White House Student Loan Propaganda Push in Full Swing

today's theme is faces@campus_leadersIt's 2014, so that means after watching a hand-picked issue-specific "regular Joe" at the White House introduce the president because he's talking about the issue specific to him, you'll get an e-mail from that person via the White House. Today the issue is student loan debt and in this case the regular Joe is Andy MacCracken, the executive director of National Campus Leadership Council, a "venue for student body presidents and their teams to come together and confront exigent issues facing our generation."

The missive:

Hey, everyone --

I owe more than $75,000 in federal student loan debt -- and that's before you count interest.

So, as you might imagine, the action President Obama took today to make debt more manageable for millions of Americans is very personal to me.

When I was growing up in Colorado, my parents worked multiple jobs and made plans to refinance our house just so they could afford to put me through college.

But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life. Student loans made it possible for me to go to college and complete my education, but now they present a serious financial burden.

With tens of thousands of dollars in student debt, the only reason I'm not losing my mind is because I know my repayment will be manageable. Pay As You Earn, for example, means my monthly payments will be about $200 per month instead of nearly $900 per month.

Today, President Obama directed the Secretary of Education to propose regulations that would give nearly 5 million federal direct student loan borrowers like me the opportunity to cap their payments at 10 percent of their income. That's on top of steps he's already taken to keep interest rates low and expand income-based repayment programs.

That could not be more real for me -- and for millions of Americans across the country who have stories like mine. Maybe you're one of them.

So right now, there are two things you can do:

Right now, I'm surrounded by new graduates who want to improve the world around us -- as teachers, public servants, and, like me, as non-profit leaders.

The action this president is taking is helping to make sure finances aren't holding us back from achieving our potential.

And that's truly invaluable for me, my generation, and the nation as a whole.

Andy MacCracken
Arlington, Virginia

Andy doesn't mention what degree he went to school for. These kinds of stories usually don't because volunteering such information would lead to the question: "and you expected that degree to raise your income-earning potential enough to pay off the loans needed to get it?" Andy deploys the canard about "achieving our potential" unburdened by past debts, yet managing your debt and finances is an integral part of adulthood, something Andy's generation claims to be. That more federal subsidies of higher education will further drive up the price of higher education should be obvious to anyone who's taken a basic economics class, as it should be obvious that the number of "public servants" and "non-profit leaders" higher education produces is indicative of a mismatch between supply and demand. That it isn't raises serious questions about the quality of higher education in America today.

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  • Almanian!||

    tl;dr

    But I gleaned enough to note: fuck Obama, fuck this kid's bitch ass, fuck his debt - I ain't payin' it, and fuck the federalization of everything. And fuck you, too.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    I ain't payin' it,

    Oh, but you will...unless you're fixing to be one of those tax "protestors". And you know what we do to them.

  • Bill||

    He's less well known than his brother Phil MacCraken

  • Agammamon||

    And his cousin from the uber-religious family, Release The Cracken(from the captivity of sin).

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    That didn't take long.

  • Root Boy||

    I came here to post that lame joke and look how lame and late I am.

  • MJGreen||

    'Ey, fuck you, buddy!

  • Mokers||

    who you calling buddy, pal!

  • Invisible Finger||

    "and you expected that degree to raise your income-earning potential enough to pay off the loans needed to get it?"

    Why shouldn't the lenders be asking that question?

  • silent v||

    Because the feds guarantee the loan?

  • Invisible Finger||

    Right now, I'm surrounded by new graduates who want to improve the world around us -- as teachers, public servants, and, like me, as non-profit leaders.

    Those people only make the world worse. So fuck you very much.

  • Warren's Strapon||

    Inspired by HM's post below, I googled the guy. What a fucking douchenozzle. He never had a plan in his life that didn't involve theft and/or extortion.

  • Raven Nation||

    Not surprising. In my experience, and as a general rule, anybody who gets involved in campus student leadership is going to pretty far to the left.

  • MJGreen||

    Hence "non-profit leader."

  • Scarecrow Repair||

    That was the part that most sickened me -- that everyone else is a greedy unprincipled son of a bitch who doesn't give a damn about anyone but himself.

    Go ride a backhoe bucket out of town, buddy, fuck you very much, before your promising political career has a chance to take off.

  • PapayaSF||

    You can tell he went to college because he uses the word "exigent"!

  • mr lizard||

    You know who else used exigent?

  • R C Dean||

    Every cop ever who didn't want to wait for a warrant?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Andy doesn't mention what degree he went to school for.


    BA and MPA from AU's School of Public Affairs.

    One second on Google is all it took, Krayewski. One second.

  • Jerry on the sea||

    BA in political science. For reals.

  • Agammamon||

    I was gonna say that if he doesn't mention what his degree was in then its in some bullshit.

    And I was right.

  • Ed||

    Google is how I found out who he worked for. Point is it's not in the story. hth

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Point is it's not in the story.

    Still, we depend on you to give us the 411 to fuel the human flesh search engine that is Hit 'n Run.

  • Warren's Strapon||

    Public Affairs, eh. So his plan all along was to have taxpayers foot the bill.

  • Rev-Match||

    Naturally. These people are parasites.

  • Dweebston||

    Perhaps you missed the earlier article, but the internet has collectively agreed that disclosing information by or about a person without his or her consent, even when those facts or statements are publically available elsewhere, is an act of violence.

    I know because people on twitter are saying so.

  • CE||

    Unless you're a racist billionaire.

  • Root Boy||

    Or almost any democratic flunky in government (see Joe the plumber, True the vote, etc)

  • LynchPin1477||

    Or someone who donated to the "wrong" causes.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    is an act of violence

    Some people jus' need killin' doxin'.

    *spits in spittoon*

  • Dweebston||

    The frankly terroristic tactics of the feminist stasi (the efforts to silence or dox Karen Straughan, for example) have robbed me of any sympathy I might have felt for their various internet-decency referendums.

  • Coeus||

    Double standards are an illusion because...


    A) Patriarchy

    B) Kiriarchy

    C) Because if they were worried about equality and not gaining special privileges, they would be libertarians instead.

  • Nooge.||

    I'll maybe be impressed when feminists start demanding the right to register for the draft.

  • Dweebston||

    Or divest themselves of the burden of presumptive custody in divorce, and embrace automatic child support and/or alimony payments.

  • JW||

    "Son, there ain't no draft no more."

  • Scarecrow Repair||

    Registration certainly does still exist.

  • John C. Randolph||

    Sounds like he majored in parasitism.

    -jcr

  • JW||

    Former American University Student Government president.

    That says it all. What a feckless dick.

  • Fist of Etiquette||

    Today, President Obama directed the Secretary of Education to propose regulations that would give nearly 5 million federal direct student loan borrowers like me the opportunity to cap their payments at 10 percent of their income.

    That's what passes for an executive order? Even his pushes into the imperial presidency seem feckless.

  • CE||

    How about capping taxes at 10 percent of my income?

  • Agammamon||

    Too religious.

  • The Heresiarch||

    Is this where the left starts calling for "free" college? Because I love it when people start talking about "free" shit. It's as if you wave the magical government wand and teachers, buildings, and research facilities fall from the sky like so much manna. It's free! It's magic!

  • Bill||

    FB is full of b.s. about sweden or other countries "free" college.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    And just how much the bleeding edge research in physics, computer science, hell, even in the social sciences and humanities comes from these free European institutions of higher learning?

    And another dirty secret is that Europe so heavily tracks its students that those "free" colleges are only open to those who have had the tutoring and other advantages the Euro-elite can afford. Most of those "free" colleges are overgrown community colleges and voc-techs.

  • ||

    Yes. Europe limits enrollment by placement tests. Which you can only take a couple of times.
    If you fail the placement tests, you're shit out of luck. No amount of money will get you in. Voc-Tech for you.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    That's coming here. What do you think the end game of Common Core is? Common Core architect, Marc S. Tucker, has basically said that it is.

  • ||

    That would never work in the US, though. People here feel they are entitled to "pursue happiness" on someone else's back. Thus, you have a right to study any subject no matter how stupid it, or you, are, at someone else's expense.

    At least in Europe they follow their marching orders and accept their role in other people's schemes. They are obedient peasants.

    Americans, by contrast are entitled little shits who will throw a temper tantrum until mommy government gives them everything they want.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    That's true, but they found the answer to your dilemma back in 1960.

  • Agammamon||

    That's the problem with us trying to copy European programs.

    Even when they work over there (and most still don't) we never fully examine *what* they're doing and *why* its working.

    Europe - heavily into tracks and limiting the number of students who will apply for higher education to balance costs.

    US - HEY! They have free college!

  • ||

    The depth of the left's economic stupidity is unfathomable.

    What do you think will happen if college is free and anyone can study whatever they want?

    Enrollment in STEM fields will plummet and kids will spend four years majoring in Fine Arts, music and dance. For fun. Because if college doesn't cost anything then people will use as an excuse to do what seems fun. Not what will pay for their education.

  • Robert||

    Actually we're getting pretty close to free college right now, via distributed learning thru the nets. Volunteers will teach, and anybody will be able to become a student. This is not something to be made fun of, but is the alternative which will soon replace the racket that is now higher ed.

  • LynchPin1477||

    Maybe. But when the government says that you can't work in such and such a field without a degree from an accredited institution, and, wouldn't you know it, the accreditation organizations don't recognize uofliberty.net, it will be tough to replace the racket.

  • ||

    Fortunately, nobody has thought of occupational licensing for software developers ... yet.

  • ||

    But who will pay for your living expenses while you take free college online?

    You still need student loans for rent and parties!

  • Camisard||

    If all you're looking for is the raw information content of college courses, college has been free for a long time. There's never been a tuition payment necessary to buy college-level textbooks. Now maybe the video lectures can reach audio-learners who couldn't learn from books, but that's some thin gruel.

    A big part of college is getting references from professors and practitioners in the field, making connections with other students and alumni, and for more prestigious colleges, being where employers come looking for people to hire. You're not getting that at Coursera, however wonderful the idea is.

    And of course in a lot of fields you absolutely need hands on, up close experience. If you've never worked in a chemistry lab, you're not getting a job as a chemical engineer even if you've watched every online course all the way up to PhD level in ChemE.

  • Horatio||

    Great points, but (1) you're talking about majors that *actually belong* in a university (and yes, those include dance and other "in-person" majors) and (2) although networking is certainly the point of upper crust unis most companies don't give a shit and are not expecting Ivy League when hiring accountants, finance guys, chem engineers etc etc. Some are, of course, but most care about acumen.

  • Mokers||

    Listening to this story in the morning pissed me off. The intro was "Obama helps make college more affordable", but then goes on to talk about only capping payments, which of course does nothing to actually reduce the cost of an education. The headline really should have been "Obama tries to buy more votes giving away money that he doesn't have"

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    When I was growing up in Colorado, my parents worked multiple jobs and made plans to refinance our house just so they could afford to put me through college.

    But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life. Student loans made it possible for me to go to college and complete my education, but now they present a serious financial burden.

    Maybe if they weren't working so many jobs, your parents could have taught you that shit happens.

  • Root Boy||

    Or the parents could have said, maybe we shouldn't mortgage our house so our kid can goof off for 4 years so he can be a politician.

    Or they could have spent their money on some good health insurance

  • The Original Jason||

    75K??? Just 75K???? That's nothing! I've got closer to 500K to pay off!

  • Agammamon||

    Assuming you're serious, WTF did you go to school and WTF did you study and did it lead to a job where you have more than a snowball's chance in hell to pay it off before mid-century?

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    He got his degree in Medical Physics Engineering Law, from Harvard.

    I'm also guessing he's Asian.

  • R C Dean||

    That's Medical Physics Engineering Business Administration Law, HM.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Oh, my mistake! I didn't realize he also went for a graduate degree!

  • ||

    Considering that a single-family home costs $500,000 in much of America, we can forgive him for thinking that wasn't an insane amount of money to spend on an education.

  • ||

    Student loans made it possible for me to go to college and complete my education, but now they present a serious financial burden.

    Well let's see, Einstein: most state colleges have much lesser tuition for in state students. Does Colorado not have state universities that charge much less to Coloradans? Because if it does, you chose to take on way more debt than you had to. Boo hoo.

  • PBR Streetgang||

    How many good reasonably priced state schools are there in VA? If he only has $75 from AU, then it would have been ZERO had he picked JMU, W&M, U.Va, etc.

  • PBR Streetgang||

    $75K that is.

  • CE||

    Credit cards made it possible for me to go on expensive vacations and see the world and experience new cultures, but now they present a serious financial burden.

    Where's MY help, Mr. Prez?

  • Horatio||

    That's fantastic

  • ||

    Between this and Sallie Mae emailing to tell me that they were spinning off some of the loans to another company and didn't know which group I'd belong to, I decided to kill mine with a lump sum payment.

    Yay one fewer account to keep an eye on.

  • ||

    TBF, my loan was already paid fairly low, it's not a huge deal, but I will celebrate with a drink when I get home.

  • ||

    Clown college doesn't cost much, does it, jesse. You were in Steve-O's class, right?

  • ||

    You were in Steve-O's class

    He's 8 years older than me, Epi; he was a senior when I was a sophomore.

  • Agammamon||

    So, that's a yes then. Steve-O ain't that bright.

  • ||

    To be fair, I got a BA in the Liberal Arts with a focus on European History.

    At least clown college would've come with useful skills.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Useful to whom? We need libertoids in the liberal arts, because that's where the battle is. The battle of ideas. You can't "code" liberty; you can't CADCAM a belief in self-ownership. What you can do is use the canon of Western civilization, along with knowledge of rhetoric and philosophy to fearlessly present arguments grounded in logic and historical example that support freedom and individualism.

    No architect could draw up a blueprint that produces libertarians, but a novelist cum philosopher wrote a novel about an architect that produces libertarians by the umm...tens?

  • Agammamon||

    But, if the idiots actually paid attention to logic and historical example in the first place, they'd be libertarians.

  • Terr||

    We're talking about Princeton, right?

    /Simpsons when the show was funny

  • x4rqcks3f||

    But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life.

    Perhaps some of that money should have gone to catastrophic health insurance. It was legal back then.

  • Paul.||

    When I was growing up in Colorado, my parents worked multiple jobs and made plans to refinance our house just so they could afford to put me through college.

    But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life. Student loans made it possible for me to go to college and complete my education, but now they present a serious financial burden.

    So it never occurred to you to, you know, work while you went to college, or choose a cheaper college, or a cheaper path? No?

    Fuck you.

  • JW||

    Look, he deserves to be compensated for his years in the frat, drunkenly and violently hazing poor, stupid schulbs who never even had a chance of getting into Omega house.

    But man, the looks on their faces when he told them that they didn't get in, made it all worth it.

  • The Last American Hero||

    I'm confused. First I'm told we need more STEM. Every time I read the headlines, we need more STEM. STEM pays well. Isn't the pay cap going to provide incentives to seek out low-paying careers?

    Also, he's an idiot for taking out that much debt for a lousy political science degree.

  • CE||

    Oh, I don't know. I've heard of politicians who have freezers full of cash.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    I dunno. I imagine being a player in Obama's flim-flam act might pay off his debt handily.

  • Hyperion||

    Unless he learned the real stuff about politics. You know, how to get elected by lying, cheating, and stealing. And then doubling down on all of those things once in office. That can be pretty lucrative. Sliimy, but lucrative.

  • Agammamon||

    STEM pays well. Isn't the pay cap going to provide incentives to seek out low-paying careers?

    I don't see it as a disincentive to search out high paying careers so much as *removing* a disincentive to study something that won't land you a high paying career.

    Working a Starbucks won't seem such a waste of college if your loan payments are capped at 10%of fuck-all.

  • ||

    College will be like a four year paid vacation.

    Who wouldn't want to spend four years painting pictures and reading great novels? I bet enrollment in Film Studies skyrockets.

    When I was in college, I would always take a few liberal arts classes on the side, just for fun. If I could have spent four years doing that FOR FREE, there's a good chance that's ALL I would take.

  • Bean Counter||

    Who wouldn't want to spend four years painting pictures?

    That depends on how hot the female nudes were

  • ||

    Dude, they are all 18-22 years old.

  • CE||

    Someday it would be cool to hear a US President say this:

    "Look, I know times are tough. And my policies have contributed to that, even though they sounded good at the time I enacted them. But if you borrowed enough to buy Wetzel's Pretzels franchise to finance your education, and promised to pay it back, well it's time to man up and pay it back."

  • Hyperion||

    Yeah, right. Government's entire mission any more, apparently, is to create an entire generation of helpless dependent whiners, who are totally unable to do anything without the assistance of the state.

  • Hyperion||

    I worked through my college, took my classes mostly at night. It took me 6 years, but I did it with no loans.

  • SugarFree||

    Please check your effort privilege.

    #lazybumrights

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Here's the thing. MacCracken could have had most, if not all, that debt forgiven by just doing 2 years in the Peace Corps. But no, Andy MacCracken is too good to break a sweat digging a fucking well in Malawi.

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    Does Peace Corps even take poli sci majors? I thought they only wanted kids with useful degrees.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    They take anyone, really. And in my experience, they're full of poli sci majors, as PC looks good on a resume when applying for a Department of State job.

  • Derpetologist||

    If he had Perkins loans, he could have gotten 70% of that forgiven. I got my small loan deferred while I was in the Peace Corps.

    The main reason people get rejected for Peace Corps is health problems.

  • Agammamon||

    But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life.

    Good news Andy, the current presidential administration, with some help from the Democrats in congress, have worked hard and passed a bill the will ensure parents never again have to make that sort of tough choice.

    The rationing panel will simply deny your mother funding for her healthcare.

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    "OK, Mizz MacCracken, we've got yer first chemo treatment scheduled for 10:00 am on Friday, May 10, 2167. Would you like me to write that on a card to help you remember?"

  • Agammamon||

    Even better - they'll write it on a card an keep it on file. Until Thursday, May 09, 2167. That's when they'll enter it into the scheduling software.

    Gotta massage the metrics to keep the bonuses coming.

  • R C Dean||

    it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life.

    Is it just me, or is he kinda bitter that his parents spent "his" money saving his mother's life?

    And is he, in spite of this, just totally oblivious to the notion that other people might not want their money spent on health care for total strangers?

  • PBR Streetgang||

    This MacCracken kid grew up poor on the mean streets of... ASPEN?? What a D-Bag.

  • Raven Nation||

    I couldn't find that part on him - where was it?

  • PBR Streetgang||

    Teh Googlez skillz, show his father is Scott R. MacCracken of Aspen Co. Professional singer and manager of liquor and spirits store.

  • Raven Nation||

    Hmm, thanks. I'm starting to think a lot of this "bio" is, um, creative. I'm sitting about 40 miles from Aspen. From looking at some of the things Scott McCracken's been doing, I doubt they're really poor. If it's the same guy, being involved in all those things for as many years as he has up here, you've got money somewhere.

  • LynchPin1477||

    Ha, you mean the place with some of the highest property values in the entire country?

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    If PAYE caps how much a student has to repay (if s/he can't pay the whole tab), won't it drive up the cost of borrowing for higher ed? (Which IMO would be a good thing. Although nowhere near as good as turning off the spigot.)

  • SugarFree||

    No, because the FedGov will be paying the difference. There will still be no incentive for the loan originators to say "You know, maybe a $50,000 master's degree in puppetry is not a risk we want to take. Also, you're an idiot."

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    Well then SHIT ON THAT!

  • SugarFree||

    What they should do is get rid of the federal backing. The banks actually risking the borrower default and mom and dad putting their houses up for collateral will bring penny-pinching and useful degrees back in style.

  • cw||

    Why do you hate education for all, Sugarfree?

  • SugarFree||

    Familiarity breeds contempt and I've been grossly pregnant from academia for two decades.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Well, the way you were dressed...

  • R C Dean||

    Fascinating that the White House's idea of a "regular Joe" is "the executive director of National Campus Leadership Council", a lobbyist, possibly with a side order of community organizer. What kind of bubble do you have to be in to think that is a regular guy who lots of people will identify with?

  • Root Boy||

    True for all the regular folks regularly trotted out to show the face of the latest, greatest problem facing America whose only solution is gobermint.

    Same way with CHIP, the birth control requirement, and on and on.

  • ||

    That is the first thing that popped in my head. He is too much like Obumbles, he just hasn't lied his way so far up the ladder.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    What kind of bubble do you have to be in to think that is a regular guy who lots of people will identify with?

    It ain't about that. It's about putting on a show that will inspire your side of the infernal political chorus to out-sing the other side of it. They count on actual average Joes to be too busy and/or distracted to do anything but say to themselves "Well, looks like those guys are on top of this so I'll go along" and that's generally the case.

    If you reconfigure "Average Joe" to be the special snowflake son of "Average Joan Non-profit parasite" or "Average Joe Crony Capitalist Sr" it makes a lot more sense.

  • LynchPin1477||

    The people this email is targeting would love to be in his shoes.

  • SugarFree||

    Andy MacCracken is a great argument for bringing back debtor's prisons.

  • Bardas Phocas||

    ... and flogging.

  • Lady Bertrum||

    ...and stockades.

  • cw||

    I lol'd.

  • Lady Bertrum||

    Barack Obama is like pesto sauce; there is nothing its inclusion doesn't make worse.

  • ||

    That's controversial, but let's kick it up a notch:

    *Calculates minimum safe distance, lights fuse*

    Deep Dish Three Cheese Pesto Pizza

    *Runs like a madman*

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    The hubster makes the best pizza. Every Saturday is Pizza Night in our house, and I’m never the pizza maker. Sometimes we’ll have nice, easy hand-tossed pizzas, sometimes calzones, but one of my favorites is when we have deep dish pizza. I love all that bread…no matter how unhealthy it is!

    I have never met this woman and I already hate her with a fury that burns hotter than the sun.

  • ||

    What the fuck is a "hubster"?

  • C. Anacreon||

    I love all that bread…no matter how unhealthy it is!

    I have a feeling that whoever wrote that has elephantine hips.

  • Lady Bertrum||

    Here in the swamps of Jersey, there is no such thing as deep dish pizza. There is a menu item known as Sicilian. Much like its name sake, it is a filthy, crude version of its more sophisticated cousin and held in implacable contempt by all people with functioning taste buds.

    Only some fancy West coast diva would combine Sicilian and pesto into a Frankenstein like creature resembling what I can only imagine is the likeness of Warty and Epi's love child.

  • Anonymous Coward||


    Strategy & Outreach Guy

    'Do We Have a Deal Yet' Campaign



    July 2011 – September 2011 (3 months) Washington D.C. Metro Area

    During the debt ceiling debate over the summer, Washington was entrenched in gridlock. Our generation had most at stake whether the government acted or not, yet young people had no role to play in influencing the outcome.

    We drafted a letter to the president and congressional leaders making a call to leadership. In two weeks, 140 student body presidents around the country signed on to the letter, representing more than 2 million students.

    We held a press conference at the National Press Club, leading to hundreds of news stories nationwide, including interviews on CNN, ABC, NPR, and Fox & Friends.

    This attention landed us on a conference call with President Obama just days before the the August deadline.

    So on his resume he:
    1. Wrote a letter.

    2. Answered some questions.

    3. Made a phone call.

    Fuck me, America is done. Does somebody have a better country I could move to?

  • Root Boy||

    Well, that is actually more work than creating a twitter hashtag and getting people to RT it.

  • LynchPin1477||

    Is that actually a resume? And does he actually list his formal title as "Guy"?

  • Ayn Random Variation||

    Dumb question, but whatever happened to honor?

    I take I loan, I pay it back.
    I get offended, I get over it.

    Fucking generation of pussies.

  • ||

    People are really fucking stupid.

    They think that smaller monthly payments are BETTER. But they are NOT. The faster your pay principle down the better. If you aren't paying down principle, you are paying more in interest over the long term.

    Smaller monthly payments just mean you're going to be paying them for longer.

    There aren't any really good ideas here, because they all involve the government manipulating interest rates in an unnatural way. But the one idea I might support is to tie student loan eligibility , and interest rates, to statistical data on post-graduation expected earnings. Then at least the government would be behaving like a normal bank.

    Of course then the enrollment in liberal arts would plummet and the progressives wouldn't be able to produce as many unemployed social justice drones.

  • Root Boy||

    I think the law they want will also include a rider that if you don't pay it off in 20, it goes into default (not on you though, taxpayers will pay the balance).

    So, win-win for the deadbeats and us taxpayers I guess.

  • cw||

    It's forgiven after 20 years if you have no late payments.

  • ||

    Ugh. So basically, study whatever you want, cause it's going to cost you 10% of your income, no matter what.

  • cw||

    Yeah. It's odd there is no whole-numbered minimum, so taxpayers aren't completely robbed.

  • ||

    Look, cw, people need to be FREED from market forces!

    Can't you see how much human liberty is constrained by the fact that we have to pay for things?

    Why should the market dictate that our children be doctors and engineers when they yearn to be artists and musicians?

    Only by liberating them from the constraints of having to pay for stuff can they truly be free to pursue happiness.

    Nobody should be forced to produce things that the market demands in order to obtain what they want out of life! We all have the right to be perfectly happy without ever producing or doing anything that anyone else actually wants.

  • Dances-with-Trolls||

    Been hanging around campus coffee shops lately Hazel?

  • ||

    I don't need to hang out around coffee shops to know exactly what progressives will think about any issue.

    Seriously. I speak to my retarded progressive sister about once every five years, and every time I encounter her I always know exactly what her opinions will be on any subject before she even bothers to open her mouth. Last time, it was GMO labeling.

    That didn't stop her from opening her mouth and uttering the utterly predictable cant of her tribe like she was a high priestess delivering the divine word to the unenlightened sinners.

  • Root Boy||

    It will also mean that we'll see much more than the current 1T in student loan debt as the carrying costs and risk is reduced even more than it is already.

    Not that Obama or the other idiots in charge will see that.

  • Robert||

    If people are fucking stupid, then stupid must be fucking people.

  • ||

    People are really fucking stupid.

    They think that smaller monthly payments are BETTER. But they are NOT. The faster your pay principle down the better. If you aren't paying down principle, you are paying more in interest over the long term.

    Smaller monthly payments just mean you're going to be paying them for longer.

    There aren't any really good ideas here, because they all involve the government manipulating interest rates in an unnatural way. But the one idea I might support is to tie student loan eligibility , and interest rates, to statistical data on post-graduation expected earnings. Then at least the government would be behaving like a normal bank.

    Of course then the enrollment in liberal arts would plummet and the progressives wouldn't be able to produce as many unemployed social justice drones.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Andy MacCracken ‏@maccracken

    I wish the @HouseofCards theme music started playing when I walk into meetings.

    Fuck. You.

    And I'm glad many predispositions to cancer are inheritable.

  • Irish||

    I don't know how he's having trouble paying his loans when he should be making millions as a standup comic.

  • wwhorton||

    I don't normally laugh at many cancer jokes, so you should be quite proud that I just blasted garlic sauce out of my nose.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    I do find pride in strange things.

    I have a Star Trek Pez dispenser collection, for example.

  • Bean Counter||

    OH My God!! Even I'm not that bad

  • JW||

    I have a Star Trek Pez dispenser collection, for example.

    If I could Internet high-five you right now, I would.

  • JW||

    I will always picture McKracken as Jonah from Veep.

  • cw||

    Speaking of nonprofits, how is it not a scandal for them to label what is essentially profit "revenues over costs"?

    I'm also curious how any person is supposed to identify the true value of the services they supposedly provide when so many of them depend on government subsidies grants.

  • Derpetologist||

    Education in the US has gone way past the point of diminishing returns. The 12 years I spent in public school was bad enough, but it least I didn't have a ton of debt when I finished.

    There are millions of people out there with 16 years of education who have little or no valuable skills. This is outrageous.

    I can boil my criticisms of education down to this: it's far too much time to spend on something that just isn't that important.

  • cw||

    I do believe there is value to a liberal arts education that one cannot make a financial return off of. It certainly helped me with my critical thinking skills.

    That being said, I'm sure there are plenty of former college grads who did not get any of that value out of their education. Like so many here would agree, college today is simply a delay to adulthood.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    I do believe there is value to a liberal arts education that one cannot make a financial return off of

    With an entrepreneur's mind, one can attempt to make a financial return off of anything.

  • Irish||

    I do believe there is value to a liberal arts education that one cannot make a financial return off of.

    The problem isn't liberal arts or humanities education, it's that American liberal arts education happens to be a total fucking joke.

    It takes no effort whatsoever to get A's and B's in modern American humanities courses. No effort. Go back and look at what people were doing in liberal arts courses in 1925 and compare it to today.

    It's a total scam. Colleges use cheap Federal money to allow students to go there. They then lessen the amount of work you need to get the degree so that they can get more and more people to come to these courses, even if they aren't smart enough to do a college workload.

    As a result, at the same time that the cost of a college degree goes up the value of a degree is diluted by the fact that tons of morons now have degrees they didn't have to work for.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    Go back and look at what people were doing in liberal arts courses in 1925

    My 1st Attic Greek textbook was from 1928*. Blows most modern texts out of the water in rigor.

    *The page says 1945, but the title page has a copyright of 1928.

  • Irish||

    Have you seen the syllabus W.H. Auden taught his students from in 1941?

    It's a one semester course comprising 32 books, including Kierkegaard, 4 plays by Shakespeare, Ben Jonson, The Brothers Karamazov, and Kafka.

    Apparently it's about 6000 pages of reading.

  • Heroic Mulatto||

    That's awesome.

  • Irish||

    Except that the guy who posted it is apparently a great example of the semi-literate morons I'm talking about:

    Four Shakespeare plays and one Ben Jonson? That was my first college Shakespeare class.

    You took an entire Shakespeare course and only read four plays? They're not very long.

    All of Moby Dick? I spent over half a semester with the whale in a Melville class.

    I read all of Moby Dick in 2 and a half weeks and only read it while riding the train to and from work. It's only like 450 pages and really isn't that difficult a book to understand.

    Then he says this:

    Instead of chasing vanishing cultural ideals, I console myself with a paraphrase from the dim memory of my last reading of Moby Dick: why read widely when you can read deeply?

    It took you like 8 weeks to read Moby Dick. Stop trying to act like you're not an idiot.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    I guess it depends on how much of a 'close reading' they are doing. I can see give Shakespeare era plays in one semester if you're doing a very close read of them. You have to know that this is also one class reading load out of five during the same semester, so that adds up to a considerable amount of reading.

  • Irish||

    Yeah, I'm going to have to call bullshit, Bo. I was a liberal arts student. I got A's and B's doing virtually no work and drinking 4 times a week. My roommates who were engineering students, on the other hand, would have weekends they didn't even leave the apartment because they needed to study.

    When a liberal arts student is required to lose weekends because they have too much reading, I'll buy your argument. As it stands, the humanities require very little work to get a degree.

  • Ayn Random Variation||

    I majored in Econ and had to study for that.
    I minored in Criminal Justice between drinks.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    This research suggests that while engineering majors study the most, arts and humanities majors are comparable to physical science majors with business last.

    http://m.chronicle.com/article.....806/habits

  • ||

    The fuck? I read 4 Shakespeare plays in my AP English class.

  • Derpetologist||

    Seconded. I'll add that a college education for most people is not worth anything near $100,000. Even if you worked minimum wage full-time for 4 years instead, you'd have earned $56,000. And almost everybody earns more than after the first year of earning minimum wage.

  • Ken Shultz||

    College isn't just about dollars and cents.

    It's also about learning art history.

    And shouldn't everybody get the chance to study art history?

  • Illocust||

    That's what wikipedia is for or any other numerous books and webpages dedicated to art history that a truly interested person could read in their free time.

  • JW||

    I've told my kids that if you plan on getting a liberal arts degree, get it from the cheapest college you can.

    There's no point in overpaying for what is nothing more than a proxy for personal character for employers.

  • LynchPin1477||

    I'll second this. I studied for one LA class in my entire time in college, and studying for that one class only involved reading some book the prof had written two days before the final (and only because it wasn't covered in class). Every other class, I just went to class, listened and took notes (helps my memory), and showed up on exam day. Now, granted, these were intro gen-ed courses, but still. I couldn't get away with that in my intro science courses.

  • Alice Bowie||

    We should have a means-tested student loan forgiveness program where the TAX PAYER doesn't pay the loans but the government offers credit protection to those who will not pay the student loan back.

    So, anyone that took a Student loan before June 8th, 2014 would be eligible to just stop paying. And, you do it without the tax payer.

    Tell me that ain't genius.

  • Ken Shultz||

    I think they should all get free tickets to Cancun for Spring Break.

    And free beer, too!

    And a smart phone.

    And an Xbox.

  • Ayn Random Variation||

    Hey Alice. How about lending me 300k? I won't pay it back, but so what?

  • Ken Shultz||

    They should all get free rent, anyway.

    And free food.

    And free books.

    And free clothes! Do you have any idea how expensive it is to stay hip these days?

    I think they should get free cars.

  • C. Anacreon||

    Free cars? Today's hipsters don't need a car. They are urban sophisticates who live in walkable communities, thus single-handedly stopping global warming.
    Just ask them.

  • LynchPin1477||

    Can't tell if serious. But this definitely isn't genius.

    So if the taxpayer isn't stuck with the bill, and the person who took the loan out isn't stuck with the bill, just who is that you think picks up the tab?

  • Agammamon||

    We should have a means-tested student loan forgiveness program where the TAX PAYER doesn't pay the loans but the government offers credit protection to those who will not pay the student loan back.


    Tell me that ain't genius.


    That ain't genius. How does the government offer 'credit protection' without putting TAXPAYER money on the line?
  • Sevo||

    Alice Bowie|6.9.14 @ 7:52PM|#
    ..."So, anyone that took a Student loan before June 8th, 2014 would be eligible to just stop paying. And, you do it without the tax payer."

    So from whom are you planning to teal the money from Alice?

  • wingnutx||

    I still owe $87,000 for my degree in printer repair.

  • Ken Shultz||

    Honestly, with how much printers cost these days, I'd think there'd be more money in printer disposal.

    I mean, you're not supposed to just throw them in the dumpster when they're broken, right?

    Maybe people in India who shit in public can use them for something.

  • Brian D||

    Hey, everyone --

    I owe more than $75,000 in federal student loan debt -- and that's before you count interest -- because I couldn't get any scholarships and still wanted to party for four years while earning a near-worthless piece of paper.

    Fuck you, Andy. I earned an ROTC scholarship, couldn't pass the eye exam, and then went out and earned different scholarships.

  • C. Anacreon||

    I just got an alumni fundraising letter from my old medical school, Northwestern. They are considering moving towards a tuition-free medical education.

    I left there with an MD and a ton of loans in 1986, when it was relatively cheap to go to med school by today's standards, yet still didn't pay them off until a few years ago.

    I'm not sure of the complete philosophy behind free medical education (the flyer mostly was just "Isn't this a neat-o idea? Send us money.") But I do think it would be a great way to attract the top student class in the country and turn the school from its present state as a top-15 med school to top-5. Top students would definitely compete to get into the best free school possible, one would think.

    However, I do think NU already got more than enough from me to cover my own tuition, and I'm not prepared to pay someone else's at this point. There should be a little of your own skin in the game, at least. And I've got much more deserving charities to give to.

  • Ken Shultz||

    Giving things away for free is a great idea. I understand Bill Gates gives a lot of money away for free by way of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation.

    Hell, I sometimes give money to the Reason Foundation.

    But taxpayers are the ones underwriting so many of the loans ultimately going to Northwestern, and I kinda resent the fuck out of it. I mean if Northwestern can afford to start giving away free tuition to medical students, then why do they have to take so much money from undergraduates--to the point that taxpayers like me are being forced to give those undergrads financial aid?

    And I am being forced. It's not like when I give money to the Reason Foundation at all. It feels more like when somebody stealing money out of my future paychecks--and giving it to medical students.

    For free? Not really. Not free to me anyway.

  • LynchPin1477||

    Right now, I'm surrounded by new graduates who want to improve the world around us -- as teachers, public servants, and, like me, as non-profit leaders.

    This shit makes me so fucking furious. Not because teachers, public servants, and non-profit leaders can't do good work, but because the attitude is that icky profits make other jobs immoral. Fuck that.

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    Plus the ego inherent in "like me, non-profit leaders."

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    Doesn't the federal government make money off the student loan program?

    "The U.S. Department of Education is forecast to generate $127 billion in profit over the next decade from lending to college students and their families, according to the Congressional Budget Office."

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....49653.html

  • WDATPDIM?!||

    Actually, I think university administrators are the ones really making money off the student loan program.

  • Agammamon||

    AS with anything the government does - I'd be suspicious of their definition of 'profit'.

    Could be like the 'profit' made from bailing out GM.

  • Mickey Rat||

    "... like me, as non-profit leaders."

    Which suggests he has an education which is not geared to provide anything useful to society.

  • Bo Cara Esq.||

    You think Reason and the NRA don't provide anything useful to society?

  • Mickey Rat||

    Exceptions may exist, but I think that someone who is that smug about working for a non-profit is not intending to provide anything more useful than sanctimony.

  • trshmnster the terrible||

    But when my mom was diagnosed with breast cancer during my freshman year of high school, it meant the money they'd planned to use for my education went toward saving her life. Student loans made it possible for me to go to college and complete my education, but now they present a serious financial burden.

    Shit son, at least your college fund went to saving your mom's life. My college fund paid for my parents' divorce lawyers to buy new cars! But fuck, rather than bitching and moaning, I did what needed to be done. I kicked enough ass in high school to get 2 years paid for in scholarships, and joined a co-op program and alternated work and school for 5 semesters, making my total student loan for 5 years at school around $15k. Much of that, even, was just because I was stupid and didn't know how to say no to my college girlfriend. Once I graduated and got a job, I paid $8k of it off in a year. It's called being responsible.

    God forbid you be responsible for choosing a major that leads to a decent career, paying your own damn bills, and not racking up so much debt on an imperial russian ballet history major that your pizza delivery job can't pay for it.

  • Camisard||

    So, Obama's method of helping college grads is to have them spend longer paying off the loans and pay more interest.

  • Libertarian||

    I guess finance majors are ineligible for the program.

  • Invisible Finger||

    Americans be stupid.

    Seriously, why wouldn't Obama do this? The 8-year car loan and 30-year mortgage are the norm now. Americans love their debt serfdom.

    Right now, I'm surrounded by new graduates who want to improve the world around us -- as teachers, public servants, and, like me, as non-profit leaders.

    Not only do Americans love their debt serfdom, like like a nice heavy dose of caste society on top of it.

  • Libertarian||

    The longer loan term just means that the interest keeps compounding, no? At $200 a month, it'd take forever to pay off that loan. I think Obama is trying to screw the kids.

  • Richard Rider||

    In California UC colleges, if your family makes less than $80K, you normally qualify for ZERO tuition. Yet such students also often take out "college" loans -- for a new car, trip to Europe, or simply to enjoy today at the expense of tomorrow.

    And then try to get out of paying tomorrow.

  • Richard Rider||

    New college grads who choose to work in the private sector are looked down upon by our aspiring "public servants."

    Actually, in CA, the public sector jobs (except STEM work) normally pay more (especially counting benefits) and require less effort/results than the private sector. So maybe our private sector workers are indeed making the wrong career choice.

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