminist
circles. They're already going apeshit that he called his wife
gorgeous, then said the fact she had her doctorate was "a
problem".
|8.24.08 @ 4:42PM|#
Your biggest problem with Biden is in Pumalandia and
feminist circles. They're already going apeshit that he called his
wife gorgeous, then said the fact she had her doctorate was "a
problem".
I realize that in 21st century politics you have to walk on
eggshells because so many groups are ardently searching for a
reason to be offended.
But c'mon, isn't calling your wife gorgeous or beautiful somewhat
obligatory? "This is my somewhat attractive/average looking wife"
just ain't gonna fly.
Biden's comment about his wife's doctorate being "a problem" sounds
more like a loving husband joking about the trials and tribulations
of having a smart educated wife than anything else. I doubt many
PUMAs will be staying home on election day over that trivial
stuff.
|8.24.08 @ 4:43PM|#
he doesn't really deliver a state (I'm skeptical about
PA...and I figured that one was going Obama because of Rendell), he
shoots off at the mouth, he doesn't appeal to the pie-in-the-sky
young people who are the 2008 version of Deaniacs
He's meant more for a demographic than a state. The Obama campaign
needs an attack dog to do their dirty work for them. Also, Obama
has the pie-in-the-sky people locked up, he doesn't need more of
them, he needs their parents and siblings. It's a smart pick by the
Obama camp, but not one I'm happy about. The good thing is if he's
part of a 2 term Obama presidency, he probably won't be president
because of his age. The VP is a nice isolation chamber for him.
Like what we did with Al Gore.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 4:48PM|#
"Lefiti - just because the ticket won doesn't mean the choice of
Quayle was a wise one."
Right. But there are no unwise choices in Libertarian la-la land,
where winning is never an even remote possibility. You can run
boring old farts and porn-star look-alikes and never have to worry
about defending a policy. Then you can mock and ridicule those who
live in the messy old real world. What a bunch of loser fucks you
guys are.
Homer Gives Two Thumbs Up|8.24.08 @ 4:54PM|#
"Christ Matthews creaming his pants over the selection is all
you need to know.
...Almost as horribly good joe's "brother in lay"."
Technically, both are correct.
Billy|8.24.08 @ 4:58PM|#
"MSNBC First Read said the GOP was "stunned silent" over the
pick, that Biden was the one they least wanted to see."
MSNBC??? Right...
|8.24.08 @ 4:58PM|#
Right. But there are no unwise choices in Libertarian la-la
land, where winning is never an even remote possibility. You can
run boring old farts and porn-star look-alikes and never have to
worry about defending a policy. Then you can mock and ridicule
those who live in the messy old real world. What a bunch of loser
fucks you guys are.
Is this where I'm supposed to talk about you mother's sexual
proclivities? Since any reasoned, intelligent discussion with you
seems pointless, are childish insults mocking your intelligence and
lack of breeding what you're seeking?
'Cause I know how to do that.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 5:00PM|#
J Sub-
To you and I its not a big deal, but we're normal.
IOW, we're not PUMAs.
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 5:10PM|#
"Is this where I'm supposed to talk about you mother's sexual
proclivities? Since any reasoned, intelligent discussion with you
seems pointless, are childish insults mocking your intelligence and
lack of breeding what you're seeking?"
No, you're supposed to explain how not having a chance of winning
doesn't matter to libertarians because...
The you could defend mocking people who actually do have a shot at
governing because...
Maybe you could take a shot at explaining why government keeps
growing bigger and bigger despite all your efforts.
Tell me why I should vote for Bob Barr and the boufonte freak.
ed|8.24.08 @ 5:27PM|#
Del = "of the"...So it is The Land of the Aware?
I seriously doubt it. Barbara Mikulski is their other
senator.
Bily|8.24.08 @ 5:28PM|#
"He got good reviews on Fox News, too."
Good reviws and "stunned" are clearly not the same thing.
|8.24.08 @ 5:31PM|#
FUN FACTS ABOUT DELAWARE:
As of the mid-nineties, Delaware had the highest percentage of
Superfund sites of any state in the Union.
Valerie Bertinelli, George Thoroughgood and Bill Press are all
Wilmington-born.
Portions of the flick Dead Poet's Society were shot at a
Delaware boarding school.
Carl Perkins (of Blue Suede Shoes fame) was wounded in a
car crash near Dover, circa 1956.
At one time, half the Fortune 500 was incorporated in
Delaware.
Lynda "Wonder Woman" Carter lives near Rehoboth Beach.
Bob Marley, NFL Hall-Of-Famer Randy White, and punk rock icon Tom
Verlaine all lived for a while in Wilmington. (White and Verlaine
went to the same high school)
Delaware has no sales tax.
David Weigel, a Delaware native, writes for Reason.
Jim Walsh, Delaware native and frequent Hit 'n' Run gadfly, has way
to much free time...
|8.24.08 @ 5:34PM|#
Re ed: Delaware's other senator is Tom Carper. He's not perfect, but he is vastly preferable to Mikulski...
|8.24.08 @ 5:40PM|#
No, you're supposed to explain how not having a chance of
winning doesn't matter to libertarians because...
Libertarians expect to influence the debate. We are not irrational
enough to expect to gain significant political power this
year.
The[n] you could defend mocking people who actually do have a
shot at governing because...
Hypocrites, incompetents and enemies of liberty deserve
mocking.
Maybe you could take a shot at explaining why government keeps
growing bigger and bigger despite all your efforts.
Too many fools think that what comes from the government is without
costs. It may be inevitable for democracies to slowly squander
their freedom for "security". I do not hold people's intelligence
in high esteem.
Tell me why I should vote for Bob Barr and the boufonte [sic]
freak.
Because Obama professes socialist and populist ideas and McCain's
National Greatness shtick is a downright scary.
Now your turn -
What positives do have to say about the prospective nominees from
the major parties?
Do you expect either to press for a reduction in executive
authority and power?
Do you think that warrants are going to again be required for
eavesdropping on American's private communications?
Do you think that the War on Drugs Sanity is
going to be repudiated or even questioned by either party?
Is corporate welfare for ADM, ethanol plants, sugar cane growers
etc. going to be curtailed? Or are the Big Three domestic auto
companies next on that gravy train?
Will anything be done about a broken immigration policy that
recognizes the human rights of all immigrants?
Lefiti|8.24.08 @ 5:44PM|#
"Libertarians expect to influence the debate. We are not
irrational enough to expect to gain significant political power
this year."
This year? You're too fucking stupid to waste time talking to.
|8.24.08 @ 5:46PM|#
Biden on Obama: "I mean, you got the first mainstream
African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a
nice-looking guy," he said. "I mean, that's a storybook,
man."
Obama isn't ready to be President and the job is "not something
that lends itself to on-the-job training."
And the McCain campaign has already pounced and started running
attack ads featuring Biden's own words
And does anyone think that Biden is going to get a personality
transplant and avoid shooting off his mouth and saying something
else boneheaded between now and November?
It's nowhere near as bad as picking Quayle, but this one is gonna
cost Obama. There were much better choices -- really, there weren't
any conservative to moderate Democrats from Southern or swing
states who are pro-gun to pick from?
BDB|8.24.08 @ 5:51PM|#
You mean he said bad things about Obama when he was running
against him for President? Oh Noes! That will cost him the
election!
Yeah, right.
|8.24.08 @ 5:52PM|#
pollster.com shows the race continuing to tighten. There weren't any politicians from the states that aren't dark blue or dark red to choose for VP?
BDB|8.24.08 @ 5:55PM|#
"There weren't any politicians from the states that aren't dark
blue or dark red to choose for VP?"
Timmeh Kain who is a bland mediocre governor, Evan Bayh who goes
whichever way the wind blows, Kathleen Sebelius (OMG! A WOMAN
BESIDES HILLARY! SLAP IN THE FACE!), and Bill Richardson (too much
color for one ticket).
ed|8.24.08 @ 5:56PM|#
Re ed: Delaware's other senator is Tom Carper.
He's not perfect, but he is vastly preferable to
Mikulski...
Holy crap and my bad! Boy, is my face red!
Did someone finally shoot her or was she hit by a bus?
Either way it's a win-win.
|8.24.08 @ 5:57PM|#
BDB -- The following two statements are not identical in
meaning:
"This wasn't such a disasterous choice that it will inevitably cost
Obama this election."
"This was a solid choice, perhaps the best possible one. This VP
may help win a few swing states."
Politics is won or lost at the margins. Dukakis in a Tank TM
didn't, by itself, cause that election bid to fail -- but it sure
as fuck didn't help.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 5:58PM|#
Prole, Biden secures Pennsylvania boosts just enough in Philly to put it out of reach to be red) and helps with older voters, in a nutshell.
|8.24.08 @ 6:02PM|#
BDB -- Bill Richardson is a popular figure in a state that is in
play. He is more moderate than Obama. He would shore up Obama's
support in a swing ethnic group. IIRC, he is pro-gun. He has shown
some fiscal restraint in governing. He has actual experience at
running a governmental entity.
There may be better choices than Richardson, but he would have been
a much better pick than Biden.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 6:04PM|#
Prole I don't think Biden is a knockout choice. It is a solid
one, though.
Two minorities on the same ticket won't fly. Sadly, that's just the
truth. Maybe someday that will be possible.
I personally hate a lot of Biden's positions, but I'm not the voter
Obama is targeting here.
|8.24.08 @ 6:06PM|#
BDB -- Pennsylvania is kind of a stretch for labeling as a swing state. It will be fought over, money will be spent there, but I doubt come election night people will be agonizing over Pennsylvania because it is the final state in play in a race going down to the wire. Note that on Pollster.com it has been dark blue for a while.
|8.24.08 @ 6:08PM|#
This year? You're too fucking stupid to waste time talking
to.
So you do wish to be insulted. What's the matter, can't
afford a decent dominatrix?
|8.24.08 @ 6:20PM|#
Two minorities on the same ticket won't fly. Sadly, that's
just the truth. Maybe someday that will be possible.
He couldn't pick a woman for saimilar reasons. If Hillary had
gotten the nod, she'd have had to pick a [gasp!] white male. One
step at a time.
|8.24.08 @ 6:34PM|#
You're too fucking stupid to waste time talking
to.
Translation: Holy shit I just got pwned! Better start flinging
poop!
|8.24.08 @ 6:37PM|#
Holy crap and my bad! Boy, is my face red!
Did someone finally shoot her or was she hit by a bus?
You probably have her confused with Delaware's governor; they do
have kind of a separated-at-birth thing going...
|8.24.08 @ 6:42PM|#
BDB,
Your biggest problem with Biden is in Pumalandia and feminist
circles.
The 25 people who create the PUMA web presence have shown
themselves to be very different from the actual Hillary voters out
there.
The actual Hillary voters are people who dig on candidates like Joe
Biden, and many of them had him as their second choice. Heck,
Hillary used to talk about how he'd be a good VP pick.
prolefeed,
The south is gone, man. Redsville. The migration is complete.
Picking someone based on Bubba appeal makes as much sense for a
Democrat as picking someone beloved by NYC punks makes for a
Republican.
In the New Millennium, Democrats win by 1) expanding nationwide, 2)
expanding in the West, or 3) expanding among white working class
people in small towns in the midwest.
|8.24.08 @ 6:47PM|#
I think ed's having trouble distinguishing Delaware and Maryland. David E. Gallaher had the same problem earlier.
|8.24.08 @ 7:25PM|#
this election was over two weeks ago...the sushi/dean and dulca socalist obama is done
Patrick Henry|8.24.08 @ 7:25PM|#
Good to see they 86ed the Socialist circle jerk thread/post that used to be below this one.
Regis Carnifex|8.24.08 @ 7:36PM|#
Just for fun, I noticed this sentence on the Issues page of
Obama's website:
"Five years after 9/11, our country is still unprepared for a
terrorist attack."
Well, I suppose there was a 9/11 five years ago, as there will be
one this year, but it seems to me that 9-11-03 is not the one the
campaign should be referring to.
And some people say Reason has trouble with copy-editing. At least
Weigel isn't running for President! :(
Elemenope|8.24.08 @ 7:44PM|#
Regis, he's talking about 9/11 the Platonic Form. You know, "The 9/11". :)
|8.24.08 @ 7:57PM|#
And the McCain campaign has already pounced and started
running attack ads featuring Biden's own words
Which is going to come back and bite them in the ass if McCain taps
Romney...
Elemenope|8.24.08 @ 8:09PM|#
Which is going to come back and bite them in the ass if
McCain taps Romney...
I thought it was monumentally stupid for them to trot out the
"Yeah, I like McCain" Biden comments, because Biden could slice
them to ribbons with "yeah, he *used* to be a nice guy, but no
more. I don't even *know* this asshole that goes around town
calling himself McCain anymore. He's a different person than the
one I had affection for."
Regis Carnifex|8.24.08 @ 8:47PM|#
LMNOP,
Ah, I see! So, it's just "sharing in" "The 9/11". Wow, that must be
a fucked up Form. It's Definition must have something to do with
epic battles between The West/Christendom and Islam. Cf. the Battle
of Lepanto.
Of all the crazy Ideas...
Regis Carnifex|8.24.08 @ 8:48PM|#
Is it just me or did reason.com just shit itself for a few minutes?
BDB|8.24.08 @ 8:55PM|#
It looks like the media is trying to make this convention all Bill and Hill, all the time.
|8.24.08 @ 9:03PM|#
Regis, it wasn't just you. Old hands around here know that when
that happens, it's the Server Squirrels wreaking acts of
terrorism.
See, the Server Squirrels used to be the ruling party around here.
They used to chew up comments and send them into oblivion...but
sometimes for fun they would double, treble or even quadruple a
post, just for fun!
Now the Server Squirrels are jealous they're not the ruling party
any more, so they've turned to terrorist acts. reason doesn't
negotiate with terrorists, however.
|8.24.08 @ 9:05PM|#
Good to see they 86ed the Socialist circle jerk thread/post
that used to be below this one.
How substantive, PH. I'll note you dropped out of that thread
pretty quickly...it's best if you remain in the "intellectual
lightweight" division, for fear of bruising your delicate
sensibilities and your non-existent intellectual
gravitas.
|8.24.08 @ 9:30PM|#
"Two minorities on the same ticket won't fly. Sadly, that's
just the truth. Maybe someday that will be possible."
It's "just the truth" because you claim it to be? It hasn't been
TRIED even one time, let alone tried and failed even one time, so
how do you know?
I don't think Obama would be sinking in the polls right now if he
had picked, say, Bill Richardson as his running mate instead of
Biden. And if Bill Richardson would end up sinking Obama in the
polls, it would probably be more related to his individual failings
that also caused him to do so poorly in the Democratic Party
primaries, not because he's a minority.
Obama could've picked a racial minority or a female as his running
mate and been just fine. The real reason he would have difficulty
picking a minority or female as his running mate is because it
would be harder to find possible choices who had already been
extensively vetted in the media for many years. Obama's biggest
concern in picking a running mate had to be that he'd pick someone
who was very well known and hadn't already been gone over with a
fine-toothed comb by the national media, and thus any embarassing
things from their life and careers would be new news and dominate
the media for perhaps weeks. Thus, he picked someone who has been
in the Senate for over 3 decades. Anything embarassing about Biden
from the past (such as his plagiarism) is old news. One of the
primary goals of the Obama campaign right now has gotta be to just
not have any screw-ups that could turn the tide.
Minorities and females as possible running mates would more likely
be outsiders or lesser-knowns to the political establishment and
thus more likely to blow up in his face.
Therefore, it's more about that there are just more white guys who
have been in the Senate for over 3 decades than there are
minorities and females, and Obama wanted to go with a safe choice
given the fact that he's currently the front-runner.
BDB|8.24.08 @ 9:32PM|#
Since when did "essentially tied in the polls" come to mean the "front-runner"?
|8.24.08 @ 9:33PM|#
Typo correction: "Obama's biggest concern in picking a running mate had to be that he'd pick someone who WASN'T very well known and hadn't already been gone over with a fine-toothed comb by the national media, and thus any embarassing things from their life and careers would be new news and dominate the media for perhaps weeks."
|8.24.08 @ 9:41PM|#
Well, I'm not yet closely studying the polls or the electoral
college map, so maybe it isn't a clear-cut fact that Obama is the
front-runner. My sense is that he is, however. McCain has cut into
that lead significantly of late, which I'm glad about as I'm
probably voting for McCain.
The running mate choice was a potential dangerous moment for Obama
and he was smart to go with someone who has been high profile for
many years.
JB|8.25.08 @ 12:40AM|#
So Mr. Hopey-Changey is running with a ticket of two
Senators?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Maybe that 'change' he keeps spouting really is
what he wants to leave in your pockets.
|8.25.08 @ 12:49AM|#
"Change that I can believe in" does not include picking someone who was senator at the beginning of the Cenozoic Era.
The Wine Commonsewer|8.25.08 @ 2:16AM|#
Some really awful news. NoStar is in intensive care and his 12
year old daughter was killed in a motorcycle accident today.
Your thoughts and prayers are appreciated.
|8.25.08 @ 8:13AM|#
BDB,
Virginia, no. Virginia is becoming a mid-Atlantic state with the
growth of the DC suburbs.
North Carolina, yes. If Obama takes North Carolina, it's because he
won such a national blowout that he wouldn't need it anyway.
BDB|8.25.08 @ 8:56AM|#
Joe you need more than the D.C. suburbs. Thats only two
Congressional districts.
Obama needs Richmond, Charlottesville, and Hampton Roads PLUS a
blowout in the D.C. suburbs.
I think the hardest place for him will be Hampton Roads, they tend
to vote for the veteran if theres one on the ticket (especially
naval and marine ones).
|8.25.08 @ 10:24AM|#
BDB,
I'm saying, because the DC suburbs have grown, and are growing, as
a share of the state, it's become less like a trypical Southern
state and more like Maryland, Delaware, or eastern Pennsylvania.
But less so.
liberal cauliflower|8.25.08 @ 11:46AM|#
I believe any article about the shortcomings of Joe Biden is
incomplete without mention of his systematic shilling for the
entertainment industry (RIAA, MPAA et al) and all around execrable
voting record on all matters technological.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10024163-38.html
|8.25.08 @ 5:37PM|#
Is it just me, or does the "Obama Biden" campaign name look like a spelling mistake for "Osama Bin Laden"?
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