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One More Argument For School Choice (Dallas Public School Edition)
The Dallas school system was rocked by allegations Thursday that staff members at an inner-city high school made students settle their differences by fighting bare-knuckle brawls inside a steel cage.
The principal and other employees at South Oak Cliff High knew about the cage fights and allowed the practice to continue, according to a 2008 report by school system investigators.
"More than anything, I'm in shock and disbelief - shocked that this could ever occur and shocked that it would be condoned by a professional administrator," said Jerome Garza, a member of the Dallas school board.
The report, first obtained by The Dallas Morning News, describes two instances of fighting in an equipment cage in a boys' locker room between 2003 and 2005. It was not clear from the report whether there were other fights....
"It was gladiator-style entertainment for the staff," Frank Hammond, a fired counselor who has filed a whistle-blower lawsuit against the district, told the newspaper. "They were taking these boys downstairs to fight. And it was sanctioned by the principal and security."
Warty|3.20.09 @ 10:30AM|#
Give the kids bungee cords and chainsaws, and you could solve a lot of problems in one entertaining stroke.
|3.20.09 @ 10:34AM|#
P Brooks,
They would have been trampled to death without the union. Anyone
against unions wants teenagers to be trampled to death.
|3.20.09 @ 10:47AM|#
Why is this not a criminal issue rather than a civil one? It is called child endangerment. If I had a teenage son and had him and his buddies cage fight while my buddies and I bet on the outcomes, I would be in jail for it. Why are the teachers and counselors responsible for it in jail?
|3.20.09 @ 11:15AM|#
Oh, Tofu, you mean the wonderful government you love doesn't protect the workers?
|3.20.09 @ 11:27AM|#
if these were private schools they wouldn't be held accountable! thank goodness it was a public school so the matter will be properly investigated without bias
TofuSushi|3.20.09 @ 11:27AM|#
Oh, Tofu, you mean the wonderful government you love doesn't
protect the workers?
When the wrong people are running it the workers only have the
unions to defend them.
I misstated earlier. Finally we have a government to protect the
workers, until the other side steals it again.
Abdul|3.20.09 @ 11:35AM|#
Time for another entertaining Retard Wrangler story? Don't mind
if I do.
Back when I was a therapeutic behavioral consultant for juveniles
with mental illness (retard wrangler), I escorted a young autistic
kid to his summer camp in North Philly. He was the only special
needs kid in the camp. When the elementary school age kids got into
conflicts, the college-aged counselors would have them settle their
differences in by having them fight in the bathroom. The only
exception seemed to be when the physical mismatch would not make it
a fair fight.
As a counselor, the law required me to report this, and so I did.
People were disciplined, the thunderdome stopped and I drew ugly
stares the rest of the summer for being a wet-blanket.
But deep in my heart, I always figured that if men were truly in
charge of things, fist-fights would be considered a societally
approved form of conflict resolution.
TofuSushi|3.20.09 @ 11:36AM|#
Abdul,
At least you are not always a monster. Thank you for reporting the
Fascist thugs.
Abdul|3.20.09 @ 11:40AM|#
At least you are not always a monster.
You have insulted my honor. Pistols at dawn, sir!
Or, alternatively, a counselling session where we can use
I-statements and reflect upon each other's feelings.
|3.20.09 @ 11:49AM|#
Tofu - South Oak Cliff is a predominantly African-American
neighborhood. Any "redneck" that went to that school wouldn't even
make it to the steel cage...or through the first day of school for
that matter.
Moron.
TofuSushi|3.20.09 @ 11:50AM|#
Or, alternatively, a counselling session where we can use
I-statements and reflect upon each other's feelings.
That is acceptable as long as I can wear my kitten ears.
You know I am anti gun.
|3.20.09 @ 11:50AM|#
But deep in my heart, I always figured that if men were
truly in charge of things, fist-fights would be considered a
societally approved form of conflict resolution.
And in fact, they were. Back in my day, of you got in a fight and
both parties were willing, the school would hand out boxing gloves
and invite you to go at it.
Not to mention that when my brother and I would fight at home, my
father would drag us out to the backyard and make us fight until we
were both exhausted.
We rarely fought.
TofuSushi|3.20.09 @ 11:51AM|#
Tofu - South Oak Cliff is a predominantly African-American
neighborhood. Any "redneck" that went to that school wouldn't even
make it to the steel cage...or through the first day of school for
that matter.
Moron.
Minority abuse is no laughing matter. I hope Obama sends in Federal
troops and creates some programs for these people to get the help
they need.
|3.20.09 @ 11:57AM|#
Off-topic, anti-union sniping aside, school board member Garza's reply eerily channels the denial of police prefect Renault in "Casablanca" who is "shocked, shocked do you hear" to find that gambling is going on, just before his winnings are handed to him.
|3.20.09 @ 12:15PM|#
Back in my day, of you got in a fight and both parties were willing, the school would hand out boxing gloves and invite you to go at it. - R C Dean
Cool! Just like Flash Thompson and Peter Parker did in Amazing
Spider-Man #8!
`Course, many high schools and colleges used to have boxing as part
of their phys ed and sports programs. That's not so popular, if not
unheard of, nowadays.
I've got no problem with teens boxing voluntarily.
Kevin
Cool Cal|3.20.09 @ 12:24PM|#
You think that's bad ... the kids that refuse to fight are sent out into the desert atop a horse, blindfolded.
ev|3.20.09 @ 12:36PM|#
re: R C Dean,
Yeah my dad talks about the boxing glove solution to fights at his
school all the time. He's from abingdon, VA and went to elem.
school in the 50's.
I think it's a great idea, having (willing) kids the same
size/weight fight it out.
It's just like when stags/bison/every male animal fight to get to
the harem of chicks. Once a dude gets beaten, he knows his place
and the fight is over.
Women seem to use subtle subterfuge--fights don't resolve
themselves.
Mike Laursen|3.20.09 @ 1:22PM|#
I"m as big a school choice advocate as there is, but I don't see how this is an argument for school choice. It's an odd little story that could just as well have happened at a private school.
Warty|3.20.09 @ 1:24PM|#
You think that's bad ... the kids that refuse to fight are
sent out into the desert atop a horse, blindfolded.
And the horse has no name. It does feel good to get out of the
rain, though.
Abdul|3.20.09 @ 1:28PM|#
I"m as big a school choice advocate as there is, but I don't
see how this is an argument for school choice.
Duh, mike, you pick the school with the wussiest kids so that your
son dominates the cage and eventually acquires a harem of nubile
cheerleaders.
|3.20.09 @ 1:34PM|#
It's an odd little story that could just as well have
happened at a private school.
I really think something like this would be nigh-on impossible
outside of a a very large, poorly run educational system. In
principle, sure, a private school could foster the kind of culture
among its teachers and administrators that would allow this, but I
just don't see it happening in practice.
Abdul|3.20.09 @ 1:42PM|#
R C Dean,
My story of pre-teen Thunderdome happened at a not-for-profit
summer day camp.
Mike Laursen|3.20.09 @ 1:45PM|#
In principle, sure, a private school could foster the kind
of culture among its teachers and administrators that would allow
this, but I just don't see it happening in practice.
Perhaps. I can't readily cite any real-life cases or statistics.
I'll just note that sadism in parochial schools, boarding schools,
orphanage schools, summer camps, fraternities, etc. is a pretty
common theme in movies, TV shows, books, Kinks albums, etc.
Salvius|3.20.09 @ 1:50PM|#
Put the fights on Pay-Per-View, and the school would never have any budget problems again, either...
Robert Guest|3.20.09 @ 2:21PM|#
What's worse is if a child fails to dutifully attend DISD he/she
will be arrested for "truancy." (Funding is tied to attendance,
ergo we arrest kids to maximize DISD revenue). It's no defense that
your school is a "fight club" run by incompetent/sadistic/criminal
bureaucrats.
The Dallas truancy judge told one student to attend class or he
would "meet his boyfriend in county." DISD is a shining example of
the failures and tyranny of socialized education.
http://www.dallascriminaldefenselawyerblog.com/2009/02/dallas_truancy_judge_douglas_d.html
Abdul|3.20.09 @ 2:27PM|#
Did the top administrator of the day camp initiate the
proceedings?
He was the only one who didn't know about it because he had an air
conditioned office and the rest of the facility was not air
conditioned. To give him his due, he clamped down as soon as I told
him about it.
|3.20.09 @ 2:43PM|#
Why is this not a criminal issue rather than a civil one? It
is called child endangerment. If I had a teenage son and had him
and his buddies cage fight while my buddies and I bet on the
outcomes, I would be in jail for it. Why are the teachers and
counselors responsible for it in jail?
I think we've gotten to the point where we have so many laws that
we can't remember what the old ones are, so we have to make up new
ones any time something bad happens.
I.e.: We have to do something to restructure this company and pay
of it's creditors! Bankruptcy? What the fuck is that?
|3.20.09 @ 3:19PM|#
I can't readily cite any real-life cases or statistics. I'll
just note that sadism in parochial schools, boarding schools,
orphanage schools, summer camps, fraternities, etc. is a pretty
common theme in movies, TV shows, books, Kinks albums,
etc.
Thats all or mostly kid-on-kid stuff. Not what we are talking about
here.
|3.20.09 @ 6:14PM|#
Why should just the big time sports get publicly subsidized sports training? The UFC needs a junior league too.
Mike Laursen|3.20.09 @ 7:37PM|#
I think we've gotten to the point where we have so many laws
that we can't remember what the old ones are, so we have to make up
new ones any time something bad happens.
You're so right. A commenter on another blog told me that our
founding fathers couldn't have possibly foreseen how to deal with a
mess involving financial companies failing. Presumably these 18th
Century primitives had never heard of money, publicly-owned
companies, real estate, etc.
|3.20.09 @ 10:42PM|#
The first rule of the Dallas Public School System is, you do not
talk about the Dallas Public School System.
The second rule of the Dallas Public School System is: YOU DO NOT
FUCKING TALK ABOUT THE DALLAS PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM!!!!!
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