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Meanwhile, Joe the Plumber Is Heading off to Go Cover the Israel-Hamas War for Pajamas TV
No, really.
[Link via Wonkette]
underzog|1.7.09 @ 6:26PM|#
Joe the Plumber would do a better job than you guys.
Why don't you misnamed Reason clowns rent yourselves out to
Stormfront or Thunderbolt magazine and save the cyberspace
bandwidth duplication?
"There's no need to fear. Underzog is here!"
The Angry Optimist|1.7.09 @ 6:33PM|#
Northwest Ohio represent!
Maybe we can get Jamie Farr to represent the Ohizzle for the
Palestinian side?
underzog|1.7.09 @ 6:56PM|#
Speaking of offal type reporting, Matty works for the L.A.
Times, right?
I doubt Joe the Plumber could ever reach the depths of the sewer
that the L.A. Times does in its mid east reporting:
At L.A. Times, obscured targets Excerpts from the
link,
"In two recent articles, the Los Angeles Times' Ashraf Khalil has
consistently omitted key information about Gaza Strip sites
targeted by the Israeli army. His selective reporting gives the
false impression that Israel makes no effort to avoid harm to
civilians, and in fact targets them.
Rayan Home, Doubled as Weapons Cache
Thus, despite addressing the killing of top Hamas official Nizar
Rayan and at least 13 of his family members in two separate
articles, Khalil does not mention in either article that the Rayans
were given warning to evacuate immediately prior to the bombing or
that the home was used as a weapons depot....
(snip)
Yet, as reported by the United Nations' Office for the Coordination
of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA), a source hardly friendly to Israel,
the death of Rayan and his many family members was completely
avoidable. The January 2 report states:
The main feature of teh Israeli Air Force (IAF) attacks in the last
24 hours was the escalation in the targeting of residential houses
belonging to Hamas leaders and militants. Some 25 such houses were
attacked. Most of their residents received prior phone warnings by
the IDF, informing them about the intention to bomb the house and
advising their evacuation. In some cases the strike occurred only 5
minutes after the call. . .
Among the houses targeted yesterday was the house of Hamas leader
Nizar Rayan in Jabaliya Refugee Camp, who refused to evacuate upon
being warned of an imminent strike....
(snip)
Jabaliya Mosque
The Los Angeles Times' coverage of the Jan. 2 bombing of a mosque
in Jabaliya is again inferior to other major papers'. In the Jan. 3
article, Khalil and abu Alouf report:
Israeli jets Friday targeted a prominent mosque in the Jabaliya
refugee camp, along with several homes that the Israelis said
belonged to Hamas operatives.
Once again, the Los Angeles Times ignored information provided by
the Israeli army that the mosque was used as a storage
site....
(snip)
The New York Times, the Independent, and the Washington Post, among
others, included this information [that the mosque was used as a
storage site] in their reporting...." (end of exerpts)
The sheer snobbery of these neo Communists masquerading as free
enterprise types. Maybe if the L.A. times did some honest reporting
-- at least to the level of the other Liberal periodicals -- they
would not feel the need to smear honest people who are trying to
find out what is really going on, instead of cheerleading some of
the most vicious terrorists on earth!
"There's no need to fear. Underzog is here."
|1.7.09 @ 7:07PM|#
An unlicensed plumber named Joe
To cover the war he did go
No license had he
'cause there's no need to be
Licensed if your merely a journo
Let's gather some info by plumber
Dick Nixon tried it one summer
The H 'n' R blog has a joe
He's liberal, but say it ain't so
That a conservative plumber is dumber.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 7:25PM|#
Anyone want to watch me 69 with Lefiti?
"There's no need to fear. Underzog is here."
NP|1.7.09 @ 7:29PM|#
Wrong thread, but this was so scrumptious I couldn't pass up.
Check out the question for Lou Dobbs' latest poll:
"If the Vatican seriously objects to the U.S. border fence, should
the Catholic church tear down the wall surrounding the
Vatican?"
I dunno how to respond to such LOL-worthy demagogy. What a
nutjob.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 7:30PM|#
My my my.... Someone just stole my name. Trying to pair me with
some Lefiti?
I expect dirty tricks from you guys so I just take your imitating
smears in stride.
|1.7.09 @ 7:36PM|#
Matt used to work at the LA times, not anymore.
Journalists report facts. If a journalist doesn't repoort the facts
he is not a good journalist.
That is it.
Joe the plumber reports the facts he is better then all the other
journalists who don't.
You don't need a journalism degree. That is utter horseshit.
|1.7.09 @ 7:38PM|#
Underzog-
Quick! What nation has violated more U.N. resolutions than the rest
of the world combined?
underzog|1.7.09 @ 7:38PM|#
I thought Matt was just hired there. Did he leave of his own
accord? Did they fire him for non Liberal reporting?
Inquiring minds want to know.
|1.7.09 @ 7:39PM|#
Matt,
It is actually "Yes, really" the response. Not, "No, really."
Think about it.
|1.7.09 @ 7:46PM|#
Shouldn't reporters begin every piece concerning Gaza with
reminding their readers, listeners and viewers that "Israel, of
course, is a nation that was birthed by terrorism as witnessed by
the King David Hotel Massacre where doazens of women and children
were brutally murdered by a terrorist gang headed by former Israeli
Prime Minister Meachem Begin."
In the interest of being fair and balanced.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 7:49PM|#
LMike,
Those Jewhaters?
The UN be damned. World opinion be damned too, pal.
I would hope at some point Israel and the United States would leave
the U.N. and the U.S. move the U.N. to Ridyah or Geneva.
|1.7.09 @ 7:54PM|#
Terry-
No, think about it. Matt is right. Language is fluid. Part of that
fluidity is the development of idioms. Hence, the use of "No,
really" would be understood by most amercian listeners to mean
"yes".
underzog|1.7.09 @ 8:00PM|#
LMike,
This "I'm with ya on evicting the U.N. from Hy...er, New York."
reminds me of something Jesse Jackson, Sr. said.
He said it at the time I was in "Jews against Jackson."
It sure brings back memories.
I am Israel\'s Average Joe\'s |1.7.09 @ 8:01PM|#
he wants to let Israel's "'Average Joes' share their story."
|1.7.09 @ 8:07PM|#
Underzog-
No, really. I abhor the U.N. and its philosophical underpinnings. I
cite the violations of its resolutions to underscore the fact that
I am not alone in observing that Israel is a pariah state with a
propensity to committ mass murder.
Earlier today, on another thread, I cited Uncle Joe to support the
proposition that democracy is a fraud. It doesn't mean that I would
have loved to have had the opportunity to sniff Stalin's
scrotum.
nobody u no and a big fan of j|1.7.09 @ 8:19PM|#
is the joe of reason the plumber joe guy.
totally wow.
no wonder so many were mocking him in the other threads.
not sure if i can still support him after he made obama look bad
during that meeting on the street.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 8:20PM|#
LMike,
A pariah state?
Big f'kn deal. The tannakh says of us Jews that we're "a people who
dwell alone and are not to be reckoned with other nations."
The primal screaming against the Jewish State and the Jews today (
Hamas
kristallnacht USA 2008: another synagogue attacked ) is
something that we have to deal with. And it can't be dealt with by
appeasement and joining our enemies in supporting Israel's
destruction.
As Rabbi Meir Kahane, Zt"l said, "It is better to have an Israel
that is hated than an Auschwitz that is loved."
That certainly makes sense to me.
nobody u no and a big fan of j|1.7.09 @ 8:28PM|#
underzog, dude, you need to mellow and so do the children picking on you man.
|1.7.09 @ 8:30PM|#
The UN school in Gaza get blown up. Doesn't that remind you a same incident happened in Lebanon during the Hezbolah war, when the IDF I bet purposely hit a UN observation post and killed few of their officers. I don't believe too much in coincidence, I bet the one in Gaza was deliberatly hit. As they also told reporters to stay out of Gaza. I guess the IDF don't like too many observers, and want the UN out of Gaza. That would make the international force very hesitant to move in the area.
|1.7.09 @ 8:32PM|#
Thoreau-
Why are we so quick to warholize the average joe? And with such
emphasis? We don't seem to apply the same standard to celebrities,
be they ball players, movie stars, talk show hosts or
politicians.
Please do not take offense at my queries. My post is not intended
to be a swipe at you. I must confess I have used the 15 minute
thing before-though I do not like it. Its just something that I
have pondered, our culture's double standard with this issue. If we
are so sick of Joe the Plumber, the Run-away-Bride, Lorena Bobbit,
Drew Peterson, etc., then what is wrong with us if we have not died
a thousand deaths already with the likes of Liz Taylor, Britney
Spears, Brett Favre, Manny being Manny, Jen and Ben, Bennifer, Jen
and Brad, GWB, Chucky Schumer, Teddy Kenedy, Jesse Jackson, Obama,
the "war hero" McCain, etc.?
|1.7.09 @ 8:35PM|#
nobody u no-
Joe has been critical of Israel's actions. I don't have to remind
you of MNG's posts over the weekend, do I? Just thought I should
tell ya.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 8:43PM|#
Hamas should not commit warcrimes by firing from schools so they
can get people killed on their front.
Hamas are war criminals for firing on Israeli civilians in Sderot;
etc., and also for rigging the school so there would be multiple
explosions Did the
United Nations set up civilians to be killed to discredit
Israel? (excerpt from the link)
It is now a proven fact that Hamas terrorists were using a United
Nations (UNRWA) school in the Gaza Strip as a position from which
to shell Israel. When the Israeli Defense Forces returned the
terrorists' fire, a shell struck the terrorists' booby traps and
the resulting secondary explosions killed thirty or more civilians
who had taken refuge at what they believed to be a noncombatant or
neutral building.
Naga Sadow|1.7.09 @ 8:52PM|#
Underdogz, you fool!!! Hamas followers are heroes! Saviors of the faithful! Defenders of a humbled people! Donate now!
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 8:53PM|#
The tannakh says of us Jews that we're "a people who dwell
alone and are not to be reckoned with other nations."
It also says that rabbits chew cud and you can sell your daughter
into slavery. Appeals to dead texts are the most boring of
all.
Oh, and point of reality: the Tanakh *says* nothing. It is
inanimate, words on a scroll. You *read* from it and inject
yourself, your fears and hopes, prejudices and appetites, into that
reading. Such is unavoidable, whether or not the words themselves
are inspired by God.
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 8:59PM|#
Rabbits don't have a split hoof.
Brilliant non sequitor. I wasn't arguing as to the Kashrut
categories, I was arguing as to the text's *obvious and stupid
observation fail*. One might think if God built the fuckers, he'd
know how their parts work.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 9:10PM|#
It has always bothered, seeing atheists as cheerleaders and
defenders of Islam.
Atheists are supposed to be for reason and logic and they defend
and do political analingus to an illogical death cult?
Outrageous!
Judaism has Maimomodies (sp) who admired Aristotle and was a pretty
good physician for his time. Christianity has Albert Magnamus and
St. Thomas Acquinas (St. Thomas brought Aristotleanism to Europe),
but Islam's greatest philosopher Averros left no school and was and
is shunned by the majority of Muslims.
What the f... are non believers doing being cheerleaders for some
deathcult and their little rock God, Allah (Jallah)?
I never expected atheists to act like this and I admit I an
extremely dissapointed.
One doesn't need idiots to attack other religions only to support
Islam or anti-Semitic hatred against the Jews!
|1.7.09 @ 9:13PM|#
underzog-
Seriously, I just don't trust anybody or anything that is in the
public sector or anybody or anything that depends upon or otherwise
is subsidized by the gvt. Particularly if the somebody is in the
warfare part of the public sector of a nation state that is
subsidized by Elemenope's, Joe's and MNG's hard earned money,
forcibly taken from them, in order for that somebody to do some
ethnic cleansing.
|1.7.09 @ 9:18PM|#
Underzog-
You are assuming facts not in evidence to the extent your 9:10 post
was directed at me. First, I'm the guy that told Ron Bailey that
when I see a Big Bang, I'll be a believer. Second, the world would
be infiniely better without Mecca, Medina and Mohammed.
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 9:38PM|#
Judaism has Maimomodies (sp) who admired Aristotle and was a
pretty good physician for his time. Christianity has Albert
Magnamus and St. Thomas Acquinas (St. Thomas brought Aristotleanism
to Europe), but Islam's greatest philosopher Averros left no school
and was and is shunned by the majority of Muslims.
While Moses ben Maimon was arguably the most important *to* Judaism
(and his impact outside of Judaism was remarkably contained to
theology via negativa), most philosophers consider Spinoza
to be the greatest Jewish philosopher.
And, oddly enough, the Jewish community reacted to Spinoza pretty
much the same way the Muslim community reacted to Averroes.
Guy Montag|1.7.09 @ 9:42PM|#
IDF chicks are hot!
Libertymike, so can you trust what I say because I work for a
Defense Contractor rather than directly for the feds? Or am I
completly untrustworthy?
Guy Montag|1.7.09 @ 9:53PM|#
Little recognized fact: Tel Aviv is but a swallows flight from Gaza. Yes, bith African and European.
The Wine Commonsewer|1.7.09 @ 9:56PM|#
Maybe if the Europeans gave the Jews back all the property they
stole, the Jews could move back to Europe and leave Israel to the
Palestinians.
Oh wait, Jews don't have the Right of Return. Sorry.
The Wine Commonsewer|1.7.09 @ 9:59PM|#
IDF chicks are hot!
Doubtless!
Should I post that Rachel Papo
link again?
|1.7.09 @ 9:59PM|#
Two points:
IDF chicks= hot indeed.
I am curious to read some Joe the Plumber stuff, it will probably
not be any good. But really can it be any worse?
underzog|1.7.09 @ 10:05PM|#
Highly doubtful that the Jewish community rejected
Aristotleanism as the Muslims did.
It's not an accident that the the Jews with their tiny population
have so many nobel prizes in math and science while the Muslims
with their enormous population have so little.
There's a saying (I'm not quite sure of the words) that while the
Muslims are working on their umpteenth homicide bombing, the Jews
are working on their umpteenth Nobel Prize
Guy Montag|1.7.09 @ 10:07PM|#
But, was it unladen?
Close enough for even a laden swallow. Where do you think Hamas got
the coconuts?
Guy Montag|1.7.09 @ 10:08PM|#
underzog,
Watch out! The leftoids will label you 'eurocentric' for that Nobel
Prize bit.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 10:09PM|#
Hugo's URL hyperlinked. Demonstrators chant that Jews should go to the ovens. "You need a big oven."
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 10:19PM|#
Highly doubtful that the Jewish community rejected
Aristotleanism as the Muslims did.
Spinoza was not an Aristotelian. But while we are on the subject,
during the Rambam's lifetime, his work was extremely controversial
amongst his fellow rabbis, who were not at all thrilled by his
importation of Greek and Arabic principles into Jewish
thought.
BTW, if you are going to make cracks about Jewish intellectual
superiority, it might be wise to read more carefully and attempt to
comprehend what is being asserted.
underzog|1.7.09 @ 10:36PM|#
Elemenope:
"BTW, if you are going to make cracks about Jewish intellectual
superiority, it might be wise to read more carefully and attempt to
comprehend what is being asserted."
I don't get what you're saying, Elemenope.
Do you think homicide bombing is a good thing? Is it on par with
Nobel Prizes in math and science?
I have to keep away from athiests now with their newfound love of
Islam. The support of this murderous primitivism and bloodlust is
so disgusting coming from people one expects to uphold reason and
logic.
Maybe Debbie Schlussel was right when she said she wasn't suprised
that so many atheists support the barbaric deathcult of
Islam.
"Those two people [Adam Gahan and John Walker Lindh] are enemies of
America, and many of those who think like them are of equally weak
mind. If you don't believe in anything, you'll easily fall for
virtual nothings."
Debbie Schlussel
underzog|1.7.09 @ 10:40PM|#
I don't know, Guy....
Since someone on Hit & Run hijacked/imitated my nickname to
claim I want sexual situations with someone whose name I never saw
before this Joe the Plumber folder, I better skedaddle before some
nasty Hit and Runner goes further and hacks my computer.
Shalom everybody!
Guy Montag|1.7.09 @ 10:46PM|#
Wow, that is funny/creepy. I am listening to the first episode of Off the Hook in ages as you contemplate your computer being hacked!
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 11:00PM|#
Do you think homicide bombing is a good thing? Is it on par
with Nobel Prizes in math and science?
Your analogy is patent idiocy. The vast majority of Muslims do not
engage in acts of violence towards *anyone*. The reason why there
aren't many Nobel prizes coming out of Muslim countries is that
they tend to be in poverty, and so are lacking education,
facilities, and other infrastructure.
Adam|1.7.09 @ 11:19PM|#
"Homicide bombing" is an idiotic redundancy. The bombs dropped
on London during the blitz were "homicide bombs." Car bombs are
homicide bombs (assuming they kill anyone). For some strange
reason, some people seem to think that "suicide bombing" is a
nicey-nice politically correct term that's just a euphemism for
something terrible. I have never quite understood why that is.
Suicide bombing seems to nicely capture the concept of an
individual committing a bombing that takes his or her own life. And
suicide bombings are called such regardless of whether they
actually kill anyone else.
Anyway, it's nice to see that Hit & Run believes in freedom of
speech, even to the point that it doesn't censor loathsome racist
drivel like some of what is posted above. Everyone's entitled to
his or her (bigoted) opinion.
There's nothing wrong with quoting disgusting people (like Stalin,
mentioned above). But when you do it in a way that suggests that
you think they're great, there's something horribly wrong with you.
Meir Kahane was a despicable blot on the human race. Kind of like a
demented, racist version of Stalin, actually (I won't invoke the
obvious Germanic name, lest I infringe on Godwin's law).
I think there really are some people out there who think that every
single Arab (or indeed, Muslim) on Earth owes everybody else an
apology for having had to temerity to have been born. Although I
suppose if you think such people are "lice" (to quote the late
Israeli minister of tourism), then I suppose such a belief comes
quite naturally.
Rick H.|1.7.09 @ 11:20PM|#
Thread so far: 44 percent pro-Israel-status quo rantings by one
troll.
Jesus Christ, at least the Ultimate Anonymity creep keeps it down
to a handful of five-word posts. This one throws out assfuls of
secondhand, unsupported spatter like "...so many atheists support
the barbaric deathcult of Islam."
Also, anyone who posts on HnR with a self-promoting sig line needs
to take a long vacation in Gaza.
Elemenope|1.7.09 @ 11:28PM|#
Also, anyone who posts on HnR with a self-promoting sig line
needs to take a long vacation in Gaza.
"Without me, the alphabet has no soul!"
;)
|1.7.09 @ 11:57PM|#
Why not? If he's able to milk his fifteen minutes of fame into a job opportunity, then God bless him. That, after all, is America.
Elemenope|1.8.09 @ 12:10AM|#
Why not? If he's able to milk his fifteen minutes of fame
into a job opportunity, then God bless him. That, after all, is
America.
At first I was confused as to whom you were referring, as I was
distracted by the thread-consuming rants of Underzog. But then I
realized, well fuck! He's talking about the article! ;)
And yeah, if someone wants his opinions and/or latent reporting
skillz badly enough to pay him, more power to him.
|1.8.09 @ 12:13AM|#
I got it. Who would you pick for Senator:
Joe the plumber or Caroline Kennedy.
Didn't Caroline do some interviews? I know both John F Kennedy and
Jackie O were both newspaper reporters and John John founded George
magazine.
Who is the better reporter: Joe the plumber or Caroline?
Actually they would make a great interview team.
the possibilities.
Not a contributer to the site |1.8.09 @ 12:21AM|#
And yeah, if someone wants his opinions and/or latent
reporting skillz badly enough to pay him, more power to
him.
Heck, it worked for Megan McArdle.
I spel gud really|1.8.09 @ 12:25AM|#
"contributor"
(though Yglesias proved you don't need accuracy in your English to
write for the Atlantic)
|1.8.09 @ 1:29AM|#
Maybe I am stoned, but does anyone else find the irony in the
fact that an alleged Jew is heralding the superiority of the Jewish
people above all others?
A master race if you will......
While this may only be anecdotal evidence, but 12 days of reading
discussion forums like H&R, Fark, Digg, Slashdot etc, there
seems to be quite a bit of this Jewish Pride type trolling, well at
least I hope its trolling.
Would be a shame that even after 5-6 million or so Jews slaughtered
in the name of a Master Race that only a few generations later, the
same sick cancer would begin to spread among the Jewish
youth.
Avi Shlaim has a very interesting piece in the Guardian:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jan/07/gaza-israel-palestine
alan|1.8.09 @ 1:48AM|#
Ghaad, I've successfully avoided the Israelis-Palestinian
threads until now, as I assumed this one would be humorously
inclined given the subject of J the P, but damn, this primitivist
tribal shit spouted by the underzogs of the world always makes me
feel a little bit more bitter about the human race.
As every day of turmoil passes, and every year of violence that
sustains the existence of the state of Israel is marked, you know
who starts looking much better through the dim eye of history? The
Romans.
Elemenope|1.8.09 @ 1:51AM|#
As every day of turmoil passes, and every year of violence
that sustains the existence of the state of Israel is marked, you
know who starts looking much better through the dim eye of history?
The Romans.
Yuck. When the Romans start looking good, it's time to face the
fact that you have an alcohol problem. ;)
alan|1.8.09 @ 1:59AM|#
Yuck. When the Romans start looking good, it's time to face
the fact that you have an alcohol problem. ;)
LOL! Hey, does Sophia Loren count? I have no idea what part of
Italy she is from though?
alan|1.8.09 @ 2:05AM|#
then again, even if she is Roman, if the first star I can think of career began fifty years ago is from that region, maybe they don't look so good.
Elemenope|1.8.09 @ 2:15AM|#
Hey, does Sophia Loren count? I have no idea what part of
Italy she is from though?
Yes, and, believe it or not, Rome.
alan|1.8.09 @ 2:23AM|#
for some reason I almost assumed it.
I can vouch for the beauty of Milanese women. I had a study partner
in college from there. Interestingly, her dad was the cities
communist party boss at that very time they dropped communism from
their name. She gave me some of the new stickers her dad sent her
with the new party name, quite spiffy looking.
crimpy|1.8.09 @ 2:44AM|#
Maybe I am stoned, but does anyone else find the irony in
the fact that an alleged Jew is heralding the superiority of the
Jewish people above all others?
Maybe you're stoned but certainly you're an idiot. We're not
supposed to notice differences in achievement between different
groups because to do so promotes a "master race" theory which leads
to Auschwitz? Pure idiocy.
crapula|1.8.09 @ 2:45AM|#
Next: Joe the Plumber is appointed imperial governor of Iraq and Afghanistan.
Elemenope|1.8.09 @ 3:02AM|#
We're not supposed to notice differences in achievement
between different groups because to do so promotes a "master race"
theory which leads to Auschwitz?
No. What you're not supposed to do is come up with cockamamie
post hoc "explanations" for why one group outperforms
another, as Underzog did to which kanabiis was responding.
Empirically, it is simply far more likely that prevailing economic
conditions in the relevant parts of the world better account for
differences in achievement than some half-baked notion of racial
superiority. kanabiis noted the *crushing irony* of certain people
coming to embrace the same *type* of ideology that led to that
group's near-extinction.
And, yes, once an ideology of natural superiority takes hold, it
leads to nowhere pretty. You don't have to open ovens to be a
complete dick, you know.
Right Wing Realist|1.8.09 @ 3:41AM|#
Joe the Plumber is more qualified to be President than Barack Obama. At least Joe has built an actual, honest, profitable business while Barack has been sucking at the state's teat.
Right Wing Realist|1.8.09 @ 3:44AM|#
No. What you're not supposed to do is come up with cockamamie post hoc "explanations" for why one group outperforms another, as Underzog did to which kanabiis was responding. Empirically, it is simply far more likely that prevailing economic conditions in the relevant parts of the world better account for differences in achievement than some half-baked notion of racial superiority.
Disease succeptability, body type, and other things can be
correlated to race. But IQ? NO NO NO NO LALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU
WITH THIS WESTERN LIBERAL SECULARISM FIRMLY OVER MY EARS!!!!
Right Wing Realist|1.8.09 @ 3:45AM|#
I need to quit my job and go work in a DC agency so I can keep even posting with all you guys.
Right Wing Realist|1.8.09 @ 3:46AM|#
Maybe I am stoned, but does anyone else find the irony in the fact that an alleged Jew is heralding the superiority of the Jewish people above all others?
Whether it be culture or genetics, they are clearly doing something
right.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 4:53AM|#
I think the over achievement of Jews can be explained by the ban on Jewish farmers. Outside the US, before the Enlightenmen, most nations banned Jews from owning land or working on farms. Since farming took up arround 95% of the labor supply, that meant Jews were 20 times over represented in the non-farm sector. There they developed non-farm skills that they passed on from generation to generation, because for most of history, people ended up with the same careers as their parents. When the agricultural revolution automated farming and made non-farming skills more valuable, Jews were already trained in those fields. Southern US Jews also benefited from being in non-farm careers. When the Civil War loss collapsed the farm economy, they still had a livelihood. It just goes to show, developing marketable skills is a much better strategy than fighting over natural resources.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 5:03AM|#
While Jewish over achievement is real, I think a sampling bias tends to exaggerate it. Einstine and Sandler make the news. My brother, the starving artist, doesn't. Someone who never met a Jew in person might think they are all in Hollywood, when in reality El Paso and New Orleans have Jewish congregations as well. If I only knew Catholics from the news, I would think the Kennedies were a representative family.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 5:12AM|#
kanabiis | January 8, 2009, 1:29am | #
Maybe I am stoned, but does anyone else find the irony in the fact that an alleged Jew is heralding the superiority of the Jewish people above all others?
I hope you bought that pot from a medical marijuana dispensary.
Support the cause:
Buy only legal
pot
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 5:27AM|#
The Wine Commonsewer | January 7, 2009, 9:56pm | #
Maybe if the Europeans gave the Jews back all the property they stole, the Jews could move back to Europe and leave Israel to the Palestinians.
Oh wait, Jews don't have the Right of Return. Sorry.
Half of Israelis are Sephardic, so the Arabs would also have to
return the land and property stolen from those Sephardim. Arab
states would then have to grant religious freedom and equality to
all their citizens so Sephardim could live there with their full
rights.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 5:47AM|#
I think underdog's comment on noble prizes highlighted a difference in values. There was nothing racist about it. Jews could have reacted to the farming ban by burning down European villiages. Instead, they foccused on their own survival and on making the world better. They're more likely to move and rebuild than to resort to violence. During the Spanish Inquisition, the US and the Ottoman Empire welcomed Jewish refuges, and Jews moved there. German Jews moved to the US in the 19th century to escape turmoil and economic discrimination. Russian Jews moved to the US and Israel in the late 19th century/early 20th century to escape the pograms. Sephardic Jews moved to Israel in the 1940's and 1950's from Arab lands to escape persecution. Jews would much rather build up the societies that accept them than to tear down societies that dislike them.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 5:57AM|#
Underzog,
There are different camps among Atheists, just like there are
different camps among Muslims. Objectivists tend to stand up to
Muslim dictators, while Communists tend to appease them. The
peaceful Muslims of Albania and Kosovo are a sharp contrast to
Hamas. Albania was a refuge to Jews during the Holocaust, and the
Albanian Jewish community was the only community in Europe that
grew during WWII. The new Muslim country of Kosovo respects all
religions and is pro-America and pro-Israel.
Guy Montag|1.8.09 @ 6:37AM|#
Matt,
Matt, Matt, Matt, who is Reason sending to Gaza to report the other
side?
Yeshiva Bocher|1.8.09 @ 7:26AM|#
Not to mention that we're bred for our brains: It's an honor for a Yiddishe Maidel/Mamma to support my studies her whole life and bear more like me and her! So what's not to like?
Elemenope|1.8.09 @ 8:12AM|#
Sephardic Jews moved to Israel in the 1940's and 1950's from
Arab lands to escape persecution. Jews would much rather build up
the societies that accept them than to tear down societies that
dislike them.
These two sentences, juxtaposed, yield a startling
contradiction.
Disease succeptability, body type, and other things can be
correlated to race. But IQ? NO NO NO NO LALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU
WITH THIS WESTERN LIBERAL SECULARISM FIRMLY OVER MY
EARS!!!!
Moving past the part where that was childish, you are shifting the
entirety of the argument to suit your snark. Neither of us said
anything about IQ. The argument was about the (IMO false) dichotomy
between "murderers" (who Underzog correlated with Muslims) and
"Nobel Prize winners" (who Underzog correlated with Jews). Beyond
the fact that the dichotomy is absurd on its face, one can
reasonably react to the fact that it was set up along strictly
racial/cultural lines.
Also, as a supposed "realist", you should be whining a great deal
about the *disproportionality* of the Israeli response in
Gaza.
If you were a realist.
|1.8.09 @ 9:23AM|#
1300s underzog:
It is apparent that Europeans are an inferior race capable only of violence, invasion and tearing down societies more technologically and socially advanced than their own. It is obvious that Muslims and Arabs are the superior race and culture.
|1.8.09 @ 9:29AM|#
Joe the Plumber's real name is Samuel Wurzelbacher.
Ya know WHO ELSE had guys named Wurzelbacher on his payroll?
Adolph Hitler.
Makes ya think...
|1.8.09 @ 9:32AM|#
Why not? If he's able to milk his fifteen minutes of fame
into a job opportunity, then God bless him.
His fifteen minutes, after all, is entirely the creation of
frothing Obamanauts trying to tear him down. If they hadn't broken
the law and tried to smear him, he would be a footnote to a
footnote. Instead, they gave him a nice high media profile. Exactly
like what happens when the hated fundies rant against a
movie.
I say go for it. He's as qualified as most journalists. If he
doesn't have a knack for it, then nothing will come of it.
|1.8.09 @ 10:25AM|#
RC,
His 15 minutes was due to McCain mentioning him about 200 times in
a single debate. It was only after that, when the media started
asking his opinion, did people try to tear him down. I wish they
had succeeded.
|1.8.09 @ 10:51AM|#
I think the over achievement of Jews can be explained by the
ban on Jewish farmers.
I think there's something to this. However, there's a reason why
European Jews were able to succeed in the effort to establish
themselves so strongly in the merchant and professional economies:
because Judaism, even in the ancient world, made literacy a
religious obligation.
|1.8.09 @ 10:53AM|#
His fifteen minutes, after all, is entirely the creation of
frothing Obamanauts trying to tear him down.
Right, remember when they made John McCain mention him 27 times in
a nationally televised debate and take him on the road as a
spokes-mascot?>
Mean, mean Obamanauts! All the guy wanted to do was live a private
life, away from celebrity and politics.
|1.8.09 @ 12:18PM|#
Check your timelines, folks. Joe asked his question of Obama,
and within a day Obamanauts in state government were breaking the
law to look at his records, and hit pieces were breaking out all
over the blogosphere, setting up the chain reaction.
Sure, McCain used him. Would he have mentioned him so much if there
wasn't already a big media foofaraw? Dunno. But I do know the
attack dogs were loosed immediately, before McCain wrote him into
his spiel.
|1.8.09 @ 12:33PM|#
Check your timelines, folks. Joe asked his question of
Obama...and then he became a hero on right-wing blogs, and then the
McCain campaign itself picked up on him.
Would he have mentioned him so much if there wasn't already a big
media foofaraw? Of course not. That's why they created
one.
Wait, what?|1.8.09 @ 1:22PM|#
During the Spanish Inquisition, the US and
the Ottoman Empire welcomed Jewish refuges
The Spanish Inquisition didn't expect the United States.
LurkerBold|1.8.09 @ 1:30PM|#
joe is right. It was the Republican War Machine that blew the
Plumber up into a media frenzy. They were probably assisted by
their wealthy allies in mainstream media.
Check your timelines and country club connections.
|1.8.09 @ 4:07PM|#
Empirically, it is simply far more likely that prevailing
economic conditions in the relevant parts of the world better
account for differences in achievement than some half-baked notion
of racial superiority.
No. Empirically, it is far more likely that the prevailing economic
conditions in the relevant parts of the world are correlated to the
abilities and mindset of the inhabitants of those parts of the
world.
|1.8.09 @ 5:39PM|#
Is it wrong of me to not care a bit about Israel and Palestine
and the whole fucking mess any longer?
Judaism, even in the ancient world, made literacy a religious
obligation.
Bingo
2 points for the hack named joe for getting something right.
|1.8.09 @ 5:56PM|#
Realist, do you even think about what you type before you type
it, or is your general understanding of the history of human
civilization so lacking that you actually believe what you
typed.
Large civilizations have been built by every culture and every race
of humans. While the Muslims may not be the beacon of civilization
in 2009, at one time in history the region of the world now
occupied by Iran/Iraq/Eqypt etc. was the cradle of economic,
scientific and social civilization while Europe wallowed in what we
now call the Dark Ages. But I guess those dumb Europeans at the
time were just not as smart as those Muslims in Jerusalem.
You laud the nobel prizes awarded to Jewish people, and completely
disregard the fact that Islamic mathematicians gave us algebra,
calculus, geometry, advanced breakthroughs in astronomy the very
foundations of modern science. Are you going to argue that these
contributions are somehow insignificant?
I suppose you are going to argue that North Korea is not an
economic powerhouse in the world because the North Korean people
are just stupid, it has nothing to do with the social and political
circumstances. Certainly if those North Koreans were just a little
smarter, they would be able to compete.. too bad they are too dumb
right??
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 8:24PM|#
kanabiis,
The contributions Muslims made to mathematics and the sciences
centuries ago are amazing. They prove that Islam is compatible with
rational thought and advancement. However, most of today's Muslim
majority countries are not living up to that heritage. It's a
matter of priorities, not IQ. The Muslim empires that made those
historic advances focused more on development than on conquest.
Groups like Hamas focus so much energy on trying to destroy Israel,
they don't take care of building their country. Hamas is still
fueling dozens of rocket launches into Israel each day, even though
doing so means diverting fuel from hospital electricity generators
and causing energy shortages there. That is Hama's priorities, and
until it changes, I won't expect any new discoveries from Gaza.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 8:29PM|#
Wait, what? | January 8, 2009, 1:22pm | #
During the Spanish Inquisition, the US and the Ottoman Empire welcomed Jewish refuges
The Spanish Inquisition didn't expect the United States.
LOL
Funny story, when New Orleans was still in Spanish hands, the
Inquisition sent a priest there to spread the persecution. The
party loving New Orleanians mellowed him out so much he never
started the process.
jtuf|1.8.09 @ 8:59PM|#
It's worth noting that the current leaders in technology among Muslim majority countries are Malaysia (home of the Petronas Towers) and United Arab Emirates (home of Dubai). Both have taken a more tolerant approach towards non-Muslims. When they live and let live, Muslims achive technological wonders.
steve the home improver|11.5.09 @ 6:06AM|#
Meanwhile, Joe the Plumber Is Heading off to Go Cover the Israel-Hamas War for Pajamas TV
Thanks for sharing
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