Eat the Invaders!

Katherine Mangu-Ward | February 20, 2008

A lot of ecologists are wringing their hands about aggressive invasive species these days, though they're nothing new. The first recorded case was in 1245, "when Norse voyagers brought a soft-shelled clam to the shores of the North Sea on the sides of their wooden ships." Still, in an era of global trade more and more fish, bacteria, and plants are hitching rides to foreign lands, causing some serious changes. Today's New York Times op-ed section has the solution. Eat the invaders.

A half billion giant jellyfish a day forming a slimy ring around your island nation? No problem:

The citizens of Fukui, a northern Japanese island, coped by marketing souvenir cookies flavored with powdered jellyfish. Returning from a fact-finding mission to China, a professor from Japan’s National Fisheries University offered up 10 different recipes for preparing Nomura’s jellyfish. “Making them a popular food,” he told a Japanese newspaper, “is the best way to solve the problem.”

In the U.S., huge super-powered Asian carp are muscling their way north on the Mississippi and have been spotted just 25 miles from Lake Michigan. What to do?:

If we want to forestall our looming carp quagmire, [the Japanese approach] is the kind of attitude we need to adopt on our shores. Sports fishermen are already doing their part by angling for the pests (as the presence of such titles as International Carper, TotalCarp, and Carpology on magazine racks attests). Restaurateurs from Tupelo to Toronto could pitch in by replacing the bland-fleshed channel catfish on their menus with equally bland-fleshed Asian carp. It seems only fair: it was catfish farmers in the South who imported the fish to filter algae from their ponds in the 1970s and allowed them to escape into the wild during the Mississippi floods of 1993...Asian carp, Cajun-style, anyone?

More on the joys of invasive species here (snakehead fish are delish), and here (zebra mussels, anyone?)

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Marxist|2.20.08 @ 4:57PM|#

I wholeheartedly support this. I have not eaten nearly all the different types of animals I want to yet. The more choice the better.

Episiarch|2.20.08 @ 4:57PM|#

ARRGHHH must change joke handle

|2.20.08 @ 4:58PM|#

it was catfish farmers in the South who imported the fish to filter algae from their ponds in the 1970s

The Mississippi could be a blue water river!?!?

The Horror!

Bingo|2.20.08 @ 5:00PM|#

See we don't need a border fence, we just need more creative chefs!

|2.20.08 @ 5:01PM|#

That's terriffic, when it works.

Unfortunately, an invasive species' harmfulness and its yummyness are not likely to be closely correlated.

the innominate one|2.20.08 @ 5:03PM|#

Katherine, let me know when you start eating marine toads and Cuban tree frogs.

Brandybuck|2.20.08 @ 5:03PM|#

While the suggestion to eat the invaders sounds plausible, it ignores an important point. By making the invaders economically valuable, you are providing an incentive NOT to eradicate them.

p.s. I've eaten barbecued jellyfish. Very tasteless. Sort of like bland gummi bears. I think the best way to utilize jellyfish is to dry them out and use them as frisbees.

KMW|2.20.08 @ 5:04PM|#

innominate, I'm game. If you send me a couple via FedEx, I'll give it a shot.

Piled high, Deep|2.20.08 @ 5:08PM|#

sounds kinda like the logic of balancing the budget by eliminating earmarks...

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 5:08PM|#

Unfortunately, an invasive species' harmfulness and its yummyness are not likely to be closely correlated.

Deep-frying helps. Asian Carp McNuggets!

Jesse Walker|2.20.08 @ 5:09PM|#

By making the invaders economically valuable, you are providing an incentive NOT to eradicate them.

That's my problem with the proposal too, though I still favor it on It's Always Good To Find Something New To Eat grounds.

|2.20.08 @ 5:10PM|#

innominate, I'm game.

Pun intentional?

Seriously, I wonder how jellyfish would taste like anything at all besides flavorless gelatin.

KMW,

Have you ever tried cutlassfish? If so, do you recommend it?

There was a big marketing push in Louisianna to eat nutria. I'm not really sure how that worked out for them, but I'm guessing not very well.

|2.20.08 @ 5:11PM|#

Unfortunately, an invasive species' harmfulness and its yummyness are not likely to be closely correlated.

Mmmmmmm...feral pig. I live too far north for them to be a problem around here, but I hear it's a blast to go hunting for feral piggies. One of my crazy redneck Texas uncles was telling me that since they're feral, there are no game protections on them, so you can do fun stuff like spotlighting them and baiting them with old donuts.

|2.20.08 @ 5:18PM|#

you are providing an incentive NOT to eradicate them.

In most cases, the harm causes by invasives is a consequence of their unimpeded population growth, not anything particularly harmful about the species itself.

So merely cutting back on the species population - by providing that which the ecosystem lacks, predation of that species - will solve the problem.

In a related matter, this country's ecology would be a lot healthier if people ate more venison and less farm-raised beef. Although deer are not invasive, the elimination of their predators and the suburbanization of the landscape - increasing the "edge" area where grasslands (yards) and woods are in close proximity, which deer love - has caused their population to explode in a similar manner to an invasion species without predators.

So, in conclusion, eat yummy bambis.

alan|2.20.08 @ 5:20PM|#

bland catfish? How bad of a cook do you have to be to make catfish taste bland? I guess, English bad.

|2.20.08 @ 5:21PM|#

Bambi is the most delicious meat of all, joe. The problem is that most people aren't willing to sit still in a tree for a few hours in order to shoot one. What do you think about legalizing commercial deer hunting?

I don't know. If our coastal waters get overrun with whales and seals, count me out. There ain't no way to make blubber palatable.

thoreau|2.20.08 @ 5:23PM|#

joe, I believe in doing my part to save the earth. I'll gladly eat some venison. I've got this slow cooker that I've been having fun with. Which cut of venison would go best in a stew?

|2.20.08 @ 5:29PM|#

Unfortunately, an invasive species' harmfulness and its yummyness are not likely to be closely correlated.

joe's right. Ask any scuba diver in California about Calupera growth thanks to it being dumped by reefkeepers throughout the state. Unless they are vegetarians, they'll tell you that stuff's a bitch.

|2.20.08 @ 5:31PM|#

Warty,

If you mean, allow the open-market sale of venison, I'm all for it. I'd go so far as to supporting sending USDA-types out to certify the meat for public sale. That would be a very intelligent investment of public funds.

Episiarch|2.20.08 @ 5:34PM|#

I am all for joe and Warty's idea. Sure, I could go shoot a deer, but I'm busy and then I have to pay somebody to butcher it anyway.

If I could buy it in the store at a beef-parity price, I would buy more venison than beef. I love it.

S Kimo|2.20.08 @ 5:35PM|#

Oogruk Flippers (seal)

Cut the flippers off from the oogruk. Put the flippers on the seal in fresh blubber. Let them stay there for about 2 weeks. Take the loose fur off the flipper. Then cut them in small pieces and eat the meat.

http://www2.grand-forks.k12.nd.us/iditarod/inuitrecipes.html

|2.20.08 @ 5:38PM|#

As mentioned above, if you're having trouble doing your duty to humanity, simply deep fry the offending critter. Then it will be yummy.

S Kimo|2.20.08 @ 5:38PM|#

Does the Internet rock or what? When I woke up this morning, I had no idea I'd be looking for blubber recipes. But once the impulse arrived, it only took a few seconds!

|2.20.08 @ 5:52PM|#

Have you ever tried cutlassfish? If so, do you recommend it?

Smacky -

I came so close to embarrassing myself just now. I was going to upbraid you for mutilating cuttlefish, but inexplicably googled cutlassfish and, lo and behold, cutlassfish exist.

Thanks for teaching me something today.

S Kimo@5:35pm
Unsure if the seal I had was prepared that way, but it had the consistency of the stuff that Slim Jims are wrapped in. I suppose in a pinch it could be used as a substitute for chewing gum. And chewing on whale skin is like chewing on a hockey puck.

Pro Libertate@5:38pm
Deep frying blubber would be like trying to deep fry Crisco.

|2.20.08 @ 5:55PM|#

Deer hunting is not the reason we don't eat more venison. It's illegal to commercially sell wild venison.

|2.20.08 @ 5:56PM|#

Unfortunately, an invasive species' harmfulness and its yummyness are not likely to be closely correlated.

Probably not. Think of zebra mussels and lamprey eels, both plagues on the Great Lakes.

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 5:56PM|#

this country's ecology would be a lot healthier if people ate more venison and less farm-raised beef.

I dunno. Would farm-raised venison do a thing about the wild deer population?

|2.20.08 @ 6:00PM|#

If only this solution worked for illegal immigrants...

|2.20.08 @ 6:01PM|#

Would farm-raised venison do a thing about the wild deer population?

Chronic Wasting Disease is a serious problem aong captive deer. It has now spread into wild populations and there is some evidence that animals in overpopulated areas are more at risk.

Wisconsin conducted a massive cull a couple of years ago due to an outbreak of CWD in the state.

Rhywun|2.20.08 @ 6:02PM|#

We're losing sight of the fact that East Asians will eat almost anything that moves. I've seen it in action. Not every "surprise" that turns up on our shores is going to look edible to the average American.

|2.20.08 @ 6:02PM|#

Russ 2000,

For some reason, it's almost impossible to raise deer commercially. Fatal diseases spread very quickly among them when it's been tried.

Maybe it has something to do with deer not being natural herd animals, unlike cattle or buffalo.

And also unlike cattle and buffalo, deer are able to sustain themselves in the contemporary American landscape in large numbers - as in, large enough to produce a commercial industry - without any need for human husbandry at all.

JLE|2.20.08 @ 6:07PM|#

You stole the photo from National Geographic?

I used to have it tacked on a corkboard on my wall.

|2.20.08 @ 6:07PM|#

Other benefits: less antibiotic medicine being secreted into the environment. Less antibiotic material being consumed in food. Fewer manure pits (ever read about the pig "farms" in Carolina? Eek!) Far less fossil fuel consumption per unit of meat. Vast acreage now being used to grow feed becoming available for...take your pick: biofuels, human food, forest/natural prarie. All the water and pesticides used to grow that feed. All the water used on the cattle themselves. Much less erotion/denuding of pasturelands.

It's an idea whose time has come.

|2.20.08 @ 6:08PM|#

SugarFree

It's true that market hunting is illegal, but what joe is suggesting is legalizing it and I agree.

The only people who can get venison that is not imported from New Zealand or Europe* now is to have access to a food program for the poor. Hunters regularly donate surplus game to these programs.

*There are some deer farms that sell venison in the US but it's pretty expensive. As your link points out restrictions on selling wild killed deer have pretty much eliminated it from the marketplace.

|2.20.08 @ 6:12PM|#

I live too far north for them to be a problem around here, but I hear it's a blast to go hunting for feral piggies.

Indeed it is.

One of my crazy redneck Texas uncles was telling me that since they're feral, there are no game protections on them, so you can do fun stuff like spotlighting them and baiting them with old donuts.

The real crazies hunt them with packs of dogs, and kill them with knives. No joke.

Which cut of venison would go best in a stew?

Slow cookers are God's gift to every cut, except the backstraps and, if you have a really tender one, the chops. Those should be grilled.

Wisconsin conducted a massive cull a couple of years ago due to an outbreak of CWD in the state.

A buddy of mine works for the Department of Wildlife. The "cull" had the effect of negating population growth. Basically, we were shooting all the fawns.

Which, BTW, are excellent eating.

|2.20.08 @ 6:16PM|#

joe, actually most of the venison for sale in the US is farm raised. But you are correct in pointing out that farming them has its problems (as I pointed out at 6:01).

Venison is also expensive at this point. I'm not sure if Market Hunting would lower the cost or not.

The other idea whose time is due is suburban (and even urban hunting). Naturally there are good (safety eg) reasons and bad (animal "rights" concerns eg) ones that need to be addressed. But frankly in some parts of the country whitetail deer are a serious nuisance and serious population reductions need to be carried out for both human safety and deer health.

alisa|2.20.08 @ 6:22PM|#

I also wouldn't mind legalizing commercial hunting.

I've heard parts of suburban New Jersey are now legalizing deer hunting for the first time due to serious population problems. Good decision -- though I sure hope they make some kind of announcement before people start shooting in the state park where I run.

|2.20.08 @ 6:25PM|#

Isaac,

My point, which I guess I could have made clearer, is that deer-farming is too hard to ever become large enough to make a dent in the diet of the average American. Not that it is impossible.

And absolutely about the suburbs. By some estimates, there are more deer now than in 1492. The deer actually prefer the suburbs to the deep woods.

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 6:34PM|#

deer are able to sustain themselves in the contemporary American landscape in large numbers

joe, I don't claim to know jack shit about deer-raising. But the wild deer population problem was due to over-hunting and, later, consumption safety. Seems like the economic nature of venison is such that it will cost significantly more than farmed herd animals so the idea of spreading the popularity of venison meals to reduce wild deer population seems more theoretical than practical.

In any event, deer are hardly an invasive species since they're indigenous.

Here's the extent of my deer knowledge:

http://www.anl.gov/Science_and_Technology/Virtual_Tour/deer.htm

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 6:38PM|#

The deer actually prefer the suburbs to the deep woods.

The place I see the most deer is in the city limits of Chicago. (Of course, I spend more time there. Still, I'm more concerned about plowing into a deer driving in the city than I am in the suburbs. Part of the problem is the idiots tossing food out to Bambi.)

|2.20.08 @ 6:39PM|#

I'm all for commercial hunting, farming, whatever. (I'm hip to the joe tip.)

Since my grandfather died I don't have access to venison at all. He used to take two a year (bow and gun) and I used to have a freezer full of it. I used the last of it a few years ago making cassoulet.

As for cooking, just about any recipe for rabbit is adaptable to venison. Grilling the tender cuts is great, as is long high-acid marinades and kababing. It grinds well, but makes a fairly dry burger. Vension chili, stew, goulash and tomato-based meat sauces work well. Vension jerky and summer sausage are fantastic, but sausage applications are usually recommended to be the cooked kind (venison fat goes rancid easier than pork fat.)

My motto?

Less deer on the highway, and more in my belly.

|2.20.08 @ 6:40PM|#

Russ 2000,

But you forget: people go hunting for fun. A good deal of that cost, hunters will willingly bear, and recoup the money.

Not to mention, if a commercial market develops, some of those costs will come down considerably. For example, if operations are set up for hunters to sell their deer whole, where they can be butchered assembly-line style, at trailheads and elsewhere in the area of the hunt.

|2.20.08 @ 6:41PM|#

Whoops, that first sentence should be, people will absorb those costs, and more willl do so (or, will do so more) if they can recoup some of the money.

|2.20.08 @ 6:43PM|#

Joe, I was only picking a nit.

I think you're right. the extent to which farming is successful (the Kiwis have done an awfully good job from what I hear*) it still only fills a niche market. For example if the special of the day in some upscale eatery is, say, Elk Roast it is probably from a farm in Wyoming or Montana.

But farming is problematical for the very reasons you state. And especially in the case of CWD which while it is also present in some wild populations appears to be especially a problem for overcrowded populations.

|2.20.08 @ 6:53PM|#

joe, you make many good points.

The food pantry operations work because of the widespread donation networks in place. For the most part the hunters donate the meat and local butchers donate time to cut and pack it.

Introducing a cash incentive for both the hunter and the butcher would extend the supply of venison beyond the food pantry community. And furthermore i very much doubt that suply would suffer.

Another benefit might be that as more nonhunters got to taste the deliciousness that is venison they might raise their voices to loudly tell the antis to shut the fuck up.

Kolohe|2.20.08 @ 6:54PM|#

The real crazies hunt them with packs of dogs, and kill them with knives. No joke.

I think this is the most common way they do pig hunting in the Oahu mountains, and AFAIK the only one of two legal ways to do it (the other being bow hunting). The hunting 'season' is every Wednesday and Saturday year round.

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 6:54PM|#

and more willl do so (or, will do so more) if they can recoup some of the money.

Fine. what's stopping the market now?

|2.20.08 @ 6:57PM|#

Russ

Market hunting is illegal, that's what's stopping it.

Russ 2000|2.20.08 @ 7:06PM|#

Market hunting is illegal, that's what's stopping it.

Exactly. It's a government-created problem, not an I-don't-wanna-eat-venison problem. joe at 5:18 hinted that it's a combination of sprawl and consumption habits that causes a deer overpopulation problem and I say it's a government-restrictions problem.

|2.20.08 @ 7:21PM|#

In any event, deer are hardly an invasive species since they're indigenous.

Nay, nay, moosebreath.

From here -
Belle Isle also was home to a large herd of European fallow deer for more than 50 years. A few remain as exhibits at the nature center, but the last of the 300 animals was captured in 2004 and relocated.

These critters were doing extensive damage to the parks flora and had to be dealt with. Yes folks, Detroit had a wild, invasive species, deer problem. I'd have solved it differently, cheaper, and still had some wild deer for the city folks to go visit. Close the park for one work week in November, sell permits, and hunters would happily cull the herd for you. The park is in the middle of the Detroit River so the hunting wouldn't present a hazard to residents. Just close the bridge to all but the hunters for five usually cold and wet days.

Instead we spent a large sum to capture and relocate what is not an endangered species, just a pain in the ass on Belle Isle. People don't think.

|2.20.08 @ 7:23PM|#

Russ 2000,

joe at 5:18 hinted that it's a combination of sprawl No hint there, I said that openly. And I'm right - sprawl creates edge habitat, which deer like, and it has caused the population to explode

...and consumption habits Huh? There is nothing remotely related to "consumption habits" in that statement.

|2.20.08 @ 7:26PM|#

I'm sitting here with lemons and melted butter, hoping for a runaway lobster invasion.

Meanwhile, I'll be ordering more venison summer sausage.

DOING MY PART.

|2.20.08 @ 7:32PM|#

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, Russ. What are you saying?

|2.20.08 @ 7:35PM|#

Tired of the same old bland invasive species every day?

Try Soylent Sauce

Made with our special blend of HFCS, MSG, now including PEOPLE, only poor ones though, credit defaults and such...

Now, every jellyfish will be a meal fit for a king.

|2.20.08 @ 7:43PM|#

Deep frying can do a lot, but there isn't enough breading in the world to make me eat kudzu.

|2.20.08 @ 8:11PM|#

Actually, kudzu leaves, especially the young ones, are quite tasty. They are peppery, like arugula.

Wash them well, especially off the roadside and dress them simply.

[sorry, joe]

Devo|2.20.08 @ 8:16PM|#

joe, I see what you mean about market hunting, but would that leave enough deer left for the sportsmen? And I imagine it would be more difficult for the USDA to verify the venison quality. I think it might just be easier to lower the cost of hunting licenses and deer tags in order to make an incentive for hunting.

|2.20.08 @ 8:22PM|#

Man, I'm a little pissed that joe is getting all the credit for the market hunting idea. Hmph.

*takes ball elsewhere*

|2.20.08 @ 10:12PM|#

A lot of ecologists are wringing their hands about aggressive invasive species these days

That's just the free market in action. These isolated species have been coddled by various barriers for too long and are now facing some real competition. There may be some short-term difficulties, but in the long term the invisible hand of natural selection will sort everything out.

|2.20.08 @ 10:14PM|#

I thought deer overpopulation was mostly a result of elimination/ reduction of their predators (cougars).

KMW, I'll work on getting you some Cuban tree frogs and marine toads (insert illegal immigrant joke here), but I take no responsibility for your well-being should you choose to consume them. Marine toads (aka cane toads) are large with large parotoid glands, and consequently produce a lot of bufotoxin.

Cuban tree frogs similarly produce a noxious skin secretion. I unforgettably IDed a Cuban tree frog by the burning sensation in my eye once.

|2.20.08 @ 10:35PM|#

Devo,

Just my guess, I think the sportsmen would BE the supply-side of market hunting. There would be more of them, and the existing ones would get out more, because it would be economically productive.

the innominate one,

Both landscape change and the elimination of predators come into play, and interact with each other. For example, a deer needs a smaller range than a cougar, so sprawling development will break up rural areas so that there is enough habitat for deer, but not for cougars.

|2.20.08 @ 10:54PM|#

I finally found something to agree with joe about.

I particularly like this one, and think it is a very good point.Just my guess, I think the sportsmen would BE the supply-side of market hunting. There would be more of them, and the existing ones would get out more, because it would be economically productive.

And I also agree that sports~~men~~folk (there are at least 2 genders of hunters - maybe more)would happily pay for most, if not all the cost associated with the process. I would.

And he came very close, very close, to not resorting at all to the "I'm right and anyone who can't see that is a shithead." position he usually takes. Nonetheless, joe had some useful things to contribute, presented it in a most reasonable way and didn't actually call anyone a shithead.

However in the 2:23 posting, joe is still making sure we know he is right and somehow seems awfully close to letting out a rude/crude word or two. But maybe it's just me..?

joe | February 20, 2008, 7:23pm | #
Russ 2000,

joe at 5:18 hinted that it's a combination of sprawl No hint there, I said that openly. And I'm right - sprawl creates edge habitat, which deer like, and it has caused the population to explode

...and consumption habits Huh? There is nothing remotely related to "consumption habits" in that statement.

In any case joe, you actually did (in my opinion) contribute something to this thread. As you so kindly told me in a previous thread, it is something you do often: http://www.reason.com/blog/show/125024.html#comments

joe | February 16, 2008, 8:01pm | #
Actually, I get people discussing ideas with me every single day.

Every.

Single.

Day.

I also get emails from strangers just about weekly, complimenting me for how much I contribute to the level of discussion.

How about you?

Hey Warty, bring that ball back, joe may have gotten through his idiot stage and it may become necessary to start appreciating him.(polling data suggests a 13.6 percent chance)

Warty | February 20, 2008, 8:22pm | #
Man, I'm a little pissed that joe is getting all the credit for the market hunting idea. Hmph.

*takes ball elsewhere*

|2.20.08 @ 11:06PM|#

I read a bit on this subject, and found some interesting things.

The reason they hire marksmen to cull deer populations in the suburbs, other than safety concerns, is the high level of non-fatal shots that regular joes commit. "You can't have a deer wandering over and dying on Mrs. Smith's lawn."

If deer were worth money, do you think they would get away?

|2.20.08 @ 11:43PM|#

OK, for some reason the rest of you have decided to gang up on joe. I'm not sure why in this case.

For the record it seems like joe would like some venison.

Well I'd like to say, any time that joe wants to come hunting with me he is more than welcome. I will even lend him one of my deer rifles for the occasion. I am serious, as serious as a heart attack.

|2.20.08 @ 11:47PM|#

Having been able to hunt since I was 12-ish, and knowing many regular hunters (my definition of regular means going hunting at least once per season) I would say that most -though not all- of them (self included) spend considerable time and effort at the shooting range between seasons.

The huge majority of hunters do this because they do not want their deer wandering away and dying in the thickets -never mind Mrs. Smith's lawn - where it would be far easier to load them into the truck than from aforementioned thicket.

I have no hard evidence to support it, but my belief is that regular hunters (joes if you will - do you hunt by the way joe?) do not in fact commit a high level of non-fatal shots.

I would say (from personal conversations with Conservation officers) that a main reason 'sharpshooters' are hired is because "Bambi huggers" - who inevitably kick up a huge stink at the merest suggestion of culling anything, figure a professional 'sharpshooter' is not going to be getting any enjoyment from a cull, whereas a 'regular joe' who enjoys the hunt, might actually get something they desire (beside the meat) out of it.

And as for Mrs (or Professor) Smith and her lawn, (forgive me for another personal anecdote here) my personal experience is that once Bambi and the gang start munching on his/her exotic and not so exotic shrubbery I'm one of the first folks they call to "cull". Often the question is can you use a silencer, and do it at night so the neighbors don't connect me with the dastardly deed.

And much as I'd love to put some venison in the freezer after picking it up in somebody's garden (remember the thicket?) the answer to both questions is, and remains NO, but thanks for asking.

If deer were worth money, do you think they would get away?

And most hunters are not going to let them get away (that's why the accuracy practice). To them (and me) deer are worth more than money. With basic non-descript ground beef going for $3.50/lb, steaks at least a buck more, and so on; a few dozen pounds of good clean venision, meat without additives etc (as you pointed out)is certainly worth it to folks like me.

And Bambi huggers be damned - I personally get satisfaction, and a spiritual reward when I bring home wild meat. Most deer are smarter than me in their own environment, so I don't actually manage it that often!

Isaac: me too! ...take me! I'm not that good (see sentence above) and I have my own rifle (though I am a good shot -practicing and all- I'm just not smarter than the average deer. I'd be happy to share with joe if I get anything.

|2.20.08 @ 11:52PM|#

Actually, joe, at FSU they have a flock of sheep that love to graze on kudzu. I'm not sure how the meat tastes, but I would not be surprised if it is not delicious.

But then, I love me some lamb. With mint sauce. Or not. Comes from being raised in 'strylya and all).

|2.21.08 @ 12:05AM|#

...I love me some lamb. With mint sauce.

Yum... my previous wife was Kiwi (the whole family actually ate vegemite) but her mom did a fabulous lamb with mint sauce, and Pavlova for dessert - and yes I know, Aussies claim to have invented Pavlova!

I haven't even thought of lamb with mint sauce since the divorce, not until I see it here on H&R ... gotta get me some...!!!

I'll continue to pass on the vegemite

|2.21.08 @ 12:39AM|#

Yeah mate, I know how that works. I made the mistake of marrying a Canadian. At least I learned how game travels. But in the real world they move a different way.

|2.21.08 @ 12:58AM|#

Hey... I'm a Canadian... (not one of those who trusts the government however!)

...but I married an American (whom I should have married 20 years ago when I knew her back then) and now life is gooood!

Russ 2000|2.21.08 @ 11:12AM|#

OK, for some reason the rest of you have decided to gang up on joe. I'm not sure why in this case.

It's called supply meeting demand.

Russ 2000|2.21.08 @ 11:17AM|#

I thought deer overpopulation was mostly a result of elimination/ reduction of their predators (cougars).

Man is also a predator, but government has a way of restricting his actions.

Russ 2000|2.21.08 @ 11:21AM|#

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, Russ. What are you saying?

joe, your words were "if people ate more venison and less farm-raised beef." That's sounds like "consumption habits" to me.

|2.21.08 @ 11:53AM|#

Why can't they just extend hunting season? I know plenty of hunters would like to be out there all year round.

Chromepulse|2.21.08 @ 12:35PM|#

All this talk of urban deer culling brings up an interesting reversal I've come across.
In New Zealand, Australia, and many parts of Europe, despite much stricter gun laws, it is remarkably easy to purchase a suppressor for your rifle. It is considered good manners to not annoy your neighbors with gunshots, akin to not driving around without a muffler on Sunday morning.
In the US our government types are convinced that suppressors have no other use than mob-style assassinations a la Anton Chigurh.
The attitude is "why do you need that thing? You got something to hide?"

Michael Ejercito|2.21.08 @ 12:44PM|#

If we can not eat the invaders, use them as feed for domesticated animals.

|2.21.08 @ 3:16PM|#

Chromepulse

There was an article in Field and Stream a few months ago about a hunt on an estate in Scotland.

Suppressors are required in Scotland law to protect the hearing of the guide and his assistant. It's sort of a labor law.

Russ 2000|2.22.08 @ 6:13PM|#

joe wrote:

"For example, a deer needs a smaller range than a cougar, so sprawling development will break up rural areas so that there is enough habitat for deer, but not for cougars."

This might be changing, too.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-cougar_22feb22,1,4243757.story

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