Random Bloggage

and then the author proceeds to describe a host of situations in which gays are shamed/pressured/punished into pretending they're heterosexual. Progress!

Franklin Harris|9.5.08 @ 1:27PM|#

Noam Chomsky is the poster boy for "wanker."

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 1:35PM|#

The evangelical piece was interesting. Maybe someone can clarify this for me, but I've seen some evangelical churches in the West trying really hard to emulate the Southern style.

While not a member of the faith, I attended a Pentecostal church in B.C., Canada for a while (the guy I was dating in hs went there and although I was much more interested in making out than listening to sermons, I absorbed a little of the culture).

This particular church, and others in the vicinity, made a big deal of singing old, Southern-style hymns, and getting travelling ministries from the South to come visit. There was a lot of emphasis on the no drinking, no gambling, no sex, no gays thing.

I got the sense that they were trying hard to appear just as traditional as the Southern Baptists. Part of an homage to the history of the movement, perhaps? Or maybe there are subtleties to the regional thing that I'm missing.

Naga Sadow|9.5.08 @ 1:38PM|#

Dagny! You're my kinda girl. Impure thoughts in a church! Naughty.

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 1:46PM|#

Impure thoughts in a church! Naughty.

Come to think of it, that really was half the fun. These evangelicals might be on to something.

And, FWIW, there was more than just impure thoughts. ;)

Naga Sadow|9.5.08 @ 1:53PM|#

Like I said, you're my kinda girl. I was raised deep woods baptist(Brownsville, TN), myself.

Seward|9.5.08 @ 2:01PM|#

Southerners were once fierce defenders of such an individualistic culture...

Maybe. Or Maybe not. Take the slavery issue for example. In the 19th century it was nearly impossible to live in most of the South and be an abolitionist. Indeed, Southern state governments did their level best to keep abolitionist literature from entering their borders.

|9.5.08 @ 2:10PM|#

the topic of gays in India is interesting. I think that the primary importance of, as my brother says, "following the script" closely in Indian culture leads to a lot of other stuff. The primary objection to gays isn't exactly homophobia or threatened masculinity, although obviously those aspects are there; it's that your son/daughter won't be getting married and having kids, or will have problems when they do since they really don't want to - and yet that is your primary duty in life.

Across all the varied religions and sects and castes and traditions in India, there's a roughly common life script. you must do all of the following: get married, take care of your parents, have children, raise them properly, get them educated or get them started in life, and finally, get them married off. Indian parents feel absolutely horrible if they do not achieve all of the above; it's often simply unacceptable and if for whatever reason they can't get all that done, they are miserable.

Indian culture has always been conservative (obviously in the unpolitical small-c sense of the word), but also very varied and thoughtful. Not just the eunachs and Kama Sutra (hmm, why is this the only 'Sutra' Westerners are familiar with? what a mystery), but tribals and many different types of communities, from rural to urban, all different religions mixing into Indian-ness. (I even read once about some traditional whore-and-thief community, maybe here? not sure how the script would apply to them) I get a sense that it has become, over the past couple hundred years, more right-wing or close-minded; questioning is disdained more than it seems to have been in Vedic times.

Sorry if this was a bit rambling.

|9.5.08 @ 2:24PM|#

And, FWIW, there was more than just impure thoughts. ;)

Nice. I would like to report the same, but I cannot enter a church without catching on fire and causing the earth to shake, so I just don't have the opportunity.

Seward|9.5.08 @ 2:36PM|#

robc,

Do any evangelical churches have good music? I would go to one if I could hear say Handel's "Messiah." :)

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 2:40PM|#

I cannot enter a church without catching on fire and causing the earth to shake, so I just don't have the opportunity.

Not sure whether to picture Hellboy or the girl from The Exorcist.

|9.5.08 @ 2:41PM|#

But is this really the way the wild will reclaim our world? Starting with foreclosed homes and moving inward, to the centers of cities, from there. Soon ivy crawls across the well-polished tables of New York boardrooms, as the suburbs fall prey to nests of field

I should take the author on a walking tour of Detroit. He could witness wildlife returning to/reclaiming an urban setting first hand.

It really is fascinating.

robc|9.5.08 @ 2:48PM|#

Do any evangelical churches have good music? I would go to one if I could hear say Handel's "Messiah." :)

Mine has electric guitars and a drum set now. A big improvement over the 80s.

C. S. Lewis made the comment once about Church of England's hymns being 5th rate poetry set to 4th rate music. Or something like that. Not a lot has changed. Its just more upbeat now.

On a related note, I agree with Hank Hill when it comes to christian rock.

Naga Sadow|9.5.08 @ 2:51PM|#

Dagny T.,

Epi is exaggerating. His skin sizzles a little but that's all.

J sub D,

Actually I was looking at that recently. Someone uploaded all these photos of Detroit "goin' to wilderness" on their stupid website. The photos of Detroit were awesome. Did you know this guy had a picture of a coyote in Detroit proper?

robc|9.5.08 @ 2:53PM|#

Did you know this guy had a picture of a coyote in Detroit proper?

A friend of mine hit a deer in his rental car in downtown Atlanta. Unlike Detroit, Atlanta isnt going wild yet.

Orange Line Special|9.5.08 @ 2:57PM|#

Now here's something you don't see every day! TAPPED has an interview with the Paultard who interrupted McCain's speech, and AFAIK Reason has zilch on that topic. My comments on how he could have done something effective are here. You probably know what they are by heart by now.

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 2:57PM|#

Church of England's hymns being 5th rate poetry set to 4th rate music. Or something like that. Not a lot has changed. Its just more upbeat now.

Eddie Izzard had a bit about the dismal songs in the Church of England, re. how only white people (generally the richest and most powerful) could sound so dull singing about joy and redemption.

|9.5.08 @ 3:00PM|#

Not sure whether to picture Hellboy or the girl from The Exorcist.

Neither. More like this (I wonder if you will get the reference).

Epi is exaggerating. His skin sizzles a little but that's all.

Yeah, but if you throw holy water on me all hell breaks loose.

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 3:03PM|#

(I wonder if you will get the reference).

Damn. My work's firewall blocked it. :(

Naga Sadow|9.5.08 @ 3:07PM|#

Dagny,

I fear that when I get a real job. I don't even have to get ready for work for another half hour.

Epi,

It's familiar but I don't like to cheat unless I absolutely have to . . . errrrrr . . . okay, what's the reference?

|9.5.08 @ 3:08PM|#

How annoying. It was a picture of this guy.

Naga Sadow|9.5.08 @ 3:18PM|#

Oh . . . I thought it was gonna be a reference to Anne Rice's "Servant of the Bones". My bad.

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 3:19PM|#

Yellow eyes and all? Cool.

|9.5.08 @ 3:35PM|#

Yes. try this, maybe it'll work as it isn't YTMND.

Dagny T.|9.5.08 @ 3:44PM|#

maybe it'll work as it isn't YTMND.

Success! The cute ones are all evil, huh?

I suspect that's yet another filmed-in-B.C. show I should be watching.

|9.5.08 @ 3:51PM|#

Yes, everything is filmed in Vancouver, whoops, I mean Hollywood North. It's actually a very well done show that often deliberately deviates from what one would expect to keep you on your toes.

The cute ones are all evil, huh?

Yes. But that's part of the appeal.

Invisible Finger|9.5.08 @ 3:54PM|#

She called the police, but the cats continued to enjoy their perch, staying on the wall for 30 minutes -- plenty of time for police and an animal control officer to get a good look at them.

If they were family dogs instead of bobcats, the police would've shot them on sight.

Seward|9.5.08 @ 3:56PM|#

robc,

You'd be surprised how many atheists would show up at your church if it had decent music. For example, a good a capella Mass.

|9.5.08 @ 4:19PM|#

Seward-

Sounds like you might want to check out a good Lutheran church. Sadly, many of our congregations are turning to that contemporary crap, but we are the church of Bach and occasionally you can find a good old-school congregation that really gets into their music. Personally, just as I believe in the separation of church and state, I believe in the separation of church music and popular music. I'm an indie rock guy at heart, but if I'm in church I want a hymn where I can sing the bass line, not some folk crap where we repeat "Jesus is love" for six minutes.

|9.5.08 @ 4:23PM|#

Did you know this guy had a picture of a coyote in Detroit proper?

Six months or so ago one turned up right in the fucking middle of downtown which is only 2 miles from some riverfront that has been going feral for quite a while. No black bear sightings. Yet.

Seward|9.5.08 @ 4:51PM|#

ClubMedSux,

Yeah, some of the mainline churches have great music.

Mike Laursen|9.5.08 @ 5:04PM|#

I should take the author on a walking tour of Detroit. He could witness wildlife returning to/reclaiming an urban setting first hand.

Yikes! That could lead to the return of Ted Nugent!

Mike Laursen|9.5.08 @ 5:38PM|#

Maybe someone can clarify this for me, but I've seen some evangelical churches in the West trying really hard to emulate the Southern style.

There's more cross-fertilization among evangelicals than in the picture painted by the article. Sometimes literally.

Also, most of the TV preachers are from the South, but they're watched by Western evangelicals, too.

|9.6.08 @ 12:32PM|#

"Leninist anarchism" seems more accurate.

|9.8.08 @ 4:13AM|#

Noam Chomsky thinks anarchy is good... for everyone else but himself - figures he might need coercive authority and armed goons in order to ban teh filthy pron from da intarweb.

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