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Gov. Sarah Palin on Scitech Issues
Just a quick round up of what I could find about Gov. Sarah Palin's take on various scitech issues.
On teaching evolutionary biology in schools:
"Teach both. You know, don't be afraid of information....Healthy debate is so important and it's so valuable in our schools. I am a proponent of teaching both. And you know, I say this too as the daughter of a science teacher. Growing up with being so privileged and blessed to be given a lot of information on, on both sides of the subject -- creationism and evolution. It's been a healthy foundation for me. But don't be afraid of information and let kids debate both sides."
Q. What is your take on global warming and how is it affecting our country?
A. A changing environment will affect Alaska more than any other state, because of our location. I'm not one though who would attribute it to being man-made.
On endangered species (polar bears):
I am disappointed with U.S. Interior Secretary Dirk Kempthorne's decision to list polar bears as threatened under the Endangered Species Act. Measures are already in place to protect the polar bear.
On abortion (and perhaps by extension human embryonic stem cell research):
I'm pro-life. I'll do all I can to see every baby is created with a future and potential. The legislature should do all it can to protect human life.
On energy policy:
Favors opening up the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge for oil and gas production. "I beg to disagree with any candidate who would say we can’t drill our way out of our problem or that more supply won’t ultimately affect prices. Of course it will affect prices."
On access to health care:
Against the Certificate of Need (CON) program which is a regulatory process that requires certain health care providers to obtain state approval before offering certain new or expanded services. "As I said recently in my State of the State Address to the Legislature, 'Under our present Certificate of Need process, costs and needs don't drive health-care choices -- bureaucracy does. Our system is broken and expensive.' Eliminating the CON program, with certain exceptions, will allow free-market competition and reduce onerous government regulation."
More later.
Brian|8.29.08 @ 4:11PM|#
Another great reason to pick Palin?
There's a built-in Politics & Prog tie-in. Ladies and gents,
Genesis:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_VkwSp4dXg
(sorry, no actual concert footage AFAIK)
|8.29.08 @ 4:11PM|#
"Teach both...But don't be afraid of information and let kids
debate both sides."
Are there really only two sides, fundamentalist Christian v.
atheistic evolution believer? No word from catholics, jews,
episcopalians, hindus, muslims, agnostics, wiccans or others on the
origin of life?
Kolohe|8.29.08 @ 4:15PM|#
Global warming would be almost an unalloyed boon to Alaska,
unless it changes the rainfall patterns on south east coast enough
to be more like central and southern california.
But the rest of the state would see a lot more precipitation.
Franklin Harris|8.29.08 @ 4:20PM|#
Unlike McCain, Obama, and Biden, Palin actually seems to have more pros than cons.
|8.29.08 @ 4:27PM|#
David: The two sides are magic and science. She's just speaking from the point of view of a believer in the most popular form of magic in the USA.
|8.29.08 @ 4:34PM|#
As the 800th flamewar today on the subject of Governor Palin starts, did anyone hear about some big speech that was given last night? I don't think I have ever seen the air sucked from one side to the other so quickly in my life. Only time will tell if she is a good pick or not, but it certainly got McCain windward of Obama.
|8.29.08 @ 4:36PM|#
you can forget seals delivering their pups on ice flows anymore.
The California Grey whales would likely appreciate it. The polar
bears will be seriously decimated if not eradicated, unless they
change their evil ways.
I have a Reuters article I cut out of a Malaysian newspaper which
sited the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment report (created by the
US and 7 other arctic nations), which says in summary "global
warming in the next 100 years will raise the ocean level 90 cm and
destroy lots of natural habitat, but hey!, we'll have so much
better access to Arctic Oil! If that isn't polishing the turd, I
don't know what is.
ed|8.29.08 @ 4:39PM|#
She running for vice president for Christ's sake. The last time a president died in office from natural causes was 1945. And if President McCain gets his head blown off in Dallas, would that be such a bad thing? The concept of citizen legislators may just be getting a second chance here, and Palin's "inexperience" might not be such a bad thing, at least from a libertarian perspective.
|8.29.08 @ 4:42PM|#
Doesn't the bible equate life with blood? If so, no blood, no
life and life would not begin at conception by there own
standard.
My problem with the many pro-life politicians is they act like God
should be the one to decide the end of life, yet they have little
problem with governments trumping god on the issue when it's a form
of punishment. If it's ok for government to trump god, why not the
citizenry?
|8.29.08 @ 4:44PM|#
One point on the biology question. That is a quote from a debate before the election. She never pushed the idea once in office. That says to me that that is boob bait. Not that giving boob bait is admirable, but if she really were some kind of inteligent design crazy, why didn't she do something to that effect as governor?
|8.29.08 @ 4:47PM|#
The only reason to teach creationist theory* is to debunk it.
Like the geocentric universe.
*I know it isn't one. I'm being charitable today.
|8.29.08 @ 4:48PM|#
Ed, when was the last time a 72 year old was elected as
president?
""and Palin's "inexperience" might not be such a bad thing, at
least from a libertarian perspective."""
Right. We want an outsider that doesn't play politics as usual, yet
we want them to have experience with politics as usual. I'm not
suprised, both teams pick their prez candidate from the body of
government with the lowest approval rating of all time. Neither has
executive experience, but they do know how to rub elbows with
lobbyist.
Zeb|8.29.08 @ 4:50PM|#
Global warming would be almost an unalloyed boon to
Alaska
I dont' know. Most of the state would be one big mosquito filled
swamp without permafrost.
the innominate one|8.29.08 @ 4:55PM|#
"The only reason to teach creationist theory is to debunk it.
Like the geocentric universe."
agreed, but the Biblical literalists would kick up a shitstorm like
you've never seen.
Jesus is just all right with me, but to take Genesis 1-2 literally
and at face value is foolish.
Elemenope|8.29.08 @ 4:59PM|#
I don't see how "Abortion" is a scitech issue so much as a moral
issue. And health care access is really a fiscal/economic
issue.
On the rest she, unfortunately, sounds a lot stupider than her
Wikipedia article indicated. Though, to be fair, no stupider than
her running-mate.
How unfortunate.
Elemenope|8.29.08 @ 5:00PM|#
I dont' know. Most of the state would be one big mosquito
filled swamp without permafrost.
"It's not weather, it's Malaria!"
|8.29.08 @ 5:13PM|#
As the 800th flamewar today on the subject of Governor Palin
starts, did anyone hear about some big speech that was given last
night?
You mean the story that took up the top half of the front page of
every morning newspaper in the country?
|8.29.08 @ 5:21PM|#
How I wish an Atheist would run for president...
"Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the
plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed
by inserting "Jesus Christ," so that it would read "A departure
from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;"
the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that
they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the
Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and
Infidel of every denomination."
-Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act
for Religious Freedom
Richard |8.29.08 @ 5:28PM|#
It dismays me how bigoted and intolerant atheist are,in an academic environment both should be presented with both presenting their arguments, for it part of a well rounded education. It not the job of the academics (in a secular environment) to prove one way or the other but to present to the the student knowledge that there different views in American Culture.
|8.29.08 @ 5:29PM|#
That says to me that that is boob bait. Not that giving boob
bait is admirable, but if she really were some kind of inteligent
design crazy, why didn't she do something to that effect as
governor?
She did say "legislatures."
Which I have no problem with on such a contentious and ambiguous
issue. Unclear if she'd go the Federalist route like I would, but
it wouldn't surprise me.
|8.29.08 @ 5:31PM|#
"That says to me that that is boob bait. Not that giving
boob bait is admirable, but if she really were some kind of
inteligent design crazy, why didn't she do something to that effect
as governor?"
She did say "legislature."
Which I have no problem with on such a contentious and ambiguous
issue. Unclear if she'd go the Federalist route like I would, but
it wouldn't surprise me.
"The concept of citizen legislators may just be getting a
second chance here, and Palin's "inexperience" might not be such a
bad thing, at least from a libertarian perspective."
No idea at this point if that's what Palin herself represents, but
"from your mouth to God's ears..."
---
Sorry for the double.
kevin|8.29.08 @ 5:32PM|#
As the 800th flamewar today on the subject of Governor Palin
starts, did anyone hear about some big speech that was given last
night?
You mean the story that took up the top half of the front page of
every morning newspaper in the country?
First of all, no one reads newspapers anymore. Second, the papers
were printed before McCain announced. This was probably a huge coup
for McCain, stepping on Obama's toes li
kevin|8.29.08 @ 5:39PM|#
Creationism is obviously retarded, but I sympathize with parents
who are pissed at having their kids taught in school that their
parents are retards.
The solution is to let school vouchers solve the problem for us.
The market would provide for creationist classes at some schools,
everyone else could have their kids taught real science.
Elemenope|8.29.08 @ 5:39PM|#
It not the job of the academics (in a secular environment)
to prove one way or the other but to present to the the student
knowledge that there different views in American
Culture.
Sure, in an "American Culture" class.
Science, on the other hand, really isn't one of those things that
lends itself to "ideological balance".
We wouldn't teach *in a science class* that the world has four
corners (such as a stupidly literal reading of the Bible would
indicate), would we?
|8.29.08 @ 5:51PM|#
What about federal welfare?
She's the governor of the number 1 recipient of it in the country
by far. And that doesn't even include Alaska's sweetheart deal on
royalties from oil and mineral rights from federal land.
And she's already hinting she'll use the position to garner even
more wilderness welfare for Alaska.
|8.29.08 @ 6:12PM|#
"And you know, I say this too as the daughter of a science
teacher. Growing up with being so privileged and blessed to be
given a lot of information on, on both sides of the subject --
creationism and evolution. "
HAHAHAHAHAHA, that shit is FUNNY!
Oh, she's being serious? Holy shit...
|8.29.08 @ 6:31PM|#
The problem is not creationism being taught in schools, but
outright and unabashed socialism. The statists WANT you to be
debating creationism versus evolution, because that keeps the
public's attention off of the real indoctrination going on.
The core problem isn't what's being taught in public schools, the
core problem is that the vast majority have no choice but to send
their children to the weekday gulags.
|8.29.08 @ 8:22PM|#
"The core problem isn't what's being taught in public schools,
the core problem is that the vast majority have no choice but to
send their children to the weekday gulags."
First of all who is making anyone go to public schools? They have
these things called private schools near where I live, you should
check in your local area for them. Kids are allowed to go to them
all the time where I live...
Second, public schools are a public good enriching us all. You know
how some states will spend less money on their school systems and
they have a crappy school system and so, well, businesses don't
locate there and their economy sucks? Without public education this
nation would be like those states.
Public education provides many people with an education that they
would not otherwise get. As an education is the kind of thing that
can determine everything else about a person it can be rightly said
that if they did not get such educations they would have their life
choices severly limited. Therefore they would have less liberty.
More choices for more people. If that's statism then give me some
statism!
Siggy|8.29.08 @ 8:28PM|#
It dismays me how bigoted and intolerant atheist are,in an
academic environment both should be presented with both presenting
their arguments, for it part of a well rounded education. It not
the job of the academics (in a secular environment) to prove one
way or the other but to present to the the student knowledge that
there different views in American Culture.
It's not science. Therefore, it should not be taught in science
class.
|8.29.08 @ 8:37PM|#
First of all who is making anyone go to public schools? They
have these things called private schools near where I live, you
should check in your local area for them. Kids are allowed to go to
them all the time where I live...
That's not the problem - the problem is mandatory schooling. Also,
regulations and zoning laws make private schools expensive
enterprises, instead of cheaper alternatives to those white
elephants that we call, with a sick sense of humor, "Public
Schools". Besides there is the fact that people are made to pay for
the public schools anyway, through private property confiscation,
or "property taxes", as we choose to euphemistically call it.
And, many private schools receive State funding, making their
choice of subjects suspicious, to boot.
Second, public schools are a public good enriching us
all.
Is this a statement of faith? Because you cannot possibly know what
does "enrich us all", without surveying everybody, an expensive
undertaking to say the least.
Public education provides many people with an education that
they would not otherwise get.
This statement begs the question - you already assume people do not
have choices, or assume what you want to prove. People can get
education by other means, like, for starters, homeschooling. And
no, it is NOT more expensive to home school than relying on public
schools.
the innominate one|8.29.08 @ 8:44PM|#
"It dismays me how bigoted and intolerant atheist
are...[sic]"
Richard, I bet everyone who disagrees with your religious beliefs
is a bigoted and intolerant atheist.
|8.29.08 @ 8:45PM|#
You know how some states will spend less money on their
school systems and they have a crappy school system and so, well,
businesses don't locate there and their economy sucks?
Really? Because many businesses are relocating to Asian countries
that do not waste... pardon me, "spend" as much money on education
as the US. The US is actually losing its manufacturing base,
despite a seemingly better educated labor force.
Economics 101: It's the COST of labor that makes capitals move, and
not necessarily how much a State decides to spend on education. By
the way, education is a personal choice, it does not come magically
just because a government decides to throw money at schools and
teachers.
Without public education this nation would be like those
states.
You cannot know that for a fact.
|8.29.08 @ 9:52PM|#
Finally, a real Libertarian is posting on this
site.
You go, Francisco!
Now, be sure to explain how the Federal income tax is
unconstitutional despite the constitutional amendment that permits
it.
Let everybody know that traffic rules and regulations are an
intolerable abridgement of our God-given liberties ("Drive on the
right? Stop on red? Not until they pull the steering wheel from my
cold, dead hands!")
And it's about time somebody exploded once and for all the statist
tyranny of what we call, with a sick sense of humor, "Standard Time
Zones." Francisco, you're just the one to do it!
We'e all counting on you, buddy. Please don't let us down.
ed|8.29.08 @ 10:01PM|#
Ed, when was the last time a 72 year old was elected as
president?
72 is the new 62. Besides, I have a feeling this is one VP
who won't face-shoot her hunting mates. That's good enough for
me.
|8.29.08 @ 10:17PM|#
"Because you cannot possibly know what does "enrich us all",
without surveying everybody, an expensive undertaking to say the
least."
Oh yes I can, we do it all the time. We call them elections and no
one who wants to end public schools ever wins them.
"People can get education by other means, like, for starters,
homeschooling."
For a large swath of the US population this is simply not an
option. As I said, without public schools a great many people who
know get an education would not. They would suffer and so would the
public.
"The US is actually losing its manufacturing base, despite a
seemingly better educated labor force." This demonstrates some of
your problems. Yes better education is not tied so much to
manufacturing, nor textile work I suppose. But it is tied to
attracting the kind of work that needs an educated workforce.
btw-when countries modernize, i.e. go from 3rd world to developed
nations, they often dump quite a bit of money into educating their
populations.
"It's the COST of labor that makes capitals move, and not
necessarily how much a State decides to spend on education."
Really? It's just the cost? So that's why the much more costly
environment of Manhattan, NY is an economic dynamo while Topeka
Kansas with all of it's low costs is such an economic backwater?
Costs are not the only factor in capital movement and the "costs"
that provide incentives for capital investors can be more than
wages/benefits of labor (for example not living in, or putting your
company HW in, a backwards shithole is something many people will
"pay" a lot for). Some ECON 101 for you my friend.
no thanks|8.29.08 @ 10:45PM|#
It's official: the Neocons have taken over McCain. Palin is
woefully under qualified and untested to be in the second chair and
a faint, irregular heartbeat away from being President. Supporting
Creationism was the icing on the cake. I don't think she even
partly believes in evolution.
What a truly crappy choice in a sea of similar but well qualified
(Sen. Coburn*?) candidates, McCain picks "Monica Goodling 'light'."
No. thank. you.
BTW, Technology Review has an interesting article about Obama's
economic advisor (including the whole NAFTA "leak").
http://bit.ly/Obamas-Geek-Economist
* Seriously, I believe if Sen. Coburn was "let loose" he could draw
more votes than Palin.
Sigh.
|8.29.08 @ 10:53PM|#
Economic junk science is far more damaging than creation junk
science. I wish there was the same amount of concern regarding
economic junk science as there was creation junk science.
Advice for the "Reality-Based" Community
So here is this week's message for the Left: Economics is a science. Willful ignorance or emotional rejection of the well-known precepts of this science is at least as bad as a fundamentalist Christian's willful ignorance of evolution science (for which the Left so often criticizes their opposition).
In fact, economic ignorance is much worse, since most people can come to perfectly valid conclusions about most public policy issues with a flawed knowledge of the origin of the species but no one can with a flawed understanding of economics.
Postscript: In fact, the more I think about it, the more economics and evolution are very similar. Both are sciences that are trying to describe the operation of very complex, bottom-up, self-organizing systems. And, in both cases, there exist many people who refuse to believe such complex and beautiful systems can really operate without top-down control.
Seward|8.29.08 @ 11:37PM|#
When it comes to the creationism* v. evolution in the science
classroom (vs. say the philosophy classroom) there seem to be at
least two issues at play in this conversation:
(1) Should we have public schools at all?
(2) Is juxtaposing these two visions an appropriate way to teach
science?
Now, does Palin oppose public schools? I have no idea.
Is juxtaposing these two visions a good way to teach science
whether in a public or a private setting? For various reasons I
would argue that it isn't.
*I would note that she apparently volunteered the term creationism,
so we aren't even using terminology like "intelligent design"
here.
|8.29.08 @ 11:43PM|#
Does it really matter whether Sarah Palin believes in
young-earth creationism? She isn't running for Vice Pope, nor is
she publishing a paper in a scientific journal.
With one exception, all members of Congress have publicly
proclaimed belief in some religion; the cast majority are some
denomination of Christianity. If we're going to dismiss every
politician who believes in talking snakes, virgin births and zombie
messiahs, I think we'll never be satisfied.
Besides, as an atheist, it seems wrong to judge a politician on a
non-political issue which I'd much prefer voters not judge me on,
were I running for office.
Seward|8.29.08 @ 11:58PM|#
Corey Cagle,
Yes, it seems like an appropriate measure of a candidate to know
whether they believe in YEC or anything else they happen believe
in.
Besides, as an atheist, it seems wrong to judge a politician on
a non-political issue...
Religion has never been a non-political issue in this country and
never will be.
|8.30.08 @ 8:07AM|#
A Taxachussets website didn't quote her full remarks. Go
figure!
Here's what she said:
"I don't think there should be a prohibition against debate if it
comes up in class. It doesn't have to be part of the
curriculum."
She added that, if elected, she would not push the state Board of
Education to add such creation-based alternatives to the state's
required curriculum.
Members of the state school board, which sets minimum requirements,
are appointed by the governor and confirmed by the
Legislature.
"I won't have religion as a litmus test, or anybody's personal
opinion on evolution or creationism," Palin said.
http://dwb.adn.com/news/politics/elections/story/8347904p-8243554c.html
Hmm... she doesn't think that the politicians should be the ones
making the call about what schools should teach or not? What the
heck is she thinking?
The more I know about her, the more I like.
|8.30.08 @ 9:07AM|#
"Does it really matter whether Sarah Palin believes in
young-earth creationism?"
I would say yes. If a person can be that fucking misinformed on
such an issue for ideological reasons, then one should shudder at
other areas where this could pop up its head. Young earth
creationism goes against not only modern biology, but modern
geology as well. A person who claims to know something about a
geological issue like oil and also claims to be a young earth
creationist is a scary person if you ask me.
My take on evolution as well as global warming is grounded in
humility. I don't have a PhD in biology or climatology or what have
you and thus I will defer to the consensus of experts on that
subject. A contrary general rule would be batshit crazy. Imagine
that in medecine or law or geology or economics if you just thought
that without years of study and experience you suddenly could see
that the consensus arrived at by thousands of practicioners in a
given field were "really" wrong or the workings of some "hoax."
Expert consensus will be wrong here or there but the arrogance of a
non-expert declaring this or that expert consensus wrong (and how
nice to suddenly discern the falsity of ones that have implications
that bother you ideologically!) is way out there. I mean, do the
math, what's more likely, that a diverse group of thousands of
highly trained experts in a field are wrong or conspiring to
mislead the world or that your untrained and highly ideologically
committed self is wrong?
TJIT-I grant that economics is, like biology or geology, a field of
its own with its own experts and findings. I would qualify that the
social sciences don't seem to have or even usually claim the same
amount of reliable findings and generalizations as the hard
sciences do. But more to the point, if you actually take a look at
economics as a field you will find that the view of classical
economics most spouted by libertarians is in fact not the consensus
in the field anymore.
AuH2Oreloaded|8.30.08 @ 10:33AM|#
"Mr. Nice Guy | August 30, 2008, 9:07am | #
"Does it really matter whether Sarah Palin believes in young-earth
creationism?"
I would say yes. If a person can be that fucking misinformed on
such an issue for ideological reasons, then one should shudder at
other areas where this could pop up its head. Young earth
creationism goes against not only modern biology, but modern
geology as well. A person who claims to know something about a
geological issue like oil and also claims to be a young earth
creationist is a scary person if you ask me."
Err... have you read the comment before yours? She never claimed to
be a creationist.
|8.30.08 @ 11:05AM|#
Is "Rev" Jeremiah Wright a creationist?
Ask Barak Milhouse Obama cause I want to know!!
|8.30.08 @ 11:11AM|#
You can't trust experts. Well, sometimes you can, but you have
to find out if they are religious first.
Mr. Nice Guy, and AuHlkjhaldskf, as a heathen I see what yous guys
are saying, but...have you ever had surgery? Pretty good odds that
guy cutting you apart and playing with yer guts while your napping
believes in angels, Jebus, Mohamsandwich, maybe even alien UFOs,
slot machine/gambling myths, Feng Shui-type crap, race memory,
ghosts. In general, I don't want to know these things - "just wake
me up when its over". But, when I meet a science teacher who talks
about what he did after church last Sunday, its one of those things
that does make me go hmmm.
Bill Clinton believes in Jesus Christ. He believes in a being more
powerful than superman. Should that man have had his finger on "the
button"?
This thread is over anyway. It was pwned at 8:07 with the link
(worth reposting for anyone who missed it):
http://dwb.adn.com/news/politics/elections/story/8347904p-8243554c.html
|8.31.08 @ 2:10PM|#
"The education section of the Republican Party of Alaska's
platform states "We support giving Creation Science equal
representation with other theories of the origin of life. If
evolution is taught, it should be presented as only a theory." Do
you support this position? Why?
A: I support this plank in the Republican Party's platform. I
believe society can have healthy debates on scientific theories, so
equal representation of creation and evolution shouldn't be an
offense."
http://www.newsminer.com/news/2008/aug/29/palin-issues-2002-alaska-gubernatorial-race/
Jordan|9.2.08 @ 1:23PM|#
First of all who is making anyone go to public schools? They have these things called private schools near where I live, you should check in your local area for them. Kids are allowed to go to them all the time where I live...
Well, the kids who can afford to after having already paid for
public schooling.
Oh yes I can, we do it all the time. We call them elections and no one who wants to end public schools ever wins them.
By that token, slavery and segregation enriched us all for quite a
long time. So has the War On Drugs.
Second, public schools are a public good enriching us all. You know how some states will spend less money on their school systems and they have a crappy school system and so, well, businesses don't locate there and their economy sucks? Without public education this nation would be like those states.
It's not funding that's the problem. We spend more per-pupil than
any other nation on Earth and our schools are absolute shit. Even
China has better schools.
Public education provides many people with an education that they would not otherwise get. As an education is the kind of thing that can determine everything else about a person it can be rightly said that if they did not get such educations they would have their life choices severly limited. Therefore they would have less liberty. More choices for more people. If that's statism then give me some statism!
And school choice would still allow these kids to receive an
education, without going to schools who cater to the lowest common
denominator and who group the A.P. kids with the gangbangers and
drug dealers.
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